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(The Nation)   ICE agents admit that their gang database is a way for them to indiscriminately round up immigrants of color who are neither gang members, nor pose a threat to public safety   ( thenation.com) divider line
    More: Asinine, Mara Salvatrucha, MS-13 gang members, Gang, Trump administration, Operation Raging Bull, Crime, gang Mara Salvatrucha, Los Angeles  
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1202 clicks; posted to Politics » on 21 Nov 2017 at 2:32 PM (34 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2017-11-21 11:52:08 AM  
 
2017-11-21 01:04:37 PM  
My opinion of the federal government's ability to identify gang members dropped to nothing when I learned that they put juggalos into the same classification as the Bloods and the Crips and the Hell's Angels.
 
2017-11-21 01:05:13 PM  
The jackbooted thugs of America are known as ICE.  This is the whole idea behind the MAGA slogan.

Go ahead, bite the Big Apple, don't mind the maggots.
 
2017-11-21 01:16:27 PM  

Soup4Bonnie: The jackbooted thugs of America are known as ICE.  This is the whole idea behind the MAGA slogan.

Go ahead, bite the Big Apple, don't mind the maggots.


You call them jackbooted thugs, I call them cowardly pussies.

Why not both?jpg
 
2017-11-21 01:16:48 PM  
Brown people are inherently scary.  Ergo, on the list.

You don't expect us to really go after MS13 do you?  Those dudes are dangerous!  Didn't you hear Trump?

/s/ICE
 
2017-11-21 01:19:28 PM  

thehobbes: And they are planning on a nationwide sting on fast food employers.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/feds-pla​n-nationwide-operation-targeting-food-​service-chain-over-undocumented-worker​s


Using Republican economic logic, that will only drive up prices and hurt the consumer.
 
2017-11-21 02:16:37 PM  
Prepare for more Tent Cities.
 
2017-11-21 02:31:37 PM  
abolish ICE
 
2017-11-21 02:34:07 PM  
Gestapo
 
2017-11-21 02:35:22 PM  
Gangs are a symptom of a larger issue that is never dealt with. MS-13 seems to be the new boogeyman, with calls for deportation, and exile. What few of these people realize is, much like the Taliban, the US absolutely created these groups, in the 70's and 80's. We reap what we sow.
 
2017-11-21 02:35:30 PM  

Karac: My opinion of the federal government's ability to identify gang members dropped to nothing when I learned that they put juggalos into the same classification as the Bloods and the Crips and the Hell's Angels.


That is horribly insulting to Bloods, Crips and Hell's Angels.
 
2017-11-21 02:36:04 PM  
Looks like a likely member of MS-13-shades-darker-than-I-like.
 
2017-11-21 02:38:54 PM  
 To be fair, they didn't have a way to throw them out without this so we can all totally understand why it would be necessary.

I'm so proud of my country right now that i could puke blood.

img.fark.netView Full Size
 
2017-11-21 02:41:25 PM  
Imagine what the Nazi's would have done with an Oracle database.
 
2017-11-21 02:44:10 PM  

Farxist Marxist: Imagine what the Nazi's would have done with an Oracle database.


They had one. It was just more mechanical in nature, and they went with IBM.
 
2017-11-21 02:47:34 PM  

Karac: My opinion of the federal government's ability to identify gang members dropped to nothing when I learned that they put juggalos into the same classification as the Bloods and the Crips and the Hell's Angels.


Dear lord, really?  Wow.  No way in hell those guys are as bad as juggalos...
 
2017-11-21 02:49:47 PM  

Farxist Marxist: Imagine what the Nazi's would have done with an Oracle database.


Thanks. We didn't have ENOUGH nightmare fodder going on.
 
2017-11-21 02:50:11 PM  
It's amazing that ICE can deport all of these legal immigrants, you would think this would be in direct contradiction of our long legal history of honouring visas and treating citizens of other nations who are here legally with respect and dignity.

Oh, wait, you left out a word in your headline, subby. Now this all suddenly makes more sense.
 
2017-11-21 02:51:34 PM  
So we shouldn't deport prior deports?

The headline and tfa are a bit of a stretch.
 
2017-11-21 02:53:18 PM  
Shaggy_C: ...our long legal history of honouring visas and treating citizens of other nations who are here legally with respect and dignity.

You funny.
 
2017-11-21 02:54:54 PM  

Karac: My opinion of the federal government's ability to identify gang members dropped to nothing when I learned that they put juggalos into the same classification as the Bloods and the Crips and the Hell's Angels.


To be fair the Juggalos are also scary to old whites so
 
2017-11-21 03:00:13 PM  

Nadie_AZ: Prepare for more Tent Cities.


Well about that.
 
2017-11-21 03:17:23 PM  

Smackledorfer: So we shouldn't deport prior deports?

The headline and tfa are a bit of a stretch.


I think the gist of the idea here is that we shouldn't be using a sledgehammer intended for railroad spike violent criminals and drug/human traffickers to hammer the tack of someone who overstayed a visa or slipped across the border but otherwise hasn't done any wrong.
 
2017-11-21 03:17:57 PM  

thehobbes: And they are planning on a nationwide sting on fast food employers.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/feds-pla​n-nationwide-operation-targeting-food-​service-chain-over-undocumented-worker​s


On the surface that doesn't seem like a terrible thing.  If enough of the people exploiting undocumented immigrants instead of paying fair and legal wages to citizens are punished for doing so, and punished severely enough that the risks outweigh the rewards, then the exploitation will stop, which is good.  And if illegally entering the country to get work is no longer an option, that will severely reduce the number of people illegally entering the country.

Now, ideally this would be coupled with making it easy to apply for and receive refugee status, because undoubtedly many of the undocumented persons being exploited in these "employment" situations are seeking to support themselves after coming here fleeing some sort of terrible situations, but I'll take what I can get.

Though I won't be holding my breath in regards to those profiting from the exploitation actually being punished at a level such as to disincentivize the practice.
 
2017-11-21 03:23:13 PM  
Database is useful to keep from arresting legal immigrants and naturally-born citizens.
 
2017-11-21 03:24:03 PM  

PlaidJaguar: thehobbes: And they are planning on a nationwide sting on fast food employers.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/feds-pla​n-nationwide-operation-targeting-food-​service-chain-over-undocumented-worker​s

On the surface that doesn't seem like a terrible thing.  If enough of the people exploiting undocumented immigrants instead of paying fair and legal wages to citizens are punished for doing so, and punished severely enough that the risks outweigh the rewards, then the exploitation will stop, which is good.  And if illegally entering the country to get work is no longer an option, that will severely reduce the number of people illegally entering the country.

Now, ideally this would be coupled with making it easy to apply for and receive refugee status, because undoubtedly many of the undocumented persons being exploited in these "employment" situations are seeking to support themselves after coming here fleeing some sort of terrible situations, but I'll take what I can get.

Though I won't be holding my breath in regards to those profiting from the exploitation actually being punished at a level such as to disincentivize the practice.


Instead the Trump announced Administration yesterday that 60,000 Haitian refugees will be deported
 
2017-11-21 03:38:59 PM  

OtherLittleGuy: Database is useful to keep from arresting legal immigrants and naturally-born citizens.


Aw, how cute. You think this pogrom will only target illegal immigrants.
 
2017-11-21 03:39:03 PM  
img.fark.netView Full Size


Discuss amongst yourselves.
 
2017-11-21 03:44:20 PM  

Epoch_Zero: Farxist Marxist: Imagine what the Nazi's would have done with an Oracle database.

They had one. It was just more mechanical in nature, and they went with IBM.


So....DB2. No wonder they lost.
 
2017-11-21 03:48:55 PM  
Who would've guessed that people who are very concerned with "just enforcing immigration law" are also rabid racists? Of course even the supposedly non-racist Republicans are fine with sharing their bed, since they're stigginit.
 
2017-11-21 03:52:16 PM  

Dusk-You-n-Me: abolish ICE


Ice Cold: Over here we got some perpetrators - a bunch of Ice Wannabes. See, Ice Cold, I'm the man, but we got Ice Tray, Ice Coffee, Ice Water, Iceberg, Ice Cup, Icebox. I mean it gets real ridiculous when people tryin' to bite your style, you know what I'm sayin'? But, hey, that's the way it is, it's the rap world.
 
2017-11-21 03:54:03 PM  

UltimaCS: Who would've guessed that people who are very concerned with "just enforcing immigration law" are also rabid racists? Of course even the supposedly non-racist Republicans are fine with sharing their bed, since they're stigginit.


Nonracist** Republican is an oxymoron.
It's been an oxymoron since 1965.

*hand to the sky*
**Autocorrect suggested nonfascist.
 
2017-11-21 04:01:04 PM  

vudukungfu: Soup4Bonnie: The jackbooted thugs of America are known as ICE.  This is the whole idea behind the MAGA slogan.

Go ahead, bite the Big Apple, don't mind the maggots.

You call them jackbooted thugs, I call them cowardly pussies.

Why not both?jpg


Puss 'n Boots Thugs?
 
2017-11-21 04:15:04 PM  
El trabajo te hace libre.
 
2017-11-21 04:21:41 PM  
FTFA: According to ICE's press releases, gang members are people who (1) admit that they are, (2) are convicted of violating a state or federal law that criminalizes gang-related activity-though, it must be reiterated, simply being a member of a gang is not in itself a crime-or (3) if "they meet certain other criteria such as having tattoos identifying a specific gang or being identified as a gang member by a reliable source."

I'm OK with this except for the bold parts of 3, which seem like they were made to be abused by law enforcement.

FTFA: Gang members are different from gang associates, who, according to ICE, "exhibit gang-member criteria but who are not formally initiated into the gang." ICE leaves it up to law-enforcement officers' discretion to determine "whether indications of gang association are present by referring to the gang membership criteria."

And if 3 above wasn't designed for abuse, THIS part definitely is.

FTFA: One of the worst aspects of the gang database, Unzueta says, is that a person cannot find out whether they've been added to this database, and if they do learn that they are in the database, they have neither the ability to challenge their inclusion nor the right to remove themselves from it.

Sounds like the Do Not Fly list.  WTF is it with US law enforcement and these farking lists?
 
2017-11-21 04:23:44 PM  

Arumat: Smackledorfer: So we shouldn't deport prior deports?

The headline and tfa are a bit of a stretch.

I think the gist of the idea here is that we shouldn't be using a sledgehammer intended for railroad spike violent criminals and drug/human traffickers to hammer the tack of someone who overstayed a visa or slipped across the border but otherwise hasn't done any wrong.


Workplace raids should be the place for catching people here without clean papers.  And while they're at it, grind the companies and their staff that do the illegal hiring into the dirt.  Including jail time and revocation of corporate licenses & charters.

If it's really about They Took Er Jerbs, and looking out for the American WorkerTM, then the Feds need to come down like a ton of bricks on the companies reaping the benefits of under the table workers.
 
2017-11-21 04:46:17 PM  
Citizenship is meaningless. Your body is property of the government, to be destroyed at their whim
 
2017-11-21 05:00:50 PM  

Farxist Marxist: Imagine what the Nazi's would have done with an Oracle database.


the nazis did enough with what they had at the time: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_and​_​the_Holocaust
 
2017-11-21 05:12:44 PM  

Lost Thought 00: Citizenship is meaningless. Your body is property of the government, to be destroyed at their whim


You sound like a runner.
 
2017-11-21 05:18:43 PM  
Just another article whining about illegal immigrants being deported just because they are illegal immigrant
"They aren't gang members, they are just here illegally. How dare ice enforce the law!"
 
2017-11-21 05:38:00 PM  

wejash: Brown people are inherently scary.  Ergo, on the list.

You don't expect us to really go after MS13 do you?  Those dudes are dangerous!  Didn't you hear Trump?

/s/ICE


F*ck, dude, MS13 shoots back! Nobody wants that shiat!
 
2017-11-21 05:39:02 PM  

DrewCurtisJr: Just another article whining about illegal immigrants being deported just because they are illegal immigrant
"They aren't gang members, they are just here illegally. How dare ice enforce the law!"


And if a few of the immigrants, like Wilmer Catalan-Ramirez, get badly injured by the arresting officers in the middle of aa raid, all the better, right?
 
2017-11-21 05:49:10 PM  

Emposter: FTFA: According to ICE's press releases, gang members are people who (1) admit that they are, (2) are convicted of violating a state or federal law that criminalizes gang-related activity-though, it must be reiterated, simply being a member of a gang is not in itself a crime-or (3) if "they meet certain other criteria such as having tattoos identifying a specific gang or being identified as a gang member by a reliable source."

I'm OK with this except for the bold parts of 3, which seem like they were made to be abused by law enforcement.

FTFA: Gang members are different from gang associates, who, according to ICE, "exhibit gang-member criteria but who are not formally initiated into the gang." ICE leaves it up to law-enforcement officers' discretion to determine "whether indications of gang association are present by referring to the gang membership criteria."

And if 3 above wasn't designed for abuse, THIS part definitely is.

FTFA: One of the worst aspects of the gang database, Unzueta says, is that a person cannot find out whether they've been added to this database, and if they do learn that they are in the database, they have neither the ability to challenge their inclusion nor the right to remove themselves from it.

Sounds like the Do Not Fly list.  WTF is it with US law enforcement and these farking lists?


I sat in on a pretrial hearing once, where the police "expert" was explaining why the defendants who were not actual gang members should still receive gang enhancements in their charges.

Part of his arguments included: because they were arrested in association with known gang members, they were therefore either gang associates or recruits; that any activity carried out by a gang members was in furtherance of the gang's criminal behavior, no matter what it was or if the gang at large benefited from it; that gangs often recruited new members by pretending to not be gang members and going to parties and other social events and insinuating the gang lifestyle into the social fabric of the community; and that the only reason non-gang members would be around gang members would be to become gang members, and for no other reason.

So being in the company of a gang member who is doing anything, in this cop's view, makes you a gang member too. And thus a criminal.
 
2017-11-21 05:52:19 PM  

King Something: OtherLittleGuy: Database is useful to keep from arresting legal immigrants and naturally-born citizens.

Aw, how cute. You think this pogrom will only target illegal immigrants.


Gotta make room for Puerto Ricans, no telling when we'll be able to deport them.
 
2017-11-21 05:57:31 PM  

Archidude: DrewCurtisJr: Just another article whining about illegal immigrants being deported just because they are illegal immigrant
"They aren't gang members, they are just here illegally. How dare ice enforce the law!"

And if a few of the immigrants, like Wilmer Catalan-Ramirez, get badly injured by the arresting officers in the middle of aa raid, all the better, right?


What did the court say?
 
2017-11-21 06:04:55 PM  

DrewCurtisJr: Archidude: DrewCurtisJr: Just another article whining about illegal immigrants being deported just because they are illegal immigrant
"They aren't gang members, they are just here illegally. How dare ice enforce the law!"

And if a few of the immigrants, like Wilmer Catalan-Ramirez, get badly injured by the arresting officers in the middle of aa raid, all the better, right?

What did the court say?


Not a god damn thing.

What do you say, Champ? Is brutality and the excessive use of force part of what you so admire in ICE agents?
 
2017-11-21 06:25:31 PM  

Archidude: DrewCurtisJr: Archidude: DrewCurtisJr: Just another article whining about illegal immigrants being deported just because they are illegal immigrant
"They aren't gang members, they are just here illegally. How dare ice enforce the law!"

And if a few of the immigrants, like Wilmer Catalan-Ramirez, get badly injured by the arresting officers in the middle of aa raid, all the better, right?

What did the court say?

Not a god damn thing.

What do you say, Champ? Is brutality and the excessive use of force part of what you so admire in ICE agents?


Why don't you wait for the trial to make your claims about excessive force? You'd think you would have learned your lesson by now.
 
2017-11-21 07:13:11 PM  
No. shiat.
 
2017-11-21 08:43:17 PM  

DrewCurtisJr: Just another article whining about illegal immigrants being deported just because they are illegal immigrant
"They aren't gang members, they are just here illegally. How dare ice enforce the law!"


Why should we not "whine" about a waste of law-enforcement resources that only serves to harm our economy and make it easier for real criminals to operate?
 
2017-11-21 09:20:20 PM  

Mithiwithi: DrewCurtisJr: Just another article whining about illegal immigrants being deported just because they are illegal immigrant
"They aren't gang members, they are just here illegally. How dare ice enforce the law!"

Why should we not "whine" about a waste of law-enforcement resources that only serves to harm our economy and make it easier for real criminals to operate?


Because it is very good use of law enforcement resources, helps our economy, and keeps deported criminals from coming back repeatedly
 
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