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(Business Insider)   If you've been wondering how much tax star athletes pay out of those huge contracts, Ndamukong Suh has the answer   ( businessinsider.com) divider line
    More: Interesting, National Football League, Tax, New York, Suh, New Jersey, Michigan state taxes, Ndamukong Suh, rookie deal  
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2619 clicks; posted to Sports » on 08 Mar 2018 at 2:35 PM (32 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2018-03-08 01:30:50 PM  
Unfortunately, my tiny violin is stuck in the cushions of my fainting couch.
 
2018-03-08 02:12:24 PM  
FTA:

"then you throw in the concept of inflation, which is another 3[%], that's 48, and then living expenses, let's just say that's 2%"


"Living expenses" and inflation aren't taxes.  "Living expenses" are what your pay is supposed to cover.  If you are only spending 2% of your pay on taxes, then you are doing much better than most people can even dream.

Heck, all those taxes are also part of what your pay is supposed to cover.
 
2018-03-08 02:13:50 PM  
Ugh, I mistyped and didn't see it.

Correction:
If you are only spending 2% of your pay on living expensesthen you are doing much better than most people can even dream.
 
2018-03-08 02:24:55 PM  
they need to find some good lawyers and accountants to figure out how to turn themselves into a corporation or set up a pass-through business so they only pay 10% or whatever the stupid new law lets people get away with
 
2018-03-08 02:39:37 PM  
I feel terrible


For all the players he's taken cheap shots at over the years.
 
2018-03-08 02:43:59 PM  
"Uncle Sam, the new tax reform, 37% goes to him," he said.
Really? Is he quoting the marginal rate and ignoring both the actual rate he pays which depends on earnings, as well as not disclosing his deductions? It's just hard to be sure when tax numbers are always cherry picked to suit whatever argument is being made. His tax form would be interesting to see.
 
2018-03-08 02:45:08 PM  
Everyone wants a piece, welcome to life.
 
2018-03-08 02:50:54 PM  
Popeye Taxman
Youtube g0ahJPxfGp4
 
2018-03-08 02:51:25 PM  
it sucks when the IRS "accidentally" steps on your balls
 
2018-03-08 02:58:30 PM  
Suh has always been an asshole.  This is nothing new.
 
2018-03-08 03:06:04 PM  
As my Dad told me when I had my first paying job at 16, "If you're paying a lot of money in taxes, you're making a lot of money. Don't gripe."

Suck it up, Suh.
 
2018-03-08 03:10:09 PM  
He then beat the everloving shiat out of the reporter interviewing him, then feigned innocence.
 
2018-03-08 03:13:02 PM  
His numbers are basically correct. But it's that way for everyone, not just athletes. If you travel for work, you get taxed from a lot of places. But it's also not directly cumulative. Play a road game in Jersey, they'll tax you. But then that's also not income earned in your home state.
 
2018-03-08 03:13:27 PM  

edmo: my fainting couch.


When I bought mine, I didn't read the description carefully and accidentally bought a Farting Couch.  It's comfy and all, and the pillows are filled with activated charcoal, which is nice, but it actually says "FARTING COUCH" in two-foot yellow letters across the cushions.  It's embarrassing when company comes over.
 
2018-03-08 03:14:34 PM  

Dead for Tax Reasons: they need to find some good lawyers and accountants to figure out how to turn themselves into a corporation or set up a pass-through business so they only pay 10% or whatever the stupid new law lets people get away with


Negotiate your contract so you're paid for the offseason, but not for the season. You play for free; what they're paying you for are the mandatory appearances and other local events in your team's home state. This way you don't have to pay the jock tax in other states. (Wouldn't work, but I'd like to see someone try it.)
 
2018-03-08 03:15:01 PM  
Here is an example of a jock pay stub. This is Andrew McCutchen's paystub from May 1 to 15, 2015.
img.fark.netView Full Size
 
2018-03-08 03:15:18 PM  
Congratulations, Mr. Suh, on paying your share.

Qualification: The multistate taxation complexity is shiatty and should be sorted out. Either implement a policy of everyone paying their own states tax only or pay only the tax where the NFL is located.
 
2018-03-08 03:16:00 PM  
Does anyone in this goddamn country understand marginal tax rates? His 37% is probably an effective rate of 25%. Lower if he has an accountant worth a damn.
 
2018-03-08 03:16:10 PM  
It's really not all that much money, when you figure how much he has to pay out in fines each week for his personal fouls.
 
2018-03-08 03:19:15 PM  

The5thElement: Here is an example of a jock pay stub. This is Andrew McCutchen's paystub from May 1 to 15, 2015.[img.fark.net image 425x283]


Notice what's not on there? Social Security. Because he hit the cap in the first two weeks of the year and doesn't have to pay in anything beyond that.
 
2018-03-08 03:24:18 PM  
I remember when Magic Johnson signed a contract for 25 million for 25 years, everybody knew he wouldn't play 25 more years. Billionaire now
 
2018-03-08 03:24:59 PM  

RareChimer: Qualification: The multistate taxation complexity is shiatty and should be sorted out. Either implement a policy of everyone paying their own states tax only or pay only the tax where the NFL is located.


The NFL is located in many different states.
It's not actually that shiatty, just complex, and the team takes care of the calculation. And it's not even that unusual: partners at my firm are considered to have a portion of their income in each state in which the firm has an office, so they pay state taxes in like a dozen different states. But it's not like they're paying a dozen times the normal rate - they pay a small portion in each.

So, just for example, say your organization has ten locations (offices, teams, etc.) in ten different states and you earned a million bucks. That would be apportioned as if you earned $100k in each of those ten states. At, say, 5% each, that's $5k per state or $50k total. If instead you paid state taxes in just one state with $1M in earnings at 5%*, you'd still pay... $50k total.

While the paperwork gets complex, it is fair. Fairer than it would be if 90% of your work was done in other states, but they all got shafted and you only paid income tax in one state (which inevitably would game the system with lower income tax rates in order to convince every company to set up a closet-sized office there).
 
2018-03-08 03:30:25 PM  
Thank you dude, for telling everyone about taxes.

You guys might be interested to know that I'm in the same boat on my deal as a regular guy you have never heard of. I paid about 30k federal last year. 8k property tax. And my city is at 10.1 percent. So the next time someone yes you that I make ________ I'll just ask you to consider that I only got to spend about half of it.
 
2018-03-08 03:37:06 PM  

Dead for Tax Reasons: they need to find some good lawyers and accountants to figure out how to turn themselves into a corporation or set up a pass-through business so they only pay 10% or whatever the stupid new law lets people get away with


Username checks out.
 
2018-03-08 03:40:29 PM  

RareChimer: Congratulations, Mr. Suh, on paying your share.

Qualification: The multistate taxation complexity is shiatty and should be sorted out. Either implement a policy of everyone paying their own states tax only or pay only the tax where the NFL is located.


Lucky him, Su plays his eight home games in a state without an income tax. Not pure luck, as that's one of the reasons Su left Detroit as a free agent.

Players from teams residing in high income tax states like California have a lot more to complain about. Canada (mlb Blue Jays and nba Raptors) are probably worse.
 
2018-03-08 03:42:00 PM  

JohnBigBootay: Thank you dude, for telling everyone about taxes.

You guys might be interested to know that I'm in the same boat on my deal as a regular guy you have never heard of. I paid about 30k federal last year. 8k property tax. And my city is at 10.1 percent. So the next time someone yes you that I make ________ I'll just ask you to consider that I only got to spend about half of it.


If there's anyone I feel sorry for, it's people who post enough information in Fark threads to let people guess their general level of income without openly stating it (that would be gauche) and then complain about how overtaxed they are. I'm organizing a candle light vigil for you as we speak.
 
2018-03-08 04:09:06 PM  
thumbs.gfycat.comView Full Size
 
2018-03-08 04:23:37 PM  
interesting that he equates living expenses with taxes but doesn't mention per diem.
 
2018-03-08 04:26:12 PM  
I'd prefer to hear about pro athlete's taxes from one of their accountants or tax lawyers rather than from the player himself who only vaguely understands the subject.  Counting inflation? WTF?  Also, he's wrong about being taxed in new york and new jersey for games against the Giants - they are taxed for their game day earnings, which are in new jersey.  Not sure how new york gets a bite unless they play the Bills.

Plus, suck it dude - 95%+ of all earners pay social security tax on every paycheck, and health insurance, retirement, etc.  That adds up to a helluvalot percentage wise, on top of state and local taxes.  An NFL player like Suh caps out his social security witholding on the first check of the year, and he can cover health insurance and retirement on that first check too.  Everything after that is ONLY state/local/federal taxes - a luxury that most of us never get.
 
2018-03-08 04:26:53 PM  

The5thElement: Here is an example of a jock pay stub. This is Andrew McCutchen's paystub from May 1 to 15, 2015.[img.fark.net image 425x283]


What is the "Season Meal Money" deduction? I thought players got paid meal money on the road.
 
2018-03-08 04:29:52 PM  

Bannanaslug: "Uncle Sam, the new tax reform, 37% goes to him," he said.
Really? Is he quoting the marginal rate and ignoring both the actual rate he pays which depends on earnings, as well as not disclosing his deductions? It's just hard to be sure when tax numbers are always cherry picked to suit whatever argument is being made. His tax form would be interesting to see.


At that salary, most of his income is being taxed at the highest rate, so he's not far off.
 
2018-03-08 04:35:51 PM  

Bannanaslug: "Uncle Sam, the new tax reform, 37% goes to him," he said.
Really? Is he quoting the marginal rate and ignoring both the actual rate he pays which depends on earnings, as well as not disclosing his deductions? It's just hard to be sure when tax numbers are always cherry picked to suit whatever argument is being made. His tax form would be interesting to see.


So, there is a bunch of weirdness in his claims, and you're technically correct about marginal taxes, but when you're talking about several million a year, the difference isn't that much between just using the marginal rate vs the mathed out actual rate amount.

For example, using 2017  if you made 5 million, you'd be at 41% marginal, and 40% actual.

However, as you make less and less, it becomes much more significant, at 500K, it's still 41%, but only 31% actual, and at 50K it's 25% and 11% respectively.

And, of course, that ignores any deductions/etc.
 
2018-03-08 04:40:19 PM  

Bannanaslug: "Uncle Sam, the new tax reform, 37% goes to him," he said.
Really? Is he quoting the marginal rate and ignoring both the actual rate he pays which depends on earnings, as well as not disclosing his deductions? It's just hard to be sure when tax numbers are always cherry picked to suit whatever argument is being made. His tax form would be interesting to see.


Unless he has big donations or something weird going on, the top rate is probably a pretty reasonable estimate. At those figures the typical deductions and lower brackets are rounding errors (he is looking forward with the 37% reference so state taxes limited to $10,000).

If he basked me I would tell him that.
 
2018-03-08 04:41:16 PM  

WhackingDay: Does anyone in this goddamn country understand marginal tax rates? His 37% is probably an effective rate of 25%. Lower if he has an accountant worth a damn.


The top rate kicks in at $418,000. As you go up from that, you approach that rate. Also, AMT means it doesn't matter how good your accountant is.
 
2018-03-08 04:57:50 PM  

Theaetetus: RareChimer: Qualification: The multistate taxation complexity is shiatty and should be sorted out. Either implement a policy of everyone paying their own states tax only or pay only the tax where the NFL is located.

The NFL is located in many different states.
It's not actually that shiatty, just complex, and the team takes care of the calculation. And it's not even that unusual: partners at my firm are considered to have a portion of their income in each state in which the firm has an office, so they pay state taxes in like a dozen different states. But it's not like they're paying a dozen times the normal rate - they pay a small portion in each.

So, just for example, say your organization has ten locations (offices, teams, etc.) in ten different states and you earned a million bucks. That would be apportioned as if you earned $100k in each of those ten states. At, say, 5% each, that's $5k per state or $50k total. If instead you paid state taxes in just one state with $1M in earnings at 5%*, you'd still pay... $50k total.

While the paperwork gets complex, it is fair. Fairer than it would be if 90% of your work was done in other states, but they all got shafted and you only paid income tax in one state (which inevitably would game the system with lower income tax rates in order to convince every company to set up a closet-sized office there).


Plus, it keeps Texas teams from signing all the free agents?
 
2018-03-08 05:05:16 PM  
Must be successful if he is only paying 2% of his income on living expenses

Now i need to figure out how to do that without starving or losing my home
 
2018-03-08 05:56:26 PM  
 
2018-03-08 06:08:50 PM  
I hate it when my rent, insurance, and food comes to 2% of my salary. That's bananas. We should probably start a gofundme for these guys.
 
2018-03-08 06:37:11 PM  
Is he seriously biatching that his living expenses are 2% of his income. Dude needs a reality check and a $15/hr job.
 
2018-03-08 07:16:04 PM  

The5thElement: Here is an example of a jock pay stub. This is Andrew McCutchen's paystub from May 1 to 15, 2015.[img.fark.net image 425x283]


Good to see that he's maxing out his 401(k) at $1,500 a month. Very fiscally responsible of him.
 
2018-03-08 08:11:34 PM  
Yeah, it's not like Daniel Snyder is getting himself reamed by taxes himself.

...

...Isn't he?  He should.  Seriously, second most expensive franchise and one of the worst records...
 
2018-03-08 08:21:30 PM  

wingedkat: FTA:

"then you throw in the concept of inflation, which is another 3[%], that's 48, and then living expenses, let's just say that's 2%"


"Living expenses" and inflation aren't taxes.  "Living expenses" are what your pay is supposed to cover.  If you are only spending 2% of your pay on taxes, then you are doing much better than most people can even dream.

Heck, all those taxes are also part of what your pay is supposed to cover.


I never thought I'd be defending Donkey King Suh, but I'm guessing he's speaking about COLA or cost of living. If you sign a fixed contract a isn't likely to be factored in.  I mean, $20 mil on a rookie contract, even if you only spent half would be a shiat ton of money.  Plus no student loans...
 
2018-03-08 08:33:23 PM  

cettin: wingedkat: FTA:

"then you throw in the concept of inflation, which is another 3[%], that's 48, and then living expenses, let's just say that's 2%"


"Living expenses" and inflation aren't taxes.  "Living expenses" are what your pay is supposed to cover.  If you are only spending 2% of your pay on taxes, then you are doing much better than most people can even dream.

Heck, all those taxes are also part of what your pay is supposed to cover.

I never thought I'd be defending Donkey King Suh, but I'm guessing he's speaking about COLA or cost of living. If you sign a fixed contract a isn't likely to be factored in.  I mean, $20 mil on a rookie contract, even if you only spent half would be a shiat ton of money.  Plus no student loans...


A lot of people don't get COLAs.

And most NFL contracts increase in salary each year over their life.
 
2018-03-08 08:43:36 PM  
And that's why Robinson Cano signed with the Mariners instead of staying in New York, and why Jeter moved heaven and earth not to be classified as a New York resident, even when he was playing for the Yankees - it didn't work, but with that kind of money at stake it was worth a shot.
 
2018-03-08 09:21:32 PM  

Theaetetus: RareChimer: Qualification: The multistate taxation complexity is shiatty and should be sorted out. Either implement a policy of everyone paying their own states tax only or pay only the tax where the NFL is located.

The NFL is located in many different states.
It's not actually that shiatty, just complex, and the team takes care of the calculation. And it's not even that unusual: partners at my firm are considered to have a portion of their income in each state in which the firm has an office, so they pay state taxes in like a dozen different states. But it's not like they're paying a dozen times the normal rate - they pay a small portion in each.

So, just for example, say your organization has ten locations (offices, teams, etc.) in ten different states and you earned a million bucks. That would be apportioned as if you earned $100k in each of those ten states. At, say, 5% each, that's $5k per state or $50k total. If instead you paid state taxes in just one state with $1M in earnings at 5%*, you'd still pay... $50k total.

While the paperwork gets complex, it is fair. Fairer than it would be if 90% of your work was done in other states, but they all got shafted and you only paid income tax in one state (which inevitably would game the system with lower income tax rates in order to convince every company to set up a closet-sized office there).


while i agree with you it would be so much simpler if state and local taxes only applied to where the team was based.    So if your signed to green bay for example you may the state and local taxes applicable there no matter where your next game is .

They way I see it your employed by a team based in that state and paid by them, 8 times a year or so your required to travel for work.   Not any different really then a businessman flying around the country making sales pitches.   And yet the business man is not required to pay income tax in each of those states he stops in to ply his trade and the pro football player is .
 
2018-03-08 09:52:02 PM  
FTA: "I think people have allusions of, there's no reason guys should ever go broke," Suh said, adding, "I don't think people see those things and understand what goes into that."

"Allusions?" Seriously, motherf*cker? You couldn't write that he said, "Illusions," with an "I?" You had to write it out like he's some dumb ebonics-speaking jock? F*ck you, Davis.
 
2018-03-08 09:52:42 PM  

rzrwiresunrise: FTA: "I think people have allusions of, there's no reason guys should ever go broke," Suh said, adding, "I don't think people see those things and understand what goes into that."

"Allusions?" Seriously, motherf*cker? You couldn't write that he said, "Illusions," with an "I?" You had to write it out like he's some dumb ebonics-speaking jock? F*ck you, Davis.


Oh, and if you mistakenly wrote "allusions" because YOU don't know the difference, f*ck you all the same.
 
2018-03-08 09:58:24 PM  
I am completely shocked.......that he can form a complete sentence
 
2018-03-08 09:59:26 PM  

grimlock1972: Theaetetus: RareChimer: Qualification: The multistate taxation complexity is shiatty and should be sorted out. Either implement a policy of everyone paying their own states tax only or pay only the tax where the NFL is located.

The NFL is located in many different states.
It's not actually that shiatty, just complex, and the team takes care of the calculation. And it's not even that unusual: partners at my firm are considered to have a portion of their income in each state in which the firm has an office, so they pay state taxes in like a dozen different states. But it's not like they're paying a dozen times the normal rate - they pay a small portion in each.

So, just for example, say your organization has ten locations (offices, teams, etc.) in ten different states and you earned a million bucks. That would be apportioned as if you earned $100k in each of those ten states. At, say, 5% each, that's $5k per state or $50k total. If instead you paid state taxes in just one state with $1M in earnings at 5%*, you'd still pay... $50k total.

While the paperwork gets complex, it is fair. Fairer than it would be if 90% of your work was done in other states, but they all got shafted and you only paid income tax in one state (which inevitably would game the system with lower income tax rates in order to convince every company to set up a closet-sized office there).

while i agree with you it would be so much simpler if state and local taxes only applied to where the team was based.    So if your signed to green bay for example you may the state and local taxes applicable there no matter where your next game is .

They way I see it your employed by a team based in that state and paid by them, 8 times a year or so your required to travel for work.   Not any different really then a businessman flying around the country making sales pitches.   And yet the business man is not required to pay income tax in each of those states he stops in to ply his trade and the pro football player is .


Except that businessman is required to pay tax in all those states, unless the specific states have an agreement exempting him. The same as these athletes.
 
2018-03-08 10:08:46 PM  

dywed88: grimlock1972: Theaetetus: RareChimer: Qualification: The multistate taxation complexity is shiatty and should be sorted out. Either implement a policy of everyone paying their own states tax only or pay only the tax where the NFL is located.

The NFL is located in many different states.
It's not actually that shiatty, just complex, and the team takes care of the calculation. And it's not even that unusual: partners at my firm are considered to have a portion of their income in each state in which the firm has an office, so they pay state taxes in like a dozen different states. But it's not like they're paying a dozen times the normal rate - they pay a small portion in each.

So, just for example, say your organization has ten locations (offices, teams, etc.) in ten different states and you earned a million bucks. That would be apportioned as if you earned $100k in each of those ten states. At, say, 5% each, that's $5k per state or $50k total. If instead you paid state taxes in just one state with $1M in earnings at 5%*, you'd still pay... $50k total.

While the paperwork gets complex, it is fair. Fairer than it would be if 90% of your work was done in other states, but they all got shafted and you only paid income tax in one state (which inevitably would game the system with lower income tax rates in order to convince every company to set up a closet-sized office there).

while i agree with you it would be so much simpler if state and local taxes only applied to where the team was based.    So if your signed to green bay for example you may the state and local taxes applicable there no matter where your next game is .

They way I see it your employed by a team based in that state and paid by them, 8 times a year or so your required to travel for work.   Not any different really then a businessman flying around the country making sales pitches.   And yet the business man is not required to pay income tax in each of those states he stops in to ply his trade and the pro football player is .

Except that businessman is required to pay tax in all those states, unless the specific states have an agreement exempting him. The same as these athletes.


One exception is that many states have a income threshold if you are below you don't need to file, but those are generally no more than a grand or so, most a few hundred dollars.

Also DC is not legally allowed to assess income taxes against non-residents.
 
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