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(Sun Sentinel)   Comic book stores are locked in a battle to survive and it is the Worst. Fight. Ever.   (sun-sentinel.com) divider line
    More: Florida  
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17981 clicks; posted to Main » and Fandom » on 09 Apr 2011 at 12:19 AM (10 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



168 Comments     (+0 »)
 
2011-04-08 10:26:36 PM  
They're doomed.

The recession has made comic sales drop hard. See, loss of money and fear of if they're going to have a paycheck each week has made people start to look at what they're buying, and they have realized that most all of the mainstream superhero comics that dominate the market are complete and utter shiat. It's all a bunch of pointless crossovers and fanboys turned pros jerking off onto a page, shiatting on the page, then wiping their ass with it and shiatting on it again and calling it the best story ever when in reality the books are lamer and worse than the average fanfic. And the shiat the big two have done to their characters and books has nearly killed comics.

All they want to do is try to capture the largest segment of the rapidly shrinking 20-40 loser fanboy demographic. They don't try to bring in new fans that could keep things going longer, they only want to say "WE'RE NUMBER ONE!", when being number one means selling a tenth of what comics were selling 20 years ago. And driving themselves into the direct market comic shop ghetto while pricing their books out of the price range of any normal person, and abandoning newsstand distribution has just helped drive the stake even further into the heart of the comics industry.

Oh, sure, comics will survive in some form... original graphic novels, online publishing, and the indies might keep going on with monthly books. But within the next 10 years or so, DC and Marvel will probably just be the people you license Batman and Spider-Man from.

And they deserve it.
 
2011-04-08 10:36:07 PM  
No shiat, I went to the local comic book shop for the first time in months a few weeks ago, how those places continue to stay in business is a mystery to me. A 12-15 page comic now costs anywhere from $3.99 to $5.99, as much as a full length paperback or magazine, but with only enough actual text to fill a paragraph.

The store was also full of old trade paperbacks priced at MSRP, which ends up being anywhere from 20% to 80% more expensive than the prices on Amazon, new or used. Back issues no matter how recent or crappy started at no less than $5, and the silver or golden age stuff on the walls was priced WAAAAAY above their actual value, even CCG graded value. Stuff like the 60's era Silver Surfer comics were anywhere from $60 - $100 an issue, when in reality just about every issue in that series with worth less than $20 each. It's nice to be able to say you'd rather support local businesses instead of mega corporations like Amazon.com, but in this economy, money talks and bullshiat walks.

From what I hear from people I know in that business, the only thing keeping most comic book shops open anymore is the TCG business, which remains lucrative enough to keep the ship afloat. Once the market for that bottoms out however, indy comic shops are going to go the way of mom and pop video stores.

Part of the problem is with the publishers, Marvel in particular seems to like to dictate that all storylines be concise enough to fit in a Trade, which is where the real money is, or convoluted and overlapping so people are forced to buy EVERYTHING if they want to keep track of the story. Why an X-Men story arc needs to cross over into issues of Punisher, Captain America, and Thor, I will never know, but they do that crap all the time.

You'd think that the huge popularity of the comic book based movies would have breathed life into the industry, but that largely hasn't been the case. The only thing that seems to be gaining any sort of popularity is the Manga industry, but given the nature of that business being at the mercy of publishers in Japan that often aren't interested in playing nice with international distributors, even that hasn't seen too much growth either.
 
2011-04-08 10:54:37 PM  
Just look at what's happened to record, video and book stores. It'd be foolish to think the wave would miss the local comic book shop.

Egon was right... print is dead.
 
2011-04-08 11:03:09 PM  

spman: A 12-15 page comic now costs anywhere from $3.99 to $5.99, as much as a full length paperback or magazine, but with only enough actual text to fill a paragraph.


This is what always boggled my mind. I mean, Japanese comics are a few bucks a pop for either (1) a 200+ page ish collection of a few months of content, OR (2) a weekly phone book sized thing that has the equivalent of 20+ strips EACH running their 12-15 page installment in it.

And I thought THAT was expensive. (Particularly if you want to consume it from half a world away in the US it IS expensive - read real books they're a better time value for the money.)

But the US stuff is just crazy.

Plus the US stuff seems very much aware of the collector market so stuff is pricey from the outset. Rather than just normal readers buying those cheap non-collectible phone book size weekly serials and giving them up for the paper collection man when they're done.

I'll admit I largely quit reading comics because the amount you get is so small, you can read a book in 20 minutes. But now I've found places to illegally download comics to my phone, I find I might want to actually get the paper collection versions OF the ones I actually liked (from amazon.jp, yeah it ain't cheap) but I would never do it if I couldn't already read volume 1 of a bunch of stuff to decide what I want to maybe buy first.

So, not quite on topic but maybe if publishers freely allowed "piracy" of issue #1 of everything they'd get more sales from people like me.
 
2011-04-08 11:38:14 PM  

itazurakko:
I'll admit I largely quit reading comics because the amount you get is so small, you can read a book in 20 minutes.


American comics are between $2.99 and $4.99 for 22 pages of story, which usually takes less than five minutes to read. Oh, and each individual issue is usually one part of a six part story arc, which means that 1/6th of a story costs somewhere around 4 bucks, and the entire story takes over half a year to be complete.

Also, DC and Marvel don't want to put their new books online. And when they do, it's usually weeks after the book is released, and the same price to download the book as it is to buy a physical copy.

DC and Marvel can't even get digital comics right.

OTOH, Archie Comics has same day and date new issues (meaning they're offered online the same day they're available in comic shops), and the books are priced at $1.99 instead of the $2.99 you'd pay for a physical copy.

Archie knows what they're doing. DC and Marvel? They know how to lose customers.
 
2011-04-09 12:24:09 AM  

FirstNationalBastard: They're doomed.

The recession has made comic sales drop hard. See, loss of money and fear of if they're going to have a paycheck each week has made people start to look at what they're buying, and they have realized that most all of the mainstream superhero comics that dominate the market are complete and utter shiat. It's all a bunch of pointless crossovers and fanboys turned pros jerking off onto a page, shiatting on the page, then wiping their ass with it and shiatting on it again and calling it the best story ever when in reality the books are lamer and worse than the average fanfic. And the shiat the big two have done to their characters and books has nearly killed comics.

All they want to do is try to capture the largest segment of the rapidly shrinking 20-40 loser fanboy demographic. They don't try to bring in new fans that could keep things going longer, they only want to say "WE'RE NUMBER ONE!", when being number one means selling a tenth of what comics were selling 20 years ago. And driving themselves into the direct market comic shop ghetto while pricing their books out of the price range of any normal person, and abandoning newsstand distribution has just helped drive the stake even further into the heart of the comics industry.

Oh, sure, comics will survive in some form... original graphic novels, online publishing, and the indies might keep going on with monthly books. But within the next 10 years or so, DC and Marvel will probably just be the people you license Batman and Spider-Man from.

And they deserve it.


Change a couple of words and you can pretty much say the same things about the trading card industry. God bless the suits.
 
2011-04-09 12:25:01 AM  
i979.photobucket.com
 
2011-04-09 12:25:15 AM  
More importantly, who can run faster, Flash or Superman?
 
2011-04-09 12:39:30 AM  
When the choice is between buying a trade paperback in a comic book shop for 35$, or online for 11$, it's no wonder they're going out of business.

//Hell, EVERYTHING is cheaper online.
///And they don't charge "the Canadian price", either.
////fark greedy, stupid local business owners.
 
2011-04-09 12:41:07 AM  
wish the league of super-heroes would put in an appearance, shake the villains from our governing & corporate structure while implementing change for a better tomorrow with plenty of comic book money to go around for all.
 
2011-04-09 12:42:18 AM  

ModernLuddite: When the choice is between buying a trade paperback in a comic book shop for 35$, or online for 11$, it's no wonder they're going out of business.

//Hell, EVERYTHING is cheaper online.
///And they don't charge "the Canadian price", either.
////fark greedy, stupid local business owners.


my local charges the us price in Canadian dollars.
/but his shop is awesome
 
2011-04-09 12:43:20 AM  
autographs from William Shatner of the TV series "Star Trek" and Stan Lee, the creator of Marvel Comics.

was it really necessary to explain who those guys are in an article about comic books?
 
2011-04-09 12:47:07 AM  
I recently bought on Ebay around 200 older comics - 3 lots of *complete runs*
for around 80 cents a comic.
These were all $1.25-$2.50 cover price.
So I'm getting a real kick out of these replies.
 
2011-04-09 12:53:39 AM  

missmarsha: More importantly, who can run faster, Flash or Superman?


+1
 
2011-04-09 1:00:16 AM  
Like many other industries, the comics industry got greedy in the short term and have killed themselves for the long term. My story is no different than anybody else, but when I was a kid, I could get 5-10 comics off the spinning rack at the grocery store check out line (or the drug store, or 7 eleven) for $5 and everyone was happy. I was happy. My mother was happy (I was reading!). The industry was making money.

Then, right around when the Watchmen took off and Batman (Tim Burton) made a mint at the theaters (1989ish) the industry got into the notion of "We've got product people want. We can double and triple prices and people will pay. So we will." Speculators (same thing happened with baseball cards) were willing to pay almost anything (especially if it had a foil cover or a #1 stamped on it) thinking they were making a fool-proof investment for the future. So Marvel/DC raised prices even higher.

But they didn't realize they were pricing out little kids. And without the recurring nature of the industry (Little boy holds comics in hand, reads, loves them, grows up, buys comics for his son, wash, rinse, repeat), they were losing a large portion of their customer base every year. It has now caught up to them. Sure, kids will watch an Iron Man movie - but they aren't interested in reading a comic (and their mom isn't going to pay $3.99 so he can). And dad's not buying it for him because dad didn't read them when he was little - they cost too much and there is no loyalty to the medium built up. It doesn't help, either, that kids want stuff on their iPads, phones, computers, etc and both DC and Marvel suck at producing this product (mostly likely worried about piracy - when it's all available anyway thanks to scanners).

Anyways, these stores are doomed. There is no customer base and there really hasn't been one for over a decade. Short of either Marvel or DC deciding to drop their cover prices down to $1 on all titles (and work on volume), there's no way the industry can survive.
 
2011-04-09 1:05:00 AM  

missmarsha: More importantly, who can run faster, Flash or Superman?


Superman is lame because he can do anything. Also, Wonder Woman has never done anything cool.
 
2011-04-09 1:06:03 AM  
Can't remember when the last time was that I bought an American comic book. It was probably in the mid 80's in a mall comic shop and even then they were starting to get pricey and shifting away from the mainstream.

Trouble is, back in their heyday, the comics lived in places normal people shopped. They saw the comics while out shopping for the normal day-to-day stuff and picked them up in addition to what they were purchasing. They were at the news stands, 5 & 10 stores, at lunch counters, etc. Now it's mostly a special trip to a place that sells only (or mostly) comics. With such crappy penetration they SHOULD expect sales to suck balls.

And as stated in the first two posts, much of the comics involve DC and Marvel characters circle-jerking each other at $5 or more a pop. They aren't worth it and the public at large agrees and refuses to pay.

The last comic I bought was this:
i4.photobucket.comView Full Size


Funny as shiat. DC and Marvel need to take notice.

/i'm a cicada
//zweee... zweee...
 
2011-04-09 1:08:54 AM  
Curious:
autographs from William Shatner of the TV series "Star Trek" and Stan Lee, the creator of Marvel Comics.

was it really necessary to explain who those guys are in an article about comic books?


The Stan Lee part is also kinda wrong. he was A creator, not THE creator. Jack Kirby had way more to do with the company's success during its early run. I know when i was young, before I really "read" comics and just liked to look at the art, his style was distinctive enough that if I saw his art on a cover, I'd buy the comic, because he was THE good artist. I'm sure I'm not alone.

Comics were 15 cents when i first started buying. That was the same price as three candy bars. Now you can still get three candy cars for $1-$2, maybe slightly more if you shop at pricey convenience stores, and one thinner comic is way more.

Comic publishers (book publishers too, really) should be pushing for hemp legalization, because hemp makes cheaper paper, and they could lower prices and attract more readers perhaps, or at least get better margins without raising prices.

They should push for legal marijuana too, because comics are way better when you're high.
 
2011-04-09 1:11:05 AM  
I thought Flash can run faster than Superman, but Superman can fly faster than Flash can run.. and Wonderwoman can fly, deflect bullets with her bracelets, has the lasso of truth, and has a stealth plane (never figured that one out if she can fly anyway). I haven't read comics in 30 years though so not sure if those all follow the comic story lines.. just going off the videos/cartoons which I still watch any time I can.
 
2011-04-09 1:15:44 AM  
My nine year old bought a reboot of "Silver Surfer" today, but usually he reads manga...preferring stuff like Naruto and particularly One Piece.
 
2011-04-09 1:17:54 AM  
SunsetLament:
Like many other industries, the comics industry got greedy in the short term and have killed themselves for the long term. My story is no different than anybody else, but when I was a kid, I could get 5-10 comics off the spinning rack at the grocery store check out line (or the drug store, or 7 eleven) for $5 and everyone was happy. I was happy. My mother was happy (I was reading!). The industry was making money.

Then, right around when the Watchmen took off and Batman (Tim Burton) made a mint at the theaters (1989ish) the industry got into the notion of "We've got product people want. We can double and triple prices and people will pay. So we will." Speculators (same thing happened with baseball cards) were willing to pay almost anything (especially if it had a foil cover or a #1 stamped on it) thinking they were making a fool-proof investment for the future. So Marvel/DC raised prices even higher.

But they didn't realize they were pricing out little kids. And without the recurring nature of the industry (Little boy holds comics in hand, reads, loves them, grows up, buys comics for his son, wash, rinse, repeat), they were losing a large portion of their customer base every year. It has now caught up to them. Sure, kids will watch an Iron Man movie - but they aren't interested in reading a comic (and their mom isn't going to pay $3.99 so he can). And dad's not buying it for him because dad didn't read them when he was little - they cost too much and there is no loyalty to the medium built up. It doesn't help, either, that kids want stuff on their iPads, phones, computers, etc and both DC and Marvel suck at producing this product (mostly likely worried about piracy - when it's all available anyway thanks to scanners).

Anyways, these stores are doomed. There is no customer base and there really hasn't been one for over a decade. Short of either Marvel or DC deciding to drop their cover prices down to $1 on all titles (and work on volume), there's no way the industry can survive.


Excellent points all. Add in that the stories are so convoluted and there's such an extensive history that no kid can ever really hope to collect every issue of a favorite title.

Marvel would be wise to make CHEAP reprints of a lot of their legacy titles. They effectively have moved into the "collectibles" market rather than trying to actually be an entertainment medium, forgetting that what made comics popular in the first place was they were cheap fun. Now they aren't cheap, and it's not really much fin reading a 28-part "story" by a dozen+ writers that doesn't really hang together and make a coherent story anyway. If a kid gets suckered into ONE storyline like that, he quickly realizes he's spent enough money to ride a bike for an hour or twos' worth of confusion when he could have bought a new game (or two) for his Playstation, or a new skateboard, or something that will provide many hours of of recreation. They might fool a kid once with that stuff, but not twice.

And as collector's items, they killed that market with gimmicks and overprinting in the '90s. No one believes any new comics are likely to have any value on the secondary market, and only a small handful in the past decade or so have even really maintained their cover price value (Walking Dead, for example).
 
2011-04-09 1:18:20 AM  
Comic book shops around where I live don't really make their money off selling comics anymore. Some do, but they never really lasted long.

I don't play anymore but comic book shops are the hub of CCGs like magic and pokemon (for a while) and whatever is out now. They make money off tournament entries, booster packs for drafts, food and drink sales to people who are there (big margins!), miscellaneous geek hobbies and the occasional video game. I was good buddies with the guy who owned the local magic hangout, I think he paid his rent by selling Magic cards on ebay. Also generic gaming for some of the bigger shops like warhammer and even board games. I've seen some do internet cafe style stuff in the past but that's pretty much kaput now that everyone can just bring an ipad or droid or netbook.

Never understood the appeal of going to the comic shop, plunking your ass down and playing everquest for 3 hours (wow more recently I guess). Okay, way to go try and be social then isolate yourself anyway. I have seen people do it and it just boggles the mind.
 
2011-04-09 1:19:30 AM  

Ace25: .. and Wonderwoman can fly, deflect bullets with her bracelets, has the lasso of truth, and has a stealth plane (never figured that one out if she can fly anyway).


She's explained that. Diana the ambassador takes lots of trips, and she needs the plane for her luggage.
 
2011-04-09 1:19:31 AM  
One of the problems with comics is they all became farking insane. How many Robins have their been? 5? 8? 20? And if the X-men history makes any sense to you anymore, you're a smarter man than I. They're up to what now? 3 Jeans?
 
2011-04-09 1:26:30 AM  
As someone who frequently thinks outside of the box, I have a hair-brained idea:

Print and sell local comics from local artists in store below the cost of mainstream commercial ones. (You can even use local advertisers.) The quality doesn't have to be that great, and if someone comes in with a great idea that sells like mad you pimp it to Marvel or DC. One of them buys the rights to future releases, throws a big name artist at the project with the guy who created the concept and it turns those small distribution "rags" into super rare collectibles.

-----------------------------------------------------------

The Flash "can be" faster than Superman, but it will make him one with speed itself, dissembling his particulate matter.
 
2011-04-09 1:28:11 AM  
Don't forget, 'DC is Holding the Line at $2.99!1' for 32 pages stuffed with 12 pages of ads while I can buy 240 pages of manga for $6.99 and without all your bullshiat retconning and shocking revelations and crossovers once a year like clockwork. Marvel I completely gave up on with the Spiderman Clone Saga.
 
2011-04-09 1:29:38 AM  

DigitalCoffee: Can't remember when the last time was that I bought an American comic book....
The last comic I bought was this:

i4.photobucket.comView Full Size


Funny as shiat. DC and Marvel need to take notice.


I wouldn't touch any manga sh•t even if it came with a $5 bill folded in the middle.

I'll stick with the Marvel and DC stuff, thanks.
 
2011-04-09 1:32:13 AM  

oldtaku: Don't forget, 'DC is Holding the Line at $2.99!1' for 32 pages stuffed with 12 pages of ads while I can buy 240 pages of manga for $6.99 and without all your bullshiat retconning and shocking revelations and crossovers once a year like clockwork. Marvel I completely gave up on with the Spiderman Clone Saga.



And once again, I say that manga is homogenous and trite, and only worthy of being used to mop up dog piss.
 
2011-04-09 1:32:57 AM  

missmarsha: More importantly, who can run faster, Flash or Superman?


Super Grover

images3.wikia.nocookie.netView Full Size
 
2011-04-09 1:33:03 AM  
Comics changed for the worse when collecting became the main focus. Back before comics had any value, telling a good story and having good art were the two keys to success. Now, it's pushing a brand and increasing the "collectability" with multiple covers/other useless bullshiat.
 
2011-04-09 1:40:57 AM  

Incontinent_dog_and_monkey_rodeo: Comics changed for the worse when collecting became the main focus. Back before comics had any value, telling a good story and having good art were the two keys to success. Now, it's pushing a brand and increasing the "collectability" with multiple covers/other useless bullshiat.


Well, that stuff was happening in the 80s... They just never dropped the business model.

However, that doesn't mean that good stories don't happen. If you read Deadpool, then yeah; you're getting low-grade, easy-target junk. If you read something like The Walking Dead or the current run of Amazing Spider-Man, then you're getting some of the best storytelling in the business.

Yeah yeah yeah. Now I get to listen to some of you whine about One More Day... Which was over 100 issues ago, and SO not relevant to what's being written now... but don't let that stop a good rant.
 
2011-04-09 1:48:02 AM  

ZeroCorpse: And once again, I say that manga is homogenous and trite, and only worthy of being used to mop up dog piss.


Most of it is, sure, but things like Saint Young Men, Tomehane, Twin Spica, Billy Bat, March Comes in Like a Lion, Moyashimon, Nodame Contabile, Ototomegari, s#$, this is just off the top of my head, are all excellent and very non-homogenous and non-trite. I could go on for much longer.

I think you need to differentiate between manga for children (Pokemon) and teens (Naruto, Bleach) and manga for adults (Vagabond). You are saying 'all books are homogenous and trite, and only worthy of being used to mop of dog piss' by looking at the B&N best seller pile. You'd be right as far as that went too.
 
2011-04-09 1:48:24 AM  
At least the big two are inspiring great movies from hollywood.
 
2011-04-09 1:52:55 AM  
It's not just the recession. It's marketing, we all picked up our first comic in the grocery store or pharmacy as children waiting for our mothers. We fell in love and wanted more and would even tolerate the long waits just to loiter and read. Now, no comics in those places. Only specialty shops and a few in borders or barnes & nobles. The average comic reader is in there 20's...we are dying off. No new blood, skyrocketing prices (3-4$ a book!) are killing us off. eNdangERD species.
 
2011-04-09 1:57:29 AM  
img34.imageshack.usView Full Size
 
2011-04-09 2:00:00 AM  
Meanwhile, there's the usual bad math to indicate the "horrible" decline in local stores (Yes, I'm local, and have been to Tate's).

20 years ago there were "almost two dozen" stores, where as now there are 18, implying some kind of massive decline.....even at the highest end of "almost two dozen", 23, you're talking about a decline of 5 whole stores, out of 23, a mighty 22% decrease....which for specialty stores in the era of superstores and the internet, over a 20 year span, isn't a very large decline at all.

Try looking for the decline in independent _bookstores_ with the advent of Borders, B&N, and Amazon.com for real declines
 
2011-04-09 2:01:54 AM  

unalivezombie: At least the big two are inspiring great movies from hollywood.


Really?

When are they coming out?

ZeroCorpse:
Well, that stuff was happening in the 80s... They just never dropped the business model.

However, that doesn't mean that good stories don't happen. If you read Deadpool, then yeah; you're getting low-grade, easy-target junk. If you read something like The Walking Dead or the current run of Amazing Spider-Man, then you're getting some of the best storytelling in the business.

Yeah yeah yeah. Now I get to listen to some of you whine about One More Day... Which was over 100 issues ago, and SO not relevant to what's being written now... but don't let that stop a good rant.


the current Spider-Man books could be the best damn books ever written, but I'll never know.

And no, not because of Brand New Day. I got over that. I actually enjoyed the book for the first 60 or so issues after.

But the art on Spider-Man has become so farking bad that a page from the book isn't even fit to wipe your ass with.

They could hire a five year old with ADD who is on a sugar high to draw better comics than the people they have drawing Spider-Man right now. The art is that horrible.

Oh, and as for comic prices... yeah, the Internet has any brick and mortar store beat all to hell. There are a few sites out there dedicated to selling comic back issues, and it's great to be able to get most any book for what it's really worth (usually 50 cents to a dollar) with just a few clicks.
 
2011-04-09 2:04:37 AM  
Not to be racist, but you own a store in South Florida... an increasing (every day) number of your "readers" speak Spanish. Unless you start buying bilingual comics, you're screwed.

Add to it, independents have the better stories, whereas the majors bring in the business. That's the same for ALL comic shops.

/Old enough to remember getting XMen comics at the Albertsons
//Then I found my first REAL comic shop and it was all done.
///Until I discover independents.... then I read real stories...
////Then I found Poison Elves and all paled in comparison
//Sadly Drew Hayes died... the story is unfinished and I stopped collecting.
 
2011-04-09 2:08:20 AM  

oldtaku: You are saying 'all books are homogenous and trite, and only worthy of being used to mop of dog piss' by looking at the B&N best seller pile. You'd be right as far as that went too.


But that's no different than saying that the B&N best seller pile for Marvel and DC are homogenous and trite, and that's true too.

The characters in Marvel in particular are so one-dimensional that I don't see the point. They're not even characters any more, just stereotypes. It makes me feel old to say this, but I can remember when every character in Marvel felt unique. The whole Kitty-and-Peter relationship, for example. Or Alpha Flight. At least the bad guys in the superhero movies tend to be deep.

Comics tend to be for kids. And kids like the same stuff over and over, only with a slightly different flavor. But the Marvel and DC comics in the 60s-80s could be enjoyed by adults too.

But I still preferred Dark Horse. Judah the Hammer, Dreadstar, Nexus, Alien/Predator, wow it had some good series.
 
2011-04-09 2:16:38 AM  

FirstNationalBastard: American comics are between $2.99 and $4.99 for 22 pages of story, which usually takes less than five minutes to read.


You're supposed to look at the pictures too.


/Good comics hardly need words.

Farabor:
Try looking for the decline in independent _bookstores_ with the advent of Borders, B&N, and Amazon.com for real declines


^THIS^


CSB: I used to work for an indy bookstore and some idiots would rather drive 40 miles (Each way) of 2-lane mountain highway than pay cover price.

"BUT IT'S 30% OFF AT B&N!!!"


Math is hard:

Hardcover, new: $27.99
Hardcover, -30%: $19.59
Savings: $8.40
Cost of gas ($3.50/gal) $14
 
2011-04-09 2:16:51 AM  
Step 1: Let them sell Beer and Cigarettes tax free.
Step Two: Profit
Step Three:?
 
2011-04-09 2:24:39 AM  

Brainsick: FirstNationalBastard: American comics are between $2.99 and $4.99 for 22 pages of story, which usually takes less than five minutes to read.

You're supposed to look at the pictures too.


/Good comics hardly need words.


There's hardly anything to read, anymore, anyway. It's all double page spreads and splash pages with maybe three words on the whole damn page.

For example, I remember the latest Flash #1... 4 bucks, and the first 10 pages were all pointless double page art spreads with maybe 10 words altogether on those 10 pages. And not a damn thing happened in the rest of the issue, or the next one, or the one after that. The Fastest Man Alive was starring in the slowest book ever written.

Oh, and that's another thing to biatch about... renumbering. The big two can't write a story worth a damn that will get people reading, so they have to renumber the books every six months to get idiot fanboys to BUY TEH SHINY NEW #1 BECAUSE ZOMG #1 ISSUES ARE WORF TEH MONIES AND I'LL SEND MY CHILD...er... I'd have to have sex to have a child... I'LL BE ABLE TO BUY A LOT OF CHEETOS WITH ALL TEH MONIES I MAKE FROM SELLING MY SPAWN #1 SO I HABE TO BUY TEH #1!!!, and after six months of a shiatty story, sales have dropped below where they were before the renumbering, so they have to put out another new #1 issue to get idiot fanboys to buy, and on and on and on.

I hate to say it, but the comics industry might be better off, creatively, if DC and Marvel were gone.
 
2011-04-09 2:25:56 AM  

DigitalCoffee: Can't remember when the last time was that I bought an American comic book. It was probably in the mid 80's in a mall comic shop and even then they were starting to get pricey and shifting away from the mainstream.

Trouble is, back in their heyday, the comics lived in places normal people shopped. They saw the comics while out shopping for the normal day-to-day stuff and picked them up in addition to what they were purchasing. They were at the news stands, 5 & 10 stores, at lunch counters, etc. Now it's mostly a special trip to a place that sells only (or mostly) comics. With such crappy The last comic I bought was this:


Funny as shiat. DC and Marvel need to take notice.

/i'm a cicada
//zweee... zweee...


Want the Manwah for "Marry me Mary" and "Full House" by Won Su Yeon to be published in English. I was a big comic fan as a kid and the last ones I bought were the "Elf Quest, The Hidden Years" a few years ago. I liked the DC and Marvel comics and still have a few from those days. I got em for $.25 and stopped buying when they hit over a $1.00. Kid liked Manga and bought Shonen Jump a few times and got more bang for the buck.
 
2011-04-09 2:35:59 AM  
I worked for an indie comic book publisher for a while. And a friend of mine owned a comic book shop.

This was back around 95/96.

My friend said that if it wasn't for Magic the Gathering cards and toys, he would have closed his shop already.

/He had a lot of old school Japanese toys.

/He used to sell uncommon & rare MTG cards with Japanese text here at a premium. While at the same time, selling uncommon and rare MTG cards with English text overseas at a premium.

/IIRC, MTG cards with Italian text carried the highest premium.
 
2011-04-09 2:49:55 AM  

lordargent: I worked for an indie comic book publisher for a while. And a friend of mine owned a comic book shop.

This was back around 95/96.

My friend said that if it wasn't for Magic the Gathering cards and toys, he would have closed his shop already.

/He had a lot of old school Japanese toys.

/He used to sell uncommon & rare MTG cards with Japanese text here at a premium. While at the same time, selling uncommon and rare MTG cards with English text overseas at a premium.

/IIRC, MTG cards with Italian text carried the highest premium.


I used to have 2 italian mana drains, and a nether void. And a crappy ass library of alexandria at one point.

Really like the art on nether void.
 
2011-04-09 3:03:44 AM  

The Jami Turman Fan Club: 'oldtaku: You are saying 'all books are homogenous and trite, and only worthy of being used to mop of dog piss' by looking at the B&N best seller pile. You'd be right as far as that went too.'

'But that's no different than saying that the B&N best seller pile for Marvel and DC are homogenous and trite, and that's true too.'


Absolutely. 99% of everything is crap (Sturgeon was too generous). The difference is just in the value. Good manga will cost me $6-$8 for 192-292 pages. Good comics from DC will cost me $3 for 32 pages. I will buy DC TPs of books like 'Unwritten' on sale because that's a fair price as far as my time for my money, but that doesn't help comic shops at all. As far as I can tell Marvel isn't doing a single good series right now, but same would apply.


But I still preferred Dark Horse. Judah the Hammer, Dreadstar, Nexus, Alien/Predator, wow it had some good series.

I still buy Hellboy from Dark Horse every month, even at per issue price, just because I like the world so much. Though unfortunately it's got so much baggage right now that I think it'd be really hard to just start reading.
 
2011-04-09 3:06:16 AM  

FirstNationalBastard: I hate to say it, but the comics industry might be better off, creatively, if DC and Marvel were gone.


I think you mean if SUPERHERO comics were gone. DC publishes good stuff in Vertigo (check out Fables, for starters) and Image is publishing so much stuff now there should be an expression 'the big three'.

Comics I read:

The Boys (Dynamite)
Kick-Ass (Marvel/Icon)
Amazing Spider-Man (Marvel)
Fables (DC/Vertigo)
Chew (Image)
Incorruptible (Boom!)

Fables is done as a monthly book but there are a couple of graphic novels (and a TV show, and a video game o_O) on the way
 
2011-04-09 3:06:36 AM  

oldtaku: Good manga will cost me $6-$8 for 192-292 pages. Good comics from DC will cost me $3 for 32 pages.


Sorry, I know it's crap form to reply to my own post, but I meant to add that at least 8 of those 32 pages are ads.
 
2011-04-09 3:13:40 AM  
Marvel & DC need to get the comics out of direct sales to the comic stores and back into your local newsagents etc my nearest is 7 miles away
Stop the crossovers which only bleed you dry cos you have buy into other titles your not into to keep up. They're also crap and the main reason I've stopped buying them.
Many of stories are too adult orientated. My nephew was taken to FB the other week to get some and come out with none cos his parents were uncomfortable with the content. They need to tone it down.
Quit using the limited edition covers.
 
2011-04-09 3:15:13 AM  

oldtaku: I still buy Hellboy from Dark Horse


Ah, crap.

Comics I read:

The Boys (Dynamite)
Kick-Ass (Marvel/Icon)
Amazing Spider-Man (Marvel)
Fables (DC/Vertigo)
Chew (Image)
Incorruptible (Boom!)

Hellboy (Dark Horse)
 
2011-04-09 3:16:48 AM  

Brainsick:

Fables is done as a monthly book but there are a couple of graphic novels (and a TV show, and a video game o_O) on the way


What do you mean by "done"?

As far as I know, Fables is still a successful ongoing book. Now, creatively, well, YMMV.

Now, Jack of Fables, that ended with issue #50.

Oh, and speaking of prices, I love the latest Fables TPB on principle alone. See, it's 18 bucks cover price for the trade, which reprints issues 94-100.

To buy those in single issue format was almost 30 dollars, since issue #100 was 10 bucks.

And that's another reason why comics are dying. When collections are way cheaper than the single issues, you're not giving the buyers any reason to continue buying the overpriced single issues that make up the eventual collection. They'll get wise and just wait for the trade.

Of course, DC's tpb department has always sucked, and they made a conscious effort to delay a collection for up to a year after issues were published to try to force people to buy the single issues. All it really did was make less people buy comics.

Nice going, DC!
 
2011-04-09 3:20:45 AM  

Zenith:
Many of stories are too adult orientated. My nephew was taken to FB the other week to get some and come out with none cos his parents were uncomfortable with the content. They need to tone it down.
Quit using the limited edition covers.


Oh, don't say this around hardcore fanboys. They'll want to have you drawn and quartered for suggesting that their funny books should be written with children in mind! They're mature people now, and should be able to read about Arsenal shooting smack and molesting cats, and Doctor Light raping his way through the DC Universe because that's mature! They shouldn't have their comics sanitized for young people, no sir!

/another thing killing comics... the fans. Look at what targeting this demographic has done already. So why keep targeting the quickly shrinking audience you already have instead of trying to find a new, larger audience?
 
2011-04-09 3:21:14 AM  

FirstNationalBastard: As far as I know, Fables is still a successful ongoing book. Now, creatively, well, YMMV.


D'oh!

I was at Emerald City Comicon this year and I thought I heard the series was ending...but:
The majority of the interior work has been done by Mark Buckingham, who reportedly will be given the reins to the story if Willingham becomes unable to continue it.[ (new window)


/This is one of the few times that being wrong on the internet feels good
 
2011-04-09 3:23:21 AM  
Most existing comic shops will be in business longer than most existing chain book stores.

There is a social aspect to the local comic shop that can not be replaced online. Where else is a lonely fanboy able to have a face to face conversation about how he would have had superhero A do whatever differently in issue B of series C?

It's all good as long as fanboy finds something he thinks is cool to buy while at the shop so the shop can pay it's rent.
 
2011-04-09 3:26:08 AM  

FirstNationalBastard: Zenith:
Many of stories are too adult orientated. My nephew was taken to FB the other week to get some and come out with none cos his parents were uncomfortable with the content. They need to tone it down.
Quit using the limited edition covers.

Oh, don't say this around hardcore fanboys. They'll want to have you drawn and quartered for suggesting that their funny books should be written with children in mind! They're mature people now, and should be able to read about Arsenal shooting smack and molesting cats, and Doctor Light raping his way through the DC Universe because that's mature! They shouldn't have their comics sanitized for young people, no sir!

/another thing killing comics... the fans. Look at what targeting this demographic has done already. So why keep targeting the quickly shrinking audience you already have instead of trying to find a new, larger audience?


comicspriceguide.comView Full Size
 
2011-04-09 3:27:43 AM  

oldtaku: Don't forget, 'DC is Holding the Line at $2.99!1' for 32 pages stuffed with 12 pages of ads while I can buy 240 pages of manga for $6.99 and without all your bullshiat retconning and shocking revelations and crossovers once a year like clockwork. Marvel I completely gave up on with the Spiderman Clone Saga.


Go suck a cock you idiot.

The manga you buy in the US, ALREADY made money in Japan, not to meniton it was ALREADY published, which is why you can buy 240 pages of manga for $6.99.

Not to mention manga is in farking black and white and most of the artists use a very simple drawing style (not to mention they use assistants to pump out work).

The differences in the industries are social more than anything, comics used to sell in the millions per issue back in the day. Besides everything mentioned here, there's also the stigmata of buying comics which no farking kids wants to go through unless they're already a nerd.
 
2011-04-09 3:30:04 AM  
lib.store.yahoo.netView Full Size
 
2011-04-09 3:51:53 AM  
i534.photobucket.comView Full Size


/to borrow a cliché: Just Say NO
 
2011-04-09 4:02:21 AM  

rocky_howard: 'oldtaku: Don't forget, 'DC is Holding the Line at $2.99!1' for 32 pages stuffed with 12 pages of ads while I can buy 240 pages of manga for $6.99 and without all your bullshiat retconning and shocking revelations and crossovers once a year like clockwork. Marvel I completely gave up on with the Spiderman Clone Saga.'

Go suck a cock you idiot.

The manga you buy in the US, ALREADY made money in Japan, not to meniton it was ALREADY published, which is why you can buy 240 pages of manga for $6.99.


Sooo, Comic Shop Guy (stroking your neckbeard here), would you say that was the Worst. Comment. Evar?

I can buy it new in Japan, first publication, for 400-800 yen, which is ~$4-8 US. The publishing dynamics are different. The volume is large enough they can make money on that. It actually costs more in the US than it does in Japan.

But setting aside your appalling lack of knowledge, which you nevertheless invoke in telling anyone who disagrees with you to go fellate a stranger, I don't care why it costs what it costs. It costs what it costs, and at those prices US comics can't measure up for amount of story per (converted) dollar. I guess in the US unsocialized fanboys drive enough potential readers away to keep the volume down. Keep up the great work.
 
2011-04-09 4:24:36 AM  
Brainstick

Don't know about the states but over here it's basically a series of colouring in books. I'm not sure it's bringing them for long haul cos overwise your LCSs wouldn't be closing down.
I think my points are still valid
 
2011-04-09 4:29:08 AM  
interesting. the one real reason that comic shops are on the way out hasnt really been talked about yet. a bunch of comments about stale stories, pricing, and poor marketing are all well and good, but there is only one major threat to the brick and mortar shops.

it's distribution.

in the modern age of technology, digital distribution is gaining great speed right now and will continue to do so. brick and mortar shops cant possibly compete with that. You can buy the book directly from Marvel for 3.99 and cut out any middle man percentages from the shops or print houses. Win all around for the publishers, and big lose for the shops (and Diamond Distr too.) And to some extent it is win for the creators. Web comics gained a lot of momentum over the past 10 years and many people who never made it in the comics print industry have made a decent go at it on the Web. So even though Marvel no longer needs shops to get their books to the consumer, they still need creators to make those comics. Creators who could and couldnt make it in the print industry will still be able to be seen and read for cheaper and to the broadest audience possible.

Comic shops will become the Indie book store but with comics. They already lost a considerable amount of business to Ebay sellers and mail-order services. They are doomed.
 
2011-04-09 4:33:40 AM  
oldtaku:
rocky_howard: 'oldtaku: Don't forget, 'DC is Holding the Line at $2.99!1' for 32 pages stuffed with 12 pages of ads while I can buy 240 pages of manga for $6.99 and without all your bullshiat retconning and shocking revelations and crossovers once a year like clockwork. Marvel I completely gave up on with the Spiderman Clone Saga.'

Go suck a cock you idiot.

The manga you buy in the US, ALREADY made money in Japan, not to meniton it was ALREADY published, which is why you can buy 240 pages of manga for $6.99.

Sooo, Comic Shop Guy (stroking your neckbeard here), would you say that was the Worst. Comment. Evar?

I can buy it new in Japan, first publication, for 400-800 yen, which is ~$4-8 US. The publishing dynamics are different. The volume is large enough they can make money on that. It actually costs more in the US than it does in Japan.

But setting aside your appalling lack of knowledge, which you nevertheless invoke in telling anyone who disagrees with you to go fellate a stranger, I don't care why it costs what it costs. It costs what it costs, and at those prices US comics can't measure up for amount of story per (converted) dollar. I guess in the US unsocialized fanboys drive enough potential readers away to keep the volume down. Keep up the great work.


Only tangentially related, but I wish Marvel would publish reprints in a "thicker" format. I don't mean TPBs that reprint recent story arcs -- I'd actually like to see at least three regular reprint series.

One would reprint Spider-Man, Daredevil, Hulk, starting with first appearance and then running through the series' runs.

Another would cover solo Avengers: Iron Man, Thor, Captain America.

Then a "Marvel Super Teams" series with reprints of Avengers, X-Men, and Fantastic Four.

These should be on cheap paper, like they originals, to keep the price as low as possible, so they can make money from the ads, like they used to. It would give people who can't afford to pay hundreds/thousands for originals to get the early histories of the most popular Marvel characters. Aside from cheap paper keeping down costs, the talent has already been paid as well, so it really would be cheap to produce these, and people catching up with the back stories might well start picking up newer issues.

yes, they've done some reprints in Marvel masterworks, but those are what $30 a pop? No kid is going to shell that out, but they might drop a few bucks for a big bundle reprinting 3 issues at once.

And no special or alternate covers, no mail-order only, no limited print runs -- make the comics available, like they used to be, and recruit new fans.

That's one way I see that might help revive the industry, anyway...
 
2011-04-09 4:42:03 AM  

FirstNationalBastard: Zenith:
Many of stories are too adult orientated. My nephew was taken to FB the other week to get some and come out with none cos his parents were uncomfortable with the content. They need to tone it down.
Quit using the limited edition covers.

Oh, don't say this around hardcore fanboys. They'll want to have you drawn and quartered for suggesting that their funny books should be written with children in mind! They're mature people now, and should be able to read about Arsenal shooting smack and molesting cats, and Doctor Light raping his way through the DC Universe because that's mature! They shouldn't have their comics sanitized for young people, no sir!

/another thing killing comics... the fans. Look at what targeting this demographic has done already. So why keep targeting the quickly shrinking audience you already have instead of trying to find a new, larger audience?


Never did buy the mature fans argument. It's a comic FFS!. I'm 45 & don't play my xbox, PSP, touch apps & read comics to caress my sense of maturity!
I can get all the crack den & rape sensationist stories I could ever want from the daily mail.
Your last point is really valid. They need to change the business model or they're going to die.
 
2011-04-09 4:47:12 AM  

itazurakko: spman: A 12-15 page comic now costs anywhere from $3.99 to $5.99, as much as a full length paperback or magazine, but with only enough actual text to fill a paragraph.

This is what always boggled my mind. I mean, Japanese comics are a few bucks a pop for either (1) a 200+ page ish collection of a few months of content, OR (2) a weekly phone book sized thing that has the equivalent of 20+ strips EACH running their 12-15 page installment in it.

And I thought THAT was expensive. (Particularly if you want to consume it from half a world away in the US it IS expensive - read real books they're a better time value for the money.)

But the US stuff is just crazy.

Plus the US stuff seems very much aware of the collector market so stuff is pricey from the outset. Rather than just normal readers buying those cheap non-collectible phone book size weekly serials and giving them up for the paper collection man when they're done.

I'll admit I largely quit reading comics because the amount you get is so small, you can read a book in 20 minutes. But now I've found places to illegally download comics to my phone, I find I might want to actually get the paper collection versions OF the ones I actually liked (from amazon.jp, yeah it ain't cheap) but I would never do it if I couldn't already read volume 1 of a bunch of stuff to decide what I want to maybe buy first.

So, not quite on topic but maybe if publishers freely allowed "piracy" of issue #1 of everything they'd get more sales from people like me.


A lot of the cost comes from the color printing on the semi-gloss paper. One of my favorite books, The Savage Dragon, is $3.50 now it used to be waaaay back in the day (around 13 years ago) 1.95. Erik Larsen, the man behind it has gone on record saying that he isn't ever going to "price gouge" the fans and basically he makes a living wage on his creator owned book (not much merchandising).
I wish American creators could follow the Japanese model (plenty of story on phonebook style paper (maybe even in black and white), but I don't think it would be that viable here. We aren't exactly known for our patience. We want shiny and colorful things. Most of our attention spans wouldn't support a book like Spider-man in that format.
 
2011-04-09 5:22:57 AM  
The industry needs to forget about making money on old issues and reprints. Put them online for free, everything up to about the year 2000, with no restrictions on redistribution whatsoever. Use Bittorrent, let fans repack them in their own torrents or host them for DDL, etc. Just shove it all onto the internet in the cheapest, most open way possible. That will bring in the fans.
 
2011-04-09 5:35:21 AM  
In fairness, comic book proprietors can be pretty badass.

l.yimg.comView Full Size
 
2011-04-09 5:37:00 AM  

spman: A 12-15 page comic now costs anywhere from $3.99 to $5.99, as much as a full length paperback or magazine, but with only enough actual text to fill a paragraph.


As an English teacher friend of mine says, comics are "books for illiterates."
 
2011-04-09 5:38:30 AM  

FirstNationalBastard: unalivezombie: At least the big two are inspiring great movies from hollywood.

Really?

When are they coming out?


exactly
 
2011-04-09 6:24:09 AM  
StanTheMan:
spman: A 12-15 page comic now costs anywhere from $3.99 to $5.99, as much as a full length paperback or magazine, but with only enough actual text to fill a paragraph.

As an English teacher friend of mine says, comics are "books for illiterates."


It's a common prejudice, but not really true. I learned to read in large part from comics -- and a kid reading comics is still more intellectually challenged than a kid watching TV.

Sure, a lot of comics are far from mentally challenging for an adult, but they're great for beginning readers, and some comics writers -- Neil Gaiman, Alan Moore, Daniel Clowes -- are far more literate than a lot of mass-market authors like Dan Brown, Stephanie Myers, etc.
 
2011-04-09 7:35:42 AM  

FirstNationalBastard: I hate to say it, but the comics industry might be better off, creatively, if DC and Marvel were gone.



[image from upload.wikimedia.org too old to be available]
 
2011-04-09 7:52:12 AM  
images.cheezburger.comView Full Size
 
2011-04-09 8:09:09 AM  
ZeroCorpse:
However, that doesn't mean that good stories don't happen. If you read Deadpool, then yeah; you're getting low-grade, easy-target junk.


Let's just be clear. Old Deadpool (of the Kelly/Priest/Simone era) was fantastic. Genuinely funny with good storylines.

Now current Deadpool... junk is the right word. Volume 4 Deadpool is passable but everything else is utter crap. Team-Up had 2 or 3 good issues, Corps was total garbage, everything else they've pooped out has been worse.

Yet I still buy them. Have to have a complete run of all Deadpool comics. Why? I have no idea. I think it's because I'm the kind of sucker Marvel hopes to rope in.
 
2011-04-09 8:46:40 AM  

Brainsick: pictures


Darn right pictures can do it all. One of my favorite comics ever.

img158.imageshack.usView Full Size


And my favorite storyline ever - Kraven's Last Hunt

samruby.comView Full Size


Good points here. One of the other things is that many comic shops don't carry many back issues today and are purely focused on the "Wednesday new arrivals".

We have a shop in Villa Park, IL called Unicorn Comics that I love. Go in with my son and the owner has boxes of $1.00 back issue comics are are great for my son. Thing is, some of those comics are a year old.
 
2011-04-09 8:54:58 AM  
I'm still reading some Green Lantern, Supergirl and Legion titles, Deadpool (yeah, I know), and a few others. However the increasing prices coupled with the slack writing and lame art has really killed the appeal of comics. How about writers, write a good story instead of trying to push some agenda that really has nothing to do with the book and try not to tell the same story, over and over and OVER AGAIN. Publishers, if the artist can only do lantern jaws and disproportionate anatomy, get someone with talent. The inker can only do so much.
I'm afraid the comic book business may be done, or at least over due for a major upheaval and overhaul.
 
2011-04-09 8:59:47 AM  
Infinite Crisis > 52 > countdown >one year later > seven soldiers > death of the new gods > final crisis

4 years of one massive stupid storyline that CHANGED EVERYTHING, AND EXPLAINED NOTHING.

That's why you lost me DC. I have no idea what the current DC multiverse is, or who's left to care about.

Batman is setting up franchises, Superman, the last son of krypton, is dealing with 100,000 kryptonians, Green Lantern did the zombie thing. And there are very few books that are aimed at pulling in the younger readers who these books should be for.
piss off the fanboys, ignore the youth market.

Great business plan.
/Is I mad?
 
2011-04-09 9:02:47 AM  
This article talks about a store called Tates, it's actually an extremely popular store where people will drive an hour out of their way to get to it and the damn place is always packed. I wouldn't say it's because of the comics they sell perse. It's because they sell a LOT of other shiat like high-quality character statues, cosplay costume stuff, a crap-ton of posters, blah blah blah, and they also have large space reserved for all sorts of tournaments for card games and DnD and video games and whatnot. Basically they give all the nerds of the surrounding area a reason to want to go and the nerds are all too eager to spend their money while they're there. The idea of a good time of quite a few people I know is "Hey, let's go down to Tates". Recently some friends of mine opened up another comic store in the near area which follows the same basic premise and they're already starting to do well for themselves in that light even though they're very new. Depending on the area, comic stores are not really in trouble at all, they just need to adapt to their new market.
 
2011-04-09 9:10:41 AM  
I hope Million Year Picnic in Harvard Square never closes. I've never seen so many comics packed in such a small space.
 
2011-04-09 9:26:50 AM  
There've been some remarks in this thread regarding Manga being cheaper than American comics. There's several factors at play here.

One, an american mainstream superhero comic will have: A writer (sometimes 2, one who plots and one who makes up the actual dialogue), a penciller (possibly 2), an inker, a letterer, a colorist (those last two or three might be merged since it's all done digitally), an editor, an assistant editor, and an editor in chief ALL having to work on a book. And get paid for it. And the books are printed separately from one another on high quality newsprint or magazine-style glossy paper. Don't tell me that doesn't sound expensive.

Manga, on the other hand, has one guy who writes, pencils, inks, shades (rarely does manga get colored), letters and... yeah. A lot of manga is creator owned. Then an editor gives it the once over, and it's put in a collection with 5-8 other stories all printed on cheap newsprint with a buttload of ads strewn about in between each story.

So, having to pay 6-10 guys to publish one book (and doing that multiple times over because you're publishing a hundred titles a month, not all of which will sell out), or 2 guys to publish a portion of one book which will get sold regardless (because someone's going to like SOMETHING in the book as there's all different types of genres represented in such a book)...

Which one sounds more economical?
 
2011-04-09 9:42:43 AM  
I know this sounds awful, but my local comic shop would be a place I would go to a lot more often if it didn't have about four or five absolute weirdos of varying qualities of body hygiene there ALL THE TIME. I know it is stereotypical, but a lot of people are uncomfortable shopping or browsing when there's a subset of folks there that are either a) smelling, b) staring at you, or c) extolling the virtues of the old Jimmy Olson comics, or, in my case, all three.
 
2011-04-09 10:16:04 AM  

The Flexecutioner: interesting. the one real reason that comic shops are on the way out hasnt really been talked about yet. a bunch of comments about stale stories, pricing, and poor marketing are all well and good, but there is only one major threat to the brick and mortar shops.

it's distribution.

in the modern age of technology, digital distribution is gaining great speed right now and will continue to do so. brick and mortar shops cant possibly compete with that. You can buy the book directly from Marvel for 3.99 and cut out any middle man percentages from the shops or print houses. Win all around for the publishers, and big lose for the shops (and Diamond Distr too.) And to some extent it is win for the creators. Web comics gained a lot of momentum over the past 10 years and many people who never made it in the comics print industry have made a decent go at it on the Web. So even though Marvel no longer needs shops to get their books to the consumer, they still need creators to make those comics. Creators who could and couldnt make it in the print industry will still be able to be seen and read for cheaper and to the broadest audience possible.

Comic shops will become the Indie book store but with comics. They already lost a considerable amount of business to Ebay sellers and mail-order services. They are doomed.


QFT. You nailed it. The print based companies are on their way out. IMO. Stores will need to change to survive
 
2011-04-09 10:16:25 AM  
You don't have to giver up American comics if you give up on Marvel and DC. BOOM! Studios and Dark Horse are both great companies, and depending on what you like, there's IDW and Dynamite!, among others.

DC and Marvel are in the business of making money. If you want them to change, to get back to telling good stories with our favorite characters, simply stop buying the shiat crossovers.
 
2011-04-09 10:25:18 AM  
I would have thought that people so undiscriminating or desperate for entertainment that they judge the value of a book by cost per page (or minute) would just cut to the chase and stick with free stuff (which is an infinitely better deal by that measure).
 
2011-04-09 10:25:39 AM  

whizbangthedirtfarmer: I know this sounds awful, but my local comic shop would be a place I would go to a lot more often if it didn't have about four or five absolute weirdos of varying qualities of body hygiene there ALL THE TIME. I know it is stereotypical, but a lot of people are uncomfortable shopping or browsing when there's a subset of folks there that are either a) smelling, b) staring at you, or c) extolling the virtues of the old Jimmy Olson comics, or, in my case, all three.


and you are sure that isnt the staff?
 
2011-04-09 10:35:29 AM  
I've had a friend who owned a shop that got out of the comic business (kick, replies, etc) ..

The problem with comics and pricing isn't the shop owners. It's a company called Alliance. They're basically the sole distributor for comics - and other stuff too.

If you want to carry comics, you have to carry EVERY BOOK Alliance says you have to carry. Furthermore, you have to buy a certain number of books for each set - no negotiation. If they don't sell, well, tough shiat. You're out of luck.

If you only want to carry DC - tough shiat. Alliance won't allow that. You want comics, you want everything Alliance says you want. That adds up to close to $5000 a month to Alliance which you can't negotiate about. Good luck trying to sell all those books.

Furthermore, Alliance also charges the comic shops close to cover price for those books. A comic costs $4.99? You're going to be charged about $3.00 for the book.

Of course, your recourse in this is to not do business with Alliance. Sadly, they're the sole distributor for Yu-Gi-Oh! cards (yes, some people still buy that shiat), M-TG, Warmachine, Flames of War, Hordes, World of Warcraft cards, and others - and if you find another distributor, Alliance will sever their business contract with you and not send you any more product - and then start pressuring that other company to do the same.

Alliance sucks. It's the farking devil. It's the real reason comics are going to fail - monopolies are NEVER a good thing.
 
2011-04-09 10:36:10 AM  
I'm not a big comic book fan, but I have dreams of opening a gaming shop. Table top, MMORPG, etc... I have a fondness for them since hubby and I met at one (Magic Mikes in the Clwtr / Pin. Park area - don't know if it's even still open).

Sadly it will probably never happen even though we live right down the farking road from Stetson U. and DBCC isn't that far in the other direction.
 
2011-04-09 10:47:07 AM  
I used to go to the comic book store every Wednesday to get new issues but then I realized I was spending too much a month for comics so I stopped for awhile. Now, I just mainly go when there's a big crossover event.

Civil War
Secret Invasion
The Siege
Blackest Night
I was reading Brightest Day for awhile
Now I'm getting Fear Itself
 
2011-04-09 11:14:22 AM  
My brother owned a comic book store and also worked for a regional distributor back in the '80s through the early '90s. A lot of the observations in this thread are exactly what he predicted and why he got out of the industry.

I worked for him on and off during this time when I was home from college, and I remember waiting for each new issue of "Watchmen" to come out, etc. But within a short period, it seems like every issue of the superhero books was all rapey and decapitating, etc. , trying to capture that 'mature' edge.

This thread made me realize that as I introduce my 18-month old son to things like the Three Stooges and campfires, I hadn't even thought about comic books. A buddy of mine who works at a comic store gives me old "The Walking Dead" issues, and that's the only comic I've read regularly in twenty years.

And I agree with that even if the comics wither on the vine, the Evil Disney Corporation model will still prevail: Marvel and DC will just be the owners of Spiderman and Superman licensing.
 
2011-04-09 11:16:48 AM  
Really, I'm the first ?

2.bp.blogspot.comView Full Size
 
2011-04-09 11:23:07 AM  

FirstNationalBastard: They're doomed.


My local store just expanded, picked up The Goon Vol 6. It's by far the best comic I've ever read.
 
2011-04-09 11:39:22 AM  
I have the Transmet spider tattooed on the back of my shoulder, so I'm really getting a kick out of these replies.
 
2011-04-09 11:41:16 AM  

One Bad Apple: Really, I'm the first ?


Implying that Rob Leifeld is a crappy artist who can't draw feet or proper perspective or proportions is like admitting the sky is blue. It doesn't need to be said!
 
2011-04-09 11:48:22 AM  
I still buy comics, but I do it online. Great outfit called Sci Fi Genre (PLUG) I get 20% off,free bags and boards, cheap shipping and I can buy anything that's in Previews at a discount as well and have that shipped along with my comics. Once a month I get a nice box with comics and geeky t-shirts and I never have to go inside a comic shop. They have only missed a book for me once in the last three years and an e-mail to them straightened it out and they tossed it in for free in my next shipment. They are awesome and I really kind of prefer getting my books this way.
 
2011-04-09 11:51:55 AM  

SunsetLament: Then, right around when the Watchmen took off and Batman (Tim Burton) made a mint at the theaters (1989ish) the industry got into the notion of "We've got product people want. We can double and triple prices and people will pay. So we will." Speculators (same thing happened with baseball cards) were willing to pay almost anything (especially if it had a foil cover or a #1 stamped on it) thinking they were making a fool-proof investment for the future. So Marvel/DC raised prices even higher.

But they didn't realize they were pricing out little kids. And without the recurring nature of the industry (Little boy holds comics in hand, reads, loves them, grows up, buys comics for his son, wash, rinse, repeat), they were losing a large portion of their customer base every year. It has now caught up to them.


THIIIIIIIIIS.

And not just in comics, either. Plenty of toys (granted, often comics-related) similarly started aiming for the adult "investor" market, or attracted it somehow, and so the prices went up AND you had people buying anything that was "random chance to get a rare character" by the truckload, siphoning out all the rare characters, and then reselling, before the kids have a chance.

It seems people heard a few fabulous rags-to-riches stories of people finding their old stuff worth millions in the attic, because by some miracle their mom hadn't thrown it away - baseball cards or comics or some old metal toy.

So all of a sudden everyone wants to be into "collecting." And the companies oblige, oh do they ever, and print 213950123046 versions of the same item. And no one throws them away, so they never get valuable. Ha.

(Same exact dynamic exists for the "fluffy crap around the house" set, with commemorative plates and spoons and goodness knows what all, same deal, everyone buys it, no one throws it away, and it will never be worth anything but the companies pumping it out get rich. But at least that's not farking up a market for kids.)

If you buy something thinking it will be collectible for money, it won't be because everyone else is doing the same thing.
 
2011-04-09 11:53:22 AM  

Curious: autographs from William Shatner of the TV series "Star Trek" and Stan Lee, the creator of Marvel Comics.

was it really necessary to explain who those guys are in an article about comic books?


Yes. Unless you want to write articles for very narrow audiences, then explaining who people are, and why they're relevant is something you'd want to do.

If I write an article about a subject you're not familiar with, name dropping people would be useless for you, unless I also explain who they are.
 
2011-04-09 12:01:51 PM  

Straelbora: My brother owned a comic book store and also worked for a regional distributor back in the '80s through the early '90s. A lot of the observations in this thread are exactly what he predicted and why he got out of the industry.

I worked for him on and off during this time when I was home from college, and I remember waiting for each new issue of "Watchmen" to come out, etc. But within a short period, it seems like every issue of the superhero books was all rapey and decapitating, etc. , trying to capture that 'mature' edge.

This thread made me realize that as I introduce my 18-month old son to things like the Three Stooges and campfires, I hadn't even thought about comic books. A buddy of mine who works at a comic store gives me old "The Walking Dead" issues, and that's the only comic I've read regularly in twenty years.

And I agree with that even if the comics wither on the vine, the Evil Disney Corporation model will still prevail: Marvel and DC will just be the owners of Spiderman and Superman licensing.


Tiny titans and the new line by franco. Very kid friendly, there is probably a free comic book day version.

Think tiny toons but with DC characters, drawn in crayon
 
2011-04-09 12:06:21 PM  
Well whatever, as long as ther are still ads for sea monkeys and X-ray specs.
 
2011-04-09 12:13:07 PM  

oldtaku: I can buy it new in Japan, first publication, for 400-800 yen, which is ~$4-8 US.


The other thing is, you can buy it REPRINTED in Japan, collections of stories but in newly run-off books in regular bookstores, for as long as there's a readership.

So when you see some interesting volume down at the coffeehouse or whatever but can't get into it because it's volume 52 (yes, that's 52 collections of 200+ pages each) you can stop by the bookstore and GET that #1 and start from the beginning. #1 is not special.

It's just a very different business, yeah.

soseussme: Only tangentially related, but I wish Marvel would publish reprints in a "thicker" format. I don't mean TPBs that reprint recent story arcs -- I'd actually like to see at least three regular reprint series.


Yes. People can wait a bit to get a book that they can read all at once for more story. Heck, I have the fully collected volume of "Watchmen" and enjoyed it quite a bit in that format.

MagSeven: A lot of the cost comes from the color printing on the semi-gloss paper. One of my favorite books, The Savage Dragon, is $3.50 now it used to be waaaay back in the day (around 13 years ago) 1.95. Erik Larsen, the man behind it has gone on record saying that he isn't ever going to "price gouge" the fans and basically he makes a living wage on his creator owned book (not much merchandising).
I wish American creators could follow the Japanese model (plenty of story on phonebook style paper (maybe even in black and white), but I don't think it would be that viable here. We aren't exactly known for our patience. We want shiny and colorful things. Most of our attention spans wouldn't support a book like Spider-man in that format.


Agreed the coloring is probably part of it. Though the patience thing, it seems the stuff in the US is SLOWER to come out, just because each issue has so extremely little content in it. Reprints as fatter books (even if those cost more) might get a customer who comes in less frequently but wants to get a more "graphic novel" sized amount of stuff to sit with at one time.

People do read newspaper comics in B&W... that's another form of comics I particularly like, though I see it's also moving more to online now.
 
2011-04-09 12:14:18 PM  
As much as I love comic book stores, this doesn't completely surprise me, especially considering some places i've been to had the business model of "Buy everything off ebay, then try to sell it at my brick and mortar store."

Not to mention the ones with walls of VHS, Cassette Tapes, and crappy 70's halloween costumes, so that the store looks more like a hoarder opened a store than a legitimate business.
 
2011-04-09 12:16:36 PM  

StanTheMan: spman: A 12-15 page comic now costs anywhere from $3.99 to $5.99, as much as a full length paperback or magazine, but with only enough actual text to fill a paragraph.

As an English teacher friend of mine says, comics are "books for illiterates."


Shrug, I learned English from Marvel comics. So if he's right, how come I can read and write English now?
 
2011-04-09 12:35:59 PM  
The last issue of Spiderman just came out in Denmark btw., first printed in Denmark in 1967 (ie. in Danish).

I read that religiously each month, and I'd wager it was also better and cheaper than the US version, since it included 2-3 issues per month and additional mail-box, fan fiction etc.

It changed it's name from "Edderkoppen" to "Spiderman" because of the movie, but alas, it is over now. I think at the end the company more or less just kept publishing it out of nostalgia, just like they still publish Donald Duck once a week (written and drawn in Denmark).


Oh well.

---

On comics, the best stuff is European though. I was surprised when visiting USA that you didn't have the great French and Belgian stuff.
 
2011-04-09 12:44:31 PM  
i258.photobucket.comView Full Size


/willing to be "that guy"
 
2011-04-09 12:53:51 PM  

farbekrieg: whizbangthedirtfarmer: I know this sounds awful, but my local comic shop would be a place I would go to a lot more often if it didn't have about four or five absolute weirdos of varying qualities of body hygiene there ALL THE TIME. I know it is stereotypical, but a lot of people are uncomfortable shopping or browsing when there's a subset of folks there that are either a) smelling, b) staring at you, or c) extolling the virtues of the old Jimmy Olson comics, or, in my case, all three.

and you are sure that isnt the staff?


That's the sad part. The guy in charge of the shop is really intelligent, and had the shop in recovery from the previous owner. He did all of these promotions; he even donates a lot of back issues to local middle and high schools. He's passionate about comics and he loves talking about them; he's even done some research in how to teach literacy skills with comics. Yet, the past few times I've gone in there, there sits the same four or five guys (sometimes on the floor), debating who drew some issue of an Archie comic fifteen years ago.

And the poor owner tries to ignore them. He's stuck. They are obviously his best customers (one guy appears to buy about thirty to forty comics PER WEEK), but he also knows that a lot of other customers are absolutely chased away by their presence. I feel sorry for him.
 
2011-04-09 1:16:20 PM  
lubbockonline.netView Full Size


1.bp.blogspot.comView Full Size


LAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAND!
 
2011-04-09 1:19:09 PM  

smokescreen: Darn right pictures can do it all. One of my favorite comics ever.


Goddammit, GI Joe was a toy, not a comic book.

Back in my day he was big enough to date-rape Barbie and you had to use your imagination.

Your generation reduced him to a tiny doll with a comic book to promote him.
 
2011-04-09 1:31:13 PM  
lordargent: I worked for an indie comic book publisher for a while. And a friend of mine owned a comic book shop. This was back around 95/96. My friend said that if it wasn't for Magic the Gathering cards and toys, he would have closed his shop already.

A friend of a friend used to own a comic shop here in central Florida. 98% of his sales were Magic: The Gathering, YuGiOh, and HeroClix. I think I was the only one buying any comics there. The store went out of business in early 2004. It was nice while it lasted.

//The owner was exactly like "Comic Book Guy" from The Simpsons- a fat bearded asshole that thought he knew more about comics than you. Somehow, that dickhead had a girlfriend and a baby. Even more amazing , his girlfriend looked just like Lisa Loeb, right down to the cat-eye glasses!
 
2011-04-09 1:40:30 PM  
StanTheMan: As an English teacher friend of mine says, comics are "books for illiterates."

Tell that biatch to read "Maus", "A Contract With God", "Black Hole", "Blankets", "Perseopolis", "A History Of Violence" and STFU.
 
2011-04-09 1:49:59 PM  

rocky_howard: oldtaku:
Not to mention manga is in farking black and white and most of the artists use a very simple drawing style...


i132.photobucket.comView Full Size

i132.photobucket.comView Full Size

i132.photobucket.comView Full Size


Try reading something other than Naruto sometime.
 
2011-04-09 1:59:27 PM  

MoronLessOff: FirstNationalBastard: They're doomed.

My local store just expanded, picked up The Goon Vol 6. It's by far the best comic I've ever read.


Was that Chinatown?

I've got that HC, but haven't gotten around to reading it yet.

In fact, I've got to re-read The Goon all the way through. It was a good book.
 
2011-04-09 2:05:14 PM  
I have been going to Chicago Comics every week since it opened in 95 or so.. They sell many things other than comics. Great art books, Taschen stuff, posters, statues, tons of great toys... The staff is the best and there is always good music playing. Every friday they have a dj spinning for a few hours at night and give you 10 percent off if you dance for ten minutes. Love this place, one of my favorite places to waste a couple hours and money. For reals.. It's on Clark. Check it out, they also own Quimby's book store, which carries a fantastic variety of stuff. Your welcome.
 
2011-04-09 2:19:42 PM  

Curious: autographs from William Shatner of the TV series "Star Trek" and Stan Lee, the creator of Marvel Comics.

was it really necessary to explain who those guys are in an article about comic books?


I know right? Especially since Lee died filming The Crow. Hello, it's not 1995 anymore! And Shatner hasn't had a good show since he played that lawyer on Ally McBeal.
 
2011-04-09 2:37:03 PM  

exparrot: Infinite Crisis > 52 > countdown >one year later > seven soldiers > death of the new gods > final crisis

4 years of one massive stupid storyline that CHANGED EVERYTHING, AND EXPLAINED NOTHING.

That's why you lost me DC. I have no idea what the current DC multiverse is, or who's left to care about.

Batman is setting up franchises, Superman, the last son of krypton, is dealing with 100,000 kryptonians, Green Lantern did the zombie thing. And there are very few books that are aimed at pulling in the younger readers who these books should be for.
piss off the fanboys, ignore the youth market.

Great business plan.
/Is I mad?



I stopped being a regular comics reader because I could no longer afford keeping up with the storylines. I shifted over to just reading things like The Walking Dead, Y: The Last Man, and Fables where I could simply by one series and follow the entire story. I'll occasionally grab some mainstream comic titles if it winds up being something by a writer that I enjoy, but even then I'll go for something that is an entertaining side story that only tangentially ties into the big storylines (like Paul Cornell's current adventures of Lex Luthor and his girl robot), or something like All Star Superman that is in its own continuity. The big crossover events have just gotten lame lately.
 
2011-04-09 2:44:27 PM  

exparrot: Superman, the last son of krypton, is dealing with 100,000 kryptonians


Yeah, pretty much everyone from New Krypton is now dead.
 
2011-04-09 2:59:12 PM  

Mad_Radhu:


I stopped being a regular comics reader because I could no longer afford keeping up with the storylines. I shifted over to just reading things like The Walking Dead, Y: The Last Man, and Fables where I could simply by one series and follow the entire story. I'll occasionally grab some mainstream comic titles if it winds up being something by a writer that I enjoy, but even then I'll go for something that is an entertaining side story that only tangentially ties into the big storylines (like Paul Cornell's current adventures of Lex Luthor and his girl robot), or something like All Star Superman that is in its own continuity. The big crossover events have just gotten lame lately.


This seems to be the opinion of every former comic book reader.

Unfortunately, the big two don't seem to want to listen to that. They keep listening to the zombies that buy everything, no matter what, and tell them that everything is fine. So the companies believe that more crossovers and more events will solve everything when all it does is drive away more and more readers.
 
2011-04-09 3:16:57 PM  

texdent: LAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAND!


I dont know what kind of thing this is.
more please.
 
2011-04-09 3:22:38 PM  

ronin7: texdent: LAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAND!

I dont know what kind of thing this is.
more please.


shiatty artist who swipes half of his art from stills of porn stars.

Oddly enough, Land wasn't the one who drew this...

i6.photobucket.comView Full Size
 
2011-04-09 3:43:52 PM  

exparrot: Infinite Crisis > 52 > countdown >one year later > seven soldiers > death of the new gods > final crisis

4 years of one massive stupid storyline that CHANGED EVERYTHING, AND EXPLAINED NOTHING.

That's why you lost me DC. I have no idea what the current DC multiverse is, or who's left to care about.

Batman is setting up franchises, Superman, the last son of krypton, is dealing with 100,000 kryptonians, Green Lantern did the zombie thing. And there are very few books that are aimed at pulling in the younger readers who these books should be for.
piss off the fanboys, ignore the youth market.

Great business plan.
/Is I mad?


Nailed it. I got a degree in comics (well, sequential art), so I'm personally invested in the media, but you know what? I still can't be assed to follow either anything in the stable of the big two because I know it will take me YEARS to untangle all the bullshiat on any given title. Give me quality self-contained stories like The Long Halloween that don't require reams of backstory, or give me a long-term finite arc like you see in Y or Fables, because I don't give a fark about this clone/pseudo-death/evil twin soap opera nonsense.
 
2011-04-09 3:50:18 PM  

FirstNationalBastard: ronin7: texdent: LAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAND!

I dont know what kind of thing this is.
more please.

shiatty artist who swipes half of his art from stills of porn stars.

Oddly enough, Land wasn't the one who drew this...


I am most amused.

As for the girl who is that supposed to be?
 
2011-04-09 3:57:32 PM  

Menjo_Bleeko: I've had a friend who owned a shop that got out of the comic business (kick, replies, etc) ..

The problem with comics and pricing isn't the shop owners. It's a company called Alliance. They're basically the sole distributor for comics - and other stuff too.

If you want to carry comics, you have to carry EVERY BOOK Alliance says you have to carry. Furthermore, you have to buy a certain number of books for each set - no negotiation. If they don't sell, well, tough shiat. You're out of luck.

Of course, your recourse in this is to not do business with Alliance. Sadly, they're the sole distributor for Yu-Gi-Oh! cards (yes, some people still buy that shiat), M-TG, Warmachine, Flames of War, Hordes, World of Warcraft cards, and others - and if you find another distributor, Alliance will sever their business contract with you and not send you any more product - and then start pressuring that other company to do the same.

Alliance sucks. It's the farking devil. It's the real reason comics are going to fail - monopolies are NEVER a good thing.


Ok.. the BS meter on this is pinging just a little bit. Ok.. it's pingig on it ALOT.

I'm the owner of a gaming store in Arizona that's been open for 13 years now, so let me tell you just a little bit about what's wrong with the the previous statement.

Alliance is not in the comics business. Diamond Distribution is. Alliance is owned by Diamond, and is their gaming distribution arm. They don't sell comics. Diamond does. I have an Alliance account, and have for 13 years now, and have not once yet had any sort of encounter or dealings with their parent company.

I won't comment on the "they make you buy X of this or that" when you're talking about comics, and honestly I have no idea about that. I don't sell comics, just gaming products. Your line that they are the exclusive distributor of most gaming products. Either your friend bold faced lied to you, or he was so ignorant that might have been why we went out of business.

MAgic the Gathering is available from most of the major Game distributors, of which there are still a few. Alliance's main competition is ACD distributing, and I get magic product from both Alliance, ADC, AND I order it directly from Wizards of the Coast.

Warmachine is WIDELY available from a plethora of distributors: Alliance, ACD, Warpath Games, and E-Figures. I order from all of these.

Yu Gi Oh is also available through ACD, and in fact I've had better luck getting it there than I have had wiht Alliance.

Flames of War is distributed by the company that produces it. A few of the gaming distributors have SMALL selections of the line, but if you want a good selection of Flames of War products, you have one choice : Get an account at Battlefront (the producers of that game)

World of Warcraft TCG is also available at both major distributors, Alliance and ACD.

In fact, there are VERY VERY few companies that Alliance is the exclusive distributor for. Days of wonder being the only on that immeditally comes to mind.


I've been doing business with Alliance for 13 years now and they have taken care of me quite handily in that time. I do enough sales that I am at the top of their discount tiers and sell over $300,000 in gaming products a year, about 25% of it purchased through them. (the rest being done through Games Workshop ((the vast majority)), Battlefront and other distributors)

I will agree that, for the COMICS industry, the situation that Diamond has engineered isn't healthy for the industry. But, saying that they are doing the same thing to gaming, is false and absolutely innacurate.
 
2011-04-09 3:59:30 PM  

KkrrRRZZZZ: I'm still reading some Green Lantern, Supergirl and Legion titles, Deadpool (yeah, I know), and a few others. However the increasing prices coupled with the slack writing and lame art has really killed the appeal of comics. How about writers, write a good story instead of trying to push some agenda that really has nothing to do with the book and try not to tell the same story, over and over and OVER AGAIN. Publishers, if the artist can only do lantern jaws and disproportionate anatomy, get someone with talent. The inker can only do so much.
I'm afraid the comic book business may be done, or at least over due for a major upheaval and overhaul.


Part of Marvel's problem is Joe Quesada. He and Alex Alonso essentially tossed out the good writers of "The Old Guard" to bring in a lot of young guys who can't hold the jocks of guys like Byrne, Starlin, Simonson, David, Busiek, etc. Yeah, they still can do some quality stuff, but most Marvel stuff is garbage.
 
2011-04-09 4:00:08 PM  

Wonderduck: rocky_howard: oldtaku:
Not to mention manga is in farking black and white and most of the artists use a very simple drawing style...

Try reading something other than Naruto sometime.


Honestly there is nothing wrong with Naruto, it just doesn't necessarily elevate it's self above the dozens of other similarly aimed titles out there, but like the man once said 90 percent of everything is crap. There is great Manga out there and there are even a few great super hero comics out now. Seriously Slott is blowing me away with the last few issues of The Amazing Spider-man. And outside of that genre you have things like fables, and Y: The last man that are awesome. But hell Willingham's and Brian K. Vaughan's super hero work is very good too. (Well I like it)


The paradigm that there are people who read manga and think american books are crap, and people who read american books and won't touch manga with a 10 foot pole is really outdated and old fashioned. There is so much cross pollination these days in both content, artwork and readership that it is a silly thing to hold on to. I do not know how many people got back into american comics because they were reading manga and vise versa, but it is a significant number.

In the end read what you like and try new stuff, don't be afraid of something based on what side of the pacific it comes from.
 
2011-04-09 4:14:17 PM  
whizbangthedirtfarmer:

That's the sad part. The guy in charge of the shop is really intelligent, and had the shop in recovery from the previous owner. He did all of these promotions; he even donates a lot of back issues to local middle and high schools. He's passionate about comics and he loves talking about them; he's even done some research in how to teach literacy skills with comics. Yet, the past few times I've gone in there, there sits the same four or five guys (sometimes on the floor), debating who drew some issue of an Archie comic fifteen years ago.

And the poor owner tries to ignore them. He's stuck. They are obviously his best customers (one guy appears to buy about thirty to forty comics PER WEEK), but he also knows that a lot of other customers are absolutely chased away by their presence. I feel sorry for him.

I know how it is, if I see a store with normal customers, I feel like it's a good store, if I see a store that seems like you need to have a members card to enter, that creeps me out.

Why doesn't he set up some chairs and a table in the back for those dudes to sit at, "as special customers", that way they both feel special, and get out of immediate sight.
 
2011-04-09 4:28:51 PM  
Man I used to go to Past, Present and Future when I lived in West Palm. I hope they survive, the guys there directed me to so many good comics and nerdy games.
 
2011-04-09 4:29:21 PM  

spawn73: whizbangthedirtfarmer:

That's the sad part. The guy in charge of the shop is really intelligent, and had the shop in recovery from the previous owner. He did all of these promotions; he even donates a lot of back issues to local middle and high schools. He's passionate about comics and he loves talking about them; he's even done some research in how to teach literacy skills with comics. Yet, the past few times I've gone in there, there sits the same four or five guys (sometimes on the floor), debating who drew some issue of an Archie comic fifteen years ago.

And the poor owner tries to ignore them. He's stuck. They are obviously his best customers (one guy appears to buy about thirty to forty comics PER WEEK), but he also knows that a lot of other customers are absolutely chased away by their presence. I feel sorry for him.

I know how it is, if I see a store with normal customers, I feel like it's a good store, if I see a store that seems like you need to have a members card to enter, that creeps me out.

Why doesn't he set up some chairs and a table in the back for those dudes to sit at, "as special customers", that way they both feel special, and get out of immediate sight.


There is no back of the store! The previous owner had the same problem, but was bleeding money because he was renting, essentially, two storefronts. The place was a lot cleaner, and the weirdos hung out in the back, mostly out of sight, but he couldn't make any money. The new owner simply had to choose between profits and back-loading the weirdos.
 
2011-04-09 4:43:10 PM  

ronin7: FirstNationalBastard: ronin7: texdent: LAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAND!

I dont know what kind of thing this is.
more please.

shiatty artist who swipes half of his art from stills of porn stars.

Oddly enough, Land wasn't the one who drew this...

I am most amused.

As for the girl who is that supposed to be?


I don't know for sure, but google "greg land swipes" for more.

Oh, and it might be a bit NSFW, since he likes swiping from porn.
 
2011-04-09 4:56:48 PM  
Why do manga characters have no noses? And shapeless moths And grotesquely oversized eyes?

/Creeps me the fark out.
 
2011-04-09 5:10:00 PM  
Are we assuming these companies want to keep publishing comics? Because their behavior makes me think otherwise. Most of the companies seem to just want to exploit the characters they have into other media and simply use the comics as a place to develop new characters and take old story lines from. Or at least that is what DC looks like now.

Diamond sucks too which doesn't help comic book stores.

Zenith: Many of stories are too adult orientated. My nephew was taken to FB the other week to get some and come out with none cos his parents were uncomfortable with the content. They need to tone it down.


The kids section with kids comics are in the front of the store. As for toning it down - it depends. I wish they were funner, but I don't really need more simplistic kid oriented stories. It would be fine if they split them off more. I really preferred stuff like Manhunter and Catwoman. I read Batman back when Jason Todd was showing up and I was a kid. I liked them. I'd like to see more Young Justice style comics that can be read by kids and grown-ups.

texdent: exparrot: Superman, the last son of krypton, is dealing with 100,000 kryptonians

Yeah, pretty much everyone from New Krypton is now dead.


Thank you Lex!


I read Red Robin, Superboy, and anything Young Avengers. Comics just...aren't that comic like now. I think the cancelled Blue Beetle [III] was the end of that. FNB is right, comic book companies are going to become the place you license characters from - I really think they want to go there. Comics would be better off without Marvel and DC. [Vertigo and the other companies DC owns should leave and pretend they never met DC before the horrible mainstream crap ruins the Vertigo connected lines.]

Batman and Robin was actually the last straw for me. When I hate Dick Grayson, I'm basically done. They're too much farking money. Even when the art is gorgeous, half the time the writing is just terrible or incoherent. Plus, whoever said that all comics from before 2000 should be on-line for free is right. There is stuff I want to catch up on but you can't find it anywhere.
 
2011-04-09 5:18:25 PM  

ethics-gradient: Why do manga characters have no noses? And shapeless moths And grotesquely oversized eyes?

/Creeps me the fark out.


Kinda the same reason some people can't spell "mouths" or use capitalization correctly. Lazyness!

Well, not quite, but close enough. Noses are VERY hard to get right. They come in so many shapes and sizes, only a few of which looks NICE when transferred to 2-d. Then you gotta realize that usually when an artist draws a line, they are representing the edge of a surface or the combining of two or more planes. In order to ACCURATELY portray a nose with just lines, you have to draw a LOT of lines, which then looks terrible on a simplified face with only a few other lines to represent everything else.

Eyes are use more as a graphical element. As the most important part of a face, they're given prominence, but a lot of artists take it too far, and sometimes they draw the eyes too far apart, leading to what some have called "Fish-eying". Some anime and manga avert this (most notably Akira). Where it gets bad is when an artist cops out and uses the SAME face for EVERYONE and distinguishes them with different hair and possibly accessories.
 
2011-04-09 5:24:22 PM  

Braindeath:


I read Red Robin, Superboy, and anything Young Avengers. Comics just...aren't that comic like now. I think the cancelled Blue Beetle [III] was the end of that. FNB is right, comic book companies are going to become the place you license characters from - I really think they want to go there. Comics would be better off without Marvel and DC. [Vertigo and the other companies DC owns should leave and pretend they never met DC before the horrible mainstream crap ruins the Vertigo connected lines.]



DC seems to be trying its best to kill Vertigo. There haven't been any major new titles in quite a while, and some contract bullshiat makes it more profitable for creators to go to somewhere like Image than to bring their original idea to Vertigo.

And that seems to be what has happened. Look at how many good, original books Image has put out in the last couple of years.

Also, I remember a creator who had a decently successful book through an indy publishing company very recently, thanked DC's editors for ignoring the book for so many years, because it became a hit when he published it through this indy company.

That's modern comics... no new ideas through the big two, plenty of good stuff that you have to search out comes from the indys.

The kids section with kids comics are in the front of the store. As for toning it down - it depends. I wish they were funner, but I don't really need more simplistic kid oriented stories. It would be fine if they split them off more. I really preferred stuff like Manhunter and Catwoman. I read Batman back when Jason Todd was showing up and I was a kid. I liked them. I'd like to see more Young Justice style comics that can be read by kids and grown-ups.



There's a good middle ground... before the 1980s, comics were able to be enjoyed by anyone from 6 to 96 if they wanted to read them. Claremont and Byrne's X-Men, for example... that wasn't simplistic or kid oriented, but it could be read and enjoyed by kids or adults.

I think mainstream superhero comics should be like a Pixar movie, or Doctor Who... written well and enjoyable by all audiences. But just because the main line is accessible to everyone doesn't mean we can't have Vertigo or Manhunter, too.
 
2011-04-09 5:37:52 PM  
FirstNationalBastard:

Also, I remember a creator who had a decently successful book through an indy publishing company very recently, thanked DC's editors for ignoring the book for so many years, because it became a hit when he published it through this indy company.


It was Chew.

I just remembered who it was...

The creator of Chew posted on a message board about how grateful he was that the seven Vertigo editors he pitched the book Chew to ignored him and blew him off, and that they did him the biggest favor of his life by doing so.
 
2011-04-09 5:47:08 PM  
Chew is great.
 
2011-04-09 6:05:14 PM  

missmarsha: Chew is great.


thanks for the comment earlier. kinda sad no one else saw that side of the industry as being the major contributor to brick and mortar shop death.
 
2011-04-09 6:15:46 PM  

FirstNationalBastard: MoronLessOff: FirstNationalBastard: They're doomed.

My local store just expanded, picked up The Goon Vol 6. It's by far the best comic I've ever read.

Was that Chinatown?

I've got that HC, but haven't gotten around to reading it yet.

In fact, I've got to re-read The Goon all the way through. It was a good book.


As a matter of fact, it was. I just finished it this afternoon. There's a full page with just the text, "This ain't funny". It's a fair warning, pretty sad story. I can't wait to get the next volume.
 
2011-04-09 6:29:22 PM  
i.imgur.comView Full Size
 
2011-04-09 6:36:53 PM  

The Flexecutioner: missmarsha: Chew is great.

thanks for the comment earlier. kinda sad no one else saw that side of the industry as being the major contributor to brick and mortar shop death.


Case in point: The diamond digital retailer model. LOL. Diamond is dead. Comics are not.
 
2011-04-09 6:38:02 PM  
I collected comics as a kid in the late 70s and early 80's. You guys have made some sharp comments which are very true. I also colelcted some baseball cards and I actually sold baseball cards for many years before changing into a wholesale licensed sports company. The "suits" killed the comic book and baseball card markets with many bad decisions. Pricing is a problem for sure. Now in sports cards they want monoploies like only Topps so they corner a much smaller market. With all the HUGE success of the comic book movies it is amazing that they havent been able to capture some additional business. Probably the new way of printing comics on the high quality paper cost more. I was in Japan a few months ago and comic stores were packed selling the manga books. They were buge books and very EXPENSIVE! Many were upwards of $20.00 US. I should also note that many of the comics/like the baseball cards of that generation may not even be worth the cover prices sold in those days. Ten year old comics may still be .50 each. Superman, Spiderman, the classic titles still sell. The comic stores try to sell a wide range of product. Also baseball cards have dried up due to the changes in the economy etc.
 
2011-04-09 6:51:13 PM  
StanTheMan:
spman: A 12-15 page comic now costs anywhere from $3.99 to $5.99, as much as a full length paperback or magazine, but with only enough actual text to fill a paragraph.

As an English teacher friend of mine says, comics are "books for illiterates."


Aside from my earlier comment, I'd like to point out that something like 90% of the Japanese people read manga -- which are essentially the same thing -- and that's hardly an illiterate society. Your teacher friend is pretty close-minded. The fact that most of what's produced is pretty bad is no reason to slam the medium as a whole. Most music recorded in the history since the invention of recording is crap, really, but that's no reason to say all music is bad. You can't judge orchestras (or Talking Heads, or Beatles) by Lady Gaga's output (well, you could, but it'd be damn stupid).
 
2011-04-09 7:34:59 PM  
While there are comics out there worth the price tag (despite the lies in this thread, many are thirty pages for four bucks) what's really hurting the stores is just pure dumb laziness. You can't have the place set-up like your stinky man-cave at home, that's just not going to cut it anymore.
 
2011-04-09 7:41:07 PM  
SunsetLament I could get 5-10 comics off the spinning rack at the grocery store check out line (or the drug store, or 7 eleven) for $5 and everyone was happy. I was happy. My mother was happy (I was reading!). That's a rare mother. I sell books second-hand at the flea market and the amount of parents who say 'Fifty cents? He's just going to tear it up' is sad.

And why the fark is the kid tearing up books? Spank him then!

And my favorite 'current creator is insane' story is Frank Miller. Yes, Miller. His alternate universe version of Black Canary killed a guy just for ogling her cleavage. Then Batman farked her. Yeah, that's healthy. Frank, get help. PLEASE get help.
 
2011-04-09 7:42:54 PM  
And the manga dept. of the industry isn't helping...if I see another new series of teenage girls flashing panties every three pages I'm going to punch everyone in the world.
 
2011-04-09 7:58:04 PM  

Lots43: While there are comics out there worth the price tag (despite the lies in this thread, many are thirty pages for four bucks) what's really hurting the stores is just pure dumb laziness. You can't have the place set-up like your stinky man-cave at home, that's just not going to cut it anymore.


No one's lying.

DC cut their books back to 20 story pages for 3 bucks.

Marvel is somewhere between $2.99 and $3.99 for 22 pages of story.
 
2011-04-09 8:22:38 PM  
Dog Welder: Part of Marvel's problem is Joe Quesada. He and Axel Alonso essentially tossed out the good writers of "The Old Guard" to bring in a lot of young guys who can't hold the jocks of guys like Byrne, Starlin, Simonson, David, Busiek, etc. Yeah, they still can do some quality stuff, but most Marvel stuff is garbage.

The only good thing Axel "Not The GNR One" Alonzo & "Cheesy" Quesadilla have done was putting Milligan & Allred on X-Force.

When word got out that Princess Diana was coming back from the dead to join the team, Joey Cheese and The Other Asshole Named Axel pussied out and made Milligan change the character. It's been downhill from there.
 
2011-04-09 8:25:33 PM  
I'm a huge nerd and I'm through with comics. After 'Blackest Night', it's become blatantly obvious that no one plans anymore.

Huge crossovers with 10,000 books, and they don't even print a checklist, so you have no idea how the fark to follow the story. Every comic seems to have 4 inkers, a good sign it's past deadline and slapped together. Plotlines are established and cast aside, it's completely incoherent. Not that there isn't good stuff coming out now and again, but I'll never buy the monthly stuff again. It's a trainwreck.
 
2011-04-09 8:40:26 PM  
So forgive me if this has been covered in a different comic book & store thread, but what sort of reaction do you think a store would get, if it simply stopped stocking Marvel & DC outside of Graphic Novels? I.E. you could buy the latest Hellboy or Chew, but the only Spiderman would be graphic novels? Obviously there would be the normal ancillary merchandise (shirts, toys, etc.) but no purchases (through diamond, I assume) of the latest crappy Punisher or X-Men?
 
2011-04-09 8:42:18 PM  

homerdrew415: So forgive me if this has been covered in a different comic book & store thread, but what sort of reaction do you think a store would get, if it simply stopped stocking Marvel & DC outside of Graphic Novels? I.E. you could buy the latest Hellboy or Chew, but the only Spiderman would be graphic novels? Obviously there would be the normal ancillary merchandise (shirts, toys, etc.) but no purchases (through diamond, I assume) of the latest crappy Punisher or X-Men?


Dead in a month.

Those shiatty comics are what pull people into a store. They're also the moneymakers.
 
2011-04-09 8:43:41 PM  

FirstNationalBastard:
the current Spider-Man books could be the best damn books ever written, but I'll never know.

And no, not because of Brand New Day. I got over that. I actually enjoyed the book for the first 60 or so issues after.

But the art on Spider-Man has become so farking bad that a page from the book isn't even fit to wipe your ass with.

They could hire a five year old with ADD who is on a sugar high to draw better comics than the people they have drawing Spider-Man right now. The art is that horrible.


I know what you're talking about; That was a short run of comics when they had Humberto Ramos and Paul Azaceta doing artwork (separately, not together), and they both suck ass.

They're currently bouncing around with artists. Marcos Martin gets a lot of work, and his art is OK (not great, but not Paul Azaceta, either). Carlos Cuevas has also been doing inking duties over Humberto Ramos' pencils, and that improves the artwork greatly.

This was the most recent issue:

1.bp.blogspot.comView Full Size


dadsbigplan.comView Full Size


3.bp.blogspot.comView Full Size


Not bad. Not perfect, but again, not Azaceta or Liefeld.
 
2011-04-09 9:49:29 PM  
I have an iPad, Comic Zeal, and a Demonoid account, so I'm really getting a kick out of these replies.

/People pay for this shiat? Really?
 
MIU
2011-04-09 10:07:18 PM  

spman: No shiat, I went to the local comic book shop for the first time in months a few weeks ago, how those places continue to stay in business is a mystery to me. A 12-15 page comic now costs anywhere from $3.99 to $5.99, as much as a full length paperback or magazine, but with only enough actual text to fill a paragraph.


This is probably the main reason I could never get into comics as a kid. Every now and then someone would give me some random comic. It would have either a short fragment of a much larger story I knew nothing about, or 2-3 small storylets that weren't terribly satisfying. The cost and trouble of actually reading one of the longer story arcs was something I wasn't interested in. I get that some people "collect" these things, but I didn't want to "collect".. I just wanted to read a damn story.

Years later, a few months before the first of the new x-men movies was coming out, I read through a bunch of x-men anthologies.. basically cheap, dense, book-newsprint versions of chunks of contiguous issues. THAT was immensely enjoyable. I'd read more of those.
 
MIU
2011-04-09 10:10:20 PM  

spman: From what I hear from people I know in that business, the only thing keeping most comic book shops open anymore is the TCG business, which remains lucrative enough to keep the ship afloat. Once the market for that bottoms out however, indy comic shops are going to go the way of mom and pop video stores.


I get the impression that it's been like that for a while. In the town I grew up in, there were a pair of "comic shops", which also sold fantasy and sci-fi crap, pen and paper RPGs, all that stuff. When Magic: the gathering started getting big, they were the first to host tournaments. They were for a good while the only places you could buy that stuff, and it was booming, so they were increasingly reliant on it for income.

A few years after I left for university (still early in the M:TG lifetime), they closed. Other places were selling the cards, now, it had grown beyond their niche. There wasn't enough of their old business to keep them afloat.
 
MIU
2011-04-09 10:13:02 PM  

itazurakko: This is what always boggled my mind. I mean, Japanese comics are a few bucks a pop for either (1) a 200+ page ish collection of a few months of content, OR (2) a weekly phone book sized thing that has the equivalent of 20+ strips EACH running their 12-15 page installment in it.

And I thought THAT was expensive. (Particularly if you want to consume it from half a world away in the US it IS expensive - read real books they're a better time value for the money.)


In japan, the thing to do is go to pay-by-the-hour library-ish "cafes" to read them. Many of them are also internet/gaming places as well.
 
2011-04-09 11:18:43 PM  
The comic book shops in my area stay alive by holding annual conventions. One little place in particular makes bank every year by holding a Sci-Fi convention, and usually lands some big names. About every 5th year they get the Shatner himself.

Tickets to the event are upwards of $30 now, and that doesn't buy you Shatner's autograph (that's another $70 with photo included).

Other shops hold anime conventions. The store is just a front for those big annual paydays, and with them, comic book shops can, for now, survive.
 
2011-04-10 12:08:16 AM  

Menjo_Bleeko: I've had a friend who owned a shop that got out of the comic business (kick, replies, etc) ..

The problem with comics and pricing isn't the shop owners. It's a company called Alliance. They're basically the sole distributor for comics - and other stuff too.

If you want to carry comics, you have to carry EVERY BOOK Alliance says you have to carry. Furthermore, you have to buy a certain number of books for each set - no negotiation. If they don't sell, well, tough shiat. You're out of luck.

If you only want to carry DC - tough shiat. Alliance won't allow that. You want comics, you want everything Alliance says you want. That adds up to close to $5000 a month to Alliance which you can't negotiate about. Good luck trying to sell all those books.

Furthermore, Alliance also charges the comic shops close to cover price for those books. A comic costs $4.99? You're going to be charged about $3.00 for the book.

Of course, your recourse in this is to not do business with Alliance. Sadly, they're the sole distributor for Yu-Gi-Oh! cards (yes, some people still buy that shiat), M-TG, Warmachine, Flames of War, Hordes, World of Warcraft cards, and others - and if you find another distributor, Alliance will sever their business contract with you and not send you any more product - and then start pressuring that other company to do the same.

Alliance sucks. It's the farking devil. It's the real reason comics are going to fail - monopolies are NEVER a good thing.


There is so much that is wrong about your post.
 
2011-04-10 12:15:12 AM  

Decados: Menjo_Bleeko: I've had a friend who owned a shop that got out of the comic business (kick, replies, etc) ..

The problem with comics and pricing isn't the shop owners. It's a company called Alliance. They're basically the sole distributor for comics - and other stuff too.

If you want to carry comics, you have to carry EVERY BOOK Alliance says you have to carry. Furthermore, you have to buy a certain number of books for each set - no negotiation. If they don't sell, well, tough shiat. You're out of luck.

Of course, your recourse in this is to not do business with Alliance. Sadly, they're the sole distributor for Yu-Gi-Oh! cards (yes, some people still buy that shiat), M-TG, Warmachine, Flames of War, Hordes, World of Warcraft cards, and others - and if you find another distributor, Alliance will sever their business contract with you and not send you any more product - and then start pressuring that other company to do the same.

Alliance sucks. It's the farking devil. It's the real reason comics are going to fail - monopolies are NEVER a good thing.

Ok.. the BS meter on this is pinging just a little bit. Ok.. it's pingig on it ALOT.

I'm the owner of a gaming store in Arizona that's been open for 13 years now, so let me tell you just a little bit about what's wrong with the the previous statement.

Alliance is not in the comics business. Diamond Distribution is. Alliance is owned by Diamond, and is their gaming distribution arm. They don't sell comics. Diamond does. I have an Alliance account, and have for 13 years now, and have not once yet had any sort of encounter or dealings with their parent company.

I won't comment on the "they make you buy X of this or that" when you're talking about comics, and honestly I have no idea about that. I don't sell comics, just gaming products. Your line that they are the exclusive distributor of most gaming products. Either your friend bold faced lied to you, or he was so ignorant that might have been why we went out of business.

MAgic the Gathering is available from most of the major Game distributors, of which there are still a few. Alliance's main competition is ACD distributing, and I get magic product from both Alliance, ADC, AND I order it directly from Wizards of the Coast.

Warmachine is WIDELY available from a plethora of distributors: Alliance, ACD, Warpath Games, and E-Figures. I order from all of these.

Yu Gi Oh is also available through ACD, and in fact I've had better luck getting it there than I have had wiht Alliance.

Flames of War is distributed by the company that produces it. A few of the gaming distributors have SMALL selections of the line, but if you want a good selection of Flames of War products, you have one choice : Get an account at Battlefront (the producers of that game)

World of Warcraft TCG is also available at both major distributors, Alliance and ACD.

In fact, there are VERY VERY few companies that Alliance is the exclusive distributor for. Days of wonder being the only on that immeditally comes to mind.


I've been doing business with Alliance for 13 years now and they have taken care of me quite handily in that time. I do enough sales that I am at the top of their discount tiers and sell over $300,000 in gaming products a year, about 25% of it purchased through them. (the rest being done through Games Workshop ((the vast majority)), Battlefront and other distributors)

I will agree that, for the COMICS industry, the situation that Diamond has engineered isn't healthy for the industry. But, saying that they are doing the same thing to gaming, is false and absolutely innacurate.


Haha. It's funny who you find on fark :)

/your wotc rep
//really
 
2011-04-10 12:56:37 AM  
I bought issues 1-3 of Dungeons and Dragons (pops) from IDW publishing and was quite impressed. But it's still expensive and very much a collectible / specialty item.
 
2011-04-10 3:10:59 AM  
All that being said, I miss Megacon. :(

My first comic/anime/fantasy con. Rooms and rooms full of tables of stuff.

Good times.
 
2011-04-10 4:55:12 AM  
Doesn't help that the Big Cheese Boss at Marvel Comics is obsessed with Spider-Man being a giant loser with no girlfriend who lives in his aunt's basement.
 
2011-04-10 6:13:20 AM  

dewihafta: All that being said, I miss Megacon. :(

My first comic/anime/fantasy con. Rooms and rooms full of tables of stuff.

Good times.


I havent been to Megacom since around 2001. I wanted to go this year, but couldnt find someone to watch our youngest kid for a day or two. Since there is no way Im hauling an 18 month old around a con, we skipped it.
 
2011-04-10 9:25:09 AM  

Sultan Of Herf: dewihafta: All that being said, I miss Megacon. :(

My first comic/anime/fantasy con. Rooms and rooms full of tables of stuff.

Good times.

I havent been to Megacom since around 2001. I wanted to go this year, but couldnt find someone to watch our youngest kid for a day or two. Since there is no way Im hauling an 18 month old around a con, we skipped it.


Megacon is my favourite con. Tons of stuff to do in Orlando, the con staff are awesome and they make extra wide aisles so traffic moves. The theme parks make for great cosplay, and it's easy to make a family trip out of it. Yay megacon! If you haven't gone, go next year. I'll be there.
 
2011-04-10 9:52:33 AM  

Browncoat: I have an iPad, Comic Zeal, and a Demonoid account, so I'm really getting a kick out of these replies.

/People pay for this shiat? Really?


I used to know people who would collect record albums. They kept the records and the album covers in immaculate condition. Those folks still exist, I'm sure, but I don't know any now. And there are certainly no new ones to replace the old.

Slowly but surely, the collectibility of comic book art is dying out.

Record stores are going away, bookstores aren't too far behind...

Isn't one key issue the slow stranglehold by the distributor(s) who hold the note on loans to some comic book shops? I know it used to be a problem. They can't foreclose, they don't want to take over, and they have to keep fronting money. Comic book shops that don't owe a significant amount to their distributor I'd consider as thriving.
 
2011-04-10 9:52:54 AM  

FirstNationalBastard: There haven't been any major new titles in quite a while, and some contract bullshiat makes it more profitable for creators to go to somewhere like Image than to bring their original idea to Vertigo.


I was wondering why more new stuff is coming up at Image lately.

FirstNationalBastard: The creator of Chew posted on a message board about how grateful he was that the seven Vertigo editors he pitched the book Chew to ignored him and blew him off, and that they did him the biggest favor of his life by doing so.


Good. I hate it when those guys keep their mouths shut about crap. I know it's their former employer and they're trying to be professional - but I want to know what happened with say, Rucka, since we finally worked out about Dixon.

Also: The copy of Herosquared I ordered finally came and I should have it next week or so. Thanks again for that. I ordered Blue Estate too.

FirstNationalBastard: I think mainstream superhero comics should be like a Pixar movie, or Doctor Who... written well and enjoyable by all audiences. But just because the main line is accessible to everyone doesn't mean we can't have Vertigo or Manhunter, too.


That's fair. I wouldn't mind that.
 
2011-04-10 11:11:32 AM  

Wonderduck: rocky_howard: oldtaku:
Not to mention manga is in farking black and white and most of the artists use a very simple drawing style...

Try reading something other than Naruto sometime.


Yeah you see...

1.- I don't read Naruto. Why would I read Naruto when I'm complaining about that very same thing?

2.- You seem to have problems with the word MOST. It's not the same as ALL.

3.- LOL, why are you posting POSTERS as opposed to ACTUAL panels from the manga?

4.- Um...that's supposed to be "very detailed"? You'd crap your pants at what Travis Charest, Brian Bolland or Bryan Hitch can do. You should read something by Kenichi Sonoda, Masamune Shirow, Masakazu Katsura or Kentaro Miura instead of some magical girl crap.
 
2011-04-10 2:27:06 PM  

Lots43: Doesn't help that the Big Cheese Boss at Marvel Comics is obsessed with Spider-Man being a giant loser with no girlfriend who lives in his aunt's basement.


More like living on his own now, with a girlfriend who is essentially Quesada's daughter.
 
2011-04-10 3:03:47 PM  
missmarsha: Megacon is my favourite con. Tons of stuff to do in Orlando, the con staff are awesome and they make extra wide aisles so traffic moves. The theme parks make for great cosplay, and it's easy to make a family trip out of it. Yay megacon! If you haven't gone, go next year. I'll be there.

I went to MegaCon in 05 and 07 with my best friend. Since then, he's been stationed in Japan with the Army, so going by myself would suck (my other friends aren't into comics).

I'd love to go next year if any fellow FARK nerds were willing to give me a ride there (I'll pay for the gas). We can split the cost of a hotel room, if you don't have a nearby place to crash.
 
2011-04-10 3:29:52 PM  

rocky_howard: Wonderduck: rocky_howard: oldtaku:
Not to mention manga is in farking black and white and most of the artists use a very simple drawing style...

Try reading something other than Naruto sometime.

Yeah you see...

1.- I don't read Naruto. Why would I read Naruto when I'm complaining about that very same thing?

2.- You seem to have problems with the word MOST. It's not the same as ALL.

3.- LOL, why are you posting POSTERS as opposed to ACTUAL panels from the manga?

4.- Um...that's supposed to be "very detailed"? You'd crap your pants at what Travis Charest, Brian Bolland or Bryan Hitch can do. You should read something by Kenichi Sonoda, Masamune Shirow, Masakazu Katsura or Kentaro Miura instead of some magical girl crap.


Not a contest. Relax, have a brew.
 
2011-04-10 8:58:57 PM  
texdent
Lots43: Doesn't help that the Big Cheese Boss at Marvel Comics is obsessed with Spider-Man being a giant loser with no girlfriend who lives in his aunt's basement.

More like living on his own now, with a girlfriend who is essentially Quesada's daughter.


Oh dear god, I've repressed that. One of the many dingbats Peter has been associated has had a drunken fling with him neither remember then was raped by the Chameleon who disguised himself as Peter. If -this- is the idiot that is supposed to be Joe's kid, then we now have a candidate for most insane comic book personality of all time (the current one is Frank Miller).

You know what?

Fark it. Joe's kid or not, letting the the 'let's rape her for the lolz' and allowing Porno Mag Tracer Greg Land to have work gives Joe the win.
 
2011-04-11 10:59:10 AM  

FirstNationalBastard: It's all a bunch of pointless crossovers and fanboys turned pros jerking off onto a page, shiatting on the page, then wiping their ass with it and shiatting on it again and calling it the best story ever when in reality the books are lamer and worse than the average fanfic. .


You started off good, but this line was over the top.

2/10 for effort, I'm sure someone else quoted you.

Now fetch me some cheetos
 
2011-04-11 12:03:24 PM  

ZeroCorpse:
Not bad. Not perfect, but again, not Azaceta or Liefeld.


Rob "pockets and crazy tits" Liefeld?

The guy couldn't draw correct anatomy if his career depended on it(thankfully it doesn't).
 
2011-04-11 11:31:08 PM  

FirstNationalBastard: They're doomed.

The recession has made comic sales drop hard. See, loss of money and fear of if they're going to have a paycheck each week has made people start to look at what they're buying, and they have realized that most all of the mainstream superhero comics that dominate the market are complete and utter shiat. It's all a bunch of pointless crossovers and fanboys turned pros jerking off onto a page, shiatting on the page, then wiping their ass with it and shiatting on it again and calling it the best story ever when in reality the books are lamer and worse than the average fanfic. And the shiat the big two have done to their characters and books has nearly killed comics.



Done in one.

"Hey, let's cut off Aquaman's hand again! And then kill him again! And then bring him back to life. Again! With a (slightly) different costume. The fan-tards will eat-it-up!"
 
2011-04-11 11:49:33 PM  

texdent: exparrot: Superman, the last son of krypton, is dealing with 100,000 kryptonians

Yeah, pretty much everyone from New Krypton is now dead.


Also equally ridiculous.

/Nerd-rage-rising.
 
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  2. When community members submit a link, they also write a custom headline for the story.

  3. Other Farkers comment on the links. This is the number of comments. Click here to read them.

  4. Click here to submit a link.