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(Slashdot)   Slashdot user asks what a Mac user should know before buying a Windows laptop. "Welcome to the real world, jackass" suspiciously absent   ( apple.slashdot.org) divider line
    More: Amusing, good computing practices, windows, Personal computer, Windows Vista, laptop, power supply, high school laptop, gaming Windows Desktops  
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1875 clicks; posted to Geek » on 10 Nov 2017 at 3:20 PM (27 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2017-11-10 01:21:16 PM  
Ubuntu Linux FTW
 
2017-11-10 01:34:45 PM  
At this point they are all the same.

You can play more games on Windows. Other than that, no real difference.
 
2017-11-10 01:36:04 PM  
Twenty years down the pike since the Mac/PC wars and we're still doing the "Macs are suxxor" thing?
 
2017-11-10 01:50:12 PM  
He should budget in a significant number of hours trying to figure out WTF is going wrong at any given moment.

/used to be hardcore PC partisan
//switched a long time ago
///Linux is for people that love updating their OS as a hobby
 
2017-11-10 02:23:23 PM  
Hey subby -- in MY WORLD (doing Internet Technology for startups), most everyone uses Mac Laptops
Oh sure, you could do development on Windows as well, if you wanted to use a VM or CygWin and deal with managing all that setup just to start working. I can do everything I need right in the native OS and Commandline, just as I do with *nix. And with the market demand for iOS Apps, and NO DEMAND AT ALL for Windows Mobile Apps, using Apple OS for Development is the best way to go for Web and Mobile Development. In fact the only reason I can think of why a Web or Mobile Developer would want to use Windows for their workstation is because they build for .NET and use Xamarin for Mobile -- beyond that, they are either zealots or too broke to afford a Mac
 
2017-11-10 02:48:25 PM  
"Is having a full time job and living without a parental subsidy difficult?"

"I didn't think they sold these in L.A.?"

"Is it possible to pursue my true calling as a DJ/ international meme broker with a windows machine?"

all possibles...
 
2017-11-10 03:14:17 PM  

rcain: Hey subby -- in MY WORLD (doing Internet Technology for startups), most everyone uses Mac Laptops
Oh sure, you could do development on Windows as well, if you wanted to use a VM or CygWin and deal with managing all that setup just to start working. I can do everything I need right in the native OS and Commandline, just as I do with *nix. And with the market demand for iOS Apps, and NO DEMAND AT ALL for Windows Mobile Apps, using Apple OS for Development is the best way to go for Web and Mobile Development. In fact the only reason I can think of why a Web or Mobile Developer would want to use Windows for their workstation is because they build for .NET and use Xamarin for Mobile -- beyond that, they are either zealots or too broke to afford a Mac


Sadly, VMs and/or Cygwin is often a better approximation of an actual Linux system than the bastardized BSD install that comes on a Mac.
 
2017-11-10 03:25:53 PM  

Gubbo: You can play more games on Windows. Other than that, no real difference.


Go buy an Xbox if you want games.

Which of these doesn't belong?
img.fark.netView Full Size

Hint: the one without an ancestor whose name begins with "U" or ends with "X."
 
2017-11-10 03:26:45 PM  

Gubbo: At this point they are all the same.

You can play more games on Windows. Other than that, no real difference.


Dude in the article said he needs a gaming rig.

Otherwise, yeah.
 
2017-11-10 03:29:27 PM  

SurfaceTension: Ubuntu Linux FTW


2018 is the Year of Linux on the Desktop
 
2017-11-10 03:29:35 PM  

derpes_simplex: rcain: Hey subby -- in MY WORLD (doing Internet Technology for startups), most everyone uses Mac Laptops
Oh sure, you could do development on Windows as well, if you wanted to use a VM or CygWin and deal with managing all that setup just to start working. I can do everything I need right in the native OS and Commandline, just as I do with *nix. And with the market demand for iOS Apps, and NO DEMAND AT ALL for Windows Mobile Apps, using Apple OS for Development is the best way to go for Web and Mobile Development. In fact the only reason I can think of why a Web or Mobile Developer would want to use Windows for their workstation is because they build for .NET and use Xamarin for Mobile -- beyond that, they are either zealots or too broke to afford a Mac

Sadly, VMs and/or Cygwin is often a better approximation of an actual Linux system than the bastardized BSD install that comes on a Mac.


I'm running it with X just fine. I run iTerm and can ssh wherever, modify any file, extract or compress any archive, write scripts for any bash or ksh environment. Much much much nicer to have it native than to have to bend and twist your way through VMs and or cygwin- all of which I've done.

OSX works. I've got plenty of gripes, but it is so much better than Windows.
 
2017-11-10 03:30:27 PM  

mcreadyblue: SurfaceTension: Ubuntu Linux FTW

2018 is the Year of Linux on the Desktop


Oh now I'm excited! Finally! For the first time!
 
2017-11-10 03:33:25 PM  

Bimmer Jones: Go buy an Xbox if you want games.


Can't properly mod games on an XBox.

Giant Clown Shoe: "Is it possible to pursue my true calling as a DJ/ international meme broker with a windows machine?"


I know you're just joking but most DJs tend to prefer Mac because of Core Audio and their prevalence in most production studios.  However, Windows has been gaining ground and companies like Razer actually were marketing towards producers and DJs (although that backfired hilariously with Carnage and his "808" tutorial.)

You get a more functional device with a laptop PC, as Apple thinks people don't need any USB ports for some reason (which is something you need a lot of with DJ midi gear.)
 
2017-11-10 03:39:01 PM  

derpes_simplex: rcain: Hey subby -- in MY WORLD (doing Internet Technology for startups), most everyone uses Mac Laptops
Oh sure, you could do development on Windows as well, if you wanted to use a VM or CygWin and deal with managing all that setup just to start working. I can do everything I need right in the native OS and Commandline, just as I do with *nix. And with the market demand for iOS Apps, and NO DEMAND AT ALL for Windows Mobile Apps, using Apple OS for Development is the best way to go for Web and Mobile Development. In fact the only reason I can think of why a Web or Mobile Developer would want to use Windows for their workstation is because they build for .NET and use Xamarin for Mobile -- beyond that, they are either zealots or too broke to afford a Mac

Sadly, VMs and/or Cygwin is often a better approximation of an actual Linux system than the bastardized BSD install that comes on a Mac.


How so? I've been working with both OSX and *nix since 2001 and the only issues I've ever had running code on Linux that I created on a Mac was a realtime Font Parser I created that ripped apart Chinese and Korean Font Sets into individual Glyphs and repackaged each Glyph as a Flash Fonts for UI Rendering in a Flex App -- the Code Was created with Java and the Apple Font Library for Java was not compatible with the Linux Font Library for Java, so instead of running the App and doing the processing on AWS as planned, I did all the processing on my Apple X-Serve in order to meet the deadline

But that was a Java/JRE Issue and nothing to do with OSX or Linux itself
Also, that bastardized BSDis an ACTUAL UNIX, and certified as such
Linux is famously NOT UNIX, hence "*nix"
 
2017-11-10 03:39:06 PM  

gar1013: He should budget in a significant number of hours trying to figure out WTF is going wrong at any given moment.

/used to be hardcore PC partisan
//switched a long time ago
///Linux is for people that love updating their OS as a hobby


Genuine question. What have you had that's going wrong that you need to figure out?
 
2017-11-10 03:40:18 PM  

mcreadyblue: SurfaceTension: Ubuntu Linux FTW

2018 is the Year of Linux on the Desktop


I put Linux mint on my laptop. Quite liking it. But keeping windows for games and office.

Don't care what anyone says, nothing is a good enough replacement for excel yet.
 
2017-11-10 03:43:35 PM  

Gubbo: At this point they are all the same.

You can play more games on Windows. Other than that, no real difference.


You'd be right up until Windows 10. Today, the answer is: one isn't a confusing mess of a UI.
 
2017-11-10 03:47:17 PM  

FrabjousDay: Twenty years down the pike since the Mac/PC wars and we're still doing the "Macs are suxxor" thing?


The Mac was introduced 33 years ago and the war was over the day it was released and IBM won.  Later Microsoft would take the crown from IBM.  It wasn't until the last decade that Mac OS X reached any significant market share.

/typed from a Mac in an business office full of Macs
//the only company making any money on desktops and laptops is Apple these days
 
2017-11-10 03:48:41 PM  
Fourteen year old wants a gaming system? Spot him the cost of a console and let it be his headache.
 
2017-11-10 03:50:09 PM  
If you want to close a program, just close the window. IT'S A MIRACLE!
 
2017-11-10 03:50:23 PM  
I've been waiting to use this meme, seems appropriate.
img.fark.netView Full Size
 
2017-11-10 03:51:51 PM  

imgod2u: Gubbo: At this point they are all the same.

You can play more games on Windows. Other than that, no real difference.

You'd be right up until Windows 10. Today, the answer is: one isn't a confusing mess of a UI.


Can I ask what you do in the ui? Just because I suspect for most people all they do is open a browser?
 
2017-11-10 03:55:13 PM  

Gubbo: At this point they are all the same.

You can play more games on Windows. Other than that, no real difference.


Windows does have the added benefit of added spyware, etc.
 
2017-11-10 03:56:01 PM  
Step One: Choose Budget
Step One A: If budget is low, uninstall OEM garbage or reinstall Windows (easy on W10)
Step Two: Turn it on
Step Three: Always read and consider warnings the OS gives you
Step Four: Don't click things that are unsolicited, only click things you're actively seeking.
 
jvl [BareFark]
2017-11-10 03:57:39 PM  

Gubbo: You can play more games on Windows. Other than that, no real difference.


Win10 downloads Candy Crush automatically so you don't have to!

// Ha ha only serious. WTF MS
/// I want my Win7 back
 
2017-11-10 03:58:16 PM  

rcain: Hey subby -- in MY WORLD (doing Internet Technology for startups), most everyone uses Mac Laptops
Oh sure, you could do development on Windows as well, if you wanted to use a VM or CygWin and deal with managing all that setup just to start working. I can do everything I need right in the native OS and Commandline, just as I do with *nix. And with the market demand for iOS Apps, and NO DEMAND AT ALL for Windows Mobile Apps, using Apple OS for Development is the best way to go for Web and Mobile Development. In fact the only reason I can think of why a Web or Mobile Developer would want to use Windows for their workstation is because they build for .NET and use Xamarin for Mobile -- beyond that, they are either zealots or too broke to afford a Mac


Intel's PC is Inside!
http://www.tomshardware.com/news/goog​l​e-removing-minix-management-engine-int​el,35876.html

The ME has its own MAC and IP address for the out-of-band interface, with direct access to the Ethernet controller; one portion of the Ethernet traffic is diverted to the ME even before reaching the host's operating system, for what support exists in various Ethernet controllers, exported and made configurable via Management Component Transport Protocol (MCTP).[37][38] The ME also communicates with the host via PCI interface.[36] Under Linux, communication between the host and the ME is done via /dev/mei.[34]
 
2017-11-10 03:59:42 PM  

mcreadyblue: SurfaceTension: Ubuntu Linux FTW

2018 is the Year of Linux on the Desktop


I was hoping to set up a media computer using Ubuntu and an old laptop. After installing a new copy of Ubuntu on the laptop, I realized nothing works on Ubuntu anymore and gave up. The project is either dead, or I'll install Android on it. I think progress stopped on linux about a decade ago. It feels old, clunky and useless today. Sad, but true.
 
2017-11-10 04:02:22 PM  

dirkfunk: mcreadyblue: SurfaceTension: Ubuntu Linux FTW

2018 is the Year of Linux on the Desktop

I was hoping to set up a media computer using Ubuntu and an old laptop. After installing a new copy of Ubuntu on the laptop, I realized nothing works on Ubuntu anymore and gave up. The project is either dead, or I'll install Android on it. I think progress stopped on linux about a decade ago. It feels old, clunky and useless today. Sad, but true.


Solid effort. Should get bites.
 
2017-11-10 04:02:52 PM  
When you click on Settings in almost any application you'll be overwhelmed compared to what you're force fed in the Mac world.
 
2017-11-10 04:08:56 PM  

Gubbo: dirkfunk: mcreadyblue: SurfaceTension: Ubuntu Linux FTW

2018 is the Year of Linux on the Desktop

I was hoping to set up a media computer using Ubuntu and an old laptop. After installing a new copy of Ubuntu on the laptop, I realized nothing works on Ubuntu anymore and gave up. The project is either dead, or I'll install Android on it. I think progress stopped on linux about a decade ago. It feels old, clunky and useless today. Sad, but true.

Solid effort. Should get bites.


Yeah... bites.

I wanted a computer that could do extreme stuff like play Hulu and Netflix videos without a lot of effort. Ubuntu can't do that. If my pointing that out offends you, get a hobby.
 
2017-11-10 04:15:50 PM  

Glitchwerks: Bimmer Jones: Go buy an Xbox if you want games.

Can't properly mod games on an XBox.

Giant Clown Shoe: "Is it possible to pursue my true calling as a DJ/ international meme broker with a windows machine?"

I know you're just joking but most DJs tend to prefer Mac because of Core Audio and their prevalence in most production studios.  However, Windows has been gaining ground and companies like Razer actually were marketing towards producers and DJs (although that backfired hilariously with Carnage and his "808" tutorial.)

You get a more functional device with a laptop PC, as Apple thinks people don't need any USB ports for some reason (which is something you need a lot of with DJ midi gear.)


Isn't the whole point of USB that you need one port and can use a hub to turn that into many ports?
 
2017-11-10 04:28:23 PM  
It's for his 14 year old kid who wants to play games. The correct answer was - make your kid research it with a budget and figure it out himself so he's not reliant on you for the rest of his life
 
2017-11-10 04:31:04 PM  

mcreadyblue: SurfaceTension: Ubuntu Linux FTW

2018 is the Year of Linux on the Desktop


The Year Of Linux is the same as fusion reactors, always 30 years away.

/ And I say this as a current Arch and Ubuntu user.
 
2017-11-10 04:32:42 PM  

rcain: derpes_simplex: rcain: Hey subby -- in MY WORLD (doing Internet Technology for startups), most everyone uses Mac Laptops
Oh sure, you could do development on Windows as well, if you wanted to use a VM or CygWin and deal with managing all that setup just to start working. I can do everything I need right in the native OS and Commandline, just as I do with *nix. And with the market demand for iOS Apps, and NO DEMAND AT ALL for Windows Mobile Apps, using Apple OS for Development is the best way to go for Web and Mobile Development. In fact the only reason I can think of why a Web or Mobile Developer would want to use Windows for their workstation is because they build for .NET and use Xamarin for Mobile -- beyond that, they are either zealots or too broke to afford a Mac

Sadly, VMs and/or Cygwin is often a better approximation of an actual Linux system than the bastardized BSD install that comes on a Mac.

How so? I've been working with both OSX and *nix since 2001 and the only issues I've ever had running code on Linux that I created on a Mac was a realtime Font Parser I created that ripped apart Chinese and Korean Font Sets into individual Glyphs and repackaged each Glyph as a Flash Fonts for UI Rendering in a Flex App -- the Code Was created with Java and the Apple Font Library for Java was not compatible with the Linux Font Library for Java, so instead of running the App and doing the processing on AWS as planned, I did all the processing on my Apple X-Serve in order to meet the deadline

But that was a Java/JRE Issue and nothing to do with OSX or Linux itself
Also, that bastardized BSDis an ACTUAL UNIX, and certified as such
Linux is famously NOT UNIX, hence "*nix"


Here's one annoying example.  I find it annoying because I work with RHEL/Centos and I like my laptop to at least share some common features of command packages and utils...

Make a 3 line scratch file called foo.txt

line1
line2
line3

Now run this command against it to delete the 2nd line....

sed -i 2d foo.txt

This is the most common sed command I can think of, often used to blast out stale entries in known_hosts.  It don't work on a Mac.  In fact, just try to get sed to edit the file inline without another output file specified.  It'll make ya batty.  I know that's sorta trivial, and it's related to it being BSD based.  But most folks run actual linux in prod, not BSD.  Having to remember two sets of behaviors for something like sed is fricking lame.
 
2017-11-10 04:43:58 PM  
I barely even care what kind of computer I have. I certainly don't care what kind of computer you have.
 
2017-11-10 04:47:33 PM  
Buy a Signature Edition, then move on with life.
 
2017-11-10 04:49:34 PM  

Linux_Yes: Gubbo: At this point they are all the same
Windows does have the added benefit of added spyware, etc.


It can all be turned off quite easily. Apple has similar phone home efforts as well.
Linux doesn't but they don't really have a single producer, so it makes sense.

rcain: Hey subby -- in MY WORLD (doing Internet Technology for startups), most everyone uses Mac Laptops
Oh sure, you could do development on Windows as well, if you wanted to use a VM or CygWin and deal with managing all that setup just to start working. I can do everything I need right in the native OS and Commandline, just as I do with *nix. And with the market demand for iOS Apps, and NO DEMAND AT ALL for Windows Mobile Apps, using Apple OS for Development is the best way to go for Web and Mobile Development. In fact the only reason I can think of why a Web or Mobile Developer would want to use Windows for their workstation is because they build for .NET and use Xamarin for Mobile -- beyond that, they are either zealots or too broke to afford a Mac


Developers only use Macs if they are doing any substantial work with xCode, otherwise there is no justifying the cost. Know why they have to do this? Because Apple made it basically impossible (and technically a violation of their TOS) to run OSX on non Mac hardware/VM's. Considering xCode requires the latest OSX, it means that VM's are basically right out.

Java is platform independent and can be developed on anything, with plenty of ease.

Windows 10 has BASH built in now, you just have to turn it on, and it's stupid simple. It's not Cygwin, it is more like reverse WINE. There are numerous free tools for development from web based IDE's and other open source projects like Eclipse/Aptana to fill gaps. 

Windows is cheaper, and more importantly, it has Active Directory. If you are in a large enterprise environment there is nothing better for user management - particularly with the use of Exchange (though 365 is the future). When I was at AWS training a few weeks ago, the large majority of the room was on Windows machines for the reason I just stated above. Small studios and independents use macs because of the reasons I specified.

I use a MBP at my office currently, but the second I leave the office I turn it off and I use my W10 desktop because it is a serious machine.
 
2017-11-10 05:00:21 PM  

derpes_simplex: Here's one annoying example.  I find it annoying because I work with RHEL/Centos and I like my laptop to at least share some common features of command packages and utils...

Make a 3 line scratch file called foo.txt

line1
line2
line3

Now run this command against it to delete the 2nd line....

sed -i 2d foo.txt

This is the most common sed command I can think of, often used to blast out stale entries in known_hosts.  It don't work on a Mac.  In fact, just try to get sed to edit the file inline without another output file specified.  It'll make ya batty.  I know that's sorta trivial, and it's related to it being BSD based.  But most folks run actual linux in prod, not BSD.  Having to remember two sets of behaviors for something like sed is fricking lame.


So you're using a non-standard feature of the GNU version of sed, and upset that it's not in every version?

/There's also a macport of coreutils, which probably has GNU sed, too.
//Bet it's in pkgsrc, too.
 
2017-11-10 05:05:05 PM  

dirkfunk: Gubbo: dirkfunk: mcreadyblue: SurfaceTension: Ubuntu Linux FTW

2018 is the Year of Linux on the Desktop

I was hoping to set up a media computer using Ubuntu and an old laptop. After installing a new copy of Ubuntu on the laptop, I realized nothing works on Ubuntu anymore and gave up. The project is either dead, or I'll install Android on it. I think progress stopped on linux about a decade ago. It feels old, clunky and useless today. Sad, but true.

Solid effort. Should get bites.

Yeah... bites.

I wanted a computer that could do extreme stuff like play Hulu and Netflix videos without a lot of effort. Ubuntu can't do that. If my pointing that out offends you, get a hobby.


Genuinely thought you were trolling. But only cause I don't think I had any trouble with those. I thought they were pretty platform agnostic these days. Just use chrome and they work.

Maybe I'm wrong.
 
2017-11-10 05:05:56 PM  
Obtw, from the sed man page on macOS:

STANDARDS
The sed utility is expected to be a superset of the IEEE Std 1003.2
(''POSIX.2'') specification.

The -E, -a and -i options are non-standard FreeBSD extensions and may not
be available on other operating systems.


It's a bit daft to be relying on non-standard extensions, then complain when other systems implement them differently.
 
2017-11-10 05:06:05 PM  

dirkfunk: Gubbo: dirkfunk: mcreadyblue: SurfaceTension: Ubuntu Linux FTW

2018 is the Year of Linux on the Desktop

I was hoping to set up a media computer using Ubuntu and an old laptop. After installing a new copy of Ubuntu on the laptop, I realized nothing works on Ubuntu anymore and gave up. The project is either dead, or I'll install Android on it. I think progress stopped on linux about a decade ago. It feels old, clunky and useless today. Sad, but true.

Solid effort. Should get bites.

Yeah... bites.

I wanted a computer that could do extreme stuff like play Hulu and Netflix videos without a lot of effort. Ubuntu can't do that. If my pointing that out offends you, get a hobby.


My HTPC, an Acer Revo, runs Ubuntu 16.04 without problems. Netflix runs on Chrome without any workaround. I also run Kodi as well as two HDDs worth of media. I'm not sure what problems you encountered.
 
2017-11-10 05:07:53 PM  

derpes_simplex: rcain: derpes_simplex: rcain: Hey subby -- in MY WORLD (doing Internet Technology for startups), most everyone uses Mac Laptops
Oh sure, you could do development on Windows as well, if you wanted to use a VM or CygWin and deal with managing all that setup just to start working. I can do everything I need right in the native OS and Commandline, just as I do with *nix. And with the market demand for iOS Apps, and NO DEMAND AT ALL for Windows Mobile Apps, using Apple OS for Development is the best way to go for Web and Mobile Development. In fact the only reason I can think of why a Web or Mobile Developer would want to use Windows for their workstation is because they build for .NET and use Xamarin for Mobile -- beyond that, they are either zealots or too broke to afford a Mac

Sadly, VMs and/or Cygwin is often a better approximation of an actual Linux system than the bastardized BSD install that comes on a Mac.

How so? I've been working with both OSX and *nix since 2001 and the only issues I've ever had running code on Linux that I created on a Mac was a realtime Font Parser I created that ripped apart Chinese and Korean Font Sets into individual Glyphs and repackaged each Glyph as a Flash Fonts for UI Rendering in a Flex App -- the Code Was created with Java and the Apple Font Library for Java was not compatible with the Linux Font Library for Java, so instead of running the App and doing the processing on AWS as planned, I did all the processing on my Apple X-Serve in order to meet the deadline

But that was a Java/JRE Issue and nothing to do with OSX or Linux itself
Also, that bastardized BSDis an ACTUAL UNIX, and certified as such
Linux is famously NOT UNIX, hence "*nix"

Here's one annoying example.  I find it annoying because I work with RHEL/Centos and I like my laptop to at least share some common features of command packages and utils...

Make a 3 line scratch file called foo.txt

line1
line2
line3

Now run this command against it to delete the 2nd line.... ...


Learn Perl. I haven't touched actual sed or awk in years.
 
2017-11-10 05:09:37 PM  

mcreadyblue: SurfaceTension: Ubuntu Linux FTW

2018 is the Year of Linux on the Desktop


I just wish I could slap Linux on my father's machine.  You don't want to know how many toolbars, how many viruses, how much hardware no longer connects.  But noooo, linux doesn't run Family Tree Maker so on goes Windows.

I probably should fix my mom's the same way (shouldn't have the same software specific issues).  She absolutely insisted on Windows 10 after seeing my aunt's new computer.  My aunt uses a chromebook...
 
2017-11-10 05:14:38 PM  

Linux_Yes: rcain: Hey subby -- in MY WORLD (doing Internet Technology for startups), most everyone uses Mac Laptops
Oh sure, you could do development on Windows as well, if you wanted to use a VM or CygWin and deal with managing all that setup just to start working. I can do everything I need right in the native OS and Commandline, just as I do with *nix. And with the market demand for iOS Apps, and NO DEMAND AT ALL for Windows Mobile Apps, using Apple OS for Development is the best way to go for Web and Mobile Development. In fact the only reason I can think of why a Web or Mobile Developer would want to use Windows for their workstation is because they build for .NET and use Xamarin for Mobile -- beyond that, they are either zealots or too broke to afford a Mac

Intel's PC is Inside!
http://www.tomshardware.com/news/googl​e-removing-minix-management-engine-int​el,35876.html

The ME has its own MAC and IP address for the out-of-band interface, with direct access to the Ethernet controller; one portion of the Ethernet traffic is diverted to the ME even before reaching the host's operating system, for what support exists in various Ethernet controllers, exported and made configurable via Management Component Transport Protocol (MCTP).[37][38] The ME also communicates with the host via PCI interface.[36] Under Linux, communication between the host and the ME is done via /dev/mei.[34]


And that effects user space how exactly? That's so low-level that only System Engineers would have any knowledge or concern about that. Devs couldn't give two shiats since they only care about their ability to get work done. Granted, removing an embedded OS from the Processor would be great -- but that is something that effects ALL machines with Intel Processors and not just Mac users. So your post made in response to me is a red herring
 
2017-11-10 05:25:41 PM  

Gubbo: dirkfunk: Gubbo: dirkfunk: mcreadyblue: SurfaceTension: Ubuntu Linux FTW

2018 is the Year of Linux on the Desktop

I was hoping to set up a media computer using Ubuntu and an old laptop. After installing a new copy of Ubuntu on the laptop, I realized nothing works on Ubuntu anymore and gave up. The project is either dead, or I'll install Android on it. I think progress stopped on linux about a decade ago. It feels old, clunky and useless today. Sad, but true.

Solid effort. Should get bites.

Yeah... bites.

I wanted a computer that could do extreme stuff like play Hulu and Netflix videos without a lot of effort. Ubuntu can't do that. If my pointing that out offends you, get a hobby.

Genuinely thought you were trolling. But only cause I don't think I had any trouble with those. I thought they were pretty platform agnostic these days. Just use chrome and they work.

Maybe I'm wrong.


Sorry, not trolling. I'm just sad.

Hulu and Netflix don't work with Firefox on the latest Ubuntu due to DRM crap. So I tried Chromium and the packages failed. I could get all motivated about the whole thing and make it work. But honestly, the whole project was just because my girlfriend can't figure out the PS4. She's just going to have to figure it out.

But really my point is that a dozen years ago Ubuntu just worked. Everything seemed to behave as good or better than windows. With enough motivation I even got WoW and Teamspeak to work on linux simultaneously. Now it feels like it's been left behind in the mid-00's, which feels way behind Windows, OSX, IOS or Android.
 
2017-11-10 05:26:28 PM  
First of all, cash that check, Subwhoremitter.

Second of all, blow me.
 
2017-11-10 05:29:52 PM  

iron de havilland: derpes_simplex: Here's one annoying example.  I find it annoying because I work with RHEL/Centos and I like my laptop to at least share some common features of command packages and utils...

Make a 3 line scratch file called foo.txt

line1
line2
line3

Now run this command against it to delete the 2nd line....

sed -i 2d foo.txt

This is the most common sed command I can think of, often used to blast out stale entries in known_hosts.  It don't work on a Mac.  In fact, just try to get sed to edit the file inline without another output file specified.  It'll make ya batty.  I know that's sorta trivial, and it's related to it being BSD based.  But most folks run actual linux in prod, not BSD.  Having to remember two sets of behaviors for something like sed is fricking lame.

So you're using a non-standard feature of the GNU version of sed, and upset that it's not in every version?

/There's also a macport of coreutils, which probably has GNU sed, too.
//Bet it's in pkgsrc, too.


The point is that testing existing scripts, or things that work in your prod environment against your mac is not a valid thing unless you happen to be using BSD.  A point was being made that the mac is great because it has all your native linux stuff right there, but unless you spend a silly amount of time matching packages, it won't be similar to prod.  It becomes no easier than spinning up a VM or using *cough* cygwin.  Sure you get native ssh and all that stuff, so you don't have to waste time getting that set up just so you can log in.  But as a dev environment I find it pretty useless until I spin up virtualbox.  That being said, you're going to run into that problem choosing just about anything as your laptop OS, and nobody wants to run RHEL on a laptop for obvious reasons.  I only used the sed example to highlight why you can't assume anything will work just using your mac if your prod env doesn't match exactly.
 
2017-11-10 05:33:39 PM  
Submitter:

out here in the Windoze world, guys you would not hire to mow your lawn will suddenly think they are your superior, even though they have done (and will never do) anything to prove that.

It's a particularly weird cult. If I take my car in to the shop, nobody there will sneer at me because I didn't take the transmission apart on my kitchen table with a toothpick, and yet computer dweebs will act all high and mighty if I don't know how to do something that I don't need to do, if they are doing their jobs correctly.
 
2017-11-10 05:37:13 PM  

derpes_simplex: The point is that testing existing scripts, or things that work in your prod environment against your mac is not a valid thing unless you happen to be using BSD.  A point was being made that the mac is great because it has all your native linux stuff right there, but unless you spend a silly amount of time matching packages, it won't be similar to prod.  It becomes no easier than spinning up a VM or using *cough* cygwin.  Sure you get native ssh and all that stuff, so you don't have to waste time getting that set up just so you can log in.  But as a dev environment I find it pretty useless until I spin up virtualbox.  That being said, you're going to run into that problem choosing just about anything as your laptop OS, and nobody wants to run RHEL on a laptop for obvious reasons.  I only used the sed example to highlight why you can't assume anything will work just using your mac if your prod env doesn't match exactly.


But you're writing non-portable code or scripts or whatever, and complaining that it's not portable. Stick to POSIX, or use something like autoconf or whatever to ensure that your code builds and works on non-GNU systems and you're fine.

And if you're set on coding to the GNU utils, just install them locally and put their PATH before /bin and /usr/bin. Not really a difficult issue to solve.

Like I say, there's even a macport of it, so you don't even need to build it yourself.
 
2017-11-10 05:37:45 PM  

yet_another_wumpus: mcreadyblue: SurfaceTension: Ubuntu Linux FTW

2018 is the Year of Linux on the Desktop

I just wish I could slap Linux on my father's machine.  You don't want to know how many toolbars, how many viruses, how much hardware no longer connects.  But noooo, linux doesn't run Family Tree Maker so on goes Windows.

I probably should fix my mom's the same way (shouldn't have the same software specific issues).  She absolutely insisted on Windows 10 after seeing my aunt's new computer.  My aunt uses a chromebook...


lolololol! Family Tree Maker and those damned embroidery programs are serious business to seniors.
 
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