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(London Times)   Great moments in socialized medicine: New antibiotics would fight infections picked up in hospitals, but NHS doesn't want to use them because they cost money   (timesonline.co.uk) divider line
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6406 clicks; posted to Main » on 16 Feb 2009 at 9:05 PM (14 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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FireBreathingLiberal
2009-02-16 5:39:41 PM  
"In Scandinavia, Holland and Harley Street (three places where MRSA is rare) carriers are screened and treated before being admitted to the wards, but the NHS has been slow in following suit."

This has nothing to do with "socialized medicine". See, Scandanavia, Holland etc.,

It's about good old fashioned incompetance. Heckuva job Smitty.
 
hillbillypharmacist
2009-02-16 6:24:13 PM  

FireBreathingLiberal: It's about good old fashioned incompetance.


Precisely. Incompetence can be found in any nation, despite any economic overtures, even among the best and brightest.
 
cameroncrazy1984 [TotalFark]
2009-02-16 6:35:39 PM  

hillbillypharmacist: FireBreathingLiberal: It's about good old fashioned incompetance.

Precisely. Incompetence can be found in any nation, despite any economic overtures, even among the best and brightest.


You are correct. This is why you never hear about Switzerland or Scandinavia when people are complaining about socialized medicine.
 
Bill_Wick's_Friend
2009-02-16 6:46:49 PM  
Is it just me or do 99.9% of the headlines kvetching about the evils of socialized medicine lead to articles in which the person or entity paying the bills is irrelavent?

A drunk Canadian surgeon (who gets fired for being drunk) is not indicative of a problem with socialized medicine.

A crumbling old hospital building in the UK is not indicative of a problem with socialized medicine.

A dutch patient who, against the advice of doctors, shoots heroin into his neck until he dies says nothing about socialized medicine.

I guess "Man waits six weeks for hip replacement while other man gets immediate life-saving kidney transplant" doesn't make a good headline. That six week wait for the elective hip replacement is pretty much the major complaint when it comes to Canada's health care system but it's not exactly the makings of a sexy "haw haw!" headline, eh?
 
snuff3r
2009-02-16 7:12:48 PM  
I wouldn't give up my socialised medicine for anything. Free health care is great and all I pay is 1% on top of my income tax. What's that health insurance costing you again subby? I'm willing to bet it's more than 1% of your annual income...

/smug
 
Shrew2u
2009-02-16 7:26:23 PM  

Bill_Wick's_Friend: Is it just me or do 99.9% of the headlines kvetching about the evils of socialized medicine lead to articles in which the person or entity paying the bills is irrelavent?


Bingo. This is along the same lines as hospitals here in the US being reluctant to implement a system of checklists for routine tasks (like inserting lines in an ICU patient) because of the "cost" of implementing such a system. Never mind that whose hospitals would save millions of dollars (in both actual expenses and legal costs) and hundreds of lives each year by implementing checklists. Whether a health care system is private pay or public pay, short-sightedness, resistance to systematic change, pigheaded stubbornness and arrogance are universally human traits.
 
HansensDisease
2009-02-16 8:15:39 PM  
MRSA is what helped kill my mom.

Last time I looked the US doesn't have socialized medicine.
 
adamgreeney [TotalFark] [OhFark]
2009-02-16 8:32:09 PM  
This headline is Trollrific!

I'm curious to see how someone manages to equate this article to socialized medicine.
 
Merltech
2009-02-16 9:12:49 PM  

HansensDisease: Last time I looked the US doesn't have socialized medicine.


You're not a mother of six that can get implanted for eight more.
 
Captain Horatio Mindblower
2009-02-16 9:12:57 PM  
"When you wake up to the fact that your paper is Tory, just remember: there are two sides to every story."

-- Billy Bragg
 
Shadow Blasko [TotalFark]
2009-02-16 9:13:29 PM  

HansensDisease: MRSA is what helped kill my mom.

Last time I looked the US doesn't have socialized medicine.


MRSA is a biatch. I was in the hospital for most of september, and stuck in bed with it for most of october.

Asstastic amounts of antibiotics IV and Oral later, and all I have now is cellulitis in my legs, which may last years.
 
mrEdude
2009-02-16 9:14:33 PM  
'socialized' medicine!

ooh how evil! i can see what the American right has to fear.

health care for everybody, rich or poor!

o noes!
that's not right!


/will never understand America's problem with helping out thy brother
//except insofar as I understand most Americans are greedy self-serving sons of biatches
 
wwtsomifitsd
2009-02-16 9:14:34 PM  
b-b-but socialism!
 
Portugal. The Man
2009-02-16 9:15:02 PM  

FireBreathingLiberal: "In Scandinavia, Holland and Harley Street (three places where MRSA is rare) carriers are screened and treated before being admitted to the wards, but the NHS has been slow in following suit."

This has nothing to do with "socialized medicine". See, Scandanavia, Holland etc.,

It's about good old fashioned incompetance. Heckuva job Smitty.



I came here to post just this sentiment. Most of the stories of 'bad' universal healthcare are cited from England. Their NHS is not very well run. That doesn't mean that all countries with universal or single-payer systems are bad. France, Germany and the Scandinavian countries have a very good system that we should model when we turn to implement our own single-payer system.
 
Mad Tea Party
2009-02-16 9:15:55 PM  
If we price people out of being able to go to hospitals, they'll be much less likely to contract MRSA. The system works, libs.
 
thereadlines
2009-02-16 9:16:38 PM  
FAIL subby. Everyone else today has been so clever and witty in working "Nanny State" into the headline. You took the dull "socialized medicine" trollproach instead. Lame.
 
signaljammer
2009-02-16 9:17:20 PM  
How about the abuse of antibiotics by the free-market livestock industry?
 
Micanope
2009-02-16 9:17:32 PM  
You're all wrong. If its about greed, that'd be capitalism.
 
DaShredda
2009-02-16 9:18:07 PM  
Only those who are business savvy deserve medical treatment.

The rest of society does not deserve to live.

We raise corporate barons to their deserved god-state.

Praise the dollar!
 
12349876
2009-02-16 9:18:59 PM  
Yes, having half of all bankruptcies due to medical expenses is far superior to nationalized medicine.
 
PatoDeAgua
2009-02-16 9:22:09 PM  
Not only do I agree with most of the above posts, but actually reading the article reveals that NHS isn't even involved in anything the author has to say. He just drops in random attacks that are completely unrelated.
 
Gdalescrboz
2009-02-16 9:22:32 PM  
mrEdude 2009-02-16 09:14:33 PM
'socialized' medicine!

ooh how evil! i can see what the American right has to fear.

health care for everybody, rich or poor!

o noes!
that's not right!


/will never understand America's problem with helping out thy brother
//except insofar as I understand most Americans are greedy self-serving sons of biatches

The US government was not put in place by our founding fathers to dictate our lives and provide for its citizens. If you, or anyone else, wants to "help thy brother out" start a charity and fund it. The government is not a charity, a charity is a charity, stop mixing the two up. Call it the "health care for everyone" charity.
 
barc0001
2009-02-16 9:26:16 PM  
As opposed to your HMO not approving those antibiotics because they have a list of approved ones to use.
 
skinink [OhFark]
2009-02-16 9:26:17 PM  
"NHS practice has been poor. MRSA (methicillin-resistant staphylococcal aureus) is a bacterium that many people carry, safely, in their noses."


My nose is a weapon of self destruction. Cool ... I think.
 
ImJustaTroll
2009-02-16 9:27:09 PM  
America is greedy. America is stupid.

Not all of us, but enough to ruin any sort of "National" program that comes into play. You want to see white flight on a scale not seen since the 60s? Wait until we get government funded health care.

Hell, might as well move to Canada, at least they're good at it.
 
Robopuppy Mistreatment
2009-02-16 9:28:59 PM  
That article was farking retarded. I don't see how either of those studies has anything to do with antibiotics. The staph study was about a part of the mechanism Staph aureus uses to cockblock the immune system, and the Clostridium one was about the evolution of its metabolic enzymes, neither of which have anything to do with antibiotics.

It's an ever bigger stretch to say they have anything to do with socialized medicine, given that one of the studies was done in farking Seattle.

Drs Fang and Pierik now proffer the hope of a focused future. Now that we can characterise the key enzymes of MRSA and C difficile, we might design new antibiotics systematically, not randomly.

We don't design them systematically or randomly anymore. Way back in the 50s we found out it was a hell of a lot easier to steal premade antibiotics from other living things like penicillin than to test every chemical we could think of.

Moreover, we know of a lot more than 2 enzymes in both of those bacteria. I'm fairly sure we've sequenced their genomes and mapped huge chunks of it. That doesn't mean we can reliably knock any of those enzymes out.
 
darth_shatner
2009-02-16 9:30:13 PM  

barc0001: As opposed to your HMO not approving those antibiotics because they have a list of approved ones to use.


Or having them reject your policy completely because of a pre-existing condition.
 
wingnut396
2009-02-16 9:31:40 PM  
Great moments in socialized medicine: New antibiotics would fight infections picked up in hospitals, but NHS doesn't want to use them because they cost money

Serves those pinko turncoats rights, they should be ashamed to even utter Churchill's name. Now here in the God's true Christian nation, you never hear of any one covered by our great and benevolent insurance getting treatment denied based on cost. No sirree, its top coverage for all regardless of the cost involved.
 
e-christ
2009-02-16 9:32:07 PM  
HAHA! Cuz god knows American for-profit hospitals are ALL ABOUT spending extra money for the good of their patients! Well played subby!
 
StopArrestingMe
2009-02-16 9:32:21 PM  
Another great moment in soclized medicine. This is why Im glad I live in Dallas TX and not Lib city, Nanny State. Here I know Ill get the best treatment becuase I pay for it. In Europe the doctors are two bit hustlers who cant even do there job. I would rather perform surgery on myself then go to a socilized hospital in Greece or w.e and not just because Id be an outsider, but because those guys dont know how to treat me, or theyll just let me die. I would LITERALLY die of burn wounds in the waiting room. And yet Obama wants to promise us all free healthcare and a free pony. Boy Id like to see how he will pay for all that? Oh yeah, by taxing me. I cant even buy sodapop and I have to pay for some gay guy getting his AIDS cured by stem cells. F that. God created Adam and Eve not Adam and Steve and George Washington created capitalism not socilism. F all soc. I will NOT pay for some gay guys medical bills because he got his cherry popped by his hiv positive boyfriend Darrell. Trying to do that is a violation of my constitutional rights but I guess you libs dont care as long as its not your rights. Stay gold, libs.
 
TofuTheAlmighty [BareFark]
2009-02-16 9:32:33 PM  
Have the freepmins ever greenlit a healthcare headline that didn't bash the dreaded SOCIAMALIZED MEDICINE?
 
Tillmaster
2009-02-16 9:32:43 PM  
most Americans are greedy self-serving sons of biatches

Or as they prefer to say: 'Libertarians'.

I've lived in New England for twenty plus years. For the most part, the locals are pleasant, friendly people, that you would be proud to have as your neighbours, with none of the false bonhomie one comes across in other parts of the country.

But if you mention gun control, or socialized medecine, the third eyelid comes down, and they turn into Thargoids from the Planet Drelb. Most odd.
 
Githerax
2009-02-16 9:34:15 PM  
what if patients in hospitals were treated in such a way as to reduce in-hospital infections? Then you wouldn't need to stick everyone with a new antibiotic, thereby helping disease to become even stronger.
 
General Vayo
2009-02-16 9:34:19 PM  

Gdalescrboz: mrEdude 2009-02-16 09:14:33 PM
'socialized' medicine!

ooh how evil! i can see what the American right has to fear.

health care for everybody, rich or poor!

o noes!
that's not right!


/will never understand America's problem with helping out thy brother
//except insofar as I understand most Americans are greedy self-serving sons of biatches

The US government was not put in place by our founding fathers to dictate our lives and provide for its citizens. If you, or anyone else, wants to "help thy brother out" start a charity and fund it. The government is not a charity, a charity is a charity, stop mixing the two up. Call it the "health care for everyone" charity.


This.

If you people are too incompetent to take care of your own health care costs, either through insurance or savings, then why the fark should my tax money pay for your incompetence?

I have Type I diabetes, and I don't have insurance. Am I clamoring for the government to pay my bills? FARK NO. I simply afford less luxuries. Yes, the internet, video games, your farking iPhones and iPods and hybrids, those are all farking luxuries. I can deal with less luxury, because I am not a whiny little wuss who can't control his own budget enough to pay for his own health costs. I don't need the government, the government needs me, it needs me to earn an income so it can tax it to death to pay for social engineering projects that lifeless left-wing scumbags whine for.

I earn my way through life. The Socialist wants people like me to pay for his life, as well. I say to you socialists: up yours. I will not accept socialized medicine, I will not accept government control of my life, and I will not accept your farcical arguments built on the magnificent fraud of socialism.

Earn a living or GTFO.

Sic Semper Tyrannis
 
jjorsett
2009-02-16 9:34:53 PM  

mrEdude:
/will never understand America's problem with helping out thy brother
//except insofar as I understand most Americans are greedy self-serving sons of biatches


And I'll never understand the Brit penchant for codifying every aspect of human behavior and having it controlled by the State.

Except insofar as they're fearful, knee-bending little wuss-bunnies.
 
TheOther
2009-02-16 9:36:22 PM  
Gdalescrboz: The US government was not put in place by our founding fathers to dictate our lives and provide for its citizens. If you, or anyone else, wants to "help thy brother out" start a charity and fund it. The government is not a charity, a charity is a charity, stop mixing the two up. Call it the "health care for everyone" charity.

Fark the founding fathers and their 3/5 slave census. It's our country now and we'll make it better than they ever imagined.
 
fusillade762
2009-02-16 9:36:45 PM  
Dr Fang, paging Dr Fang to the blood bank, please.
 
All Apologies
2009-02-16 9:37:25 PM  
Isn't it even slightly embarrassing when the 37th ranked country in the world for healthcare starts mocking other countries health care systems?

/I could understand it if our health care system was the best, or at least in the top 10.


It is no surprise then that the United States spends more than twice as much per capita on health care compared to almost every other country in the world - and with worse health quality than most industrialized nations. Health premiums for a family of four have nearly doubled since 2001. Starbucks pays more for health care than it does for coffee. Nearly 100,000 Americans are killed every year by preventable medical errors.



It's pretty deplorable that people know so little about the state of healthcare that they would want things to remain as bad as they are.
 
Jrchip
2009-02-16 9:40:33 PM  
Socialized healthcare = medical treatment rationing


The government will decide whether you are "worth" treating or not.
 
ace in your face [TotalFark]
2009-02-16 9:41:48 PM  
Great moments in non socialized medicine: You cant afford to go to the hospital so you don't until you feel "really bad" and then you go broke trying to cure the cancer that is now an advanced stage 3. You die, bankrupt, with your house foreclosed on.

/Stop biatching about healthcare you biatching biatch (subby).
 
PatoDeAgua
2009-02-16 9:41:57 PM  

General Vayo:

I have Type I diabetes, and I don't have insurance.


You have DM-I and you don't have insurance? Are you stupid? You talked all big on the internet about paying your own bills, but it's pretty hard to believe you will be able to afford the 10-20K yearly bills that are coming your way in a few years...
 
darth_shatner
2009-02-16 9:42:09 PM  

Jrchip: Socialized healthcare = medical treatment rationing
The government will decide whether you are "worth" treating or not.


Umm - hate to break it to you, but private health insurers do exactly the same thing.
 
Loud_Mouth_Soup
2009-02-16 9:42:18 PM  

StopArrestingMe: Another great moment in soclized medicine. This is why Im glad I live in Dallas TX and not Lib city, Nanny State. Here I know Ill get the best treatment becuase I pay for it. In Europe the doctors are two bit hustlers who cant even do there job. I would rather perform surgery on myself then go to a socilized hospital in Greece or w.e and not just because Id be an outsider, but because those guys dont know how to treat me, or theyll just let me die. I would LITERALLY die of burn wounds in the waiting room. And yet Obama wants to promise us all free healthcare and a free pony. Boy Id like to see how he will pay for all that? Oh yeah, by taxing me. I cant even buy sodapop and I have to pay for some gay guy getting his AIDS cured by stem cells. F that. God created Adam and Eve not Adam and Steve and George Washington created capitalism not socilism. F all soc. I will NOT pay for some gay guys medical bills because he got his cherry popped by his hiv positive boyfriend Darrell. Trying to do that is a violation of my constitutional rights but I guess you libs dont care as long as its not your rights. Stay gold, libs.



I live with my mom for trying too damn hard.
 
All Apologies
2009-02-16 9:42:40 PM  

Gdalescrboz: mrEdude 2009-02-16 09:14:33 PM
'socialized' medicine!

ooh how evil! i can see what the American right has to fear.

health care for everybody, rich or poor!

o noes!
that's not right!


/will never understand America's problem with helping out thy brother
//except insofar as I understand most Americans are greedy self-serving sons of biatches

The US government was not put in place by our founding fathers to dictate our lives and provide for its citizens. If you, or anyone else, wants to "help thy brother out" start a charity and fund it. The government is not a charity, a charity is a charity, stop mixing the two up. Call it the "health care for everyone" charity.


I bet you didn't have a problem with the Patriot Act, or suspension of Habeas Corpus did ya?

The Government is not going to have a big a role as you are making out, this makes sense in just about every possible way.

You clearly can't argue this on merit, so you've created an inaccurate, though emotionally stimulating boogie man out of govt. healthcare. It's no wonder you guys are always on the losing end.
 
SpeckledJim
2009-02-16 9:43:16 PM  

snuff3r: I wouldn't give up my socialised medicine for anything. Free health care is great and all I pay is 1% on top of my income tax. What's that health insurance costing you again subby? I'm willing to bet it's more than 1% of your annual income...


Hmm, it works out to less than 1% for me for PPO. That's through work at a large company though - if you have to find it on your own I think it becomes a lot more expensive.
 
Rhaab
2009-02-16 9:43:29 PM  

General Vayo: I don't need the government, the government needs me



So, uh, how do you get from place to place, seeing as how those government-funded roads are out of the question?
 
Robopuppy Mistreatment
2009-02-16 9:45:08 PM  
weblogs.newsday.comView Full Size

In the wild, health care is, "Ow, I hurt my leg. I can't run. A lion eats me and I'm dead." Well, I'm not dead. I'm the lion. You're dead.
 
Adolf Oliver Nipples [TotalFark]
2009-02-16 9:45:44 PM  
Does this complete the Nanny State trifecta?
 
StopArrestingMe
2009-02-16 9:46:11 PM  

Loud_Mouth_Soup: StopArrestingMe: Another great moment in soclized medicine. This is why Im glad I live in Dallas TX and not Lib city, Nanny State. Here I know Ill get the best treatment becuase I pay for it. In Europe the doctors are two bit hustlers who cant even do there job. I would rather perform surgery on myself then go to a socilized hospital in Greece or w.e and not just because Id be an outsider, but because those guys dont know how to treat me, or theyll just let me die. I would LITERALLY die of burn wounds in the waiting room. And yet Obama wants to promise us all free healthcare and a free pony. Boy Id like to see how he will pay for all that? Oh yeah, by taxing me. I cant even buy sodapop and I have to pay for some gay guy getting his AIDS cured by stem cells. F that. God created Adam and Eve not Adam and Steve and George Washington created capitalism not socilism. F all soc. I will NOT pay for some gay guys medical bills because he got his cherry popped by his hiv positive boyfriend Darrell. Trying to do that is a violation of my constitutional rights but I guess you libs dont care as long as its not your rights. Stay gold, libs.


I live with my mom for trying too damn hard.


Actually this is America, where people who try hard are rewarded. You get I live with my mom for being a lazy socialist loser who lives in mommys basement and gets your acne medication and slim fast paid from my taxes. I get 10/10 for being a MAN who goes out, does his job everyday and earns everything he gets. Not right now b/c Im currently out of work but usually I mean, I earn everything I get. The only thing youve ever earned is an a@@ kicking from me if we ever meet IRL. Not to be internet tough guy but I would LITERALLY put my foot in your a@@.
 
TofuTheAlmighty [BareFark]
2009-02-16 9:48:01 PM  

Jrchip: Socialized

Privatized, profit-driven healthcare = medical treatment rationing

The government Your insurance company will decide whether you are "worth" treating or not.

Edited for accuracy
 
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