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(Yahoo)   New Mexico removes the word "forcible" from state regulation mentioning rape after people question the legitimacy of the term   ( divider line
    More: Followup, A New Mexico, idea  
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3097 clicks; posted to Main » on 02 Oct 2012 at 5:05 AM (5 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»

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2012-10-02 05:37:14 AM  
4 votes:
Ugh. Why do some people seem to want to insist on using words to defy reality? There's a reason we have terms like "forcible rape", and it's to differentiate them from the other types. Of which, yes, there are some. Statutory rape, for example. There could be no force involved there, both parties could be consenting, one party just lacks (under the law) the ability to give consent. Or, as another example, date rape, where one party might be intoxicated or drugged. Again, no force required because the other party isn't in a position to resist.

"Rape is rape" is fine if you are talking about it casually, but from a legal perspective, well, sorry, that's not really accurate.
2012-10-02 05:07:08 AM  
2 votes:
I would assume that they used the term 'forcible' to distinguish actual rapes from morning after regret rapes.

It's amazing to see how neighboring states New Mexico and Arizona are so close in proximity yet so different in culture.
2012-10-02 03:24:55 AM  
2 votes:
"Forcible rape" makes about as much sense as "deadly murder." It always involves force, even if not violence.
2012-10-02 12:42:34 PM  
1 vote:

Rogue Surf: r1niceboy: Rogue Surf: r1niceboy: AverageAmericanGuy: I would assume that they used the term 'forcible' to distinguish actual rapes from morning after regret rapes.

It's amazing to see how neighboring states New Mexico and Arizona are so close in proximity yet so different in culture.

If Susana Martinez had her way, they'd be very similar. She's trying to get as much food from the right-wing buffet onto her plate, but much of it is falling off.

THIS! Our Tea-Bag leaning Governor Susana wanted to get rid of our Medical Cannabis Laws, and her Political Advisors are all asses, Her Chief of Staff - (a Mormon) was recorded calling a State Senator a Mutha-Farker and Cawk-Sucker and they are trying to influence major state elections so they can ram further crap down our throats! Our last "good" Governor was Gary Johnson!

She's also on a tear after the state employee unions as well. It looks like employees are deliberately being targeted if they don't bend over and ask 'please sir, may I have another.' One of her lackeys put in writing that labor laws don't apply to state employees.

Yes, and my brother - who has accomplshed more for bringing industry to the state than about anyone around is blacklisted as he "helped" the Legislature kill many of her introduced bills! The Medical Cannabis legislation repeal died a quick death - mostly at the hands of Vets (PTSD) who packed the committees in opposition!
/I'm a Dem who used to work for the Gary Johnson Adminstration, don't see much cross-party cooperation anymore since the R's went off the deep end!

My wife's a AFSCME steward, who, along with every other union rep, is having to fight a string of petty disciplinary actions. My favorite was the employee relations board demanding to see personal medical records when my wife used one of the vast number of sick days she had accrued.

I'm pretty sure memos are being sent down threatening the jobs of mid-level state management that don't persecute their underlings so they can replace them with cheap, entry-level replacements who can be cowed more easily. It's pretty scummy, but part of a national trend.
2012-10-02 11:43:38 AM  
1 vote:
Forcible rape is a label used by the FBI UCR (Uniform Crime Reports) to group together rape crimes from various sources.

From the UCR definition:

Forcible rape, as defined in the FBI's Uniform Crime Reporting (UCR) Program, is the carnal knowledge of a female forcibly and against her will. Attempts or assaults to commit rape by force or threat of force are also included; however, statutory rape (without force) and other sex offenses are excluded.

There's supposedly an updated definition out there from the DOJ that removes the requirement for the victim to be female, and allows for anal or oral contact to be considered rape, but none of the FBI documentation reflects it that I can find.

Should laws be defining forcible rape? Only if there is also a category for non-forcible. But the label itself does have a real legitimate source at the FBI and DOJ.
2012-10-02 11:07:48 AM  
1 vote:

Theaetetus: You're calling them morons for saying that should be illegal?

No. I'm saying that they are morons for latching onto this non-issue and changing the law in their state solely for political purposes. There is forceable and non-forceable rape and they must have statues to cover both. Should a man who has sex with a willing girl, who has not reached the age of consent, be subject to the same accusation/penalties as a man who beats a woman senseless and sexually brutalizes her? Of course not.

But this is an election year and so they must posture and, by doing so, waste the taxpayers' money. Next year the legislature will quietly repeal this, since legally it is untenable.
2012-10-02 08:52:06 AM  
1 vote:
came for the rape-rape. Left happy.

i.ytimg.comView Full Size

Seriously. She said that on national TV.
2012-10-02 08:10:07 AM  
1 vote:

Boojum2k: "Forcible rape" makes about as much sense as "deadly murder." It always involves force, even if not violence.

and murder is murder yet we have different legal classifications.
2012-10-02 05:49:47 AM  
1 vote:
His sexual life, for example, was entirely regulated by the two Newspeak words sexcrime (sexual immorality) and goodsex (chastity). Sexcrime covered all sexual misdeeds whatever. It covered fornication, adultery, homosexuality, and other perversions, and, in addition, normal intercourse practised for its own sake. There was no need to enumerate them separately, since they were all equally culpable, and, in principle, all punishable by death. In the C vocabulary, which consisted of scientific and technical words, it might be necessary to give specialized names to certain sexual aberrations, but the ordinary citizen had no need of them. He knew what was meant by goodsex - that is to say, normal intercourse between man and wife, for the sole purpose of begetting children, and without physical pleasure on the part of the woman: all else was sexcrime. In Newspeak it was seldom possible to follow a heretical thought further than the perception that it was heretical: beyond that point the necessary words were nonexistent.
2012-10-02 05:37:49 AM  
1 vote:
Why, yes, there may be a difference between the guy who kidnapped a woman and did horrible things to her, and a guy who committed "rape" because he's a year or two older than his minor girlfriend.
2012-10-02 05:36:10 AM  
1 vote:

Public Savant: So what is the opposite of forcible rape, since we're all mincing words, now?

The kind where she was clearly asking for it due to the way she dressed or acted.

/This is what the religious right actually believes
2012-10-02 05:12:57 AM  
1 vote:

Boojum2k: "Forcible rape" makes about as much sense as "deadly murder." It always involves force, even if not violence.

Many if not most states don't actually just have a law against "rape". Rape is just a catchall term for a certain category of sex crimes including sexual assault, sexual battery, sodomy by threat of force, quid pro quo sexual harassment, sexual exploitation of a minor, intentional infection of a sexual partner with a venerial disease and certain cases of fraud.

So that ranges from "always a felony and up there in the classification system with murder and arson" through "misdemeanor" and into "civil infraction with a fine".

I assume "forcible" rape is intended to be some subset of that, probably the assault/battery end of the scale and excluding statutory rape and rape by fraud. Albeit trying to qualify it in terms of allocating state assistance is stupid whether there's a legitimate subcategory or not, so kinda moot.
2012-10-02 02:54:01 AM  
1 vote:
Now that is how one should shut things down.
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