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(Irish Independent)   Student sues university over "Mickey Mouse" degree. She actually wanted the Donald Duck degree   ( independent.ie) divider line
    More: Dumbass, graduation ceremony, Mickey Mouse, University, Sunday Telegraph, Ms Wong, education demand value, Lord Ashcroft International, University Faiz Siddiqui  
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8018 clicks; posted to Main » on 13 Mar 2018 at 7:20 AM (18 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2018-03-13 01:58:35 AM  
As a 'student' also with a Mickey Mouse degree, I agree wholeheartedly.

/I wish my parents had taught me better
//At least I graduated, for whatever that's worth
///Not a piss in a pot
 
2018-03-13 04:50:15 AM  
In the mid 80s I went to Humber College for Audio Visual Production. During the tour of the campus while they were trying to recruit us they promised over 90% job placement in the industry in the first year after graduation. It looked like a good course so I enrolled.

The equipment we were being trained on was from the 60s. I was working with more advanced AV equipment at the local cable station I volunteered at in highschool. The computers in the lab were Commodore Pets, obsolete 1970s computers, so the advantage I had was my Commodore 64 meant I could do most of my computer programming assignments from home. But, you know, over 90% job placement in the industry in the first year after graduation. But then I talked to my Prof and he told me that my part time job in a computer store meant I was already placed at a job in the industry because computers are used in A/V production and I sell them. He also told me that the college considered getting a job at a video rental store also qualified as job placement "in the industry". Basically the shiatty jobs we took right out of highschool to pay for the course were considered to be industry jobs we were taking the course to get. The students at Humber all joked that the school's motto was "You should have gone to Seneca". Although to Humber's credit it did have a world class jazz music program and hospitality management program.

It was a valuable educational experience for a naive boy from a small rural town. I learned that institutions will bald-faced lie to you to separate you from your money and there's fark all you can do about it once they've got your cash.

The real kick in the balls was the CBC had just laid off a huge number of experienced AV people who were taking any job they could get so it was a great time to be an employer in the AV industry. You could either hire a Humber College grad who learned on the best technology 1968 had to offer or you could hire some guy who worked at the CBC since 1968 and was willing to work for the same shiatty wages.

The course is no longer offered at Humber, but it looks like they've essentially split it into Film and Television production and another course on Web Media production.

I wonder if the Film and Television production class is still using the giant black and white TV cameras and reel to reel video tape machines we were taught on in 1985.
 
2018-03-13 05:00:39 AM  
Also the best $150 I spent in college was on some used darkroom equipment so I could set up my own darkroom at home so I wouldn't have to stay at school late at night waiting for my booked time in the school's darkroom to work on a photography project.

Having my own darkroom meant not only being able to work on my photography projects whenever I wanted, but also for a two-four my classmates could come over and use my darkroom to work on their projects, so I got plenty of free beer out of that $150.

Every now and then a wave a nostalgia will sweep over me and I'll feel like taking my old darkroom equipment out of storage and setting it up and buying some rolls of Ilford black and white and taking some photographs on actual film which I develop myself. When that happens I just boot up Photoshop, pop the SD card from my Canon Rebel into my computer, open a bottle of vinegar and take a big sniff then thank the gods of technology that I'm not stuck in the 1980s.
 
2018-03-13 05:42:28 AM  
Oh, and speaking of the Commodore Pets. The prof for our Computer Programming for AV class had no computer programming experience. None at all. He had taught a class on using computer software but had never programmed. So the first two weeks he was trying his best to teach us from a tutorial book about programming the Commodore Pet but he wasn't able to answer any questions without flipping through the book so he'd ask the class if anyone knew the answer and being the C64 nerd I was and having spent a lot of time in my highschool's computer lab which also was stocked with ancient Commodore 64s I was able to answer every question. So he took me aside and explained the situation to me and said, "Look, here's what I'm supposed to be teaching. I'll make a deal with you. You teach the class, and I'll take it then I'll teach the lessons you give to the next semester's class and I'll give you a 98 on the class. I can't give you a 100 because it would look too suspicious."

I was so excited to be teaching the class that it never once occurred to me just how wrong what we were doing was. So I thought the class and he learned how to program a Commodore Pet and I tried my best to come up with some audio visual applications a Commodore Pet could be used for (mostly how to write a program to handle billing for a project). It was a ridiculous situation but I felt really grown-up teaching a college class even if it was unofficial and I was actually paying money to be taught. I heard that 2 years after I escaped Humber they discarded all the Commodore Pets and replaced them with IBM PC/XTs so I hope the prof learned enough about programming from me to make the transition to programming on the PC.

I also made friends with my computer graphics prof. That course was being taught on.... ugh.... Apple II+ computers. He was working with some programmers developing some animation and graphics software for UNISYS Icon computer which he was hoping to be able to sell to the Ontario Ministry of Education and so he taught us some classes using the software he was working on which at the time I thought was amazingly high tech. He was really impressed with the animation and graphics I was able to make on the machine so one day he showed me this new computer system Humber was test driving to see if it was something they could use for a course on computer graphics and animation. I can't remember what it was called, something that began with a P, like Paradigm or Paragon or Pegasus or something. It was a 286 XT computer that was hooked up to a separate custom hardware computer. The XT had a monochrome monitor on it and the other hardware box had its own custom colour display. It was the very first 3D graphics computer I'd ever worked on. You did all the vertex editing on the XT and the custom hardware box would (very slowly) render what you made. You basically had a set of different 3D primitives you could choose from and then on the XT you would use the cursor keys to scroll through the list of vertexes and edit their coordinates. You could stack a number of these primitives together and make simple objects out of them. You could then set coordinates for a path and set rotation direction and your 3D model would follow that path and rotate how you set it to. It completely blew my mind at the time but this was not technology that Humber would be teaching me. Maybe the students 2 years after me or so might get to use it, which really freaking depressed me because this was the kind of cutting edge stuff I thought I was going to be taught when they talked about the computer graphics classes that were part of our course. I didn't know it was going to be learning how to make vector graphics on an Apple II+ in BASIC. God damn that course so screwed me over.

Oh well, fast forward to now and I'm doing stuff on my laptop that would have been considered magic back when I was in college so even if I had learned all of the cutting edge stuff 1985 had to offer it'd still be obsolete right now anyway. I still want to kick myself in the ass for being suckered in by their sales pitch though.
 
#2 [TotalFark]
2018-03-13 06:39:14 AM  
img.fark.netView Full Size
 
2018-03-13 06:47:31 AM  
Maybe, instead of going to Phoenix University online, you should bite the bullet and go to an actual college.
 
2018-03-13 07:18:04 AM  
She needs to stop being goofy.
 
2018-03-13 07:36:01 AM  
Dummy, my degree from Trump U already paid for itself and I got a picture with a cardboard cutout, just like the real thing. Go fighting conmen!
 
2018-03-13 07:45:38 AM  
Unlike Celsius and Fahrenheit, a Mickey Mouse degree measures the heat inside one of them damn costumes in summertime Orlando.
 
2018-03-13 07:46:53 AM  
I keep waiting for someone to sue UNC.  Fake classes essentially devalued your degree.
 
2018-03-13 07:49:18 AM  
magazine.larchitetto.itView Full Size
 
2018-03-13 07:51:21 AM  
farkin Goofy Cum Laude
 
2018-03-13 07:58:18 AM  
She was lied to and she has a case.  I do not think she is stupid just young and gullible, but even if she were dumb that would not make defrauding her all right.  Private colleges used to prey on vets with TBI and that was wrong, so is preying on young peoples ignorance.  Unless you are a church, then it is all good.
 
2018-03-13 07:58:58 AM  

iheartscotch: Maybe, instead of going to Phoenix University online, you should bite the bullet and go to an actual college.


I would argue that you can achieve exactly the same level of education there as you can from 90% of the institutions in this country.

Think about how much time and money is wasted on non-instructional items. How many classes are "taught" by assistants. How many textbooks are used instead of proper source material.

Let's be real:  for most people, college is an opportunity to have a lot of fun, maybe pick up some education, and then you are supposedly going to land a job.

The truth is, many degrees are worthless because they don't prepare you for anything other than trying to a higher degree in the same subject in the hopes of one day earning less than minimum wage while working as an adjunct at a community college.

I have no problem with the idea of helping my son through college when the time comes...unless despite my efforts to teach him basic personal finance concepts and economic, he chooses to major in something stupid.
 
2018-03-13 07:58:59 AM  
Man, it sucks that she was forced to go to that school.
 
2018-03-13 08:01:55 AM  

winedrinkingman: She was lied to and she has a case.  I do not think she is stupid just young and gullible, but even if she were dumb that would not make defrauding her all right.  Private colleges used to prey on vets with TBI and that was wrong, so is preying on young peoples ignorance.  Unless you are a church, then it is all good.

Caveat emptor>lawsuits.

 
2018-03-13 08:08:39 AM  
She should have stayed in school and got her Ducktorate.
 
2018-03-13 08:09:30 AM  
So many schools claim to have job placement and give the impression of a guaranteed job after graduating and it's rarely ever the case.

I went to Chubb Tech for programming and they made all sorts of employment promises.  Fortunately for me, the only reason I was there was because I had a friend in the tech industry who said if I got the education, he'd get me the job.

After our finals, I think on the last day of class, the teacher is giving this grand speech about employment and says, "And we have one student who we have already placed in a job."  I'm looking around at who she's talking about and a second later she says my name.  I said, "This school didn't place me, it had nothing to do with my landing a job.  I had this job before I even came here."  She just kind of gawped at me for a second and did a fumbling kind of recovery.  Did she think I was just going to smile and say thank you?

It pissed me off because not only did I know their claims of employment were bullshiat before I enrolled, but that they were trying to take false credit to make themselves look good.  I know a lot of people in my class never got help landing a job, if any did at all, and many never got the opportunity to utilize what they learned.

It really should be illegal to lure people into investing in institutions with false promises that they have no intention on delivering.  There doesn't seem to be any repercussions for schools that do this.
 
2018-03-13 08:10:56 AM  
Yup,  not her fault, everyone else.
 
2018-03-13 08:24:51 AM  

HedlessChickn: As a 'student' also with a Mickey Mouse degree, I agree wholeheartedly.

/I wish my parents had taught me better
//At least I graduated, for whatever that's worth
///Not a piss in a pot


I pretty much came to say all of this. 50K over 4.5 years and I only worked in my field for about 3 years. It took some time to find a job, even though I graduated with honors from one of the best University's in the state for my field. And after those 3 years in the field I left the industry to peruse a different path. I make more, enjoy my job more and have a LOT  more opportunity to learn new things and advance in any path I choose. None of this required a degree of any kind.

fark College.
 
2018-03-13 08:25:26 AM  
- For profit diploma mills grossly exaggerate the value of their diplomas.

- This woman's lawsuit is ridiculous bc the college never promised that should would get a job just that their diploma would make it more likely.

Both of these statements are true.
 
2018-03-13 08:25:54 AM  
I did my MA at Saint Mary's University in Halifax. My advisor was Peter March. Long story short I wish I'd taken the option to go to the University of Saskatchewan to do it. Saint Mary's is worthless.

I also did a post-graduation certificate in technical writing that was mostly about how to justify the existence of a technical writer on the payroll, at Algonquin College in Ottawa. I got a job before the program was officially done, because the employer wanted a Unix Admin, ITIL certified, with a tech writing cert. 1/3 ain't bad.
 
2018-03-13 08:31:14 AM  
She needs to get a good Mexican lawyer to shut that school down and get her money back.
 
2018-03-13 08:32:51 AM  
Even if she had another Wong join the suit, she wouldn't be right.
 
2018-03-13 08:39:27 AM  
prlog.orgView Full Size
 
2018-03-13 08:42:03 AM  
"The prospectus convinced me that the university is really impressive," she told The Sunday Telegraph. "But, as soon as I started in 2011, I realised there were failings. "

Sounds like she got educated in good marketing after all...
 
2018-03-13 08:49:17 AM  

idrow: It really should be illegal to lure people into investing in institutions with false promises that they have no intention on delivering.  There doesn't seem to be any repercussions for schools that do this.


Hell, they lure people into the army with the same BS. Unless you're a helicopter mechanic, your army training means about dick in the job market.
 
2018-03-13 08:55:41 AM  

Natalie Portmanteau: Hell, they lure people into the army with the same BS. Unless you're a helicopter mechanic, your army training means about dick in the job market.


Oh I dunno know about that. Army Vet here. Signed up to be in the Signal Corps back in 1987..Came out, with a wonderful career 3 years later in Data Networking/Communications. Mind you this was just when the Internet was being introduced tot he public. So far so good, I'm still in the industry.

Although when I was in basic training there were a lot of fella's who signed up to be tank turret repair techs and I never quite understood how that could help them when they left the service. One of them told me.."I'm a lifer, I'll do my 20 and retire"...another one told me..."When I get out, I'll go into heavy machinery repair."  So I suppose there's a path for everyone.
 
2018-03-13 08:58:51 AM  
But this is completely acceptable under glorious free market Capitalism! In fact, the college should be commended for their creative money making scheme. Maybe if this person was smarter they would be the one ripping others off instead of getting ripped off. Do into others as best profits you - it's right there in the Bible.
 
2018-03-13 08:59:05 AM  

Natalie Portmanteau: idrow: It really should be illegal to lure people into investing in institutions with false promises that they have no intention on delivering.  There doesn't seem to be any repercussions for schools that do this.

Hell, they lure people into the army with the same BS. Unless you're a helicopter mechanic, your army training means about dick in the job market.


Directly, maybe, but some companies do like to hire ex-military, especially if hiring manager is ex-military.

/still helps to get a degree to go with the experience
 
2018-03-13 09:03:27 AM  
Here in Minnesota, there was a "college" called Minnesota School of Business. They had a program where you could become a cop. Only problem is they weren't accredited. When people found out after graduation, they sued. Part of the reason they closed. That, and losing the right to use federal student loan money.
 
2018-03-13 09:04:11 AM  
Stephen Fry on Oxford
Youtube OKuHYO9TM5A
 
2018-03-13 09:08:53 AM  

Natalie Portmanteau: idrow: It really should be illegal to lure people into investing in institutions with false promises that they have no intention on delivering.  There doesn't seem to be any repercussions for schools that do this.

Hell, they lure people into the army with the same BS. Unless you're a helicopter mechanic, your army training means about dick in the job market.


Everyone in the military should come out disciplined, focused, and hard-working which gives you a leg up on civilians.

If you were an infantry grunt who left the Army as a Corpral or lower then yeah you probably don't have much else. If you made NCO you have leadership training. Most specialized jobs have some kind of broadly transferable skill or experience - machinery repairs, electronics repairs, construction, logistics, aviation (flight or maintenance crew), medical, security,  etc.
 
2018-03-13 09:12:18 AM  
It should be noted that these "diploma mills" recruit heavily in some East Asian countries.  They set up offices here, advertise heavily with billboards and stuff like that, and sometimes have grandiose English sounding names.   And I'm sure they try to sell hard.

So what might be common knowledge in the US about the reputation of certain schools, or the ability to drive to their campus and see what's up, isn't exactly available to overseas candidates. Now is that totally excusable in this day and age of checking on the internet, maybe not as much, but still unless you know folks in the US it still can be hard to get decent info.
 
2018-03-13 09:19:43 AM  

Permanent Solutions For Permanent Problems: Natalie Portmanteau: idrow: It really should be illegal to lure people into investing in institutions with false promises that they have no intention on delivering.  There doesn't seem to be any repercussions for schools that do this.

Hell, they lure people into the army with the same BS. Unless you're a helicopter mechanic, your army training means about dick in the job market.

Everyone in the military should come out disciplined, focused, and hard-working which gives you a leg up on civilians.


Not to mention if you're lucky enough to get a security clearance as well. Those go over really well in the outside market and I am sure there's extra pay involved. I got out of the service as a Spec 4 from the Signal Corps with one year of college under my belt and I've done ok for myself. Not everyone who joins the military wants to be a NCO or be a leader. It helps on the outside, not denying that, but the work force also needs followers too.
 
2018-03-13 09:20:42 AM  

doubled99: Man, it sucks that she was forced to go to that school.


Isawwhatyoudidthere.jpg
 
2018-03-13 09:32:45 AM  

Permanent Solutions For Permanent Problems: But this is completely acceptable under glorious free market Capitalism! In fact, the college should be commended for their creative money making scheme. Maybe if this person was smarter they would be the one ripping others off instead of getting ripped off. Do into others as best profits you - it's right there in the Bible.


What does a government institution defrauding people out of their money have to do with free market capitalism?
 
2018-03-13 09:33:49 AM  

iheartscotch: Maybe, instead of going to Phoenix University online, you should bite the bullet and go to an actual college.


It's a government-run university in the UK, apparently ranked in the top 350 universities in the world.
 
2018-03-13 09:42:40 AM  
I fail to see how a 1st class degree in business in an accredited university is "worthless". Maybe the university isn't the one people think of when they say they studied in Cambridge but it's still a public university. A course in business studies is immediately applicable for anybody seeking employment unlikes certain arts & history courses.

As for her employment prospects, I have no idea what the prospectus says and maybe it presented an optimistic picture but there are clearly factors outside the institution's control. For example if the student is an insufferable, entitled, whiny idiot who threatens to disrupt their own graduation ceremony.
 
2018-03-13 10:35:18 AM  

steklo: [prlog.org image 650x459]


The diploma has a typo...that's hard. It obliviously doesn't include editing, or  Punctuation education.

School of hard knocks...

/not Hard Knocks
//hard knocks
/// 'conter'
 
2018-03-13 10:39:03 AM  
I'm always baffled at how many folks believe that they're entitled to a job because they attained a degree.
 
2018-03-13 11:02:45 AM  
The degree "does not play a role to help secure a rewarding job with prospects", she claimed, adding that the prospectus had promised the course would leave graduates "well equipped" for jobs in the business world, following two years of "high quality teaching".

That's not a promise of anything, other than that you'll be "well equipped." Whatever that means.
 
2018-03-13 11:06:54 AM  
50 years ago students were told that college prepares one for life.
 
2018-03-13 11:25:14 AM  
That's what you get with a "Women Study's" degree.
 
2018-03-13 12:12:33 PM  

Mikeyworld: steklo: [prlog.org image 650x459]

The diploma has a typo...that's hard. It obliviously doesn't include editing, or  Punctuation education.

School of hard knocks...

/not Hard Knocks
//hard knocks
/// 'conter'


And this is why its important to go to a real college.
 
2018-03-13 01:53:49 PM  
img.fark.netView Full Size
 
2018-03-13 02:35:13 PM  

boyvoyeur: That's what you get with a "Women Study's" degree.


Ahhh... see there is the problem.  You really should've done "womyns studies" instead, thats where the jobs are.
 
2018-03-13 03:09:41 PM  
So majoring in Women's studies and Liberal Arts don't help in job market.
 
2018-03-13 03:22:59 PM  
She must be Goofy, we should ship her off to Pluto.
 
2018-03-13 03:31:22 PM  
Hope she wins. Actually, she should have asked for more, a lot more.

"Higher eddication", my left buttock. More like "advanced wallet emptying".
 
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