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(Reno Gazette-Journal)   Nevada county residents upset because they can't make religious slogans part of the water bill   ( divider line
    More: Stupid  
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2471 clicks; posted to Main » on 28 Dec 2001 at 9:13 AM (18 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook

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2001-12-28 9:19:37 AM  
Religions slogans like,

"Christians. Working hard to take your freedom of religion away."

"Christians. Please don't be angry, it's out duty to force our beliefs on you."

2001-12-28 9:22:29 AM  
"It's time the majority rules,"Wardwell said."This is supposed to be a democracy."

I get sick of Americans not understanding the fact that we are a representative democracy, not a majority (read mob) rules direct democracy. The US Constitution is specifically set up to protect the rights of the minority from exactly such statements as that from this idiot.
2001-12-28 9:24:08 AM  
"I am offended that Christians have used this tragedy from the World Trade Center to promote their own religion,"he said.

That's funny - I don't hear him biatching about radical Muslims destroying the WTC in the name of Allah . . .
2001-12-28 9:31:33 AM  
Gee, what's this fellow going to do when he gets the bill with the message "Merry Christmas"?

From the headline, I figured it was something more specific and would be agreeing that it was inappropriate. But "God Bless America"? That's promoting religion. Good (pardon the expression) Lord!
2001-12-28 9:31:39 AM  
Personally, I biatch about radical Christians, Muslims and Jews fairly equally.
2001-12-28 9:35:16 AM  
"a property owner complained about a violation of the separation of church and state."

As he should have. Good man.
2001-12-28 9:36:02 AM  
"Gee, what's this fellow going to do when he gets the bill with the message 'Merry Christmas'?"

That's why you don't write "Merry Christmas" to people who might not believe in your god and write "Happy Holidays". It's pretty simple really--doesn't take much brain power and gets the same meaning across. You can only be OK with bills saying "Merry Christmas" if you would also be OK if a Muslim was making the bills and just included the greeting "Happy Ramadan". I doubt many Christians would be happy to have that greeting greet them on their utility bill.
2001-12-28 9:41:51 AM  
This woman claiming to be an atheist has made a grave mistake. She should've said she was a devout christian. That way the christians can't say anything.
2001-12-28 9:52:49 AM  
Actually, World Citizen, I'd have no trouble with that.
2001-12-28 9:57:27 AM  
Well, GadgetDon, I'm glad. But I still would put money that this town would not be OK with that greeting on their bill. Get someone to send out a bill with "Happy Ramadan" on it to that same town, and let's sit back and see how many of them complain.
2001-12-28 9:57:32 AM  
personally I cant wait until the peasants who still believe in a 'magic bearded man in the sky (tm)' die out and let the human race get on with important matters.
2001-12-28 10:00:39 AM  
As long as people fear, there will be fundies.
2001-12-28 10:07:28 AM  
Meshman is exactly right.

The "in god we trust" slogan was put on our money, inserted in the pledge of allegiance, and added to court procedings because of christian PARANOIA during the McCarthy era of the 1950's. It was a propaganda ploy to oppose America from communist countries, which were designed to be totally secular. To paraphrase: "My God, we can't have an America that is secular if communist countries are also secular. That would mean WE would be too much like THEM." Sadly, all this "in god we trust" crap was not removed when all the rabid paranoia about communism subsided and Senator McCarthy died in the nut house.

It is just typical for christians to constantly remind themselves (via "Kilroy-was-here" type graffiti) that only they hold the lock and key to the absolute truth to the mysteries of life and the universe, and everyone else in the history of humankind has been totally wrong. Sometimes christian arrogance is way beyond measure.
2001-12-28 10:08:50 AM  
non-issue. Next!
2001-12-28 10:11:06 AM  
You wish!
2001-12-28 10:16:16 AM  
"You have irreparably violated my civil rights by using public resources to promote religion," wrote Messina.

"Irreparably violated"??? WTF? I thought that was something akin to being anally raped in prison. Now that's being "irreparably violated". I guess she'll have to be in therapy for life over this tramatic experience.

Her being offended offends me, where's my soapbox? WAH! WAH! WAH!

Somebody get this woman laid. Fb-, you around?
2001-12-28 10:17:39 AM  
Christians can be a bit hypocritical in their calls for "religious freedom". I think that in my classroom I will start out every Monday with a classroom wide group Christian prayer. Christians will cheer Monday evening when their kids come home and tell them of their prayer session. Then Tuesday morning, we will start class with a nice Jewish prayer. Tuesday evening the Christian parents will be a little uneasy. Wednesday we will start out the class knealing to the east for a nice Muslim prayer. Wednesday evening I will start getting phone calls from concerned Christian parents. Thursday we will have a nice period of Buddhist meditation. I will inform the students of how the path to enlightenment can be attained by following the teachings of the Buddha. Thursday evening I will get a call from the school board telling me that my job could be on the line because of the outrage expressed by several of the children's Christian parents.
2001-12-28 10:19:40 AM  
Damn straight! The US claims to have such a seperation of church and state, but lets get one of those wiccan people and see if their religion is as respected by the government. Not that I follow the beliefs of wiccans, but it is a religion... one that I think wouldn't get national holidays.
2001-12-28 10:19:56 AM  
WC - Are you reserving friday for summoning Satan?
2001-12-28 10:21:05 AM  
How about "Nobody bless you" on the bills?
2001-12-28 10:22:26 AM  
Creeto: How about "What Would Jesus Pay?" on the bills?
2001-12-28 10:25:56 AM  
CM: I don't know. I think Fridays should be rotating. I wouldn't want to leave anyone out. Certainly to be fair, Satanists would have to have a prayer once in awhile. I would have to step on religious freedoms a bit as I don't think I'd want a goat sacrificed in my classroom. I could also do Hindu, Shinto, Greek Myth and various African pagan religions on Fridays. Maybe I should go in order of number of followers in the US or some such thing.
2001-12-28 10:34:13 AM  
" for all your horse castrating needs"

would be a pretty non-demoninational slogan. run with it.
2001-12-28 10:36:09 AM  
On the one had we have someone who's civil rights were "irreparably harmed" because someone else spent the cost of a stamp's worth of ink in public funds on a really really vague but still religious message. On the other side we have somone who wants a tyrrany of the majority (and actually thinks that's how our country is supposed to work).
There should be some sort of rule that all news articles need to have a quote from at least one person who's not a total wack job.
2001-12-28 10:37:37 AM  
I think we should put everybody involved in the affair, from the person that wrote the message, to the lady complaining, to the asshole that wrote the article in front of a firing squad and be done with the whole affair.
2001-12-28 10:37:57 AM  
WC - I'd make the whole thing one big rotation. Until you run out of religions, that is. Then you can start all over. Also, I don't think you need to go so far as to sacrifice live animals to The Dark One. I mean, you're not
going to perform an entire latin mass when the catholics' turn rolls around, are you?
2001-12-28 10:38:52 AM  
"You have irreparably violated my civil rights by using public resources to promote religion," wrote Messina

Suck it up. Just because a government official slaps "God Bless America" on a Post-it note on his desk doesn't mean you have to scream about it.

If anything, America is too anti-religious. People argue like each individual has the right to censor whatever religious message they like, because it might offend them.
2001-12-28 10:40:10 AM  
Whoops. Been spending too much time on non-HTML enabled places. Those [i]s should be <i>s.
2001-12-28 10:41:06 AM  
By the way, $5 says this guy has stolen office supplies and used them for his own purposes
2001-12-28 10:42:00 AM  
WorldCitizen, you hit the nail on the head!

P.S. I have heard that some Satanists require that a nude woman be present at all their worship services.
2001-12-28 10:47:44 AM  
"If anything, America is too anti-religious. People argue like each individual has the right to censor whatever religious message they like, because it might offend them."

Bisifiniti - Religious messages are fine. Government-sponsored religious messages are not.
2001-12-28 10:47:45 AM  
Hmm, Huracan, I don't know. It's difficult (I was going to say hard) enough to keep the attention of teenage boys in class on a normal day. I'd never get anywhere if they had to spend the rest of the day excusing themselves to the rest room.
2001-12-28 11:03:59 AM  
as an atheist, i'd like to say that i honestly don't give a fark what message is written on my water bill. it could say, "go suck a donkey cock" for all i care. it's just a bill, fer christ's sake!

you're rights were "irreparably violated?" what the hell is wrong w/ you? you're an atheist! you know that you're in the minority. how could it bother you so much that your community wants to spread a tiny little positive message once a month. so it's on a state document. it's not like they're mailing bibles with yr bills! the water dept isn't turning off service to non-christians! calm down! besides, "god bless america" is a friggin cliche these days.

whew, enough of that. </rant>
2001-12-28 11:06:20 AM  
Nevada Water Commission says:
"Drink our water, it comes from God's dick. Plus if you don't, you'll make Plastic Baby Jeebus cry."

I'll trudge off to Hell now...
2001-12-28 11:06:51 AM  
WorldCitizen: Perhaps, to be entirely fair to religious freedom, you should perform prayers of different Christian denominations on different days. I'm sure there are some people (CoughJackChickCough) who would be offended if you mixed, say, Catholic prayer with Protestant.
2001-12-28 11:10:15 AM  
My water bill never say nice stuff like merry christmas. They always have slogans like "4th NOTICE!! PAST DUE!"

2001-12-28 11:17:43 AM  
WorldCitizen, you should just eliminate that whole pesky "learning" portion of school. Somebody might get offended in History, how it's slightly biased towards a certain culture, or some people migh get offended by the Biology textbooks, or Surrealists might get offended by the facts in a Math book.

Censoring religion is an atheistic move. Atheism's as much a religion as anything else, and it shouldn't get it's way simply because it isn't a belief but a lack thereof.
2001-12-28 11:19:27 AM  
That "irreparably violated" BS should have to be explained a little better. Hopefully in the actual legal process, it was. I can't imagine this person being anything other than a huge farkin' anal retentive loser. And he/she has a lot more concessions to make (like not using American money), or claims to take to court (to get God off of the money).

I have a feeling that most people who are atheists or who don't practice the predominant religion in this country are more like DB. At least I hope so. Never underestimate the power of the cult of victimology though.

2001-12-28 11:20:34 AM  
Praise be to Allah
2001-12-28 11:30:38 AM  
Bisifiniti: No one is censoring religion. You can preach and pray and do whatever religious expression you want on your own time and on private property. You can buy all the billboards preaching your religion you want. You can have as many tax-exempt churches as you can imagine. That's all on your time, your dime and your space.
Just don't put it on government property. Or if you are going to do it, represent them all, not just one.
Religion is taught in school in its historical context. You can't understand history without understanding religion. But that includes all major religions that have influenced world history, not just Christianity.

Bhamv: . "I'm sure there are some people (CoughJackChickCough) who would be offended if you mixed, say, Catholic prayer with Protestant."
Hehe...that's the point.
2001-12-28 11:33:12 AM  
"Atheism's as much a religion as anything else."

Bisinfiniti - Atheism is NOT a religion, it is a LACK of religious beliefs. Big difference. Also, the issue at hand is not one of religious censorship. The issue is the separation of church and state.
2001-12-28 11:34:05 AM  
Oh, and on a personal note, I probably never would have noticed the damn message on the bill in the first place. I'm for separation of church and state, but as DB said, "God Bless America", as well as "In God We Trust" are both cliche and generic. They really don't carry that much meaning behind them to the masses. I really couldn't care less that our money says, "In God We Trust". Now if they said "In Jesus Christ We Trust", I'd probably be a for getting it the hell off of my cash.
2001-12-28 11:41:07 AM  
DB, how can you say you are an athiest and make a comment like "for christ sake", or was that an attempt at humor?

I must say though, that fire, text, cat, fb,wc,slayer...are all good citizens, as socrates would define it. I think that after 5 years in the bible belt I just reformed from atheist to an agnostic, it is much easier on the ears that way, and besides i will have to rent a new appartment for all the bibles i receive (6 so far, and still in the wrappers).

I think that we should separate the states into non-believers on one side, and believers on the other, that would be a separation worth fighting for, then they could spend their tax dollars on writing god on whatever the fark they wanted to.
2001-12-28 11:41:20 AM  
And I have to agree that Atheism isn't a religion. It is a total lack of religion...certainly a total lack of something does not qualify as that something.
I think it's hard for some of those out there that seem to need to believe in something to understand that there are some people that can function perfectly normally without needing a belief system. I happen to be agnostic just because I personally can't justifying claiming to know if there is or is not a diety out there. I just can't claim that my little carbon based brain on this little rock in the universe is in any place to lay such claims either way, but that is just a totally personal stance. I don't fault anyone for logical, well thought out beliefs either way. Notice I say logical and well thought out...for those out there that just blindly believe anything without question...THINK.
That's all.
2001-12-28 11:41:31 AM  

You couldn't be more wrong. Atheism is not a lack of beliefs. Atheists have beliefs as strong as Pat Robertson. They only believe that there is no God. No omnipotent presence.
2001-12-28 11:42:56 AM  
"Atheism is NOT a religion, it is a LACK of religious beliefs. Big difference."

Yeah, the belief in no religion, a religion in itself. Sounds like your God is what's wrong with "God bless america" then?
2001-12-28 11:42:57 AM  
All hail the great god Equilibrium.
2001-12-28 11:44:30 AM  
whoa there WC, "They really don't carry that much meaning behind them to the masses", what do you think that is then? it doesn't say anything but silent messages that we should believe in god? no?
2001-12-28 11:48:34 AM  
Cyberhoser: Ultimately, I don't think it should be on there, but I think there are bigger fish to fry in this world. No one really pays attention to it--which is what I mean by it doesn't really carry that much meaning to the masses. That doesn't make it right, but that does make it more of a backburner my mind. And that is strickly just a personal opinion. I'm sure there are non-religious people out there that care much more about it than I do.
2001-12-28 11:49:51 AM  
Fb-, Pericles: Strong belief in something doesn't make it a religion. If someone believed strongly in the sanctity of marriage, does that make marriage a religion? What about political or philosophical beliefs?

Thus, a lack of religious beliefs does not make a religion.
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