Skip to content
 
If you can read this, either the style sheet didn't load or you have an older browser that doesn't support style sheets. Try clearing your browser cache and refreshing the page.

(Ars Technica)   Google abandons Microsoft's compiler for Windows, and uses Apple's Clang compiler toolchain instead. Awkward   ( arstechnica.com) divider line
    More: Awkward, compiler, Microsoft, clang, Visual C++ compiler, Linux, Operating system, Debugger, Google  
•       •       •

2254 clicks; posted to Geek » on 06 Mar 2018 at 3:06 AM (39 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



27 Comments     (+0 »)
 
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest
 
2018-03-05 10:28:01 PM  
The open-source compiler is the compiler of choice on macOS, making it the natural option there,

Narrator:  "it wasn't actually a choice."
 
2018-03-05 10:38:48 PM  
img.fark.netView Full Size

Clang, indeed.
 
2018-03-05 11:17:31 PM  
img.fark.netView Full Size


Go Kang!
 
2018-03-06 03:12:46 AM  
img.fark.netView Full Size


I like Krang too.
 
2018-03-06 03:16:23 AM  
"Hey, Woz, the suits gave us a cool 700 bucks for the game you killed yourself for four days straight making."  "Nice."
*Hands Woz $350, pockets $5350*
 
2018-03-06 03:35:41 AM  
I'm surprised Google hasn't whipped up an AI driven compiler that corrects errors in the process of compiling.
 
2018-03-06 03:38:24 AM  

Cpl.D: "Hey, Woz, the suits gave us a cool 700 bucks for the game you killed yourself for four days straight making."  "Nice."
*Hands Woz $350, pockets $5350*


img.fark.netView Full Size
 
2018-03-06 03:56:27 AM  
After reading that, I have a pretty good idea on who subby is...lol
 
2018-03-06 03:58:59 AM  
in other news
Fark had TWO actual geek threads greened (the ipv6 and this one) within 24 hr of each other.
Feeling like old times again.
 
2018-03-06 05:50:47 AM  
Don't blame me, I voted for Clodos.
 
2018-03-06 07:09:52 AM  
LLVM came out of University  of Illinois. Clang is a front-end from UoI maintained by Apple, Google and Microsoft. So... actually... Google is still using Microsoft's compiler.
 
2018-03-06 07:35:45 AM  

t3knomanser: LLVM came out of University  of Illinois. Clang is a front-end from UoI maintained by Apple, Google and Microsoft. So... actually... Google is still using Microsoft's compiler.


Apple isn't supporting Clang/LLVM any longer. They have moved on to Swift. Google is the major maintainer of Clang/LLVM these days. So Google just moved to eating their own dog food, so to speak.
 
2018-03-06 07:53:56 AM  

wildcardjack: I'm surprised Google hasn't whipped up an AI driven compiler that corrects errors in the process of compiling.


They haven't because error removing optimization is 1990s technology that is pretty foolproof, except for the better fool factor.
 
2018-03-06 08:36:21 AM  

wildcardjack: I'm surprised Google hasn't whipped up an AI driven compiler that corrects errors in the process of compiling.


There's been error correction during compile time since the 90's. Most of the correction is in the form of bloat being slathered all over the code like some kind of sloppy spackling compound job, but there it is.
 
2018-03-06 08:38:26 AM  

farker99: Apple isn't supporting Clang/LLVM any longer. They have moved on to Swift. Google is the major maintainer of Clang/LLVM these days. So Google just moved to eating their own dog food, so to speak.


Swift is built on top of LLVM, but not Clang.
 
2018-03-06 11:04:13 AM  
 
2018-03-06 11:11:12 AM  

Ivo Shandor: If you want an example of 'awkward': https://www.extremetech.com​/computing/258154-microsoft-employee-i​nstalls-chrome-mid-demo-edge-keeps-cra​shing


Firefox has been awfully crashy for my on Win 10 lately, too.

Chrome has been fine.
 
2018-03-06 11:36:48 AM  

farker99: t3knomanser: LLVM came out of University  of Illinois. Clang is a front-end from UoI maintained by Apple, Google and Microsoft. So... actually... Google is still using Microsoft's compiler.

Apple isn't supporting Clang/LLVM any longer. They have moved on to Swift. Google is the major maintainer of Clang/LLVM these days. So Google just moved to eating their own dog food, so to speak.


Ummm. No.

LLVM was a thesis project that got open sourced. It was nowhere near ready for prime time when Apple hired the guy who wrote the thesis and bankrolled a team to work with him.

In 2005, Apple Inc. hired Lattner to begin work bringing LLVM to production quality for use in Apple products. Over time, Lattner built out the technology, personally implementing many major new features in LLVM, formed and built a team of LLVM developers at Apple, started the Clang project

Clang was an in-house Apple project right from the start.

Apple hasn't abandoned Clang. It's what they still write their freaking OS in.
 
2018-03-06 11:45:20 AM  

farker99: Apple isn't supporting Clang/LLVM any longer. They have moved on to Swift. Google is the major maintainer of Clang/LLVM these days. So Google just moved to eating their own dog food, so to speak.


It's easy to see why Google might embrace LLVM and Clang for most/all binary builds. It's closer to GCC than Visual C/C++, so there's fewer dialect-specific workarounds (the latter deviates from Standard C more than the former two). It's published under the UIUC License, which is commercial-friendly compared to the GPL. Google isn't LLVM's maintainer, but they have project leader Chris Lattner on the payroll. Lattner also did a stint at Apple, where he created Swift (as a LLVM front-end).

Apple super-pimps Swift, but there is still a LOT of macOS, iOS, et al written in C. All that POSIX/SUS stuff that makes macOS Unix would have to be rewritten, and Apple has no motive to rediscover fire. If that's not enough, Apple ships Apache HTTPd, Postfix, and OpenSSH. Those are found in most Linux distros and BSD's, and are written in C. Traditional languages will be a part of Mac development for years to come.
 
2018-03-06 11:50:34 AM  
all because the GPL is shiat, otherwise they could just use GCC.
 
2018-03-06 12:02:35 PM  

Ball of Confusion: all because the GPL is shiat, otherwise they could just use GCC.


Nope. It was more about the fact that GCC wasn't designed to integrate into a modern IDE.

LLVM 2.0
Youtube 029YXzHtRy0
 
gcc
2018-03-06 12:27:32 PM  
Boy I sure do love all the comment notifications this thread is generating...
 
2018-03-06 12:57:36 PM  
I might be misreading, but the headline implies Apple created the alternate clang, while in truth, the alternate clang is simply the one that Apple chooses to employ, themselves, as well.
 
2018-03-06 01:58:21 PM  

T.rex: I might be misreading, but the headline implies Apple created the alternate clang, while in truth, the alternate clang is simply the one that Apple chooses to employ, themselves, as well.


You are incorrect. Clang was created inside Apple and then open sourced.

Starting in 2005, Apple made extensive use of LLVM in a number of commercial systems, including the iPhone software development kit (SDK) and integrated development environment (IDE) Xcode 3.1.

One of the first uses of LLVM was an OpenGL code compiler for OS X that converts OpenGL calls into more fundamental calls for graphics processing units (GPU) that do not support certain features. This allowed Apple to support the entire OpenGL application programming interface (API) on computers using Intel Graphics Media Accelerator (GMA) chipsets, increasing performance on those machines. For GPUs that support it, the code is compiled to exploit fully the underlying hardware, but on GMA machines, LLVM compiles the same OpenGL code into subroutines to ensure continued proper function.

LLVM was intended originally to use GCC's front end, but GCC turned out to cause some problems for developers of LLVM and at Apple. The GCC source code is a large and somewhat cumbersome system for developers to work with; as one long-time GCC developer put it, "Trying to make the hippo dance is not really a lot of fun".

Apple chose to develop a new compiler front end from scratch, supporting C, Objective-C and C++. This "clang" project was open-sourced in July 2007.
 
2018-03-06 02:27:09 PM  
BullBearMS:
You are incorrect. Clang was created inside Apple and then open sourced.

Thank you....
 
2018-03-06 04:03:34 PM  
Clang? Isn't that the noise you hear when Apple employees run into the glass wall?
 
2018-03-07 04:57:14 PM  
Good luck doing any serious debugging unless they have figured out how to make .PDB symbolic debugging information files under clang that are compatible with the Debugging Tools for Windows package. There are plenty of user mode device driver .DLL files that load into every browser and those who must debug them will frown upon such shenanigans.
 
Displayed 27 of 27 comments

View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest

This thread is archived, and closed to new comments.

Continue Farking





On Twitter



Top Commented
Javascript is required to view headlines in widget.
  1. Links are submitted by members of the Fark community.

  2. When community members submit a link, they also write a custom headline for the story.

  3. Other Farkers comment on the links. This is the number of comments. Click here to read them.

  4. Click here to submit a link.

Report