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(The New York Times)   Scientist discover far more fetal alcohol syndrome in US population than was previously thought to exist before Trump election victory   ( nytimes.com) divider line
    More: Sad, Fetal alcohol syndrome, fetal alcohol, Pregnancy, Alcohol, Brain damage, fetal alcohol spectrum, Attention-deficit hyperactivity disorder, Alcohol abuse  
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2936 clicks; posted to Main » on 07 Feb 2018 at 1:24 AM (22 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



47 Comments     (+0 »)
 
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2018-02-07 12:47:01 AM  
Culturally, this country's strong puritanical mindset makes it difficult for women to choose to terminate pregnancies of fetuses that are handicapped in some way. Instead of courageous and smart for ending a pregnancy in order to finish school or to sliding back into poverty, abortions based on physical or mental handicaps are seen as selfishness.

Changing this country's culture is difficult, but maybe if enough babies are born with this easily detectable and easily preventable problem, maybe one day we can look at pregnancy and child rearing as a choice available to women rather than their duty.
 
2018-02-07 01:10:13 AM  
img.fark.netView Full Size
 
2018-02-07 01:16:48 AM  
I'm a guy, but I'm still trying to do my part.

*chugs liquor*
 
2018-02-07 01:37:10 AM  
There's a visible form, and the binge form. It's a bit like lead poisoning, you can't tell at a glimpse. But if you can get the subject population to cut back on exposure, all the better.

I actually suspect this was a part of the Flynn effect. In the past century, we've gotten women to cut back on alcohol and tobacco, and pulled lead out of the atmosphere. Those three clear problems contributed to reducing natal intelligence, and improved B-vitamins in the food supply bumped up the general score.
 
2018-02-07 01:50:46 AM  
I can't even imagine how much a woman would have to drink to cause FAS.  I didn't find out I was pregnant with my daughter until almost seven months and up until that point, I drank A LOT.  I obviously stopped once I got the "happy news", and my now 18yr.old just made dean's list.  Still, how the hell does someone stay that wasted all the time to cause this, though?
 
2018-02-07 01:57:03 AM  
SomeFarkinFarmgirl:

You think you drank?

Read about Keith Moon or Hunter S Thomson.

Your handle of Jack a day makes you a teetotaler in their league.
 
2018-02-07 01:57:27 AM  
 I was drunk before Trump was nominated, subby.
 
2018-02-07 01:59:35 AM  

AverageAmericanGuy: Culturally, this country's strong puritanical mindset makes it difficult for women to choose to terminate pregnancies of fetuses that are handicapped in some way. Instead of courageous and smart for ending a pregnancy in order to finish school or to sliding back into poverty, abortions based on physical or mental handicaps are seen as selfishness.

Changing this country's culture is difficult, but maybe if enough babies are born with this easily detectable and easily preventable problem, maybe one day we can look at pregnancy and child rearing as a choice available to women rather than their duty.


Are you trolling? To be fair, I don't like it when people equate, say, aborting a handicapped child with government mandated eugenics, but a lot of people who aren't particularly anti-choice or religious have issues with it. Anyone who reads Fark and the news a lot has very likely read a hand-wringing article about the future of genetic testing, when it will be possible to terminate a pregnancy based on information about all sorts of characteristics and handicaps.
 
2018-02-07 02:02:25 AM  

doglover: SomeFarkinFarmgirl:

You think you drank?

Read about Keith Moon or Hunter S Thomson.

Your handle of Jack a day makes you a teetotaler in their league.


I'm sure that if either of them had been equipped to incubate a fetus, it would have been born with FAS.
 
2018-02-07 02:03:09 AM  

wildcardjack: There's a visible form, and the binge form. It's a bit like lead poisoning, you can't tell at a glimpse.


Had a tenant years ago who had two older kids, both with FAS. Their eyes were a little on the beady side, and a little too close together, but apart from that you wouldn't know they were disabled unless you spoke to them.

For having destroyed their minds their mother got a fat SSI check every month which she dutifully signed over to me on receiving. Basically the kids paid the rent.

Based on the the kids' ages, I guess Carter would have been president at the time of their conception.
 
2018-02-07 02:05:08 AM  

wildcardjack: There's a visible form, and the binge form. It's a bit like lead poisoning, you can't tell at a glimpse. But if you can get the subject population to cut back on exposure, all the better.

I actually suspect this was a part of the Flynn effect. In the past century, we've gotten women to cut back on alcohol and tobacco, and pulled lead out of the atmosphere. Those three clear problems contributed to reducing natal intelligence, and improved B-vitamins in the food supply bumped up the general score.


It is common knowledge (I think) that the US has unusually high infant mortality. This fact is usually brought up in debates about the US health care system, to prove that the system sucks compared to other countries. However, I don't usually see any discussion of underlying causes.

I happened to read something a while ago that said the higher infant mortality in the US is almost entirely due to the higher number of premature babies. The full term babies survive just as well as in other countries, and the preemies survive at least as well - it's just there are more preemies.

I'm not sure what the underlying cause of that is, but it seems like a question worth asking.
 
2018-02-07 02:06:55 AM  
img.fark.netView Full Size
img.fark.net
 
2018-02-07 02:09:10 AM  
The band - The Weight (Take a load off Annie/Fanny)
Youtube HmRDM7GyJXE
 
2018-02-07 02:09:49 AM  

SomeFarkinFarmgirl: doglover: SomeFarkinFarmgirl:

You think you drank?

Read about Keith Moon or Hunter S Thomson.

Your handle of Jack a day makes you a teetotaler in their league.

I'm sure that if either of them had been equipped to incubate a fetus, it would have been born with FAS.


I'm sure if either could have carried a child, it would have come out as fully grown greek man in a toga with a crown of grapes and an everflowing cup of spirits.
 
2018-02-07 02:23:30 AM  

SomeFarkinFarmgirl: I can't even imagine how much a woman would have to drink to cause FAS.  I didn't find out I was pregnant with my daughter until almost seven months and up until that point, I drank A LOT.  I obviously stopped once I got the "happy news", and my now 18yr.old just made dean's list.  Still, how the hell does someone stay that wasted all the time to cause this, though?


A lot of the problems are about timing as much as quantity.  One of my kids was diagnosed at birth, as mom was arrested for DUI and went into labor.  She then reported having been kicked out of her obgyn for failure to follow Drs orders.  She estimated consuming between 12-24 beers daily.  The kid has been receiving intense intervention since the age of 33 months, but remains developmentally half the chronological age.  As the child ages, the once obvious facial anomalies smooth out, and that's when the real trouble starts.  Because the disability is mostly confined inside, it's assumed the kid is acting up by choice.  We have testing that goes back years, including brain scans that show how much is missing.  A person missing an arm or leg gets pity, while a person missing brain mass gets blame.
What you consider a lot of drinking may not have been, or maybe your family has good genetics and you've been blessed.  My kid has compensations for cognitive dysfunction, and we've been privileged to be a part of the ongoing research in fetal alcohol syndrome.  Unfortunately, there are communities that are devastated by alcoholism, and getting women in the child bearing years to limit or abstain from consuming a legal substance is almost impossible.  It's also a legacy thing.  First kid is a handful, have a few drinks to unwind, get pregnant again, and now there's two handfuls, pretty soon Mom is overwhelmed, especially if the Dad (s) is out of the picture.  Kids grow up with a Mom who drinks to cope and that's normal, so the cycle continues.
Glad your kid turned out so well, but read up on the effects and see if there are any that might apply.  The research groups are always looking for outliers to include.  One guy in our support group has some of the exact problems, but it was his dad that was alcoholic.  Male alcoholism and offspring are not even studied due to the variable nightmare, but this guy lives with many of the issues the rest of us see in our kids.
 
2018-02-07 02:29:44 AM  

itcamefromschenectady: I happened to read something a while ago that said the higher infant mortality in the US is almost entirely due to the higher number of premature babies. The full term babies survive just as well as in other countries, and the preemies survive at least as well - it's just there are more preemies.

I'm not sure what the underlying cause of that is, but it seems like a question worth asking.


Being very overweight is a significant underlying cause of premature birth. While Pacific island states lead the world in fat women, the U.S. isn't far behind.
 
2018-02-07 02:32:04 AM  
Didn't this stupidity make the rounds months ago?

It's still based on self reporting and interpretations on facial features to place children on a spectrum of fetal alcohol syndrome disorders with no strong correlation on outcomes, right?  And funded by abolitionists?

Or was that a different incredibly similar study.
 
2018-02-07 02:33:26 AM  
Having been to Traverse City, I dare say there are entire communities built around FAS as a way of life.
 
2018-02-07 02:34:33 AM  
FTA: The study, published Tuesday in the journal JAMA, estimates that fetal alcohol syndrome and other alcohol-related disorders among American children are at least as common as autism

So is it becoming more common or have doctors just expanded the definition, like they did with autism a few years back?
 
2018-02-07 02:44:22 AM  

cherryl taggart: SomeFarkinFarmgirl: I can't even imagine how much a woman would have to drink to cause FAS.  I didn't find out I was pregnant with my daughter until almost seven months and up until that point, I drank A LOT.  I obviously stopped once I got the "happy news", and my now 18yr.old just made dean's list.  Still, how the hell does someone stay that wasted all the time to cause this, though?

A lot of the problems are about timing as much as quantity.  One of my kids was diagnosed at birth, as mom was arrested for DUI and went into labor.  She then reported having been kicked out of her obgyn for failure to follow Drs orders.  She estimated consuming between 12-24 beers daily.  The kid has been receiving intense intervention since the age of 33 months, but remains developmentally half the chronological age.  As the child ages, the once obvious facial anomalies smooth out, and that's when the real trouble starts.  Because the disability is mostly confined inside, it's assumed the kid is acting up by choice.  We have testing that goes back years, including brain scans that show how much is missing.  A person missing an arm or leg gets pity, while a person missing brain mass gets blame.
What you consider a lot of drinking may not have been, or maybe your family has good genetics and you've been blessed.  My kid has compensations for cognitive dysfunction, and we've been privileged to be a part of the ongoing research in fetal alcohol syndrome.  Unfortunately, there are communities that are devastated by alcoholism, and getting women in the child bearing years to limit or abstain from consuming a legal substance is almost impossible.  It's also a legacy thing.  First kid is a handful, have a few drinks to unwind, get pregnant again, and now there's two handfuls, pretty soon Mom is overwhelmed, especially if the Dad (s) is out of the picture.  Kids grow up with a Mom who drinks to cope and that's normal, so the cycle continues.
Glad your kid turned out so well, but read up on the effects and see if there are any that might apply.  The research groups are always looking for outliers to include.  One guy in our support group has some of the exact problems, but it was his dad that was alcoholic.  Male alcoholism and offspring are not even studied due to the variable nightmare, but this guy lives with many of the issues the rest of us see in our kids.


I have nothing but sympathy for children who grow up dealing with the effects of FAS.  When I found out I was pregnant, I was immediately sick with guilt and worry about how my party-hard lifestyle would impact the kid.  I was a 12-24 drink-a-night partier, but being being responsible for the health of a defenseless potential-human can sober you up really damn quick.

/still haven't ruled out alien insemination
//it's weird when your pregnancy only shows up on a blood test
 
2018-02-07 02:49:51 AM  

SomeFarkinFarmgirl: Still, how the hell does someone stay that wasted all the time to cause this, though?


More than my mother did with me and my brother. My brother works with his degree, and although I went non-traditional in my education, my IQ tested +120 at 17.

Our eyes are a very normal width apart, too. LOL
 
2018-02-07 04:06:10 AM  

SomeFarkinFarmgirl: I was a 12-24 drink-a-night partier


Wow. I guess it's true what they say about Farkers...is that every night or only "party nights"?
 
2018-02-07 05:24:29 AM  
img.fark.netView Full Size
 
2018-02-07 05:27:19 AM  
I mean, it's obvious now, but how did they get to voting age before aanyone noticed. We really dropped the ball...
 
2018-02-07 05:37:01 AM  

uttertosh: SomeFarkinFarmgirl: Still, how the hell does someone stay that wasted all the time to cause this, though?

More than my mother did with me and my brother. My brother works with his degree, and although I went non-traditional in my education, my IQ tested +120 at 17.

Our eyes are a very normal width apart, too. LOL


Is your family part of any studies?  Especially any for people with average and above IQ's?  Yeah, I'm on a tear this morning.  If you are on the west coast, look up Dr. Anne Streissguth, she's the foremost researcher on FAS in the world.  If you are on the east coast, check on the Emory University website, outside Atlanta, GA.  Dr. Claire Coles and Dr. Molly Millians are constantly looking for new subjects to study.  Emory also is constantly studying autism, and regularly tries to get pregnant women and new moms to let their babies be studied, trying to unlock more answers about just how far back autism develops.  The kids that present with obvious issues are not nearly so fascinating as the kids that present with only subtle issues, and help define the spectrums for both conditions.  One horrifying stat I read years ago was about the numbers of kids with FAS that never complete high school, but do get time in prison, something along the lines of 60%,  So finding and studying the people who finish high school and above should help raise the percentage for completion of school in future generations.
 
2018-02-07 05:51:14 AM  
Ugh, FASD enrages me.  100% preventable and completely devastating, requiring the work and suffering of so many people you meet along the way.  So much time, money, and emotional investment spent trying to mitigate your fark up.  Just because YOU just had to drink. Gah.

/general you
 
2018-02-07 05:51:58 AM  
I had a convo once with a foster mom. She said dealing with FAS babies was much more difficult than crack babies and it had to do with how the drug(s) worked on the brain.
 
2018-02-07 05:56:08 AM  
img.fark.netView Full Size
 
2018-02-07 06:04:00 AM  
Her body, her choice. STFU
 
2018-02-07 06:44:53 AM  
The only solution is to abort all babies until Trump is out of office. Thanks for the unbiased political slant on everything, everywhere, forever, amen. Syndrome beyond a syndrome.
 
2018-02-07 07:05:19 AM  
It's funny because Trumperdink supporters exhibit severely reduced mental limitations.
 
2018-02-07 07:37:52 AM  

Dahnkster: [img.fark.net image 640x360]


Also a poster child for FAS...

cdn.cnn.comView Full Size
 
2018-02-07 09:11:27 AM  
So subby is saying these people hate Trump more than they love their unborn child
 
2018-02-07 09:17:21 AM  

serfdood: Dahnkster: [img.fark.net image 640x360]

Also a poster child for FAS...

[cdn.cnn.com image 850x478]"


"the degree and area of a child's brain damage ".
I think you're correct about this and the rise of alt-right. Will be interesting to see what the opioid epidemic brings.
 
2018-02-07 09:34:01 AM  

SomeFarkinFarmgirl: I can't even imagine how much a woman would have to drink to cause FAS.  I didn't find out I was pregnant with my daughter until almost seven months and up until that point, I drank A LOT.  I obviously stopped once I got the "happy news", and my now 18yr.old just made dean's list.  Still, how the hell does someone stay that wasted all the time to cause this, though?


There is no threshold for FAS.  My Dad (OB/GYN for 35 years before retiring) explained it this way:  To see the minimum safe level of a toxin, you do a statistical analysis (actually they do many, many of them) of a population with varying degrees of exposure and look for some minimum exposure below which there is no measurable harm.  In the case of FAS, there is no such minimum exposure.
One data point does NOT refute decades of medical evidence.
 
2018-02-07 09:44:05 AM  
The CDC's Preachy Recommendations on Pregnancy and Alcohol. and the Internet's Overreaction
Youtube qkKcWsrzdX0
 
2018-02-07 10:34:24 AM  

Dahnkster: [img.fark.net image 640x360]


Cam for Scott Walker.

/Figuratively, not literally.
 
2018-02-07 10:44:48 AM  
Depressed liberals are drinking through their pregnancies?
 
2018-02-07 10:51:38 AM  
(Mitch McConnel . jpg)
 
2018-02-07 10:53:32 AM  
Scientist discover far more fetal alcohol syndrome in US population than was previously thought to exist before Trump election victory

I guess the implication here is that liberals would be more likely to try and ignore a reality they didn't like by using drugs rather than face it?  Meh, probably true, subs, probably true.
 
2018-02-07 12:39:30 PM  

sex_and_drugs_for_ian: wildcardjack: There's a visible form, and the binge form. It's a bit like lead poisoning, you can't tell at a glimpse.

Had a tenant years ago who had two older kids, both with FAS. Their eyes were a little on the beady side, and a little too close together, but apart from that you wouldn't know they were disabled unless you spoke to them.

For having destroyed their minds their mother got a fat SSI check every month which she dutifully signed over to me on receiving. Basically the kids paid the rent.

Based on the the kids' ages, I guess Carter would have been president at the time of their conception.


Here in calistan I was behind a woman who bought some sushi and 30 bottles of wine on EBT.
Lovely system we got.
 
2018-02-07 02:14:14 PM  
Hmmmmm.  This makes me wonder if the decreased crime rate in the past few decades has anything to do with increased awareness of dangers of drinking while pregnant.  Because one of the hallmark behaviors of fetal alcohol disorders is an inability to understand the connection between actions and consequences.
 
2018-02-07 02:55:11 PM  

SomeFarkinFarmgirl: I can't even imagine how much a woman would have to drink to cause FAS.  I didn't find out I was pregnant with my daughter until almost seven months and up until that point, I drank A LOT.  I obviously stopped once I got the "happy news", and my now 18yr.old just made dean's list.  Still, how the hell does someone stay that wasted all the time to cause this, though?


You probably just dodged a bullet.  The amount of alcohol and it takes to affect the fetus is highly variable and can vary down to the day of development whether the brain or the physical features are affected.  I have also heard that the first or second child will not be as affected as subsequent children because the placental barrier brakes down in later pregnancies. I have heard of other studies where one twin was affected and the other was not.  It is a crap shoot.  But that is why they tell all women to completely abstain from drinking because it's not something you can test for (ethically).

I am raising a son on the milder end of the FASD spectrum.  He is 10.  Very few physical features but impulse control, emotional control and executive functioning impairments. He is smart and aware enough to know his brain is different that his friends and he gets really depressed about it.  I am hoping he can get through high school and stay out of jail or end his life due to depression.  He has an older bio brother who is not affected.  It makes me sad to think of how my son's life would have been different with out FASD.
 
2018-02-07 03:44:28 PM  
Don't you dare tell a pregnant woman to abstain from drugs or drink while pregnant, because it's her body, her choice. That the kid pays the price doesn't matter.
 
2018-02-07 06:51:30 PM  
i.pinimg.comView Full Size


No masturbating, Dems ...
 
2018-02-08 04:54:13 AM  

cherryl taggart: the kids that present with only subtle issues, and help define the spectrums for both conditions


I'm in Sweden, so I doubt I'd be of interest to the study, but 'subtle issues' is what I had. I was 'tested' for Autism in the 80's. The thing is, that a 6 year old me LOVED tests, and even more loved PASSING tests. I tried my hardest and passed all the psych-tests!! I was most annoyed that I didn't get a gold star. I felt cheated.

My mother also stopped smoking only after giving birth to me. I got your asthma right here!

*sigh* I guess that the kids of my generation will be tested for FVS Fetal Vegan Syndrome sometime in the future
 
2018-02-08 09:27:47 AM  

Best Princess Celestia: sex_and_drugs_for_ian: wildcardjack: There's a visible form, and the binge form. It's a bit like lead poisoning, you can't tell at a glimpse.

Had a tenant years ago who had two older kids, both with FAS. Their eyes were a little on the beady side, and a little too close together, but apart from that you wouldn't know they were disabled unless you spoke to them.

For having destroyed their minds their mother got a fat SSI check every month which she dutifully signed over to me on receiving. Basically the kids paid the rent.

Based on the the kids' ages, I guess Carter would have been president at the time of their conception.

Here in calistan I was behind a woman who bought some sushi and 30 bottles of wine on EBT.
Lovely system we got.


I'm going to call bullshiat on the wine on EBT, that's not a allowable purchase on EBT.

Sushi, being pre-made, typically isn't allowed but some states allow "cold pre-made food" to be purchased with an EBT card.

/Former cashier
 
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