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(UPI)   The last time a Chancellor was in this bad of a bargaining position, Valorum lost control of the Senate   (upi.com) divider line
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963 clicks; posted to Sports » on 06 Aug 2015 at 10:51 AM (5 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



25 Comments     (+0 »)
 
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2015-08-06 9:47:28 AM  
I knew the Seahawks were being blockaded by the Trade Federation.
 
2015-08-06 10:49:00 AM  
+1 for Subby.

/Go Hawks.
 
2015-08-06 10:55:06 AM  
Another one of those things that no1curr.

He's getting healthier, saves on training camp wear and tear, and the younger guys get more reps. As long as he's there for the season, I'm pretty sure he knows his job in the secondary and isn't getting anything significant out of training camp.
 
2015-08-06 11:05:21 AM  
Headline submitted by Dennis Miller?
 
2015-08-06 11:34:31 AM  
OH KAM ON!  Don't screw this up in the name of greed.
 
2015-08-06 11:39:18 AM  
Dear Pro Athletes, you signed a contract, please honor it or give the money back and go away.  Thank you.
 
2015-08-06 11:44:08 AM  

wiseolddude: Dear Pro Athletes, you signed a contract, please honor it or give the money back and go away.  Thank you.


As soon as the NFL guarantees their end.
 
2015-08-06 11:47:04 AM  

PluckYew: wiseolddude: Dear Pro Athletes, you signed a contract, please honor it or give the money back and go away.  Thank you.

As soon as the NFL guarantees their end.


That's incredibly simplistic. All NFL contracts are partially guaranteed, partially non-guaranteed. It reflects an allocation of risks that is heavily negotiated between team and player. The non-guaranteed portion is effectively a team option, which it gets as consideration for giving up the guaranteed portion. When a team cuts a player it's not dishonoring the contract; it's exercising a right specifically given to it under the contract. A holdout, by contrast, is a breach.
 
2015-08-06 11:52:36 AM  
There are better ways to go about getting a better contract. I can understand both sides of the argument, but at the end of the day, the team wins the argument.
 
2015-08-06 12:12:13 PM  
"and ostensibly is seeking an upgrade over the $4.55 million he is set to be paid in 2015."

media4.giphy.comView Full Size
 
2015-08-06 12:33:53 PM  

xaks: Super Chronic: PluckYew: wiseolddude: Dear Pro Athletes, you signed a contract, please honor it or give the money back and go away.  Thank you.

As soon as the NFL guarantees their end.

That's incredibly simplistic. All NFL contracts are partially guaranteed, partially non-guaranteed. It reflects an allocation of risks that is heavily negotiated between team and player. The non-guaranteed portion is effectively a team option, which it gets as consideration for giving up the guaranteed portion. When a team cuts a player it's not dishonoring the contract; it's exercising a right specifically given to it under the contract. A holdout, by contrast, is a breach.

And is inherent bullshiat

Players hold out because that's all they can do. It's not like the club will shoulder any of the injury risk.

So long as they give non-guaranteed contracts and fark players over with the franchise/transition tags, this'll happen.

Now, those things exist BECAUSE the NFLPA is run by a retard in the pocket of the league and has been for years, but that's a different story.


Suppose a MLB team signs a player for two years and $20 million ($10 million per year), with a team option for a third year at another $10 million. After year two, the team declines to pick up the option, making the player a free agent. Do you have a problem with that? Why or why not?

It's exactly the same thing as an NFL contract that's nominally $30 million with only $20 million guaranteed. The only reason NFL teams structure them differently is because of the salary cap: signing bonuses are prorated, so more nominal years tend to be added, even though everybody knows it's not likely to run for its full term.
 
2015-08-06 12:34:03 PM  
If the Seahawks hate train doesn't get rolling today like it usually does, Patrick Kane is under a rape investigation in Buffalo so Blackhawks hating can be substituted.
 
2015-08-06 12:45:55 PM  

Super Chronic: That's incredibly simplistic. All NFL contracts are partially guaranteed, partially non-guaranteed. It reflects an allocation of risks that is heavily negotiated between team and player. The non-guaranteed portion is effectively a team option, which it gets as consideration for giving up the guaranteed portion. When a team cuts a player it's not dishonoring the contract; it's exercising a right specifically given to it under the contract. A holdout, by contrast, is a breach.


And they don't get paid when the hold out, so what's the big deal with them asking for more money?
 
2015-08-06 1:04:39 PM  
What a waste of a great talent.  And I am talking about Terrance Stamp.
 
2015-08-06 1:31:45 PM  

xaks: But that's the whole point.

Stop with the funny munny and bullshiat years. Guarantee X years at x dollars period. Signing bonus? Counted in the guaranteed years only.

Simple math, simple numbers, no bullshiat.

Of course, agents and capologists would be out of jobs and glory, but for the most part, they can take a long walk off a short pier for all I care.


Yeah, there's no real great way of doing things. On the one hand, I don't really dig the idea of some teams just being able to outspend everyone. On the other, I don't like the "well, the way to be really good is to be the best at paying people less than they're worth" attitude that comes with the salary cap.

I wish you could exceed the cap to sign your own draft picks, but then you're limited to certain types of contracts if you want to sign FA vets, kinda like basketball, but instead of limiting it to one player, you can keep as many as you can stomach paying. Just gotta actually draft well.

/obviously this opinion is partially influenced by recent events involving the Seahawks
 
2015-08-06 1:36:32 PM  

xaks: But that's the whole point.

Stop with the funny munny and bullshiat years. Guarantee X years at x dollars period. Signing bonus? Counted in the guaranteed years only.

Simple math, simple numbers, no bullshiat.

Of course, agents and capologists would be out of jobs and glory, but for the most part, they can take a long walk off a short pier for all I care.

 

Just so we're clear, are you standing up for worker protections, or are you standing up for accounting integrity? Because my point is that the worker protections are not all that different between MLB and the NFL. Yes, NFL contracts tend to be shorter in terms of guaranteed years, because it's a violent sport and careers tend to be shorter. You won't see anything like Robinson Cano's ten-year deal any time soon in the NFL. (We really shouldn't have seen it in MLB either but that's another discussion.) But if it's about accounting integrity, what difference does it make to you if the team and the player agree to slap a couple of bullshiat years on the back end?
 
2015-08-06 2:11:55 PM  

Electromax: If the Seahawks hate train doesn't get rolling today like it usually does, Patrick Kane is under a rape investigation in Buffalo so Blackhawks hating can be substituted.


Was just discussing this with a friend. If this turns out to be true, it will be the leagues only chance to set a level of expectation. Otherwise, any discipline in the future will be meaningless.
 
2015-08-06 2:19:03 PM  

Super Chronic: But if it's about accounting integrity, what difference does it make to you if the team and the player agree to slap a couple of bullshiat years on the back end?


I'm not a fan of the bullsh*t back end because all the numbers are then horsesh*t. The cap number is different than what you're spending is different than what a guy's actually making that year...it's what I recall from the Dilbert books, a confuseopoly, akin to what phone companies do. Instead of creating a fair marketplace where everyone can understand what's going on, they create incredibly complex rules for no real reason except to ensure that it's impossible for others to get a good understanding of what they can fairly expect.

Don't have a situation where "This team has $10 million in dead cap money; they're paying a couple players $3 million to not be there, and if you want to count actual amount paid this year, they've spent more than the cap because they had signing bonuses this year" is the norm. Or "This team is x over the cap, but they're actually spending $50M under the cap because of how the cap works," which is possible.
 
2015-08-06 2:43:36 PM  
"The last time a Chancellor was in this bad of a bargaining position, Victor Newman come in and saved the company by acquiring it.

FTFY.

/yougotthat?
 
2015-08-06 3:49:56 PM  

iron_city_ap: There are better ways to go about getting a better contract. I can understand both sides of the argument, but at the end of the day, the team wins the argument.


They both win. Kam's primary goal is more monies. His secondary goal is no training camp.
 
2015-08-06 5:04:34 PM  
I dont care who Kam plays for as long as he keeps racking up IDP points for my fantasy leagues.
 
2015-08-07 8:06:39 AM  
+1 for the headline subby, I enjoyed it. :D
 
2015-08-07 11:43:13 AM  

OtherLittleGuy: "The last time a Chancellor was in this bad of a bargaining position, Victor Newman come in and saved the company by acquiring it.

FTFY.

/yougotthat?


I was trying to put together an Otto von Bismarck reference, but I couldn't make it work.
 
2015-08-07 3:45:37 PM  

OtherLittleGuy: "The last time a Chancellor was in this bad of a bargaining position, Victor Newman come in and saved the company by acquiring it.

FTFY.

/yougotthat?


it's been 30+ years since I watched but sadly yes, I got that.
 
2015-08-07 5:12:51 PM  

xaks: Super Chronic: xaks: Super Chronic: PluckYew: wiseolddude: Dear Pro Athletes, you signed a contract, please honor it or give the money back and go away.  Thank you.

As soon as the NFL guarantees their end.

That's incredibly simplistic. All NFL contracts are partially guaranteed, partially non-guaranteed. It reflects an allocation of risks that is heavily negotiated between team and player. The non-guaranteed portion is effectively a team option, which it gets as consideration for giving up the guaranteed portion. When a team cuts a player it's not dishonoring the contract; it's exercising a right specifically given to it under the contract. A holdout, by contrast, is a breach.

And is inherent bullshiat

Players hold out because that's all they can do. It's not like the club will shoulder any of the injury risk.

So long as they give non-guaranteed contracts and fark players over with the franchise/transition tags, this'll happen.

Now, those things exist BECAUSE the NFLPA is run by a retard in the pocket of the league and has been for years, but that's a different story.

Suppose a MLB team signs a player for two years and $20 million ($10 million per year), with a team option for a third year at another $10 million. After year two, the team declines to pick up the option, making the player a free agent. Do you have a problem with that? Why or why not?

It's exactly the same thing as an NFL contract that's nominally $30 million with only $20 million guaranteed. The only reason NFL teams structure them differently is because of the salary cap: signing bonuses are prorated, so more nominal years tend to be added, even though everybody knows it's not likely to run for its full term.

But that's the whole point.

Stop with the funny munny and bullshiat years. Guarantee X years at x dollars period. Signing bonus? Counted in the guaranteed years only.

Simple math, simple numbers, no bullshiat.

Of course, agents and capologists would be out of jobs and glory, but for the most part, they can take a long walk off a short pier for all I care.


But then players wouldn't be able to brag about their contract and neither could their agents. Actual amount they get paid be damned.
 
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