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(BBC-US)   Oscar Pistorius gets his murder sentence more than doubled in a move that some are calling "un-American". But since this is a South African court, everyone else says, "Good"   ( bbc.com) divider line
    More: Followup, Ms Steenkamp, South Africa, Amputation, athlete Oscar Pistorius, United States, Olympic Games, Reeva Steenkamp, South African court  
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1467 clicks; posted to Sports » on 24 Nov 2017 at 2:34 PM (34 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



40 Comments     (+0 »)
 
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest
 
2017-11-24 01:50:37 PM  
The guy didn't have a leg to stand on.
 
2017-11-24 02:30:59 PM  
South Africa has the weirdest court system.
 
2017-11-24 02:35:34 PM  
He must be pist.
 
2017-11-24 02:42:11 PM  
Where are the "some" calling it un-American? I didn't read that anywhere in the story and there was no comments section to see that in either. Your headline smacks of someone trying to take a shot at the US. If you want to do that, fine. There's plenty of issues to take shots at. This, however, isn't one of them.
 
2017-11-24 02:46:05 PM  

SecretAgentWoman: South Africa has the weirdest court system.


I don't know, and know exceedingly little about most court systems. But if a defendant can appeal to have an unfair sentence shortened, surely a prosecutor deserves the right to appeal to have an unfair sentence lengthened?
 
2017-11-24 02:47:16 PM  
It didn't take place in America, so by definition that makes it un-American.
 
2017-11-24 02:47:40 PM  

SecretAgentWoman: South Africa has the weirdest court system.


Well I only know this case in a cursory fashion... but I would ask- do they review cases and lighten sentences also?  If that is the case, I wouldn't call it all that weird.  To go back on sentences and review them.  Unless all they're in the business of is giving heavier and heavier sentences for nefarious reasons (which we're good at in general in the US.)
 
2017-11-24 02:48:23 PM  

Craw Fu: It didn't take place in America, so by definition that makes it un-American.


^---- Well, this pretty much closes the book on the headline.

Good one.
 
2017-11-24 02:48:47 PM  
Shame.  Such a great bass player.
 
2017-11-24 03:24:43 PM  
Not as un-American as ending Apartheid.
 
2017-11-24 03:25:57 PM  

b0rg9: Shame.  Such a great bass player.


Exceptionally fine work.

I, of course, see what you did there.
 
2017-11-24 03:29:37 PM  
I get that he's a murderer, but they shouldn't be allowed to have more time added after a sentence has been handed down and served
 
2017-11-24 03:33:43 PM  
This is going to upset the guntards who see in Pistorius one of their own, somebody who shares their fantasy of shooting big scary black men.
 
2017-11-24 03:34:46 PM  

b0rg9: Shame.  Such a great bass player.


Everyone I've heard of with that name murdered someone of got murderd by someone.
 
2017-11-24 03:35:34 PM  

soupafi: I get that he's a murderer, but they shouldn't be allowed to have more time added after a sentence has been handed down and served


Except that, by South African law, he should have gotten 15 years as the *minimum* sentence. All this did was give him the sentence the *law* said he was supposed to get in the first place.
 
2017-11-24 03:36:50 PM  

jaytkay: This is going to upset the guntards who see in Pistorius one of their own, somebody who shares their fantasy of shooting big scary black men.


It was a white woman, and he didn't shoot her, he decapitated her with a blade-runner roundhouse kick.
 
2017-11-24 03:43:53 PM  
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take"

                                                -Oscar Pistorius
 
2017-11-24 03:47:35 PM  
*based on a true story*

img.fark.netView Full Size
 
2017-11-24 03:54:47 PM  

Gubbo: SecretAgentWoman: South Africa has the weirdest court system.

I don't know, and know exceedingly little about most court systems. But if a defendant can appeal to have an unfair sentence shortened, surely a prosecutor deserves the right to appeal to have an unfair sentence lengthened?


Not a fan of that idea as you need to err on the side of the innocent. It is hard enough for the poor to get justice. Can you imagine how many innocent people will plea out if under threat of constant appeals and harder punishments in higher courts that they cannot afford to fight in?
 
2017-11-24 04:20:13 PM  

AliceBToklasLives: b0rg9: Shame.  Such a great bass player.

Everyone I've heard of with that name murdered someone of got murderd by someone.


Wayne Pastorius?
 
2017-11-24 04:40:18 PM  
memecrunch.comView Full Size
 
2017-11-24 04:43:29 PM  

soupafi: I get that he's a murderer, but they shouldn't be allowed to have more time added after a sentence has been handed down and served


Then the convicted person shouldn't have the right to appeal for a shorter sentence if the sentence they receive is within the legal terms for the law they broke.  Goes both ways.

Pistorius was given a sentence outside the terms the law lays out; all this did was change his sentence to what the law required he be sentenced to.  If he were given a sentence outside the longest term the law allowed; that would be a different story.
 
2017-11-24 04:46:09 PM  

TheManofPA: Gubbo: SecretAgentWoman: South Africa has the weirdest court system.

I don't know, and know exceedingly little about most court systems. But if a defendant can appeal to have an unfair sentence shortened, surely a prosecutor deserves the right to appeal to have an unfair sentence lengthened?

Not a fan of that idea as you need to err on the side of the innocent. It is hard enough for the poor to get justice. Can you imagine how many innocent people will plea out if under threat of constant appeals and harder punishments in higher courts that they cannot afford to fight in?


Those convicted are, by definition, no longer innocent.  They have been found guilty, either by trial or accepting a plea agreement.  A plea agreement is quite different from the trial court passing down sentencing.  Plea's include either a definitive sentence agreed upon by both parties and the court, or an agreed upon range of a sentence between those three parties.  When you accept a plea you waive your right to appeal, and the right of the state to appeal is limited, very strictly anyway.

So no, in sentencing we don't need to "err on the side of the innocent."
 
2017-11-24 06:07:49 PM  

soupafi: I get that he's a murderer, but they shouldn't be allowed to have more time added after a sentence has been handed down and served


"Allowed"?  So the sovereign country with their own judicial system, which followed their rules correctly, needs to have external intervention because you don't agree with it?

Just because this isn't how a few western countries work, doesn't mean it's broken.  Hell, we don't even let states intervene with other states when they have differing sentencing guidelines.  To say they shouldn't be "allowed" to do this reeks of a broken interventionist mentality.
 
2017-11-24 06:27:31 PM  

SecretAgentWoman: South Africa has the weirdest court system.


They also have 3 capitals. Weird system but a beautiful country and they make great wine.
 
2017-11-24 06:48:47 PM  

Gubbo: SecretAgentWoman: South Africa has the weirdest court system.

I don't know, and know exceedingly little about most court systems. But if a defendant can appeal to have an unfair sentence shortened, surely a prosecutor deserves the right to appeal to have an unfair sentence lengthened?


I believe the reasoning for the way the US legal system works the way it does is the state has way more resources at their disposal than the typical defendant so the state only gets one shot at convicting and sentencing. Also, those convicted in the US are somewhat limited in what they can appeal.
 
2017-11-24 07:04:50 PM  
Sick bastard should have gotten life in the first place.
 
2017-11-24 07:16:49 PM  
Its not like the American justice system is flawless, so its pretty ethnocentric to conclude that our way is the right way or even the best way.
 
2017-11-24 08:09:41 PM  

dryknife: AliceBToklasLives: b0rg9: Shame.  Such a great bass player.

Everyone I've heard of with that name murdered someone of got murderd by someone.

Wayne Pastorius?


That would be oscar wayne pistorius.
  Wayne is the classic middle name for killers.
 
2017-11-24 08:15:07 PM  

Khellendros: "Allowed"?  So the sovereign country with their own judicial system, which followed their rules correctly, needs to have external intervention because you don't agree with it?

Just because this isn't how a few western countries work, doesn't mean it's broken.


There is the whole Common Law vs. Napoleonic Law argument to be made there.

Pretty sure South Africa is Common Law, so it should be pretty close to the US, UK et cetera. In the US, double jeopardy applies to prevent people being victimised by the legal system. That's a principle that originated in the UK, but was lost to the mists of time, here, because politicians get a bump from victimising people who may have done wrong, and served their time, but the public outrage demands blood.

Hell, we don't even let states intervene with other states when they have differing sentencing guidelines.  To say they shouldn't be "allowed" to do this reeks of a broken interventionist mentality.

So, what you gunna do about it?

/I like the quirks of the Scottish legal system.
//Juries are 15 peers, and there's always the chance of the Scottish Verdict: Not Proven -we know you did it, now don't do it again.
 
2017-11-24 08:35:57 PM  

iron de havilland: Khellendros: "Allowed"?  So the sovereign country with their own judicial system, which followed their rules correctly, needs to have external intervention because you don't agree with it?

Just because this isn't how a few western countries work, doesn't mean it's broken.

There is the whole Common Law vs. Napoleonic Law argument to be made there.

Pretty sure South Africa is Common Law, so it should be pretty close to the US, UK et cetera. In the US, double jeopardy applies to prevent people being victimised by the legal system. That's a principle that originated in the UK, but was lost to the mists of time, here, because politicians get a bump from victimising people who may have done wrong, and served their time, but the public outrage demands blood.

Hell, we don't even let states intervene with other states when they have differing sentencing guidelines.  To say they shouldn't be "allowed" to do this reeks of a broken interventionist mentality.

So, what you gunna do about it?

/I like the quirks of the Scottish legal system.
//Juries are 15 peers, and there's always the chance of the Scottish Verdict: Not Proven -we know you did it, now don't do it again.


Double Jeopardy refers to being tried for the same crime twice, it has nothing to do with post-conviction sentencing relief.  It also hasn't been "lost" here.  As for the so-called "Scottish Verdict," that exists here in the form of jury nullification.
 
ZAZ [TotalFark]
2017-11-24 08:38:38 PM  
In America the prosecutor could not appeal a manslaughter verdict asking it to be upgraded to murder, but the prosecutor could appeal an illegally low sentence for the crime of conviction. That's what sparked the occupation of the wildlife refuge in Oregon. An appeals court raised a one year sentence for arson to the mandatory minimum five years, and supporters of the defendants got mad.
 
2017-11-24 08:57:06 PM  
He should get some kind of award.
 
2017-11-24 10:56:35 PM  

Befuddled: Gubbo: SecretAgentWoman: South Africa has the weirdest court system.

I don't know, and know exceedingly little about most court systems. But if a defendant can appeal to have an unfair sentence shortened, surely a prosecutor deserves the right to appeal to have an unfair sentence lengthened?

I believe the reasoning for the way the US legal system works the way it does is the state has way more resources at their disposal than the typical defendant so the state only gets one shot at convicting and sentencing. Also, those convicted in the US are somewhat limited in what they can appeal.


This can and does happen in the U.S.

http://blog.al.com/live/2013/11/in_ra​r​e_appeal_federal_prosecu.html

General appeals by the prosecution are with regards to procedural issues by the courts. Such as if a judge handed down a sentence below the minimum required by law.
 
2017-11-24 11:14:55 PM  
Poor little Tink Tink
 
2017-11-25 11:54:36 AM  

HideAndGoFarkYourself: TheManofPA: Gubbo: SecretAgentWoman: South Africa has the weirdest court system.

I don't know, and know exceedingly little about most court systems. But if a defendant can appeal to have an unfair sentence shortened, surely a prosecutor deserves the right to appeal to have an unfair sentence lengthened?

Not a fan of that idea as you need to err on the side of the innocent. It is hard enough for the poor to get justice. Can you imagine how many innocent people will plea out if under threat of constant appeals and harder punishments in higher courts that they cannot afford to fight in?

Those convicted are, by definition, no longer innocent.  They have been found guilty, either by trial or accepting a plea agreement.  A plea agreement is quite different from the trial court passing down sentencing.  Plea's include either a definitive sentence agreed upon by both parties and the court, or an agreed upon range of a sentence between those three parties.  When you accept a plea you waive your right to appeal, and the right of the state to appeal is limited, very strictly anyway.

So no, in sentencing we don't need to "err on the side of the innocent."


That's not at all how that works.
 
2017-11-25 01:28:00 PM  
Good
 
2017-11-25 03:28:57 PM  

soupafi: I get that he's a murderer, but they shouldn't be allowed to have more time added after a sentence has been handed down and served


ZAZ: In America the prosecutor could not appeal a manslaughter verdict asking it to be upgraded to murder, but the prosecutor could appeal an illegally low sentence for the crime of conviction. That's what sparked the occupation of the wildlife refuge in Oregon. An appeals court raised a one year sentence for arson to the mandatory minimum five years, and supporters of the defendants got mad. wealthy white famous athlete can buy themselves a lighter sentence or escape punishment all together.


FTFY
 
2017-11-25 04:19:49 PM  

Gubbo: SecretAgentWoman: South Africa has the weirdest court system.

I don't know, and know exceedingly little about most court systems. But if a defendant can appeal to have an unfair sentence shortened, surely a prosecutor deserves the right to appeal to have an unfair sentence lengthened?


The problem is that most people don't have unlimited resources to continually defend over and over.  The prosecution is much less limited.
 
2017-11-25 05:18:18 PM  

jaytkay: This is going to upset the guntards who see in Pistorius one of their own, somebody who shares their fantasy of shooting big scary black men.


Have you really seen where someone has defended him?  I'll bet it's damn few if at all.
 
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