FARK.com: (3900228) Conservative Congressmen are revolting

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		Conservative Congressmen are revolting (breitbart.com)		934
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11850 clicks; posted to Politics » on 25 Sep 2008 at 10:51 PM (13 years ago) | Favorite | share:

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Ragnar

2008-09-25 10:17:19 PM

And how!

eyehate

2008-09-25 10:20:06 PM

They certainly are.

DistendedPendulusFrenulum

2008-09-25 10:20:09 PM

Yeah, they stink on ice!

.

A Dark Evil Omen

2008-09-25 10:21:26 PM

Aye, and now they're rebellin'!

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-25 10:21:57 PM

A Dark Evil Omen: Aye, and now they're rebellin'!

Hey...you're a week late to be talking like that :D

A Dark Evil Omen

2008-09-25 10:23:58 PM

IXI Jim IXI: A Dark Evil Omen: Aye, and now they're rebellin'!

Hey...you're a week late to be talking like that :D

It may not be Talk Like A Pirate Day out there, but it can always be Talk Like A Pirate Day...

...in here. *fist over heart*

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-25 10:24:50 PM

A Dark Evil Omen: ...in here. *fist over heart*

Yarr!

SilentStrider

2008-09-25 10:25:53 PM

eyehate: They certainly are.

well. i have no reason to comment in this thread now.

A Dark Evil Omen

2008-09-25 10:27:56 PM

IXI Jim IXI: A Dark Evil Omen: ...in here. *fist over heart*

Yarr!

Arr! This now be a pirate thread!

/Arr!

SilentStrider

2008-09-25 10:30:49 PM

A Dark Evil Omen: i209.photobucket.com

i have to laugh, i JUST bought a flag that says exactly that on saturday.

Hobodeluxe

2008-09-25 10:31:34 PM

oh well. looks like he will have to lead them back to the table and save the day just in the nick of time. such a leader.
a true maverik

bobbette

2008-09-25 10:32:09 PM

DistendedPendulusFrenulum: Yeah, they stink on ice!

.

All fellow members of the Roman senate hear me. Shall we continue to build palace after palace for the rich? Or shall we aspire to a more noble purpose and build decent housing for the poor? How does the senate vote?
Entire Senate: fark THE POOR!

/the poor need banks, too
//cannot deal with this Republican WHARRRGARBL approach. Where are their brains? Do they know what a bank is? Have they ever watched even a few minutes of CNBC?

impaler

2008-09-25 10:32:21 PM

Take my wife!

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-25 10:32:58 PM

A Dark Evil Omen: Arr! This now be a pirate thread!

Why not. These bastards be stealin' our booty!

FredaDeStilleto

2008-09-25 10:33:13 PM

McCain is trying to get his Econ 101 credits with this self-aggrandizing ploy.

A Dark Evil Omen

2008-09-25 10:33:52 PM

Pirrrate crews: Nautical trrrade unions at theirrr finest!

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-25 10:35:56 PM

FredaDeStilleto: McCain is trying to get his Econ 101 credits with this self-aggrandizing ploy.

Great. Hopefully he does better than he did at the Academy...

ecmoRandomNumbers

2008-09-25 10:36:39 PM

DistendedPendulusFrenulum: Yeah, they stink on ice!

.

PULL!

Alacritous

2008-09-25 10:36:49 PM

How many of them are short selling?

Churchill2004

2008-09-25 10:37:33 PM

I might actually be able to find some respect for the House Republicans if they do everything in their power to stop this crap.

And McCain has nothing to do with this, he's with Bush and the pro-bailout Republicans.

quickdraw

2008-09-25 10:37:48 PM

FredaDeStilleto: McCain is trying to get his Econ 101 credits with this self-aggrandizing ploy.

Well he better do the assigned reading first.

NewportBarGuy

2008-09-25 10:42:31 PM

quickdraw: Well he better do the assigned reading first.

He can't even read a three-page proposal.

FredaDeStilleto

2008-09-25 10:44:11 PM

quickdraw: Well he better do the assigned reading first.

Pisses me off. I'm not for a bailout but (even at the tender age of over 50), I believe in honer and integrity. McCain professes to embrace country over self but, other than being placed in circumstances beyond his control, he has yet to distinguish himself in either category.

If, indeed, the stalling by some members of Congress is merely a means of gaining political traction for McCain, I believe every last one of them should be tried for treason.

bobbette

2008-09-25 10:45:00 PM

Churchill2004: I might actually be able to find some respect for the House Republicans if they do everything in their power to stop this crap.

And McCain has nothing to do with this, he's with Bush and the pro-bailout Republicans.

It's the modified bailout that everyone in Congress spent this past week negotiating that they've scuttled, to keep with the pirate metaphors. It looks like they're waiting for John McCain to waltz in and say, "Hey! I have a plan! My plan is MORE DEREGULATION and suck it banks! Private investors can buy you!"

Unfortunately... in a capitalist economy... banks are crucial. And nobody has enough money to bail out these enormous financial services companies except the government. Which should play a role in keeping the entire economy from collapsing.

stargazer101

2008-09-25 10:45:57 PM

This will end well

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-25 10:46:42 PM

NewportBarGuy: He can't even read a three-page proposal.

To be fair, it wasn't written in his native cuneiform...

bulldg4life

2008-09-25 10:47:42 PM

I'm just glad that people are finding a way to defend McCain on this whole thing.

NewportBarGuy

2008-09-25 10:49:57 PM

IXI Jim IXI: NewportBarGuy: He can't even read a three-page proposal.

To be fair, it wasn't written in his native cuneiform...

Low... VERY low.

I laughed.

bobbette

2008-09-25 10:50:02 PM

IXI Jim IXI: NewportBarGuy: He can't even read a three-page proposal.

To be fair, it wasn't written in his native cuneiform...

Sarah Palin can't read at all. She's now legally blind from having gone a month without blinking.

Rascal King

2008-09-25 10:50:30 PM

IXI Jim IXI: NewportBarGuy: He can't even read a three-page proposal.

To be fair, it wasn't written in his native cuneiform...

Lol, minus one keyboard....

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-25 10:50:33 PM

Funny...I never realized what the graphic actually said when it came up in searches:

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-25 10:51:29 PM

bobbette: Sarah Palin can't read at all. She's now legally blind from having gone a month without blinking.

She's just trying to balance out Pelosi's performance at the State of the Union.

bulldg4life

2008-09-25 10:52:46 PM

PLEASE SOMEONE TELL ME HOW MCCAIN GETS CREDIT FOR EVERYTHING

FredaDeStilleto

2008-09-25 10:53:23 PM

IxI Jim IXI: To be fair, it wasn't written in his native cuneiform...

Christ, Even in the middle of a tirade, I had to laugh.

A Dark Evil Omen

2008-09-25 10:54:01 PM

bulldg4life: I'm just glad that people are finding a way to defend McCain on this whole thing.

It's insane. I'm just wondering what's next. Is he going to punch out an old lady? Maybe lose bladder control in the middle of a debate?

Or, maybe it's Sarah's turn. Maybe she'll shoot Todd. Maybe she'll make a trip to China, get drunk, and ask Wen Jiabao if he does the "frapping dicky" just before puking all over him.

Come on! Have fun with it!

(I mean, given that the alternative is crying, drinking heavily, and, ultimately, suicide...)

newmoonpuppyhead

2008-09-25 10:55:15 PM

Politics, politics, politics. Great! Fark this sideshow with McCain as its ringmaster. And fark you, Republicans. Get the fark back in and work on a goddamned compromise!

/from another thread

Mike_LowELL

2008-09-25 10:55:37 PM

This is going to be a serious problem for Obama. Expect him to be trailing big by the first debate when it happens next March.

Fark Me To Tears

2008-09-25 10:56:06 PM

Wait -- are we talking the verb or the adjective?

Tacoby Bellisbury

2008-09-25 10:56:41 PM

Sigh, Palin should get in the ring and straighten this all out. When's the Pit bull coming off the leash?

Muta

2008-09-25 10:57:13 PM

bulldg4life: PLEASE SOMEONE TELL ME HOW MCCAIN GETS CREDIT FOR EVERYTHING

McCain only gets credit for the good things.
Bad things are Obama's fault.

Dr.Zom

2008-09-25 10:58:02 PM

Epsilon

2008-09-25 10:58:13 PM

So will McCain's evil plan to sabotage the debates work in his favor? That is the big question.

bulldg4life

2008-09-25 10:58:32 PM

Tacoby Bellisbury: When's the Pit bull coming off the leash?

She was let off the leash the last two days and she was able to say that the bailout would help people get healthcare benefits and a reduction in taxes would help lower taxes.

Cathedralmaster

2008-09-25 10:58:36 PM

Congratulations - they just committed political suicide. When the market tanks tomorrow on news of the stall and WaMu, guess who's taking the blame? And guess who's going to be taking the blame on all the Sunday morning talk shows?

Tacoby Bellisbury

2008-09-25 10:58:38 PM

A Dark Evil Omen: Arr! This now be a pirate thread!

/Arr!

um... no

[image from docly.com too old to be available]

Ninjas are 5000 times better

Donald_McRonald

2008-09-25 10:59:02 PM

They are also unappetizing.

Coco LaFemme

2008-09-25 10:59:05 PM

McCain's not showing up tomorrow night, is he? LOL

Wight Power

2008-09-25 10:59:08 PM

Guess I'll toss this out there again

Tacoby Bellisbury

2008-09-25 10:59:24 PM

bulldg4life: reduction in taxes would help lower taxes.

So?

Andric

2008-09-25 10:59:29 PM

Thanks a lot, Boner.

tallsails

2008-09-25 10:59:31 PM

A question worth considering - if McCain drops out of the race (which would explain his last 4 stunts...), does Palin become the nominee candidate?

FarKnight

2008-09-25 10:59:41 PM

Question: Is the house republicans more paleoconservative than the Senate or vice versa? Which are moar neoconservative?

Mike_LowELL

2008-09-25 10:59:42 PM

I like ninjas because Biden hates pirates.

newmoonpuppyhead

2008-09-25 10:59:59 PM

Coco LaFemme: McCain's not showing up tomorrow night, is he? LOL

When has he ever shown up?

Dr.Zom

2008-09-25 11:00:17 PM

bulldg4life: Tacoby Bellisbury: When's the Pit bull coming off the leash?

She was let off the leash the last two days and she was able to say that the bailout would help people get healthcare benefits and a reduction in taxes would help lower taxes.

Like such.

Tacoby Bellisbury

2008-09-25 11:00:27 PM

tallsails: A question worth considering - if McCain drops out of the race (which would explain his last 4 stunts...), does Palin become the nominee candidate?

FarKnight: Question: Is the house republicans more paleoconservative than the Senate or vice versa? Which are moar neoconservative?

Question- does boldface make you cool? Answer: No

lexslamman

2008-09-25 11:00:43 PM

BEFORE MCCAIN GOT THERE:

Congress looked close to reaching a deal to approve a $700 billion plan to bail out the U.S. financial system and President George W. Bush called an emergency meeting for Thursday to hammer out details.
The move toward a deal will likely calm U.S. markets, which were in turmoil on Wednesday as negotiations dragged on. Investors stampeded into cash and safe-haven assets, briefly sending short-term interest rates below zero. Experts said banks were hoarding cash, fearful that if they loaned money to other banks they might not get repaid.
But with a deal near, U.S. stock futures were up about 0.5 percent after earlier being negative, suggesting a firmer open for Wall Street on Thursday. Asian stock markets also retraced earlier losses.
Bush warned of a looming economic disaster if Congress failed to act swiftly to fund the $700 billion bailout that would be larger than the total cost of the Iraq war.
Bush offered few details about the makeup of the emerging deal for a bailout.
U.S. congressional Democrats and Republicans plan to meet on Thursday to draft a final bipartisan plan, a Democratic source told Reuters on Wednesday night.
"Not too many unresolved issues remain," the source said.
Earlier on Wednesday, Senate Banking Committee Chairman Christopher Dodd expressed optimism a deal was nearing.
"We're not there yet," Dodd told reporters, adding there was a "good possibility we'll get there in a day or so."

AFTER MCCAIN ARRIVED:

Republican revolt stalled urgent efforts to lash together a national economic rescue plan Thursday, a chaotic turnaround on a day that had seemed headed for a success that President Bush, both political parties and their presidential candidates could celebrate at an extraordinary White House meeting.

Weary congressional negotiators worked into the night, joined by Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson in an effort to revive or rework the $700 billion proposal that President Bush said must be quickly approved by Congress to stave off potentially "a long and deep recession."

They gave up after 10 p.m. EDT, more than an hour after the lone House Republican involved, Rep. Spencer Bachus of Alabama, left the room. Democrats blamed the House Republicans for the apparent stalemate. Those conservatives have complained that the plan would be too costly for taxpayers and would be an unacceptable federal intrusion into private business.

Wow, thanks for getting to Warshington to make sure this deal went through, McCain.

Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid announced a new round of late-night discussions Thursday in a bid to get the deal back on track, set to be joined by Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson and Federal Reserve chief Ben Bernanke.

"John McCain did nothing to help, he only hurt the process," the senior Democrat said at a joint news conference with Senate banking committee chairman Christopher Dodd.

Barney Frank, the Democratic chair of the House of Representatives financial services committee, said: "I think this was a campaign ploy for Senator McCain.

"I think they then had the problem that there might not have been enough of a deadlock for him to resolve," he said, after Dodd had earlier announced an in-principle agreement with some senior Republicans on the bailout package.

The meeting convened by Bush was a "photo op and political theater that had nothing to do with us getting to work," Dodd said.

Let's hear it for McCain's pseudo-campaign suspension to hammer out this deal. Didn't he do great?

Donald_McRonald

2008-09-25 11:01:01 PM

Coco LaFemme: McCain's not showing up tomorrow night, is he? LOL

McCain just shiat his pants. So, nothing out of the ordinary.

bubbaprog

2008-09-25 11:01:29 PM

THEY WERE JUST BEING REBELLION

bulldg4life

2008-09-25 11:01:32 PM

Epsilon: So will McCain's evil plan to sabotage the debates work in his favor? That is the big question.

That's what I've been wondering.

Democrats and Republicans are already set in their analysis of the situation.

So, I've really been trying to find independents to explain how they feel about the situation.

I would think that if they watch CNN (ignoring MSNBC and Fox for bias) then they think it is a political stunt that has failed.

captsaveahoe

2008-09-25 11:01:46 PM

pup.socket

2008-09-25 11:01:56 PM

so, is it a part of the McCain drama, or what?

adamgreeney

2008-09-25 11:02:06 PM

Tacoby Bellisbury: tallsails: A question worth considering - if McCain drops out of the race (which would explain his last 4 stunts...), does Palin become the nominee candidate?

FarKnight: Question: Is the house republicans more paleoconservative than the Senate or vice versa? Which are moar neoconservative?

Question- does boldface make you cool? Answer: No

Stop. farking stop. I hate the fact that i go from hating everything you say to thinking that i want to have a beer with you. You are messing with my head.

tallsails

2008-09-25 11:02:13 PM

Wassamatta taco boy, you went to USC?

milk_plus

2008-09-25 11:02:45 PM

The GOP is generating a crisis by walking out on talks so McCain can come in and pretend to resolve it while farking up the debate schedule to help Palin out. Great work folks, you're a real credit to your country.

GAT_00

2008-09-25 11:02:48 PM

I didn't think I could hate the Republicans more. I have been proven wrong yet again. That's only the 25th time that's happened.

PUFTAS

2008-09-25 11:03:01 PM

"Finally, something we agree on."

/best I could find.

Prospero424

2008-09-25 11:03:12 PM

Oh, they'll make lots of noise to try to suck up to the fiscally-conservative base, but big business runs the Republican party, and big business gets what it wants from Republicans 99% of the time.

I mean, maybe if the conservative base got as active over this $700 billion as they did when they thought the Mexicans were gonna get amnesty, their lawmakers might listen to them.

But I guess they have their priorities...

cchris_39

2008-09-25 11:03:41 PM

bulldg4life: I'm just glad that people are finding a way to defend McCain on this whole thing.

Paulson/Bush/Democrats: $700 billion (round one) to cover losses for Wall Street.

McCain: Wait a minute. We'll insure/guarantee the loans, the Wall Street firms will pay us the insurance premiums, and we'll force them to work out the recovery.

Pretty obvious if you ask me. But you could always call Obama (if you need him)

CogentSpirit

2008-09-25 11:03:42 PM

The republican party finally seems to be coming apart at the seems. The small government folks are finally ripping apart from the big business folks, neither of which cares about supporting the religious wing as represented in Sarah Palin.

And look at what they are proposing less regulations and less taxes, exactly the type of thing that got us into this mess.

Having less taxes devalues the dollar to compensate for the increased amount of capital in the market. Taxes end up as a zero sum if done well and in the right proportion to the cost of living. Increasing taxes means that the dollar is worth more in proportion to the amount of capital it removes from the market.

Mordac Lord of Unholy Fury

2008-09-25 11:03:44 PM

bobbette: //cannot deal with this Republican WHARRRGARBL approach. Where are their brains? Do they know what a bank is? Have they ever watched even a few minutes of CNBC?

What WHARRGARBL? Instead of the taxpayers being on the hook for the bill, they want it privately funded. Instead of the Treasury shoving this down Congress' throat, they are actually talking about things and thinking of better ideas.

Isn't that what you all want? To not have to pay for Wall Street's blunders? Seems like a much better proposal to me. And at least we are thinking of different solutions that don't screw over the Average Joe.

But no, you want to biatch no matter what they do. fark off if you aren't going to be constructive.

lexslamman

2008-09-25 11:03:44 PM

A quick timeline:

Early 9/25 AM: Republicans and Democrats in Congress state that they are near a deal on bailout
Later 9/25 AM: Repblicans and Democrats in Congress state a deal has been reached on the bailout
Early 9/25 afternoon: McCain finally shows up in Warshington and meets with Congressional Republicans
Late 9/25 afternoon: Bush meets with bipartisan Congressional leadership, Obama, and McCain
Early 9/25 evening: Congressional Republicans state there is no way the bailout passes
Late 9/25 evening: McCain states that since the bailout hasn't passed, he's still considering not showing up to debate
Now: We all learn that the deal-breaker for the GOP was a capital gains tax cut and more deregulation.

Wait... what?

Aeonite

2008-09-25 11:03:59 PM

[image from i33.tinypic.com too old to be available]

hyperdream

2008-09-25 11:04:18 PM

Tacoby Bellisbury: Sigh, Palin should get in the ring and straighten this all out. When's the Pit bull coming off the leash?

Funny thing about the pitbull... since they never bothered to check beforehand, they didn't realize she barks like a chihuahua and has a bad habit of unintentionally biting her master.

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-25 11:04:48 PM

milk_plus: The GOP is generating a crisis by walking out on talks so McCain can come in and pretend to resolve it while farking up the debate schedule to help Palin out. Great work folks, you're a real credit to your country.

I dunno...the fiscal conservatives have really been annoyed with McCain. They might just be willing to let McCain go down in flames. Him chumming up with Bush today couldn't have helped in their eyes.

I have to hope...don't I?

SilentStrider

2008-09-25 11:04:48 PM

You know
The Daily Show just did a comparison of Bush's speeches last night, and regarding going to war in Iraq.

The similarities are amazing.

Bucky Katt

2008-09-25 11:04:49 PM

eyehate: They certainly are.

yep

Tacoby Bellisbury

2008-09-25 11:05:23 PM

adamgreeney: Stop. farking stop. I hate the fact that i go from hating everything you say to thinking that i want to have a beer with you. You are messing with my head.

It's what I do. Confusion is my medium. Tell you what, you can publicly hate me but tell yourself that I'm OK

FredaDeStilleto

2008-09-25 11:05:36 PM

lexslamman: Let's hear it for McCain's pseudo-campaign suspension to hammer out this deal. Didn't he do great?

In his mind, yes. He'll ride in on a white horse and bring the House Rep around. That's the plan. It will "stop" the criticism that he has no economic experience. He wants to come out of this looking like HE brokered the deal.

The Great EZE

2008-09-25 11:05:44 PM

bubbaprog: THEY WERE JUST BEING REBELLION

Ain't no sin to wreck the bail out deal.

tallsails

2008-09-25 11:05:47 PM

Chris Rock on Larry king tonight

"She is gonna be vice president and has only done 3 interviews? I did more than that today..."

"The country is broke, broke, broke, and lemma tell ya, black people know a lot about dealin with bein broke..."

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-25 11:06:42 PM

SilentStrider: You know
The Daily Show just did a comparison of Bush's speeches last night, and regarding going to war in Iraq.

The similarities are amazing.

Just wait until he starts going on about Pakistan...

newmoonpuppyhead

2008-09-25 11:06:44 PM

FredaDeStilleto: lexslamman: Let's hear it for McCain's pseudo-campaign suspension to hammer out this deal. Didn't he do great?

In his mind, yes. He'll ride in on a white horse and bring the House Rep around. That's the plan. It will "stop" the criticism that he has no economic experience. He wants to come out of this looking like HE brokered the deal.

Ding!

bobbette

2008-09-25 11:08:41 PM

Or, what you will have to make a shelter once the market opens tomorrow...

Please tell me the American people are going to see through this attempt to play stupid political games with the entire economy. (I hate the phrase "playing politics" because, of course, everything is playing politics and nobody in politics ever stops playing politics, but this is criminally insane timing.) That you could try to score points in the polls for sabotaging attempts to fix the economy, because the measures it would take are unpopular... COME ON. Do your job, which is to govern the United States, not destabilize its economic fundamentals even further.

FarKnight

2008-09-25 11:08:50 PM

southaustin

2008-09-25 11:08:58 PM

Tacoby Bellisbury: It's what I do. Confusion is my medium. Tell you what, you can publicly hate me but tell yourself that I'm OK

Meanwhile, I've decided to be in love with you. It all works out.

Coco LaFemme

2008-09-25 11:09:28 PM

Get ready for the Obama Town Hall tomorrow night. And bring marshmallows to roast in the flames of McCain's campaign.

SilentStrider

2008-09-25 11:09:52 PM

heh. And now TDS is ripping McCain for taking his sweet time to get back to Washington from NYC.

DistendedPendulusFrenulum

2008-09-25 11:10:22 PM

Tacoby Bellisbury: bulldg4life: reduction in taxes would help lower taxes.

So?

Increase in prices would increase prices

.

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-25 11:10:39 PM

SilentStrider: heh. And now TDS is ripping McCain for taking his sweet time to get back to Washington from NYC.

I guess he just can't turn down a hot date.

...or Katie Couric.

guesser

2008-09-25 11:11:03 PM

I just hope McCain can talk some sense into these people and get this deal brokered. If anyone can get it done, it's The Maverick! Thankfully the conservatives saw the light and held onto their votes long enough for McCain to come to the rescue. I love it when it all works out in the end, and the Hero comes out smelling like a rose. If I didn't know better, I'd say this was all scripted....nah.

I_Hate_Iowa

2008-09-25 11:11:08 PM

Hahahaha.

Daily Show timeline of events:

-Fundamentals of a deal are agreed upon
-John McCain returns to Washington
-Deal falls apart

Mordac Lord of Unholy Fury

2008-09-25 11:12:25 PM

FarKnight

Pretty much.

Peter von Nostrand

2008-09-25 11:12:30 PM

So according to the GOP, this is a full crisis and we have to act swiftly and decisively to avert an economic melt down. So, what do they do, play political games with it (as usual.) Makes me wonder if this really is that much of a crisis.

bulldg4life

2008-09-25 11:12:56 PM

cchris_39: Paulson/Bush/Democrats: $700 billion (round one) to cover losses for Wall Street.

McCain: Wait a minute. We'll insure/guarantee the loans, the Wall Street firms will pay us the insurance premiums, and we'll force them to work out the recovery.

Pretty obvious if you ask me. But you could always call Obama (if you need him)

Hey, ya know, other than McCain not proposing that plan since it was actually conservative republicans from the House and McCain not providing any proposal at all other than a bullet point list similar to Obama's plan...you're totally right.

And, by totally right, I mean not right at all.

Conservative house republicans are the ones balking at this idea and that has absolutely nothing to do with McCain whatsoever.

FredaDeStilleto

2008-09-25 11:13:00 PM

bobette; Please tell me the American people are going to see through this attempt to play stupid political games with the entire economy.

Turn on FOX news tomorrow and watch your head spin in the mirror.
I'd like to think that what McCain is doing is evident to any reasonable person. But there is a faction of voters who listen and never think.

Unemployedingreenland

2008-09-25 11:13:07 PM

The Nixonian-era plan continues to unfold perfectly. McCain and Palin are doing all they can to lose the election but still ensure a good amount of ill will is felt by the "base" -- ill will that will come in handy in 2012. Meanwhile, the entrenchment of the military industrial complex is proceeding nicely, and soon the financial/governmental cabal will be brought into the world fully formed and armed to the teeth. Although the Dems will win in '08, things are crapped up way beyond anyone's ability to improve the situation meaningfully in a few short years. The combination of the short memory of the American public, the effective castigation of the media, and the aforementioned ill will will sweep a new neo-coservative government into Washington in only four years. By then technological wizardry, media fecklessness, unopposed erosion of liberty, awesome financial and military power and THE WILL OF THE SUPERMEN will sweep this nation into it's grandest hour, leading to generations and possibly centuries of THE NEW AMERICAN MILLENIUM. All those who stand in the way will be marginalized or eliminated.

/or something like that

Gwendolyn

2008-09-25 11:13:11 PM

I've been waiting for some true fiscal conservatives to show up in my government. Could this possibly be them??

darknys

2008-09-25 11:13:26 PM

You know who could solve this crisis?

Count DeMoney.

hubiestubert

2008-09-25 11:13:41 PM

lexslamman: BEFORE MCCAIN GOT THERE:

Congress looked close to reaching a deal to approve a $700 billion plan to bail out the U.S. financial system and President George W. Bush called an emergency meeting for Thursday to hammer out details.
The move toward a deal will likely calm U.S. markets, which were in turmoil on Wednesday as negotiations dragged on. Investors stampeded into cash and safe-haven assets, briefly sending short-term interest rates below zero. Experts said banks were hoarding cash, fearful that if they loaned money to other banks they might not get repaid.
But with a deal near, U.S. stock futures were up about 0.5 percent after earlier being negative, suggesting a firmer open for Wall Street on Thursday. Asian stock markets also retraced earlier losses.
Bush warned of a looming economic disaster if Congress failed to act swiftly to fund the $700 billion bailout that would be larger than the total cost of the Iraq war.
Bush offered few details about the makeup of the emerging deal for a bailout.
U.S. congressional Democrats and Republicans plan to meet on Thursday to draft a final bipartisan plan, a Democratic source told Reuters on Wednesday night.
"Not too many unresolved issues remain," the source said.
Earlier on Wednesday, Senate Banking Committee Chairman Christopher Dodd expressed optimism a deal was nearing.
"We're not there yet," Dodd told reporters, adding there was a "good possibility we'll get there in a day or so."

AFTER MCCAIN ARRIVED:

Republican revolt stalled urgent efforts to lash together a national economic rescue plan Thursday, a chaotic turnaround on a day that had seemed headed for a success that President Bush, both political parties and their presidential candidates could celebrate at an extraordinary White House meeting.

Weary congressional negotiators worked into the night, joined by Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson in an effort to revive or rework the $700 billion proposal that President Bush said must be quickly approved by Congress to stave off potentially "a long and deep recession."

They gave up after 10 p.m. EDT, more than an hour after the lone House Republican involved, Rep. Spencer Bachus of Alabama, left the room. Democrats blamed the House Republicans for the apparent stalemate. Those conservatives have complained that the plan would be too costly for taxpayers and would be an unacceptable federal intrusion into private business.

Wow, thanks for getting to Warshington to make sure this deal went through, McCain.

Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid announced a new round of late-night discussions Thursday in a bid to get the deal back on track, set to be joined by Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson and Federal Reserve chief Ben Bernanke.

"John McCain did nothing to help, he only hurt the process," the senior Democrat said at a joint news conference with Senate banking committee chairman Christopher Dodd.

Barney Frank, the Democratic chair of the House of Representatives financial services committee, said: "I think this was a campaign ploy for Senator McCain.

"I think they then had the problem that there might not have been enough of a deadlock for him to resolve," he said, after Dodd had earlier announced an in-principle agreement with some senior Republicans on the bailout package.

The meeting convened by Bush was a "photo op and political theater that had nothing to do with us getting to work," Dodd said.

Let's hear it for McCain's pseudo-campaign suspension to hammer out this deal. Didn't he do great?

The article fails to mention that McCain put forth, in the meeting with Bush and Obama, a proposal of his own--one for half the money that has been asked for, but retaining many of the more toxic elements of the previous proposal, and entirely blindsided BOTH sides of the debate for the deal, and sparked new debate.

It's not just that he rolled in and instantly his presence touched off problems with the deal, but that he wanted to insert his own deal to the President without any Congressional oversight or approval. Essentially he Mavericked his own party to the punch.

Heckuva job there...

Girl From The North Country

2008-09-25 11:14:13 PM

lexslamman: A quick timeline:

Early 9/25 AM: Republicans and Democrats in Congress state that they are near a deal on bailout
Later 9/25 AM: Repblicans and Democrats in Congress state a deal has been reached on the bailout
Early 9/25 afternoon: McCain finally shows up in Warshington and meets with Congressional Republicans
Late 9/25 afternoon: Bush meets with bipartisan Congressional leadership, Obama, and McCain
Early 9/25 evening: Congressional Republicans state there is no way the bailout passes
Late 9/25 evening: McCain states that since the bailout hasn't passed, he's still considering not showing up to debate
Now: We all learn that the deal-breaker for the GOP was a capital gains tax cut and more deregulation.

Wait... what?

Your timeline is missing the critical point of when Tucker Carlson gave credit to McCain for the deal being done. Of course that was before the deal was undone.

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-25 11:14:22 PM

guesser: Thankfully the conservatives saw the light and held onto their votes long enough for McCain to come to the rescue. I love it when it all works out in the end, and the Hero comes out smelling like a rose. If I didn't know better, I'd say this was all scripted....nah.

Oddly enough, according to this, Obama brought up the idea of the new plan:

TheOther

2008-09-25 11:14:32 PM

Dr. Obama wants to stop the bleeding.

Dr. McCain wants to argue over who is going to pay for the ambulance ride, the charges for filing insurance claims, malpractice waivers and how cute Candystriper Palin looks in that outfit.

darknys

2008-09-25 11:14:43 PM

Unemployedingreenland

Your tinfoil... I can has?

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-25 11:15:10 PM

Dammit, THIS is the Link (new window)

bulldg4life

2008-09-25 11:15:12 PM

Girl From The North Country: Your timeline is missing the critical point of when Tucker Carlson gave credit to McCain for the deal being done. Of course that was before the deal was undone.

Tucker Bounds.

But hey, all Tuckers are jackasses

Lawnchair

2008-09-25 11:15:13 PM

HOUSE Republicans?

What can HOUSE Republicans do?

I don't get it.

I mean, the Senate GOP could, if necessary, filibuster something. There are enough of them.

The House Dems are in the majority. There is no filibuster in the House. End debate and vote, biatch.

Sure, Bush could veto it. Would he?

Make him.

Indis

2008-09-25 11:15:25 PM

Tacoby Bellisbury: Sigh, Palin should get in the ring and straighten this all out. When's the Pit bull coming off the leash?

She's off, and chewing on some shoes. Looking an awful lot like she's about to pee on the rug.

servoled

2008-09-25 11:15:28 PM

I'm tempted to think McCain caused the deal to fall through, but from the reports he didn't do much more than sit there during the meeting.

Gwendolyn

2008-09-25 11:15:35 PM

mizchief: Finally SOMEONE in our government that doesn't want to use taxpayer money as a first resort. I'm trying to figure out exactly who these congressmen are and if I get the chance to vote for them.

My only choice is Steny "Who can I write this blank check to again" Hoyer and some guy that the RNC isn't even really helping on his campaign because there is no way in hell Hoyer can loose unless he's caught with his dick in a dead 5 year old.

Unemployedingreenland

2008-09-25 11:15:50 PM

darknys

Your tinfoil... I can has?

No. I'm still using it.

alostpacket

2008-09-25 11:16:08 PM

Tacoby Bellisbury: Question- does boldface make you cool? Answer: No

Question: How do you spell Molecular?

lexslamman

2008-09-25 11:16:11 PM

mizchief: The plan also calls for: participating firms to disclose the value of the mortgage assets on their books, ending Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac's securitization of "unsound mortgages," reviewing the performance of the credit rating agencies and having the Securities and Exchange Commission audit failed companies to ensure their financial standing was accurately portrayed.

So in other words, half the bailout with little oversight and less regulation.

Typical GOP pandering and wealth-baiting.

BigG

2008-09-25 11:16:15 PM

FredaDeStilleto: Turn on FOX news tomorrow and watch your head spin in the mirror.

I watch FOX & Friends in the morning. It's a better wakeup than any caffeine could possibly be.

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-25 11:16:23 PM

servoled: I'm tempted to think McCain caused the deal to fall through, but from the reports he didn't do much more than sit there during the meeting.

Did anyone hold a mirror in front of his mouth?

alybaba

2008-09-25 11:16:44 PM

I thought this is where McCain would become a Maverick and break with Bush and not support the bailout. But then that would throw his entire "suspend campaign to work on the financial crisis" excuse out of the water.

Death to America

2008-09-25 11:17:06 PM

WTF is this shiat. Is the rest of the world watching this? Or are we in some kind of china like firewall bubble reality, i get that feeling sometimes. This is a god damn nightmare.

Gwendolyn

2008-09-25 11:17:27 PM

Owangotang: Gwendolyn: I've been waiting for some true fiscal conservatives to show up in my government. Could this possibly be them??

It'd be nice. Now if such fiscal conservatives are confirmed to be more that apparitions then I hope at least one is a social liberal. Someday, it has to happen, right?

Well I could run for office but I had way too much sex in college to be a viable female candidate.

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-25 11:17:39 PM

Gwendolyn: My only choice is Steny "Who can I write this blank check to again" Hoyer and some guy that the RNC isn't even really helping on his campaign because there is no way in hell Hoyer can loose unless he's caught with his dick in a dead 5 year old.

Girl or boy?

whereisian

2008-09-25 11:18:12 PM

*faceplam* Get your shiat together Americans.

bulldg4life

2008-09-25 11:18:14 PM

IXI Jim IXI: Dammit, THIS is the Link (new window)

ahahahhahahahahhaha

I must see more proof of this. That would be hilarious.

newmoonpuppyhead

2008-09-25 11:18:23 PM

Does the McCain campaign do anything original?

Late Thursday, McCain's campaign issued a statement saying, "the plan that has been put forth by the administration does not enjoy the confidence of the American people as it will not protect the taxpayers and will sacrifice Main Street in favor of Wall Street."

They hijack every single Obama phrase.

Andric

2008-09-25 11:18:28 PM

servoled: I'm tempted to think McCain caused the deal to fall through, but from the reports he didn't do much more than sit there during the meeting.

According to CNN, he met with the dissenting Republicans before the White House meeting; so he didn't have to do much, as his dirty work was already done.

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-25 11:18:56 PM

newmoonpuppyhead: They hijack every single Obama phrase.

And most of his positions.

Loneman1

2008-09-25 11:19:05 PM

hyperdream: Tacoby Bellisbury: Sigh, Palin should get in the ring and straighten this all out. When's the Pit bull coming off the leash?

Funny thing about the pitbull... since they never bothered to check beforehand, they didn't realize she barks like a chihuahua and has a bad habit of unintentionally biting her master.

Wow...that was pretty damn good.

davidlachnicht

2008-09-25 11:19:05 PM

Okay, libs, answer me this:
Why do you need the GOP to approve this?
SERIOUSLY, I want an answer.
Democrats control both houses, why not just vote on it and get it over with

One F Jef

2008-09-25 11:19:12 PM

You 'pubs done farked up now.

You can play politics with dead soldiers.

You can play politics with uninsured children.

You can play politics with minorities.

You can play politics with our gas pumps.

But you can NOT, you can NOT play politics with Wall Street. This is gonna bite them in the ass.

Biological Ali

2008-09-25 11:19:24 PM

hubiestubert: Essentially he Mavericked his own party to the punch.

Yep, they never saw it coming.

/maverickroll?

Gwendolyn

2008-09-25 11:19:36 PM

IXI Jim IXI: Gwendolyn: My only choice is Steny "Who can I write this blank check to again" Hoyer and some guy that the RNC isn't even really helping on his campaign because there is no way in hell Hoyer can loose unless he's caught with his dick in a dead 5 year old.

Girl or boy?

Girl. The gay scandals are Republican silly.

BigG

2008-09-25 11:19:54 PM

Andric: According to CNN, he met with the dissenting Republicans before the White House meeting; so he didn't have to do much, as his dirty work was already done.

Why do you think they waited until he was back in town to revolt?

So he can be seen as "THE MAVRICK"^TM and get some distance from Bush.

bulldg4life

2008-09-25 11:20:20 PM

davidlachnicht: Why do you need the GOP to approve this?
SERIOUSLY, I want an answer.
Democrats control both houses, why not just vote on it and get it over with

Because they want the GOP to back the proposal of a GOP president.

The GOP is going to stonewall and force the Dems to move forward. Then, when Bush signs it and the economy tanks anyway, their hands are clean and they can blame the Dems even though it was the GOP that cried wolf about the need to do something.

Astroturfing the Internet

2008-09-25 11:20:42 PM

Any time a bill is stampeded through congress, it should be suspect.
The fearmongering and faux urgency is what got us Iraq, The Patriot Act, and the ever expanding list of companies jumping ship onto the free money bailout barge. A hasty law that no one has really had a chance to scrutinize is often worse than no new law at all.

If we don't get a better deal now, we never will.
As soon as congress issues Paulson his blank check, the bargaining power of the american people to attach this with legislation to actually *fix the problem* will pass.

Actually call your congresscritter, they just ignore the interwebz.
[Congress.org] Congressional Directory

Or take to the streets and force them to hear your voice.
[TrueMajority.org] Reject the Blank Check Bailout ! Protest Events Calendar and Contacts

/ I'll be the angry guy, with the "No Cash for Wall St. Trash" protest sign

cameroncrazy1984

2008-09-25 11:20:50 PM

davidlachnicht: Okay, libs, answer me this:
Why do you need the GOP to approve this?
SERIOUSLY, I want an answer.
Democrats control both houses, why not just vote on it and get it over with

Because they don't have a filibuster proof majority?

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-25 11:20:59 PM

Gwendolyn: Girl. The gay scandals are Republican silly.

Hahahhah...I'm glad I wasn't the only one thinking that.

thegoodthebadthedumb

2008-09-25 11:21:18 PM

Forgive me if the answer to this question is obvious, but why is the approval of a few conservative House Republicans even needed? Since when do bills need unanimous approval for passage?

If I'm not mistaken, Democrats have a majority in both houses?

What am I missing?

Girl From The North Country

2008-09-25 11:21:19 PM

bulldg4life: Girl From The North Country: Your timeline is missing the critical point of when Tucker Carlson gave credit to McCain for the deal being done. Of course that was before the deal was undone.

Tucker Bounds.

But hey, all Tuckers are jackasses

Hahahaha. I almost said "Tucker what's-his-name" but went with Carlson because it sounded familiar.

/they do kind of look alike

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-25 11:22:24 PM

Owangotang: On a separate note, who knew the most important election in my lifetime, to this point, would be so fun?

I find that it helps if you just take your mind off of the country going into the shiatter, and just enjoy the ride.

orclover

2008-09-25 11:22:40 PM

davidlachnicht: Okay, libs, answer me this:
Why do you need the GOP to approve this?
SERIOUSLY, I want an answer.
Democrats control both houses, why not just vote on it and get it over with

Because thats a load of blame that needs to be spread around equally. Everybody sign it, or just let the nation burn to the ground. Hell we've had a good run.

bulldg4life

2008-09-25 11:22:47 PM

Girl From The North Country: /they do kind of look alike

And they are both incredible douchebags

milk_plus

2008-09-25 11:23:08 PM

alybaba: I thought this is where McCain would become a Maverick and break with Bush and not support the bailout. But then that would throw his entire "suspend campaign to work on the financial crisis" excuse out of the water.

"Hold on everybody, I have to fark this bipartisan effort up!" is an unusual leadership position but I'll grant him this, it's mavericky.

davidlachnicht

2008-09-25 11:23:20 PM

bulldg4life: davidlachnicht: Why do you need the GOP to approve this?
SERIOUSLY, I want an answer.
Democrats control both houses, why not just vote on it and get it over with

Because they want the GOP to back the proposal of a GOP president.

The GOP is going to stonewall and force the Dems to move forward. Then, when Bush signs it and the economy tanks anyway, their hands are clean and they can blame the Dems even though it was the GOP that cried wolf about the need to do something.

Tanks anyway? why do ths at all then??

Death to America

2008-09-25 11:23:32 PM

Stop the polical bullshiat this thing was passed around the same time it was written, months ago.

But way to go McCain! I knew he had a few tricks up his sleeve! You will be an awesome puppet, don't worry apprently now "live" presidental addresses are prerecorded and the media is under complete governmental/corporate control.

One F Jef

2008-09-25 11:23:40 PM

thegoodthebadthedumb: Forgive me if the answer to this question is obvious, but why is the approval of a few conservative House Republicans even needed? Since when do bills need unanimous approval for passage?

If I'm not mistaken, Democrats have a majority in both houses?

What am I missing?

Why the fark do you dumb asses keep saying that.

The republicans have enough to filibuster, and they do it ALL THE farkING TIME. Good god, get a brain morans. I'm sure you stupid motherfarkers are gonna tell me I spelled that wrong too. SHE-it.

Gwendolyn

2008-09-25 11:23:41 PM

Don't get me wrong I like Hoyer on his social issues, usually, but dear god the man's never met a spending bill he didn't like.

Bonkthat_Again

2008-09-25 11:23:42 PM

God damn it, people, this isn't something to joke about.

I'm sorry to rain on this nice little trainwreck thread. But this country obviously does not understand what's happening to it, its people, or its finances, and making comments like some of these farking trolls have the potential to literally destroy a country on the rocks instead of saving it.

Get over yourselves, grow up, and shut the fark up, or face the consequences. This isn't a game.

NewportBarGuy

2008-09-25 11:23:53 PM

I nominate Heidi Montag as Secretary of the Treasury

Peter von Nostrand

2008-09-25 11:23:54 PM

It seems some new McCain talking points have just been issued. Something to do with Dems controlling Congress and what are they missing.......

bionicjoe

2008-09-25 11:24:01 PM

darknys: You know who could solve this crisis?

Count DeMoney.

Dee Moe-nay! Dee Moe-nay!!!!!!

lexslamman

2008-09-25 11:24:16 PM

Sen. Chris Dodd, the top Democrat on the Senate Banking Committee, said Thursday that bipartisan meeting with President Bush at the White House on the mortgage rescue plan was nothing short of a disaster. In an interview on the CNN cable news network, Dodd described a meeting in which Democrats were blindsided by a new core mortgage proposal from House Republicans, with the tacit backing of Republican presidential candidate John McCain. "I am not going to sign on to something I just saw this afternoon," he said. Dodd said Republicans and Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson had to decide what they wanted to support. The whole meeting "looked like a rescue plan for John McCain," Dodd said. He said he was simply going to pretend that the meeting had never happened

Ouch. Way to prove your bipartisanship, John McCain.

Girl From The North Country

2008-09-25 11:24:29 PM

davidlachnicht: Okay, libs, answer me this:
Why do you need the GOP to approve this?
SERIOUSLY, I want an answer.
Democrats control both houses, why not just vote on it and get it over with

So all the Republicans can go back to their constituants and say "I didn't have anything to do with that piece of crap legislation"? This is an election season and the cons got us into this mess so let them take 'credit' for the fix - no matter how painful it may be for them.

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-25 11:24:46 PM

milk_plus: "Hold on everybody, I have to fark this bipartisan effort up!" is an unusual leadership position but I'll grant him this, it's mavericky.

And if McCain knows how to do anything, it's crash things into the ground.

The_Gallant_Gallstone

2008-09-25 11:24:52 PM

Bonkthat_Again: Get over yourselves, grow up, and shut the fark up, or face the consequences. This isn't a game.

Marge... allow me to play Devil's Advocate...

mesohorny

2008-09-25 11:24:53 PM

Ron Paul is leading the way....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GHW-nY229U0 (new window)

seriously you guys are stupid if you support this bailout. The party leaders on both sides are using fear to get thing passed.

lexslamman

2008-09-25 11:25:28 PM

davidlachnicht: Okay, libs, answer me this:
Why do you need the GOP to approve this?
SERIOUSLY, I want an answer.
Democrats control both houses, why not just vote on it and get it over with

Because unlike John McCain, some people actually believe in the principles of bipartisanship and don't just like to talk about it.

Mordac Lord of Unholy Fury

2008-09-25 11:25:33 PM

And yet, the Libs are saying this is a bad thing. "Shove it through while we complain about it and somehow blame the GOP instead of think of alternative solutions that don't screw over the taxpayer." You have the majority Dems, its time to lead.

Peter von Nostrand: So according to the GOP, this is a full crisis and we have to act swiftly and decisively to avert an economic melt down. So, what do they do, play political games with it (as usual.) Makes me wonder if this really is that much of a crisis.

Newsflash: Not everyone in the same political party agrees with everyone else. Exhibit A: Progressives vs. Blue Dogs. Exhibit B: Environmentalists vs. Coal State Dems.

And this whole "Blame McCain for the failure" is stupid. There was never an agreement in the House. Everything fell apart in the caucus meetings and both sides of the leadership knew they wouldn't have the votes, so they never presented a plan for consideration. The House is kind of necessary to pass this whole thing along.

Edsel

2008-09-25 11:25:45 PM

BigG: Andric: According to CNN, he met with the dissenting Republicans before the White House meeting; so he didn't have to do much, as his dirty work was already done.

Why do you think they waited until he was back in town to revolt?

So he can be seen as "THE MAVRICK"TM and get some distance from Bush.

I don't think they have any love for McCain either. He's just a sideshow.

davidlachnicht

2008-09-25 11:26:26 PM

One F Jef: thegoodthebadthedumb: Forgive me if the answer to this question is obvious, but why is the approval of a few conservative House Republicans even needed? Since when do bills need unanimous approval for passage?

If I'm not mistaken, Democrats have a majority in both houses?

What am I missing?

Why the fark do you dumb asses keep saying that.

The republicans have enough to filibuster, and they do it ALL THE farkING TIME. Good god, get a brain morans. I'm sure you stupid motherfarkers are gonna tell me I spelled that wrong too. SHE-it.

But why fillabuster if it SUCKS? Surely the GOP would let it crash and let the Dems take all the blame.

thegoodthebadthedumb

2008-09-25 11:26:30 PM

I love it when a person resorts to ad hominem name calling and then FAILS miserably.

There is no filibustering in the House. There is only filibustering in the Senate. The Senate Republicans are on board.

You were saying....DUMBASS?

bulldg4life

2008-09-25 11:26:42 PM

I can't wait for McCain to start parroting the House republican plan tomorrow.

It'll be his plan to save America by tomorrow at 2pm.

The_Gallant_Gallstone

2008-09-25 11:26:46 PM

mesohorny: seriously you guys are stupid if you support this bailout. The party leaders on both sides are using fear to get thing passed.

I was lost in the wilderness of false political ideology... until a great leader showed me the error of my ways... I put my impressionable mind in the hands of this great leader, whose very name is synonomous with resolve and nobility... mesohorny

alostpacket

2008-09-25 11:26:56 PM

Or bush could even veto it claiming the dems passed something un-signable, either way, same result.

how about this davidlachnicht,

SERIOUSLY, I want an answer.
Republicans proposed this, why not just support it and get it over with.

Andric

2008-09-25 11:27:15 PM

IXI Jim IXI: And if McCain knows how to do anything, it's crash things into the ground.

If I could, I'd adjourn the thread. But as I can't, I'll just say you won and it's all downhill from here.

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-25 11:27:33 PM

Bonkthat_Again: This isn't a game

This is not a chawade...

bulldg4life

2008-09-25 11:27:45 PM

alostpacket: Or bush could even veto it claiming the dems passed something un-signable, either way, same result.

Bush won't veto it because it is his $700b plan. Plus, he's a lameduck anyway, he'll sign whatever they put in front of him.

newmoonpuppyhead

2008-09-25 11:28:08 PM

Bonkthat_Again: God damn it, people, this isn't something to joke about.

I'm sorry to rain on this nice little trainwreck thread. But this country obviously does not understand what's happening to it, its people, or its finances, and making comments like some of these farking trolls have the potential to literally destroy a country on the rocks instead of saving it.

Get over yourselves, grow up, and shut the fark up, or face the consequences. This isn't a game.

I agree. What do you think should be done?

Noirceuil

2008-09-25 11:28:18 PM

I may not be an American, but if i may put my opinion on what should be done.

1)Seize the assets of the CEO, CFO, Upper Management, Board of Directors of these companies.

2)Arrest them, and try them. Those that weren't involved in this go free, those that were are hung on national television.

3)Take the seized assets of the guilty and use that for the bailout.

4)For the remainder needed in the bailout, these companies, not just the assets go into a government holding company. They are regulated and watched over by the government. Shares of the companies are divided to tax payers based upon their actual taxes paid. 25% of their profits/loss must be paid out to the tax payers. If it's a loss a taxpayer gets a deduction for their share, if it's a gain they get it tax free. The other 75% goes to pay off their debt to the government. When they have paid off their debt, they are released from the holding company. They owe no more to the taxpayers or to the federal government, and are free to keep all future profit.

In the end the taxpayers get a 25% return on their investment, and the government paid nothing for the bailout. The people get justice in terms of seized property of the guilty party and watching them executed on TV. The remainder companies are more apt to be self-regulated as the CEO doesn't desire execution.

Peter von Nostrand

2008-09-25 11:28:29 PM

Mordac Lord of Unholy Fury: Newsflash: Not everyone in the same political party agrees with everyone else.

Wow and all this time I thought that everyone in the US was either a blue or red drone that thought the exact same thing within their group. Thank you for explaining that.

bobbette

2008-09-25 11:28:36 PM

One F Jef: You 'pubs done farked up now.

You can play politics with dead soldiers.

You can play politics with uninsured children.

You can play politics with minorities.

You can play politics with our gas pumps.

But you can NOT, you can NOT play politics with Wall Street. This is gonna bite them in the ass.

Yeah, I think this could seriously backfire. Could this turn off even Rupert Murdoch? Probably not... but I doubt there will be headlines in McCain's favour on Bloomberg and CNBC tomorrow.

davidlachnicht: Okay, libs, answer me this:
Why do you need the GOP to approve this?
SERIOUSLY, I want an answer.
Democrats control both houses, why not just vote on it and get it over with

It has to be perceived as being bipartisan, kind of like a war effort. It's a major rescue operation and spending money on what the public perceives as being Wall Street fat cats in a time of widespread economic trouble is politically unpopular.

I was actually impressed that the Democrats rallied to negotiate in such good faith. They want to have a strong position on economic issues while equally standing up for Main street. That the Republicans have essentially reversed their position in the past 24 hours to the original Democratic stance is what is so bizarre to me, because the Republicans are pro-business. So am I; I'm an odd combination of a social liberal and libertarian who is very pro-business and pro-economic growth. Right now, more deregulation is not pro-business. A recession certainly wouldn't be pro-business. Allowing the financial services giants to fall one after the other like so many dominoes is not pro-business. Like it or not, these are the companies that all of America's wealth flows through. It's terrifying that anyone could play a game of chicken with the major institutions of the American (and the world) economy.

davidlachnicht

2008-09-25 11:28:50 PM

lexslamman: Sen. Chris Dodd, the top Democrat on the Senate Banking Committee, said Thursday that bipartisan meeting with President Bush at the White House on the mortgage rescue plan was nothing short of a disaster. In an interview on the CNN cable news network, Dodd described a meeting in which Democrats were blindsided by a new core mortgage proposal from House Republicans, with the tacit backing of Republican presidential candidate John McCain. "I am not going to sign on to something I just saw this afternoon," he said. Dodd said Republicans and Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson had to decide what they wanted to support. The whole meeting "looked like a rescue plan for John McCain," Dodd said. He said he was simply going to pretend that the meeting had never happened

Ouch. Way to prove your bipartisanship, John McCain.

Not putting much stock into ANYTHING Dodd says these days --- he has a lot to lose... like his freedom!

Gwendolyn

2008-09-25 11:28:55 PM

Don't get me wrong I like Hoyer on his social issues, usually, but dear god the man's never met a spending bill he didn't like.

lexslamman: davidlachnicht: Okay, libs, answer me this:
Why do you need the GOP to approve this?
SERIOUSLY, I want an answer.
Democrats control both houses, why not just vote on it and get it over with

Because unlike John McCain, some people actually believe in the principles of bipartisanship and don't just like to talk about it.

Well actually it's because there are enough pissed off Republicans (and some Democrats) to filibuster. They can't vote on it yet.

Tacoby Bellisbury

2008-09-25 11:29:26 PM

alostpacket: Question: How do you spell Molecular?

ummm... way to ask a question and answer it at the same time. The fail is strong with you.

The_Gallant_Gallstone

2008-09-25 11:29:34 PM

alostpacket: SERIOUSLY, I want an answer.

I want answers now... or I want them eventually!

You ain't gettin' no damned answer son... John Boner or whatever his name is isn't going to get in his Maybach to personally deliver you a response.

8-bit-nintendo

2008-09-25 11:29:43 PM

OK, all I want to say is that these "conservative" congressmen that you are talking about.... they may be republican; however, they are neo-cons, not conservatives.

/carry on

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-25 11:29:45 PM

Mordac Lord of Unholy Fury: And yet, the Libs are saying this is a bad thing.

You know, if you keep throwing around words like 'libs' and 'Dems', people might think you're a bit...partisan.

Girl From The North Country

2008-09-25 11:29:52 PM

Owangotang: IXI Jim IXI: I find that it helps if you just take your mind off of the country going into the shiatter, and just enjoy the ride.

I'm well ahead of ya, bub. I play fantasy football. While this shiat is all mildly concerning, Adrian Peterson's hamstring is MUCH more important to me in the short term.

I've been spending way too much time on the Politics tab. I had no idea about Peterson's hammy. Very concerning....

/end threadjack

bartink

2008-09-25 11:29:53 PM

Noirceuil: I may not be an American, but if i may put my opinion on what should be done.

Hugo, is that you?

newmoonpuppyhead

2008-09-25 11:30:13 PM

bulldg4life: I can't wait for McCain to start parroting the House republican plan tomorrow.

It'll be his plan to save America by tomorrow at 2pm.

I can't wait!

Tune into tomorrow for..."How Stupid is America: Part XXXXIIIXIV and a half"

Cathedralmaster

2008-09-25 11:30:28 PM

There's no fighting in the war room!

/Sorry, Dr. Strangelove keeps coming to mind when it comes to this whole crisis for some reason. I can just see McCain as Dr. Strangelove, only instead of "Mein Fuhrer!" it's "POW!".

sonnyboy11

2008-09-25 11:30:32 PM

That's what I am thinking too. No doubt we have some issues that need to be addressed in our financial sector. The Bush economy is not as strong as we have been led to believe. But I really think McCain's campaign saw this as a chance to show what a great leader McCain could be under the right circumstances and they even convinced Bush to get up there are give a 'doom and gloom' speech yesterday to make it all seem necessary.

The added side bonus is the attempt to move the vice-presidential debate to an 'unspecified' time and keep Palin away from the spotlight, especially after the disaster on Couric's show today.

As far as I can tell, it's not working. Most people are seeing these moves as political grandstanding and bullshiat. All you need to do is watch that Palin interview and ask yourself "Is this someone I want to potentially be the most powerful political leader in the world". If you answer 'yes' to that question, then you haven't been paying attention.

Gwendolyn

2008-09-25 11:31:11 PM

davidlachnicht: lexslamman: Sen. Chris Dodd, the top Democrat on the Senate Banking Committee, said Thursday that bipartisan meeting with President Bush at the White House on the mortgage rescue plan was nothing short of a disaster. In an interview on the CNN cable news network, Dodd described a meeting in which Democrats were blindsided by a new core mortgage proposal from House Republicans, with the tacit backing of Republican presidential candidate John McCain. "I am not going to sign on to something I just saw this afternoon," he said. Dodd said Republicans and Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson had to decide what they wanted to support. The whole meeting "looked like a rescue plan for John McCain," Dodd said. He said he was simply going to pretend that the meeting had never happened

Ouch. Way to prove your bipartisanship, John McCain.

Not putting much stock into ANYTHING Dodd says these days --- he has a lot to lose... like his freedom!

Yeah Dodd isn't exactly a neutral party in this.

Campaign donors (new window)

IStateTheObvious

2008-09-25 11:31:16 PM

alostpacket:

SERIOUSLY, I want an answer.
~~Republicans~~ Bush proposed this, why not just support it and get it over with.

FTFY

Bush isnt exactly popular even among Republicans.

Bucky Katt

2008-09-25 11:31:16 PM

Gwendolyn: I've been waiting for some true fiscal conservatives to show up in my government. Could this possibly be them??

no.

captsaveahoe

2008-09-25 11:31:24 PM

The_Gallant_Gallstone

2008-09-25 11:31:40 PM

Noirceuil: 2)Arrest them, and try them. Those that weren't involved in this go free, those that were are hung on national television.

I call for a seat on the Tribunal of the Peoples' Court!

I've always wanted to hurl abuse at my socio-economic betters without being harrassed by The Bacon.

Enchantrem

2008-09-25 11:31:56 PM

Noirceuil: I may not be an American, but if i may put my opinion on what should be done.

1)Seize the assets of the CEO, CFO, Upper Management, Board of Directors of these companies.

2)Arrest them, and try them. Those that weren't involved in this go free, those that were are hung on national television.

3)Take the seized assets of the guilty and use that for the bailout.

4)For the remainder needed in the bailout, these companies, not just the assets go into a government holding company. They are regulated and watched over by the government. Shares of the companies are divided to tax payers based upon their actual taxes paid. 25% of their profits/loss must be paid out to the tax payers. If it's a loss a taxpayer gets a deduction for their share, if it's a gain they get it tax free. The other 75% goes to pay off their debt to the government. When they have paid off their debt, they are released from the holding company. They owe no more to the taxpayers or to the federal government, and are free to keep all future profit.

In the end the taxpayers get a 25% return on their investment, and the government paid nothing for the bailout. The people get justice in terms of seized property of the guilty party and watching them executed on TV. The remainder companies are more apt to be self-regulated as the CEO doesn't desire execution.

You must be from one of them socialist countries. Don't you know that in America the only people who actually take risks and suffer consequences in business are small business owners? Once you hit publicly traded status, you're immune to all consequences.

PresidentPutz

2008-09-25 11:31:57 PM

It's an election year. They are either doing it to look like "Navericks" or to make the other guys look like A-Holes.
These asshats aren't doing it for a noble cause.

Give a politician a soapbox and he's gonna build a skyscraper on it to be the center of attention.

Meanwhile, you, I and our children get to eat shiat for the Wall Street Scumbags who, after the dust settles, will still have their Bentlys, Houses in the Hamptons and greater disdain and disrespect for the us, the people whose sweat, retirements and mortgages pay for their lives of luxury and greed.

The bulls of Wall Street gored us all like we're on the streets of Pamplona and congress is watching it all from the second floor windows, laughing their asses off.

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-25 11:32:03 PM

Cathedralmaster: /Sorry, Dr. Strangelove keeps coming to mind when it comes to this whole crisis for some reason. I can just see McCain as Dr. Strangelove, only instead of "Mein Fuhrer!" it's "POW!".

I can see I've got some heavy photoshopping ahead of me this weekend...

One F Jef

2008-09-25 11:32:11 PM

alostpacket: bulldg4life: davidlachnicht: Why do you need the GOP to approve this?
SERIOUSLY, I want an answer.
Democrats control both houses, why not just vote on it and get it over with

Because they want the GOP to back the proposal of a GOP president.

The GOP is going to stonewall and force the Dems to move forward. Then, when Bush signs it and the economy tanks anyway, their hands are clean and they can blame the Dems even though it was the GOP that cried wolf about the need to do something.

Or bush could even veto it claiming the dems passed something un-signable, either way, same result.

how about this davidlachnicht,

SERIOUSLY, I want an answer.
Republicans proposed this, why not just support it and get it over with.

Who's the leader of the repulbican party until four months

thegoodthebadthedumb: One F Jef: thegoodthebadthedumb: Forgive me if the answer to this question is obvious, but why is the approval of a few conservative House Republicans even needed? Since when do bills need unanimous approval for passage?

If I'm not mistaken, Democrats have a majority in both houses?

What am I missing?

Why the fark do you dumb asses keep saying that.

The republicans have enough to filibuster, and they do it ALL THE farkING TIME. Good god, get a brain morans. I'm sure you stupid motherfarkers are gonna tell me I spelled that wrong too. SHE-it.

I love it when a person resorts to ad hominem name calling and then FAILS miserably.

There is no filibustering in the House. There is only filibustering in the Senate. The Senate Republicans are on board.

You were saying....DUMBASS?

Jesus christ don't run your farkin' mouth when you have no idea what the fark you are talking about.

Who's the President of this shiatty ass soon-to-be third world country? Oh yeah, the leader of the Republican party. Ohhh, right, the guy with the red crayon. Welcome to the red states, unity or death, gay sex with boys and fark the mexicans.

Welcome to Amerikuh.

newmoonpuppyhead

2008-09-25 11:32:11 PM

Clapclapclapclap!!

davidlachnicht

2008-09-25 11:32:26 PM

Exactly my point. If the GOP is REALLY to blame, why not wipe the floor with 'em on this, and pass whatever bill you want - go to the people and wall street and say, we're fixin' it, and the GOP can suck it. ?

PresidentPutz

2008-09-25 11:32:34 PM

Navericks = Mavericks

bionicjoe

2008-09-25 11:32:42 PM

I just Sen. Dodd on the news.

"We're not going to go ahead with a plan resting on a 3-legged stool!" or something to that affect.

[image from codinghorror.com too old to be available]

/Insert obligatory Dodd facepalm here
//double hot-linked for economic emergency

Chuck Ruffcorn

2008-09-25 11:33:13 PM

Crash and burn, eh Mav?

Does this "crisis" fall under the "Catastrphic Emergency" part of NSPD 51 & HSPD 20? How much longer before Bush declares Martial Law?

thegoodthebadthedumb

2008-09-25 11:33:14 PM

So in other words - Democrats can't pass this bill on their own because they're scared it won't work and then be blamed for it later? Sounds like the same chicken-shiat logic that caused them to vote FOR the Iraq war.

WTF? We finally control Congress and still need to get the GOP to approve everything we do or be scared of them being mean to us?

FARKING GROW A PAIR, DEMS!

The_Gallant_Gallstone

2008-09-25 11:33:19 PM

IXI Jim IXI: You know, if you keep throwing around words like 'libs' and 'Dems', people might think you're a bit...partisan.

Pfftt... typical liberal spin...

lexslamman

2008-09-25 11:33:39 PM

During the White House meeting, it appears that Sen. John McCain had an agenda. He brought up alternative proposals, surprising and angering Democrats. He did not, according to someone briefed on the meeting, provide specifics.

One the proposals -- favored by House Republicans -- would relax regulation and temporarily get rid of certain taxes in order to lure private industry into the market for these distressed assets.

That approach has been rejected by Senate Democrats, Senate Republicans and, to this point, the White House. During the meeting, according to someone briefed on it, Sec. Henry Paulson told those assembled that the approach was not workable.

There's a word for authorizing several hundred billion dollars of a bailout while cutting revenue.

That word is Retarded.

A month ago we were all saying that McCain would be 4 more years of Bush.

That was wrong.

McCain has shown himself to be WORSE than Bush.

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-25 11:34:05 PM

Owangotang: Yea, let's start executing people in the streets when they fark up at their jobs!

Although I think that's a bit extreme, I think there may be two major points to this:

These people who farked up their jobs did it, by in large, on purpose.

And these people who farked up their jobs affected the lives of millions of people.

newmoonpuppyhead

2008-09-25 11:34:46 PM

mizchief: Astroturfing the Internet: Any time a bill is stampeded through congress, it should be suspect.
The fearmongering and faux urgency is what got us Iraq, The Patriot Act, and the ever expanding list of companies jumping ship onto the free money bailout barge. A hasty law that no one has really had a chance to scrutinize is often worse than no new law at all.

Exaclty. This is like going on tilt when playing poker. You lose a quater of your stack so on the next hand you get pissed off and push it all in with a King-2 offsuit and lose it all.

I agree. But the problem is no one really understands what's going on except Paulson and Bernanke.

Gwendolyn

2008-09-25 11:34:50 PM

Cathedralmaster: Bonkthat_Again: God damn it, people, this isn't something to joke about.

I'm sorry to rain on this nice little trainwreck thread. But this country obviously does not understand what's happening to it, its people, or its finances, and making comments like some of these farking trolls have the potential to literally destroy a country on the rocks instead of saving it.

Get over yourselves, grow up, and shut the fark up, or face the consequences. This isn't a game.

There's no fighting in the war room!

/Sorry, Dr. Strangelove keeps coming to mind when it comes to this whole crisis for some reason. I can just see McCain as Dr. Strangelove, only instead of "Mein Fuhrer!" it's "POW!".

I keep thinking JESUS CHRIST! I said this shiat was going to happen like 8 years ago but does anyone listen to me? nooooo

quickdraw

2008-09-25 11:35:06 PM

IXI Jim IXI: Cathedralmaster: /Sorry, Dr. Strangelove keeps coming to mind when it comes to this whole crisis for some reason. I can just see McCain as Dr. Strangelove, only instead of "Mein Fuhrer!" it's "POW!".

I can see I've got some heavy photoshopping ahead of me this weekend...

I hardly know where to start. I've really been slacking lately with the pixel mangling.

alostpacket

2008-09-25 11:35:07 PM

Tacoby Bellisbury: alostpacket: Question: How do you spell Molecular?

ummm... way to ask a question and answer it at the same time. The fail is strong with you.

Oh hmm, what are your 4 PhD's in again?

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-25 11:35:19 PM

bionicjoe: "We're not going to go ahead with a plan resting on a 3-legged stool!" or something to that affect.

To be fair, if I had a three-legged stool, I'd go straight to the emergency room.

YixilTesiphon

2008-09-25 11:35:31 PM

Please don't let shiat hit the fan until I'm out of college...please?

The_Gallant_Gallstone

2008-09-25 11:35:33 PM

mizchief: Exaclty. This is like going on tilt when playing poker. You lose a quater of your stack so on the next hand you get pissed off and push it all in with a King-2 offsuit and lose it all.

Problem gambling is gambling behavior which causes disruptions in any major area of life: psychological, physical, social or vocational. The term "Problem Gambling" includes, but is not limited to, the condition known as "Pathological", or "Compulsive" Gambling, a progressive addiction characterized by increasing preoccupation with gambling, a need to bet more money more frequently, restlessness or irritability when attempting to stop, "chasing" losses, and loss of control manifested by continuation of the gambling behavior in spite of mounting, serious, negative consequences

Mordac Lord of Unholy Fury

2008-09-25 11:35:45 PM

IXI Jim IXI: You know, if you keep throwing around words like 'libs' and 'Dems', people might think you're a bit...partisan.

Not really. I just find that the dumber the comment, tne more likely it is to get noticed. The comments that make sense are overlooked way too often. So I tend to inject what I say with a little bit of stupid, but I'd never go the full retard.

SilentStrider

2008-09-25 11:35:57 PM

newmoonpuppyhead: I agree. But the problem is no one really understands what's going on except Paulson and Bernanke.

i wouldn't be so sure of that.

of them understanding it i mean.

hubiestubert

2008-09-25 11:36:26 PM

YixilTesiphon: Please don't let shiat hit the fan until I'm out of college...please?

Dude, you might want to stay in school for as long as you can. Just sayin'...

Biological Ali

2008-09-25 11:36:37 PM

bionicjoe: "We're not going to go ahead with a plan resting on a 3-legged stool!" or something to that affect.

Not to nitpick, but a 4-legged stool with one leg removed (which is presumably what the phrase is referring to) would not be stable, as opposed to a stool built with three legs to begin with.

Mr Logo

2008-09-25 11:36:40 PM

Congress is rightly being cautious. Given the history of the Patriot act etc, this bill could have severe unintended consiquences if passed without scrutiny.

For example, the money could just be profiteered away instead of actually going to displace bad debt.

thegoodthebadthedumb

2008-09-25 11:36:41 PM

One F Jef: alostpacket: bulldg4life: davidlachnicht: Why do you need the GOP to approve this?
SERIOUSLY, I want an answer.
Democrats control both houses, why not just vote on it and get it over with

Because they want the GOP to back the proposal of a GOP president.

The GOP is going to stonewall and force the Dems to move forward. Then, when Bush signs it and the economy tanks anyway, their hands are clean and they can blame the Dems even though it was the GOP that cried wolf about the need to do something.

Or bush could even veto it claiming the dems passed something un-signable, either way, same result.

how about this davidlachnicht,

SERIOUSLY, I want an answer.
Republicans proposed this, why not just support it and get it over with.

Who's the leader of the repulbican party until four monthsthegoodthebadthedumb: One F Jef: thegoodthebadthedumb: Forgive me if the answer to this question is obvious, but why is the approval of a few conservative House Republicans even needed? Since when do bills need unanimous approval for passage?

If I'm not mistaken, Democrats have a majority in both houses?

What am I missing?

Why the fark do you dumb asses keep saying that.

The republicans have enough to filibuster, and they do it ALL THE farkING TIME. Good god, get a brain morans. I'm sure you stupid motherfarkers are gonna tell me I spelled that wrong too. SHE-it.

I love it when a person resorts to ad hominem name calling and then FAILS miserably.

There is no filibustering in the House. There is only filibustering in the Senate. The Senate Republicans are on board.

You were saying....DUMBASS?

Jesus christ don't run your farkin' mouth when you have no idea what the fark you are talking about.

Who's the President of this shiatty ass soon-to-be third world country? Oh yeah, the leader of the Republican party. Ohhh, right, the guy with the red crayon. Welcome to the red states, unity or death, gay sex with boys and fark the mexicans.

Welcome to Amerikuh.

You can't be serious. I mean, really. You're just messing with me.

As such, I don't feel the need to tell you that the core of this bill is Bush's (Paulson's) proposal. He would sign this bill the second it hits his desk.

Gwendolyn

2008-09-25 11:36:41 PM

newmoonpuppyhead: I agree. But the problem is no one really understands what's going on except Paulson and Bernanke.

Has someone dug Greenspan up and gotten his take on it? Did he die and I missed it?

newmoonpuppyhead

2008-09-25 11:36:46 PM

Gwendolyn: Cathedralmaster: Bonkthat_Again: God damn it, people, this isn't something to joke about.

I'm sorry to rain on this nice little trainwreck thread. But this country obviously does not understand what's happening to it, its people, or its finances, and making comments like some of these farking trolls have the potential to literally destroy a country on the rocks instead of saving it.

Get over yourselves, grow up, and shut the fark up, or face the consequences. This isn't a game.

There's no fighting in the war room!

/Sorry, Dr. Strangelove keeps coming to mind when it comes to this whole crisis for some reason. I can just see McCain as Dr. Strangelove, only instead of "Mein Fuhrer!" it's "POW!".

I keep thinking JESUS CHRIST! I said this shiat was going to happen like 8 years ago but does anyone listen to me? nooooo

Me too. I listened.

Karma Curmudgeon

2008-09-25 11:36:47 PM

Won't it be funny when a flood of new money starts bidding up oil again

PresidentPutz

2008-09-25 11:36:55 PM

"One the proposals -- favored by House Republicans -- would relax regulation and temporarily get rid of certain taxes in order to lure private industry into the market for these distressed assets."

Ain't this more of he same shiat that got us into this mess to begin with?
And now these ignorant FARKS want us to pay MORE for MORE of it?

"Thanks, but no thanks for that plan to nowhere"

rustik

2008-09-25 11:36:59 PM

So when do the CEOs/CFOs start getting arrested?

Also, are there any economics types here that could wager a guess at the worst-case scenario if we just let these banks burn and didn't hand out any bailouts?

mesohorny

2008-09-25 11:37:07 PM

The_Gallant_Gallstone: mesohorny: seriously you guys are stupid if you support this bailout. The party leaders on both sides are using fear to get thing passed.

I was lost in the wilderness of false political ideology... until a great leader showed me the error of my ways... I put my impressionable mind in the hands of this great leader, whose very name is synonomous with resolve and nobility... mesohorny

haha i know your probably joking but if your not there is hope.

real liberals and real conservatives coming together for a greater cause.
http://nocashfortrash.org/ (new window)

The_Gallant_Gallstone

2008-09-25 11:37:08 PM

alostpacket: Oh hmm, what are your 4 PhD's in again?

Tacoby definitely has a Player Hater Degree

I think he majored in Yo Momma jokes... I took that as a minor.

Sym_pathetic

2008-09-25 11:37:15 PM

YixilTesiphon: Please don't let shiat hit the fan until I'm out of college...please?

You might want to stay in college longer.

One F Jef

2008-09-25 11:37:20 PM

8-bit-nintendo: OK, all I want to say is that these "conservative" congressmen that you are talking about.... they may be republican; however, they are neo-cons, not conservatives.

/carry on

Sticking feathers up your ass doesn't make you a chicken. Neo-cons, cons, ex-cons, all Republi-cons. If the "real conservatives" want to stand up to the "neo-conservatives" they should kick them out or form another party.

Until then, they're just 'cons. Boy rapin' tax stealin' cowboy pretendin' rich white redneck wifebeating fundamentalist ignorant motherfarkers all of 'em.

Then again, that's just, like, my opinion ... maaaaaaaaaaaaan.

milk_plus

2008-09-25 11:37:33 PM

John McCain wants to fix this by turning the Statue of Liberty into a 111ft tall beer heiress and bumming it for the cash.

Paedophile_Deluxe

2008-09-25 11:37:41 PM

Don't worry, McCain's coming!

Noirceuil

2008-09-25 11:37:52 PM

For those that seem don't like my idea of executions. It would seem to me your current judicial system just isn't working, which is why you're in this situation. You have executives that purposely placed your nation's economy on the brink of destruction simply to make more money.

It also could be that I do come from a country where we decapitated our leaders.

SilentStrider

2008-09-25 11:37:54 PM

The_Gallant_Gallstone: alostpacket: Oh hmm, what are your 4 PhD's in again?

Tacoby definitely has a Player Hater Degree

I think he majored in Yo Momma jokes... I took that as a minor.

His momma's so vain, she probably thinks this yo momma joke is about her.

newmoonpuppyhead

2008-09-25 11:37:59 PM

SilentStrider: newmoonpuppyhead: I agree. But the problem is no one really understands what's going on except Paulson and Bernanke.

i wouldn't be so sure of that.

of them understanding it i mean.

Nice!

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-25 11:37:59 PM

quickdraw: I hardly know where to start. I've really been slacking lately with the pixel mangling.

I started out strong around the conventions, but I've kinda petered out lately.

Tacoby Bellisbury

2008-09-25 11:38:14 PM

alostpacket: Oh hmm, what are your 4 PhD's in again?

What- is your memory that bad? Don't act like you don't know.

One F Jef

2008-09-25 11:38:48 PM

thegoodthebadthedumb: One F Jef: alostpacket: bulldg4life: davidlachnicht: Why do you need the GOP to approve this?
SERIOUSLY, I want an answer.
Democrats control both houses, why not just vote on it and get it over with

Because they want the GOP to back the proposal of a GOP president.

The GOP is going to stonewall and force the Dems to move forward. Then, when Bush signs it and the economy tanks anyway, their hands are clean and they can blame the Dems even though it was the GOP that cried wolf about the need to do something.

Or bush could even veto it claiming the dems passed something un-signable, either way, same result.

how about this davidlachnicht,

SERIOUSLY, I want an answer.
Republicans proposed this, why not just support it and get it over with.

Who's the leader of the repulbican party until four monthsthegoodthebadthedumb: One F Jef: thegoodthebadthedumb: Forgive me if the answer to this question is obvious, but why is the approval of a few conservative House Republicans even needed? Since when do bills need unanimous approval for passage?

If I'm not mistaken, Democrats have a majority in both houses?

What am I missing?

Why the fark do you dumb asses keep saying that.

The republicans have enough to filibuster, and they do it ALL THE farkING TIME. Good god, get a brain morans. I'm sure you stupid motherfarkers are gonna tell me I spelled that wrong too. SHE-it.

I love it when a person resorts to ad hominem name calling and then FAILS miserably.

There is no filibustering in the House. There is only filibustering in the Senate. The Senate Republicans are on board.

You were saying....DUMBASS?

Jesus christ don't run your farkin' mouth when you have no idea what the fark you are talking about.

Who's the President of this shiatty ass soon-to-be third world country? Oh yeah, the leader of the Republican party. Ohhh, right, the guy with the red crayon. Welcome to the red states, unity or death, gay sex with boys and fark the mexicans.

Welcome to Amerikuh.

You can't be serious. I mean, really. You're just messing with me.

As such, I don't feel the need to tell you that the core of this bill is Bush's (Paulson's) proposal. He would sign this bill the second it hits his desk.

I am just messing with you. I just wanted to pick a fight on the internet. Just got back home drunk and saw a news flash and said fark it, it's on! Pow pow, duck and weave!

Sym_pathetic

2008-09-25 11:39:37 PM

Noirceuil: For those that seem don't like my idea of executions. It would seem to me your current judicial system just isn't working, which is why you're in this situation. You have executives that purposely placed your nation's economy on the brink of destruction simply to make more money.

It also could be that I do come from a country where we decapitated our leaders.

Oliver Cromwell?

The_Gallant_Gallstone

2008-09-25 11:39:37 PM

Mordac Lord of Unholy Fury: Not really. I just find that the dumber the comment, tne more likely it is to get noticed. The comments that make sense are overlooked way too often. So I tend to inject what I say with a little bit of stupid, but I'd never go the full retard.

That's true.... if i get too cerebral, I find that I'm largely ignored. But if I include an obvious typo, or call some other chatter "dawg" or "son!," I tend to get a response, even if it is somewhat negative.

Holla atcha boy shorty!

Bucky Katt

2008-09-25 11:39:39 PM

sonnyboy11: Peter von Nostrand: So according to the GOP, this is a full crisis and we have to act swiftly and decisively to avert an economic melt down. So, what do they do, play political games with it (as usual.) Makes me wonder if this really is that much of a crisis.

That's what I am thinking too. No doubt we have some issues that need to be addressed in our financial sector. The Bush economy is not as strong as we have been led to believe. But I really think McCain's campaign saw this as a chance to show what a great leader McCain could be under the right circumstances and they even convinced Bush to get up there are give a 'doom and gloom' speech yesterday to make it all seem necessary.

The added side bonus is the attempt to move the vice-presidential debate to an 'unspecified' time and keep Palin away from the spotlight, especially after the disaster on Couric's show today.

As far as I can tell, it's not working. Most people are seeing these moves as political grandstanding and bullshiat. All you need to do is watch that Palin interview and ask yourself "Is this someone I want to potentially be the most powerful political leader in the world". If you answer 'yes' to that question, then you haven't been paying attention.

Which one? There are so many to choose from.

moothemagiccow

2008-09-25 11:39:40 PM

For once I agree with the Republicans. Let the banks fail, let wall street fail, let the economy fail, I don't give a shiat. We can't just have good consequences; we need bad ones too. I don't have that much money, but after I make an early run on the bank, I'm going to Australia or some shiat.

lexslamman

2008-09-25 11:39:51 PM

Towards the end, McCain finally spoke up, mentioning a counter-proposal that had been offered by some conservative House Republicans, which would suspend the capital gains tax for two years and provide tax incentives to encourage firms that buy up bad debt. McCain did not discuss specifics of the plan, though, and was non-committal about supporting it.

Paulson, however, argued directly against the conservative proposal. "He said that he did not think it would work," according to the source. At another point in the meeting, President Bush chimed in, "If money isn't loosened, this sucker could go down" -- and by sucker he meant economy.

ABC News reported that, following the meeting, Paulson "walked into the room where Democrats were caucusing...at the White House and pleaded with them 'please don't blow this up.'" But this story isn't incomplete, according to sources.

Democrats stayed talking in the Roosevelt room and Paulson approached them. After his comment, Speaker Pelosi and Rep. Barney Frank shot back that the real problem was with House Republicans. Paulson replied, "I know, I know," as he got down on one knee to lighten the mood. Pelosi joked back, "I didn't know you were a Catholic."

And then

"We were told it came out of the Republican House. We were told at this one point that this was maybe John McCain was floating the idea that Hank Paulson was considering it," Dodd said of the proposal, which he did not elaborate upon. "And of course Barney Frank and I, along with Republicans from the House and the Senate, had spent three hours this morning working on a different core. We were told for the last seven days it was the core issue to give the Secretary authority to move with the crisis, but simultaneously protect the taxpayers and accountability and deal with foreclosure issues all of the things the president mentioned last evening were going to be important as well."

Obama himself did not directly take McCain to task at his post-meeting press avail, but suggested that his methods were not helping the process.

"What I found and I think was confirmed today when you inject presidential politics into delicate negotiations it is not necesary as helpsful as it could be," he said, according to Politico's Carrie Budoff Brown. "When you are not worried about who is getting credit and who is getting blamed you tend to move forward more constructively."

UPDATE: CBS News reports that McCain's alternative proposal includes "fewer regulations and corporate tax breaks":

John McCain - unfit to lead, and following in the same deregulatory, revenue slashing footsteps that got us into this mess.

newmoonpuppyhead

2008-09-25 11:40:04 PM

Gwendolyn: newmoonpuppyhead: I agree. But the problem is no one really understands what's going on except Paulson and Bernanke.

Has someone dug Greenspan up and gotten his take on it? Did he die and I missed it?

He's with Cheney. At an undisclosed location.

You know what this calls for?

The Ex-Presidents!

davidlachnicht

2008-09-25 11:40:07 PM

Who Am I?

"We didn't know what we were voting for; they lied to us, tricked us. We're in this quagmire, and we need to get out now. If I knew what I know now, I woul hve voted against it..."

a) Current pantload of dummie-crats talking about the WOT
b) Current pantload of republicrats talking, in the future, about this bailout.
c) obama supporters, April 15, 2010.

moothemagiccow

2008-09-25 11:40:19 PM

Roughly translated: the democrats are pussies

Sym_pathetic

2008-09-25 11:40:33 PM

The_Gallant_Gallstone: Mordac Lord of Unholy Fury: Not really. I just find that the dumber the comment, tne more likely it is to get noticed. The comments that make sense are overlooked way too often. So I tend to inject what I say with a little bit of stupid, but I'd never go the full retard.

That's true.... if i get too cerebral, I find that I'm largely ignored. But if I include an obvious typo, or call some other chatter "dawg" or "son!," I tend to get a response, even if it is somewhat negative.

Holla atcha boy shorty!

Booyah, nuycka.

captsaveahoe

2008-09-25 11:40:37 PM

bionicjoe

2008-09-25 11:40:38 PM

Biological Ali: bionicjoe: "We're not going to go ahead with a plan resting on a 3-legged stool!" or something to that affect.

Not to nitpick, but a 4-legged stool with one leg removed (which is presumably what the phrase is referring to) would not be stable, as opposed to a stool built with three legs to begin with.

The point is the phrase is 3-legged CHAIR.
There are lots of 3-legged stools. It's a stupid metaphor.
It's as smart as a screen door on a battleship!!!

/submarine

thegoodthebadthedumb

2008-09-25 11:40:40 PM

Still no answer as to why House Republicans should be able to hold this bill up.

Democrats have all the political cover they need, considering Senate Republicans would vote for this AND Bush would sign it the moment it hits is desk.

What's the hold up? I smell a rat. Though I can't figure out what it is.

SilentStrider

2008-09-25 11:40:52 PM

Gwendolyn: Has someone dug Greenspan up and gotten his take on it? Did he die and I missed it?

last i heard (and I could be wrong on this), but even Greenspan was saying some kind of action needed to be taken.

InmanRoshi

2008-09-25 11:40:56 PM

Now that McCain has introduced Presidential politics and a full fledged dog and pony show into what was already going to be an extremely difficult negotiation, I don't see jack getting done any time soon.

I tried to convince myself McCain just a senile, dottering old fool who handed the keys of his campaign over to Schmidt and the rest of the Rovians in an admittance that he was in over his head. But clearly that isn't the case. The man is just simply the most craven, cynical politician I've seen in my lifetime ... even more ruthless than Rove in his own way. Rove at least held his neocon ideals sacred .. nothing is sacred with McCain, and he's scorch and burn it all to get the office.

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-25 11:40:58 PM

Mordac Lord of Unholy Fury: The comments that make sense are overlooked way too often. So I tend to inject what I say with a little bit of stupid, but I'd never go the full retard.

I, of course, have no such constraints ;)

technocrat

2008-09-25 11:41:02 PM

perhaps this deal sucks and some people are standing up to and Mccain threw a monkey wrench into there lets spend 700 billion without asking any hard questions party Why can't we debate this for weeks.

What is the Hurry
Who has the list of companies that get the money I would like to see that

Gwendolyn

2008-09-25 11:41:25 PM

IXI Jim IXI: quickdraw: I hardly know where to start. I've really been slacking lately with the pixel mangling.

I started out strong around the conventions, but I've kinda petered out lately.

Christ on a stick...All the churches around here have those damn abortion graveyards up again. They kept the 1/4 of them painted red or blue with the little American flags for the aborted that would have joined the military. I'm in a bad mood tonight maybe I should grab a washable marker and paint jail stripes on a few of them. It's supposed to rain tomorrow. It'll wash off.

quickdraw

2008-09-25 11:41:26 PM

IXI Jim IXI: I started out strong

Oh is that yours? Very nice. I decided I didn't want to do any Palin shops. I can't stand looking at her that long. I did do this one of Paulson the other day though.

The_Gallant_Gallstone

2008-09-25 11:41:38 PM

Noirceuil: It also could be that I do come from a country where we decapitated our leaders.

We only kill retards or scary looking black people.

SilentStrider: His momma's so vain, she probably thinks this yo momma joke is about her.

His momma's so fat, I had to take a train and two buses to get on her bad side.

davidlachnicht

2008-09-25 11:41:39 PM

moothemagiccow: For once I agree with the Republicans. Let the banks fail, let wall street fail, let the economy fail, I don't give a shiat. We can't just have good consequences; we need bad ones too. I don't have that much money, but after I make an early run on the bank, I'm going to Australia or some shiat.

I almost totally agree; fark the poor and their representation, at least.

Sym_pathetic

2008-09-25 11:42:11 PM

davidlachnicht: Who Am I?

"We didn't know what we were voting for; they lied to us, tricked us. We're in this quagmire, and we need to get out now. If I knew what I know now, I woul hve voted against it..."

a) Current pantload of dummie-crats talking about the WOT
b) Current pantload of republicrats talking, in the future, about this bailout.
c) obama supporters, April 15, 2010.

d) your parents not getting an abortion.

I'll go with D.

lexslamman

2008-09-25 11:42:16 PM

Al Qaeda/Bin Laden's Goals:

1. Destabilize the U.S. economy
2. Have the U.S. overextend itself militarily
3. Make the rest of the world to dislike and disrespect the U.S.

Bush/McCain/Republican Accomplishments:

1. Destabilized the U.S. economy
2. Overextended the U.S. militarily
3. Have made the rest of the world dislike and disrespect the U.S.

newmoonpuppyhead

2008-09-25 11:42:23 PM

Uhm...no.

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-25 11:43:07 PM

quickdraw: Oh is that yours? Very nice. I decided I didn't want to do any Palin shops. I can't stand looking at her that long. I did do this one of Paulson the other day though.

Hahahh...that's great. That should get a lot of play in the coming weeks

YixilTesiphon

2008-09-25 11:43:12 PM

Sym_pathetic: YixilTesiphon: Please don't let shiat hit the fan until I'm out of college...please?

You might want to stay in college longer.

That's kinda the plan...gonna get an MS and an MEM.

Gwendolyn

2008-09-25 11:43:40 PM

SilentStrider: Gwendolyn: Has someone dug Greenspan up and gotten his take on it? Did he die and I missed it?

last i heard (and I could be wrong on this), but even Greenspan was saying some kind of action needed to be taken.

I was trying to google it but coming up empty. : / Sometimes I just don't ask for it the right way though.

Magorn

2008-09-25 11:43:47 PM

First , yes he does, both Dem and Republican Senators and Sec Paulson all basically say this was a done deal until McCain showed up and used his Republican house allies (simple farmers, the COmmon Clay fo the new west...you know, morons) to kick it all to pieces.

Second if they do kill this deal, and with it the economy of the US, YOu are the first One I'm eating when we run out of food stocks.

Biological Ali

2008-09-25 11:43:57 PM

bionicjoe: The point is the phrase is 3-legged CHAIR.
There are lots of 3-legged stools. It's a stupid metaphor.
It's as smart as a screen door on a battleship!!!

Ah, that makes sense. The one stool I have in my apartment has four legs, so that may have skewed my perspective on the matter...

Lawnchair

2008-09-25 11:44:06 PM

YixilTesiphon: Please don't let shiat hit the fan until I'm out of college...please?

I'm going to agree with the peanut gallery here. There is absolutely no better place to be. If inflation goes to 100%/year (far from impossible, not even in the realm of technical "hyperinflation") while your student loans are locked at 5%, you will eventually pay them off with an honest day's labor. In the meantime, they're deferred. Take them out. Buy some solid assets (gold?) if you don't need all your loans. Live on ramen. Most schools will let you cruise around for seven years on a Master's and 10 on a PhD. Take six hours a semester. Find a campus job. Sit tight.

quickdraw

2008-09-25 11:44:08 PM

Gwendolyn: Christ on a stick...All the churches around here have those damn abortion graveyards up again.

Creepy. I'm so glad I live in hippyland. I had no idea such things existed.

Zombie Hitler

2008-09-25 11:44:35 PM

I still don't understand why/how the government is working so hard to give billions of dollars to institutions currently under investigation for fraud.

newmoonpuppyhead

2008-09-25 11:44:47 PM

lexslamman: Al Qaeda/Bin Laden's Goals:

1. Destabilize the U.S. economy
2. Have the U.S. overextend itself militarily
3. Make the rest of the world to dislike and disrespect the U.S.

Bush/McCain/Republican Accomplishments:

1. Destabilized the U.S. economy
2. Overextended the U.S. militarily
3. Have made the rest of the world dislike and disrespect the U.S.

Serious question...did bin Laden or Al Qaeda ever state those goals?

lexslamman

2008-09-25 11:44:50 PM

YixilTesiphon: Sym_pathetic: YixilTesiphon: Please don't let shiat hit the fan until I'm out of college...please?

You might want to stay in college longer.

That's kinda the plan...gonna get an MS and an MEM.

I'm starting to think MD/PhD/JD at this point.

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-25 11:45:08 PM

Zombie Hitler: I still don't understand why/how the government is working so hard to give billions of dollars to institutions currently under investigation for fraud.

Professional courtesy.

moothemagiccow

2008-09-25 11:45:37 PM

technocrat:
What is the Hurry
Who has the list of companies that get the money I would like to see that

I think it's an opt-in thing, so whoever wants to pay their CEOs more than 400k is going to avoid the plan and tank.

Chuck Ruffcorn

2008-09-25 11:45:38 PM

There's way too many people to hang for putting the American People "on the hook" here - we'd have to hang people from the future according to Paulson.

alostpacket

2008-09-25 11:45:56 PM

davidlachnicht: Exactly my point. If the GOP is REALLY to blame, why not wipe the floor with 'em on this, and pass whatever bill you want - go to the people and wall street and say, we're fixin' it, and the GOP can suck it. ?

An interesting thought. I honestly don't know the answer. I think it probably has to do with not doing the repubs work for them especially when this is unpopular work. The whole things STINKS of a game being played by Bush, Paulson, McCain and house republicans to try and say "well the economy tanked but look at these big government democrats giving your money to Wall Street."

Does anyone actually think Paulson was seriously proposing the he get to control $700 billion with no oversight?

Two words: Overton window.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overton_window ^

Also, someone mentioned the republicans trying to add an elimination of the capital gains tax earlier. Does anyone have a source for this? I would be curious to read it.

Cyber_Junk

2008-09-25 11:46:04 PM

thegoodthebadthedumb 2008-09-25 11:40:40 PM
Still no answer as to why House Republicans should be able to hold this bill up.

Democrats have all the political cover they need, considering Senate Republicans would vote for this AND Bush would sign it the moment it hits is desk.

What's the hold up? I smell a rat. Though I can't figure out what it is.

There is no hold up, not from the Democratic Party. It seems some of the members of the Republican Party have decided to turn this rescue mission into a political maneuver. Considering that the measures being taken are extreme this bill needs extraordinary support from BOTH sides of the house to be accepted by the American people. Simply 'passing' won't be enough.

So step up and start asking those idiots to get back to the table and act in good faith. Do it or abandon all pretense that you yourself are playing politics with this situation.

Simplest Quantum System Conceivable

2008-09-25 11:46:05 PM

Way to go GOP!
Fight the Power!

/eyeroll
//suck it up and take what's coming to you, get booted out of office, and come back in 8 years with serious ideas about governing.

gaspode

2008-09-25 11:46:11 PM

http://img442.imageshack.us/img442/784/2888631726d5a0b6059fo97yc6.jpg

"I'm just jazzed about being on the show, man!"

Bonkthat_Again

2008-09-25 11:46:22 PM

newmoonpuppyhead:

I agree. What do you think should be done?

Of all people, I thought you would remember some of the epic ANON-DITs of yesteryear

My honest opinion is despite all the negatives in this mess, I see a positive in the fact there is dissent all around. I'd like to think someone of power said "...this isn't a game anymore. Fark the lobbyists. This is about America and its future."

newmoonpuppyhead

2008-09-25 11:46:22 PM

bubbaprog: You're right! This guy really is REVOLTING

As of three minutes ago on MSNBC.

Whoa! Wait a minute! Where is McCain? Is he campaigning? Or is that an old campaign video?

Karma Curmudgeon

2008-09-25 11:46:31 PM

davidlachnicht: If the GOP is REALLY to blame, why not wipe the floor with 'em on this, and pass whatever bill you want - go to the people and wall street and say, we're fixin' it, and the GOP can suck it. ?

They want no innocents left for the better than even chance that $300 billion turns into $600 billion turns into $900 billion and things still aren't too good. It also makes it difficult for other Republicans not to be revolting too.

quickdraw

2008-09-25 11:46:51 PM

IXI Jim IXI: Hahahh

Thanks! Heres another one.

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-25 11:47:00 PM

bubbaprog: As of three minutes ago on MSNBC.

I saw that earlier, and had a total WTF moment.

Ah well, if McCain is going to start hanging around with celebrities, I think Obama should get ahold of the Mythbusters.

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-25 11:47:48 PM

quickdraw: Thanks! Heres another one.

That would look really good if you set it in front of train tracks. Maybe a money-train...

jocutus

2008-09-25 11:47:52 PM

Liquidity is drying up. Banks are reluctant to even lend to other banks because they don't think they will get money back. Very soon, even good companies with good credit wont be able to borrow and then? Perhaps your credit cards get cancelled, or the rates will skyrocket, minimum monthlies go up. Businesses that rely on lending like cars and home sales will crater as lending locks up even for those with good credit. Leading to more unemployment, declining house values, etc. Its a potential death spiral. But hey, better that than bailing out those rich guys on Wall Street, right?

That view is short sighted. We should stop worrying about a few people who made money at our expense and look at the problems with the system we all rely on. It's like there's a dam holding back the ocean about to burst and we refuse to fix it because we would also save the life of the builder who built it wrong. So let's all drown. It's much cheaper.

I can't see how a tax incentive would encourage anyone to invest 700 billion to remove bad assets from these institutions. What's the incentive? Pay zero taxes on anything for life and the life of your heirs in perpetuity?

orclover

2008-09-25 11:47:55 PM

bubbaprog: You're right! This guy really is REVOLTING
As of three minutes ago on MSNBC.

He met with those idiots? I wouldnt trust those drama queens to give my bike an oil change.

Chuck Ruffcorn

2008-09-25 11:48:00 PM

bubbaprog: You're right! This guy really is REVOLTING

As of three minutes ago on MSNBC.

You're shiatting me?!?!!!! Please.

USCLaw2010

2008-09-25 11:48:28 PM

Did a deal just get struck or are CNBC future trackers malfunctioning because DOW futures just went from 150 points down to 160 points up?

Gwendolyn

2008-09-25 11:48:36 PM

quickdraw: Gwendolyn: Christ on a stick...All the churches around here have those damn abortion graveyards up again.

Creepy. I'm so glad I live in hippyland. I had no idea such things existed.

They do it for two months a year and there is a sign that says something like "These crosses represent the 704 babies who are MURDERED every day by choice. When we first moved down here my older kid thought someone around here was going to murder her baby brother when she read the damn thing. They kill babies down here?!?!?! Thank you fundie wack jobs for making me explain abortion to my 7 year old.

YixilTesiphon

2008-09-25 11:48:52 PM

Lawnchair: YixilTesiphon: Please don't let shiat hit the fan until I'm out of college...please?

I'm going to agree with the peanut gallery here. There is absolutely no better place to be. If inflation goes to 100%/year (far from impossible, not even in the realm of technical "hyperinflation") while your student loans are locked at 5%, you will eventually pay them off with an honest day's labor. In the meantime, they're deferred. Take them out. Buy some solid assets (gold?) if you don't need all your loans. Live on ramen. Most schools will let you cruise around for seven years on a Master's and 10 on a PhD. Take six hours a semester. Find a campus job. Sit tight.

I don't have student loans, so that part doesn't factor in. Still, I was planning on getting the MS and MEM before all this went down, and now I'm set on it.

The_Gallant_Gallstone

2008-09-25 11:48:54 PM

mizchief: That's called communisum. I'm not about to let 200 years of blood, sweat, and tears go down the drain to prevent a recession.

I, for one, would welcome a Peoples' Revolution, and may even be willing to do my part to expedite its arrival, but I will have to work it in around my 5 hours of television watching a day.

DO NOT WANT Poster Girl

2008-09-25 11:49:01 PM

moothemagiccow: lexslamman: davidlachnicht: Okay, libs, answer me this:
Why do you need the GOP to approve this?
SERIOUSLY, I want an answer.
Democrats control both houses, why not just vote on it and get it over with

Because unlike John McCain, some people actually believe in the principles of bipartisanship and don't just like to talk about it.

Roughly translated: the democrats are pussies

The irony is that this very kind of macho-in-your-face crap is what helped get the GOP into the problems it has now.

Politics, especially national politics, isn't a sports game, kids. It's not about what guys have the best football throw, or who can "tear into the other team".

This isn't a two-team game with a winner and a loser, kids. Grow a pair yourself and start to realize that politics is a grown-up game, and all the partisan rhetoric masks what's really going on.

Unless, of course, you like being puppets of whatever talk show host makes you feel like big grown up people.

quickdraw

2008-09-25 11:49:29 PM

lexslamman: I'm starting to think MD/PhD/JD at this point.

I started grad school this month.

IXI Jim IXI: Zombie Hitler: I still don't understand why/how the government is working so hard to give billions of dollars to institutions currently under investigation for fraud.

Professional courtesy.

Its funny cuz it's true.

/sort of
//not really funny at all
///gonna go cry now

thegoodthebadthedumb

2008-09-25 11:49:39 PM

Cyber_Junk: thegoodthebadthedumb 2008-09-25 11:40:40 PM
Still no answer as to why House Republicans should be able to hold this bill up.

Democrats have all the political cover they need, considering Senate Republicans would vote for this AND Bush would sign it the moment it hits is desk.

What's the hold up? I smell a rat. Though I can't figure out what it is.

There is no hold up, not from the Democratic Party. It seems some of the members of the Republican Party have decided to turn this rescue mission into a political maneuver. Considering that the measures being taken are extreme this bill needs extraordinary support from BOTH sides of the house to be accepted by the American people. Simply 'passing' won't be enough.

So step up and start asking those idiots to get back to the table and act in good faith. Do it or abandon all pretense that you yourself are playing politics with this situation.

Why do the Democrats NEED ANY GOP VOTES in the House? Per all the stories I've read - Senate Dems are on board. Senate GOP are on board. House Dems are on board. Bush is on board.

Meanwhile, the plan "falls apart" because a MINORITY party in the HOUSE (where there is no filibuster) says "No"? Why does anybody give a rats ass what some conservative GOPers in the House care about the bill?

MindStalker

2008-09-25 11:50:17 PM

Yay, the agreement may now be just $250.
HAAH they fooled us all. When they announced the $700 Billion price tag I KNEW it was purposefully a really high pricetag because then they could negotiate down and we'd consider it a deal!

BLAH.

NO MORE BAILOUTS

PresidentPutz

2008-09-25 11:50:19 PM

All you dumb-arses saying "Let Wall Street fail" should remember what that means:
20 to 30 million retirees suddenly are broke
20 to 30 million retirees have to move into their childrens homes
20 to 30 million retirees return to the job market

Millions of poorly structured, barely surviving home loans are restructured at higher rates.
The home sales market COMPLETELY dies for inaccessible loans
Car sales completely die for inaccassible loans
Home inprovements cease for inaccessible loans
college students start dropping out and flooding the job markets and their parents couches for inaccessible loans
and so on and so on and so on....

Be careful what yu ask for, you just might get it.

newmoonpuppyhead

2008-09-25 11:50:27 PM

Bonkthat_Again: newmoonpuppyhead:

I agree. What do you think should be done?

Of all people, I thought you would remember some of the epic ANON-DITs of yesteryear

My honest opinion is despite all the negatives in this mess, I see a positive in the fact there is dissent all around. I'd like to think someone of power said "...this isn't a game anymore. Fark the lobbyists. This is about America and its future."

yeah, I remember. ;)

And, yeah, I'd like to think that, too. But in all the blahblahblah and lack of clarity, it's tough to discern who is actually saying that.

The BEST thing for the country wuld be for all the former presidents as well as McCain and Obama, to issue a joint press release stating and adhering to a set of principles they all agre on. Anything else will be viewed with suspicion.

The_Gallant_Gallstone

2008-09-25 11:50:35 PM

Gwendolyn: Thank you fundie wack jobs for making me explain abortion to my 7 year old.

No problem.

jocutus: We should stop worrying about a few people who made money at our expense and look at the problems with the system we all rely on. It's like there's a dam holding back the ocean about to burst and we refuse to fix it because we would also save the life of the builder who built it wrong. So let's all drown. It's much cheaper.

Cry me a river... cry me... cry me a river....

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-25 11:51:10 PM

MindStalker: Yay, the agreement may now be just $250.
HAAH they fooled us all. When they announced the $700 Billion price tag I KNEW it was purposefully a really high pricetag because then they could negotiate down and we'd consider it a deal!

What is this...the Chief Engineer Scott School of Economics? ;)

bubbaprog

2008-09-25 11:51:19 PM

Chuck Ruffcorn: You're shiatting me?!?!!!! Please.

Sadly, no.

And I blew the joke. It should have been:

"These guys don't look very conservative to me."

Mentat

2008-09-25 11:51:30 PM

[image from img529.imageshack.us too old to be available]

torquestripe

2008-09-25 11:51:34 PM

Fark McCain, Obama, Pelosi and any other elected thief who wants a bailout for Greed Incorporated paid for by the American taxpayer.
Let the whole thing go into free fall for 10 years and let's see how it all works out!
Seriously!

alostpacket

2008-09-25 11:52:16 PM

The_Gallant_Gallstone: jocutus: We should stop worrying about a few people who made money at our expense and look at the problems with the system we all rely on. It's like there's a dam holding back the ocean about to burst and we refuse to fix it because we would also save the life of the builder who built it wrong. So let's all drown. It's much cheaper.

Cry me a river... cry me... cry me a river....

Dude your tears are breaking the dam! wtf! stop crying!

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-25 11:52:18 PM

Gwendolyn: Thank you fundie wack jobs for making me explain abortion to my 7 year old.

"Sometimes mommy and daddy love each other very much, and mommy becomes pregnant. However, when mommy finds out she's going to have a republican, it's time to break out the coathanger..."

Rascal King

2008-09-25 11:52:38 PM

So wait, the general consensus is that this current crisis has a lot to do with deregulation, so the Republican nominee swoops in to town after a few days of saying he's all about regulation and the main thing they propose is deregulation and cutting taxes?

WHAT THE FARK?

Lawnchair

2008-09-25 11:52:41 PM

Cyber_Junk: Considering that the measures being taken are extreme this bill needs extraordinary support from BOTH sides of the house to be accepted by the American people. Simply 'passing' won't be enough.

If the bill itself is effective, passing it *is* enough. 218 House votes. If Pelosi can't do it, she isn't fit to hold Gingrich's nutsack, let alone his old gavel.

If, instead, it's on the "we need to believe it will work, and then it will work", we've gone to Tinkerbell economics, and, sorry, we're farked.

/ not really for the bailout
// we've been on Tinkerbell economics since at least the early 70s.

Sum Dum Gai

2008-09-25 11:52:48 PM

This "insurance" idea is INSANE.

The asset-purchase plan will likely turn a profit for the government in the long run; both the risk AND any payoff would be shifted to the government.

Under the insurance plan, the government takes all the risk and the company keeps any payoff!

Cathedralmaster

2008-09-25 11:52:56 PM

technocrat: perhaps this deal sucks and some people are standing up to and Mccain threw a monkey wrench into there lets spend 700 billion without asking any hard questions party Why can't we debate this for weeks.

What is the Hurry

As I understand it, and to use an analogy, essentially Rome is burning, and if they don't start throwing water on the fire soon, it's going to be too late. Though taking your time and thinking things through is often a good strategy, reality is sometimes not so accommodating.

The_Gallant_Gallstone

2008-09-25 11:53:02 PM

They're the Greatest Generation... I'm sure they can deal.
Where's the love for the free market and government non-intervention? I'm sure the Small Government Brigade of the GOP will come out of their 8 year hibernation should Obama win the Presidency

Bucky Katt

2008-09-25 11:53:04 PM

thegoodthebadthedumb: Still no answer as to why House Republicans should be able to hold this bill up.

Democrats have all the political cover they need, considering Senate Republicans would vote for this AND Bush would sign it the moment it hits is desk.

What's the hold up? I smell a rat. Though I can't figure out what it is.

maybe because not every single democrat will vote for it? why do you expect the democrats to march in lock step? the republicans are sharply divided and perhaps there's some disagrements among the democrats? it would seem that you are trying to some a way to blame the democrats for this when its bush's proposal. if the president's own party won't support the bill then why should the democrats?

davidlachnicht

2008-09-25 11:53:04 PM

The Democrats unwillingness to fix this
and stop worrying about whether or not
the GOP gets enough blame for the debacle itself
or any future failure
reminds me of a quote I recently heard...

"I would rather lose an election than lose a war" -JohnMcCain

Dems, its time to lose your (re)elections...

c7hu1hu fh746n

2008-09-25 11:53:42 PM

Is it too late to say "Yarr"?

bubbaprog

2008-09-25 11:53:50 PM

Sum Dum Gai: This "insurance" idea is INSANE.

The asset-purchase plan will likely turn a profit for the government in the long run; both the risk AND any payoff would be shifted to the government.

Under the insurance plan, the government takes all the risk and the company keeps any payoff!

Well, that's the American way. To do it the other way would be SOCIALIST.

PresidentPutz

2008-09-25 11:53:53 PM

torquestripe:
"Let the whole thing go into free fall for 10 years and let's see how it all works out!
Seriously!"

Yeah, cus a 45% unemployment market would be REALLY cool.

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-25 11:54:41 PM

davidlachnicht: reminds me of a quote I recently heard...

"I would rather lose an election than lose a war" -JohnMcCain

Actually, he was misquoted. What he actually said was, "I would rather lose my erection than lose a war."

Goetz

2008-09-25 11:54:51 PM

Tacoby Bellisbury: alostpacket: Oh hmm, what are your 4 PhD's in again?

What- is your memory that bad? Don't act like you don't know.

Taco, if you keep this up I'll have to tell everyone about your homo-erotic escapades with Hector the pool boy.

Actually, taco is just an alt for newmoonpuppyhead, but I'm sure he'll come out of the closet in time.

lexslamman

2008-09-25 11:54:56 PM

newmoonpuppyhead: lexslamman: Al Qaeda/Bin Laden's Goals:

1. Destabilize the U.S. economy
2. Have the U.S. overextend itself militarily
3. Make the rest of the world to dislike and disrespect the U.S.

Bush/McCain/Republican Accomplishments:

1. Destabilized the U.S. economy
2. Overextended the U.S. militarily
3. Have made the rest of the world dislike and disrespect the U.S.

Serious question...did bin Laden or Al Qaeda ever state those goals?

But what about the goal of bringing down the U.S. economy? Remember what bin Laden himself said about his goals back in December 2001: "If their economy is destroyed, they will be busy with their own affairs rather than enslaving the weak peoples. It is very important to concentrate on hitting the U.S. economy through all possible means." This was echoed by al Qaeda second-in-command Ayman al-Zawahiri in September 2002: "We will also aim to continue, by the permission of Allah, the destruction of the American economy."

AND

ABC News discusses the new translation of an al Qaeda strategy document which is currently circulating among DoD and government policy people.
"Abu Bakr Naji, an al Qaeda insider and author of the book, "The Management of Savagery," believes that the 9/11 attacks accomplished what they needed to by forcing the U.S. to commit their military overseas. He says 9/11 forced the U.S. to fall into the "trap" of overextending their military and that "it began to become clear to the American administration that it was being drained."

He says that al Qaeda shouldn't be focused on any more of those kinds of attacks for now.

"The focus is on mid- to small-range targets in the region and not go after big symbolic targets like the Twin Towers," says Will McCants, a fellow at the Combating Terrorism Center at West Point, who translated the 268-page document."

hubiestubert

2008-09-25 11:55:00 PM

Pretty much. Which is why it's popular with the House Reps--it will secure them dollars that won't be accounted for for their re-election campaigns.

soy_bomb

2008-09-25 11:55:02 PM

PresidentPutz: 20 to 30 million retirees return to the job market

Sweet! That means I can play on their lawn without them yelling at me!

YixilTesiphon

2008-09-25 11:55:11 PM

Just because it's the consensus on DailyKOS doesn't make it correct or even the consensus.

Lenny_da_Hog

2008-09-25 11:55:14 PM

But don't you see? That creates *jobs*!

mesohorny

2008-09-25 11:55:21 PM

jocutus: Liquidity is drying up. Banks are reluctant to even lend to other banks because they don't think they will get money back. Very soon, even good companies with good credit wont be able to borrow and then? Perhaps your credit cards get cancelled, or the rates will skyrocket, minimum monthlies go up. Businesses that rely on lending like cars and home sales will crater as lending locks up even for those with good credit. Leading to more unemployment, declining house values, etc. Its a potential death spiral. But hey, better that than bailing out those rich guys on Wall Street, right?

That view is short sighted. We should stop worrying about a few people who made money at our expense and look at the problems with the system we all rely on. It's like there's a dam holding back the ocean about to burst and we refuse to fix it because we would also save the life of the builder who built it wrong. So let's all drown. It's much cheaper.

I can't see how a tax incentive would encourage anyone to invest 700 billion to remove bad assets from these institutions. What's the incentive? Pay zero taxes on anything for life and the life of your heirs in perpetuity?

We wouldn't drown. it would be a one year recession like we already are having. if we prolong it with a bailout the bubble will burst again and we will have a depression for sure.

SAY NO TO BAILOUTS!!!!! remember these are real conservatives that are revolting and even some real democrats.

NewportBarGuy

2008-09-25 11:55:34 PM

I, for one, am encouraged that retarded children are responsible for solving a credit crisis they can't even begin to understand.

Where are all those whiz-kid quantitative traders who just knew a mathematical formula could guarantee market results?

Anyone? Bueller?

quickdraw

2008-09-25 11:55:36 PM

IXI Jim IXI: That would look really good if you set it in front of train tracks. Maybe a money-train...

Yeah I was thinking maybe a big train/wall st crash with Nell/tax payer on the tracks. Go for it if you're so inclined. Take my Paulson - please. I have a ton of homework.

Gwendolyn: Thank you fundie wack jobs for making me explain abortion to my 7 year old.

Oh my. When I was pregnant with my first kid and full of first time mom jitters I saw a bumper sticker that said "the most dangerous place for a child is in its mother's womb." I just burst into tears. I thought they were talking about birth defects and miscarriages.

torquestripe

2008-09-25 11:55:50 PM

Gwendolyn: quickdraw: Gwendolyn: Christ on a stick...All the churches around here have those damn abortion graveyards up again.

Creepy. I'm so glad I live in hippyland. I had no idea such things existed.

They do it for two months a year and there is a sign that says something like "These crosses represent the 704 babies who are MURDERED every day by choice. When we first moved down here my older kid thought someone around here was going to murder her baby brother when she read the damn thing. They kill babies down here?!?!?! Thank you fundie wack jobs for making me explain abortion to my 7 year old.

Kindergarten is a great time to start teaching seven year olds about ~~sex~~abortion, no?

BigG

2008-09-25 11:56:23 PM

thegoodthebadthedumb

2008-09-25 11:56:37 PM

Bucky Katt: thegoodthebadthedumb: Still no answer as to why House Republicans should be able to hold this bill up.

Democrats have all the political cover they need, considering Senate Republicans would vote for this AND Bush would sign it the moment it hits is desk.

What's the hold up? I smell a rat. Though I can't figure out what it is.

maybe because not every single democrat will vote for it? why do you expect the democrats to march in lock step? the republicans are sharply divided and perhaps there's some disagrements among the democrats? it would seem that you are trying to some a way to blame the democrats for this when its bush's proposal. if the president's own party won't support the bill then why should the democrats?

That's the closest thing to an answer to my question that I've heard in this thread. However, I haven't seen a single shred of evidence in any news report I've read that suggests that this is the case. The story I've seen everywhere tonight is that this group of GOP House members are killing the deal. And I just can't understand how.

bulldg4life

2008-09-25 11:56:58 PM

Rascal King: So wait, the general consensus is that this current crisis has a lot to do with deregulation, so the Republican nominee swoops in to town after a few days of saying he's all about regulation and the main thing they propose is deregulation and cutting taxes?

I would assume McCain had no idea what was going on with any of the bailouts. He's on the hook talking about bipartisan and working with the President to get the deal done quickly.

When he got to Washington, he was told that senate republicans and democrats had already reached a deal and he heard of conservative republicans having an alternative.

The specifics of the alternative don't really matter as much as the talking points of less regulation and not making the government pay $700b. Plus, it lets him drag this out AND take credit of the conservative house republican plan.

bionicjoe

2008-09-25 11:57:05 PM

[image from independent.co.uk too old to be available]

I think this has relevance, but I love the photo.

Gangway Fathead

2008-09-25 11:57:59 PM

davidlachnicht: The Democrats unwillingness to fix this
and stop worrying about whether or not
the GOP gets enough blame for the debacle itself
or any future failure
reminds me of a quote I recently heard...

"I would rather lose an election than lose a war" -JohnMcCain

Dems, its time to lose your (re)elections...

You do realize it's not democrats who... oh, never mind.

lexslamman

2008-09-25 11:58:07 PM

FAIL.

Towards the end, McCain finally spoke up, mentioning a counter-proposal that had been offered by some conservative House Republicans, which would suspend the capital gains tax for two years and provide tax incentives to encourage firms that buy up bad debt. McCain did not discuss specifics of the plan, though, and was non-committal about supporting it.

Paulson, however, argued directly against the conservative proposal. "He said that he did not think it would work," according to the source. At another point in the meeting, President Bush chimed in, "If money isn't loosened, this sucker could go down" -- and by sucker he meant economy.

ABC News reported that, following the meeting, Paulson "walked into the room where Democrats were caucusing...at the White House and pleaded with them 'please don't blow this up.'" But this story isn't incomplete, according to sources.

Democrats stayed talking in the Roosevelt room and Paulson approached them. After his comment, Speaker Pelosi and Rep. Barney Frank shot back that the real problem was with House Republicans. Paulson replied, "I know, I know,"

Take your ball and go home.

Bonkthat_Again

2008-09-25 11:58:43 PM

newmoonpuppyhead: The BEST thing for the country wuld be for all the former presidents as well as McCain and Obama, to issue a joint press release stating and adhering to a set of principles they all agre on. Anything else will be viewed with suspicion.

We may never know what's being said behind closed doors. We can only hope someone is sincerely looking out for our interests. Politicians, while usually residing just below lawyers on the scum-o-meter, sometimes do the right thing. Let's hope this is one of those times. But yea, it would help if past, present, and future presidents echoed the same message.

bartink

2008-09-25 11:58:55 PM

YixilTesiphon: Just because it's the consensus on DailyKOS doesn't make it correct or even the consensus.

It was the change in regulation that allowed big banks to securitize mortgages. So, yeah, it was a regulation issue.

Astroturfing the Internet

2008-09-25 11:59:00 PM

What an elected representive with some balls might say to corporate bankers begging for a bailout :

"Gentlemen, I have had men watching you for a long time and I am convinced that you have used the funds of the bank to speculate in the breadstuffs of the country. When you won, you divided the profits amongst you, and when you lost, you charged it to the bank.
You tell me that if I take the deposits from the bank and annul its charter, I shall ruin ten thousand families. That may be true, gentlemen, but that is your sin!
Should I let you go on, you will ruin fifty thousand families, and that would be my sin!
You are a den of vipers and thieves."

- Andrew Jackson (1836) 7th US President. Jackson revoked the charter of the Second Bank.

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-25 11:59:03 PM

c7hu1hu fh746n: Is it too late to say "Yarr"?

Never too late to say yarr...

Karma Curmudgeon

2008-09-25 11:59:27 PM

mesohorny: We wouldn't drown. it would be a one year recession like we already are having. if we prolong it with a bailout the bubble will burst again and we will have a depression for sure.

This...would make the late 70's look like the 50's

davidlachnicht

2008-09-25 11:59:38 PM

lexslamman: davidlachnicht: The Democrats unwillingness to fix this
and stop worrying about whether or not
the GOP gets enough blame for the debacle itself
or any future failure
reminds me of a quote I recently heard...

"I would rather lose an election than lose a war" -JohnMcCain

Dems, its time to lose your (re)elections...

FAIL.

Towards the end, McCain finally spoke up, mentioning a counter-proposal that had been offered by some conservative House Republicans, which would suspend the capital gains tax for two years and provide tax incentives to encourage firms that buy up bad debt. McCain did not discuss specifics of the plan, though, and was non-committal about supporting it.

Paulson, however, argued directly against the conservative proposal. "He said that he did not think it would work," according to the source. At another point in the meeting, President Bush chimed in, "If money isn't loosened, this sucker could go down" -- and by sucker he meant economy.

ABC News reported that, following the meeting, Paulson "walked into the room where Democrats were caucusing...at the White House and pleaded with them 'please don't blow this up.'" But this story isn't incomplete, according to sources.

Democrats stayed talking in the Roosevelt room and Paulson approached them. After his comment, Speaker Pelosi and Rep. Barney Frank shot back that the real problem was with House Republicans. Paulson replied, "I know, I know,"

Take your ball and go home.

EPIC FAIL

You didn't even address what I said.

lexslamman

2008-09-25 11:59:42 PM

Why does the McCain/GOP plan include capital gains tax cuts for the rich but no assistance to homeowners facing foreclosure?

torquestripe

2008-09-25 11:59:50 PM

PresidentPutz: torquestripe:
"Let the whole thing go into free fall for 10 years and let's see how it all works out!
Seriously!"

Yeah, cus a 45% unemployment market would be REALLY cool.

Actually, I was thinking more like 60%, and yeah it would be great!

newmoonpuppyhead

2008-09-26 12:00:03 AM

Owangotang: Look, I'm nothing even close to possessing economic expertise but doesn't it stand to reason that a market that is suffering from wild uncertainty would benefit from rules, aka regulations, meant to stabilize things?

If I'm wrong, go easy on me. I'm blond.

Yes, you are correct, blond. It's really that simple.

The problem is you have some very loud people in the neocon/deregulation camp that won't stfu.

Shrugging Atlas

2008-09-26 12:00:09 AM

One of two things is happening here:

1. All of this is an organized ploy by the Republicans to help McCain's campaign get back on its feet. They sink the plan in place earlier today to allow McCain to appear to organize the various wings of the Republican Party in the House and Senate over the next couple of days and present a new plan that will be approved. He looks like a decider and a leader and comes out ahead, while Obama sat on the sidelines advising caution and ultimately accomplishing nothing.

2. The Republican Party really is totally in chaos. The House GOPers really are revolting and are willing to rat fark McCain to get what they want because they are looking out for their own skins and never liked McCain anyway. They give the finger to Bush as well because he's gone anyway in 3.5 months and has done nothing but shiat on them for 7 years. They'll defy McCain and refuse anything outside of their terms, making him look like he can't control his own party.

I don't know which it is, but I can't see any other possibilities at this point.

bionicjoe

2008-09-26 12:00:43 AM

BigG -- Anger issues towards small furniture?

Gwendolyn

2008-09-26 12:00:59 AM

PresidentPutz: All you dumb-arses saying "Let Wall Street fail" should remember what that means:
20 to 30 million retirees suddenly are broke
20 to 30 million retirees have to move into their childrens homes
20 to 30 million retirees return to the job market

Millions of poorly structured, barely surviving home loans are restructured at higher rates.
The home sales market COMPLETELY dies for inaccessible loans
Car sales completely die for inaccassible loans
Home inprovements cease for inaccessible loans
college students start dropping out and flooding the job markets and their parents couches for inaccessible loans
and so on and so on and so on....

Be careful what you ask for, you just might get it.

Well the house and car loans are pretty much going to be farked no matter what. Cars and houses were spiraling up in price because of the easy loans. Private school tuition had been growing at about 8% a year for the past 20 years. OMG people might have to go to a public university. The horror! If you are ready to retire why the hell do you have your money should be someplace safe. these people most likely already got bit in the ass when the tech stocks crashed. Retirees usually take low paying service jobs

Families who have most of their wealth tied into their house, bad plan anyway, are farked but they are going to be anyway.

tuition rate chart just for kicks. (new window)

Blathering Idjut

2008-09-26 12:00:59 AM

Not real fond of the compromise plan.

Even less of the Republican substitute.

But all that pales to the fact McCain is playing political games with the entire U.S. economy here.

For that he can go fark himself.

Rascal King

2008-09-26 12:01:14 AM

lexslamman: Why does the McCain/GOP plan include capital gains tax cuts for the rich but no assistance to homeowners facing foreclosure?

To encourage them to trickle down some economy! Duh!

InteriorDesignNinja

2008-09-26 12:01:22 AM

Tacoby Bellisbury: alostpacket: Question: How do you spell Molecular?

ummm... way to ask a question and answer it at the same time. The fail is strong with you.

Fail? Or concentrated WIN?

Great Janitor

2008-09-26 12:01:28 AM

My point of view on all of this:

McCain went to Washington, returned to his job, and worked on a bailout deal.

Obama continued his campaign, talked about how bad the deal was going to be and how he was against it, even though he's a farking senator and can vote against it if he doesn't like it or get his say in as to what he wants done.

So, this leads me to think that McCain is a doing, Obama is all talk. I'd rather have a leader that will do stuff instead of someone that will just sit by and biatch about what's going on.

Might have to vote McCain...

Noirceuil

2008-09-26 12:01:30 AM

mizchief,

1)Fraud for one. Taking mortgage backed securities that were of a higher risk, and passing them off as secure.

2)I'll ignore your stupidity on this one. If you wish to reply, reply with an actual response, not something a five year old would say.

3)If you read the first few words in 4, you would see I said the remainder needed. I.E. of course their assets wouldn't cover the entire bailout, but their assets would go towards it.

lexslamman

2008-09-26 12:01:49 AM

davidlachnicht: You didn't even address what I said.

The ball has been in the GOP court, and they decided to turn their backs. There was a broad agreement and instead of moving forward on it, they followed their presidential candidate in leading this country over a cliff.

This will get passed in some form, but time will be taken to try to let bipartisanship work.

jocutus

2008-09-26 12:02:01 AM

The House Republicans are trying to weasel out of voting for this thing because they know how we feel: we don't want to pay for other peoples' mistakes. But they also know that this fx has to happen, so they are hoping to push the Democrats to pass a very necessary but unpopular bill so they can turn around and use it a re-election campaign slogan: "Those no-good libs took your hard-earned money and fed it to Wall Street Fat Cats. I voted against it! vote for me!"

The Democrats are balking at talking the heat for a bailout plan to fix failed Republican policies. The House Republicans basically walked out and left a one page outline of their "proposal". I can only imagine the calls that are going on tonight and early morning to force these idiots back to the negotiating table.

Lawnchair

2008-09-26 12:02:03 AM

The_Gallant_Gallstone: They're the Greatest Generation... I'm sure they can deal.

The "Greatest Generation" are the ones 84 and older. Generally near dead. And, they almost always own their homes. They'll "deal" by cat food and not going to the "home" for the last few months of their life.

Most retirees now are the "Silent Generation" with a growing bit of the Boomers.

But, yeah. This stuff is serious. The wife and I have well over 20% for a house in my preferred market (middle of nowhere midwest). Actually, over 40%. But, we're holding out and seriously considering instead paying off her parents mortgage (on 8 acres), moving a trailer out there for us, and working the land/living cheap.

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-26 12:02:12 AM

NewportBarGuy: I, for one, am encouraged that retarded children are responsible for solving a credit crisis they can't even begin to understand.

PresidentPutz

2008-09-26 12:02:14 AM

The Republitards never learn.
Deregulatiuon broke this.
More deregulation will break it the rest of the way.
There needs to be some serious regulation and oversite.
This isn't just about a bunch of rich cockups playing with Daddy's money, they are playing with the retirements of MILLIONS, the job market for MILLIONS and the economic stability of our Nation.
You wouldn't just elect some Rich Guys son and make him President then let him do whatever the hell he wanted while in office, the relect him a second time so he could screw everything up even more, would you?

InteriorDesignNinja

2008-09-26 12:02:18 AM

InteriorDesignNinja: Tacoby Bellisbury: alostpacket: Question: How do you spell Molecular?

ummm... way to ask a question and answer it at the same time. The fail is strong with you.

Fail? Or concentrated WIN?

Sorry I forgot to bold that for you XD

The_Gallant_Gallstone

2008-09-26 12:02:20 AM

Owangotang: doesn't it stand to reason that a market that is suffering from wild uncertainty would benefit from rules, aka regulations, meant to stabilize things?

The mob has plans, the cops have plans, Gordon's got plans. You know, they're schemers. Schemers trying to control their worlds. I'm not a schemer. I try to show the schemers how pathetic their attempts to control things really are. So, when I say that you and your girlfriend was nothing personal, you know that I'm telling the truth. It's the schemers that put you where you are. You were a schemer, you had plans, and uh, look where that got you.

davidlachnicht

2008-09-26 12:02:34 AM

lexslamman: Why does the McCain/GOP plan include capital gains tax cuts for the rich but no assistance to homeowners facing foreclosure?

If the forclosures are for sub-prime loans, that they shouldn't have gotten in the first place, LET THEM FAIL.

Chuck Ruffcorn

2008-09-26 12:02:47 AM

IXI Jim IXI: Gwendolyn: Thank you fundie wack jobs for making me explain abortion to my 7 year old.

"Sometimes mommy and daddy love each other very much, and mommy becomes pregnant. However, when mommy finds out she's going to have a republican, it's time to break out the coathanger..."

WIN

bulldg4life

2008-09-26 12:02:49 AM

Shrugging Atlas: 1. All of this is an organized ploy by the Republicans to help McCain's campaign get back on its feet. They sink the plan in place earlier today to allow McCain to appear to organize the various wings of the Republican Party in the House and Senate over the next couple of days and present a new plan that will be approved. He looks like a decider and a leader and comes out ahead, while Obama sat on the sidelines advising caution and ultimately accomplishing nothing.

ding ding ding

Tacoby Bellisbury

2008-09-26 12:03:00 AM

Goetz: Actually, taco is just an alt for newmoonpuppyhead, but I'm sure he'll come out of the closet in time.

I havce no alts. Broken Record is you

elysive

2008-09-26 12:03:04 AM

mizchief: That's called communisum. I'm not about to let 200 years of blood, sweat, and tears go down the drain to prevent a recession.

Seizing monies gained through criminal acts is hardly communism. People here are far too trusting that no exlicitly criminal acts have been commited. At the very least systematically farking with Wall Street has to qualify as crime against the state and the welfare of the people.

GoodasGold

2008-09-26 12:03:35 AM

The Republicans are responding the phone calls and emails they are receiving from their constituents. There is an outcry against this.

I think its called democracy.

Sym_pathetic

2008-09-26 12:03:41 AM

lexslamman: Why does the McCain/GOP plan include capital gains tax cuts for the rich but no assistance to homeowners facing foreclosure?

The Republican party helps those that can already help themselves.

bulldg4life

2008-09-26 12:03:42 AM

Great Janitor: My point of view on all of this:

McCain went to Washington, returned to his job, and worked on a bailout deal.

Obama continued his campaign, talked about how bad the deal was going to be and how he was against it, even though he's a farking senator and can vote against it if he doesn't like it or get his say in as to what he wants done.

So, this leads me to think that McCain is a doing, Obama is all talk. I'd rather have a leader that will do stuff instead of someone that will just sit by and biatch about what's going on.

Might have to vote McCain...

Other than Obama getting to Washington before McCain...you're totally right.

But hey, thanks for being completely oblivious to reality.

newmoonpuppyhead

2008-09-26 12:03:44 AM

Gangway Fathead: davidlachnicht: The Democrats unwillingness to fix this
and stop worrying about whether or not
the GOP gets enough blame for the debacle itself
or any future failure
reminds me of a quote I recently heard...

"I would rather lose an election than lose a war" -JohnMcCain

Dems, its time to lose your (re)elections...

You do realize it's not democrats who... oh, never mind.

It's everyone's fault, but most certainly those who pressed for deregulation. It's ironic that the man (McCain) who was the loudest champion of deregulation is trying to appear as the answer to (t)his crisis.

mesohorny

2008-09-26 12:03:44 AM

Bullshiat that is the same type of fear mongering coming from Bush and party leaders on both sides.

We will have a 1 year recession like we are having now, If we prolong it and more financial institutions fail after the bailout (which they will) WHAT THEN???? Another Bailout????? the next time we will have a depression.

Flying Code Monkey

2008-09-26 12:04:20 AM

This is the most pathetic Republican political grandstanding since what ... either Schiavo or the Patriot Act.

They're trying to game this whole thing so that McCain can ride to the rescue and have some kind of Mavrick Moment, whether it's Standing Up to his Own Party, or Reaching Across the Aisle, or your campaign cliche of choice. Bookmark me and look it up later.

McCain has no relevant expertise. He's not Majority Leader, nor Committee Chairman. His "campaign on hold" has been nothing but more sham. There's nothing left of him but an unhealthy political puppet with the RNC's hand up his ass.

When only Obama shows up for the debate/town hall tomorrow, it'll have hardly even started before Tucker Bounds is dispatched to trumpet McCain's shiny country-firstedness while he sits around Washington being useless. Meanwhile the news channel guys will talk ambiguously about it like they do everything.

thegoodthebadthedumb

2008-09-26 12:04:21 AM

Shrugging Atlas: One of two things is happening here:

1. All of this is an organized ploy by the Republicans to help McCain's campaign get back on its feet. They sink the plan in place earlier today to allow McCain to appear to organize the various wings of the Republican Party in the House and Senate over the next couple of days and present a new plan that will be approved. He looks like a decider and a leader and comes out ahead, while Obama sat on the sidelines advising caution and ultimately accomplishing nothing.

2. The Republican Party really is totally in chaos. The House GOPers really are revolting and are willing to rat fark McCain to get what they want because they are looking out for their own skins and never liked McCain anyway. They give the finger to Bush as well because he's gone anyway in 3.5 months and has done nothing but shiat on them for 7 years. They'll defy McCain and refuse anything outside of their terms, making him look like he can't control his own party.

I don't know which it is, but I can't see any other possibilities at this point.

Neither of those would happen if they'd just put the bill up for a vote. It would pass the Senate. It would pass the House. Bush would sign it. There simply aren't enough House GOPers to kill this. (Unless, as BuckyKatt theorizes, there are some Dem defectors in the house - of which I haven't seen one iota of evidence.)

I'm seriously lost as to what is going on here and why it hasn't been passed yet.

Weaver95

2008-09-26 12:04:36 AM

lexslamman: Why does the McCain/GOP plan include capital gains tax cuts for the rich but no assistance to homeowners facing foreclosure?

Because us little people don't make million dollar donations to political parties.

I've had this conversation with dad already:

Me: 'I think the Republicans and Democrats are equally responsible for this mess and can't get us out of it.'

Dad: 'I agree.'

M: 'so...why are you voting for McCain again?'
D: 'Because Obama can't save us!'
M: 'but...you just said that the Republicans can't save us either.'
D: 'yeah, and what's your point?'
M: 'well...if neither party can save us - why keep voting for them?'
D: 'Because!'
M: 'gonna need some more detail on that one.'
D: 'Because....[shakes] [shivers] IT'S ALL OBAMA'S FAULT!'
M: '*sigh*'

InmanRoshi

2008-09-26 12:04:40 AM

Uhmm .. I'm going to go with #1.

And I don't think McCain, with the House Republicans, are going to sign off on anything that doesn't at least give the appearance that McCain went down to Washington and "Got-R-Dun" to the mouthbreathers.

NewportBarGuy

2008-09-26 12:04:48 AM

IXI Jim IXI: .

Goddamn, you are worse than me.

I'll see you in hell.

lexslamman

2008-09-26 12:04:51 AM

davidlachnicht: lexslamman: Why does the McCain/GOP plan include capital gains tax cuts for the rich but no assistance to homeowners facing foreclosure?

If the forclosures are for sub-prime loans, that they shouldn't have gotten in the first place, LET THEM FAIL.

Ah yes, the good old GOP 'let them eat cake' response.

How's that been working out? (new window)

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-26 12:04:56 AM

Great Janitor: McCain went to Washington, returned to his job, and worked on a bailout deal.

McCain decided to call a press conference to say he was suspending his campaign over this...which never happened. Ads continued to run, interviews continued to happen...

Great Janitor: So, this leads me to think that McCain is a doing, Obama is all talk. I'd rather have a leader that will do stuff instead of someone that will just sit by and biatch about what's going on.

I'd rather have a leader who will give credit to others for their ideas, instead of just co-opting them and claiming that they're theirs.

The_Gallant_Gallstone

2008-09-26 12:05:02 AM

Great Janitor: My point of view on all of this:

Aren't you just the janitor?

Lawnchair: But, we're holding out and seriously considering instead paying off her parents mortgage (on 8 acres), moving a trailer out there for us, and working the land/living cheap.

I'm considering a bizarre haircut, firearms, and the willingness to consume human flesh in the coming years.

davidlachnicht

2008-09-26 12:05:15 AM

lexslamman: davidlachnicht: You didn't even address what I said.

The ball has been in the GOP court, and they decided to turn their backs. There was a broad agreement and instead of moving forward on it, they followed their presidential candidate in leading this country over a cliff.

This will get passed in some form, but time will be taken to try to let bipartisanship work.

But if the Dems are convince they are right, and Paulsen is IN, and Bush is IN, and Wall Street is IN (insofar as anything is better than nothing), then I still don't get why they give a shiat what McCain or any other Congressional GOPer thinks. Make 'em vote on it - they won't filabuster.

InteriorDesignNinja

2008-09-26 12:05:31 AM

IXI Jim IXI: NewportBarGuy: I, for one, am encouraged that retarded children are responsible for solving a credit crisis they can't even begin to understand.

Jesus shiat, you managed to royally burn both halves of the Republican ticket. Now, PS McCain crashing the retard baby into the ground. That is your last challenge.

/(please please please please please please...)

Sym_pathetic

2008-09-26 12:05:35 AM

Too bad the only thing McCain has done in Washington, so far, is go to the same meeting as Obama.

/nice try

alostpacket

2008-09-26 12:05:38 AM

davidlachnicht: The Democrats unwillingness to fix this
and stop worrying about whether or not
the GOP gets enough blame for the debacle itself
or any future failure

Dems, its time to lose your (re)elections...

No. As I said earlier this whole things STINKS of a game being played by Bush, Paulson, McCain and house republicans to try and say "well the economy tanked but look at these big government democrats giving your money to Wall Street."

Does you actually think Paulson was seriously proposing the he get to control $700 billion with no oversight? Are you really so blind as to think that was an honest proposal?

Two words: Overton window.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overton_window ^

To claim this as democrat inaction is rich at best.

Also, someone mentioned the republicans trying to add an elimination of the capital gains tax earlier. Does anyone have a source for this? I would be curious to read it.

Coco LaFemme

2008-09-26 12:05:46 AM

I would be surprised to see McCain in Mississippi tomorrow night.

Lawnchair

2008-09-26 12:05:53 AM

Gwendolyn: If you are ready to retire why the hell do you have your money should be someplace safe

Where do you suggest is safe against the very real possibility of monetizing the currently insufferable amount of debt in the system (i.e., massive inflation) while in a downturn.

Karma Curmudgeon

2008-09-26 12:06:03 AM

davidlachnicht:
If the forclosures are for sub-prime loans, that they shouldn't have gotten in the first place, LET THEM FAIL.

Yet we'll save the hides of the companies that put the entire system at risk. How noble.

Rascal King

2008-09-26 12:06:19 AM

McCain received the three page proposal on Monday, Hadn't read it as of Tuesday. On Wednesday he says he is suspending his campaign. Yet he goes through more TV appearances and interviews after that announcement yesterday and today than normal and then lands in DC 22 hours after explaining how urgent it was for him to get to Washington. This is all a full 10 days after the 'Crisis' began mind you.

What exactly is it he's doing that would make you want to vote for him?

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-26 12:06:44 AM

NewportBarGuy: Goddamn, you are worse than me.

I'll see you in hell.

Well, I have certain expectations to live down to ;)

I think this one has been my worst so far:

That, or the Palin blowjob animation.

Of course, I still have plenty of time until the election :D

Weaver95

2008-09-26 12:07:05 AM

Coco LaFemme: I would be surprised to see McCain in Mississippi tomorrow night.

Oh I think McCain is gonna run and hide as much as he can.

thegoodthebadthedumb

2008-09-26 12:07:14 AM

Flying Code Monkey: This is the most pathetic Republican political grandstanding since what ... either Schiavo or the Patriot Act.

They're trying to game this whole thing so that McCain can ride to the rescue and have some kind of Mavrick Moment, whether it's Standing Up to his Own Party, or Reaching Across the Aisle, or your campaign cliche of choice. Bookmark me and look it up later.

McCain has no relevant expertise. He's not Majority Leader, nor Committee Chairman. His "campaign on hold" has been nothing but more sham. There's nothing left of him but an unhealthy political puppet with the RNC's hand up his ass.

When only Obama shows up for the debate/town hall tomorrow, it'll have hardly even started before Tucker Bounds is dispatched to trumpet McCain's shiny country-firstedness while he sits around Washington being useless. Meanwhile the news channel guys will talk ambiguously about it like they do everything.

The only way that McCain can "game the system", is if the Democrats allow him to. They could have passed this bill tonight and stolen all of McCain's thunder.

pvd021

2008-09-26 12:07:17 AM

I agree with republicans. If you make poor decisions, you deserve to fail, and if you live beyond your means, consider this a wake up call.

Calvin Coolidge

2008-09-26 12:07:18 AM

Well, that about does it. The market is going to farking FREAK tomorrow when it opens. Black Friday II: Information Age Bugaloo.

Thanks a lot, conservative morons (and John McCain).

PresidentPutz

2008-09-26 12:07:19 AM

"McCain went to Washington, returned to his job, and worked on a bailout deal."

No, he didn't. He isn't on the Senate Banking Committee and had NO HAND in the planning, He went to DC to Grandstand.

Obama is doing what he needs to. When a vote is called, he will be there to cast his. He actually read the first plan where as McCain admitted he didn't read it. It was only 2.5 pages but he couldn't find time to read it?
Yeah, it was a shiat plan, but he couldn't have known that with any confidence since, by Tuesday, he still hadn't READ it. How very BUSH-like of him.
Yeah, I am POSITIVE he is 4 more years of the last 8.

bulldg4life

2008-09-26 12:07:55 AM

Weaver95: Because us little people don't make million dollar donations to political parties.

Hey!

Have you seen the house republican proposal? Have you seen McCain's White House talk of tax breaks and a decrease in regulation to lure people back to the table?

Does he take credit of it tomorrow and ride to the rescue on a shiny white horse?

Dr.Zom

2008-09-26 12:07:58 AM

Weaver95: I really enjoy these updates about your dad.

/seriously

The_Gallant_Gallstone

2008-09-26 12:08:02 AM

Owangotang: So...you're saying I should flip a coin to decide it?

I would. You might want to use Chinese currency though... do they even have coins over there? I'm sure they do. I wonder if they got Mao to look good on their currency.

Weaver95

2008-09-26 12:08:07 AM

Calvin Coolidge: Well, that about does it. The market is going to farking FREAK tomorrow when it opens. Black Friday II: Information Age Bugaloo.

Thanks a lot, conservative morons (and John McCain).

Yeah, it's an interesting time to suddenly rediscover their commitment to fiscal conservatism.

newmoonpuppyhead

2008-09-26 12:08:47 AM

No. They were sold this bill of goods with the government cheering them on and deregulating the whole damn mess. No. You are most definitely wrong. People that think like you are the exact reason we're in this situation. Trickle down, fark those on the bottom rung, take care of those on the top. You had your chance, you failed.

lexslamman

2008-09-26 12:09:02 AM

davidlachnicht: lexslamman: davidlachnicht: You didn't even address what I said.

The ball has been in the GOP court, and they decided to turn their backs. There was a broad agreement and instead of moving forward on it, they followed their presidential candidate in leading this country over a cliff.

This will get passed in some form, but time will be taken to try to let bipartisanship work.

But if the Dems are convince they are right, and Paulsen is IN, and Bush is IN, and Wall Street is IN (insofar as anything is better than nothing), then I still don't get why they give a shiat what McCain or any other Congressional GOPer thinks. Make 'em vote on it - they won't filabuster.

Two Words: Electoral liability.

If they push it through, McBush attacks them for unilaterally pushing through a bailout of wallstreet that costs $700 billion of taxpayer money.

If they don't, McBush attacks them for not acting when the economy was swirling the drain.

That is the entire reason McCain (finally) arrived in Warshington today and promptly sabotaged the agreement that the House and Senate leadership of both parties had reached.

Weaver95

2008-09-26 12:09:30 AM

bulldg4life: Weaver95: Because us little people don't make million dollar donations to political parties.

Hey!

Have you seen the house republican proposal? Have you seen McCain's White House talk of tax breaks and a decrease in regulation to lure people back to the table?

Does he take credit of it tomorrow and ride to the rescue on a shiny white horse?

if you mean 'slimy white horse' I'd agree.

Christ. this whole thing is a mess and Congress is playing politics while wall street melts down. opening bell, massive sell offs - wait and see.

The_Gallant_Gallstone

2008-09-26 12:09:32 AM

Calvin Coolidge: Well, that about does it. The market is going to farking FREAK tomorrow when it opens. Black Friday II: Information Age Bugaloo.

I know... ain't it cool!

Any chance McCain will go on Letterman next week?

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-26 12:09:37 AM

bulldg4life: Does he take credit of it tomorrow and ride to the rescue on a shiny white horse?

He'd have to. Those newfangled internal combustion engines scare him.

moothemagiccow

2008-09-26 12:09:53 AM

I said let them fail, I'm doing a bank run, then going to Australia. After they fail I could give a shiat. The fact is this shiat wasn't a few banks, it was widespread. It was company policy for countless banks. They decided to gamble with the American economy, and they farked. it. up.

Don't assume I don't understand the gravity of the situation, but why should we not be allowed to fail? In 20 years, maybe more, maybe less, ARMs are just going to come back with a vengeance because no one remembered there being a problem with them.

Truncks1

2008-09-26 12:09:59 AM

davidlachnicht: If the forclosures are for sub-prime loans, that they shouldn't have gotten in the first place, LET THEM FAIL.

I, for one, do not wish to see The Great Depression: Part II

Satyagraha

2008-09-26 12:10:13 AM

It's time to let go. It's all well and good these guys want to privatise the profits but the loss they want to socialize on us...I don't think so.
Here is a c-span video of the Bail out game...it's a short 5 minutes

Link (worth a view)

Kaybeck

2008-09-26 12:10:20 AM

THIS.

If only there were enough people in America smart enough to see this as his most shameful stunt yet.

The idiots will probably give him the presidency in a landslide now.

5_second_rule

2008-09-26 12:10:29 AM

Great Janitor 2008-09-26 12:01:28 AM
My point of view on all of this:

McCain went to Washington, returned to his job, and worked on a bailout deal.

Obama continued his campaign, talked about how bad the deal was going to be and how he was against it, even though he's a farking senator and can vote against it if he doesn't like it or get his say in as to what he wants done.

So, this leads me to think that McCain is a doing, ~~Obama is all talk. I'd rather have a leader that will do stuff instead of someone that will just sit by and biatch about what's going on.~~Playing politics with the situation that just about everyone even in his own party can see
Might have to vote McCain...

fixed it for you fark indendepent

Bobbinsworth

2008-09-26 12:10:45 AM

E-mail from Ron Paul today:

"Dear Friends:

The financial meltdown the economists of the Austrian School predicted has arrived.

We are in this crisis because of an excess of artificially created credit at the hands of the Federal Reserve System. The solution being proposed? More artificial credit by the Federal Reserve. No liquidation of bad debt and malinvestment is to be allowed. By doing more of the same, we will only continue and intensify the distortions in our economy - all the capital misallocation, all the malinvestment - and prevent the market's attempt to re-establish rational pricing of houses and other assets.

Last night the president addressed the nation about the financial crisis. There is no point in going through his remarks line by line, since I'd only be repeating what I've been saying over and over - not just for the past several days, but for years and even decades.

Still, at least a few observations are necessary.

The president assures us that his administration "is working with Congress to address the root cause behind much of the instability in our markets." Care to take a guess at whether the Federal Reserve and its money creation spree were even mentioned?

We are told that "low interest rates" led to excessive borrowing, but we are not told how these low interest rates came about. They were a deliberate policy of the Federal Reserve. As always, artificially low interest rates distort the market. Entrepreneurs engage in malinvestments - investments that do not make sense in light of current resource availability, that occur in more temporally remote stages of the capital structure than the pattern of consumer demand can support, and that would not have been made at all if the interest rate had been permitted to tell the truth instead of being toyed with by the Fed.

Not a word about any of that, of course, because Americans might then discover how the great wise men in Washington caused this great debacle. Better to keep scapegoating the mortgage industry or "wildcat capitalism" (as if we actually have a pure free market!).

Speaking about Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, the president said: "Because these companies were chartered by Congress, many believed they were guaranteed by the federal government. This allowed them to borrow enormous sums of money, fuel the market for questionable investments, and put our financial system at risk."

Doesn't that prove the foolishness of chartering Fannie and Freddie in the first place? Doesn't that suggest that maybe, just maybe, government may have contributed to this mess? And of course, by bailing out Fannie and Freddie, hasn't the federal government shown that the "many" who "believed they were guaranteed by the federal government" were in fact correct?

Then come the scare tactics. If we don't give dictatorial powers to the Treasury Secretary "the stock market would drop even more, which would reduce the value of your retirement account. The value of your home could plummet." Left unsaid, naturally, is that with the bailout and all the money and credit that must be produced out of thin air to fund it, the value of your retirement account will drop anyway, because the value of the dollar will suffer a precipitous decline. As for home prices, they are obviously much too high, and supply and demand cannot equilibrate if government insists on propping them up.

It's the same destructive strategy that government tried during the Great Depression: prop up prices at all costs. The Depression went on for over a decade. On the other hand, when liquidation was allowed to occur in the equally devastating downturn of 1921, the economy recovered within less than a year.

The president also tells us that Senators McCain and Obama will join him at the White House today in order to figure out how to get the bipartisan bailout passed. The two senators would do their country much more good if they stayed on the campaign trail debating who the bigger celebrity is, or whatever it is that occupies their attention these days.

F.A. Hayek won the Nobel Prize for showing how central banks' manipulation of interest rates creates the boom-bust cycle with which we are sadly familiar. In 1932, in the depths of the Great Depression, he described the foolish policies being pursued in his day - and which are being proposed, just as destructively, in our own:

Instead of furthering the inevitable liquidation of the maladjustments brought about by the boom during the last three years, all conceivable means have been used to prevent that readjustment from taking place; and one of these means, which has been repeatedly tried though without success, from the earliest to the most recent stages of depression, has been this deliberate policy of credit expansion.

To combat the depression by a forced credit expansion is to attempt to cure the evil by the very means which brought it about; because we are suffering from a misdirection of production, we want to create further misdirection - a procedure that can only lead to a much more severe crisis as soon as the credit expansion comes to an end... It is probably to this experiment, together with the attempts to prevent liquidation once the crisis had come, that we owe the exceptional severity and duration of the depression.

The only thing we learn from history, I am afraid, is that we do not learn from history.

The very people who have spent the past several years assuring us that the economy is fundamentally sound, and who themselves foolishly cheered the extension of all these novel kinds of mortgages, are the ones who now claim to be the experts who will restore prosperity! Just how spectacularly wrong, how utterly without a clue, does someone have to be before his expert status is called into question?

Oh, and did you notice that the bailout is now being called a "rescue plan"? I guess "bailout" wasn't sitting too well with the American people.

The very people who with somber faces tell us of their deep concern for the spread of democracy around the world are the ones most insistent on forcing a bill through Congress that the American people overwhelmingly oppose. The very fact that some of you seem to think you're supposed to have a voice in all this actually seems to annoy them.

I continue to urge you to contact your representatives and give them a piece of your mind. I myself am doing everything I can to promote the correct point of view on the crisis. Be sure also to educate yourselves on these subjects - the Campaign for Liberty blog is an excellent place to start. Read the posts, ask questions in the comment section, and learn.

H.G. Wells once said that civilization was in a race between education and catastrophe. Let us learn the truth and spread it as far and wide as our circumstances allow. For the truth is the greatest weapon we have.

In liberty,

Ron Paul"

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-26 12:10:51 AM

Owangotang: If a deal is reached early tomorrow, leaving no wiggle room out of the debate for McCain, expect Bristol Palin to go into early labor sometime in the afternoon. It will always be something

I'm taking bets on the baby looking a little TOO much like dad...

Sym_pathetic

2008-09-26 12:11:12 AM

The_Gallant_Gallstone: Calvin Coolidge: Well, that about does it. The market is going to farking FREAK tomorrow when it opens. Black Friday II: Information Age Bugaloo.

I know... ain't it cool!

Any chance McCain will go on Letterman next week?

He's been trashing him all night tonight.

Rascal King

2008-09-26 12:11:19 AM

Owangotang: Coco LaFemme: I would be surprised to see McCain in Mississippi tomorrow night.

If a deal is reached early tomorrow, leaving no wiggle room out of the debate for McCain, expect Bristol Palin to go into early labor sometime in the afternoon. It will always be something

Nah, thats how Palin is going to get out of her debate, which they already want to postpone.

Gwendolyn

2008-09-26 12:11:49 AM

tuition rate chart just for kicks. (new window)

Sym_pathetic: lexslamman: Why does the McCain/GOP plan include capital gains tax cuts for the rich but no assistance to homeowners facing foreclosure?

The Republican party helps those that can already help themselves.

There are already a crap ton of options for people facing foreclosure. As long as they talk to the bank when they are only a month behind there are options like restructuring the payment plan, making up the missed money over a course of a few months, interest only options, short sales, a government program what will pay your interest for a year. I was there in 2006 when the housing market in Ohio went to shiat, my husband lost his job, and we had to move. The renters trashed our house and caused about $15,000 damage and skipped town owing 3 months rent. Our credit went to shiat becuase we needed to stay one month last for 6 months until the house sold or there couldn't be a short sale but we're getting it back up.

The banks already work with you. Now if you let it get to 4 or 5 months behind without talking to them or were really farking stupid and bought a $500,000 house on a 0% down interest only loan and you work as a secretary at a police station making $32,000 a year (someone we know) no bail out in the world is going to help you.

lexslamman

2008-09-26 12:12:00 AM

mizchief: lexslamman: Why does the McCain/GOP plan include capital gains tax cuts for the rich but no assistance to homeowners facing foreclosure?

Where did you see the whole plan? i've been looking for that but have failed so far. It wasn't in the article. Best I could tell was that the tax cuts were to be in conjunction with buying the bad debt to give business incentives to buy the debt vs. having the government buy it with taxpayer money. Oh and there is no income requirement for capital gains taxes it and cuts to it, apply to everyone not just the rich. Just thought you should know. Some of us middle-class folk do a little investing too.

thehill.com

You do know that most of us middle-class folk have our investments as a retirement investment and do not buy-and-sell like the wealthy, so most of us only have to deal with capital gains once or twice in our lifetimes - while the ultra wealthy pay it on a daily basis when they short-sell.

FL8ME

2008-09-26 12:12:01 AM

IXI Jim IXI: davidlachnicht: reminds me of a quote I recently heard...

"I would rather lose an election than lose a war" -JohnMcCain

Actually, he was misquoted. What he actually said was, "I would rather lose my erection than lose a war."

John McCain is Chinese?

/Supplies!

Lawnchair

2008-09-26 12:12:08 AM

Great Janitor: McCain went to Washington, returned to his job, and worked on a bailout deal.

It's about time he went to his job. He hasn't made a Senate vote since the first week in April. Still hasn't, by the way. Ted Kennedy has been diagnosed with brain cancer, had surgery, radiation, chemo, made more than one floor vote, and hada speech at his political convention, all since the last time McCain did anything in the Senate. He's the ranking Republican member of the Senate Armed Services Committee, and hasn't been to that since March.

Can you tell me what he has actually done regarding the bailout deal? Because he said he hadn't read it as of earlier today.

Noah's Arcade

2008-09-26 12:12:15 AM

Oh, f*ck it - can't Bush just cancel the election and declare himself Emperor already? This is like when a rapist has you up against the wall with the knife to your throat and keeps talking about what he's going to do to you.

For christ sake, just stick it in and get it over with.

thegoodthebadthedumb

2008-09-26 12:12:27 AM

lexslamman: davidlachnicht: lexslamman: davidlachnicht: You didn't even address what I said.

The ball has been in the GOP court, and they decided to turn their backs. There was a broad agreement and instead of moving forward on it, they followed their presidential candidate in leading this country over a cliff.

This will get passed in some form, but time will be taken to try to let bipartisanship work.

But if the Dems are convince they are right, and Paulsen is IN, and Bush is IN, and Wall Street is IN (insofar as anything is better than nothing), then I still don't get why they give a shiat what McCain or any other Congressional GOPer thinks. Make 'em vote on it - they won't filabuster.

Two Words: Electoral liability.

If they push it through, McBush attacks them for unilaterally pushing through a bailout of wallstreet that costs $700 billion of taxpayer money.

If they don't, McBush attacks them for not acting when the economy was swirling the drain.

That is the entire reason McCain (finally) arrived in Warshington today and promptly sabotaged the agreement that the House and Senate leadership of both parties had reached.

Perhaps. But McCain's GOP colleagues in the Senate are reportedly on board. A bipartisan Senate vote for the bill would completely undercut any hypothetical McBush attack for passing the bill. Not to mention that Bush would be the one signing it.

Sym_pathetic

2008-09-26 12:12:27 AM

Sym_pathetic: The_Gallant_Gallstone: Calvin Coolidge: Well, that about does it. The market is going to farking FREAK tomorrow when it opens. Black Friday II: Information Age Bugaloo.

I know... ain't it cool!

Any chance McCain will go on Letterman next week?

He's been trashing him all night tonight.

Paris Hilton just said "Revenge is sweet." When Letterman asked her about McCain.

alostpacket

2008-09-26 12:12:39 AM

Weaver95: Coco LaFemme: I would be surprised to see McCain in Mississippi tomorrow night.

Oh I think McCain is gonna run and hide as much as he can.

Now that they've put the cards on the table I am beginning to think this as well.

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-26 12:12:56 AM

Sym_pathetic: He's been trashing him all night tonight.

Aw crap, I forgot to tape it. I just watched last night's show.

I know he's been on plenty of times, but was Letterman a Mccain supporter, or just friendly to the cause?

davidlachnicht

2008-09-26 12:13:14 AM

lexslamman: davidlachnicht: lexslamman: Why does the McCain/GOP plan include capital gains tax cuts for the rich but no assistance to homeowners facing foreclosure?

If the forclosures are for sub-prime loans, that they shouldn't have gotten in the first place, LET THEM FAIL.

Ah yes, the good old GOP 'let them eat cake' response.

How's that been working out? (new window)

Reno's problem was not dramatic increase in homeless numbers, it was typical NIMBY-types.

Jster422

2008-09-26 12:13:23 AM

This is all a propaganda stunt to allow McCain to be seen as standing up to Bush.

The Republicans in congress are joining in as a big show to demonstrate that they aren't tied to the Bush administration.

Mavrick 2...Boogaloo...

Weaver95

2008-09-26 12:13:33 AM

Dr.Zom: Weaver95: I really enjoy these updates about your dad.

/seriously

I'm starting to think that the ONLY reason Dad is voting for McCain is because, mentally speaking, he refuses to admit that the Republicans have failed him. He literally shakes with anger when I mention voting third party. He had to almost physically restrain himself from yelling at me across the dinner table tonight. I have NEVER seen him so angry before in my life. He's desperately afraid of Obama winning the election and outright refuses to acknowledge even the well documented McCain flaws. He actually told me that the 'Keating Five' mess had no bearing on McCain's possible behavior as President. I was stunned.

PresidentPutz

2008-09-26 12:13:44 AM

moothemagiccow:

"I said let them fail, I'm doing a bank run, then going to Australia."

Cus yeah, Australia is gonna be insulated from the failure of the biggest economy in the world.
Oh, and those dollars you pull outta your bank will likely be worth exactly SHIAT.
Yeah, you have a clue.

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-26 12:13:56 AM

FL8ME: /Supplies!

One of my favorite jokes, which never fails to get a round of groans when I tell it.

The_Gallant_Gallstone

2008-09-26 12:13:57 AM

moothemagiccow: I said let them fail, I'm doing a bank run, then going to Australia

You can't like run away from your problems dude. Sure, they got Vegemite and Crocodile Dundee 8 and boomerangs and koalas and shiat, but at the end of the day, you're going to be on an island with a bunch of convicts and what's going to change:

1. You'll still have to learn Mandarin (or Japanese) to make a decent living
2. The economic fall-out is going to reverberate around the world, even in "Crikey look at that manta" land.

Karma Curmudgeon

2008-09-26 12:14:26 AM

I find the faith that whatever plan was put on hold tonight is actually going to work, and the denial of the law of unintended consequences, to be both amusing and a face-palm generator.

hubiestubert

2008-09-26 12:14:28 AM

lexslamman: Why does the McCain/GOP plan include capital gains tax cuts for the rich but no assistance to homeowners facing foreclosure?

Because the homeowners who actually purchase things matter less than the pay outs that they're going to receive directly from the folks who get the real benefit from capital gains tax cuts?

Never mind that they receive taxpayer dollars as their paycheck from the gub'ment--a gub'ment that many claim to hate, but they keep cashing those suckers, don't they?

lexslamman

2008-09-26 12:14:42 AM

davidlachnicht: lexslamman: davidlachnicht: lexslamman: Why does the McCain/GOP plan include capital gains tax cuts for the rich but no assistance to homeowners facing foreclosure?

If the forclosures are for sub-prime loans, that they shouldn't have gotten in the first place, LET THEM FAIL.

Ah yes, the good old GOP 'let them eat cake' response.

How's that been working out? (new window)

Reno's problem was not dramatic increase in homeless numbers, it was typical NIMBY-types.

RTFA and try again.

/here's a hint: its not just about Reno.

Cathedralmaster

2008-09-26 12:14:47 AM

lexslamman: That is the entire reason McCain (finally) arrived in Warshington today and promptly sabotaged the agreement that the House and Senate leadership of both parties had reached.

And it will backfire tomorrow when the market plunges and they take the blame. You can't ride to the rescue of a mess you yourself are blamed fro creating.

This is why I think the House Republicans have to be playing to their base. Otherwise, they just committed political suicide and I don't see diving on a grenade for McCain as a good reason for them to be doing that.

Sym_pathetic

2008-09-26 12:14:47 AM

Noah's Arcade: Oh, f*ck it - can't Bush just cancel the election and declare himself Emperor already? This is like when a rapist has you up against the wall with the knife to your throat and keeps talking about what he's going to do to you.

For christ sake, just stick it in and get it over with.

"I wanna hear you scream..."

lexslamman

2008-09-26 12:15:51 AM

hubiestubert: lexslamman: Why does the McCain/GOP plan include capital gains tax cuts for the rich but no assistance to homeowners facing foreclosure?

Because the homeowners who actually purchase things matter less than the pay outs that they're going to receive directly from the folks who get the real benefit from capital gains tax cuts?

Never mind that they receive taxpayer dollars as their paycheck from the gub'ment--a gub'ment that many claim to hate, but they keep cashing those suckers, don't they?

Because homeowners facing foreclosure don't donate to the GOP.

People who end up paying capital gains taxes, on the other hand...

davidlachnicht

2008-09-26 12:16:05 AM

Truncks1: davidlachnicht: If the forclosures are for sub-prime loans, that they shouldn't have gotten in the first place, LET THEM FAIL.

I, for one, do not wish to see The Great Depression: Part II

Sub-prime failures would only account for a small % of the total mortgage market.

MisterTweak

2008-09-26 12:16:23 AM

pvd021: I agree with republicans. If you make poor decisions, you deserve to fail, and if you live beyond your means, consider this a wake up call.

That would be cool, except millions of people who *do* work hard, live within their means, and pay their bills are watching their neighborhoods turn into board-ups, schools can't pay teachers when "flippers" default on taxes, and instead of letting financial experts solve the problem, it's just exploited as a "game-changer".

Calvin Coolidge

2008-09-26 12:16:30 AM

Weaver95: Calvin Coolidge: Well, that about does it. The market is going to farking FREAK tomorrow when it opens. Black Friday II: Information Age Bugaloo.

Thanks a lot, conservative morons (and John McCain).

Yeah, it's an interesting time to suddenly rediscover their commitment to fiscal conservatism.

Seriously. I know these conservative congressmen (and probably a lot of more liberal ones, too) are getting flooded with calls from constituents bellyaching about the $700 billion "bailout of Wall Street." Never mind that this isn't explicitly a bailout of big companies; it's a bailout of all banks, institutions, etc. that are being poisoned by these subprime-infested securities.

I mean, where the fark was their outrage over the Iraq war, which we've spent at least $1 trillion on so far? Or the profligate spending at the hands of the Republicans from 2001-2006? That was all a-OK because Rush, Hannity, et al weren't screaming "SOCIALISM!!!1."

There's blame to place on liberals who oppose it, too. They're the ones going "OMG, this is Iraq all over again!11 Let's not be so quick to give them this money!11."

Come on. For one thing, this isn't authorization to wage war. And this isn't some plan cooked up by Cheney and the neocon cabal in the DoD. This is Ben Bernanke (non-partisan) and Henry Paulson (partisan, and from Wall Street, but by all indicates well-intentioned). Bernanke did his PhD studies on the depression. I trust that he knows his shiat, and he says this is our best shot at staving off a major economic crisis.

Whatever Bernanke approves, I saw we go with. He's the farking expert on this shiat. And it's not like they were going to pass this $700 billion bill without adding in Congressional/judicial oversight.

The_Gallant_Gallstone

2008-09-26 12:16:31 AM

Gwendolyn: Now if you let it get to 4 or 5 months behind without talking to them or were really farking stupid and bought a $500,000 house on a 0% down interest only loan and you work as a secretary at a police station making $32,000 a year (someone we know) no bail out in the world is going to help you.

No, for that secretary's problem, a bailout won't do it... what she needs is a full-scale civil war.

Bacontastesgood

2008-09-26 12:16:41 AM

PresidentPutz: All you dumb-arses saying "Let Wall Street fail" should remember what that means:

Wall Street is not 100% finance and banking, and inflated housing is the core of this "crisis". There are a lot of firms who actually make real products or provide real services, and who are doing just fine. They aren't glorified bookies. They'll still do fine if the money supply tightens, because they have business models that aren't a shiatstain on someone's underwear, and they have talented, hardworking employees, not people with real estate licenses or MBAs with a finance specialty.

This "economy is cratering" stuff is pure bunk, spun by people who stand to make out like bandits.

Coco LaFemme

2008-09-26 12:16:46 AM

How many points in the polls will this cost McCain?

Sym_pathetic

2008-09-26 12:17:00 AM

IXI Jim IXI: Sym_pathetic: He's been trashing him all night tonight.

Aw crap, I forgot to tape it. I just watched last night's show.

I know he's been on plenty of times, but was Letterman a Mccain supporter, or just friendly to the cause?

It's hard to tell. Letterman's an entertainer, and will use any opportunity to capitalize on his ratings.

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-26 12:17:10 AM

The_Gallant_Gallstone: You can't like run away from your problems dude. Sure, they got Vegemite and Crocodile Dundee 8 and boomerangs and koalas and shiat, but at the end of the day, you're going to be on an island with a bunch of convicts and what's going to change:

What is Vegemite like? I actually received a free sample, but never had the guts to try it.

duncangonuts

2008-09-26 12:17:22 AM

I really wish there was someone out there who wasn't a partisan, a comedian, a candidate, nor the president, could just come out tomorrow morning, call a press conference, and simply say, "Grow the fark up" to everybody in Washington.

NYZooMan

2008-09-26 12:17:44 AM

Astroturfing the Internet: What an elected representive with some balls might say to corporate bankers begging for a bailout :

"Gentlemen, I have had men watching you for a long time and I am convinced that you have used the funds of the bank to speculate in the breadstuffs of the country. When you won, you divided the profits amongst you, and when you lost, you charged it to the bank.
You tell me that if I take the deposits from the bank and annul its charter, I shall ruin ten thousand families. That may be true, gentlemen, but that is your sin!
Should I let you go on, you will ruin fifty thousand families, and that would be my sin!
You are a den of vipers and thieves."
- Andrew Jackson (1836) 7th US President. Jackson revoked the charter of the Second Bank.

Those who undermined the security of the country are guilty of treason as far as I'm concerned.

newmoonpuppyhead

2008-09-26 12:18:34 AM

mizchief: newmoonpuppyhead: davidlachnicht: lexslamman: Why does the McCain/GOP plan include capital gains tax cuts for the rich but no assistance to homeowners facing foreclosure?

If the forclosures are for sub-prime loans, that they shouldn't have gotten in the first place, LET THEM FAIL.

No. They were sold this bill of goods with the government cheering them on and deregulating the whole damn mess. No. You are most definitely wrong. People that think like you are the exact reason we're in this situation. Trickle down, fark those on the bottom rung, take care of those on the top. You had your chance, you failed.

Could you please enlighten me on what exactly the republicans deregulated? As in what regulation did they specifically remove from whom? The only specific facts I can find about that is when they tried to get more oversight on freddie and fannie and the dems shot it down.

Well, here's McCain talking it on 60 Minutes:

http://www.drudge.com/news/112683/mccain-deregulation-helpful-economy

And check out his top financial guy, Phil Graham. Google: Phil Graham Deregulation...then: McCain deregulation. .

Happy reading!

bartink

2008-09-26 12:18:43 AM

NYZooMan: Those who undermined the security of the country are guilty of treason as far as I'm concerned.

I never figured you to be the impeach and hang Bush type.

Who knew?

Coco LaFemme

2008-09-26 12:18:58 AM

Owangotang: Coco LaFemme: How many points in the polls will this cost McCain?

None. This whole thing is over the heads of his base anyways. They'll just like him walking around looking like he's doing stuff.

Can we pretend his base is smart?

bartink

2008-09-26 12:19:25 AM

Owangotang: None. This whole thing is over the heads of his base anyways. They'll just like him walking around looking like he's doing stuff.

His base is not what will change in the polls.

Coco LaFemme

2008-09-26 12:19:34 AM

bartink: NYZooMan: Those who undermined the security of the country are guilty of treason as far as I'm concerned.

I never figured you to be the impeach and hang Bush type.

Who knew?

I've got the rope if you find a sturdy tree.

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-26 12:19:41 AM

Owangotang: Colin Powell?

Nah. He was tied to the administration too long, rode too hard.

The_Gallant_Gallstone

2008-09-26 12:19:45 AM

Calvin Coolidge: Whatever Bernanke approves, I saw we go with. He's the farking expert on this shiat.

Don't let that beard fool you.

davidlachnicht

2008-09-26 12:19:59 AM

lexslamman: davidlachnicht: lexslamman: davidlachnicht: lexslamman: Why does the McCain/GOP plan include capital gains tax cuts for the rich but no assistance to homeowners facing foreclosure?

If the forclosures are for sub-prime loans, that they shouldn't have gotten in the first place, LET THEM FAIL.

Ah yes, the good old GOP 'let them eat cake' response.

How's that been working out? (new window)

Reno's problem was not dramatic increase in homeless numbers, it was typical NIMBY-types.

RTFA and try again.

/here's a hint: its not just about Reno.

Read more than just that article! It been on-going for many, many years.

PresidentPutz

2008-09-26 12:20:32 AM

Bacontastesgood: PresidentPutz: All you dumb-arses saying "Let Wall Street fail" should remember what that means:

Wall Street is not 100% finance and banking, and inflated housing is the core of this "crisis". There are a lot of firms who actually make real products or provide real services, and who are doing just fine. They aren't glorified bookies. They'll still do fine if the money supply tightens, because they have business models that aren't a shiatstain on someone's underwear, and they have talented, hardworking employees, not people with real estate licenses or MBAs with a finance specialty.

This "economy is cratering" stuff is pure bunk, spun by people who stand to make out like bandits.

You heard about WAMU? About the increasing difficulty of getting loans? The Market fluctuating like a spastic gerbil?

It may not be cratering but over a TRILLION in value to retirements, investments, property values propping equity loans has been lost.

That seems pretty significant to me. AND it hasn't "Failed" yet.
Wonder how that is gonna look.

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-26 12:20:53 AM

Coco LaFemme: Can we pretend his base is smart?

Maybe after I'm done pretending I'm rich. And THAT's gonna take a while

NewportBarGuy

2008-09-26 12:21:32 AM

Sym_pathetic: It's hard to tell. Letterman's an entertainer, and will use any opportunity to capitalize on his ratings.

Yeah, it didn't come off like that at all. He was genuinely pissed off.

davidlachnicht

2008-09-26 12:21:58 AM

I'm not saying let Wall Street fail, I'm saying the BILL should require sub-prime failures to fail.

Gwendolyn

2008-09-26 12:22:03 AM

The_Gallant_Gallstone: No, for that secretary's problem, a bailout won't do it... what she needs is a full-scale civil war.

Her husband was working 3 jobs to keep up the payments. She's recently decided she's in love with some guy and threw him and his three kids out of "her" house. The house is in her name because he had bad credit from a divorce. She's getting foreclosed on soon. Which I think is kinda funny as she was a major biatch.

A 27 year old with a 12 year old daughter who's recently decided she didn't get to have enough fun in high school and now it's her turn. Whoopee!

sory thread jack. *heh*

Weaver95

2008-09-26 12:22:10 AM

Coco LaFemme: Owangotang: Coco LaFemme: How many points in the polls will this cost McCain?

None. This whole thing is over the heads of his base anyways. They'll just like him walking around looking like he's doing stuff.

Can we pretend his base is smart?

Dad: 'did you see McCain's brave decision this week?'
Me: 'oh, you mean his cut and run, hide from Obama plan? Yeah, it's a disgrace.'
D: 'Hey! He's a POW! you don't know what that means!'
M: 'I know exactly what it means - he crashed his plane and got caught. What I don't get is how this qualifies him for the highest office in the land.'
D: 'oh what do you care, you're voting for that asshole.'
M: 'no, i'm voting for Bob Barr not McCain.'
D: '....'
M: 'hey, you raised me to be like this.'

IXI Jim IXI

2008-09-26 12:22:17 AM

Wow...this has to be my best greenlight yet.

Not that there are that MANY of em.

lexslamman

2008-09-26 12:22:21 AM

davidlachnicht: lexslamman: davidlachnicht: lexslamman: davidlachnicht: lexslamman: Why does the McCain/GOP plan include capital gains tax cuts for the rich but no assistance to homeowners facing foreclosure?

If the forclosures are for sub-prime loans, that they shouldn't have gotten in the first place, LET THEM FAIL.

Ah yes, the good old GOP 'let them eat cake' response.

How's that been working out? (new window)

Reno's problem was not dramatic increase in homeless numbers, it was typical NIMBY-types.

RTFA and try again.

/here's a hint: its not just about Reno.

Read more than just that article! It been on-going for many, many years.

Yup. Those Bush tax cuts that McCain wants to extend and deepen sure have stimulated our economy.

Lawnchair

2008-09-26 12:22:23 AM

duncangonuts: I really wish there was someone out there who wasn't a partisan, a comedian, a candidate, nor the president, could just come out tomorrow morning, call a press conference, and simply say, "Grow the fark up" to everybody in Washington.

Actually, this would be exactly the time for a President to say exactly that. Too bad we don't have one.

tuna fingers

2008-09-26 12:22:32 AM

Jster422: This is all a propaganda stunt to allow McCain to be seen as standing up to Bush.

The Republicans in congress are joining in as a big show to demonstrate that they aren't tied to the Bush administration.

Mavrick 2...Boogaloo...

Spot-on.
I enjoy the big show. It's when all the clowns pop out of ~~Palin's vaginal cavity~~ the clown car.

rppp01a

2008-09-26 12:22:57 AM