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(Hot Air)   Obama: "When Blagojevich and I met on Nov. 5 to talk about my Senate seat, we didn't meet and we didn't talk about my Senate seat." Media: "Well, that makes perfect sense. Case closed"   (hotair.com) divider line
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16953 clicks; posted to Main » and Politics » on 15 Dec 2008 at 6:14 PM (14 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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thomps
2008-12-15 5:26:34 PM  
Does this mean that they discussed the Senate succession? As I wrote above, not necessarily, and it's worth pointing out that the photo itself is undated. Neither, though, does it mean that they didn't discuss it, either before or after the election, or both.

OH THE OUTRAGE THAT THIS DESERVES!
 
hillbillypharmacist
2008-12-15 5:28:48 PM  
This is the worst straw-grasping I've seen yet. It's damn near as bad as the birth certificate thing.

When Obama said this: "I had no contact with the governor or his office and so we were not, I was not aware of what was happening."

He was saying he wasn't personally aware that, and had no contact in which, Blaggy solicited bribes.

He most certainly wasn't trying to say he'd never had contact with him, which would have been ridiculous.

The only creative parsing going on here are the people desperate to make Obama look bad.
 
bronyaur1
2008-12-15 5:30:47 PM  
Does any sentient being actually believe that a President-Elect would get himself involved with a governor who is widely known to be corrupt in a deal to sell the former's newly vacant Senate seat?

You have to be a whole lot of stupid to believe that Obama or anyone else would do that. Did Obama's people make a recommendation about a favorite choice? Of course. Would they pay Blago off to do it? That is crazy what would be in it for them?

And note how immediately after that conference call, Valerie Jarrett bowed out. Where's the mystery?
 
Weaver95
2008-12-15 5:32:39 PM  
Is this anything like parsing the meaning of the word "is"? Obviously, Obama made contact with Blagojevich a week before the statement at the December 2nd NGA conference. Did they discuss the Senate succession? Probably not, but it's not necessarily out of the question, either.

So if this isn't an issue, then why all the ranting about it? The pundits are *desperate* for this to be some sort of scandal but it's not cooperating. It's like a desperation feedback loop or something.

As I understand it, the FBI even has Blagojevich on freaking tape swearing about how Obama wasn't playing ball or going along with the usual corruption.
 
Diogenes [TotalFark] [OhFark]
2008-12-15 5:34:21 PM  

bronyaur1: Does any sentient being actually believe that a President-Elect would get himself involved with a governor who is widely known to be corrupt in a deal to sell the former's newly vacant Senate seat?


When his own Lt. Governor didn't talk to him for the past year+, I find Obama's claim to quite believable. That, and the fact that he's really anal about scandals/drama.

Sounds to me like alot of people gave Hair Boy a wide berth.
 
Sensei Can You See [TotalFark]
2008-12-15 5:36:33 PM  

hillbillypharmacist: The only creative parsing going on here are the people desperate to make Obama look bad.


Speaking of desperate, how about the two different news releases, both of which mentioned Obama meeting with Blago to talk about his Senate seat, and both of which vanished from the TV station's web site as soon as the shiat hit the fan? (new window)

Obama's not doing himself any favors by pretending he never met with the governor about this and by censoring any questions about it on his own site. (new window)

He needs to just man up and say "Yeah; we met. Duh. No, I did not know he was going to try to sell the seat and I condemn his actions in doing so." All he's doing with this ducking and dodging is making it impossible for the story to go away.

Like Clinton, he's going to find out that just because the media's in tank for him doesn't mean they won't eat him alive if they smell blood.
 
Diogenes [TotalFark] [OhFark]
2008-12-15 5:36:47 PM  

Weaver95: So if this isn't an issue, then why all the ranting about it? The pundits are *desperate* for this to be some sort of scandal but it's not cooperating. It's like a desperation feedback loop or something.


Easy:

1) We're in a news hole, and Governor Motherfarker is a wealth of WTF!?!?

2) Just like with the birth certificate, some people have already made up their mind to not accept Obama. Any reason will do. They're not picky.
 
DamnYankees
2008-12-15 5:37:02 PM  
Why is anyone surprised these two people know each other and have talked and met? They are the governor and senator from the same state. Of course they have met - many times.

Until you come up with any evidence, at all, shut the frak up.
 
Weaver95
2008-12-15 5:38:24 PM  

You Can't Fix Stupid: Like Clinton, he's going to find out that just because the media's in tank for him doesn't mean they won't eat him alive if they smell blood.


Obama could walk on water, and the next day the WND headline would something along the lines of "Obama: so elite he can't bother learning to swim like the rest of us".
 
KaponoFor3
2008-12-15 5:38:28 PM  
I think what most likely happened is they discussed it, Blago made overtures that he wanted something in exchange, Obama said fark you, and here we are.
 
Sensei Can You See [TotalFark]
2008-12-15 5:39:39 PM  

bronyaur1: You have to be a whole lot of stupid to believe that Obama or anyone else would do that.


Funny. I was just thinking how stupid you'd have to be to think a politician who came up through the ranks in the most corrupt city in the country could get himself elected to the Senate while being as pure and innocent as Mr. Smith.
 
absoluteparanoia
2008-12-15 5:40:19 PM  

hillbillypharmacist: He was saying he wasn't personally aware that, and had no contact in which, Blaggy solicited bribes.

He most certainly wasn't trying to say he'd never had contact with him, which would have been ridiculous.

The only creative parsing going on here are the people desperate to make Obama look bad.


Of course you would make excuses for your Messiah. Can't you libtards admit, just once, that you're wrong and that Obama might not be the best candidate here?

I mean GAWD you guys are thick.
 
thomps
2008-12-15 5:42:21 PM  

absoluteparanoia: that you're wrong and that Obama might not be the best candidate here?


exactly what is obama a candidate for at this point? looks like someone needs to update the coding for their troll-bot
 
Sensei Can You See [TotalFark]
2008-12-15 5:42:22 PM  

Weaver95: Obama could walk on water, and the next day the WND headline would something along the lines of "Obama: so elite he can't bother learning to swim like the rest of us".


WND? Screw them. I'm talking about CNN, ABC, NPR -- the same guys who worshipped Clinton right up until the Starr Report came out.

They've got all the loyalty of sharks. For all the whining this year about how they've been so biased toward Obama, if they think this story has legs they'll crucify him.
 
Weaver95
2008-12-15 5:43:13 PM  

You Can't Fix Stupid: bronyaur1: You have to be a whole lot of stupid to believe that Obama or anyone else would do that.

Funny. I was just thinking how stupid you'd have to be to think a politician who came up through the ranks in the most corrupt city in the country could get himself elected to the Senate while being as pure and innocent as Mr. Smith.


I'd agree with except for one thing and one thing only: back when Hillary was desperate to win the primary race, she had a legion of researchers crawling through every last mudpuddle in Obama's backyard. If they had found anything even remotely credible to use against Obama then Hillary would have used it against him in the primary race. But they found nothing. Nothing at all.
 
Sensei Can You See [TotalFark]
2008-12-15 5:43:43 PM  

KaponoFor3: I think what most likely happened is they discussed it, Blago made overtures that he wanted something in exchange, Obama said fark you, and here we are.


If that's the case, it makes me wonder if Obama's trying so hard not to talk about it because he didn't blow the whistle himself.
 
KaponoFor3
2008-12-15 5:45:27 PM  

You Can't Fix Stupid: If that's the case, it makes me wonder if Obama's trying so hard not to talk about it because he didn't blow the whistle himself


If that's the truth, which is possible, he'd be an idiot for not running with it from the beginning. "Look, this guy wanted favors. I don't run my government this way, so I narc'ed his ass. He deserves it for betraying the public trust, something I will never do."
 
Obdicut
2008-12-15 5:45:46 PM  

KaponoFor3: I think what most likely happened is they discussed it, Blago made overtures that he wanted something in exchange, Obama said fark you, and here we are.


What is your rationale for why Obama would lie about that, since it would make him look even better?
 
hillbillypharmacist
2008-12-15 5:45:48 PM  

You Can't Fix Stupid: Speaking of desperate, how about the two different news releases, both of which mentioned Obama meeting with Blago to talk about his Senate seat, and both of which vanished from the TV station's web site as soon as the shiat hit the fan? (new window)


You mean Obama is responsible for the station's f*ckup?

Obama's not doing himself any favors by pretending he never met with the governor about this and by censoring any questions about it on his own site. (new window)

The AG wouldn't be happy with public discussion of all sorts of details at this level of investigation. Thus, no questions.

He needs to just man up and say "Yeah; we met. Duh. No, I did not know he was going to try to sell the seat and I condemn his actions in doing so." All he's doing with this ducking and dodging is making it impossible for the story to go away.

You mean like:
The "public trust has been violated" and "I hope that the governor himself comes to the conclusion that he can no longer effectively serve and that he does resign,"? He could say those sorts of things?
 
Weaver95
2008-12-15 5:45:55 PM  

You Can't Fix Stupid: They've got all the loyalty of sharks. For all the whining this year about how they've been so biased toward Obama, if they think this story has legs they'll crucify him.


Nah. they don't want to lose access to such a historic white house. At least not so early in the game. I'm sure a couple of reporters have dreams of being woodward and bernstien but neither Hillary or McCain's opposition research team(s) found thing one to use against Obama. If something was there, they'd have found it and it would have shown up on the campaign trail.
 
Sensei Can You See [TotalFark]
2008-12-15 5:46:37 PM  

hillbillypharmacist: This is the worst straw-grasping I've seen yet. It's damn near as bad as the birth certificate thing.


Forgot to mention: Obama's own press secretary said he met with Blago to discuss the Senate seat, then issued another release a few days later saying they never met.

They can't both be true. Which one do you suppose is the false one?
 
Weaver95
2008-12-15 5:48:14 PM  

You Can't Fix Stupid: hillbillypharmacist: This is the worst straw-grasping I've seen yet. It's damn near as bad as the birth certificate thing.

Forgot to mention: Obama's own press secretary said he met with Blago to discuss the Senate seat, then issued another release a few days later saying they never met.

They can't both be true. Which one do you suppose is the false one?


yeah, but that was the thing with that guy about da place, ya know? nah, fugedaboutit.
 
hillbillypharmacist
2008-12-15 5:50:31 PM  

You Can't Fix Stupid: Forgot to mention: Obama's own press secretary said he met with Blago to discuss the Senate seat, then issued another release a few days later saying they never met.


They did meet, probably to talk about the Senate seat. However, Obama wasn't personally aware that, and had no contact in which, Blaggy solicited bribes.

Twist the words all you want, but it's desperation. We can smell it from here.
 
DamnYankees
2008-12-15 5:50:49 PM  

Obdicut: KaponoFor3: I think what most likely happened is they discussed it, Blago made overtures that he wanted something in exchange, Obama said fark you, and here we are.

What is your rationale for why Obama would lie about that, since it would make him look even better?


There's no way Blago personally asked Obama about anything illegal. That would be insane. In all likelihood they talked about it in the vaguest terms, Blago asking for nothing specific and Obama offering no advice and just goodwill. The reason Obama probably can't completely and outright deny everything is that he *doesn't know* what other people said to Blago and vice versa. If he denies everything, and then it seems some deputy talkde to Blago about it, the whole thing comes back in Obama's face again. So he needs to be specific and say that he personally never talkde about this with Blago.

The media creates this nonsense and forces politicians to talk this way. It's depressing.
 
Sensei Can You See [TotalFark]
2008-12-15 5:51:48 PM  

Weaver95: neither Hillary or McCain's opposition research team(s) found thing one to use against Obama


McCain ran one of the most incompetent campaigns I've ever seen -- his researchers wouldn't be recognize a scandal if it dressed up like Ru Paul, gave 'em lap dances and farted in their faces.

And wasn't Hillary's campaign the one that started the non-scandal about McCain having an affair, then floated the idea that he wasn't eligible because he was born in Panama?

IMHO, we're talking about researchers who couldn't find their own asses with both hands and a flashlight.

On the other hand, the FBI is interested in this case; if the media decides to get serious about seeing if Obama's got any dirt on him, they'll find it if it's there.
 
make me some tea [TotalFark] [OhFark]
2008-12-15 5:52:13 PM  
Tom Clancy was on the money again:

Jack Ryan, advising the President:
"Don't say 'We were friends', say, 'We were lifelong friends'"

videodetective.comView Full Size
 
KaponoFor3
2008-12-15 5:54:54 PM  

Obdicut: What is your rationale for why Obama would lie about that, since it would make him look even better?


Simple -- distance. Perhaps he didn't want to backtrack based on what his advisers had already said in public. By admitting they had discussions at all, he could give fuel to the "corrupt Chicago politician" meme that I'm assuming he also wants to distance himself from.
 
Weaver95
2008-12-15 5:55:00 PM  

You Can't Fix Stupid: And wasn't Hillary's campaign the one that started the non-scandal about McCain having an affair, then floated the idea that he wasn't eligible because he was born in Panama?


Hillary is a vindictive biatch with a cruel streak a mile wide. About the *only* thing I trust her to do is dig up dirt on her opponents and use against them to achieve her goals. And if she couldn't find something to use against Obama, then it just wasn't there to use.
 
Sensei Can You See [TotalFark]
2008-12-15 5:55:07 PM  

hillbillypharmacist: Twist the words all you want, but it's desperation. We can smell it from here.


You're avoiding the real issue here -- this isn't a fabricated incident, and people are demonstrably lying about it.

You think it's "desperate" to note that Obama's press secretary issued conflicting press releases and that two news stories saying they met to talk about the Senate seat suddenly vanished?
 
DamnYankees
2008-12-15 5:55:11 PM  
I think the biggest risk here is that if Blagojavich feels trapped and is going to lose his life and go to prison, and he feels that its the fault of Obama and his people, he will come out and say Obama did illegal things and was involved - just for spite. Imagine a sitting governor making accusations against the President-elect for personal spite. I mean, I don't expect it to happen, but if it does...watch the fark out.
 
Obdicut
2008-12-15 5:57:29 PM  

KaponoFor3: Simple -- distance. Perhaps he didn't want to backtrack based on what his advisers had already said in public. By admitting they had discussions at all, he could give fuel to the "corrupt Chicago politician" meme that I'm assuming he also wants to distance himself from.


So your theory is based on Obama assuming nobody would ever find out that they met, or just the subject matter discussed, or what?

You Can't Fix Stupid: You're avoiding the real issue here -- this isn't a fabricated incident, and people are demonstrably lying about it.


You mean like the newspaper you cited, or what?
 
Sensei Can You See [TotalFark]
2008-12-15 5:57:35 PM  

DamnYankees: There's no way Blago personally asked Obama about anything illegal. That would be insane.


This idiot managed to get himself taped by the FBI offering to sell the Senate seat in just those words. Why would he shy away from asking Obama himself about it? It's becoming pretty clear that there isn't much Blago wouldn't stoop to.
 
Weaver95
2008-12-15 5:57:53 PM  

You Can't Fix Stupid: You're avoiding the real issue here -- this isn't a fabricated incident, and people are demonstrably lying about it.


No, they're being very politican about it. Which is sad, but understandable given how things work in D.C. these days.

You think it's "desperate" to note that Obama's press secretary issued conflicting press releases and that two news stories saying they met to talk about the Senate seat suddenly vanished?

OMG! Conspiracy! Roswell!
 
DamnYankees
2008-12-15 5:58:33 PM  

You Can't Fix Stupid: DamnYankees: There's no way Blago personally asked Obama about anything illegal. That would be insane.

This idiot managed to get himself taped by the FBI offering to sell the Senate seat in just those words. Why would he shy away from asking Obama himself about it? It's becoming pretty clear that there isn't much Blago wouldn't stoop to.


I tend to agree, but this guy did get elected Governor. He can't be that dumb.
 
LordPistachio
2008-12-15 5:59:20 PM  

DamnYankees: I think the biggest risk here is that if Blagojavich feels trapped and is going to lose his life and go to prison, and he feels that its the fault of Obama and his people, he will come out and say Obama did illegal things and was involved - just for spite. Imagine a sitting governor making accusations against the President-elect for personal spite. I mean, I don't expect it to happen, but if it does...watch the fark out.


He very well could do that. But nobody would believe him without some independent evidence. Blago has been thoroughly discredited.

Here's something to think about. Patrick Fitzgerald is a presidential appointee. He would probably like to keep his job after Obama takes office. If he had something on Obama, would he make it public or keep it under wraps?
 
make me some tea [TotalFark] [OhFark]
2008-12-15 5:59:50 PM  

DamnYankees: The media creates this nonsense and forces politicians to talk this way. It's depressing.


To be fair, this is the job of reporters. When they drop the ball and don't ask these sorts of questions of our elected representatives, this gives them a blank check to run amok.

If Woodward and Bernstein hadn't started to dig into what turned into the Watergate scandal, Nixon would've gotten away with what did he and no one would've been the wiser.

Some reporters ask wiser questions than others, though. And the pundits just stir up the pot unnecessarily and work to reframe the narrative to something it's not (or not yet anyway). That's my beef with the whole system as it is right now.
 
DamnYankees
2008-12-15 6:00:01 PM  

LordPistachio: He very well could do that. But nobody would believe him without some independent evidence. Blago has been thoroughly discredited.


Have you met the media?
 
KaponoFor3
2008-12-15 6:00:33 PM  

Obdicut: So your theory is based on Obama assuming nobody would ever find out that they met, or just the subject matter discussed, or what?


Either/or. Both will work.

DamnYankees: I tend to agree, but this guy did get elected Governor. He can't be that dumb


Look, people said the same thing about Bush.
 
DamnYankees
2008-12-15 6:01:06 PM  

make me some tea: DamnYankees: The media creates this nonsense and forces politicians to talk this way. It's depressing.

To be fair, this is the job of reporters. When they drop the ball and don't ask these sorts of questions of our elected representatives, this gives them a blank check to run amok.

If Woodward and Bernstein hadn't started to dig into what turned into the Watergate scandal, Nixon would've gotten away with what did he and no one would've been the wiser.

Some reporters ask wiser questions than others, though. And the pundits just stir up the pot unnecessarily and work to reframe the narrative to something it's not (or not yet anyway). That's my beef with the whole system as it is right now.


The issue isn't digging, but talking about nonsense. If they asked all these question in private to try to find out the truth, and didn't merely vomit speculation on cable shows and op-ed pages, I wouldn't complain.
 
LordPistachio
2008-12-15 6:02:02 PM  

DamnYankees: LordPistachio: He very well could do that. But nobody would believe him without some independent evidence. Blago has been thoroughly discredited.

Have you met the media?


Oh, they would certainly report on it. But honestly, who would take it seriously without some sort of corroboration?
 
hillbillypharmacist
2008-12-15 6:02:02 PM  

You Can't Fix Stupid: You're avoiding the real issue here -- this isn't a fabricated incident, and people are demonstrably lying about it.


Being obtuse doesn't demonstrate anything.

You think it's "desperate" to note that Obama's press secretary issued conflicting press releases and that two news stories saying they met to talk about the Senate seat suddenly vanished?

The press releases don't conflict. And the news stories were released by mistake, and withdrawn. So, yes, precisely, it's desperate.
 
DamnYankees
2008-12-15 6:03:18 PM  

LordPistachio: Oh, they would certainly report on it. But honestly, who would take it seriously without some sort of corroboration?


Most everyone in the media would. Or they'd spend all their time talking about how they aren't taking it seriously, but then spend the next hour talking about what if it were true.
 
KaponoFor3
2008-12-15 6:04:10 PM  

hillbillypharmacist: The press releases don't conflict. And the news stories were released by mistake, and withdrawn.


"Mistake" that was only caught until after all this shiat started hitting the fan. It may be totally innocuous, but it sure has the appearance of impropriety.
 
make me some tea [TotalFark] [OhFark]
2008-12-15 6:04:24 PM  

DamnYankees: The issue isn't digging, but talking about nonsense. If they asked all these question in private to try to find out the truth, and didn't merely vomit speculation on cable shows and op-ed pages, I wouldn't complain.


Right, that's the stuff I aimed my last bit at. It's destructive to otherwise fair investigative reporting overall and I hate it too. Unfortunately there's no real way to get rid of it, except to switch the channel when those jerks come on TV.
 
Obdicut
2008-12-15 6:04:25 PM  

KaponoFor3: Either/or. Both will work.


So you think that Obama, knowing that Blago was being taped, wired, etc., made provably false statements? After it was revealed that Blago was being wiretapped?

And to back this up your evidence is what, again?
 
Weaver95
2008-12-15 6:05:10 PM  

LordPistachio: He very well could do that. But nobody would believe him without some independent evidence. Blago has been thoroughly discredited.


it doesn't have to be entirely credible. this country loves conspiracy theories. especially if the person at the center of the theory looks like he's innocent. Not to mention that the Republican pundits are so desperate for any issue that they'd ignore reality and common sense to take the guy at his word if it made Obama look guilty.

I had a conversation with Dad about this incident last week. He seemed pleased to see Obama's name associated with this mess. I pointed out that there was nothing at all connecting Obama to anything illegal that Blagojevich might have done, but he just seemed to get even happier about it. As near as I can figure, he just wants to believe that Obama is guilty and this is an opportunity to feel smug or something. He *almost* started to make a comment about blaming Obama for having the wrong sorts of friends but he knows i've got a pile of Bush administration names just waiting in the wings for THAT little conversation to occur....
 
Obdicut
2008-12-15 6:05:46 PM  

KaponoFor3: "Mistake" that was only caught until after all this shiat started hitting the fan. It may be totally innocuous, but it sure has the appearance of impropriety.


Can you be clear about what impropriety, on who's part, your alleging in this statement? The newspaper was improper in retracting those stories? Obama's camp was improper in saying that the stories weren't true?
 
make me some tea [TotalFark] [OhFark]
2008-12-15 6:09:17 PM  

DamnYankees: talking about nonsense


Heh... kinda like that Kapono guy is mouthing off about right now.
 
KaponoFor3
2008-12-15 6:09:35 PM  

Obdicut: So you think that Obama, knowing that Blago was being taped, wired, etc., made provably false statements? After it was revealed that Blago was being wiretapped? And to back this up your evidence is what, again....

Can you be clear about what impropriety, on who's part, your alleging in this statement? The newspaper was improper in retracting those stories? Obama's camp was improper in saying that the stories weren't true?


I have no idea if Obama knew it was taped/wired. It's all speculation or a "theory" as you asked above.

All I'm saying it is sounds and looks shady. Newspaper stories say they meet, then they are said to be "mistakes" after this story gets legs -- that's shady as all hell. Is it possible it was an innocent mistake that just got caught once the story got legs? Yes, but I can't prove that. Is it possible that a phone call was made and the paper was asked to retract the story and say it was a mistake? Yes, but I can't prove that.
 
LordPistachio
2008-12-15 6:10:26 PM  

Weaver95: it doesn't have to be entirely credible. this country loves conspiracy theories. especially if the person at the center of the theory looks like he's innocent. Not to mention that the Republican pundits are so desperate for any issue that they'd ignore reality and common sense to take the guy at his word if it made Obama look guilty.


I guess I to people who take those TV pundits at face value. In my mind, just because they say something doesn't mean it's true. People on TV say lots of things about lots of people. So if Blago implicated Obama with no evidence to back it up, the cable TV blowhards would bluster on for a while and then it would go away. The people who want to believe it are going to regardless.
 
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