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(The Atlantic)   So ... your free shipping helps make Amazon a crappy place to work   ( theatlantic.com) divider line
    More: Obvious, san bernardino, San Bernardino, California, Amazon, Amazon.com, Amazon River, Inland Empire, Amazon employees, new Amazon facility  
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1547 clicks; posted to Business » on 02 Feb 2018 at 4:20 PM (23 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



30 Comments     (+0 »)
 
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2018-02-02 03:30:18 PM  
Shut up and make with the single roll of scotch tape I ordered for free 2-hour delivery, peon.
 
2018-02-02 03:43:28 PM  

Diogenes: Shut up and make with the single roll of scotch tape I ordered for free 2-hour delivery, peon.


img.fark.netView Full Size
 
2018-02-02 04:00:00 PM  
My nephew worked in an Amazon warehouse and says it was quite crappy.
 
2018-02-02 04:23:57 PM  
I might be a weirdo, but I actually think of the people picking the order when I order something. Lots of times I think, know what? I can go out and have this thing in and for like, the same price.

And that's what I do.
 
2018-02-02 04:32:12 PM  
Mixed feelings on this. Obviously a good job with a living wage is the goal. However, some jobs are hard. That doesn't mean one shouldn't be compensated, but complaining that you're on your feet all day at a job moving stuff around a warehouse isn't really smrt.

Would like to see someone with time and math skills figure out ways to make the job more pleasant and yet still profitable for Amazon. Some combination of higher pay with higher product costs or more breaks or fewer widgets out the door or better incentives.

And it's interesting to hear the same old same old complaints from factory workers of bygone eras. Comparing workers against the average is how you get slower and slower workers...and how faster workers discover why it's not so smart to work faster than your compadres. And management not listening to workers, who probably have some very good ideas, is classic.

Bezos is at least partly liberal and he should take some notice of these articles. He should be figuring out ways to benefit the company AND workers.

How get those trash bags to my house peons!
 
2018-02-02 04:36:55 PM  
These red blooded Muricans can't make it at Amazon, how in the fark are they going to make working 12 hrs a day 6 days a week at the warehouses in the food industry?
 
2018-02-02 04:40:13 PM  
I've been to an Amazon DC on a couple of occasions. Place is locked down like a prison, and I can understand that.

A couple of years ago during a brutal summer Amazon had to hire ambulances to stand by in the parking lot, because employees kept passing out while they were rushing to fill their order quotas.
http://www.mcall.com/news/local/amazo​n​/mc-allentown-amazon-complaints-201109​17-story.html
 
2018-02-02 04:51:46 PM  
What I find really sketchy about Amazon's warehouse culture is how they won the right to make workers stand in line to be checked before they can leave.  They aren't paid for this time mind you, no no that is some how perfectly okay.  They 'clock out' and can then spend upwards of half an hour waiting to be allowed to leave.

That's some shady shiat and I wary of supporting a company like Amazon who does that sort of stuff.
 
2018-02-02 04:54:27 PM  
If you want companies to follow some kind of unwritten rules for how they should operate then farking WRITE THEM DOWN. Make them into law. Regulation isn't a bad thing FFS.
 
2018-02-02 04:57:28 PM  
seems like its only a narrow matter of time until the robots take over these jobs completely
 
2018-02-02 05:01:48 PM  

BumpInTheNight: What I find really sketchy about Amazon's warehouse culture is how they won the right to make workers stand in line to be checked before they can leave.  They aren't paid for this time mind you, no no that is some how perfectly okay.  They 'clock out' and can then spend upwards of half an hour waiting to be allowed to leave.

That's some shady shiat and I wary of supporting a company like Amazon who does that sort of stuff.


If they're not getting paid for it, it's straight-up illegal. Now. It's illegal now. They should be made to either pay people for their time or stop doing it that way.
 
2018-02-02 05:04:22 PM  
San Bernardino - a horrible thing that shouldn't exist.. like work... and god.
 
2018-02-02 05:15:35 PM  

Smelly Pirate Hooker: BumpInTheNight: What I find really sketchy about Amazon's warehouse culture is how they won the right to make workers stand in line to be checked before they can leave.  They aren't paid for this time mind you, no no that is some how perfectly okay.  They 'clock out' and can then spend upwards of half an hour waiting to be allowed to leave.

That's some shady shiat and I wary of supporting a company like Amazon who does that sort of stuff.

If they're not getting paid for it, it's straight-up illegal. Now. It's illegal now. They should be made to either pay people for their time or stop doing it that way.


That's what you think, but unfortunately the american supreme court doesn't see it that way:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politi​c​s/courts_law/supreme-court-rules-amazo​n-doesnt-have-to-pay-for-after-hours-t​ime-in-security-lines/2014/12/09/05c67​c0c-7fb9-11e4-81fd-8c4814dfa9d7_story.​html?utm_term=.4b39dca081e6

So uh, yah.  I don't buy things from Amazon.

/at least I won't until all the workers are robots
 
2018-02-02 05:28:39 PM  

LadySusan: Mixed feelings on this. Obviously a good job with a living wage is the goal. However, some jobs are hard. That doesn't mean one shouldn't be compensated, but complaining that you're on your feet all day at a job moving stuff around a warehouse isn't really smrt.

Would like to see someone with time and math skills figure out ways to make the job more pleasant and yet still profitable for Amazon. Some combination of higher pay with higher product costs or more breaks or fewer widgets out the door or better incentives.

And it's interesting to hear the same old same old complaints from factory workers of bygone eras. Comparing workers against the average is how you get slower and slower workers...and how faster workers discover why it's not so smart to work faster than your compadres. And management not listening to workers, who probably have some very good ideas, is classic.

Bezos is at least partly liberal and he should take some notice of these articles. He should be figuring out ways to benefit the company AND workers.

How get those trash bags to my house peons!


It's a job, not a fluffy fun party.
Get over it, or quit.
 
2018-02-02 06:16:16 PM  

BumpInTheNight: https://www.washingtonpost.com/politi​c​s/courts_law/supreme-court-rules-amazo​n-doesnt-have-to-pay-for-after-hours-t​ime-in-security-lines/2014/12/09/05c67​c0c-7fb9-11e4-81fd-8c4814dfa9d7_story.​html


I worked at a Cracker Barrel restaurant that would padlock the front doors as soon as the last guest was gone at closing time. Those employees left in the building would do their closing duties and the managers would tell the employees to wait by the timeclock until about 2-3 were in a group, bunched and ready to leave. The managers would have everyone punch out, immediately walk to the front door, and be let out with a quick & perfunctory check of any purse or backpack people had with them. That was decent of them.

I always wondered why coal miners got paid for the 30 minutes it takes to ride the elevator down the the face and then  the 30 minutes to ride back up at the end of their shift. I guess that's a negotiated benefit. By the Supreme Court ruling, the mine isn't paying the miners to ride the elevator.
 
2018-02-02 06:36:01 PM  

BumpInTheNight: Smelly Pirate Hooker: BumpInTheNight: What I find really sketchy about Amazon's warehouse culture is how they won the right to make workers stand in line to be checked before they can leave. They aren't paid for this time mind you, no no that is some how perfectly okay. They 'clock out' and can then spend upwards of half an hour waiting to be allowed to leave.

That's some shady shiat and I wary of supporting a company like Amazon who does that sort of stuff.

If they're not getting paid for it, it's straight-up illegal. Now. It's illegal now. They should be made to either pay people for their time or stop doing it that way.

That's what you think, but unfortunately the american supreme court doesn't see it that way:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politic​s/courts_law/supreme-court-rules-amazo​n-doesnt-have-to-pay-for-after-hours-t​ime-in-security-lines/2014/12/09/05c67​c0c-7fb9-11e4-81fd-8c4814dfa9d7_story.​html?utm_term=.4b39dca081e6

So uh, yah. I don't buy things from Amazon.

/at least I won't until all the workers are robots


Funny because courts in Colorado rule the exact opposite around this same time on the same law(Portal to Portal Act) when corrections officers went to court for the same thing(not being paid for security checks into and out of the facility, to make sure they are not smuggling items in and out of prison).  They are now paid portal to portal, but they had to make a concession of using punch terminals to do so(very unusual in public safety).
 
2018-02-02 06:42:26 PM  
Fair enough, Subby, but buying stuff on Amazon also pays the wages of the people working there.

/Oh, and the shipping is not "free". There just isn't a line item for it.
 
2018-02-02 06:46:29 PM  

bhcompy: Funny because courts in Colorado rule the exact opposite around this same time on the same law(Portal to Portal Act) when corrections officers went to court for the same thing(not being paid for security checks into and out of the facility, to make sure they are not smuggling items in and out of prison). They are now paid portal to portal, but they had to make a concession of using punch terminals to do so(very unusual in public safety).


I was actually flabbergasted to learn that the supreme court didn't find these mandatory security lines were part of their paid time myself.  It reminds of back in my first call center job where they'd over-subscribed the work stations and being a cheap out-sourcing place they left a number of systems in unworkable states.  Any ways you'd often spend up to the first half hour of your day hunting for a place to sit and they wouldn't let you count that time as paid.  Same place decided that if your last call went over your shift they wouldn't pay you unless it was significant enough like half an hour or longer.

I hate sketchy policies like this and go out of my way not to patron businesses that abuse them.
 
2018-02-02 06:51:25 PM  
Since Amazon warehouses are huge, they end up in places where real estate is cheap.  99.9 times out of 100, that's in economically depressed areas. That's why it's San Bernardino as opposed to Huntington Beach.

They're the burger flipping jobs of the 21st century only more physically demanding.
 
2018-02-02 07:18:34 PM  
"Workers are competing against an average time..."

So at any give time you can write about half of 'em up. Nice system.
 
2018-02-02 07:30:03 PM  

robbrie: Since Amazon warehouses are huge, they end up in places where real estate is cheap. 99.9 times out of 100, that's in economically depressed areas. That's why it's San Bernardino as opposed to Huntington Beach.


Partly, but San Bernardino is also one of the most important shipping/freight corridors in the US, connecting the ports of Los Angeles and Long Beach to interstate, rail, and air to the rest of the country.  As Amazon does a lot of business with overseas vendors, the direct rail and highway connection to the port is invaluable, and UPS has their regional hub at Ontario airport(and a smaller operation at San Bernardino Airport).  Tons of companies have massive warehouse facilities in San Bernardino along the 10 and 15 and further up the 15 in Victorville.  Interstates 10 and 15 give access to nearly the entire nation quite easily and rail corridors follow those for heavier freight.
 
2018-02-02 08:07:09 PM  
So ... your free shipping helps make Amazon a crappy place to work

Then it's very fortunate that Amazon is proceeding with all possible speed to automate those crappy jobs out of existence.
 
2018-02-02 08:15:02 PM  
So.

Amazon brings jobs *and* tax revenue to economically depressed area.

Residents with no marketable job skill complain complain that the menial work is too hard.

I begin to think that the poor might be poor due to life choices, attitude and stupidity.
 
2018-02-02 09:51:07 PM  

BumpInTheNight: What I find really sketchy about Amazon's warehouse culture is how they won the right to make workers stand in line to be checked before they can leave.  They aren't paid for this time mind you, no no that is some how perfectly okay.  They 'clock out' and can then spend upwards of half an hour waiting to be allowed to leave.

That's some shady shiat and I wary of supporting a company like Amazon who does that sort of stuff.


I'm in purchasing, and I thought about forwarding this to our COO but he's probably seen it.  I try not to use Amazon because of this and also because often it's cheaper elsewhere if you're shopping on the internet.
 
2018-02-02 10:33:44 PM  
Sure, the pay is good, the benefits are great, but THE WORK IS HARD!!!  WHAAA!!
 
2018-02-02 10:37:27 PM  

Smelly Pirate Hooker: BumpInTheNight: What I find really sketchy about Amazon's warehouse culture is how they won the right to make workers stand in line to be checked before they can leave.  They aren't paid for this time mind you, no no that is some how perfectly okay.  They 'clock out' and can then spend upwards of half an hour waiting to be allowed to leave.

That's some shady shiat and I wary of supporting a company like Amazon who does that sort of stuff.

If they're not getting paid for it, it's straight-up illegal. Now. It's illegal now. They should be made to either pay people for their time or stop doing it that way.


Wrong.

The courts deemed it legal, so it is therefore legal.

But they should be paid for it.
 
2018-02-02 11:54:04 PM  

GDubDub: Sure, the pay is good, the benefits are great, but THE WORK IS HARD!!!  WHAAA!!


The pay is not good, that's one of the points. They want to be paid more and at a similar warehouse, the employees are paid more. One should be paid commensurate with various factors of the job, skills needed, difficulty, etc.

There is certainly some possibly unwarranted biatching about the job. I realize that is completely unprecedented in any other job or industry so it is a complete surprise.
 
2018-02-03 10:23:46 AM  

LadySusan: GDubDub: Sure, the pay is good, the benefits are great, but THE WORK IS HARD!!!  WHAAA!!
The pay is not good, that's one of the points. They want to be paid more and at a similar warehouse, the employees are paid more. One should be paid commensurate with various factors of the job, skills needed, difficulty, etc.
There is certainly some possibly unwarranted biatching about the job. I realize that is completely unprecedented in any other job or industry so it is a complete surprise.


That is the key as I see it. It isn't fair to the hard workers to get sub-par pay. But you got to make sure you don't reward the lazy ones. One way is to not punish those who don't meet average time rather reward those that beat it. The more you beat it the higher the reward. (So to speak).
 
2018-02-03 12:18:47 PM  

The_Philosopher_King: LadySusan: GDubDub: Sure, the pay is good, the benefits are great, but THE WORK IS HARD!!!  WHAAA!!
The pay is not good, that's one of the points. They want to be paid more and at a similar warehouse, the employees are paid more. One should be paid commensurate with various factors of the job, skills needed, difficulty, etc.
There is certainly some possibly unwarranted biatching about the job. I realize that is completely unprecedented in any other job or industry so it is a complete surprise.

That is the key as I see it. It isn't fair to the hard workers to get sub-par pay. But you got to make sure you don't reward the lazy ones. One way is to not punish those who don't meet average time rather reward those that beat it. The more you beat it the higher the reward. (So to speak).


Yes! Obviously you probably want to get rid of someone who is just completely unproductive so there would be a floor. 1 item per hour? Sorry sweetie, maybe some other job is a better fit. Then an acceptable range. 1-3 items per 5 minutes and you're good. Then bonus time. And probably some sort of looksie for anyone who is doing 100 items per hour because either the whole company needs to copy that or there's some shenanigans going on. I could maybe see a smart person hacking the tracker in some way.

And I would pay the bonus for any hour (day? half day?) because someone might be able to do a very fast hour and they'll be super happy to get some extra pay. And the bonuses might be adjustable by season. Christmas? Valentines? Raise the minimum, give bigger bonuses let's slam those puppies out. Jan or March? Slow times? Lower the minimum and reduce the bonuses.
 
2018-02-03 07:12:35 PM  

southernmanblog: "Workers are competing against an average time..."

So at any give time you can write about half of 'em up. Nice system.


Fire the slowest one and the average goes up.
 
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