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(Chron)   Christians upset that spring holiday is all about eggs and the Easter Bunny, no longer about celebrating the resurrection of Santa Claus   ( chron.com) divider line
    More: Obvious, resurrection, National Retail Federation, Rice University, Shroud of Turin, History Channel, New Testament, Easter, salvation  
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3468 clicks; posted to Main » on 03 Apr 2010 at 10:28 AM (8 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



169 Comments     (+0 »)
 
 
2010-04-03 09:19:16 AM  
Time out.

These same people used to biatch and moan about how Santa and commercialism had taken away the "true meaning" of Christmas (which was a valid point). Then they suddenly started complaining about how everything was part of a War on Christmas™, and that if we used the word "holiday" and didn't run up debt buying presents, Supply-Side Jesus was going to send us to hell.

We need a good word for the Easter/Passover timeframe akin to "holidays" that means nothing more than pissing off the fundies.
 
2010-04-03 09:37:53 AM  
The frigging Romans ruined all the good holidays when they invented Catholicism. Fark them.
 
2010-04-03 09:48:46 AM  
We need goat leggings and a virgin to make things right again.
 
2010-04-03 10:16:14 AM  
saw the Santa Claus reference, leaving this link for spare reading.

you all have a great weekend

Link
 
2010-04-03 10:20:08 AM  
Kids eat chocolate eggs because the color of the chocolate...and the color of
the wood on the cross... Well, you tell me? It's got nothing to do with it, has it? People are going, "Remember kids, Jesus died for your sins." "Yeah, I know, it's great." "No, it's bad!" "It's bad. lt's terrible. Whatever you want. Just keep giving me these eggs." And the bunny rabbits, where do
they come into the Crucifixion? There were no rabbits going, "You putting crosses in our warrens? We live below this hill, all right?" Bunny rabbits are for shagging, eggs are for fertility.
 
2010-04-03 10:23:17 AM  
John 10.37 "If I do not do the works of My Father, do not believe Me; 38 but if I do them, though you do not believe Me, believe the works, that you may know and understand that the Father is in Me, and I in the Father."

John 14.6 Jesus said to him, "I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father, but through Me."

Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. ~ Philip Dick
 
2010-04-03 10:30:33 AM  
It's because Jesus only likes black people.
 
2010-04-03 10:30:46 AM  
Sanctum Peter Cotium
Deus ri hunnam
hippitus hoppitus rex domine
 
2010-04-03 10:33:01 AM  
As if most people even understand the meaning behind their religions in the first place...
 
2010-04-03 10:33:14 AM  

Bevets: Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. ~ Philip Dick


Oh the irony.
 
2010-04-03 10:34:11 AM  
South Park explained the connection in a clear, logical manner.
 
2010-04-03 10:34:37 AM  
Atheism is a Religion.
 
2010-04-03 10:34:42 AM  
i184.photobucket.comView Full Size
 
2010-04-03 10:34:51 AM  
Well, guys, if we wanna reclaim these holidays as a time of religious reflection. We need to act like it. Which I think at this time and place means...

*End the Santa Claus and presents tradition.
*End the Easter Bunny and egg hunt tradition.

Then for us it's strictly a time of reflection and feasting. Let the heathens have their co-opted holiday/pissup.
 
2010-04-03 10:34:58 AM  

jehovahs witness protection: We need goat leggings and a virgin to make things right again.


insidesocal.comView Full Size


/where the fark do we find goat leggings?
 
2010-04-03 10:36:05 AM  

UNC_Samurai: We need a good word for the Easter/Passover timeframe akin to "holidays" that means nothing more than pissing off the fundies.


Fictional Jesus Birthday?
 
2010-04-03 10:37:21 AM  

Efferus X: As if most people even understand the meaning behind their religions in the first place...


Please don't use the words understand and religion in the same sentence. It makes Baby Jesus Cry.

/Reason is the Devil's Ass Trumpet.
 
2010-04-03 10:37:35 AM  

Bevets: Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. ~ Philip Dick


Don't stop believing, Hold on to that feeling, Streetlight people ~ Journey
 
2010-04-03 10:37:49 AM  

CravenMorehead: Bevets: Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. ~ Philip Dick

Oh the irony.


I saw the quote first, kept scrolling and only realized that Bevets had written it from your post. Did the irony meter just asplode?
 
2010-04-03 10:38:26 AM  
"...they celebrate Easter the same way we do. Commemorating the death and resurrection of Jesus, by telling our children, a Giant BUNNY RABBIT......left chocolate eggs in the night. Now,...I wonder why we're f**ked up as a race. Anybody? Anybody got any clues out there, or...? Where do you get this shiat from, you know? Why those two things, you know?

Why not goldfish left Lincoln logs in your sock drawer, you know? Long as we're makin' shiat up, go hog wild, you know? At least a goldfish with a Lincoln log on it's back goin' across your floor to your sock drawer has a miraculous connotation to it.

Childlike voice: Mummy, I woke up today and there was a Lincoln log in me sock drawer!...that's the story of Jesus."


BILL HICKS
 
2010-04-03 10:39:43 AM  
This bullshiat needs to stop. Now.

Yeah, yeah, I get, we're running out of christians because the eeeeevil socialists want to destroy us. Just like the eeeeevil pagans wanted to destroy us, the eeeeevil jews wanted to destroy us, and the eeeevil muslims wanted to destroy us. Honestly, this is bullshiat. So what if our most sacred Holiday (more important than Christmas, by the way) shares the calendar with a pagan holiday? Wouldn't the logical thing would be trade a bit of their mead with our wine, and let us all be merry?.

We just surpassed the Middle Ages, we already know more than before, so we shouldn't really keep this knee-jerk reaction to the pagans. Who are you expecting to roll in to defend you from the eeeevil pagans, the Spanish Inquisition?.

/Catholic
 
2010-04-03 10:40:20 AM  
CHOCOLATE
i132.photobucket.comView Full Size
 
2010-04-03 10:40:42 AM  
Came for Bill Hicks.

Leaving satisfied - with a gift.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aHdEr_EL2yU
 
2010-04-03 10:40:47 AM  
Oh that's why i don't believe in zombie jesus. Jesus is 'challenging' and makes me 'uncomfortable'. All this time I thought my hangup was my desire for 'facts' and 'evidence'.
 
2010-04-03 10:41:25 AM  
christians need to stfu, they nicked the idea for easter from a pagan fertility festival anyway. hence the rabbit and the egg, symbols of fertility. im pretty sure.
 
2010-04-03 10:42:04 AM  
They need a better marketing department.
 
2010-04-03 10:42:09 AM  
From Wikipedia:

The modern English term Easter is speculated to have developed from Old English word Ēastre or Ēostre or Eoaster, which itself developed prior to 899. The name refers to Eostur-monath, a month of the Germanic calendar attested by Bede as named after the goddess Ēostre of Anglo-Saxon paganism.[15] Bede notes that Eostur-monath was the equivalent to the month of April, and that feasts held in her honor during Ēostur-monath had died out by the time of his writing, replaced with the Christian custom of Easter.[16] Using comparative linguistic evidence from continental Germanic sources, the 19th century scholar Jacob Grimm proposed the existence of an equivalent form of Eostre among the pre-Christian beliefs of the continental Germanic peoples, whose name he reconstructed as Ostara.

The implications of the goddess have resulted in theories about whether or not Eostre is an invention of Bede, theories connecting Eostre with records of Germanic folk custom (including hares and eggs), and as cultural descendant of the Proto-Indo-European goddess of the dawn through the etymology of her name. Grimm's reconstructed Ostara has had some influence in modern popular culture. Modern German has Ostern, but otherwise, Germanic languages have generally borrowed the form pascha, see below.


Keep the Ēostre in Easter!
 
2010-04-03 10:42:49 AM  
I am disappointed that I couldn't have my annual "Jesus is Dead" party today due to family obligations.
/Wait, what are talking about?
 
2010-04-03 10:42:54 AM  
We never believed in santa claus b/c we were always told throughout the year how much mommy and daddy had to work to buy the toys that we got on christmas...So we focused more on the religious side of it. I think maybe we coddle kids waaay too much in american society. This whole notion that if you tell kids what really happens that will shatter their innocence for ever!!!!
 
2010-04-03 10:44:13 AM  

UNC_Samurai: We need a good word for the Easter/Passover timeframe akin to "holidays" that means nothing more than pissing off the fundies.


How about "Spring Break"?
 
2010-04-03 10:44:16 AM  
Holidays evolve. Get over it.

You're free to celebrate it in whichever way you like.
 
2010-04-03 10:45:39 AM  
Sanctum Piter oteum, Deus ore uneum.
Hippitus hoppitus reus homine.
In suspiratoreum, lepus in re sanctum.
Hippitus hoppitus Deus Domine.
 
2010-04-03 10:45:56 AM  
No, no, no! You SHOOT the zombie, you don't WORSHIP it!

When the zombie apocalypse hits, the most well-armed segment of the populace (redneck gun nuts) will be the least willing to kick zombie ass. So I damn well WILL pry your guns from your cold, dead hands... fully loaded.
 
2010-04-03 10:46:42 AM  
it should always be about going to the department store and buying those special outfits for you and the little one for easter sunday. dressing up your precious snowflakes and showing them off is the true meaning of easter.
damn i hated easter sunday and that clear gel dad combed into my hair that turned rock hard.
 
2010-04-03 10:47:23 AM  

StoneColdAtheist: UNC_Samurai: We need a good word for the Easter/Passover timeframe akin to "holidays" that means nothing more than pissing off the fundies.

How about "Spring Break"?


WOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
 
2010-04-03 10:47:34 AM  
I fully support divesting Jesus' resurrection from other Easter traditions. Then the Christians can have their church services and we heathens can bring back Easter orgies.
 
2010-04-03 10:47:50 AM  
Bevets: Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. ~ Philip Dick

Like evolution.

Because none of us has ever seen anyone rise after being dead for days.
 
2010-04-03 10:48:11 AM  
Jesus and his apostles observed Passover.

Not 'easter'.
 
2010-04-03 10:48:11 AM  

Miss Smartass: CHOCOLATE


+1
 
2010-04-03 10:50:39 AM  

Miss Smartass: CHOCOLATE


damn you for getting that stuck in my head


+1
 
2010-04-03 10:50:41 AM  
Easter is just another word for Nature worship you televangelical fundie biatches!!

 
2010-04-03 10:51:01 AM  
img251.imageshack.usView Full Size
 
2010-04-03 10:52:16 AM  
Best part about this time of year? Reese's Eggs. Much more peanut butter than a more Reeses... so tasty.
 
2010-04-03 10:53:45 AM  
I thought easter had to do with the old spring/nature goddess? Was that wrong? I thought the Christians just usurped the name and tacked the resurrection thing on at the end? I guess that means that modern society is usurping it from the Christians and that our new god is a Chocolate Bunny.

/All praise to the Chocolate Bunny
 
2010-04-03 10:54:10 AM  

ptelg: Well, guys, if we wanna reclaim these holidays as a time of religious reflection. We need to act like it. Which I think at this time and place means...

*End the Santa Claus and presents tradition.
*End the Easter Bunny and egg hunt tradition.

Then for us it's strictly a time of reflection and feasting. Let the heathens have their co-opted holiday/pissup.


The Santa Claus and presents traditions is, directly and completely, part of the Feast Day of Saint Nicholas. It's entirely Christian in origin.

If you don't know that, and you call yourself a Christian, you should question why the hell you claim to belong to a faith you're highly ignorant of.

As for Easter, bunnies laying chocolate eggs makes more sense than the internally-hypocritical torture porn of the Crucifixion and Resurrection. If Jesus is the Son and thus part of the Trinity, then God sacrificed Himself to save us from the sin He gave us. Oh, except He didn't actually sacrifice anything, because Jesus resurrected; he just had a three day respawn timer.

So, the important part of the story must be the torture. The death was irrelevant; God just brought Him back to life. I guess this is where the idea of self-flagellation started, since that's all the Crucifixion amounts to.

Frankly, I'd rather think about chocolate bunnies than an omnipotent entity that can't think of any better way to do things than to go emo and start cutting himself because he can't stop hurting other people.
 
2010-04-03 10:54:37 AM  
I thought it was when Jesus comes out of his hole and he sees his own shadow, which means we have six more weeks of spring.
 
2010-04-03 10:55:29 AM  

jehovahs witness protection: We need goat leggings and a virgin to make things right again.


Connie Swale?
 
2010-04-03 10:56:03 AM  
ZOMBIE JESUS DAY!!
 
2010-04-03 10:56:28 AM  
Who let bevets in here?
 
2010-04-03 11:01:06 AM  

Omnivorous: Bevets: Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. ~ Philip Dick

Like evolution.

Because none of us has ever seen anyone rise after being dead for days.


Does bloating count?
 
2010-04-03 11:02:11 AM  
Step 1: Adopt aboriginal beliefs to help sell your line of shiat to indigenous people conquered by whichever kingdom you happen to be puppeteering this century.

Step 2: Wait a few generations, then complain that these beliefs conflict with the pure teachings of your line of shiat.

Step 3: Profit!

/figured out step 2!
 
2010-04-03 11:02:21 AM  

mudesi: Who let bevets in here?


My fault.

/He asked nicely
 
2010-04-03 11:03:44 AM  
With teh global warming, I think easter will become a holiday like Memorial Day, where everybody gets together around the grill.
 
2010-04-03 11:07:46 AM  

LasssiterBeRight: Jesus and his apostles observed Passover.

Not 'easter'.


Dude, that's what I said. Wouldn't being "Christlike" mean converting to Judaism? Or at least observing the same holidays?

I've explained to anyone who gives me the bullshiat excuse "I gave it up for Lent" that God is so totally honored that you deigned to stop drinking Mountain Dew for a month and a half in His name.

If you want to go on a diet, please, be my guest. I like nothing more than people trying to make themselves happier and healthier. But don't even front like you are doing it for anything other than selfish purposes. None of them think "Oh man I'll be so spiritually fulfilled if I don't eat that Cadbury's egg."
 
2010-04-03 11:09:02 AM  
Pfft. People waste energy over subjects like this? I just can't bring myself to care. Our family celebrates our way, and I don't care how my neighbors celebrate. None of my business.

Carry on. =)
 
2010-04-03 11:09:55 AM  

Min5trel: I am disappointed that I couldn't have my annual "Jesus is Dead" party today due to family obligations.
/Wait, what are talking about?


I believe we're talking about Easter Sunday. If I'm right this is the day when the Jews cooked bread on their backs because a little guy flung a rock at a giant guy so they then put ashes that came from a burning bush, that spoke, on their head to ward off the evil spirits that were coming to take their first born, but not if if they killed a chicken or something and put its blood over their fire pit that they never used to cook bacon because they couldn't figure out that pig tastes good?


/bacon
 
2010-04-03 11:11:03 AM  
 
2010-04-03 11:12:26 AM  
 
2010-04-03 11:12:33 AM  
I am so mad at organized religion for not being open to other's beliefs that I am going to be completely close-minded to anything they believe in. Further I will actively attack all their beliefs in an attempt to make them see the error of their ways. Ridicule. Malevolence. Insensitivity. These are the tools I will use.
 
2010-04-03 11:14:03 AM  
3 words:

Zombie Awareness Day

It's a holiday aimed at raising awareness and preparedness against the coming Zombie Apocalypse using one of the few recorded cases of Zombification.

Jesus was a Zombie, a slow-burn as it were. Took him three days to rise from the grave and go looking for his last supper.

A supper of BRRAAAIIINNNNNSSSS!
 
2010-04-03 11:14:59 AM  
i.imgur.comView Full Size
 
2010-04-03 11:16:12 AM  

letrole: Atheism is a Religion.


Opening with the same old Fool's Mate gets predictable after a while, you douche.
 
2010-04-03 11:16:14 AM  
Oh religion threads on Fark, a place for all the 13 year old /b/tards to come together all saying the same stupid trolling comments.


Welcome to Farkchan.
 
2010-04-03 11:18:12 AM  
Kar98

This is why we can't have nice things.
 
2010-04-03 11:19:09 AM  
This is for all those silly "gawd botherers"
img62.imageshack.usView Full Size

Happy Vernal Equinox!
 
2010-04-03 11:19:45 AM  

Mr.Hawk: Min5trel: I am disappointed that I couldn't have my annual "Jesus is Dead" party today due to family obligations.
/Wait, what are talking about?

I believe we're talking about Easter Sunday. If I'm right this is the day when the Jews cooked bread on their backs because a little guy flung a rock at a giant guy so they then put ashes that came from a burning bush, that spoke, on their head to ward off the evil spirits that were coming to take their first born, but not if if they killed a chicken or something and put its blood over their fire pit that they never used to cook bacon because they couldn't figure out that pig tastes good?


/bacon


Thanks for clearing that up!
/Christians believe some damn funny things.
//Mmm, bacon.
 
2010-04-03 11:22:19 AM  
If it weren't for the Jews, we wouldn't have Easter.
 
2010-04-03 11:22:31 AM  

Min5trel: Mr.Hawk: Min5trel: I am disappointed that I couldn't have my annual "Jesus is Dead" party today due to family obligations.
/Wait, what are talking about?

I believe we're talking about Easter Sunday. If I'm right this is the day when the Jews cooked bread on their backs because a little guy flung a rock at a giant guy so they then put ashes that came from a burning bush, that spoke, on their head to ward off the evil spirits that were coming to take their first born, but not if if they killed a chicken or something and put its blood over their fire pit that they never used to cook bacon because they couldn't figure out that pig tastes good?


/bacon

Thanks for clearing that up!
/Christians believe some damn funny things.
//Mmm, bacon.


Passover is a Jewish holiday not celebrated by Christians unless they are messianic Christians.

/TMYK
 
2010-04-03 11:32:02 AM  

studebaker hoch: If it weren't for the Jews, we wouldn't have Easter.


Sorry to disappoint, but Easter (in its various forms) is older than Jews.

Sorry.
 
2010-04-03 11:33:13 AM  
Bevets:

John 14.6 Jesus said to him, "I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father, but through Me."

John 10.37 "If I do not do the works of My Father, do not believe Me; 38 but if I do them, though you do not believe Me, believe the works, that you may know and understand that the Father is in Me, and I in the Father."

Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. ~ Philip Dick


felixecho:

Pfft. People waste energy over subjects like this? I just can't bring myself to care. Our family celebrates our way, and I don't care how my neighbors celebrate. None of my business.

Please keep your opinions to yourself.

Studson:

I am so mad at organized religion for not being open to other's beliefs that I am going to be completely close-minded to anything they believe in. Further I will actively attack all their beliefs in an attempt to make them see the error of their ways. Ridicule. Malevolence. Insensitivity. These are the tools I will use.

You sound like a dork :)
 
2010-04-03 11:34:29 AM  
i2.photobucket.comView Full Size


The confluence of the stars is complete.

"Legomorpha! Pentalagus! Leporidae! Oryctolagus! Heed My Summons! Pikka Pikka Lepus Pooka!"

The choice is made. The traveler comes!"
 
2010-04-03 11:35:55 AM  

studebaker hoch: If it weren't for the Jews, we wouldn't have Easter.


Yeah we would. It used to be a pagan rite of spring celebration dedicated to reproduction. Eggs represent fertility, and bunnies represent the screwing. SPRING!
 
2010-04-03 11:37:58 AM  

Farker T: Seeking to resurrect the true origins of Easter?

Better not dig too deeply. Might not like what you find.


...


Well now you've done it. Finding out that their particular iteration of sun-god mythology is not the first is going to make for some red cheeks and soiled drawers.
 
2010-04-03 11:38:05 AM  
Easter was originally a Pagan fertility holiday, anyway.

Could it be that fewer people are celebrating the "true meaning" of Easter because fewer people are gullible enough to swallow fairy tales about a dead body coming back to life and "saving" people from some kind of imaginary sin? Let's hope so. At least eggs, bunnies, and chocolate are based on reality.
 
2010-04-03 11:38:38 AM  

Bevets: You sound like a dork :)


My mom thinks I'm cool, she even lets me have the whole basement to myself.
 
2010-04-03 11:38:47 AM  
Farker T

Sorry to disappoint, but Easter (in its various forms) is older than Jews.

Vernal Equinox, sure. But that's not what is celebrated.
 
2010-04-03 11:42:02 AM  

Bevets: Please keep your opinions to yourself.


Lulz.
 
2010-04-03 11:42:58 AM  

Bevets: Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. ~ Philip Dick


Odd. I pretty much tossed out my old religious beliefs 10 years ago and I still haven't seen this "reality" you speak of.

As far as I'm concerned, the God of the Bible is either some non-divine alien being who really enjoys farking with people, or just a created figment of people's imaginations (I'm leaning towards the latter). If he really had a problem with all the gays and non-believers, why didn't he just make it so they don't exist in the first place? Doesn't the Bible say that all of God's creations are perfect? If that is really the case, what the fark is the point of worrying about what some invisible man in the cloud thinks about what I do with my life, let alone whether I visit one of his many homes on the weekends.
 
2010-04-03 11:44:19 AM  

Bevets: Bevets:

John 14.6 Jesus said to him, "I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father, but through Me."

John 10.37 "If I do not do the works of My Father, do not believe Me; 38 but if I do them, though you do not believe Me, believe the works, that you may know and understand that the Father is in Me, and I in the Father."

Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. ~ Philip Dick

felixecho:

Pfft. People waste energy over subjects like this? I just can't bring myself to care. Our family celebrates our way, and I don't care how my neighbors celebrate. None of my business.

Please keep your opinions to yourself.

Studson:

I am so mad at organized religion for not being open to other's beliefs that I am going to be completely close-minded to anything they believe in. Further I will actively attack all their beliefs in an attempt to make them see the error of their ways. Ridicule. Malevolence. Insensitivity. These are the tools I will use.

You sound like a dork :)


Uh-oh. Someone broke the Bevets bot......
 
2010-04-03 11:50:38 AM  

studebaker hoch: Farker T

Sorry to disappoint, but Easter (in its various forms) is older than Jews.

Vernal Equinox, sure. But that's not what is celebrated.


Your point?

Much of Judaism is based on recycled Sumerian mythology, which shouldn't be surprising, as Sumeria is where Abraham came from.
 
2010-04-03 11:51:09 AM  
I am all for a little commercialism but not just Easter, but the other holidays as well are all getting over commercialized. Holidays I thought were supposed to be about the story behind the holiday not about what goodies were being bought for the holiday. I infuriated my wife the other day because I asked her where in the bible did it mention Jesus coming out of the tomb and picking up eggs.

/still pissed that she wouldn't let me have any kind of meat to eat yesterday and fark I ain't even catholic.
 
2010-04-03 11:52:33 AM  

jimmyjackfunk: I am all for a little commercialism but not just Easter, but the other holidays as well are all getting over commercialized. Holidays I thought were supposed to be about the story behind the holiday not about what goodies were being bought for the holiday. I infuriated my wife the other day because I asked her where in the bible did it mention Jesus coming out of the tomb and picking up eggs.

/still pissed that she wouldn't let me have any kind of meat to eat yesterday and fark I ain't even catholic.


You sound OWNED.
 
2010-04-03 11:52:57 AM  
And why do we name the holiday after a pagan fertility goddess? JESUS DOES NOT APPROVE
 
2010-04-03 11:57:01 AM  
i44.tinypic.comView Full Size
 
2010-04-03 12:00:55 PM  

Farker T: jimmyjackfunk: I am all for a little commercialism but not just Easter, but the other holidays as well are all getting over commercialized. Holidays I thought were supposed to be about the story behind the holiday not about what goodies were being bought for the holiday. I infuriated my wife the other day because I asked her where in the bible did it mention Jesus coming out of the tomb and picking up eggs.

/still pissed that she wouldn't let me have any kind of meat to eat yesterday and fark I ain't even catholic.

You sound OWNED.



No, he's just married....

/it's all about the give and take
 
2010-04-03 12:02:39 PM  

Farker T: studebaker hoch: Farker T

Sorry to disappoint, but Easter (in its various forms) is older than Jews.

Vernal Equinox, sure. But that's not what is celebrated.

Your point?

Much of Judaism is based on recycled Sumerian mythology, which shouldn't be surprising, as Sumeria is where Abraham came from.


There is one problem though. If Abraham migrated with his tribes to Caanan, why haven't archaeologists found a single shred of evidence of it? You would think that they would at least find SOMETHING beyond uncovering old texts.

jimmyjackfunk: I am all for a little commercialism but not just Easter, but the other holidays as well are all getting over commercialized. Holidays I thought were supposed to be about the story behind the holiday not about what goodies were being bought for the holiday. I infuriated my wife the other day because I asked her where in the bible did it mention Jesus coming out of the tomb and picking up eggs.

/still pissed that she wouldn't let me have any kind of meat to eat yesterday and fark I ain't even catholic.


I just use those holidays as an excuse to see family and eat free food. The commercialism and religious aspects don't hold much of a significance to me.
 
2010-04-03 12:03:19 PM  
So, YHWH and Asherah have an acrimonious divorce. There's your old testament, right there. YHWH was having an utterly ridiculous mid-life crisis, which culminates in him getting some tail from a woman significantly younger than he is. Bam, pregnancy. And we get to see YHWH's parenting skills, which end up with his son nailed to a tree in some misguided attempt to please his fairly abusive father.

So, good job, YHWH. Really stellar performance there.
 
2010-04-03 12:10:44 PM  

t3knomanser: So, YHWH and Asherah have an acrimonious divorce. There's your old testament, right there. YHWH was having an utterly ridiculous mid-life crisis, which culminates in him getting some tail from a woman significantly younger than he is. Bam, pregnancy. And we get to see YHWH's parenting skills, which end up with his son nailed to a tree in some misguided attempt to please his fairly abusive father.

So, good job, YHWH. Really stellar performance there.


That's an interesting take on the story.

Might also explain why so many religious folks pay tithing.

Child support by proxy.
 
2010-04-03 12:12:51 PM  

oroku_saki: Farker T: studebaker hoch: Farker T

Sorry to disappoint, but Easter (in its various forms) is older than Jews.

Vernal Equinox, sure. But that's not what is celebrated.

Your point?

Much of Judaism is based on recycled Sumerian mythology, which shouldn't be surprising, as Sumeria is where Abraham came from.

There is one problem though. If Abraham migrated with his tribes to Caanan, why haven't archaeologists found a single shred of evidence of it? You would think that they would at least find SOMETHING beyond uncovering old texts.


The Devil stole all the evidence?
 
2010-04-03 12:15:59 PM  
Well, I don't know about Jesus being very challenging and existential and all that, but after spending 10 years on two continents in catlic schools, I've always found the whole chocolate bunnies/Easter eggs observance thing a real hoot.

Both of which, I'd get down and prostate MYself for ANY day of the year.
 
2010-04-03 12:20:03 PM  

biglot: Well, I don't know about Jesus being very challenging and existential and all that, but after spending 10 years on two continents in catlic schools, I've always found the whole chocolate bunnies/Easter eggs observance thing a real hoot.

Both of which, I'd get down and prostate MYself for ANY day of the year.


Kinky.
 
2010-04-03 12:21:56 PM  

Farker T: oroku_saki: Farker T: studebaker hoch: Farker T

Sorry to disappoint, but Easter (in its various forms) is older than Jews.

Vernal Equinox, sure. But that's not what is celebrated.

Your point?

Much of Judaism is based on recycled Sumerian mythology, which shouldn't be surprising, as Sumeria is where Abraham came from.

There is one problem though. If Abraham migrated with his tribes to Caanan, why haven't archaeologists found a single shred of evidence of it? You would think that they would at least find SOMETHING beyond uncovering old texts.

The Devil stole all the evidence?


Nah, he just plants it.

img410.imageshack.usView Full Size
 
2010-04-03 12:24:03 PM  
Easter is not a holiday. Sunday is already a day off.
 
2010-04-03 12:25:25 PM  
Look, Christians, here's the deal. The only reason 90% of people celebrate Christmas & Easter is the commercialized stuff. If you took that away, people would forget all about it and churches would be as empty on those two days as they are on any other Sunday. Is that what you really want? How about you just shut the fark up about Santa Claus & the Easter Bunny, and some portion of us will keep pretending that what we're celebrating has something to do with your religion.
 
2010-04-03 12:33:37 PM  
ptelg:
Well, guys, if we wanna reclaim these holidays as a time of religious reflection. We need to act like it. Which I think at this time and place means...

*End the Santa Claus and presents tradition.
*End the Easter Bunny and egg hunt tradition.

Then for us it's strictly a time of reflection and feasting. Let the heathens have their co-opted holiday/pissup.


Feasting? The puritans would be pissed at your evil gluttony and desecration of Easter with your wild ungodly ways. The same way they banned Christmas and tried to ban Thanksgiving because people were using them as time for family to get together and even... have fun. Instead the day is supposed to be spent fasting on your knees in solemn prayer in a church. Any other activity during religious holidays in sin and of the devil.

How things have changed. Now they consider feasting and getting together with family the central part of Easter.
 
2010-04-03 12:38:30 PM  
I have to remember when Easter is so that I can go to the store and get all the sale Easter candy right afterward.

[image from clickaclue.com too old to be available]

THAT'S what it's all about.
 
2010-04-03 12:41:21 PM  
I'm still trying to figure out why nobody recognized Jebus when he was 'resurrected'. Dudes and chicks walked with him, talked with him, hung on his every utterance for three years, and when he 'returned', he walked with them, talked with them, stood right in front offering to show his 'crucifixion scars', and they still didn't recognize him. Maybe it wasn't really him? Maybe it was all just a hoax?

/waiting for Bevets to cut-n-paste someone else' expalnation
 
2010-04-03 12:47:22 PM  

eljefedeath: Oh that's why i don't believe in zombie jesus. Jesus is 'challenging' and makes me 'uncomfortable'. All this time I thought my hangup was my desire for 'facts' and 'evidence'.


Faith is the evidence of things unseen. I'd start there if I were you.
 
2010-04-03 12:48:55 PM  

limeyfellow: ptelg:
Well, guys, if we wanna reclaim these holidays as a time of religious reflection. We need to act like it. Which I think at this time and place means...

*End the Santa Claus and presents tradition.
*End the Easter Bunny and egg hunt tradition.

Then for us it's strictly a time of reflection and feasting. Let the heathens have their co-opted holiday/pissup.

Feasting? The puritans would be pissed at your evil gluttony and desecration of Easter with your wild ungodly ways. The same way they banned Christmas and tried to ban Thanksgiving because people were using them as time for family to get together and even... have fun. Instead the day is supposed to be spent fasting on your knees in solemn prayer in a church. Any other activity during religious holidays in sin and of the devil.

How things have changed. Now they consider feasting and getting together with family the central part of Easter.


I can't speak for anyone else, but if I am spending any time on MY knees it's not going to be in solemn prayer.

//Bow chicka bow wow
/Happy Easter! ;)
 
2010-04-03 12:49:08 PM  

cookiefleck: Farker T: jimmyjackfunk: I am all for a little commercialism but not just Easter, but the other holidays as well are all getting over commercialized. Holidays I thought were supposed to be about the story behind the holiday not about what goodies were being bought for the holiday. I infuriated my wife the other day because I asked her where in the bible did it mention Jesus coming out of the tomb and picking up eggs.

/still pissed that she wouldn't let me have any kind of meat to eat yesterday and fark I ain't even catholic.

You sound OWNED.


No, he's just married....

/it's all about the give and take


^so much THIS. I was raised non denominational and we didn't get into all of the hype. I did manage to make the wife mad though by telling her the following: (an oldie but a goodie)

Protestant moves into a neighborhood full of Catholics grills steaks every Friday, no matter what. The neighbors can't stand it so they get the local parish priest to talk with him. He tells him, "My son how would you like to join the Catholic church?" The protestant agrees so the priest takes out some holy water and his rosary, makes the sign of the cross and says "Born a protestant, raised a protestant, now a catholic" The following week the man is outside grilling steaks again. The priest tells him, "You can't do that, you have to eat something like fish on Fridays" The man promptly takes his steak sauce, makes the sign of the cross and while sprinkling sauce on the steak says, "Born a cow, raised a cow, now a fish"

Totally pissed off my non practicing "catholic" wife. Of course her practicing catholic mother thought it was a laugh riot. go figure.
 
2010-04-03 12:49:13 PM  

oroku_saki: Farker T: studebaker hoch: Farker T

Sorry to disappoint, but Easter (in its various forms) is older than Jews.

Vernal Equinox, sure. But that's not what is celebrated.

Your point?

Much of Judaism is based on recycled Sumerian mythology, which shouldn't be surprising, as Sumeria is where Abraham came from.

There is one problem though. If Abraham migrated with his tribes to Caanan, why haven't archaeologists found a single shred of evidence of it? You would think that they would at least find SOMETHING beyond uncovering old texts.


They lived in tents and weren't into the idol carving thing.
 
2010-04-03 12:57:09 PM  
Getting upset about eggs and chocolate bunnies on Easter is silly.
That's for the little kids, the deeper meanings are there for those who seek Christ. If you're not participating, why get upset?
And if you have to drag out some long convoluted reason or any reason at all why you resent Christians, maybe the problem is just you and your prejudice.
 
2010-04-03 12:59:40 PM  

Kurmudgeon: Getting upset about eggs and chocolate bunnies on Easter is silly.



...even sillier when they can be combined.

Jesus Died for His Peeps (new window)
 
2010-04-03 01:01:55 PM  

UNC_Samurai: Time out.

These same people used to biatch and moan about how Santa and commercialism had taken away the "true meaning" of Christmas (which was a valid point). Then they suddenly started complaining about how everything was part of a War on Christmas™, and that if we used the word "holiday" and didn't run up debt buying presents, Supply-Side Jesus was going to send us to hell.

We need a good word for the Easter/Passover timeframe akin to "holidays" that means nothing more than pissing off the fundies.


Done in one.

It would be amusing if they weren't so vicious in their rhetoric surrounding the war on _____ Christian holiday.

Easter is supposed to be a touch more important than Christmas, if I remember correctly at least.

Even I think the cheap plasitc toys in the premade Easter baskets are tacky and in poor taste, but they wouldn't be making them if there wasn't a demand for them.
 
2010-04-03 01:03:51 PM  
Blowmonkey Dictionary...get one.

Or look on wikipedia for "cult". Christianity much like Islam are not cults, they're religions.

/I'm sorry your dad touched you
 
2010-04-03 01:09:01 PM  
Everybody ('cept you Jehova's Witness Loonies) knows that Easter is about squeezing a couple more presents out of the "Christmas" thing.
 
2010-04-03 01:09:59 PM  
Just to troll a little more,

Ok, so we've got two holidays right at basically the same time, Passover and Easter.

The Jews have been around a lot longer. Yeah, ok there was that whole persecution of the Jews by the Nazis, but the Nazis didn't really like Catholics either.

So keeping that in mind, why isn't Passover as insanely merchandized like Easter? Or Hanukkah like Christmas? I guess we could go with the stereotype that the Jews are pinch-pennies and don't buy into gilding something that's significant to them regardless. But doesn't that just strengthen the argument that Christians are idiots who will buy whatever they are told they should buy?
 
2010-04-03 01:12:44 PM  

ingineervt: Blowmonkey Dictionary...get one.

Or look on wikipedia for "cult". Christianity much like Islam are not cults, they're religions.

/I'm sorry your dad touched you


Though there are christian flavored cults.
 
2010-04-03 01:19:42 PM  
Mouser: "Faith is the evidence of things unseen."

Also known as 'unreason'.
 
2010-04-03 01:20:17 PM  

featherspy: So keeping that in mind, why isn't Passover as insanely merchandized like Easter?


Judaism has no evangelical element. They don't really want converts, since it's as much a cultural thing as it is a religious thing. Hell, most of the Jews I know don't practice in the least and are borderline atheist (aside from the one that shocked everybody and went to Rabbinical school, but that's neither here nor there).

The point is: Judaism is a niche market. You just can't make much money by commercializing it. So it's not terribly commercialized.

Also, as pointed out, some Easter traditions predate Passover by a fair margin.
 
2010-04-03 01:21:29 PM  

ingineervt: Blowmonkey Dictionary...get one.

Or look on wikipedia for "cult". Christianity much like Islam are not cults, they're religions.


Main Entry: cult
Pronunciation: \ˈkəlt\
Function: noun
Usage: often attributive
Etymology: French & Latin; French culte, from Latin cultus care, adoration, from colere to cultivate - more at wheel
Date: 1617

1 : formal religious veneration : worship
2 : a system of religious beliefs and ritual; also : its body of adherents
3 : a religion regarded as unorthodox or spurious; also : its body of adherents
4 : a system for the cure of disease based on dogma set forth by its promulgator
5 a : great devotion to a person, idea, object, movement, or work (as a film or book); especially : such devotion regarded as a literary or intellectual fad b : the object of such devotion c : a usually small group of people characterized by such devotion
 
2010-04-03 01:27:23 PM  

muck4doo: oroku_saki: Farker T: studebaker hoch: Farker T

Sorry to disappoint, but Easter (in its various forms) is older than Jews.

Vernal Equinox, sure. But that's not what is celebrated.

Your point?

Much of Judaism is based on recycled Sumerian mythology, which shouldn't be surprising, as Sumeria is where Abraham came from.

There is one problem though. If Abraham migrated with his tribes to Caanan, why haven't archaeologists found a single shred of evidence of it? You would think that they would at least find SOMETHING beyond uncovering old texts.

They lived in tents and weren't into the idol carving thing.


So in other words, they weren't talented enough to make a sharp stick?

/Not highly renown as artisans or craftsmen
//Unless you call usury a "craft"
 
2010-04-03 01:29:15 PM  

ingineervt: Blowmonkey Dictionary...get one.

Or look on wikipedia for "cult". Christianity much like Islam are not cults, they're religions.

/I'm sorry your dad touched you


From Dictionary.com:
Link (new window)


cult
/kʌlt/ Show Spelled[kuhlt] Show IPA
-noun
1.
a particular system of religious worship, esp. with reference to its rites and ceremonies.
2.
an instance of great veneration of a person, ideal, or thing, esp. as manifested by a body of admirers: the physical fitness cult.
3.
the object of such devotion.
4.
a group or sect bound together by veneration of the same thing, person, ideal, etc.
5.
Sociology. a group having a sacred ideology and a set of rites centering around their sacred symbols.
6.
a religion or sect considered to be false, unorthodox, or extremist, with members often living outside of conventional society under the direction of a charismatic leader.
7.
the members of such a religion or sect.
8.
any system for treating human sickness that originated by a person usually claiming to have sole insight into the nature of disease, and that employs methods regarded as unorthodox or unscientific.

Did they miss any? I'm pretty sure that all of those apply.

Or are we using a different definition of dictionary? This could get confusing...
 
2010-04-03 01:30:26 PM  

Guntram Shatterhand: UNC_Samurai: We need a good word for the Easter/Passover timeframe akin to "holidays" that means nothing more than pissing off the fundies.

Fictional Jesus Birthday?


I prefer "Zombie Jesus Week"
 
2010-04-03 01:31:43 PM  
featherspy: but the Nazis didn't really like Catholics either.

Where do you get this shiat? the Nazi's were MOSTLY catholics, including f*cking Hitler. The catholic church did most of the prodding and pushing towards the holocaust. I know most xtians like to say they were athiests, but that revisionist history is so easy to debunk it's f*cking laughable.

Once again Nazi = Christian.
 
2010-04-03 01:34:42 PM  

t3knomanser: featherspy: So keeping that in mind, why isn't Passover as insanely merchandized like Easter?

Judaism has no evangelical element. They don't really want converts, since it's as much a cultural thing as it is a religious thing. Hell, most of the Jews I know don't practice in the least and are borderline atheist (aside from the one that shocked everybody and went to Rabbinical school, but that's neither here nor there).

The point is: Judaism is a niche market. You just can't make much money by commercializing it. So it's not terribly commercialized.

Also, as pointed out, some Easter traditions predate Passover by a fair margin.


That's a really good explanation. And of course, it just strengthens the argument that most Christians are simple-minded enough to be impressed by shaped chocolate covered in foil.
 
2010-04-03 01:36:11 PM  
The moment these self proclaimed Christians put as much effort into spreading the word of the 1st commandment "Thou Shalt Not Kill" is the moment I'll start taking them so seriously.

/hucking fipocrites!
 
2010-04-03 01:37:52 PM  

featherspy: Or are we using a different definition of dictionary? This could get confusing...


Wait, so a cult is any instance of great veneration?

The Super-bowl is a cult? How about the Presidents inaguration - that a cult too?

Or maybe we shouldn't rely entirely on lexical definitions created to emulate common speech rather than educated speech when discussing topics in depth. Just a thought.
 
2010-04-03 01:38:44 PM  

SandmanEatsYourBrain: featherspy: but the Nazis didn't really like Catholics either.

Where do you get this shiat? the Nazi's were MOSTLY catholics, including f*cking Hitler. The catholic church did most of the prodding and pushing towards the holocaust. I know most xtians like to say they were athiests, but that revisionist history is so easy to debunk it's f*cking laughable.

Once again Nazi = Christian.


Christian and Catholic aren't the same thing. That said I could be and probably am mistaken. Somewhere along the line I got the impression that Nazis were mostly of the Protestant flavor. Perhaps I was mistaking Old School Nazis with the Neo variety here in the States that have less than nice things to say about Catholics.
 
2010-04-03 01:38:48 PM  
featherspy: "but the Nazis didn't really like Catholics either."

They had it in their heads that they could reshape it into a distinctly Nazi version of Christianity that Hitler called "Positive Christianity". The Nazi Party did take action against the church wherever it opposed the aims of the regime, but those churches which preached party approved material were retained and even promoted. Meanwhile, Hitler's first act upon coming to office was to wipe out the atheist movement in Germany:

"In a speech delivered in Berlin, October 24, 1933, Hitler stated: "We were convinced that the people needs and requires this faith. We have therefore undertaken the fight against the atheistic movement, and that not merely with a few theoretical declarations: we have stamped it out."

Link
 
2010-04-03 01:39:13 PM  

Farker T: muck4doo: oroku_saki: Farker T: studebaker hoch: Farker T

Sorry to disappoint, but Easter (in its various forms) is older than Jews.

Vernal Equinox, sure. But that's not what is celebrated.

Your point?

Much of Judaism is based on recycled Sumerian mythology, which shouldn't be surprising, as Sumeria is where Abraham came from.

There is one problem though. If Abraham migrated with his tribes to Caanan, why haven't archaeologists found a single shred of evidence of it? You would think that they would at least find SOMETHING beyond uncovering old texts.

They lived in tents and weren't into the idol carving thing.

So in other words, they weren't talented enough to make a sharp stick?

/Not highly renown as artisans or craftsmen
//Unless you call usury a "craft"


Things like sticks usually don't last for thousands of years. That's why you find arrow heads, but not arrows.

/What makes you think they were usurers?
//Sounds more like they were shepherds.
 
2010-04-03 01:40:22 PM  
My message to Christians:

Happy Oester. Go lay an egg.

/You could use a good lay.
//Actually, so could I.
 
2010-04-03 01:42:09 PM  

ingineervt: Or look on wikipedia for "cult". Christianity much like Islam are not cults, they're religions.


Cult: Small, marginalized religion
Religion: Large, popular cult
 
2010-04-03 01:44:25 PM  
ninjakirby:

ingineervt and Blowmonkey are the ones who started the Webster fight, not me boo.

Personally, I'm of the opinion that any 'cause' that has at least one documented murder for the furthering of its goals or message could be deserving of the title.
 
2010-04-03 01:44:44 PM  
"Jesus Died for His Peeps (new window)"

Thanks! That was awesome!
 
2010-04-03 01:50:38 PM  

muck4doo: Things like sticks usually don't last for thousands of years. That's why you find arrow heads, but not arrows.


You still leave behind refuse; pottery, animal carcases, excrement, broken sandals, leather belts, dull knives. Thousands of people don't just spent 40 years wandering in circles and leave no trace.

Plus that whole we have evidence that they never originated from Egypt to begin with thing.
 
2010-04-03 01:52:15 PM  
So was Jesus an immortal god before or after he died was executed and then rose from the dead of course he did he is an immortal god thank you so much Jesus
 
2010-04-03 01:53:06 PM  
featherspy: "Personally, I'm of the opinion that any 'cause' that has at least one documented murder for the furthering of its goals or message could be deserving of the title."

Does that include democracy, and independence from British rule?
 
2010-04-03 02:00:12 PM  

ptelg: Well, guys, if we wanna reclaim these holidays as a time of religious reflection. We need to act like it. Which I think at this time and place means...

*End the Santa Claus and presents tradition.
*End the Easter Bunny and egg hunt tradition.

Amazing how capitalism pwns the hell out of religion.

 
2010-04-03 02:01:33 PM  
an irrefutable claim meets an unwavering skepticizm?

i used to have photoshop skills, but i have neither souce mats, or an application in which to process them.

i thought of 2 concepts:
a mortal kombat style faceoff in motivational poster format, with the caption above.

a train wreck(figuratively, but literaly works too)
 
2010-04-03 02:04:42 PM  

muck4doo: Things like sticks usually don't last for thousands of years. That's why you find arrow heads, but not arrows.


Yes, but even shepherds make various tools. The Hebrew were a nomadic, herding people, but they did build semi-permanent structures in a region of the world where the climate does a really good job preserving things.

Most of the ancient world hate for the Hebrews arises from the fact that they completely ignored national borders and just followed their flocks. Like the modern-day Beduin, the locals get pissy about what they see as trespassing. And, of course, for a period of time, the Hebrew decided to try and conquer everything they passed through, like some sort of YHWHist Dschingis Khan.
 
2010-04-03 02:06:41 PM  

featherspy: any 'cause' that has at least one documented murder for the furthering of its goals or message could be deserving of the title.


Well thats a pretty lame definition =p

You just made like every violent offender in prison the leader of their own personal cult.

The term is a weird one, in that within anthropology and sociology circles its used to just mean something akin to "accumulated practices and rituals of the group", which comes from the world cultus, meaning religious ritual.

But when people use it nowadays they do so with the implication that they're dealing with another People's Temple. That type of cult is entirely other thing.

That form of cult is (geeze I gotta get my notes out for this.) Ahem. Proper "cults" share common practices such as controlling the social environment of the followers, creating new meanings for common words (aka loading the language), insistence on thought-killing behavior patterns, espouse the concept of doctrine over the individual, maintaining a closed system of logic from an authoritarian perspective and acts of symbolic (or quite real) betrayal, along with a renunciation of self, family and previously held values designed to increase psychological distance from the previous life and attach them strongly to the new system

North Korea is probably the best visceral example of this; the rote memorization, the constant inundation with messages about the Great Leader, the assignment to work despite their being no consumption of goods, the complete lack of autonomy among most subjects.

The pattern follows for most things we would call cults, and among religions in America, outside of the many tiny fringe cults that exist (not all are harmful btw) Scientology comes the closest to being a religion and leaving its.. cultness behind.

Christianity certainly isn't one, not as a whole. The Branch Davidians of Waco, though, as a sect of Christianity was almost certainly a cult - probably a not very harmful one despite the horrible bumbling of the ATF and FBI.
 
2010-04-03 02:06:58 PM  
CravenMorehead

Bevets: Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. ~ Philip Dick

Oh the irony.


What's really funny is that quote comes from an essay by PKD where he claims that it's actually just a few years after Jesus has died, and that everything we're seeing in the modern world is an illusion by Satan to keep us from God.
 
2010-04-03 02:16:16 PM  

ninjakirby: muck4doo: Things like sticks usually don't last for thousands of years. That's why you find arrow heads, but not arrows.

You still leave behind refuse; pottery, animal carcases, excrement, broken sandals, leather belts, dull knives. Thousands of people don't just spent 40 years wandering in circles and leave no trace.

Plus that whole we have evidence that they never originated from Egypt to begin with thing.


Interesting link.

t3knomanser: muck4doo: Things like sticks usually don't last for thousands of years. That's why you find arrow heads, but not arrows.

Yes, but even shepherds make various tools. The Hebrew were a nomadic, herding people, but they did build semi-permanent structures in a region of the world where the climate does a really good job preserving things.

Most of the ancient world hate for the Hebrews arises from the fact that they completely ignored national borders and just followed their flocks. Like the modern-day Beduin, the locals get pissy about what they see as trespassing. And, of course, for a period of time, the Hebrew decided to try and conquer everything they passed through, like some sort of YHWHist Dschingis Khan.


Joshua Kahn
 
2010-04-03 02:16:56 PM  
Lighten up Farkers. Don't focus so much on pagan rituals, commercialism and forced worship. Rather, focus on the important:

Candy. Delcious, delightful candy! Jelly beans, chocolate, lemon cream and marshmallow peeps!

/although, not a fan of the peeps
 
2010-04-03 02:27:59 PM  
meat0918: Even I think the cheap plasitc toys in the premade Easter baskets are tacky and in poor taste, but they wouldn't be making them if there wasn't a demand for them.

But the spring pop up toys are great for a physics demo/lab!
 
2010-04-03 02:34:14 PM  

Bacchus-ette: Lighten up Farkers. Don't focus so much on pagan rituals, commercialism and forced worship. Rather, focus on the important:

Candy. Delcious, delightful candy! Jelly beans, chocolate, lemon cream and marshmallow peeps!

/although, not a fan of the peeps


Also ham.
 
2010-04-03 02:37:48 PM  
You can celebrate spring without having to be religious.
 
2010-04-03 02:37:50 PM  

muck4doo: ninjakirby: muck4doo: Things like sticks usually don't last for thousands of years. That's why you find arrow heads, but not arrows.

You still leave behind refuse; pottery, animal carcases, excrement, broken sandals, leather belts, dull knives. Thousands of people don't just spent 40 years wandering in circles and leave no trace.

Plus that whole we have evidence that they never originated from Egypt to begin with thing.

Interesting link.

t3knomanser: muck4doo: Things like sticks usually don't last for thousands of years. That's why you find arrow heads, but not arrows.

Yes, but even shepherds make various tools. The Hebrew were a nomadic, herding people, but they did build semi-permanent structures in a region of the world where the climate does a really good job preserving things.

Most of the ancient world hate for the Hebrews arises from the fact that they completely ignored national borders and just followed their flocks. Like the modern-day Beduin, the locals get pissy about what they see as trespassing. And, of course, for a period of time, the Hebrew decided to try and conquer everything they passed through, like some sort of YHWHist Dschingis Khan.

Joshua Kahn


You might find this interesting.

/If you bother to read it
//Avaris vs. avarice
///Etymology?
 
2010-04-03 02:39:46 PM  
Meh. Time to plant the garden, eat some really good candy, grill some lamb and make the hubby my spring fertility rite.
 
2010-04-03 02:49:15 PM  
I thought Easter was all about the day that Jesus came out of his tomb, saw his shadow and went back in for another 6 weeks.
 
2010-04-03 02:51:51 PM  

featherspy: ingineervt: Blowmonkey Dictionary...get one.

Or look on wikipedia for "cult". Christianity much like Islam are not cults, they're religions.

/I'm sorry your dad touched you

From Dictionary.com:
Link (new window)


cult
/kʌlt/ Show Spelled[kuhlt] Show IPA
-noun
1.
a particular system of religious worship, esp. with reference to its rites and ceremonies.
2.
an instance of great veneration of a person, ideal, or thing, esp. as manifested by a body of admirers: the physical fitness cult.
3.
the object of such devotion.
4.
a group or sect bound together by veneration of the same thing, person, ideal, etc.
5.
Sociology. a group having a sacred ideology and a set of rites centering around their sacred symbols.
6.
a religion or sect considered to be false, unorthodox, or extremist, with members often living outside of conventional society under the direction of a charismatic leader.
7.
the members of such a religion or sect.
8.
any system for treating human sickness that originated by a person usually claiming to have sole insight into the nature of disease, and that employs methods regarded as unorthodox or unscientific.

Did they miss any? I'm pretty sure that all of those apply.

Or are we using a different definition of dictionary? This could get confusing...


The difference between a cult and a religion is that society readily accepts the delusions of one as perfectly normal and sane, while the other much less so.

Mormonism used to be considered a cult... most people now seem to accept it as a religion, a weird one, but a religion.

Right now Scientology is a cult. In two hundred years, who knows if it will be how we see Mormonism today?

Way back in the first few centuries, Christianity was a cult... and we all see what society thinks of it now.

/so really that's the only difference I can think of.
 
2010-04-03 02:57:26 PM  

ninjakirby: That form of cult is (geeze I gotta get my notes out for this.) Ahem. Proper "cults" share common practices such as controlling the social environment of the followers, creating new meanings for common words (aka loading the language), insistence on thought-killing behavior patterns, espouse the concept of doctrine over the individual, maintaining a closed system of logic from an authoritarian perspective and acts of symbolic (or quite real) betrayal, along with a renunciation of self, family and previously held values designed to increase psychological distance from the previous life and attach them strongly to the new system


Controlling the social environment? See churches, and the extensive services and social clubs/events they host outside of religious services. Christianity does this, extensively, in pretty much every major sect.

Creating new meanings for words? So many to choose from, though some are sect-specific, like Catholicism and "confession". It's difficult to see a lot of these, precisely because Christianity has been such a strong cultural force for so long. A good example, though, is "marriage". If we whip back to the Roman era, marriage was secular. It wasn't until the middle ages, around 1100 AD, that marriage started to get taken over as a religious sacrament by the Church, as one of their many attempts to attain greater control as their political power increased. This led, pretty directly, to a contract between two adults for the purpose of tax, progeny, and property ownership after death, into the "gays can't marry!" BS that's going on today.


Thought-killing behaviour patterns? Churches get you to stand, sit, kneel at the same time as everyone else, while saying and signing the same things. Similar tactics are used in brainwashing techniques.

Doctrine over the individual? The entire CONCEPT of sin where it does not directly harm another applies here.


Ask any atheist who's argued with Christians about "closed circles of logic". As for authoritarian perspective, while not all follow the Pope (though that's a clear example), they all do have heirarchies which apply.

Renunciation of prior life and family upon conversion? I've known several born-again Christians who did EXACTLY this when they converted, at the encouragement of their church. They make an attempt to convert their friends and family, any who refuse are seen as bad infuences and cut out of their lives. Lost a few good friends this way.


So yes, Christianity is a cult. By pretty much any definition except the sociological one I heard in school, which basically used different terms for religious followings based solely on membership; part of what we looked at there was how groups like the Mormons and Scientologists made the shift from "cult" to full-fledged "religion". It's got nothing to do with their beliefs or ethics, just membership numbers.
 
2010-04-03 03:06:55 PM  

Farker T: Seeking to resurrect the true origins of Easter?

Better not dig too deeply. Might not like what you find.

The goddess Astarte, AKA Eostre (root word of estrogen), Ishtar (pronounced "easter"?), Isis, Kybele, Semiramis, Aphrodite... among others.

This goddess, associated with fertility, is far older than Christ is purported to be.

Her sacred symbol? The egg, and sometimes rabbits or hares.

Her day of veneration? Spring equinox.

Mary -w- son Jesus

Semiramis -w- son Tammuz

Isis -w- son Horus

Common roots.

But hey, believe whatever makes you feel good.


Goa'uld. Explains a lot...
 
2010-04-03 03:08:38 PM  
Christ on a Cross!
What a way to spend Easter!

 
2010-04-03 03:17:06 PM  

Thorak: The Santa Claus and presents traditions is, directly and completely, part of the Feast Day of Saint Nicholas. It's entirely Christian in origin.

If you don't know that, and you call yourself a Christian, you should question why the hell you claim to belong to a faith you're highly ignorant of.


Oh my, no.

Christmas, like Easter, was co-opted from earlier celebrations by the christians. When the catholic church was attempting to convert Romans to their faith, they ran up against a major roadblock because they could not condone the yearly pagan celebration of Saturnalia. It was full of drunkenness and chaos, like any good roman festival. The Romans were basically saying, "Our biggest reason for not converting to your religion is that you won't let us have the Saturnalia, and we love it sooo much.", and weren't converting.

So, eventually, the leadership of the catholic church put their heads together and decided, "Look, we'll let 'em keep their festival, but we'll say it's Jesus' birthday or something and we'll rename it. Over time we'll tone it down and make it more Chritian. In the meantime, we'll get the asses in the pews."

And so they did, and it worked beautifully. They gained converts en masse, and the rest is history.

And the revision of the holiday worked so well, that even today, centuries later, there are tons of people who think Christmas was actually Jesus' birthday and that the celebration is christian in origin.
 
2010-04-03 03:31:50 PM  
Do what you will just don't take away my cadbury creme eggs...


/or the peanut butter ones
 
2010-04-03 03:42:14 PM  

Forbidden Doughnut: Farker T: Seeking to resurrect the true origins of Easter?

Better not dig too deeply. Might not like what you find.

The goddess Astarte, AKA Eostre (root word of estrogen), Ishtar (pronounced "easter"?), Isis, Kybele, Semiramis, Aphrodite... among others.

This goddess, associated with fertility, is far older than Christ is purported to be.

Her sacred symbol? The egg, and sometimes rabbits or hares.

Her day of veneration? Spring equinox.

Mary -w- son Jesus

Semiramis -w- son Tammuz

Isis -w- son Horus

Common roots.

But hey, believe whatever makes you feel good.

Goa'uld. Explains a lot...


Ever read Zecharia Sitchin?

Interesting.
 
2010-04-03 04:11:35 PM  

Bevets: felixecho:

Pfft. People waste energy over subjects like this? I just can't bring myself to care. Our family celebrates our way, and I don't care how my neighbors celebrate. None of my business.

Please keep your opinions to yourself.


Irony notwithstanding, I am curious who Bevets quote-mined for than one.
 
2010-04-03 04:32:06 PM  

cookiefleck: StoneColdAtheist: UNC_Samurai: We need a good word for the Easter/Passover timeframe akin to "holidays" that means nothing more than pissing off the fundies.

How about "Spring Break"?

WOOOOOOOOOOOOO!


I'm gonna go down to Senor Tadpoles to have a margarita made in my mouth.
 
2010-04-03 04:34:55 PM  

jimmyjackfunk: I am all for a little commercialism but not just Easter, but the other holidays as well are all getting over commercialized. Holidays I thought were supposed to be about the story behind the holiday not about what goodies were being bought for the holiday. I infuriated my wife the other day because I asked her where in the bible did it mention Jesus coming out of the tomb and picking up eggs.

/still pissed that she wouldn't let me have any kind of meat to eat yesterday and fark I ain't even catholic.


Why didn't you just go to Knights of Columbus and get the $7 all you can eat fish and chips special?

That's the best part of Lent!

For me, anyway.
 
2010-04-03 04:40:46 PM  

biglot:
Both of which, I'd get down and prostate MYself for ANY day of the year.



"If two R's are found, it is down on the ground
If one R is on hand, then it is a gland"
-Dave Barry

jewishstore.comView Full Size


What Passover commercialism may look like.

/Happy Zombie Jesus Day!
 
2010-04-03 05:16:12 PM  

UNC_Samurai: Supply-Side


Can I just say that, of all the Jesuses (baby, Republican, Zombie, etc.) that get bandied about, Supply-Side Jesus is my new favorite?
 
2010-04-03 05:18:14 PM  

StreetlightInTheGhetto: cookiefleck: StoneColdAtheist: UNC_Samurai: We need a good word for the Easter/Passover timeframe akin to "holidays" that means nothing more than pissing off the fundies.

How about "Spring Break"?

WOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

I'm gonna go down to Senor Tadpoles to have a margarita made in my mouth.


She's in rehab!!!
 
2010-04-03 05:38:24 PM  
Pfft. It's common knowledge that Easter is a pagan fertility festival

i942.photobucket.comView Full Size
 
2010-04-03 05:41:05 PM  

Bevets: John 10.37 "If I do not do the works of My Father, do not believe Me; 38 but if I do them, though you do not believe Me, believe the works, that you may know and understand that the Father is in Me, and I in the Father."

John 14.6 Jesus said to him, "I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father, but through Me."

Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. ~ Philip Dick


A peaceful Easter to you and yours, my friend.
 
2010-04-03 06:13:45 PM  
Sigh. No one disputes Religions and Cults share commonalities.

upload.wikimedia.orgView Full Size
(new window)


Thorak: By pretty much any definition except the sociological one I heard in school, which basically used different terms for religious followings based solely on membership; part of what we looked at there was how groups like the Mormons and Scientologists made the shift from "cult" to full-fledged "religion". It's got nothing to do with their beliefs or ethics, just membership numbers.


Numbers play a role, as seen by the "normative religious behavior" clause. That is by no means the sole indicator.
 
2010-04-03 08:57:21 PM  
landoverbaptist.orgView Full Size
 
2010-04-03 09:38:54 PM  
Shouldn't our deities be more rational than we are? I mean, shouldn't farking sanity be part of omniscience?

We've got this deity you should believe in and worship. He created everything in the universe, but screwed it all up somehow that the only way to fix things up was to send his son here to be tortured and killed. And all this so that the only way you can survive your own death is to be his cheerleader.

Or something.
 
2010-04-03 10:12:05 PM  
Satan scored twice today!
 
2010-04-03 10:17:46 PM  

God hates panty lines: biglot:
Both of which, I'd get down and prostate MYself for ANY day of the year.


"If two R's are found, it is down on the ground
If one R is on hand, then it is a gland"
-Dave Barry

What Passover commercialism may look like.

/Happy Zombie Jesus Day!


Was there a plague of clowns between boils and locusts?
 
2010-04-03 11:11:18 PM  

ChadM89: Thorak: The Santa Claus and presents traditions is, directly and completely, part of the Feast Day of Saint Nicholas. It's entirely Christian in origin.

If you don't know that, and you call yourself a Christian, you should question why the hell you claim to belong to a faith you're highly ignorant of.

Oh my, no.

Christmas, like Easter, was co-opted from earlier celebrations by the christians. When the catholic church was attempting to convert Romans to their faith, they ran up against a major roadblock because they could not condone the yearly pagan celebration of Saturnalia. It was full of drunkenness and chaos, like any good roman festival. The Romans were basically saying, "Our biggest reason for not converting to your religion is that you won't let us have the Saturnalia, and we love it sooo much.", and weren't converting.

So, eventually, the leadership of the catholic church put their heads together and decided, "Look, we'll let 'em keep their festival, but we'll say it's Jesus' birthday or something and we'll rename it. Over time we'll tone it down and make it more Chritian. In the meantime, we'll get the asses in the pews."

And so they did, and it worked beautifully. They gained converts en masse, and the rest is history.

And the revision of the holiday worked so well, that even today, centuries later, there are tons of people who think Christmas was actually Jesus' birthday and that the celebration is christian in origin.


Yes. That's why Christmas, as the Mass of Christ, focusing on celebrating the events of his birth, is on the same day (more or less) as the pagan festival of the winter solstice. There's a lot of old Yule in there too, with the tree with lights on it, too.

But the gift giving and Santa Claus, that comes straight from Saint Nicholas (Santa Claus being a shifting, through a couple languages, of that name). It's entirely Christian, and we have no reason to doubt that Nicholas was a real person, from whom the tradition of gift giving really does come from.

His feast day is the 6th of December, but it's been rolled into the Christmas festival over time.

The placement of Saint Nick's feast day to coincide with Saturnalia was probably done for the reasons you mention, to make it easier to gain converts by having a similar festival at a similar time, but the basis of the Christian tradition isn't directly borrowed from Saturnalia.

If you want an analogy, it's like putting the celebration of Christ's rebirth at Easter. Both celebrate the renewal of life. That doesn't mean Christ's rebirth is a retelling of fertility stories.

There are other ties you can make to prior mythologies there, for sure, but that's a different argument to make. We know Saint Nick existed, for real, and there's plenty of documentation of his gift-giving tendencies, so the only connection to Saturnalia is for convenience of conversion; the Christian gift giving is not, itself, a borrowed tradition. Just the scheduling it for December bit.
 
2010-04-03 11:51:41 PM  

HAMMERTOE: Shouldn't our deities be more rational than we are? I mean, shouldn't farking sanity be part of omniscience?

We've got this deity you should believe in and worship. He created everything in the universe, but screwed it all up somehow that the only way to fix things up was to send his son here to be tortured and killed. And all this so that the only way you can survive your own death is to be his cheerleader.

Or something.


I never got that, either. So, "god" made us knowing he farked it up, but then sent us to hell, anyway, to punish us for....what? Doing what it was we were made to do? Then, "he" apparently changed "his" mind and sent his son to do some magic, then get tortured and killed. Somehow, if we "believe" in this gory spectacle, our souls will NOT burn in hell (unlike all those dirty Jews and Pagans and Hindus.....apparently not believing in someone's death merits eternal torture) but will fly away to live in a magic place of no sex and white people.

This is absolutely insane. Any "god" that would work like that would be a lunatic and a monster. "The Ten Commandments" is on TV right now, and it's at the part where God murders all the little babies in Egypt to get back at the Pharoah. That's not the action of some wise cosmic ruler, that's the petty, murderous rage of the Mafia. Sick.
 
2010-04-04 12:32:23 AM  

ChrisSuperstar: I never got that, either. So, "god" made us knowing he farked it up, but then sent us to hell, anyway, to punish us for....what? Doing what it was we were made to do?


It makes more sense when you know some Babylonian mythology, some ancient Biblical/Torah history, and some basic human psychology.

Babylonian myth has as its creation story a legend surprisingly similar to the Genesis story in Eden, down to the names. Babylonian theology was pantheistic (hence a lot of the "let us create man in our image" stuff in the Bible; in the original there were multiple deities), and a bunch of the gods created men to be slave-creatures. One god thought we deserved better, so snuck into the Garden in the form of a snake and got us to eat of the tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil, so that we became sentient.

We know the Hebrews were enslaved by the Babylonians for centuries. In that time, they likely picked up the Babylonian myths, but because they hated their enslavers, they swapped the roles of the gods in question; the Babylonian's "bad guy" was their "good guy" and vice versa.


On an amusing side note, this is also why Judeo-Christian mythology is the only one in the world where snakes are considered "bad"; most cultures associate snakes and serpents with wisdom. This is why, for instance, the medical caduceus is a snake twirled about a staff.
 
2010-04-04 02:55:17 AM  

ripple123: christians need to stfu, they nicked the idea for easter from a pagan fertility festival anyway. hence the rabbit and the egg, symbols of fertility. im pretty sure.


dont forget it was the godess "ESTRE'S" holiday to begin with
yes she was a pagan fertility godess representing the begining and new life of spring and growth
 
2010-04-04 04:49:10 AM  

Thorak: Yes. That's why Christmas, as the Mass of Christ, focusing on celebrating the events of his birth, is on the same day (more or less) as the pagan festival of the winter solstice. There's a lot of old Yule in there too, with the tree with lights on it, too.

But the gift giving and Santa Claus, that comes straight from Saint Nicholas (Santa Claus being a shifting, through a couple languages, of that name). It's entirely Christian, and we have no reason to doubt that Nicholas was a real person, from whom the tradition of gift giving really does come from.

His feast day is the 6th of December, but it's been rolled into the Christmas festival over time.

The placement of Saint Nick's feast day to coincide with Saturnalia was probably done for the reasons you mention, to make it easier to gain converts by having a similar festival at a similar time, but the basis of the Christian tradition isn't directly borrowed from Saturnalia.

If you want an analogy, it's like putting the celebration of Christ's rebirth at Easter. Both celebrate the renewal of life. That doesn't mean Christ's rebirth is a retelling of fertility stories.

There are other ties you can make to prior mythologies there, for sure, but that's a different argument to make. We know Saint Nick existed, for real, and there's plenty of documentation of his gift-giving tendencies, so the only connection to Saturnalia is for convenience of conversion; the Christian gift giving is not, itself, a borrowed tradition. Just the scheduling it for December bit.


Except it wasn't a case of the christians, already celebrating the birth of christ, deciding to do so at a time that coincided with the saturnalia festival. The christians prior to the time of the co-opting of the festival did not celebrate birthdays, Jesus' or otherwise. The very act of celebrating birthdays was a pagan act. There exist to this day sects of christianity that do not celebrate birthdays.

We know that the church needed to allow the romans to continue to celebrate the saturnalia in order to convert them, but we also know that the church couldn't condone such an openly pagan festival, and thus they needed a way to turn the saturnalia into a christian festival. Since it wasn't one, and since there didn't already exist a coinciding christian festival, we see that the church basically had to invent a reason for the saturnalia to become christian.

Religious scholars at that point in time held a belief that saints lived in whole years; that the day of their death was the same as the day their life began. And since they have always held that life begins at conception, not birth, the day of a saint's death was therefore always the same calendar date of their conception. Conveniently for them, christ (there's quite a bit of reasonable doubt that jesus was a real person, but for the sake of this discussion we'll assume his existence is factual) died in early April. Which means, according to their reckoning, he would have been conceived at the same time of the year, and by adding 9 months for his mother's pregnancy, that puts his birth into December.

That little trick provided all the excuse the church needed to apply the birth of Christ to a december celebration, and thus they had a means of changing the saturnalia into a christian holiday. It meant that they were now committed to celebrating birthdays, which they hadn't done before, but hey, small price to pay for all those converts. They knew that Rome, as the political, economic and military seat of the entire geographical region, was of the utmost importance to convert. Once they had Rome, all the rest of the land would follow.

Now, I'm not arguing your point about Santa Claus. That was not part of the saturnalia, and it's well documented that it has its origins in the Saint Nicholas story. However, gift-giving WAS very much an integral part of the saturnalia, so that didn't come over as part of the Santa Claus adoption. In any case, it's clear that Christmas didn't come about by merging an existing christian festival into the saturnalia. Christmas was clearly just a re-badged saturnalia, with a basically made-up, tacked-on christian significance to explain the re-badging. Doubtless it was transparent to the people at the time, but they just didn't care as long as they still got to party. It would take a lot of convincing to get me to believe that they really cared about the Saturn story to being with.

It would be an interesting analogous experiment to change the meaning of St. Patrick's Day and 1) see how many people actually care, and 2) see how long it takes for the new meaning to be accepted culturally (how long for the current meaning to be forgotten).
 
2010-04-04 05:42:56 AM  
photos.imageevent.comView Full Size

Too commercial?
 
2010-04-04 08:33:05 AM  
Just stopped in to check on all the crybabies.


/ leaves satisfied
 
2010-04-04 12:17:30 PM  
I suppose these people haven't really even considered the fact that their holiday is really just a bastardized version of a celebration of one of Ba'al's girlfriends, Ishtar, who was worshiped by Babylonians in Mesopotamia. Love me some combo worship... Sunrise service, facing east to honor Ba'al, and then a celebration of Ishtar (anglicanized as Easter) for the remainder of the day, including a festival about fertility (eggs and rabbits) and concluded with a feast, including ham - a non kosher food.
 
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