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(CNN)   Wells Fargo charged 570,000 people for car insurance they didn't want or need leading to 20,000 loan defaults and vehicle repossessions; a move so egregious they got fined about 15% of their profits for one single quarter   ( money.cnn.com) divider line
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1039 clicks; posted to Business » on 19 Apr 2018 at 10:28 PM (4 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



47 Comments     (+0 »)
 
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest
 
2018-04-19 10:39:48 PM  
Years ago I came down hard with maple fever and married a Canadian.
Wife's first bank account was at WF. They promised her all kinds of bonuses and freebies if she used her account in a specific manner (basically met certain spending and saving requirements with direct deposit as well).
She did everything and then they backed out of their end.
So she made it her personal mission to get the $100 odd dollars she was owed.  I guess she was taking easy classes and was bored.
Took a little over two years, then she closed the account.

This bank is sketchy from the ground up.
 
2018-04-19 11:12:35 PM  
We need more young people. They are showing much more motivation and energy. Kids, burn thus shiat to the ground. I'll help you with the gasoline money.
 
2018-04-19 11:15:58 PM  
So glad the Trump administration is rolling back all those unnecessary banking regulations. It's obvious that the banks can be trusted to police themselves.
 
2018-04-19 11:16:07 PM  
When I run for President, I'm going to run on the law and order platform.

I'm going to bring law and order to Wall Street.
 
2018-04-19 11:33:13 PM  
More Wells Fargo execs need to be sucked out of airplane windows at high altitude.
 
2018-04-19 11:38:12 PM  
If only we had a political party willing to stand behind regulating the banks.
 
2018-04-19 11:50:51 PM  
Well, I guess at least the money goes to making those people whole again plus damages.
 
2018-04-19 11:54:08 PM  

misanthropicsob: If only we had a political party willing to stand behind regulating the banks.


If only we had a party who would give these poor banks a little bit of their trust!!

Seriously though I was just listening to npr and they were talking about how banks and lenders have been deregulated back to 2007 levels.  Good thing nothing horrifying happened around that time.
 
2018-04-20 12:05:30 AM  
Anybody who is still a customer with Wells Fargo is an idiot, and deserves to get farked by them again and again and again...
 
2018-04-20 12:10:18 AM  

TwowheelinTim: Anybody who is still a customer with Wells Fargo is an idiot, and deserves to get farked by them again and again and again...


Not that you're wrong but you are avoiding their business through whom?
 
2018-04-20 01:02:34 AM  
Well, the shareholders shouldn't be punished, right?

/sigh
 
2018-04-20 02:56:33 AM  

TwowheelinTim: Anybody who is still a customer with Wells Fargo is an idiot, and deserves to get farked by them again and again and again...


That would be the whole damned trucking industry. Wells Fargo owns ComData. $5000 deposit for a fuel card that accrues no interest and you can't touch, per truck. Plus a $2 or so fee every time it's swiped, plus more fees for ComChecks if you pay your drivers and your repairs through that system. If you pay drivers through their ComData card it's another swipe fee for every $300 you take out at an ATM which can be 3-5 transactions right there.

I don't think they could possibly screw up their regular consumer banking enough to offset the money they make just from the transportation industry.
 
2018-04-20 06:21:40 AM  

BlazeTrailer: TwowheelinTim: Anybody who is still a customer with Wells Fargo is an idiot, and deserves to get farked by them again and again and again...

Not that you're wrong but you are avoiding their business through whom?


they told me it would take two weeks to cash my paycheck, I laughed and immediately closed my account. been with a credit union for 10 years now.
 
2018-04-20 07:43:42 AM  

TwowheelinTim: Anybody who is still a customer with Wells Fargo is an idiot, and deserves to get farked by them again and again and again...


Not everyone has a say in who owns their mortgage.

/Biding my time to refi....
 
2018-04-20 08:49:34 AM  

the8re: TwowheelinTim: Anybody who is still a customer with Wells Fargo is an idiot, and deserves to get farked by them again and again and again...

Not everyone has a say in who owns their mortgage.

/Biding my time to refi....


Why? Honestly, there should be a law in place that says both parties must agree for their debt to be resold to someone else. I agreed to a debt between myself and you. I didn't do it with another party. Nor did I do so so that you could turn around and sell it to someone else who can change terms and conditions.

fark, it's long past time shiat like this got returned to the hands of consumers.
 
2018-04-20 09:22:00 AM  
Let's entire skip over the part where customers didn't look at what they were paying to find those details and challenge the issues.
 
2018-04-20 09:32:14 AM  

the8re: /Biding my time to refi....


Not too many people expect interest rates to go down in the foreseeable future, so if you want to refi, this is probably the time.
 
2018-04-20 09:46:09 AM  

mrmopar5287: Let's entire skip over the part where customers didn't look at what they were paying to find those details and challenge the issues.


What didn't these people realize earlier they were being stolen from!
 
2018-04-20 09:58:44 AM  

mrmopar5287: Let's entire skip over the part where customers didn't look at what they were paying to find those details and challenge the issues.


Many people are harried and don't read the fine print.   Lawyers, politicians, businessmen, and common grifters have relied on this fact since forever.   Years ago, when my father bought a car, he was given a bunch of papers by the salesman....'Sign here.  Sign here. Initial here.....'  and my father did.   It was only after a couple of years into a four year note that my father discovered that he had signed up for disability and life insurance for the note, which was optional, and cost something like 600 bucks extra.   Cut to the chase, my father paid off the car early, and I noticed that he was entitled to a refund on the insurance, pro-rata, for the unexpired portion of the premium.  When I contacted the insurance company for a refund, I was told that there was no policy in effect because the car dealer never sent them the premium which they had collected!    I called the dealer, tried to explain the situation, and they hung up while I was talking.   My next step was small claims where we were asking for treble damages.   A couple of days after the dealer was served he sent a check for the full amount of the premium.  My father could have rejected the offer, but he was the non-confrontational type, and did not want to go to court.
 
2018-04-20 10:09:38 AM  

mrmopar5287: Let's entire skip over the part where customers didn't look at what they were paying to find those details and challenge the issues.


Wells Fargo's lawyer (NSFW language, obvs.):

You Fucked Up. You Trusted Us.
Youtube JTF2j0OWUi8
 
2018-04-20 10:13:06 AM  
It is almost as if there is something in Wells Fargo's culture... almost a "culture of something"
 
2018-04-20 10:20:20 AM  

Fissile: More Wells Fargo execs need to be sucked out of airplane windows at high altitude.


Ha! A PR exec at a company I don't like died in a horrific accident! Hilarious!
 
2018-04-20 10:22:19 AM  

BlazeTrailer: We need more young people. They are showing much more motivation and energy. Kids, burn thus shiat to the ground. I'll help you with the gasoline money.


crypto currencies remove the middle man crooks.
 
2018-04-20 10:23:20 AM  

Pincy: So glad the Trump administration is rolling back all those unnecessary banking regulations. It's obvious that the banks can be trusted to police themselves.


the Banksters have the history to prove it.
 
2018-04-20 10:23:58 AM  

TomFooolery: Fissile: More Wells Fargo execs need to be sucked out of airplane windows at high altitude.

Ha! A PR exec at a company I don't like died in a horrific accident! Hilarious!


She was PR for Wells Fargo!  It's worse than I thought.  That's like being a PR exec for Charles Manson.
 
2018-04-20 10:24:40 AM  

Fissile: More Wells Fargo execs need to be sucked out of airplane windows at high altitude.


theyre almost as good as shiatti Bank.
 
2018-04-20 10:47:47 AM  

TwowheelinTim: Anybody who is still a customer with Wells Fargo is an idiot, and deserves to get farked by them again and again and again...


It's no BofA, but it's getting there.
 
2018-04-20 10:55:26 AM  

jpo2269: It is almost as if there is something in Wells Fargo's culture... almost a "culture of something"


My friends who work there say that the culture really changed for the worse after the merger with Wachovia. It wasn't always like this at Wells Fargo.
 
2018-04-20 10:55:57 AM  

Pincy: So glad the Trump administration is rolling back all those unnecessary banking regulations. It's obvious that the banks can be trusted to police themselves.


But think of all the jobs created by those 570,000 fraudulent policies being opened!

... what's that?
Zero?
But how could that be, I was promised that when banks make money everyone benefits
 
2018-04-20 11:36:07 AM  

Fissile: TomFooolery: Fissile: More Wells Fargo execs need to be sucked out of airplane windows at high altitude.

Ha! A PR exec at a company I don't like died in a horrific accident! Hilarious!

She was PR for Wells Fargo!  It's worse than I thought.  That's like being a PR exec for Charles Manson.


Never mind that she was a regional exec and not an any way involved in any of the scandals that the company has gone through, was actively in a number of charitable organizations, was very well respected in her local community, and left behind a husband and two kids.  Let's revel in her death because we don't like her employer! Not that you're likely to read it, but here's a tribute written by someone who actually knew her, in case you're interested in knowing anything about the the woman whose death you're celebrating.
 
2018-04-20 11:49:35 AM  

Syrrh: But think of all the jobs created by those 570,000 fraudulent policies being opened!

... what's that?
Zero?


Lots of lawyer jobs.
 
2018-04-20 11:50:02 AM  

mrmopar5287: Let's entire skip over the part where customers didn't look at what they were paying to find those details and challenge the issues.


She deserved to get raped! Did you see what she was wearing?!

/See how ridiculous that sounds?
 
2018-04-20 12:53:49 PM  

TomFooolery: Fissile: TomFooolery: Fissile: More Wells Fargo execs need to be sucked out of airplane windows at high altitude.

Ha! A PR exec at a company I don't like died in a horrific accident! Hilarious!

She was PR for Wells Fargo!  It's worse than I thought.  That's like being a PR exec for Charles Manson.

Never mind that she was a regional exec and not an any way involved in any of the scandals that the company has gone through, was actively in a number of charitable organizations, was very well respected in her local community, and left behind a husband and two kids.  Let's revel in her death because we don't like her employer! Not that you're likely to read it, but here's a tribute written by someone who actually knew her, in case you're interested in knowing anything about the the woman whose death you're celebrating.


Yeah, yeah, she was just being a good German.  Got it.
 
2018-04-20 01:50:58 PM  

Fissile: TomFooolery: Fissile: TomFooolery: Fissile: More Wells Fargo execs need to be sucked out of airplane windows at high altitude.

Ha! A PR exec at a company I don't like died in a horrific accident! Hilarious!

She was PR for Wells Fargo!  It's worse than I thought.  That's like being a PR exec for Charles Manson.

Never mind that she was a regional exec and not an any way involved in any of the scandals that the company has gone through, was actively in a number of charitable organizations, was very well respected in her local community, and left behind a husband and two kids.  Let's revel in her death because we don't like her employer! Not that you're likely to read it, but here's a tribute written by someone who actually knew her, in case you're interested in knowing anything about the the woman whose death you're celebrating.

Yeah, yeah, she was just being a good German.  Got it.


Absolutely. Being a regional exec doing company outreach and charity work for a company that screwed some customers in a totally different wing of the company is exactly the same as a concentration camp commander murdering civilians.  Totally fair comparison.  Especially from someone advocating death bank executives.
 
2018-04-20 03:09:09 PM  

TomFooolery: Fissile: TomFooolery: Fissile: More Wells Fargo execs need to be sucked out of airplane windows at high altitude.

Ha! A PR exec at a company I don't like died in a horrific accident! Hilarious!

She was PR for Wells Fargo!  It's worse than I thought.  That's like being a PR exec for Charles Manson.

Never mind that she was a regional exec and not an any way involved in any of the scandals that the company has gone through, was actively in a number of charitable organizations, was very well respected in her local community, and left behind a husband and two kids.  Let's revel in her death because we don't like her employer! Not that you're likely to read it, but here's a tribute written by someone who actually knew her, in case you're interested in knowing anything about the the woman whose death you're celebrating.


The death was at the least, hilarious, and more appropriately, farking metal. We all got to go sometime and there are millions of people who are just as good as she is.

It's not like we lost Prince, Michael Jackson, Yo Yo Ma or even Seth Macfarlane here.
 
2018-04-20 03:34:58 PM  

Moopy Mac: What didn't these people realize earlier they were being stolen from!


It is kinda a YOU problem to take care of YOUR financials.

Jim from Saint Paul: She deserved to get raped! Did you see what she was wearing?!

/See how ridiculous that sounds?


That is the absolute dumbest analogy I've ever read. The difference with WF being that people consented to what was done to them when they signed a contract.
 
2018-04-20 03:38:42 PM  

Fissile: Many people are harried and don't read the fine print.   Lawyers, politicians, businessmen, and common grifters have relied on this fact since forever.


That is their problem. This is the very definition of a YOU problem. YOU should read what YOU are signing.

Part of what I do at my job revolves around a labor contract. I'm the union steward at my shop. Everything that is in the contract is important. Words have meaning. When something says "shall" or "will," that's important. When something says "may," that's also important. I have to school management on the difference between E.G. and I.E., and why what they think something says doesn't actually mean what they think it means.

I just bought a car last month. I read every piece of paper put in front of me. The finance guy was being a complete douche and nagging me to hurry up, but I wasn't having it. When it came to the binding arbitration agreement for any problems I had with the dealership, that's where I refused to sign and the guy about had a seizure over it.

I am glad that you pressed the issue and got your dad's money back, but it's still a problem for him to have signed something he didn't read.
 
2018-04-20 07:38:00 PM  

Jim from Saint Paul: mrmopar5287: Let's entire skip over the part where customers didn't look at what they were paying to find those details and challenge the issues.

She deserved to get raped! Did you see what she was wearing?!

/See how ridiculous that sounds?


Yes, yes I do.
You're conflating money and sex. Giggity.
 
2018-04-20 08:21:34 PM  
mrmopar5287: Fissile: Many people are harried and don't read the fine print.   Lawyers, politicians, businessmen, and common grifters have relied on this fact since forever.

That is their problem. This is the very definition of a YOU problem. YOU should read what YOU are signing.

Let me extend your logic.  I'm bigger, stronger, know how to use a knife or a gun better than you.   You deserve to be victimized by me.  It's a YOU problem.
 
2018-04-20 08:35:39 PM  

mrmopar5287: Fissile: Many people are harried and don't read the fine print.   Lawyers, politicians, businessmen, and common grifters have relied on this fact since forever.

That is their problem. This is the very definition of a YOU problem. YOU should read what YOU are signing.

Part of what I do at my job revolves around a labor contract. I'm the union steward at my shop. Everything that is in the contract is important. Words have meaning. When something says "shall" or "will," that's important. When something says "may," that's also important. I have to school management on the difference between E.G. and I.E., and why what they think something says doesn't actually mean what they think it means.

I just bought a car last month. I read every piece of paper put in front of me. The finance guy was being a complete douche and nagging me to hurry up, but I wasn't having it. When it came to the binding arbitration agreement for any problems I had with the dealership, that's where I refused to sign and the guy about had a seizure over it.

I am glad that you pressed the issue and got your dad's money back, but it's still a problem for him to have signed something he didn't read.


What happened here is this: WF and their insurance contractor periodically check to make sure that cars they own the note for have full coverage insurance. For whatever reason, they somehow determined that a whole bunch of cars were not insured, and put them on their own insurance. Now, when you sign for the loan, you agree to carry full coverage in the car for the life of the loan, and agree that they can insure it themselves and charge you for it IF you fail to uphold your end of the bargain. Pretty standard terms in a car loan- especially the type of car loan that WF tends to write (sub-prime loans on used cars) These borrowers had insurance, but for whatever reason, the systems at WF and the insurer determined they didn't, which meant that they started insuring the cars themselves and tacking the cost on to the loan. In other words, they didn't sign up for the insurance. WF forced it on them without warning based on faulty information- or assumptions- or even greed.
 
2018-04-20 08:43:53 PM  

Greek: mrmopar5287: Fissile: Many people are harried and don't read the fine print.   Lawyers, politicians, businessmen, and common grifters have relied on this fact since forever.

That is their problem. This is the very definition of a YOU problem. YOU should read what YOU are signing.

Part of what I do at my job revolves around a labor contract. I'm the union steward at my shop. Everything that is in the contract is important. Words have meaning. When something says "shall" or "will," that's important. When something says "may," that's also important. I have to school management on the difference between E.G. and I.E., and why what they think something says doesn't actually mean what they think it means.

I just bought a car last month. I read every piece of paper put in front of me. The finance guy was being a complete douche and nagging me to hurry up, but I wasn't having it. When it came to the binding arbitration agreement for any problems I had with the dealership, that's where I refused to sign and the guy about had a seizure over it.

I am glad that you pressed the issue and got your dad's money back, but it's still a problem for him to have signed something he didn't read.

What happened here is this: WF and their insurance contractor periodically check to make sure that cars they own the note for have full coverage insurance. For whatever reason, they somehow determined that a whole bunch of cars were not insured, and put them on their own insurance. Now, when you sign for the loan, you agree to carry full coverage in the car for the life of the loan, and agree that they can insure it themselves and charge you for it IF you fail to uphold your end of the bargain. Pretty standard terms in a car loan- especially the type of car loan that WF tends to write (sub-prime loans on used cars) These borrowers had insurance, but for whatever reason, the systems at WF and the insurer determined they didn't, which meant that they started insuring the cars themselves and tacking the cost on to the loan. In other words, they didn't sign up for the insurance. WF forced it on them without warning based on faulty information- or assumptions- or even greed.


Great. People who read their contracts and pay attention to what they are being billed for have the chance to either: A) drop their insurance coverage and use Wells Fargo [maybe that insurance is cheaper for whatever reason], or; B) drop the WF insurance by providing proof of coverage from their own policy.

This is lazy/incompetent people who didn't do one of those things.
 
2018-04-20 09:04:09 PM  

mrmopar5287: Greek: mrmopar5287: Fissile: Many people are harried and don't read the fine print.   Lawyers, politicians, businessmen, and common grifters have relied on this fact since forever.

That is their problem. This is the very definition of a YOU problem. YOU should read what YOU are signing.

Part of what I do at my job revolves around a labor contract. I'm the union steward at my shop. Everything that is in the contract is important. Words have meaning. When something says "shall" or "will," that's important. When something says "may," that's also important. I have to school management on the difference between E.G. and I.E., and why what they think something says doesn't actually mean what they think it means.

I just bought a car last month. I read every piece of paper put in front of me. The finance guy was being a complete douche and nagging me to hurry up, but I wasn't having it. When it came to the binding arbitration agreement for any problems I had with the dealership, that's where I refused to sign and the guy about had a seizure over it.

I am glad that you pressed the issue and got your dad's money back, but it's still a problem for him to have signed something he didn't read.

What happened here is this: WF and their insurance contractor periodically check to make sure that cars they own the note for have full coverage insurance. For whatever reason, they somehow determined that a whole bunch of cars were not insured, and put them on their own insurance. Now, when you sign for the loan, you agree to carry full coverage in the car for the life of the loan, and agree that they can insure it themselves and charge you for it IF you fail to uphold your end of the bargain. Pretty standard terms in a car loan- especially the type of car loan that WF tends to write (sub-prime loans on used cars) These borrowers had insurance, but for whatever reason, the systems at WF and the insurer determined they didn't, which meant that they started insuring the cars themselves and tacking the cost on to the loan. In other words, they didn't sign up for the insurance. WF forced it on them without warning based on faulty information- or assumptions- or even greed.

Great. People who read their contracts and pay attention to what they are being billed for have the chance to either: A) drop their insurance coverage and use Wells Fargo [maybe that insurance is cheaper for whatever reason], or; B) drop the WF insurance by providing proof of coverage from their own policy.

This is lazy/incompetent people who didn't do one of those things.


Look, I'm not your Google gopher. How about you go and look up what happened instead of just assuming that a bank is being hit with a record farking fine solely because of "lazy/incompetent customers." I'll give you a little clue. People were being charged for the insurance, then they'd contact WF and inform them that they already had insurance, provided proof of said insurance, and WF still wouldn't fix the problem. After multiple attempts, in some cases, by the borrower to get it corrected. Wells Fargo has gotten the smackdown multiple times now for shady crap. While I normally might agree with you that it boils down to the customer being vigilant, this bank has now been caught doing shady shiat without telling the customer in a lot of areas, and at this point, when someone says they screwed up, the assumption should be that they in fact did so, and that they are 100% to blame, until they prove otherwise. Again, I'm not applying this to all banks. But Wells Fargo has shown themselves to be completely unworthy of any sort of trust, and the assumption needs to be that they messed up, not the customer.
 
2018-04-20 09:14:39 PM  

Greek: People were being charged for the insurance, then they'd contact WF and inform them that they already had insurance, provided proof of said insurance, and WF still wouldn't fix the problem.


How were they being charged for insurance? Capital One can try charging me for insurance on my car loan, but I'm not mailing them a check for it.

Unless they had some sort of direct debit arranged to come out of their checking account, and I'll put that down as not being smart. I don't take out loans that get automatic access to my money.
 
2018-04-20 09:31:20 PM  

mrmopar5287: Greek: People were being charged for the insurance, then they'd contact WF and inform them that they already had insurance, provided proof of said insurance, and WF still wouldn't fix the problem.

How were they being charged for insurance? Capital One can try charging me for insurance on my car loan, but I'm not mailing them a check for it.

Unless they had some sort of direct debit arranged to come out of their checking account, and I'll put that down as not being smart. I don't take out loans that get automatic access to my money.


They were charging it, adding the charge to the monthly payment on your statement, then, if you didn't pay it, they'd add it to your principal and charge late fees. One guy was getting charged an extra $600/month for the insurance, despite having provided proof of his own insurance multiple times. Granted, his was an extreme case (the loan was for a BMW 7 Series) but that's how it worked. There was a third party-the insurer- supposedly doing the verifications. Which means that when there was a problem, I can guarantee you it became a game of "call Wells Fargo, get told to call the insurer, call the insurer, who would tell them to call WF.
 
2018-04-20 10:16:47 PM  

Greek: They were charging it, adding the charge to the monthly payment on your statement, then, if you didn't pay it, they'd add it to your principal and charge late fees. One guy was getting charged an extra $600/month for the insurance, despite having provided proof of his own insurance multiple times. Granted, his was an extreme case (the loan was for a BMW 7 Series) but that's how it worked. There was a third party-the insurer- supposedly doing the verifications. Which means that when there was a problem, I can guarantee you it became a game of "call Wells Fargo, get told to call the insurer, call the insurer, who would tell them to call WF.


I guess it's just me, but I'm still not mailing them a check for any added principal and late fees. The best you can do is ask me to pay and get told NO.
 
2018-04-20 11:21:29 PM  

mrmopar5287: Greek: They were charging it, adding the charge to the monthly payment on your statement, then, if you didn't pay it, they'd add it to your principal and charge late fees. One guy was getting charged an extra $600/month for the insurance, despite having provided proof of his own insurance multiple times. Granted, his was an extreme case (the loan was for a BMW 7 Series) but that's how it worked. There was a third party-the insurer- supposedly doing the verifications. Which means that when there was a problem, I can guarantee you it became a game of "call Wells Fargo, get told to call the insurer, call the insurer, who would tell them to call WF.

I guess it's just me, but I'm still not mailing them a check for any added principal and late fees. The best you can do is ask me to pay and get told NO.


Then you're getting your car repossessed,which happened to a number of these people, hence the massive fine.
 
2018-04-21 09:29:59 AM  

jayphat: the8re: TwowheelinTim: Anybody who is still a customer with Wells Fargo is an idiot, and deserves to get farked by them again and again and again...

Not everyone has a say in who owns their mortgage.

/Biding my time to refi....

Why? Honestly, there should be a law in place that says both parties must agree for their debt to be resold to someone else. I agreed to a debt between myself and you. I didn't do it with another party. Nor did I do so so that you could turn around and sell it to someone else who can change terms and conditions.

fark, it's long past time shiat like this got returned to the hands of consumers.


Last year Citigroup announced that they were doing away with their entire mortgage servicing division, that they would only originate mortgage loans going forward
 
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