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(Salon)   Superhero segregation: why do nearly all heroes live in mostly-white, wealthy, elite New York City?   ( salon.com) divider line
    More: Sad, New York City, DC Comics, Image Comics, mid-west, Dr. Doom, West Coast blues, new economy, u.s. east coast  
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2578 clicks; posted to Entertainment » on 17 Aug 2013 at 4:56 PM (5 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-08-17 01:15:05 PM  
Some West Coast superheroes:

images1.wikia.nocookie.netView Full Size

Green Lantern, Speedy and the other members of the Green Lantern affiliated heroes operate out of Star City, California.

2.bp.blogspot.comView Full Size

Black Canary operated out of Star City and Seattle.


static.comicvine.comView Full Size

Green Lantern Hal Jordan was the protector of Coast City, Calfornia.

wtfdccomics.files.wordpress.comView Full Size

The Teen Titans operated out of San Francisco, California.

upload.wikimedia.orgView Full Size

Wonder Woman and Wonder Girl operated out of Gateway City, California.

images3.wikia.nocookie.netView Full Size

Mr. Terrific operated out of Gateway City, California.

reilly2040.co.ukView Full Size

Oracle, Huntress and Lady Blackhawk used to operate out of Platinum Flats, California.

upload.wikimedia.orgView Full Size

Zatana operates out of San Francisco.
 
2013-08-17 01:33:56 PM  
Metropolis is not Pseudo-New York it is Psedo-Chicago.
Kansas boy didn't go too far from home.
 
2013-08-17 02:02:02 PM  
i105.photobucket.comView Full Size


(Yes, he goes to NY, the southeast, France, etc. but he brings the west with him.)
 
2013-08-17 02:12:44 PM  
White, wealthy, elite NYC?
 
2013-08-17 02:28:30 PM  
It's mostly Marvel heroes that call Manhattan home.  And that's because that's where Marvel's offices are.  Write what you know.
 
2013-08-17 02:38:20 PM  
Because Spiderman's web slinging mode of transport isn't nearly as effective in Gary, Indiana.
 
2013-08-17 02:58:54 PM  

unyon: Because Spiderman's web slinging mode of transport isn't nearly as effective in Gary, Indiana.


That, plus there are no super criminals there, because there really isn't anything in Gary, Indiana that's worth stealing.
 
2013-08-17 03:00:19 PM  

Thrabalen: It's mostly Marvel heroes that call Manhattan home.  And that's because that's where Marvel's offices are.  Write what you know.


Plus NYC has more variety in the weather than anywhere along the California coastline, allowing the artists more creative freedom when setting the scene.
 
2013-08-17 03:50:25 PM  
Because you don't need a superhero that can leap several floors in a single bound to rescue a cat from a mid-century ranch house...Plus there just aren't a lot of selling points for going rural for a supervillain..
 
2013-08-17 03:51:10 PM  
Incidentally, X-Men are currently based out of San Francisco, it seems. So, really, what you have is a writer for Salon who has no idea what they're talking about and bases everything they know about comics from the Marvel movies and a quick Wikipedia search.
 
2013-08-17 03:56:31 PM  
Because the West coast wasn't exactly full of dense metropolitan areas in the thirties, when all the major superheroes were invented?
 
2013-08-17 04:01:13 PM  
Also, white, wealthy elite NYC?

It's the most diverse city in the world, with one of the highest and most varied income discrepancies.
 
2013-08-17 04:09:00 PM  

alaric3: Metropolis is not Pseudo-New York it is Psedo-Chicago.
Kansas boy didn't go too far from home.


BZZT. Wrong.

batmangothamcity.netView Full Size


Metropolis is in DELAWARE. Gotham City is in NEW JERSEY.

This is backed up by many modern DC comics, as well as Marvel/DC crossovers which establish that Metropolis, Delaware is non-existent on Marvel 616 Earth. It's just a big open field.

As for the creators' intentions, Metropolis is based on New York City during the day, and Gotham City is based on New York City (especially the seedy parts) at night. But that's OLD thinking.

In DC, NYC is NYC, and Metropolis is pretty far south of it.
 
2013-08-17 04:22:13 PM  

Thrabalen: It's mostly Marvel heroes that call Manhattan home.  And that's because that's where Marvel's offices are.  Write what you know.


Although they span the globe, and the universe.

The Black Panther is from a fictional African nation.
Doctor Doom is from a fictional Eastern Bloc nation.
The Black Widow was a spy for the U.S.S.R.
Sunfire, Silver Samurai, The Hand, and many others are based in the east-- Especially the fictional nation of Madripoor.
The 50-State Initiative put a superhero team in every state in the USA.*
The Incredible Hulk was always based out of New Mexico.
New Asgard floats above Broxton, Oklahoma.
There were West Coast Avengers and there still are Great Lakes Avengers (Now called Great Lakes Initiative).
Several heroes are based out of Chicago.
The X-Men spent a long time based in California.
Dazzler was a California icon.


50-State west-coast sampling:
California: The Order (members: Anthem, Aralune, Calamity, Supernaut, Veda)
Washington: Earth Force (members: Skyhawk, Earth Lord, Wind Warrior)
Oregon: Force of Nature (members: Aqueduct, Terraformer, Sunstreak, Skybreaker)
Alaska:Hellcat (member: Hellcat)

The article is a lot of misinformed meandering and outdated info from what seems to be a casual fan. There are many heroes in California and on the west coast. It's just that they don't all have their own books.
 
2013-08-17 04:26:07 PM  
 
2013-08-17 04:26:33 PM  
ZeroCorpse: As for the creators' intentions, Metropolis is based on New York City during the day, and Gotham City is based on New York City (especially the seedy parts) at night. But that's OLD thinking.

I've had to have this total nerd discussion with non comic readers. I don't know why DC/National didn't want to use real locations back in the day, but Marvel didn't have a problem using real places in America. Now, foreign nations are a whole 'nother story: Latveria, Wundagore, etc.
 
2013-08-17 04:29:45 PM  
'cause most comics are created by white boys. And you write what you know.
 
2013-08-17 04:36:35 PM  

Irving Maimway: ZeroCorpse: As for the creators' intentions, Metropolis is based on New York City during the day, and Gotham City is based on New York City (especially the seedy parts) at night. But that's OLD thinking.

I've had to have this total nerd discussion with non comic readers. I don't know why DC/National didn't want to use real locations back in the day,


Bill Finger said he moved Batman from NYC to Gotham so that everyone could identify with it, not just New Yorkers (i.e. so they could sell Detective to Red Sox fans too).
 
2013-08-17 05:07:42 PM  

FloydA: Irving Maimway: ZeroCorpse: As for the creators' intentions, Metropolis is based on New York City during the day, and Gotham City is based on New York City (especially the seedy parts) at night. But that's OLD thinking.

I've had to have this total nerd discussion with non comic readers. I don't know why DC/National didn't want to use real locations back in the day,

Bill Finger said he moved Batman from NYC to Gotham so that everyone could identify with it, not just New Yorkers (i.e. so they could sell Detective to Red Sox fans too).


That makes sense to me.
 
2013-08-17 05:13:31 PM  

James!: White, wealthy, elite NYC?


I believe it was Will Smith in MIB who said it was "just raining black people in New York."
 
2013-08-17 05:23:49 PM  

Thrabalen: It's mostly Marvel heroes that call Manhattan home.  And that's because that's where Marvel's offices are.  Write what you know.


And turn out the lights so that only Matt Murdoch can read the rest of this thread
 
2013-08-17 05:23:53 PM  

ZeroCorpse: As for the creators' intentions, Metropolis is based on New York City during the day


Actually Metropolis was originally based on Toronto, the birthplace of the creator
 
2013-08-17 05:25:50 PM  
Superheros should spend more time in rural areas enforcing parking and cruising ordinances.

While there, maybe they could address teen pregnancy also.
 
2013-08-17 05:33:17 PM  
"Along with these broader social shifts, American superhero comics were looking for new audiences - audiences outside of the metropolitan East Coast that had dominated readership for so long and provided the industry with a reliable sales base. While DC attempted to appeal to the working-class kids and adults left behind in the emerging Rust Belt, Marvel attempted to participate in the new economy of the American West and to explore the tropes that the West provided."
News to me.
 
2013-08-17 05:35:50 PM  
Maybe because most comic book villains are white, wealthy elites who live in New York City?
 
2013-08-17 05:41:02 PM  
Serial Actually Metropolis was originally based on Toronto, the birthplace of the creator

if yer goin' Full Fanboy Metropolis is a mix of GTA & Cleveland, the creators hometown(s)
http://thegldc.com/blog/archives/tag/siegel-shuster-society
Failmitter left out Fawcett City, where talking tigers walk upright wearing loud suits
bmj2k.files.wordpress.comView Full Size
 
2013-08-17 05:46:22 PM  

RexTalionis: Incidentally, X-Men are currently based out of San Francisco, it seems. So, really, what you have is a writer for Salon who has no idea what they're talking about and bases everything they know about comics from the Marvel movies and a quick Wikipedia search.


Actually, they aren't anymore and the article writer factually pointed out it was during the Utopia era. But hey, whatever makes you feel superior. Seems to me you're the one who needs to stop doing a quick Wikipedia search and read the comics ;)
 
2013-08-17 05:49:37 PM  
Whatever. LOOK AT ALL THEM TITTIESSSSSSSSSSS!
 
2013-08-17 06:00:11 PM  

FloydA: [i105.photobucket.com image 331x500]

(Yes, he goes to NY, the southeast, France, etc. but he brings the west with him.)


Re-reading that series right now.


FloydA: ZeroCorpse:
[i105.photobucket.com image 398x640]
FTFY


Been wondering about this: that map has Lake Erie and Lake Ontario, right? So why are some lakes named "Lake *Something*" and others named "*Something* Lake"? Like Crater Lake, Crystal Lake, Blue Lake, etc.
 
2013-08-17 06:00:31 PM  

RexTalionis: Some West Coast superheroes:

[images1.wikia.nocookie.net image 576x324]
Green Lantern, Speedy and the other members of the Green Lantern affiliated heroes operate out of Star City, California.

[2.bp.blogspot.com image 600x906]
Black Canary operated out of Star City and Seattle.


[static.comicvine.com image 600x886]
Green Lantern Hal Jordan was the protector of Coast City, Calfornia.

[wtfdccomics.files.wordpress.com image 400x625]
The Teen Titans operated out of San Francisco, California.

[upload.wikimedia.org image 250x377]
Wonder Woman and Wonder Girl operated out of Gateway City, California.

[images3.wikia.nocookie.net image 850x862]
Mr. Terrific operated out of Gateway City, California.

[reilly2040.co.uk image 593x900]
Oracle, Huntress and Lady Blackhawk used to operate out of Platinum Flats, California.

[upload.wikimedia.org image 247x390]
Zatana operates out of San Francisco.


Nerd
 
2013-08-17 06:04:35 PM  
Is this the part where I'm supposed to be outraged there is no Black Panther or Wonder Woman movie yet? You wanna know why most super heroes are white males?

Because the vast majority of comic book readers are white males. When more African Americans and women start buying comics you'll see more titles that appeal to them. Yeah yeah blah blah blah my buddy, blah blah my ex whatever. Comics publishers create works for their target audience plain and simple. Its a business same as any other and wasting resources on a demographic group that has proven time and again that aren't going to buy your product isn't prejudiced or discriminatory its just common sense.
 
2013-08-17 06:12:33 PM  
Looks like someone's deadline was coming up quicker than he thought.
 
2013-08-17 06:13:18 PM  

ScaryBottles: Is this the part where I'm supposed to be outraged there is no Black Panther or Wonder Woman movie yet? You wanna know why most super heroes are white males?

Because the vast majority of comic book readers are white males. When more African Americans and women start buying comics you'll see more titles that appeal to them. Yeah yeah blah blah blah my buddy, blah blah my ex whatever. Comics publishers create works for their target audience plain and simple. Its a business same as any other and wasting resources on a demographic group that has proven time and again that aren't going to buy your product isn't prejudiced or discriminatory its just common sense.


This series was pretty successful:

images2.wikia.nocookie.netView Full Size
 
2013-08-17 06:15:43 PM  

ScaryBottles: Is this the part


marvunapp.comView Full Size


Big fan?
 
2013-08-17 06:15:56 PM  
Just wait till Will Smith buys the rights to Static Shock so Jaden can star in another movie.
 
2013-08-17 06:18:44 PM  

spcMike: Just wait till Will Smith buys the rights to Static Shock so Jaden can star in another movie.


Thought it wasn't based off of a comic book, Hancock was a pretty dang good super hero movie, I don't know why it flopped.
 
2013-08-17 06:32:11 PM  
Because superheros eat bagels and pizza, not tomato salads and fish tacos.
 
2013-08-17 06:33:00 PM  

TuteTibiImperes: Thought it wasn't based off of a comic book, Hancock was a pretty dang good super hero movie, I don't know why it flopped.



No, it wasn't. It sucked balls and it flopped because it sucked at everything. Yes, bad movies succeed all the time (cough*transformers*cough), but that's cause they're good at marketing/hype. Hancock was just shiat all around.
 
2013-08-17 06:34:44 PM  

TuteTibiImperes: spcMike: Just wait till Will Smith buys the rights to Static Shock so Jaden can star in another movie.

Thought it wasn't based off of a comic book, Hancock was a pretty dang good super hero movie, I don't know why it flopped.


...the reason why it flopped was because it was only half a pretty dang good superhero movie.
 
2013-08-17 06:38:32 PM  

TuteTibiImperes: spcMike: Just wait till Will Smith buys the rights to Static Shock so Jaden can star in another movie.

Thought it wasn't based off of a comic book, Hancock was a pretty dang good super hero movie, I don't know why it flopped.


Because It Sucked After Charlize Showed She Had Powers.
 
2013-08-17 06:43:41 PM  
Really, do you think South Central L.A. and all of its gangs rate on a superheroes' radar? All that crime is generations old and can't be soled by simply throwing superheroes at it.

Maybe Ra's al Ghul should be allowed to eliminate all the gangs of the West Coast.
 
2013-08-17 06:44:35 PM  
This isn't that head-scratching a mystery, you know.

Both comic book companies,  Marvel and DC, were based in NYC for many decades, and many of their writers and artists lived there.  The creators just drew upon the city they knew best for their work, whether they called it by its real name or something else.

The writers that followed them built on that basis, because continuity and all that.  They usually introduced new characters via team-up or conflict with an established character, and that meant having them in NYC for one reason or another.  Things just snow-balled decade after decade until NYC became the capital of all superherodom by default.
 
2013-08-17 06:48:25 PM  

ZeroCorpse: alaric3: Metropolis is not Pseudo-New York it is Psedo-Chicago.
Kansas boy didn't go too far from home.

BZZT. Wrong.

Metropolis is in DELAWARE. Gotham City is in NEW JERSEY.

This is backed up by many modern DC comics, as well as Marvel/DC crossovers which establish that Metropolis, Delaware is non-existent on Marvel 616 Earth. It's just a big open field.

As for the creators' intentions, Metropolis is based on New York City during the day, and Gotham City is based on New York City (especially the seedy parts) at night. But that's OLD thinking.

In DC, NYC is NYC, and Metropolis is pretty far south of it.


Actually, gotta disagree. During the No Man's Land arc, the maps shown for Gotham were basically Manhatten Island.

New York itself has the nickname Gotham.
 
2013-08-17 06:49:52 PM  

TuteTibiImperes: ScaryBottles: Is this the part where I'm supposed to be outraged there is no Black Panther or Wonder Woman movie yet? You wanna know why most super heroes are white males?

Because the vast majority of comic book readers are white males. When more African Americans and women start buying comics you'll see more titles that appeal to them. Yeah yeah blah blah blah my buddy, blah blah my ex whatever. Comics publishers create works for their target audience plain and simple. Its a business same as any other and wasting resources on a demographic group that has proven time and again that aren't going to buy your product isn't prejudiced or discriminatory its just common sense.

This series was pretty successful:

[images2.wikia.nocookie.net image 518x781]


That was a movie not a comic your point doesn't actually address any of my statements. Not for nothing and I can't speak for everyone mind you, but I as a white male have never picked up a comic or saw a movie because the protagonist was white. Also I'm not suggesting that those movies shouldn't be made, in fact I still can't fathom why there isn't a Luke Cage movie. Its not that Cage necessarily appeals to a broader audience. That movie due to the particulars of the character and themes of the comic production cost especially compared to the giant piles of money tossed at directors these days, would be practically nothing almost guaranteeing a positive return. Also for your logic to be valid it would have to be a case of only African Americans going to see the Blade movies so actually your point is double retarded. My point was that comics which make exponentially less and it seems like less and less every day don't have the luxury of spreading themselves as thin as the movie industry can so they have to focus efforts where they will get them the most earnings. They can't pull a Man of Steel and make back 2/3 of their investment before the comic is even released. I'm not saying that minorities are not underrepresented in comics I just think dicknose blogger is way off base when he makes the implication that this is a result of wanting to disenfranchise minorities on the part of the comics companies.

Also I'm sure this guy totally has his finger on the pulse of African American pop culture.

wcms-prod-web-1.ucsc.eduView Full Size
 
2013-08-17 06:51:55 PM  

LucklessWonder: TuteTibiImperes: spcMike: Just wait till Will Smith buys the rights to Static Shock so Jaden can star in another movie.

Thought it wasn't based off of a comic book, Hancock was a pretty dang good super hero movie, I don't know why it flopped.

Because It Sucked After Charlize Showed She Had Powers.


I thought that twist made it cooler.
 
2013-08-17 06:54:31 PM  

ScaryBottles: TuteTibiImperes: ScaryBottles: Is this the part where I'm supposed to be outraged there is no Black Panther or Wonder Woman movie yet? You wanna know why most super heroes are white males?

Because the vast majority of comic book readers are white males. When more African Americans and women start buying comics you'll see more titles that appeal to them. Yeah yeah blah blah blah my buddy, blah blah my ex whatever. Comics publishers create works for their target audience plain and simple. Its a business same as any other and wasting resources on a demographic group that has proven time and again that aren't going to buy your product isn't prejudiced or discriminatory its just common sense.

This series was pretty successful:

[images2.wikia.nocookie.net image 518x781]

That was a movie not a comic your point doesn't actually address any of my statements. Not for nothing and I can't speak for everyone mind you, but I as a white male have never picked up a comic or saw a movie because the protagonist was white. Also I'm not suggesting that those movies shouldn't be made, in fact I still can't fathom why there isn't a Luke Cage movie. Its not that Cage necessarily appeals to a broader audience. That movie due to the particulars of the character and themes of the comic production cost especially compared to the giant piles of money tossed at directors these days, would be practically nothing almost guaranteeing a positive return. Also for your logic to be valid it would have to be a case of only African Americans going to see the Blade movies so actually your point is double retarded. My point was that comics which make exponentially less and it seems like less and less every day don't have the luxury of spreading themselves as thin as the movie industry can so they have to focus efforts where they will get them the most earnings. They can't pull a Man of Steel and make back 2/3 of their investment before the comic is even released. I'm not saying that minorities are not ...



Blade was a comic before it was a movie. The fact that it had mass appeal shows that movies based on black comic characters can work. That's all I was saying.
 
2013-08-17 06:54:45 PM  

MrEricSir: Because superheros eat bagels and pizza, not tomato salads and fish tacos.


i105.photobucket.comView Full Size

Disagrees
 
2013-08-17 06:55:23 PM  

TuteTibiImperes: ScaryBottles: Is this the part where I'm supposed to be outraged there is no Black Panther or Wonder Woman movie yet? You wanna know why most super heroes are white males?

Because the vast majority of comic book readers are white males. When more African Americans and women start buying comics you'll see more titles that appeal to them. Yeah yeah blah blah blah my buddy, blah blah my ex whatever. Comics publishers create works for their target audience plain and simple. Its a business same as any other and wasting resources on a demographic group that has proven time and again that aren't going to buy your product isn't prejudiced or discriminatory its just common sense.

This series was pretty successful:

[images2.wikia.nocooki? e.net image 518x781]


He just got out of prison a few months ago....
 
2013-08-17 07:08:01 PM  
In regard to the 'why are so many superheroes white' question that a few people have touched on,
one problem comic artists find with black characters is that it's nearly impossible to keep people happy.
If you draw a guy just the same way you'd draw a white guy and just color him to have dark skin, that's offensive (and they tend to look more Middle Eastern).  If you use the common artistic method of defining someone by using stereotypes of the group (black people: wide nose, big lips, etc), then you're being racist. (unless the artist is black)

Also, prior to modern coloring techniques artists often used 'cross-hatching' to create shadowing.  It could be difficult to shade the darker skinned characters effectively.
 
2013-08-17 07:15:50 PM  
Maybe subby, because the majority of comic creators are white and live in primarily white neighborhoods?
 
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