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(Guardian)   Obama: "Hey, where are the white women at"?   (guardian.co.uk) divider line
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6307 clicks; posted to Politics » on 10 Sep 2008 at 5:48 AM (13 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



432 Comments     (+0 »)
 
2008-09-10 3:56:57 AM  
This is why Obama is countering with Hillary Clinton, Kathleen Sebelius, and others to attack her. He is not some sexist like McCain who only sees race and gender.

The Democrats just have to be careful when the Republicans start using Palin and the "scary black man" bit to get more idiots on their team.
 
2008-09-10 3:57:47 AM  
i51.photobucket.comView Full Size
 
2008-09-10 4:10:02 AM  
Once ya go blah........
 
2008-09-10 4:28:06 AM  
Obama is apparently playing, "Rope a dope." Which isn't a bad strategy for the next 3 to 6 days. The McCain juggernaut might be hard to stop if Obama doesn't do something effective.
 
2008-09-10 4:28:57 AM  
Remove all Republicans: The Democrats just have to be careful when the Republicans start using Palin and the "scary black man PENIS" bit to get more idiots on their team.

FTFY.

/penis
//like this headline
 
2008-09-10 4:35:44 AM  
Who's afraid of the Big Black Penis?

I mean Muslim.

I mean WOLF!
 
2008-09-10 5:57:05 AM  
Sigh, no matter what happens, you always end up with the President you deserve.

I thought nothing could top 2000 until 2004. I thought nothing could top 2004 but my Are-you-farking-kidding-me?! Meter is busted from this campaign, and there's still 55 days to go.
 
2008-09-10 5:57:24 AM  
Dear America,

I'm officially giving up all hope for you.


Love,

Me
 
2008-09-10 6:03:28 AM  

organizm: Dear America,

I'm officially giving up all hope for you.


Love,

Me


Thats ok, we gave up on Jersey a LONG time ago.
 
2008-09-10 6:05:08 AM  
Bah. Polls don't mean shiat.

Polls can be manipulated to give whatever impression the pollster wants, by clever phrasing of the questions.

That, and I nobody I know has been called by a pollster...
 
2008-09-10 6:05:56 AM  

Remove all Republicans: This is why Obama is countering with Hillary Clinton, Kathleen Sebelius, and others to attack her. He is not some sexist like McCain who only sees race and gender.


So by sending his biatches after those biatches, it is alright?

You get crazier the more I see you post.
 
2008-09-10 6:06:37 AM  
My mother's American and I recently discovered she likes Palin based on the premise that 1) Palin is supposed to be a downhome country girl and 2) Palin's a mommy. Up until now I thought my mother was fairly left-wing. I tried to tell her a few of the things Palin stood for and my mom thinks they're all just smear attacks. And apparently Obama is bad because he's "coming out of big city Chicago". I had no idea cities were evil and being in the country made people good. Or that being a mother made someone saintly. Palin reminds me of those psycho biatchy cheerleader girls who bullied people and made a big deal out of being a tough girl in high school. In particular, the one who led that pray by the flagpole thing even though she was sleeping with one of the male gym teachers.

I can't decide who to vote for in the Canadian election, I mean, there's Neocon Robot, French Muppet, Big Moustache Mouth, and Ignored Green Party Lady.
 
2008-09-10 6:06:42 AM  

Entity79: That, and I nobody I know has been called by a pollster...


Exactly. I have never and probably never will be called for a poll and neither has anyone I know. People get too worked up over nothing.
 
2008-09-10 6:09:31 AM  

Entity79: Bah. Polls don't mean shiat.


Especially the demographic data of a national poll, which already has an undecided + margin of error to contend with.

It's worth noticing, but not a sure indicator of anything.
 
2008-09-10 6:11:34 AM  
Most of the women I know now like Palin, based off how they feel about her. They never even bring up where she stands on issues.

My opinion of women as a whole just took a massive dive. We never should have given them the right to vote.
 
2008-09-10 6:15:19 AM  

Tat'dGreaser: Remove all Republicans: This is why Obama is countering with Hillary Clinton, Kathleen Sebelius, and others to attack her. He is not some sexist like McCain who only sees race and gender.

So by sending his biatches after those biatches, it is alright?


He didn't pick a candidate because of her gender. He's only attacking a candidate that was picked because of their gender. The fact that he's using people of a particular gender to do is only incidental. It's what he needs to do to counter the people who only think in terms of gender.

organizm: Dear America,

I'm officially giving up all hope for you.

Love,

Me


Don't do that. You have to work and fight twice as hard to get your beliefs out there. Otherwise, you are leaving this country to the nitwits who have been managing this for the last eight years. Nobody deserves that.
 
2008-09-10 6:15:37 AM  

fortean chicken: My opinion of women as a whole just took a massive dive. We never should have given them the right to vote.


Have women not suffraged enough? We must end woman's suffrage now!
 
2008-09-10 6:17:03 AM  

Remove all Republicans: He didn't pick a candidate because of her gender. He's only attacking a candidate that was picked because of their gender. The fact that he's using people of a particular gender to do is only incidental. It's what he needs to do to counter the people who only think in terms of gender.


So he doesn't see race or gender but is attacking someone based on their gender? Gender.

/Gender
 
2008-09-10 6:17:22 AM  
Don't like the poll figures you're getting? Just modify the polling pool.

/Also referred to as "poll smoking" by TDS
 
2008-09-10 6:19:32 AM  
wow, maybe womens brains are in their farking tits.

if McCain wins, I will spend the next 4 years randomly smacking women in the street.
 
2008-09-10 6:19:40 AM  
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2008-09-10 6:19:40 AM  
 
2008-09-10 6:21:52 AM  

fortean chicken: Most of the women I know now like Palin, based off how they feel about her. They never even bring up where she stands on issues.

My opinion of women as a whole just took a massive dive. We never should have given them the right to vote.


Hey, these idiots don't speak for the rest of us women. We know a pandering ploy when we see one. Many of us are insulted by Palin. Even more so since she doesn't seem to want to face the cameras unless she has full control.

She is Cheney in a skirt.
 
2008-09-10 6:21:59 AM  

lexshine: wow, maybe womens brains are in their farking tits.

if McCain wins, I will spend the next 4 years randomly smacking women in the street.


Don't let the election stop you. They were probably asking for it anyways, I think my food got cold.
 
2008-09-10 6:22:38 AM  
And women say men think only with their sexual organ...
 
2008-09-10 6:23:25 AM  
The polls may not be accurate but polls definitely affect how people view candidates- that's what scares me.

I have a bad feeling in the pit of my stomach about this election.
 
2008-09-10 6:25:38 AM  
[image from img1.picturewizard.com too old to be available]
 
2008-09-10 6:25:39 AM  

mekki: She is Cheney in a skirt.


More like Bush in a skirt...Cheney isn't that stupid.
 
2008-09-10 6:26:38 AM  
i232.photobucket.comView Full Size


/Have a nice day
 
2008-09-10 6:28:57 AM  
Polls don't mean crap. In all my 30 years of voting I've never been called either.

Palin is joke. A puppet being told what to do and btw-that speech she gave at the convention? Written by a Bush speech writer for a male and then edited to fit a female. Don't be fooled- she's all looks and no brains. A step away from the presidency? God I hope not. WAKE UP AMERICA!!

"...A pretty face don't mean a pretty heart... Robert Palmer"
 
2008-09-10 6:30:28 AM  

coco ebert: The polls may not be accurate but polls definitely affect how people view candidates- that's what scares me.


Polls don't affect people's view of a candidate. It's not like anyone is reading a "McCain ahead by 10 points according to Gallup" headline & then suddenly say "Well, I should change my vote, then". It may spur them to look at the issues again, but a poll result in and of itself isn't going to change someone's mind.
 
2008-09-10 6:30:46 AM  
I'm currently watching Blazing Saddles, so I'm getting a kick, etc...

Also, I'm growing increasingly worried that the majority of the American voting public may actually as stupid as I've always thought.

On the other hand, I've talked to a few of my friends who are Republican, and they are voting Obama. They find Sarah Palin extremely underqualified and they find her nomination insulting, as women. Same with former Clintonite friends of mine. Those are the two groups that are supposedly railing around Palin, right?

I guess I just don't hang out with total morons.


/woman who questions our suffrage sometimes :-/
//why the hell do people vote on emotion? farking stupid
///i think about politics wayyyyy too much
 
2008-09-10 6:32:42 AM  
Sigh, time to post it again. How women really feel: Link (new window)
 
2008-09-10 6:35:33 AM  

sunshine_mcbihface: Also, I'm growing increasingly worried that the majority of the American voting public may actually as stupid as I've always thought.


I hate to tell ya that it has been that way for awhile, old people usually decide who wins.

On the other hand, I've talked to a few of my friends who are Republican, and they are voting Obama. They find Sarah Palin extremely underqualified and they find her nomination insulting, as women. Same with former Clintonite friends of mine. Those are the two groups that are supposedly railing around Palin, right?

I guess I just don't hang out with total morons.


What people need to understand is how incredibly stupid the majority of Americans are. Go walk outside if you don't believe me, I'll wait. McCain made the perfect move with choosing Palin, it has nothing to do with her qualifications. The media will attack her and middle America will say, "hey, that chick be like me. they make fun of me". Vote 3rd party if you care about America, send a message to these idiots on both side that we aren't going to take their shiat anymore.

/Bills suck :)
 
2008-09-10 6:37:08 AM  

Tat'dGreaser: Vote 3rd party if you care about America want to waste your vote.

 
2008-09-10 6:37:38 AM  

An tSaoi: Tat'dGreaser: Vote 3rd party if you care about America want to waste your vote.


Awww you think your vote actually counts, thats so adorable :)
 
2008-09-10 6:38:43 AM  

FunkOut: My mother's American and I recently discovered she likes Palin based on the premise that 1) Palin is supposed to be a downhome country girl and 2) Palin's a mommy. Up until now I thought my mother was fairly left-wing. I tried to tell her a few of the things Palin stood for and my mom thinks they're all just smear attacks. And apparently Obama is bad because he's "coming out of big city Chicago". I had no idea cities were evil and being in the country made people good. Or that being a mother made someone saintly.


My mom didn't want to vote for Obama in the primary because Oprah liked him, and Oprah hates white people because of something she once said to one of the women from Desperate Housewives on her show. BEAT THAT.

/thankfully, she voted for him when I told her Hillary voted for Iraq and Obama opposed it
 
2008-09-10 6:39:11 AM  

Opiate of the Lasses: Sigh, no matter what happens, you always end up with the President you deserve.

I thought nothing could top 2000 until 2004. I thought nothing could top 2004 but my Are-you-farking-kidding-me?! Meter is busted from this campaign, and there's still 55 days to go.


[image from libbydefensefund.com too old to be available]
 
2008-09-10 6:39:18 AM  

fortean chicken: Most of the women I know now like Palin, based off how they feel about her. They never even bring up where she stands on issues.

My opinion of women as a whole just took a massive dive. We never should have given them the right to vote.


Here in SE PA Palin isn't resonating well with women voters at all.

Sitting at the doctor's office last night (not the ob/gyn either), I spoke with two other women who were waiting.

Both stated they were Republicans who've voted that way their entire lives and now they're voting for Obama.

Not just because of Palin mind you (whom both of them thought was a whacko) but because their faith in the GOP is gone.
 
2008-09-10 6:42:40 AM  
In 20 years of voting I've been called exactly ONCE by a pollster and that was for a gubernatorial election in 1989. I didn't know a thing about either candidate at the time & told the pollster that. But she kept asking questions and I answered pretty much non-committally throughout. Sad to think that my completely uninformed responses were part of the overall result.
 
2008-09-10 6:43:43 AM  

Remove all Republicans: He didn't pick a candidate because of her gender. He's only attacking a candidate that was picked because of their gender. The fact that he's using people of a particular gender to do is only incidental. It's what he needs to do to counter the people who only think in terms of gender.


Agree - unfortunatly, we're probably going to end up up against the wall, like I always see in the retail sector - a black person screaming at another black person that person A is being mistreated because they are black, failing to notice that person B that is supposedly mistreating them because they are black is actually black, themselves. So, I think we're going to end up with a bunch of people saying that Hillary is picking on Palin because Palin is a woman.

No, Hillary is picking on Palin because Palin has no business whatsoever being picked for a VP candidacy. IMHO, Hillary doesn't either, but that's neither here nor there, since she's not a VP or P candidate.
 
2008-09-10 6:45:25 AM  
FunkOut: Big Moustache Mouth

Anyone with a moustache is automatically competent.

flashyourstache.files.wordpress.comView Full Size
 
2008-09-10 6:46:22 AM  
i38.tinypic.comView Full Size
 
2008-09-10 6:47:16 AM  

sunshine_mcbihface: On the other hand, I've talked to a few of my friends who are Republican, and they are voting Obama. They find Sarah Palin extremely underqualified and they find her nomination insulting, as women. Same with former Clintonite friends of mine. Those are the two groups that are supposedly railing around Palin, right?


Where I work, the department I'm in, i'm one of two males out of 16 employees. All 14 of the women are planning to vote for Palin. They don't trust the negro. Welcome to 2008. The guy that I work with is voting for Palin, too, because he believes that Obama is actually the anti-Christ.

I don't allow them to bring up politics at work, since they are all brainless.
 
2008-09-10 6:48:20 AM  

mekki: fortean chicken: Most of the women I know now like Palin, based off how they feel about her. They never even bring up where she stands on issues.

My opinion of women as a whole just took a massive dive. We never should have given them the right to vote.

Hey, these idiots don't speak for the rest of us women. We know a pandering ploy when we see one. Many of us are insulted by Palin. Even more so since she doesn't seem to want to face the cameras unless she has full control.

She is Cheney in a skirt.


Yeah, when I see Palin I want to KHITBASH. Then again, I'm a Canadian with anarchist leanings and a cupboard full of soybeans. I can't really expect to have any other reaction to people like Palin. As a mother, I find it appalling that she named her Down's baby "Trig". That's the kind of name you give a Jack Russell Terrier.

I blame chick flicks and Disney films. Enough with this "just follow your heart and drop your brain in the trashcan" business. Why is critical thinking so undervalued? Enough with the warm fuzzies, just look at the facts.
 
2008-09-10 6:49:11 AM  

sunshine_mcbihface: Also, I'm growing increasingly worried that the majority of the American voting public may actually as stupid as I've always thought.


Here's an example of stupidity for you: I have an Obama sticker on my car, next to an X-Men logo sticker that's been there for 3 years. Yesterday outside a Starbucks, a construction worker came up to me as I was getting in my car & called me a "Muslim-lover". I asked him what he meant and he said I must be a Muslim lover because I had an Obama sticker & a Malcolm X sticker (pointing to my X-Men logo). I was speechless.
 
2008-09-10 6:51:03 AM  

brigid_fitch: Here's an example of stupidity for you: I have an Obama sticker on my car, next to an X-Men logo sticker that's been there for 3 years. Yesterday outside a Starbucks, a construction worker came up to me as I was getting in my car & called me a "Muslim-lover". I asked him what he meant and he said I must be a Muslim lover because I had an Obama sticker & a Malcolm X sticker (pointing to my X-Men logo). I was speechless.


BWHAHAHAHAAHA!!!!!! Holy crap that is funny.

We didn't land on Plymouth rock. Plymouth rock landed on the Xavier School for the Gifted!
 
2008-09-10 6:51:24 AM  

fortean chicken: Most of the women I know now like Palin, based off how they feel about her. They never even bring up where she stands on issues.

My opinion of women as a whole just took a massive dive. We never should have given them the right to vote.


I am with you on that. The Republicans played this election perfectly. Women never make important decisions with their brain. The republicans knew they could put the wackiest person on this ticket, and as long as she was a woman, other women would throw her a sympathy vote. They knew issues would be irrelevant. I knew once a woman was selected as a candidate, it was over. I, for one, never had faith that women in general would be able to see through this B.S. Women still need to prove they are an equal sex in my mind

/Yes I am a liberal sexist
//Dont care what anybody thinks
 
2008-09-10 6:51:39 AM  
Typical white women. Dont they know once you go black, you never go back.
 
2008-09-10 6:53:13 AM  

brigid_fitch: sunshine_mcbihface: Also, I'm growing increasingly worried that the majority of the American voting public may actually as stupid as I've always thought.

Here's an example of stupidity for you: I have an Obama sticker on my car, next to an X-Men logo sticker that's been there for 3 years. Yesterday outside a Starbucks, a construction worker came up to me as I was getting in my car & called me a "Muslim-lover". I asked him what he meant and he said I must be a Muslim lover because I had an Obama sticker & a Malcolm X sticker (pointing to my X-Men logo). I was speechless.


MUTANT RIGHTS!
 
2008-09-10 6:53:26 AM  
I keep hoping the spirit moves her during the debate and she starts speaking in tongues and prophesying. that would be awesome
 
2008-09-10 6:54:47 AM  

organizm: Dear America,

I'm officially giving up all hope for you.


Love,

Me


I'm applying for a job in Asia this fall. If Obama wins, I can proudly hold my head up and represent my country with pride again. If he loses, I'll be gone at least four years, hiding my head in shame, making constant referrals to "President Obama" and earning a lot more money than I do now.
 
2008-09-10 6:56:07 AM  

Tat'dGreaser: brigid_fitch: Here's an example of stupidity for you: I have an Obama sticker on my car, next to an X-Men logo sticker that's been there for 3 years. Yesterday outside a Starbucks, a construction worker came up to me as I was getting in my car & called me a "Muslim-lover". I asked him what he meant and he said I must be a Muslim lover because I had an Obama sticker & a Malcolm X sticker (pointing to my X-Men logo). I was speechless.

You have an "X-Men" sticker on your car? When do you get out of elementary school?

 
2008-09-10 6:58:37 AM  

fortean chicken: Most of the women I know now like Palin, based off how they feel about her. They never even bring up where she stands on issues.

My opinion of women as a whole just took a massive dive. We never should have given them the right to vote.


DING DING DING...we have a winner. Step up and collect your prize.

Now you know why the GOP could never understand why women loved that lecherous Bill Clinton. It was because he made women (soccer moms) FEEL good. Barf.

Repeal the 19th Amendment!!
 
2008-09-10 6:59:29 AM  

ljf02f: organizm: Dear America,

I'm officially giving up all hope for you.


Love,

Me

I'm applying for a job in Asia this fall. If Obama wins, I can proudly hold my head up and represent my country with pride again. If he loses, I'll be gone at least four years, hiding my head in shame, making constant referrals to "President Obama" and earning a lot more money than I do now.


Good luck getting that job! Being an expat is pretty cool!
 
2008-09-10 7:02:11 AM  

DubyaHater:
/Yes I am a liberal sexist
//Dont care what anybody thinks


Oh, but you do care, otherwise you wouldn't have put that in. Now stop caring already, you big macho man. I suggest going to a voodoo energy healer and have then reverse the polarity on your heart chakra by crossing the streams on the phase modulator lemurian crystals or something. Whatever it is you liberals do.
 
2008-09-10 7:02:43 AM  
vote vagina 2008
 
2008-09-10 7:03:03 AM  
Hell hath no fury like a woman spurned.
 
2008-09-10 7:03:20 AM  

ekdikeo4: Where I work, the department I'm in, i'm one of two males out of 16 employees. All 14 of the women are planning to vote for Palin. They don't trust the negro. Welcome to 2008. The guy that I work with is voting for Palin, too, because he believes that Obama is actually the anti-Christ.


I work with about four men and five women. We're all educators and I know that at least eight of the nine support Obama enthusiastically. We are young and old, white and asian and latina.

Then again, it's a university setting so we're all elitist.
 
2008-09-10 7:05:22 AM  

The Scutt-Farkas Affair: You have an "X-Men" sticker on your car? When do you get out of elementary school?


As soon as my transfer to the Xavier School for Gifted Youngsters comes through.

/I make no secret of my geekiness.
//Some people paint their faces at sports games, I have a drawer-ful of Harry Potter t-shirts.
 
2008-09-10 7:05:48 AM  
So a woman can have kids, a successful career, and be elected to high government office. Yeahhhhhhh! Everyone should be happy about this.
 
2008-09-10 7:05:58 AM  

ljf02f: We are young and old, white and asian and latina


We are young, old, white, asian, and latino as well aa latina.

Fixed that.

The black teacher changed schools a couple years ago.
 
2008-09-10 7:06:44 AM  
Fark trying to spell correctly this early.
 
2008-09-10 7:07:54 AM  
I love how the McCain campaign is so concerned about how the media is treating her and yet no one made a peep about Fox News running with the "Obama went to a madrassa and is a secret Muslim" smear.

What if Obama had used his color to ward off criticism like McCain did with his POW or Palin has with her sexist comments?

Obama has had his faith,his patriotism,his country of birth,his views on race and everything else called into question by the media.
And we can't ask questions about the way this woman raised her family or her governing practices? Claiming executive privilege while campaigning is a sign of things to come people.
If the media is so against her then why haven't they shown her underage daughter drinking and partying with her babydaddy?
This is totally a Rovian scheme to discredit the media so that anything they say about her legitimately, will be disregarded as a partisan smear attempt.
I wouldn't put it past him to be the source of a lot of the red herrings that were floated out starting day one.
 
2008-09-10 7:08:30 AM  

sckonkh: Typical white women. Dont they know once you go black, you never go back.


My own experiences support this theory.
 
2008-09-10 7:11:10 AM  

ljf02f: I work with about four men and five women. We're all educators and I know that at least eight of the nine support Obama enthusiastically. We are young and old, white and asian and latina.

Then again, it's a university setting so we're all elitist.


I fear there are a lot more people like I described that I work with, than there are that you described, that you work with. And that scares the piss out of me.
 
2008-09-10 7:12:42 AM  

Hobodeluxe: If the media is so against her then why haven't they shown her underage daughter drinking and partying with her babydaddy?


You still think those pictures were of Palin kids?
 
2008-09-10 7:14:35 AM  

The Scutt-Farkas Affair: ljf02f: organizm: Dear America,

I'm officially giving up all hope for you.


Love,

Me

I'm applying for a job in Asia this fall. If Obama wins, I can proudly hold my head up and represent my country with pride again. If he loses, I'll be gone at least four years, hiding my head in shame, making constant referrals to "President Obama" and earning a lot more money than I do now.

Good luck getting that job! Being an expat is pretty cool!


Hell yes. I worked in Japan for two years in the late 90s. I traveled to many other countries and enjoyed a lot of ribbing about the US from folks abroad.

It was only two years ago while in Seychelles (off the coast of Africa) that I was walking down a street and someone yelled "fark YOU BUSH AMERICAN!" That hadn't happened in the twelve other countries I'd visited in the 80s and 90s.

Sarah Palin got her first passport last year and has never really stepped off US soil. Can't wait to see her performance IF she ever has to answer questions about foreign policy. She's never even been a farkin' tourist abroad!!!! wtf does that dog know?????????????????????????????????????????
 
2008-09-10 7:15:34 AM  

aw c'mon: Palin is joke. A puppet being told what to do and btw-that speech she gave at the convention? Written by a Bush speech writer for a male and then edited to fit a female. Don't be fooled- she's all looks and no brains. A step away from the presidency? God I hope not. WAKE UP AMERICA!!


Palin kinda reminds me of that Simpson's episode where Marge finds the Channel suit in a cheap store. She meets an upper class school friend who asks her to the country club becuase she is wearing this classy suit. Marge, lacking any true class beyond the suit then wore it to everything she went to, even to the point of chopping it up to make it look different.

Palin struck a chord with her performance at the RNC, but she lacks any depth beyond that. Now she is going around giving speeches that are nothing but chopped up versions of the her same old RNC speech.
 
2008-09-10 7:18:27 AM  
Entity79: and I nobody I know has been called by a pollster...

You do now: me.

I wish the damned pollsters would QUIT calling me. I get 'em almost every week: CBS News, USA Today, Pew Research, etc. My wife won't take 'em, but I will if they're not too long (forget about the 20-minute ones--I ask first).

An interesting one the other week was trying to figure out my political and charity leanings, and then wanted to know if I went to marches, protests, rallies and wrote letters to my friends urging them to my political feelings. I assure you I will never, ever attend a protest or a march. And there are tens of millions more like me in the middle who don't make so much noise. And I've never not voted in an election.
 
2008-09-10 7:22:51 AM  

betona: Entity79: and I nobody I know has been called by a pollster...

You do now: me.

I wish the damned pollsters would QUIT calling me. I get 'em almost every week: CBS News, USA Today, Pew Research, etc. My wife won't take 'em, but I will if they're not too long (forget about the 20-minute ones--I ask first).

An interesting one the other week was trying to figure out my political and charity leanings, and then wanted to know if I went to marches, protests, rallies and wrote letters to my friends urging them to my political feelings. I assure you I will never, ever attend a protest or a march. And there are tens of millions more like me in the middle who don't make so much noise. And I've never not voted in an election.


Do you have any idea why you keep getting called and others don't?
 
2008-09-10 7:22:56 AM  

Tat'dGreaser: Remove all Republicans: He didn't pick a candidate because of her gender. He's only attacking a candidate that was picked because of their gender. The fact that he's using people of a particular gender to do is only incidental. It's what he needs to do to counter the people who only think in terms of gender.

So he doesn't see race or gender but is attacking someone based on their gender? Gender.

/Gender


No, he is attacking someone based on their stance on the issues and based on their qualifications.

He is using female democrats to do this because (A) doing it himself will only further alienate the white women voters who left him and (B) he is most likely trying to avoid getting smeared with the "sexism" brush by his opponents. It's difficult to label Palin's attackers as sexist if her attackers are also female.

He does see gender here. It's been brought up by everyone ad nauseum, and he is responding the only way he can.
 
2008-09-10 7:23:16 AM  
Every woman I work with (27 women) is voting Palin/McCain. Say what you want about her, but she has a lot of people fired up.

And every smear and condescending smirk about her religion and her family is just garnering her more votes.
So, by all means, keep up the smears - you are all doing a great job for McCain.
 
2008-09-10 7:27:22 AM  
Every woman I work with (27 women) is voting Palin/McCain.

And every single one deserves the womens right leader than Palin is when they elect her.
 
2008-09-10 7:32:02 AM  
i248.photobucket.comView Full Size
 
2008-09-10 7:33:45 AM  
The Obama campaign needs to throw their media manipulation tactics right back at them.

After McCain canceling his Larry King appearance just because a reporter asked about Palin's experience as CiC of the Alaska National Guard, complained repeatedly about the media's "sexist" treatment of her, and tried to claim Obama denigrated her with his "lipstick on a pig" reference, all the Obama surrogates need to do is repeat one thing:

"They're using feminist rhetoric to support chauvinist action!"

And it'll work because it rings true. They've taken the complaining too far. This exploitation incenses feminist newswomen/journalists, and they will react. Additionally, the backlash among their female colleagues gives the media men license to actually ask the tough questions, when appropriate.

Like Charlie Gibson.

And it'll work with women in the general public, too.

Meh, just something my brother mentioned to me last night when watching the news. I thought it was smart.
 
2008-09-10 7:35:56 AM  

brigid_fitch: The Scutt-Farkas Affair: You have an "X-Men" sticker on your car? When do you get out of elementary school?

As soon as my transfer to the Xavier School for Gifted Youngsters comes through.

/I make no secret of my geekiness.
//Some people paint their faces at sports games, I have a drawer-ful of Harry Potter t-shirts.


That made me chuckle! Have a nice day!
 
2008-09-10 7:36:06 AM  
Seriously, this "go soft on the girl or be labeled sexist!" crap could backfire on McCain badly if the Obama campaign played their cards right.
 
2008-09-10 7:36:31 AM  
On one hand, the woman I work with is voting for McCain. Palin didn't make a difference to her.

On the other hand, my wife is insulted by the choice of Palin as McCain's VP candidate. She says it's pandering. She was concerned with Obama's lack of experience before and was really conflicted about who to vote for, but now she says the Palin pick pushed her over to Obama.

Personally, I'd just like to have a candidate that didn't pander to religious nutjobs that I could vote for.
 
2008-09-10 7:36:42 AM  
Xerxes99:

faithmouse.comView Full Size
 
2008-09-10 7:37:27 AM  
Palin is the ultimate smoke-and-mirrors Republican trick. She's a "shiny thing" designed to make people forget about what they have done to the country for the past eight years and vote for them. Unfortunately, there are enough dummies in America that it might possibly work.

Sarah Palin is the Shania Twain of politics. All flash and style, no substance. If she looked like Janet Reno, we wouldn't be talking about her now.
 
2008-09-10 7:38:39 AM  

Remove all Republicans: This is why Obama is countering with Hillary Clinton, Kathleen Sebelius, and others to attack her. He is not some sexist like McCain who only sees race and gender.

The Democrats just have to be careful when the Republicans start using Palin and the "scary black man" bit to get more idiots on their team.


So he isn't a sexist because he is too afraid to say in public what he thinks? I'm confused here. Not that you ever really make sense.
 
2008-09-10 7:40:04 AM  

fortean chicken: Most of the women I know now like Palin, based off how they feel about her. They never even bring up where she stands on issues.

My opinion of women as a whole just took a massive dive. We never should have given them the right to vote.


The only reason Clinton won the first time is because countless women thought he was cuter than Bush Sr.
 
2008-09-10 7:40:08 AM  

zappaisfrank:

Sarah Palin is the Shania Twain of politics. All flash and style, no substance. If she looked like Janet Reno, we wouldn't be talking about her now.


To be fair, Janet Reno's action figure was scary as hell:

midlandmemorabilia.co.ukView Full Size
 
2008-09-10 7:40:11 AM  
ljf02f: I'm applying for a job in Asia this fall. If Obama wins, I can proudly hold my head up and represent my country with pride again. If he loses, I'll be gone at least four years, hiding my head in shame, making constant referrals to "President Obama" and earning a lot more money than I do now.

Tell ya what. Regardless of who wins, why don't you just renounce your citizenship and be done with it?
 
2008-09-10 7:40:36 AM  

jenlen: Every woman I work with (27 women) is voting Palin/McCain. Say what you want about her, but she has a lot of people fired up.

And every smear and condescending smirk about her religion and her family is just garnering her more votes.
So, by all means, keep up the smears - you are all doing a great job for McCain.


I really wonder about that. Firstly, all people know about Palin is what we have seen in a few speeches. Eventually she will have to do some interviews and a debate. She may do well, or she may bomb.

Secondly, people in general are not really smearing her, at least no more than any other politician. The whole smear issue is being generated to distract people from the real issue that she has no substance. As I have said before, and differences are due more to the abnormal way in which she has been introduced to the public and not due to her gender.

Perhaps the ammount of effort that is being put into distracting people is indicative of just how poorly she will perform in front of the media.
 
2008-09-10 7:43:52 AM  

Hobodeluxe: I love how the McCain campaign is so concerned about how the media is treating her and yet no one made a peep about Fox News running with the "Obama went to a madrassa and is a secret Muslim" smear.

What if Obama had used his color to ward off criticism like McCain did with his POW or Palin has with her sexist comments?

Obama has had his faith,his patriotism,his country of birth,his views on race and everything else called into question by the media.
And we can't ask questions about the way this woman raised her family or her governing practices? Claiming executive privilege while campaigning is a sign of things to come people.
If the media is so against her then why haven't they shown her underage daughter drinking and partying with her babydaddy?
This is totally a Rovian scheme to discredit the media so that anything they say about her legitimately, will be disregarded as a partisan smear attempt.
I wouldn't put it past him to be the source of a lot of the red herrings that were floated out starting day one.


The media is deciding the outcome of this election.
 
2008-09-10 7:44:56 AM  

NeverDrunk23: The media is deciding the outcome of this election.


Among undecideds, pretty much. They're only about 10-15% of the electorate, but still...
 
2008-09-10 7:51:38 AM  
I lol'd. Nice job subby.
 
2008-09-10 7:53:32 AM  
I am a total Obama supporter and these polls got me totally concerned.

Even though the election is 55 days away, that the people have spoken ... through pollsters, who weight the results.
 
2008-09-10 7:53:39 AM  
SHame on you mods, shame. I submitted a nearly identical submission. And mine was spelld correctly as it took slang into consideration!

95% of blacks vote for Obama, cool
A 10-20% increase in women voting for McCain Palin (although there is the ideological factor), that is idiotic?

So one Archie Bunkeresque voting block is fine, but another is wrong?
 
2008-09-10 7:54:08 AM  
I'm still not all that worried about Obama's chances in November because I think the debates will change everything. All the fact checking and debunking of McCain's bullshiat that goes under the radar can be brought out front and center by Obama in a venue that the press will have to cover in detail, and he seems ready to do this. Since the convention he's definitely taken a much sharper approach to addressing McCain in his stump speeches, but you don't hear much about that right now. I think a lot of casual observers are going to be very surprised by what they see when the debates come around, and the media is going to have to address the ways McCain has lied and flip flopped.

Also, I think the structure of the debates really benefits Obama. The first debate on Sept. 26th is about foreign policy, and I'm sure people will see it as his weakest because a disappointingly large percentage of the country thinks you're an effete liberal pussy if you don't want to bomb every country that looks at us funny. The third debate on Oct 15th, the last head to head meeting of these two just a few short weeks before election day, is all about domestic policies and the economy. This strongly favors Obama by most accounts and will give him an opportunity to better frame McCain's idea of "change" as continuing almost all of the same domestic policies of the last 8 years. It'll be a good final impression for him before the voting begins.

/possibly being too optimistic about the media doing its farking job
//still think he'll win handily
 
2008-09-10 7:55:34 AM  

Tat'dGreaser: brigid_fitch: Here's an example of stupidity for you: I have an Obama sticker on my car, next to an X-Men logo sticker that's been there for 3 years. Yesterday outside a Starbucks, a construction worker came up to me as I was getting in my car & called me a "Muslim-lover". I asked him what he meant and he said I must be a Muslim lover because I had an Obama sticker & a Malcolm X sticker (pointing to my X-Men logo). I was speechless.

BWHAHAHAHAAHA!!!!!! Holy crap that is funny.

We didn't land on Plymouth rock. Plymouth rock landed on the Xavier School for the Gifted!


I bet his union gives 90% to the dems.
 
2008-09-10 7:57:31 AM  

HappyDaddy: You still think those pictures were of Palin kids?


Of Bristol yeah. Her hair was lightened,heavier makeup and she was thinner but it's her. the high forehead,pronounced canine teeth,short stubby chin and eyes give it away. Her cheeks are much fatter now (as is most everything else) and her hair color is natural now, not blonde. but it's her and Levi. Although he has a different haircut now.
That's not Levi with the weed in that pic though it's another of their friends.

i208.photobucket.comView Full Size


stupidcelebrities.netView Full Size


stupidcelebrities.netView Full Size


stupidcelebrities.netView Full Size


stupidcelebrities.netView Full Size


images.huffingtonpost.comView Full Size


i208.photobucket.comView Full Size


smh.com.auView Full Size
 
2008-09-10 7:57:45 AM  

FuriousGeorge945: I'm still not all that worried about Obama's chances in November because I think the debates will change everything. All the fact checking and debunking of McCain's bullshiat that goes under the radar can be brought out front and center by Obama in a venue that the press will have to cover in detail, and he seems ready to do this. Since the convention he's definitely taken a much sharper approach to addressing McCain in his stump speeches, but you don't hear much about that right now. I think a lot of casual observers are going to be very surprised by what they see when the debates come around, and the media is going to have to address the ways McCain has lied and flip flopped.

Also, I think the structure of the debates really benefits Obama. The first debate on Sept. 26th is about foreign policy, and I'm sure people will see it as his weakest because a disappointingly large percentage of the country thinks you're an effete liberal pussy if you don't want to bomb every country that looks at us funny. The third debate on Oct 15th, the last head to head meeting of these two just a few short weeks before election day, is all about domestic policies and the economy. This strongly favors Obama by most accounts and will give him an opportunity to better frame McCain's idea of "change" as continuing almost all of the same domestic policies of the last 8 years. It'll be a good final impression for him before the voting begins.

/possibly being too optimistic about the media doing its farking job
//still think he'll win handily


I know people shoul dnot underestimate Obama, but all I keep hearing is remove his teleprompter and he is dead in the water. W will see.
 
2008-09-10 7:59:15 AM  
It's twu, it's twu!!
 
2008-09-10 8:02:56 AM  

sunshine_mcbihface: On the other hand, I've talked to a few of my friends who are Republican, and they are voting Obama. They find Sarah Palin extremely underqualified and they find her nomination insulting, as women. Same with former Clintonite friends of mine. Those are the two groups that are supposedly railing around Palin, right?

I guess I just don't hang out with total morons.



No not morons, but you probably hang out with some ugly chicks who hate Palin because she is attractive. Feminism was invented to give ugly broads a chance.
 
2008-09-10 8:07:42 AM  

generaltimmy: I know people shoul dnot underestimate Obama, but all I keep hearing is remove his teleprompter and he is dead in the water. W will see.


Not really. Obama has done a lot of talking without teleprompters. Claims that he does not appear without a teleprompter are simply lies.

He gives thought out answers, which are generally sincere attempts to answer the question. What he doesn't do is give perfect talking point answers to the question that he wanted asked instead of the question that he wanted to be asked.

So sometimes he pauses, sometime he makes mistakes, and he doesn't sound rehearsed.
 
2008-09-10 8:12:14 AM  

generaltimmy: SHame on you mods, shame. I submitted a nearly identical submission. And mine was spelld correctly as it took slang into consideration!

95% of blacks vote for Obama, cool
A 10-20% increase in women voting for McCain Palin (although there is the ideological factor), that is idiotic?

So one Archie Bunkeresque voting block is fine, but another is wrong?


This shiat again?

First of all, Obama didn't start out with the black vote in the primaries. He partially earned it, but it was largely pissed away by the behavior of the Clintons in the early primaries. Second, 95% of blacks voting for a Democrat in the general election is not that much higher than the usual result in recent elections (Kerry got 88%).

Finally, and most importantly, blacks voting for Obama would be voting for their interests. Women voting for McCain because of Palin are voting against their interests. A majority of women favor abortion rights, and an even larger majority are opposed to the far-right belief that Palin holds that it should be illegal even in cases of rape and incest.

This is the equivalent of Hillary winning the primary and McCain putting Alan Keyes on the ticket in a cynical attempt at persuading disgruntled black voters to vote against their interests, except in this case it's actually sorta working.

generaltimmy: I know people shoul dnot underestimate Obama, but all I keep hearing is remove his teleprompter and he is dead in the water. W will see.


Not true at all, and I think Republicans gave up the right to ever make this accusation when they selected a VP that has refused to speak without a script for the last two weeks.
 
2008-09-10 8:12:39 AM  
palin is probably too busy rehearsing all week with charlie gibson to celebrate this. the poor dear.

so this proves the theory that pussy trumps party. big surprise. way to reinforce gender stereotypes there, ladies!
 
2008-09-10 8:16:13 AM  

FuriousGeorge945: First of all, Obama didn't start out with the black vote in the primaries. He partially earned it, but it was largely pissed away by the behavior of the Clintons in the early primaries. Second, 95% of blacks voting for a Democrat in the general election is not that much higher than the usual result in recent elections (Kerry got 88%).


At the start, Obama actually had a small portion of the black vote because he did not pander to them. He was seen as anti black.
 
2008-09-10 8:16:32 AM  

Hobodeluxe: That's not Levi with the weed in that pic though it's another of their friends.


Eh; given the brains level demonstrated by the social circle, I'd consider "weed = oregano" to be as likely as anything else.
 
2008-09-10 8:18:23 AM  
Maybe I just know smart women or something, but the ones I know are offended by the GOP's obvious gender pandering.
 
2008-09-10 8:24:34 AM  

FuriousGeorge945: I'm still not all that worried about Obama's chances in November because I think the debates will change everything.


I wish. Go back and watch the first Bush/Kerry debate. Bush managed to avoid humiliating himself in the second and third but in the first... Kerry slaughtered him. If you want to go check the archives, you'll see even a lot of the right-wing farkers agreed that he got whipped. The next morning, all the media reports on it made mention of how close it had been, and showed the few clips where Bush managed to barely hold his own as proof. By the time the second had rolled around, it was the established conventional wisdom that the first had been a draw.

I remember it well because it was the first moment where I fully realized how fully the media can so totally shape the way the public perceives the world. Their narrative of a close race was better for ratings, so it was essentially rammed down our throats.

The same thing is happening now. Whether you like or hate Obama, anyone whose seen him speak has to agree that he's an amazing orator, as his performance in the non-ABC debates during the primaries shows. Still though, how many people really watched those?

How many had their opinion given to them from the medias reports?

This farkwit, for one:
generaltimmy: I know people shoul dnot underestimate Obama, but all I keep hearing is remove his teleprompter and he is dead in the water. W will see.

Obama writes his own speeches, as can easily be seen by comparing what he's saying now to the books he's written - it's the same 'style'. He also gives a lot of his speeches without the aid of a teleprompter. And yet, I would wager most people would agree with generaltimmy 's uneducated belief, just because the media is interested in a close race instead of reporting the truth. Lies and slanders that'll bring in ratings get reported, while the boring truth is ignored.
 
2008-09-10 8:24:44 AM  

ekdikeo4:
Where I work, the department I'm in, i'm one of two males out of 16 employees. All 14 of the women are planning to vote for Palin. They don't trust the negro. Welcome to 2008. The guy that I work with is voting for Palin, too, because he believes that Obama is actually the anti-Christ.

I don't allow them to bring up politics at work, since they are all brainless.


They don't agree with you, therefore they must be stupid, right?

That's the kind of attitude, when spilled over onto a national scale, that loses elections.

Your job, if you want to see Obama in the Whitehouse come January*, is to convert those people, not just write them off. Granted, there are always those who can't be convinced. Don't worry about them. Don't denigrate them either. It makes you look petty and mean, and that works against you *AND* your candidate.

*Full disclosure: I don't want to see Obama win, due to his sitting on the board of the virulently anti-gun Joyce Foundation for years. That's my bias, but I don't think it effects the advice I just gave you, which is in the interest of keeping the campaign civil.
 
2008-09-10 8:25:28 AM  

Hobodeluxe: Of Bristol yeah.


No they aren't. They are pictures of Levi Johnston's sister. Link (new window)

I assume you'll go back and correct it in every thread you shiat them on.
 
2008-09-10 8:38:53 AM  
HappyDaddy :

Hobodeluxe: Of Bristol yeah.

No they aren't. They are pictures of Levi Johnston's sister. Link (new window)

I assume you'll go back and correct it in every thread you shiat them on.


Still kids will be kids, but when the beer pressure goes up woohoo! I don,t have anything against it, but the HYPOCRISY mentality. Van Palin is still not a quality leader.
Do as say, not as I failed.

Hobodeluxe:

Was that the pre myspace or post myspace?
 
2008-09-10 8:39:27 AM  
A shame Obama didn't pick a white woman as his running mate too. Watching the country get into a catfight woulda been fun. Or sad....I forget which.
 
2008-09-10 8:40:51 AM  
don,t

oops: don't
 
2008-09-10 8:45:32 AM  
Stupid house Fraus. Poll'n when they should be in the kitchen making me some got-damn bean pie!

[image from img2.putfile.com too old to be available]
 
2008-09-10 8:46:55 AM  

dittybopper: *Full disclosure: I don't want to see Obama win, due to his sitting on the board of the virulently anti-gun Joyce Foundation for years. That's my bias, but I don't think it effects the advice I just gave you, which is in the interest of keeping the campaign civil.


Hey, it worked for Kerry. Oh wait....
 
2008-09-10 8:47:16 AM  
Women in 2009: Hey, where are our abortion rights at?
 
2008-09-10 8:47:49 AM  

mrwknd: Still kids will be kids, but when the beer pressure goes up woohoo! I don,t have anything against it, but the HYPOCRISY mentality.


Sorry but what do the actions of some other kids have to do with the Palins? What is this hypocrisy of which you speak?
 
2008-09-10 8:48:49 AM  
generaltimmy: I know people shoul dnot underestimate Obama, but all I keep hearing is remove his teleprompter and he is dead in the water. W will see.

The debates could go either way. McCain v. Obama could easily be seen as Nixon v. Kennedy with the younger, more charismatic man looking better. However, the difference is that both men are regularly (nightly) seen on TV, so the comparison in physical appearance may not resonate.

One thing I have noticed when watching McCain and Obama debate, or even during interviews, Obama is very deliberate in his wording. It usually comes across as contemplative, but other times it comes across as parsing words (depends on what the definition of 'is' is)

On the other hand, McCain comes across as very certain and decisive. Many see this as inflexible, which it may very well be, but to many it comes across as self-assured and confident.

The debates are going to be key, and they are going to be a toss-up.
 
2008-09-10 8:51:14 AM  

whconner4: Stupid house Fraus. Poll'n when they should be in the kitchen making me some got-damn bean pie!


Mr Logo: dittybopper: *Full disclosure: I don't want to see Obama win, due to his sitting on the board of the virulently anti-gun Joyce Foundation for years. That's my bias, but I don't think it effects the advice I just gave you, which is in the interest of keeping the campaign civil.

Hey, it worked for Kerry. Oh wait....


I know you're being snarky for fun, but I stand by my advice.
 
2008-09-10 8:51:43 AM  
I haven't read the entire thread--but I would like to make a couple of statements.

1) I have been called and participated in polls. On more than one occasion--though not within the last month.

2) I am white, female, registered "Unaffiliated",48, and voting for Obama.

3) I grew up in Ohio, have in-laws in KY and WVA...and prejudice WILL play a role in this election. A major role.

I'll be shocked if Obama takes OH, WV, or KY. Any one of them. If he takes even ONE of those three I'll be delighted. If he takes more than one...I'll dance for joy. Not because I think he's "The One". Not because I think he can fix every problem in the nation...but because it means people looked past their prejudices when they voted.
 
2008-09-10 8:51:57 AM  
generaltimmy: 95% of blacks vote for Obama, cool
A 10-20% increase in women voting for McCain Palin (although there is the ideological factor), that is idiotic?


That's not idiotic. dancininanson.net
 
2008-09-10 8:52:15 AM  
Man, I gots the stupids today. Ignore the whconner4 quote in my previous post.
 
2008-09-10 8:54:10 AM  
Should have added...

I was a Housewife (Or Stay At Home Mother) full-time until my kids were in Middle school...and then I started working part-time while they were at school. Took every summer off.

Perhaps I should make a bumper sticker--

"White House Frau for Obama"
 
2008-09-10 8:54:49 AM  
Oh balls, I hope people pick this up...I just saw the clip of it on Morning Joe (McCain saying it), and I hope it gets shown more.

What a piece of dog shiat, McCain is.

McCain Calls Hillary a Pig (new window)
 
2008-09-10 8:57:04 AM  
dittybopper: Your job, if you want to see Obama in the Whitehouse come January*, is to convert those people, not just write them off. Granted, there are always those who can't be convinced. Don't worry about them. Don't denigrate them either. It makes you look petty and mean, and that works against you *AND* your candidate.

Screw that. Why should the democrats always have to take the high road? Why do you hold them to a standard that you don't hold the republicans to?

The entire Republican convention was nothing but a shockingly mean-spirited Obama-hatefest, while the word "liberal" is used as an epithet by pretty much every right winger in existence, yet the media has been filled with republicans whining about how cruel everyone is being to poor widdle Sarah Palin, what with demanding to interview her and all. The republicans manage to paint themselves as victims while savaging their opponents because they flood the media with their own narrative. It's the whole "talking points" thing you always see Fark liberals whining about, and it's been going on for years.

The Democrats aren't going to win this by playing nice. To win you need to "catapault the propaganda" as Bush put it; to make sure it's your version of events that's being reported, that it's your narrative the public are hearing. The Republicans are great at this, and that's why they've got a shot at winning this election after farking up everything they've done since 2000.
 
2008-09-10 8:57:54 AM  

Dancin_In_Anson: generaltimmy: 95% of blacks vote for Obama, cool
A 10-20% increase in women voting for McCain Palin (although there is the ideological factor), that is idiotic?

That's not idiotic.


95% of blacks would vote for O.J.
That's racist!
 
2008-09-10 8:58:19 AM  
did Obama say that sarah palin is ugly like a pig and that she tries to cover it up with lipstick? Because that's how it is being protrayed by the media.
 
2008-09-10 8:58:51 AM  
Okay. I know this is probably horrible of me, but whatever, I'm a terrible person. If McCain wins, I hope this country goes down the shiatter, and we split into separate countries. Except Buffalo...that gets absorbed by Ontario. :-)
 
2008-09-10 9:01:25 AM  
Women... come on!

You fought to have equal voting rights to then just start voting with a vagina hivemind.
 
2008-09-10 9:01:34 AM  
Dancin_In_Anson
generaltimmy: 95% of blacks vote for Obama, cool
A 10-20% increase in women voting for McCain Palin (although there is the ideological factor), that is idiotic?

That's not idiotic.


Isn't the increase of black people, a generally dem voting block, for Obama over those who supported kerry only a 6 percent increase, therefore making this comparison complete and utter horse-shiat?
 
2008-09-10 9:03:01 AM  
The lipstick remark in Palin's speech was inserted to elicit this precise response from the Democrats - the "put a pig in lipstick" joke was obvious, as was the media's response.

Since Palin got nominated, the Obama and crew have stepped on every landmine. This is just the latest.

You can question the right all you want, but they have completely taken over the momentum of this election, and nominating Palin was a masterstroke.

Our only hope now is the debate(s)
 
2008-09-10 9:04:47 AM  

Obviously: Dancin_In_Anson: generaltimmy: 95% of blacks vote for Obama, cool
A 10-20% increase in women voting for McCain Palin (although there is the ideological factor), that is idiotic?

That's not idiotic.

95% of blacks would vote for O.J.
That's racist!


Governor Lynn Swann unavailable for comment.

/Oh wait, he didn't win that election.
//But I keep reading that being black is the only factor in determining elections?
 
2008-09-10 9:05:10 AM  

sunshine_mcbihface: Oh balls, I hope people pick this up...I just saw the clip of it on Morning Joe (McCain saying it), and I hope it gets shown more.


Fox News is showing McCain's "political ad in response to the lipstick comment" every ten minutes. During their shows. For objective review purposes only of course.

They'll never show McCain saying the same thing.
 
2008-09-10 9:06:12 AM  
HappyDaddy :

mrwknd: Still kids will be kids, but when the beer pressure goes up woohoo! I don,t have anything against it, but the HYPOCRISY mentality.

Sorry but what do the actions of some other kids have to do with the Palins? What is this hypocrisy of which you speak?


Umm..Her boy friend, Jenna Bush,... a large portion of American youth. People talking how it needs to stop but can't stop it in their own family.
I'm just making a point; Don't do it, It's bad/wrong/evil,Not in my house, whatever. It happens, but if one claims abstinence only and can't control the ongoing family issues/values in their own home, HIPOCRISY.
 
2008-09-10 9:06:17 AM  

generaltimmy: SHame on you mods, shame. I submitted a nearly identical submission. And mine was spelld correctly as it took slang into consideration!

95% of blacks vote for Obama, cool
A 10-20% increase in women voting for McCain Palin (although there is the ideological factor), that is idiotic?

So one Archie Bunkeresque voting block is fine, but another is wrong?


2004: 88% of African Americans vote Kerry (D)

2000: 90% of African Americans vote Gore (D)

2008: 90% of blacks poll for Obama (D)? THAT'S RACIST! African Americans make up 10% of voters. White women make up 40%.
 
2008-09-10 9:06:25 AM  
Jesus farking christ, they're showing ANOTHER McCain ad during their show and discussing it. They haven't shown one pro-Obama ad.
 
2008-09-10 9:07:30 AM  
Proof that most people are dumb:


However, the loss of support among white women could be fatal for his chances of winning the presidency if it was to be sustained. Obama had upset this constituency before the conventions, with many Democratic women unhappy that he had dumped their champion, Hillary Clinton, out of the nomination race.


Supporting someone who opposes things that Clinton fought her whole life for just because she has a uterus? That's stupid.

\I hear Denmark is nice this time of year.
 
2008-09-10 9:07:33 AM  

SlothB77: did Obama say that sarah palin is ugly like a pig and that she tries to cover it up with lipstick? Because that's how it is being protrayed by the media.


To all of a sudden specifically mention "lipstick" (a gender-specific inference) when it isn't a part of his normal dialogue is suspect, albeit with plausible deniability. Like if Palin had said "you can put Afrosheen on it to make it look slick, but it's still the same tired socialism."
 
2008-09-10 9:08:48 AM  

BigG: Jesus farking christ, they're showing ANOTHER McCain ad during their show and discussing it. They haven't shown one pro-Obama ad.


I try to take comfort in the idea that people who get their news from Fox are party-line retards who were never really up for grabs as voters to begin with.
 
2008-09-10 9:09:38 AM  

Gunther: dittybopper: Your job, if you want to see Obama in the Whitehouse come January*, is to convert those people, not just write them off. Granted, there are always those who can't be convinced. Don't worry about them. Don't denigrate them either. It makes you look petty and mean, and that works against you *AND* your candidate.

Screw that. Why should the democrats always have to take the high road? Why do you hold them to a standard that you don't hold the republicans to?

The entire Republican convention was nothing but a shockingly mean-spirited Obama-hatefest, while the word "liberal" is used as an epithet by pretty much every right winger in existence, yet the media has been filled with republicans whining about how cruel everyone is being to poor widdle Sarah Palin, what with demanding to interview her and all. The republicans manage to paint themselves as victims while savaging their opponents because they flood the media with their own narrative. It's the whole "talking points" thing you always see Fark liberals whining about, and it's been going on for years.

The Democrats aren't going to win this by playing nice. To win you need to "catapault the propaganda" as Bush put it; to make sure it's your version of events that's being reported, that it's your narrative the public are hearing. The Republicans are great at this, and that's why they've got a shot at winning this election after farking up everything they've done since 2000.


img143.imageshack.usView Full Size


You want this, don't you? The hate is swelling in you now. Take your rhetorical weapon. Use it. I am unarmed. Strike me down with it. Give in to your anger. With each passing moment you make yourself more my servant.
 
2008-09-10 9:10:03 AM  

Obviously: SlothB77: did Obama say that sarah palin is ugly like a pig and that she tries to cover it up with lipstick? Because that's how it is being protrayed by the media.

To all of a sudden specifically mention "lipstick" (a gender-specific inference) when it isn't a part of his normal dialogue is suspect, albeit with plausible deniability. Like if Palin had said "you can put Afrosheen on it to make it look slick, but it's still the same tired socialism."


Except that it's apparently a common term in DC and McCain has used it in the past.
 
2008-09-10 9:10:12 AM  

Obviously: "you can put Afrosheen on it to make it look slick, but it's still the same tired socialism."


If that were a widespread saying, one that politicians on both sides of the aisle had used many times in recent years and months, then no, it wouldn't be suspect.
 
2008-09-10 9:11:31 AM  
priestrape: Since Palin got nominated, the Obama and crew have stepped on every landmine. This is just the latest.

You can question the right all you want, but they have completely taken over the momentum of this election, and nominating Palin was a masterstroke.

Our only hope now is the debate(s)


This is entirely true. Everything Obama has done sense the conventions has either been speaking against Palin or been made to look like he was speaking against Palin. Really, what is the Presidential candidate doing talking about the VP candidate all of the time?

Whoever is pulling the strings for the McCain campaign, is pure political genius. Because of that, I would say it is primarily Rove. Say what you want about that guy, and there is plenty to say, but he is a master political strategist.
 
2008-09-10 9:12:11 AM  
The sheriff President is near!!!!
 
2008-09-10 9:12:33 AM  

sunshine_mcbihface: "Okay. I know this is probably horrible of me, but whatever, I'm a terrible person. If McCain wins, I hope this country goes down the shiatter, and we split into separate countries. Except Buffalo...that gets absorbed by Ontario. :-)"


Bring it on.

upload.wikimedia.orgView Full Size
 
2008-09-10 9:12:46 AM  
HE needs to put more lipstick on his monkey.
 
2008-09-10 9:12:54 AM  

priestrape: Since Palin got nominated, the Obama and crew have stepped on every landmine. This is just the latest every step that the Obama campaign has take has been cast as a landmine by the republicans and the media has run with it.


/ftfy
 
2008-09-10 9:13:38 AM  

Munchausen's Proxy: Whoever is pulling the strings for the McCain campaign, is pure political genius. Because of that, I would say it is primarily Rove. Say what you want about that guy, and there is plenty to say, but he is a master political strategist.


I cannot believe how quickly it has all changed. It's goddamn depressing
 
2008-09-10 9:13:45 AM  

organizm: Dear America,

I'm officially giving up all hope for you.


Love,

Me


Yeah, I can't wait for the new "We're Sorry" website of whiner pictures.
 
2008-09-10 9:15:02 AM  
Obviously: To all of a sudden specifically mention "lipstick" (a gender-specific inference) when it isn't a part of his normal dialogue is suspect,

To be honest, my first impression of his lipstick on a pig line was a rebuttal of Palin's lipsticked hockey mom line.
 
2008-09-10 9:15:30 AM  
Whoever is pulling the strings for the McCain campaign, is pure political genius. Because of that, I would say it is primarily Rove.


I agree. This worm started turning 18 months ago when Florida moved their Primary date. That was the first nail in the Obama campaign coffin.
 
2008-09-10 9:16:40 AM  
Hold on while i whip this out
 
2008-09-10 9:16:54 AM  
He should just come out and say, "I want to categorically deny that I think Sarah Palin is a pig. She's relatively thin for a woman her age."

/and then run like hell as Hillary backers break out the torches and pitchforks.
 
2008-09-10 9:16:56 AM  

Mr Logo: priestrape: Since Palin got nominated, the Obama and crew have stepped on every landmine. This is just the latest every step that the Obama campaign has take has been cast as a landmine by the republicans and the media has run with it.


This is a copout. The media is a tool...both sides use it. It's pretty much the central focus of any campaign - using the media, spinning stories, turning nothing little details into huge deals.

The Democrats were crushing the republicans in this area two weeks ago. Not any more

give credit where credit is due - the republicans were down to their last strike, and they hit a grandslam.
 
2008-09-10 9:17:09 AM  
Again, this should be a blow out, as it is not, I do not believe Obama can win. I DO believe that Americans, on average, are farking superstitious morons that deserve no better government than we have. This is democracy (sort of) and the "average" American (plus one) wins the day.

Thankfully the coming economic implosion once McShame is in office will effect Mr. Average American far more than me. Good. Gotta learn some day. To hell with them all.
 
2008-09-10 9:17:11 AM  
priestrape: I cannot believe how quickly it has all changed. It's goddamn depressing

could it not have been foreshadowed? The General is turning out like the primaries with Obama jumping out to a big lead and then limping into the win.
 
2008-09-10 9:17:37 AM  

I Said: I try to take comfort in the idea that people who get their news from Fox are party-line retards who were never really up for grabs as voters to begin with.


Unfortunately the number who think Fox is "fair and balanced" is pathetically large. I like to keep on eye on them so I know what I'm up against. Now they're talking about how the Hadron collider might destroy the earth. *sigh*
 
2008-09-10 9:18:20 AM  

Munchausen's Proxy: could it not have been foreshadowed? The General is turning out like the primaries with Obama jumping out to a big lead and then limping into the win.


I had less faith in McCain adapting and reacting so well than I did in Obama's opponents on the left
 
2008-09-10 9:19:41 AM  

brigid_fitch: In 20 years of voting I've been called exactly ONCE by a pollster and that was for a gubernatorial election in 1989. I didn't know a thing about either candidate at the time & told the pollster that. But she kept asking questions and I answered pretty much non-committally throughout. Sad to think that my completely uninformed responses were part of the overall result.


No. GLAD that your uninformed responses were part of the overall result. You represented a large part of the population with those non-committal responses. The problem with current polling^ is that people who are currently undecided are being manipulated and badgered into giving a solid opinion. The numbers then mushroom into a picture that in no way reflects the actual perspective of the people. It's a dirty tactic used by snakes posing as pollsters. Good for you for not falling for it.
 
2008-09-10 9:19:44 AM  
whconner4: Americans, on average, are farking superstitious morons that deserve no better government than we have.

I'm sorry, but what does being superstitious have to do with deserving a government?
 
2008-09-10 9:20:08 AM  

priestrape: The lipstick remark in Palin's speech was inserted to elicit this precise response from the Democrats - the "put a pig in lipstick" joke was obvious, as was the media's response.

Since Palin got nominated, the Obama and crew have stepped on every landmine. This is just the latest.

You can question the right all you want, but they have completely taken over the momentum of this election, and nominating Palin was a masterstroke.

Our only hope now is the debate(s)


Faint hope.

McCain is *KNOWN* for his extemporaneous speaking, whereas Obama isn't (which doesn't necessarily mean that he's bad at it). McCain has done presidential debates before, and has more experience at it. It will be interesting to watch.

As for Obama's campaign stepping on every landmine, it looks more like the McCain campaign has got inside the Obama campaign's OODA loop.

Right now they have to stop mentioning McCain and Palin, even obliquely. Most especially Palin, at least until she makes some kind of a gaffe. And she will make one, even the best politicians make them.

The Obama campaign has to focus on what they are going to do, not what the other side is going to do. If you end up reacting to the other side all the time, you lose the initiative.
 
2008-09-10 9:20:33 AM  
Good god this nation is so farking stupid, even after the last 8 years, you would have thought atleast the clear majority of people would have woken up, but no, this race is still as tight as the last two. Ugh.
 
2008-09-10 9:20:53 AM  

BigG: Unfortunately the number who think Fox is "fair and balanced" is pathetically large. I like to keep on eye on them so I know what I'm up against. Now they're talking about how the Hadron collider might destroy the earth. *sigh*


I do the same thing (also read the NY Post now and then and lurk in freeperville). And, oddly enough, each of those sources just repeats the same talking points over and over again. Then, when I talk to party-line repubs in my family, they claim to hate Hannity and Bill-O bc they're too biased, yet they too repeat the very same tired and disproven talking points.

The republican echo chamber is a fierce beast.
 
2008-09-10 9:21:12 AM  
Karl Rove was just seen with a chainlink leash in his hand and lipstick on his fly putting up "Lost Pitbull" signs.
 
2008-09-10 9:21:30 AM  

Munchausen's Proxy: whconner4: Americans, on average, are farking superstitious morons that deserve no better government than we have.

I'm sorry, but what does being superstitious have to do with deserving a government?


I haven't changed my socks since 2004
 
2008-09-10 9:22:06 AM  
dittybopper:

Dude, I don't know how to explain this to you any better; running an entirely positive campaign loses elections. If Obama runs the same kind of campaign as Kerry he will lose just like Kerry.

Actually, after re-reading your comments I see you're a McCain supporter. You wanting Obama to run a losing campaign suddenly makes a lot more sense.
 
2008-09-10 9:24:08 AM  
I Said: I haven't changed my socks since 2004

Usually you do that to keep a winning streak going.
 
2008-09-10 9:24:23 AM  

priestrape:
I cannot believe how quickly it has all changed. It's goddamn depressing


Isn't it the American way to make someone famous and then tear them down? After a while, they have a comeback and everyone loves them again. Sad, but true.

The only thing I'm surprised about is that Obama keeps taking the bait.
 
2008-09-10 9:24:51 AM  
Anyway, I think all the white women have gone...umm...well...aah..umm...ah...I aah..DOH!...

/umm
//aah
///meh
 
2008-09-10 9:25:32 AM  
Chester the Snake: The only thing I'm surprised about is that Obama keeps taking the bait.

With some experience, he'll learn.
 
2008-09-10 9:26:10 AM  
Munchausen's Proxy - Evangelicals. You know, the biggest embarrassment to our country since segregationists. Those superstitious theocrats.
 
2008-09-10 9:26:16 AM  

generaltimmy: FuriousGeorge945: I'm still not all that worried about Obama's chances in November because I think the debates will change everything. All the fact checking and debunking of McCain's bullshiat that goes under the radar can be brought out front and center by Obama in a venue that the press will have to cover in detail, and he seems ready to do this. Since the convention he's definitely taken a much sharper approach to addressing McCain in his stump speeches, but you don't hear much about that right now. I think a lot of casual observers are going to be very surprised by what they see when the debates come around, and the media is going to have to address the ways McCain has lied and flip flopped.

Also, I think the structure of the debates really benefits Obama. The first debate on Sept. 26th is about foreign policy, and I'm sure people will see it as his weakest because a disappointingly large percentage of the country thinks you're an effete liberal pussy if you don't want to bomb every country that looks at us funny. The third debate on Oct 15th, the last head to head meeting of these two just a few short weeks before election day, is all about domestic policies and the economy. This strongly favors Obama by most accounts and will give him an opportunity to better frame McCain's idea of "change" as continuing almost all of the same domestic policies of the last 8 years. It'll be a good final impression for him before the voting begins.

/possibly being too optimistic about the media doing its farking job
//still think he'll win handily

I know people shoul dnot underestimate Obama, but all I keep hearing is remove his teleprompter and he is dead in the water. W will see.

I worry about this too. This is solely my opinion, but both Obama and Biden seem to be intelligent men who, when asked a question off the cuff have several ideas they want to voice that get logjammed on the way to their mouths, causing them to either hesitate or (occasionally) jumble up what they are trying to say. When they're writing speeches they have a chance to organize their thoughts and flesh out their ideas. the opposing side on the other hand, seems to just have to stick to USA USA USA, Jesus Jesus Jesus, Drill Drill Drill and POW POW POW for their answers. perhaps there is something to be said for simplification, but I want my candidate to be aware that we live in a world of grey and nuances and there is no such thing as a cookie-cutter solution to any problem.I'm really hoping that Obama and Biden are drilling and practicing for these debates so, when asked about any of the issues they at least have an outline in their head to control the flow of ideas and make it managable.
 
2008-09-10 9:26:18 AM  

Munchausen's Proxy: I Said: I haven't changed my socks since 2004

Usually you do that to keep a winning streak going.


shiat. This is all my fault, isn't it?
 
2008-09-10 9:27:09 AM  

Entity79: Bah. Polls don't mean shiat.

Polls can be manipulated to give whatever impression the pollster wants, by clever phrasing of the questions.

That, and I nobody I know has been called by a pollster...


I was called by one asking for the "lady of the house," which made me laugh my ass off. [Were they calling from the past or something?]

It was a very carefully worded survey to bait you into saying you were concerned about violence on television and children seeing it. I caught her and said something like, "no, I'm an adult and I watch so-called violent television and think parents need to take personal responsi--" before she said "thank you" and hung up.

Guess that wasn't what she was looking for.

It does make you distrustful of polls....
 
2008-09-10 9:28:01 AM  
Chester the Snake: Isn't it the American way to make someone famous and then tear them down? After a while, they have a comeback and everyone loves them again. Sad, but true.

For some reason, though, democrats don't like repeats, or is it just defeated general election candidates don't come back? Is it because once you lose a general election you are branded a loser?
 
2008-09-10 9:28:31 AM  

Munchausen's Proxy:
To be honest, my first impression of his lipstick on a pig line was a rebuttal of Palin's lipsticked hockey mom line.


Totally agree.

I don't like how Obama marginalized Sen. Clinton's experience during the primaries, but I never thought he was sexist. His supporters and the media are another story.

But that pig remark...not good. Not good at all. He needs to address it and move on. Otherwise, people are going to be talking about this nonstop instead of more important things.
 
2008-09-10 9:29:08 AM  
whconner4: Evangelicals. You know, the biggest embarrassment to our country since segregationists. Those superstitious theocrats.

OK, that makes sense. Thanks for the clarification. I don't consider religion to be superstition, but I know where you are coming from.
 
2008-09-10 9:29:09 AM  

Obviously: SlothB77: did Obama say that sarah palin is ugly like a pig and that she tries to cover it up with lipstick? Because that's how it is being protrayed by the media.

To all of a sudden specifically mention "lipstick" (a gender-specific inference) when it isn't a part of his normal dialogue is suspect, albeit with plausible deniability. Like if Palin had said "you can put Afrosheen on it to make it look slick, but it's still the same tired socialism."


If your example were a common idiom and not a preposterous invention, you might be on to something.
 
2008-09-10 9:29:09 AM  

Munchausen's Proxy: Obviously: To all of a sudden specifically mention "lipstick" (a gender-specific inference) when it isn't a part of his normal dialogue is suspect,

To be honest, my first impression of his lipstick on a pig line was a rebuttal of Palin's lipsticked hockey mom line.


In other words, it sounds like Obama was calling Palin a pig, which is a nasty thing to call a woman. I know the "lipstick on a pig" phrase is older than dirt. So is "Finger lickin' good", but I wouldn't use it in campaign speech if I were running against Obama because of the obvious stereotypical overtones. As Obama has said, "words have meanings".

Advice for Obama:
Avoid the follow animals when talking about Palin: Pig, Cow, Sow, Heifer, Whale, Horse, Elephant, Hippo, or any other animal known for being ugly or fat.

At least he didn't call her "old fish" like he called McCain. That would have *REALLY* pissed off the women (and made their husbands chuckle under their breath).
 
2008-09-10 9:29:26 AM  

generaltimmy: SHame on you mods, shame. I submitted a nearly identical submission. And mine was spelld correctly as it took slang into consideration!

95% of blacks vote for Obama, cool
A 10-20% increase in women voting for McCain Palin (although there is the ideological factor), that is idiotic?

So one Archie Bunkeresque voting block is fine, but another is wrong?


The black vote was split fairly evenly up until the Sixties, and it was very limited due to disenfrancisement in the South. Eisenhower was the last Republican to get a majority of black support (using federal troops to enforce integration in Arkansas may have been a factor--wow, a Republican using big government to crush states rigths!). In the early Sixties, Northern Democrats travelled to the South and started a massive drive to register blacks to vote. While most Northern Republicans in Congress supported civil rights, there was no corresponding drive to register blacks as Republicans. There was a big debate over giving recognition to the Mississippi Freedom Democratic Party at the Democratic National Convention in 1964, but the end result was that blacks were accepted into the party. Southern Democrats such as Strom Thurmond left the party and supported Barry Goldwater, one of the few Republicans who opposed the Civil Rights Act of 1964.

Thus, black identification with the Democratic Party has its roots in the civil rights era, when the majority of the black population (those still living in the South) first began to participate in politics.

/MLK endorsed Ike, stayed neutral in the Kennedy vs. Nixon, and was vehemently against Goldwater in '64.
 
2008-09-10 9:30:26 AM  
It is apparent that most women are soft pro-choice, as in they are willing to vote for a candidate they like if they think other issues/feelings resonate more.

The sexism on this thread disgusts me. It's almost like half the 'liberals' here are conservatives trying to make liberals look bad.

My wife (full-time working mom) has pointed out that Sarah Palin has two things most women don't get to have:
(1) A grandmother that is apparently willing to take care of the kids full-time, and
(2) As governor, her work/life arrangements are a bit easier to make than ordinary working women. Whatever she wants done (within some reason) gets done.

She (my wife) doesn't consider Palin to be a role model at all for those reasons.

Right now, she is Teflon. She is also the de facto Presidential candidate although eventually her honeymoon may end. Problem is, it may not end until March or April when she is Vice-President.

Rapekitgate *may* give women some pause, but it must be approached very carefully lest the Teflon cause damage to the attacker. I hope Obama is planning to verify this and run with this if it is true, otherwise he will have to rely on debates or on Palin self-destructing in the debate (*).

(*) I suspect Palin will just repeat her talking about over and over if confused. She should be able to handle speaking as she has run for AK governor, so no Stockdale moments. Macaca moments, perhaps.
 
2008-09-10 9:31:06 AM  
Nobody wants an Executive and congress that share a Party. Either Party. That's what got us into Iraq and the PATRIOT ACT.

Why would you want more of the same by electing Tubrack al-Bombao bin Biden?

Do you think the Democrats are any more deliberative, cooperative or conciliatory than the Republicans? Ha. Absolute Power...
 
2008-09-10 9:32:06 AM  
"FunkOut 2008-09-10 06:06:37 AM
My mother's American and I recently discovered she likes Palin based on the premise that 1) Palin is supposed to be a downhome country girl and 2) Palin's a mommy. Up until now I thought my mother was fairly left-wing. I tried to tell her a few of the things Palin stood for and my mom thinks they're all just smear attacks. And apparently Obama is bad because he's "coming out of big city Chicago"."

Your mother is going to win this thing for McCain Palin. It's her perception that matches the perception of the American "everyman" to a T. And you know what, the American "everyman" may not be wise but never underestimate his caginess. Someone wrote the American voter is instinctive and intuitive like a wild animal.

As far as Palin goes, I am like the lone juror holding out for more testimony before I can render my judgement. Everyone around me has already made their decision and they are pressuring me to agree so they can get home before rush hour starts. She is the X factor folks. It looks like she can carry McCain to victory. Amazing. She gave a farking great speech, no doubt. Freaky good. Is she the one? Yikes.
 
2008-09-10 9:34:01 AM  
I Said: shiat. This is all my fault, isn't it?

Well, I guess. You should have changed socks and gone in search of a string of slump-busters. If you get on that right away, there is still time to take full credit for an Obama win.

dittybopper: In other words, it sounds like Obama was calling Palin a pig, which is a nasty thing to call a woman. I know the "lipstick on a pig" phrase is older than dirt. So is "Finger lickin' good", but I wouldn't use it in campaign speech if I were running against Obama because of the obvious stereotypical overtones. As Obama has said, "words have meanings".

This is how I took it. It just seemed to much of a coincidence to have him mention lipstick less than a week after she referred to herself as a pitbull with lipstick. Couple that with the fact that he had never used the phrase before. I think it was a shot at her by Obama, and a good shot at that. Unfortunately, it backfired on him.
 
2008-09-10 9:34:08 AM  
danlpoon: Nobody wants an Executive and congress that share a Party. Either Party. That's what got us into Iraq and the PATRIOT ACT.

Why would you want more of the same by electing Tubrack al-Bombao bin Biden?

Do you think the Democrats are any more deliberative, cooperative or conciliatory than the Republicans? Ha. Absolute Power...


Aren't you supposed to be traveling, dipshiat?
 
2008-09-10 9:34:11 AM  

abb3w: Hobodeluxe: That's not Levi with the weed in that pic though it's another of their friends.

Eh; given the brains level demonstrated by the social circle, I'd consider "weed = oregano" to be as likely as anything else.


Yes, because weed is very, very hard to find in Alaska.
 
2008-09-10 9:35:24 AM  
As for those who proclaim 'positive campaigns lose,' I point out Reagan '80.

He had faith in the American people, while it seems the liberals here have zero. It's as if people here are *trying* to act like liberals out of some ordinary Republican's nightmares.
 
2008-09-10 9:35:26 AM  
Sarah Palin is Elliot Ness
McCain is Sean Conn3ry
Obama is Al Capone
Biden is his criminal lackey

Suck on that metaphor libs.
 
2008-09-10 9:35:26 AM  
Munchausen's Proxy - even the old GOP was afraid this would happen if religion and politics jumped in the sack together. It's a runaway train. I don't know when it will stop. The GOP is officially endorsed by God (and a 24-hour news network). Any candidate from the other side is at a huge disadvantage.

Can't see that changing no matter how bad things get. Also, we spend almost nothing on education, thus more evangelicals (eschews elitist intellectuals and book learn'n and puts faith ahead of facts) are created every day and while far fewer rational humans, reasonable (both things take intellect and ability to judge two opposing views for it's merits without accepting either out of hand to be true)

McCain is running the worst campaign in history and it works. Unless he rapes a 13-year-old blond white girl on Fox News, he almost can't lose. Obama will have to raise the dead and get God to come on Fox and Friends to personally endorse him to win.

Fark this country if this continues.
 
2008-09-10 9:35:58 AM  

fortean chicken: Most of the women I know now like Palin, based off how they feel about her. They never even bring up where she stands on issues.


God. I'm so ashamed of my gender. Again.

That said, I was watching a CNN "Who is Sarah Palin?" piece last night, and all they had were emotional heartstring stories told by her father, a friend, a sister... they're turning her into a Lifetime TV movie and these women are falling for it hook, line, and sinker.

The worst thing is, under it, CNN had a statement of "no bias, no bull." The whole. farking. thing. was bull.

*headdesk*

Women who "like her" because she's a mother [oh WOW, she can do things that people have to work to AVOID doing, like getting pregnant? Is breathing now some great qualification?] or because she's "down home" are retarded. These don't make a leader, they make a down home mother.

This, dear Farkers, is why I refuse to associate with feminists/feminism. This blind devotion to women and the idea that merely having tits and a vagina is more valuable than a *gasp* MAN, is misguided and wrong, but they just don't see it.
 
2008-09-10 9:37:13 AM  
PresidentPutz
Karl Rove was just seen with a chainlink leash in his hand and lipstick on his fly putting up "Lost Pitbull" signs.

BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!
 
2008-09-10 9:37:41 AM  
Show of hands... who really believes anything is going to change after this election?
 
2008-09-10 9:38:02 AM  

priestrape: "...give credit where credit is due - the republicans were down to their last strike, and they hit a grandslam."


There is one thing missing from your analysis: The people who are inclined to like Palin. Whoever masterminded the Palin selection knows something the Democratic Party simply cannot or will not know: There are millions of Americans who are not on board with their philosophy and outlook. Furthermore, whenever the Democratic Party or intelligensia acknowledge the existence of these people at all, it is in a sneering and condescending way. This large segment of Americans is ripe to be plucked, the Republicans know it, and the Democrats seemingly never get it.
 
2008-09-10 9:38:51 AM  

generaltimmy: 95% of blacks vote for Obama, cool
A 10-20% increase in women voting for McCain Palin (although there is the ideological factor), that is idiotic?


So you think that black people are voting for Obama because he's black?

It has nothing to do with the past 40 years of GOP history? Is this the argument you're making? Because, last I checked, blacks vote Democratic for a wide range of reasons. And they've been doing it for quite some time now.

Maybe it's because Republicans fark over poor people and those without health care at every opportunity. Higher turn out for a historic black candidate is one thing, but it's goddamn retarded to call black political affiliation Archie Bunker-esque. It isn't based on racism, it's based on class.

Rich black folks have no problem voting for Republicans. Black people who personally benefit through more military spending? Same deal.

Now if women want to vote for a pro-life mommy theocrat, that's their right. They probably figure this is the best way for a woman to actually win the presidency, when McCain keels over in 2010.
 
2008-09-10 9:38:56 AM  

FunkOut:
Yeah, when I see Palin I want to KHITBASH. Then again, I'm a Canadian with anarchist leanings and a cupboard full of soybeans.


Represent, yo!
 
2008-09-10 9:38:59 AM  

Prospero424: Why this poll probably overstates Palin's gains.


Hey look - statistics! It would do people (especially journalists) a ton of good to learn some of this.
 
2008-09-10 9:39:42 AM  

serpent_sky: Is breathing now some great qualification?] or because she's "down home" are retarded.


OMG, I can't believe you would insult Trig Palin this way.

/GOP playbook, pg. 8
 
2008-09-10 9:40:37 AM  

Remove all Republicans:

Don't do that. You have to work and fight twice as hard to get your beliefs out there. Otherwise, you are leaving this country to the nitwits who have been managing this for the last eight years. Nobody deserves that.


America does.
In fact, America is begging to be treated like an abused spouse. I say we let it.

/New Zealand, here I come!
 
2008-09-10 9:41:39 AM  

Chester the Snake: But that pig remark...not good. Not good at all. He needs to address it and move on. Otherwise, people are going to be talking about this nonstop instead of more important things.


Christ, "put lipstick on a pig" is so common... it's a standard issue for "you can disguise something, but it's still the same thing." Why are people playing dumb on this one? Is it fun to be willfully ignorant? Honestly?

Besides, women are far more likely to refer to men as "pigs" if you really want to dig for stereotypes -- the whole "sexist pig" thing, the Trojan commercials where the men are pigs until they get condoms... "pig" is usually FAR more stereotypically used against men. If you want to make a huge, stretched out deal out of something, you can.

This is one of the stupidest "controversies" ever.

Especially considering she feels the only difference between herself and a dog [more commonly used towards women as an insult] is lipstick.

Let's all move on.
 
2008-09-10 9:42:18 AM  

priestrape: This is a copout. The media is a tool...both sides use it. It's pretty much the central focus of any campaign - using the media, spinning stories, turning nothing little details into huge deals.

The Democrats were crushing the republicans in this area two weeks ago. Not any more

give credit where credit is due - the republicans were down to their last strike, and they hit a grandslam.


Absolutely not. Obama had garnered his support through a campaign based on substance. McCain's campaign had stalled, it was unexciting and drab.

Since he nominated Palin as his running mate, coverage of McCain's campaign has been fawning, with almost no mention of their attacks and hypocricies. And everything that Obama has done has been labled a failure.
 
2008-09-10 9:42:26 AM  
stpickrell: Right now, she is Teflon.

Playing the gender card in response to every criticism is not going to work for very long. It's a little weird it's worked at all, honestly. Imagine if Obama played the race card to fend off criticism - he'd be eaten alive for it, and rightly so.

She really is not as canny a pick for VP as people think she is. She's being investigated for that "troopergate" (ugh, how I hate the -gate suffix) scandal, her record as mayor and governor is sub-par at best, her social conservatism isn't going to play well with most women voters, and she's bad enough at interviews that she's been sequestered from the press for the last two weeks.

The bump she's given McCain isn't going to last for very long, and probably not much longer than her first interview.
 
2008-09-10 9:42:32 AM  
My rage at the effectiveness of the Republican Attack Machine is akin to not being able to pass a level on some impossible oldschool platform game.
 
2008-09-10 9:42:35 AM  
canyoneer
What parts of the Dem philosophy are people not on board with?
 
2008-09-10 9:42:43 AM  
Here's where libs fall off the tracks. Wild eyed libs own the democrats. Obama beat the moderate candidate, Hillary Clinton, by oulibbing her. Now what does he do in the national election? Reverse himself on the war, taxes, spying the whole shmeel. He lying to half the country. I think we know which half.

Obama/Biden aint going to make it folks. Their stupid rabid Olbybots thought they were winning a democratic primary and forgot about the national election.

McCain as the fighter pilot just dropped out of the cloud directly behind Obama and he's peppering his wings with small arms fire. Obama's sitting in his cockpit listening to the radar alarm going bonkers. He's going to have to try a high risk maneuver. It could be a thing of beauty but the odds say it's going to end ugly.
 
2008-09-10 9:43:16 AM  

dittybopper: They don't agree with you, therefore they must be stupid, right?


If they had a better reason than "omg he's black" and "omg he's the anti-christ", then I'd consider that it's not because they are stupid. Even the black lady won't vote for the black man because he's black!
 
2008-09-10 9:43:23 AM  

canyoneer: his large segment of Americans is ripe to be plucked, the Republicans know it, and the Democrats seemingly never get it.


when they picked Palin, I thought "so what? They're not going to lure enough undecideds with this pick and they're going to turn off a whole mess of people who are pro-choice, anti-gun, anti-ID, pro-stem cell research, etc."

Um...WRONG!

I used to (and by "used to", I'm talking about last week) think that the obvious disdain the republican party has for the voting public will catch up to them. I couldn't have been more wrong.

I mean, when they picked Palin, they might as well have just come right out and said "We think you're too stupid to look past the fact that she's someone a lot of you would never even consider voting for were it not for the fact that she has a vagina."

And it's worked perfectly for them
 
2008-09-10 9:43:49 AM  
whconner4: McCain is running the worst campaign in history and it works. Unless he rapes a 13-year-old blond white girl on Fox News, he almost can't lose. Obama will have to raise the dead and get God to come on Fox and Friends to personally endorse him to win.

I agree that McCain has run a horrible campaign, but about two weeks before the primary things changed. What we don't know is who changed it (as stated, my money is on Rove). One thing that I have always thought is that the American voter needs a reason to vote for a democrat and a reason to not vote for a republican. Up until recently, the McCain's campaign was not making a case for themselves. All they needed to do was give the voter a reason to not vote for Obama.

I agree the FoxNews is over the top (fox and friends is unwatchable), but equally biased is CNN. McCafferty, Cooper and Campbell Brown push each other out of the way to fellate Obama. Hell, they have lead the charge with some of the blog-generated fabrications against Palin. That stuff will quickly make voters immune to real things when / if they come out.
 
2008-09-10 9:44:17 AM  

icy_one: generaltimmy: SHame on you mods, shame. I submitted a nearly identical submission. And mine was spelld correctly as it took slang into consideration!

95% of blacks vote for Obama, cool
A 10-20% increase in women voting for McCain Palin (although there is the ideological factor), that is idiotic?

So one Archie Bunkeresque voting block is fine, but another is wrong?

2004: 88% of African Americans vote Kerry (D)

2000: 90% of African Americans vote Gore (D)

2008: 90% of blacks poll for Obama (D)? THAT'S RACIST! African Americans make up 10% of voters. White women make up 40%.


TO be fair, I was talking about the primary.
 
2008-09-10 9:45:28 AM  

Gunther: dittybopper:

Dude, I don't know how to explain this to you any better; running an entirely positive campaign loses elections. If Obama runs the same kind of campaign as Kerry he will lose just like Kerry.

Actually, after re-reading your comments I see you're a McCain supporter. You wanting Obama to run a losing campaign suddenly makes a lot more sense.


I'm not so much a McCain supporter as an Obama opponent. I'll not deny it, and I will give you my particular justification for it:

The reason I don't want Obama to win is that I am a gun owner, and part of the 'Great American Gun Culture'(tm), and I just can't support a person who spent several years on the board of directors of the notoriously anti-gun Joyce Foundation. I don't really care what he says about it now, it doesn't change the fact that he helped to send millions of dollars to organizations devoted to ending private ownership of firearms in this country. He'd have to undergo a conversion like Saul of Tarsus on the road to Damascus in order to change my mind, and his evolving position on this, from the 1990's, to pre-DC vs Heller, and post Heller, right up to his comments about "Even if I want to take them away, I don't have the votes in Congress" make it seem as if he is changing his position every time it seems like it will cost him votes.

If McCain had that kind of a record, and Obama didn't, I'd be voting for Obama. I don't particularly care what letter a candidate has behind their name, I do care what they have in their gun case, and what they want to do with the guns in mine.

/Not *TOTALLY* a one issue voter, but in this campaign that is the driving issue for me.
 
2008-09-10 9:46:26 AM  
I'm a white woman and I am with Obama! Don't count us all out damnit!
 
2008-09-10 9:47:01 AM  
Gunther
We'll see. You're right in that 8 weeks is a long time in the 24-hour news cycle. I did hear on WTOP today that (1) she lied about being against the bridge to nowhere and (2) that Obama was referring to McCain's ideas for change and NOT Palin.

Troopergate might get shrugged off if nothing new is revealed. If the report slams Palin, it might be something.

Will Rapekitgate get national play or has it been debunked already?

We also have the Stevens trial. If he's found not guilty, then this helps Palin and the GOP brand overall. If he's found guilty, then this drags down everything as she and Stevens can be tied together fairly easily and forces the Republicans on the defensive in much the same way they were for a month after Foleygate.

Folks -- am I 100% off base in placing such great importance on the Ted Stevens trial?
 
2008-09-10 9:47:17 AM  
It's over.

Between his dancing around the questions in O'Reilly's interview and his careless and crude remarks, his 'change' is in the diaper bin with the rest.
 
2008-09-10 9:48:15 AM  

delau: My rage at the effectiveness of the Republican Attack Machine is akin to not being able to pass a level on some impossible oldschool platform game.


I feel your pain, brother.

img92.imageshack.usView Full Size
 
2008-09-10 9:48:46 AM  

Mr Logo: Since he nominated Palin as his running mate, coverage of McCain's campaign has been fawning,


this is exactly my point, though - it was a calculated decision to nominate Palin and it has produced the exact result they were surely hoping for

It doesn't matter what we call it - 'media bias' and other excuses - it worked.

I am 100% in the tank for Obama, but to say the media as a whole has been clearly anti-Obama is absurd. The momentum garnered by the Palin nomination is not a function of the media.

The republican party's supporters circled the wagons after initial reaction to the Palin nomination. The absurdity of it, and the laughter from the Democrats at the selection, made them stronger somehow.

People take politics personally now. It's a team sport. When democrats mocked Palin, republicans took it personally and rallied behind her with more intensity than if he had nominated, say, Romney.
 
2008-09-10 9:49:20 AM  
Remove all Republicans: Don't do that. You have to work and fight twice as hard to get your beliefs out there. Otherwise, you are leaving this country to the nitwits who have been managing this for the last eight years. Nobody deserves that.

I'm not going to raise my daughter in a country where teaching her to share my values gets her demonized. I gave this country three chances to show me my family and I are welcome here. If they prove yet again that we're not, then why should I stay?

\Top three destinations for me: Netherlands, Denmark, Spain
 
2008-09-10 9:49:26 AM  

NYZooMan: It's over.

Between his dancing around the questions in O'Reilly's interview and his careless and crude remarks, his 'change' is in the diaper bin with the rest.


Hey, speaking of careless remarks, remember that Rick Warren forum? What was McCain's non-joke answer to the middle class question?
 
2008-09-10 9:49:54 AM  
I'm still voting Obama, but I have to admit I get a certain pleasure watching his devoted followers sink to the level they have so quickly.
 
2008-09-10 9:50:11 AM  
FuriousGeorge945:
This farkwit, for one:
generaltimmy: I know people should not underestimate Obama, but all I keep hearing is remove his teleprompter and he is dead in the water. We will see.

Obama writes his own speeches, as can easily be seen by comparing what he's saying now to the books he's written - it's the same 'style'. He also gives a lot of his speeches without the aid of a teleprompter. And yet, I would wager most people would agree with generaltimmy 's uneducated belief, just because the media is interested in a close race instead of reporting the truth. Lies and slanders that'll bring in ratings get reported, while the boring truth is ignored.

Farkwit, cute. In your eager attempts to be John Stewartesque, you are wrong. I did not say Obama was at all inarticulate, jut implied that people always say he will be at a loss without a prewritten speech. See the above my paygrade answer.

I also said people mistakenly underestimate BO. Douche
 
2008-09-10 9:50:22 AM  
Aren't you supposed to be traveling, dipshiat?

Ha!. This is why you're losing. You let your emotions cloud your judgment. LoserThink. It's not full retard but it's damn close.
 
2008-09-10 9:50:42 AM  
Sheeeit, at some point are we going to get a new thread on the Politics tab this morning?
 
2008-09-10 9:50:43 AM  
stpickrell: What parts of the Dem philosophy are people not on board with?

While most people want to end the Iraqi experiment, a large portion of the country don't want to just leave. To many in America it is a pride thing. I understand those on the left garner pride in America for different reasons, but they fail to see what instills pride for the rural voters across the country.

This is where Obama is stuck between the nation and his party. Logically, he should be able to say "we are going to win Iraq, then Afganistan" and couple that with his economic message and win the election. The problem is that the left has become a series of single issue campaigns, with Iraq dominating the last 3. Their stand on that issue alone is a losing one.
 
2008-09-10 9:50:46 AM  

generaltimmy: icy_one: generaltimmy: SHame on you mods, shame. I submitted a nearly identical submission. And mine was spelld correctly as it took slang into consideration!

95% of blacks vote for Obama, cool
A 10-20% increase in women voting for McCain Palin (although there is the ideological factor), that is idiotic?

So one Archie Bunkeresque voting block is fine, but another is wrong?

2004: 88% of African Americans vote Kerry (D)

2000: 90% of African Americans vote Gore (D)

2008: 90% of blacks poll for Obama (D)? THAT'S RACIST! African Americans make up 10% of voters. White women make up 40%.

TO be fair, I was talking about the primary.


To be fair, a lot of people thought Hillary Clinton had too much political and personal baggage (voting for the war, the connection with all of Bill's issues, her botched attempt to enact healthcare legislation as first lady). If she were the nominee, Rush Limbaugh would've exhumed the body of Vince Foster by now. So I don't think it's accurate to say the Hillary was brought down by a vast black wing conspiracy.
 
2008-09-10 9:51:02 AM  

Softens_hands_while_you_do_the_dishes: Here's where libs fall off the tracks. Wild eyed libs own the democrats. Obama beat the moderate candidate, Hillary Clinton, by oulibbing her. Now what does he do in the national election? Reverse himself on the war, taxes, spying the whole shmeel. He lying to half the country. I think we know which half.

Obama/Biden aint going to make it folks. Their stupid rabid Olbybots thought they were winning a democratic primary and forgot about the national election.

McCain as the fighter pilot just dropped out of the cloud directly behind Obama and he's peppering his wings with small arms fire. Obama's sitting in his cockpit listening to the radar alarm going bonkers. He's going to have to try a high risk maneuver. It could be a thing of beauty but the odds say it's going to end ugly.

Thanks for cheering me up Softens_hands_while_you_do_the_dishes! As long as McCain's in a plane he's the only one truly in danger.
 
2008-09-10 9:52:24 AM  

stpickrell: "What parts of the Dem philosophy are people not on board with?"


Activist government. Gun bans. Secular humanism. Regulation. Disdain for Christianity and tradition. Open borders. And so on.

Now, I know what response this comment is going to bring: "Why, they're just a bunch of backwards hicks!" - and that may well be true, but these traditionalists exist in large numbers and feel ignored and belittled and marginalized. They see Sarah Palin as one of their own, and are thrilled and overjoyed to have a champion at the national level. They will come out to vote this year in huge numbers.
 
2008-09-10 9:52:48 AM  

ekdikeo4: dittybopper: They don't agree with you, therefore they must be stupid, right?

If they had a better reason than "omg he's black" and "omg he's the anti-christ", then I'd consider that it's not because they are stupid. Even the black lady won't vote for the black man because he's black!


That is probably over simplistic stereotyping on your part, which is really my point. The black lady won't vote for Obama because he's black? Is she a republican? Is she a social or fiscal conservative?

Implying that she should (or will) vote for Obama/Biden because Barack Obama is black is just as stupidly stereotypical as implying she should (or will) vote for the McCain/Palin ticket because Palin is a woman.
 
2008-09-10 9:52:53 AM  
How is the rest of the world supposed to give US citizens the benefit of the doubt now?
 
2008-09-10 9:53:24 AM  
stpickrell: Right now, she is Teflon.

Yeah right. More like the Cloverfield monster, taking flak from all directions while stomping on Abrams tanks and flicking away hellfire missiles.
 
2008-09-10 9:54:24 AM  

dittybopper: /Not *TOTALLY* a one issue voter, but in this campaign that is the driving issue for me.


And I am voting entirely against people who are anti-online-gaming, as I make my living primarily by playing online poker. McCain believes that games run by computers cannot give you a fair game. (apparently he fails to note that slot machines have been entirely computerized for a couple of decades at least, now.. .. or he's just using that as an excuse)

Also voting against my current State Rep, who says that "Internet Gambling is a front for terrorists to make money".

If that were a total non issue, then I'd vote probably similarly, because my Rep is a giant douche bag, and so is McCain.
 
2008-09-10 9:54:47 AM  
Munchausen's Proxy: I understand those on the left garner pride in America for different reasons, but they fail to see what instills pride for the rural voters across the country.

Yet again, I do not understand the mindset of a rural American. To them, war isn't a horrible destruction of human life, it's something to take pride in.
 
2008-09-10 9:55:17 AM  
Automatically competent, also wants to know where the white women at:
i241.photobucket.comView Full Size
 
2008-09-10 9:58:37 AM  
Softens_hands_while_you_do_the_dishes: Yeah right. More like the Cloverfield monster, taking flak from all directions while stomping on Abrams tanks and flicking away hellfire missiles.

Does that make the conservative women flocking to her those nasty little creatures who attack people? Cause I'd find that an accurate depiction.
 
2008-09-10 9:58:46 AM  

canyoneer: Furthermore, whenever the Democratic Party or intelligensia acknowledge the existence of these people at all, it is in a sneering and condescending way.


This coming from arguably the most smug elitist on Fark. Priceless.
 
2008-09-10 9:59:55 AM  

dittybopper: That is probably over simplistic stereotyping on your part, which is really my point. The black lady won't vote for Obama because he's black? Is she a republican? Is she a social or fiscal conservative?


See, here's the thing.
Most of the people that I come across in my normal interactions with people wouldn't even be able to answer those questions. I currently believe that that is probably how the majority of people are - they don't care to such a degree that they'll just go out on election day, because that's what they are supposed to do, and pick whatever names sound most familiar, or who is least offensive to them.

And, actually, yes, I did ask the older black lady that I work with, after Obama had locked up the nomination, how she felt about that .. and she said that it was wonderful, but that she would not vote for a black man. The look on my face was of complete and utter shock.
 
2008-09-10 10:00:28 AM  

canyoneer: priestrape: "...give credit where credit is due - the republicans were down to their last strike, and they hit a grandslam."

There is one thing missing from your analysis: The people who are inclined to like Palin. Whoever masterminded the Palin selection knows something the Democratic Party simply cannot or will not know: There are millions of Americans who are not on board with their philosophy and outlook. Furthermore, whenever the Democratic Party or intelligensia acknowledge the existence of these people at all, it is in a sneering and condescending way. This large segment of Americans is ripe to be plucked, the Republicans know it, and the Democrats seemingly never get it.


This large segment of America is willing to vote against their own self-interests and for the same promises that have yet to be met by the Republican Party.
 
2008-09-10 10:00:30 AM  
The Icelander: Yet again, I do not understand the mindset of a rural American. To them, war isn't a horrible destruction of human life, it's something to take pride in.

Yes. but there is more. To many, many Americans America is all they have. They scrap by, just like their fathers and their fathers' fathers and they are fine with it. They get to hunt a little and fish a little and are fine with that, but all they have to be proud of is their country. They fly the flag proudly and sing the national anthem because it means something to them. They don't love war or hate peace, but they are proud that America is strong. Losing a war (or not winning) dishonors the one and only thing they are truly proud of - their country.

The democrats talk about making America great. To them it is great. If they want their vote they need to know their wants, not their needs.
 
2008-09-10 10:01:50 AM  
dittybopper: The reason I don't want Obama to win is that I am a gun owner, and part of the 'Great American Gun Culture'(tm), and I just can't support a person who spent several years on the board of directors of the notoriously anti-gun Joyce Foundation.

You do know BO has spoken in support of the second amendment, right? And that Democrats in general have been moving away from the "anti-gun" position for the last ten years or so?

canyoneer: Disdain for Christianity and tradition.

Oh, come on. You don't really believe this, do you?

I remember you used to be moderately intelligent. WTF happened to you, dude? are you just trolling for the election season or something?
 
2008-09-10 10:02:41 AM  

priestrape: Mr Logo: Since he nominated Palin as his running mate, coverage of McCain's campaign has been fawning,

this is exactly my point, though - it was a calculated decision to nominate Palin and it has produced the exact result they were surely hoping for

It doesn't matter what we call it - 'media bias' and other excuses - it worked.

I am 100% in the tank for Obama, but to say the media as a whole has been clearly anti-Obama is absurd. The momentum garnered by the Palin nomination is not a function of the media.

The republican party's supporters circled the wagons after initial reaction to the Palin nomination. The absurdity of it, and the laughter from the Democrats at the selection, made them stronger somehow.

People take politics personally now. It's a team sport. When democrats mocked Palin, republicans took it personally and rallied behind her with more intensity than if he had nominated, say, Romney.


It is nothing but upping the Ante.
-McCain is a POW (if you hadn't heard)-attacks against him are responded with...He served, he was a POW, Blah!
-Barack is Black (if you hand't heard). Attacks against him are seen as racist. (Gov Patterson said Community Organizer is code for Black)
-Palin is a woman (if you hadn't heard)-any attacks on her are sexist

This is all politics. It is all silly gamesmenship
 
2008-09-10 10:03:18 AM  

hyperspacemonkey: How is the rest of the world supposed to give US citizens the benefit of the doubt now?


Oops. If I had only scrolled down I would have seen DailyKOS's conspiracy theory that at least attempts to cling to some doubt.
 
2008-09-10 10:04:01 AM  
Munchausen's Proxy: Losing a war (or not winning) dishonors the one and only thing they are truly proud of - their country.

But going in illegally, committing atrocities and human rights abuses, these things are not as bad as "losing" a war that we shouldn't have fought in the first place?

I still don't understand it. They seem to love America only if it's throwing its weight around and breaking shiat.
 
2008-09-10 10:04:49 AM  

ekdikeo4: dittybopper: /Not *TOTALLY* a one issue voter, but in this campaign that is the driving issue for me.

And I am voting entirely against people who are anti-online-gaming, as I make my living primarily by playing online poker. McCain believes that games run by computers cannot give you a fair game. (apparently he fails to note that slot machines have been entirely computerized for a couple of decades at least, now.. .. or he's just using that as an excuse)

Also voting against my current State Rep, who says that "Internet Gambling is a front for terrorists to make money".

If that were a total non issue, then I'd vote probably similarly, because my Rep is a giant douche bag, and so is McCain.


Good for you. Vote your stomach.

Personally, I don't gamble so that's no skin off my nose. Not that I have a particular problem with other people gambling, it just doesn't do anything for me. Whether online gambling goes or stays is of no consequence to me.

Do what you gotta do.
 
2008-09-10 10:05:57 AM  
I am 37 year old white female mom of 2 and a recovering Republican from TX. I'm Pro-choice, pro-environment, pro-science, pro-gay rights.

There are plenty of us around! Hopefully we'll all show up on voting day.
 
2008-09-10 10:06:12 AM  

Remove all Republicans: This is why Obama is countering with Hillary Clinton, Kathleen Sebelius, and others to attack her. He is not some sexist like McCain who only sees race and gender.

The Democrats just have to be careful when the Republicans start using Palin and the "scary black man" bit to get more idiots on their team.

 
2008-09-10 10:06:57 AM  
"The Icelander 2008-09-10 09:58:37 AM
Softens_hands_while_you_do_the_dishes: Yeah right. More like the Cloverfield monster, taking flak from all directions while stomping on Abrams tanks and flicking away hellfire missiles.

Does that make the conservative women flocking to her those nasty little creatures who attack people? Cause I'd find that an accurate depiction."

Whatever. I just know it's going to end with a few crackles of static and then darkness.
 
2008-09-10 10:07:45 AM  

generaltimmy: TO be fair, I was talking about the primary.


To be fair, there aren't many black people in Iowa. That voting block did not seal the deal for Obama in Iowa.

Also, it may have had something to do with Bill Clinton's lip-smacking in South Carolina.

In either event - fail.
 
2008-09-10 10:08:39 AM  

Gunther: "Oh, come on. You don't really believe this, do you?"


Where did I say I believe it? I didn't. What I'm trying to tell you is that there are millions of Americans who do, indeed, see things that way. The Republicans know this, and exploit that set of perceptions and beliefs. The Democrats, evidently being too literalist for their own good, cannot imagine that there are millions of people can think this way. But there are, and they do, and the Republicans get their votes again and again.

It's still Obama's election to lose in my opinion, but he may well lose it. Especially if he keeps stepping on all of these cultural landmines. His "lipstick on a pig" comment was very stupid. Palin is goading him and his surrogates into just such mistakes, and they're taking the bait, hook, line, and sinker. I thought Obama was smarter than that.
 
2008-09-10 10:08:44 AM  
Munchausen's Proxy - CNN and Fox News equally bias? Anybody else here buy this? That's insane. Are you actually serious?
 
2008-09-10 10:08:59 AM  

ekdikeo4:
And, actually, yes, I did ask the older black lady that I work with, after Obama had locked up the nomination, how she felt about that .. and she said that it was wonderful, but that she would not vote for a black man. The look on my face was of complete and utter shock.


Maybe she knows something you don't, or has been effected by something you haven't. Familiarity oft breeds contempt. I love my younger brother, but I'd never vote for him if he was running for office. Any office. Even dogcatcher.
 
2008-09-10 10:09:17 AM  
canyoneer Quote 2008-09-10 09:52:24 AM
stpickrell: "What parts of the Dem philosophy are people not on board with?"

Activist government.


A scare term that means absolutely nothing more than "doesn't think the way I do"

Gun bans.

Thats a lie.

Secular humanism.

Yup.

Regulation.

What???

Disdain for Christianity and tradition.

Thats absolute rubbish. More lies and scare tactics.

Open borders.

What did GWB do for borders, will McCain really change anything? What can he do? More scare tactics.
 
2008-09-10 10:09:54 AM  

FunkOut: My mother's American and I recently discovered she likes Palin based on the premise that 1) Palin is supposed to be a downhome country girl and 2) Palin's a mommy. Up until now I thought my mother was fairly left-wing. I tried to tell her a few of the things Palin stood for and my mom thinks they're all just smear attacks. And apparently Obama is bad because he's "coming out of big city Chicago". I had no idea cities were evil and being in the country made people good. Or that being a mother made someone saintly. Palin reminds me of those psycho biatchy cheerleader girls who bullied people and made a big deal out of being a tough girl in high school. In particular, the one who led that pray by the flagpole thing even though she was sleeping with one of the male gym teachers.

I can't decide who to vote for in the Canadian election, I mean, there's Neocon Robot, French Muppet, Big Moustache Mouth, and Ignored Green Party Lady.


Moma says "don't drink the kool-aid"
 
2008-09-10 10:10:10 AM  
On one side you have the VP candidate being accused of all manner of stupidity. And she's handling it with perfect caution. Nothing bombastic.

Meanwhile you have the other candidate becoming a virtual gaffe machine, talking about his muslim faith, painting lipstick on pig women, it goes on and on. And the media is like, whatever.

The American people hate bias and the media is feeding them a steady diet of it.
 
2008-09-10 10:10:19 AM  
The Icelander: But going in illegally, committing atrocities and human rights abuses, these things are not as bad as "losing" a war that we shouldn't have fought in the first place?

I still don't understand it. They seem to love America only if it's throwing its weight around and breaking shiat.


They don't care about how we got there. They see that we are in a fight and therefore we need to win the fight.

We are proud of our country when it does things like airlift supplies as well, not just breaking shiat.
 
2008-09-10 10:10:47 AM  

Softens_hands_while_you_do_the_dishes: It looks like she can carry McCain to victory. Amazing. She gave a farking great speech, no doubt. Freaky good. Is she the one? Yikes.


You're kidding, right?

George Bush(you know, that guy that McCain's gonna go all mavericky on)'s speech writer whipped up that gem before she was even announced as McCain's running mate. You can easily identify the portions that were inserted to fit her. She was just reading words. She did a decent job of speaking, but I would expect nothing less from the former Miss Wasilla.
 
2008-09-10 10:10:52 AM  

generaltimmy: Farkwit, cute. In your eager attempts to be John Stewartesque, you are wrong. I did not say Obama was at all inarticulate, jut implied that people always say he will be at a loss without a prewritten speech. See the above my paygrade answer.


It isn't so much that he is at a loss without a pre written speech. Obama genuinely tries to answer questions in full. These answers are often quite informative whether you agree with his policies or not. Unfortunately, it is sometimes easy to extract sound bytes like 'that is above my pay grade' from his answers to questions.

In context the pay grade comment made perfect sense - some things are the responsibility of his boses - the American people.
 
2008-09-10 10:11:16 AM  

Roo1013: I am 37 year old white female mom of 2 and a recovering Republican from TX. I'm Pro-choice, pro-environment, pro-science, pro-gay rights.

There are plenty of us around! Hopefully we'll all show up on voting day.


Well, Roo, according to Obama's supporters, "you should really be at home, raising those tiring little pigs...er, kids."

And as one woman actually told me once, if you were truly pro-environment, you would have aborted them anyway.

No hate like liberal hate.
 
2008-09-10 10:11:48 AM  
Actually I was wrong earlier. McCain is sitting at his desk eating crackers and drinking diet Dr. Pepper back at Top Gun school while his prize pupil is out doing triple kills on Russian Migs.
 
2008-09-10 10:13:00 AM  

Andric: delau: My rage at the effectiveness of the Republican Attack Machine is akin to not being able to pass a level on some impossible oldschool platform game.

I feel your pain, brother.


Great, Ninja Gaiden. Now I'M angry too.
/fark you, Jacquio
 
2008-09-10 10:13:11 AM  

mekki: fortean chicken: Most of the women I know now like Palin, based off how they feel about her. They never even bring up where she stands on issues.

My opinion of women as a whole just took a massive dive. We never should have given them the right to vote.

Hey, these idiots don't speak for the rest of us women. We know a pandering ploy when we see one. Many of us are insulted by Palin. Even more so since she doesn't seem to want to face the cameras unless she has full control.

She is Cheney in a skirt.


fap , fap , fap
 
2008-09-10 10:14:54 AM  
canyoneer
Activist government is generally disdained unless people feel capitalism has failed them. Seriously, why would someone middle class or higher WANT higher taxes they feel are not going to them?

As for gun bans, there are large numbers of pro-gun Democrats.

Secular humanism -- I think there's a hard core of 20-30% secular humanists and 20-30% Evangelicals. The folks in the middle are suspicious of both.

Regulation -- see activist government. New regulations are virulently opposed but old ones are part of the furniture.

Disdain for Christianity/tradition -- sadly this lapses into dislike/suspicion of The Other.

Open borders -- yep, people aren't fans of illegal immigration. OTOH, many of the proposed cures are worse than the disease.

As for coming out to vote -- part of me wonders if 2004 was the high-water mark of the GOP base -- in 2006, Northeastern whites deserted the Republicans en masse and in 2008, Obama threatens to bring youth, Black, and Hispanic turnout to record levels.

Curious -- which of these do you yourself believe in?
 
2008-09-10 10:15:24 AM  

Mr Logo: In context the pay grade comment made perfect sense - some things are the responsibility of his boses - the American people.


Which American people have the legitimate authority to factually state the exact moment when life begins?
 
2008-09-10 10:15:30 AM  

The Icelander:

I still don't understand it. They seem to love America only if it's throwing its weight around and breaking shiat.


Have you ever watched The Wire on HBO? If you haven't, buy it, rent it, whatever. Watching The Wire is like getting punched in the gut. Season 5, in particular.

The bigger the lie, the more they believe.
 
2008-09-10 10:16:04 AM  

HighOnCraic: generaltimmy: icy_one: generaltimmy: SHame on you mods, shame. I submitted a nearly identical submission. And mine was spelld correctly as it took slang into consideration!

95% of blacks vote for Obama, cool
A 10-20% increase in women voting for McCain Palin (although there is the ideological factor), that is idiotic?

So one Archie Bunkeresque voting block is fine, but another is wrong?

2004: 88% of African Americans vote Kerry (D)

2000: 90% of African Americans vote Gore (D)

2008: 90% of blacks poll for Obama (D)? THAT'S RACIST! African Americans make up 10% of voters. White women make up 40%.

TO be fair, I was talking about the primary.

To be fair, a lot of people thought Hillary Clinton had too much political and personal baggage (voting for the war, the connection with all of Bill's issues, her botched attempt to enact healthcare legislation as first lady). If she were the nominee, Rush Limbaugh would've personallyexhumed the body of Vince Foster by now. So I don't think it's accurate to say the Hillary was brought down by a vast black wing conspiracy.


Blacks were loyal to the Clintons through thick and thin. Most probably did not care about Baggage. People cared in large that Obama was black and had liberal views. Not a huge stretch, but it was party then color.

A decent percentage may see Palin as gender first
 
2008-09-10 10:16:56 AM  
whconner4: CNN and Fox News equally bias? Anybody else here buy this? That's insane. Are you actually serious?

Yes. I watched all three cable channels during the debates (we play both kinds) CNN, MSNBC and Fox. I was not interested in what the pundits had to say about their own party, but what they said about the other, and how even the coverage was. MSNBC with Olbermann and Matthews were in the bag during the DNC convention, and at least Matthews realized and became at least marginally journalistic during the RNC. Olbermann took shots every chance he could. Fox had Wolfsen, who had some good insight into the RNC. In the days between Palin's nomination and her speech Campbell Brown was so ridiculous in her tirades against her it should be embarassing to all of CNN. After Palin's speech she did change a bit, but the bias is still clear.
 
2008-09-10 10:17:56 AM  

dittybopper: Gunther: dittybopper:

Dude, I don't know how to explain this to you any better; running an entirely positive campaign loses elections. If Obama runs the same kind of campaign as Kerry he will lose just like Kerry.

Actually, after re-reading your comments I see you're a McCain supporter. You wanting Obama to run a losing campaign suddenly makes a lot more sense.

I'm not so much a McCain supporter as an Obama opponent. I'll not deny it, and I will give you my particular justification for it:

The reason I don't want Obama to win is that I am a gun owner, and part of the 'Great American Gun Culture'(tm), and I just can't support a person who spent several years on the board of directors of the notoriously anti-gun Joyce Foundation. I don't really care what he says about it now, it doesn't change the fact that he helped to send millions of dollars to organizations devoted to ending private ownership of firearms in this country. He'd have to undergo a conversion like Saul of Tarsus on the road to Damascus in order to change my mind, and his evolving position on this, from the 1990's, to pre-DC vs Heller, and post Heller, right up to his comments about "Even if I want to take them away, I don't have the votes in Congress" make it seem as if he is changing his position every time it seems like it will cost him votes.

If McCain had that kind of a record, and Obama didn't, I'd be voting for Obama. I don't particularly care what letter a candidate has behind their name, I do care what they have in their gun case, and what they want to do with the guns in mine.

/Not *TOTALLY* a one issue voter, but in this campaign that is the driving issue for me.


Congratulations on being a moroninc idiot of epic proportions. You are what is wrong with America.
 
2008-09-10 10:19:48 AM  
Mr Logo: Obama genuinely tries to answer questions in full. These answers are often quite informative whether you agree with his policies or not.

To often, though, his answers come across as parsing words. I do agree that his manner is more contemplative that McCain's, but that can come across as both a positive and a negative
 
2008-09-10 10:19:57 AM  

DrillSergeantPoopyPants: Roo1013: I am 37 year old white female mom of 2 and a recovering Republican from TX. I'm Pro-choice, pro-environment, pro-science, pro-gay rights.

There are plenty of us around! Hopefully we'll all show up on voting day.

Well, Roo, according to Obama's supporters, "you should really be at home, raising those tiring little pigs...er, kids."

And as one woman actually told me once, if you were truly pro-environment, you would have aborted them anyway.

No hate like liberal hate.


Nice strawman, there.

There are no words in the English language, or any other, to express your stupidity.
 
2008-09-10 10:20:15 AM  
Munchausen's Proxy: They don't care about how we got there. They see that we are in a fight and therefore we need to win the fight.

Again, I don't understand this. I think we should seek peace, not just victory. I mean, we could nuke Iraq and say we won. Would that make them happy? "We won! Woo! U-S-A! U-S-A!"

We are proud of our country when it does things like airlift supplies as well, not just breaking shiat.

I'm proud when we airlift supplies, but I'm not proud when we're breaking shiat.
 
2008-09-10 10:20:16 AM  
I was just looking at the McCain (new window) ad on youtube.

There a dozens of Obama lipstick on a pig videos here is a selection of some of the worst titles:

*Obama calls Palin a 'pig' -- New low for sexism-plagued Illinois senator as he appropriates Palin's 'lipstick' remark to attack her with repulsive, misogynistic comment

*Barack Obama Refers to Palin as 'Lipstick On A Pig'! CLIP

*Sarah Palin Is 'Lipstick On A Pig' and 'Stinky Fish'! (Barack Obama Just Lost The Election!)

*Sick Bastard Obama said "You Can Put Lipstick On A Pig" to Palin

*Obama Insults Gov Sarah Palin As A Pig with Lipstick

*Obama Smears McCain-Palin As Lipstick On A Pig
 
2008-09-10 10:20:23 AM  

Munchausen's Proxy: Campbell Brown was so ridiculous in her tirades against her it should be embarassing to all of CNN


What tirades are you referring to? All I've seen is her dressing down of Tucker Bounds because he couldn't name a single order that Sarah Palin had given the Alaska NG. IMHO that was completely in line with what I'd expect any solid journalist to do when being fed a line of bullshiat.
 
2008-09-10 10:20:35 AM  
Campbell Brown is ortho Jewish (convert). She's skeered of the strong Christian. Aint nothing changing that particular base level of animosity. If you think it doesn't exist, you haven't been watching enough episodes of South Park.

I bet Campbell Brown likes to munch carpet every now and then as well. Or perhaps having her's done is part of the job description. Who knows but she's got an agenda and she's got a lot of reasons to sneer.
 
2008-09-10 10:22:16 AM  
The stinky fish comment is even more debased. Idiotic. Locker Room humor. Dude lost it.
 
2008-09-10 10:22:16 AM  
JimmyTheHutt: Congratulations on being a moroninc idiot of epic proportions. You are what is wrong with America.

So if someone disagrees with you or votes based on a different perspective they are an idiot? This I did not know. I just thought it was a difference of opinion.

Perhaps ad hominem attacks are what is wrong with America.
 
2008-09-10 10:23:50 AM  
two things as a male you never ever comment about regarding females (within earshot). Pigs and fish smells. You don't go there you dumbass. Obamba is a dumbass. Hahahahaha. It's ova.
 
2008-09-10 10:27:54 AM  
These remarks bother me.
Didn't Van Palin call herself a dog with lipstick?
As the filters go the proper term for a female dog is what?
Unless she accually has testicles.

/ HER "words"
 
2008-09-10 10:28:25 AM  

HighOnCraic: Which American people have the legitimate authority to factually state the exact moment when life begins?


The idea is that people should have a choice. That is unless you can tell me of a politician who can factually state the exact moment when life begins.
 
2008-09-10 10:28:46 AM  

Munchausen's Proxy:

So if someone disagrees with you or votes based on a different perspective they are an idiot? This I did not know. I just thought it was a difference of opinion.


That's not voting based on a difference of opinion. That is voting on a myopic, narrow view of what is important. The inability to see the larger issues in play in this election beyond "he's gonna take mah gunz away!" is perfectly symptomatic of utter stupidity at the highest level. This isn't a researched, nuanced, opinion based on the larger view. It's single issue voting, and that is beyond moronic. Any attempts to defend it as a "difference of opinion" are beyond null and void.
 
2008-09-10 10:28:50 AM  
The Icelander: Again, I don't understand this. I think we should seek peace, not just victory. I mean, we could nuke Iraq and say we won. Would that make them happy? "We won! Woo! U-S-A! U-S-A!"

Many in this country don't want peace at any cost. It is not a "love war" thing, but a "hate defeat" concept that they abhor.

If you want to help democrats win, you should try to understand this. That is why democrats have problems in rural areas. They cannot understand why someone would think differently than they do. I am not implying that Obama is less American or less proud of America, but what makes him, or you proud is not what makes a large portion of the country proud.
 
2008-09-10 10:29:27 AM  

dittybopper: Munchausen's Proxy: Obviously: To all of a sudden specifically mention "lipstick" (a gender-specific inference) when it isn't a part of his normal dialogue is suspect,

To be honest, my first impression of his lipstick on a pig line was a rebuttal of Palin's lipsticked hockey mom line.

In other words, it sounds like Obama was calling Palin a pig, which is a nasty thing to call a woman. I know the "lipstick on a pig" phrase is older than dirt. So is "Finger lickin' good", but I wouldn't use it in campaign speech if I were running against Obama because of the obvious stereotypical overtones. As Obama has said, "words have meanings".

Advice for Obama:
Avoid the follow animals when talking about Palin: Pig, Cow, Sow, Heifer, Whale, Horse, Elephant, Hippo, or any other animal known for being ugly or fat.

At least he didn't call her "old fish" like he called McCain. That would have *REALLY* pissed off the women (and made their husbands chuckle under their breath).


Except he didn't.
 
2008-09-10 10:30:36 AM  

canyoneer: stpickrell: "What parts of the Dem philosophy are people not on board with?"

Activist government. Gun bans. Secular humanism. Regulation. Disdain for Christianity and tradition. Open borders. And so on.



Are you sure you aren't talking about McCain?
 
2008-09-10 10:31:48 AM  
JimmyTheHutt: That's not voting based on a difference of opinion. That is voting on a myopic, narrow view of what is important.

So what commission gets to decide what is a valid concern for a voter and what is superfluous?
 
2008-09-10 10:33:05 AM  

dittybopper: In other words, it sounds like Obama was calling Palin a pig, which is a nasty thing to call a woman.


Except he wasn't talking about Palin at all, he was talking about McCain's policy shifts.

The Palin association is something that the McCain campaign fed the media, and the media bit on it.
 
2008-09-10 10:36:07 AM  

Munchausen's Proxy:
So what commission gets to decide what is a valid concern for a voter and what is superfluous?


If, right now, with everything going on in our country and the world, your big issue is your ability to keep your handgun, there is nothing way to argue otherwise. That speaks to massive amounts of ignorance of events and circumstances of the last 8 years.

So, no, there is no "commission". Just observing the world at large, and the country as a whole.
 
2008-09-10 10:37:25 AM  
Munchausen's Proxy: Many in this country don't want peace at any cost. It is not a "love war" thing, but a "hate defeat" concept that they abhor.

So Obama should come out and say "See! The surge worked! We won! Let's bring our boys home!" Even if it isn't true, the Heartlanders will eat it up and vote for him.
 
2008-09-10 10:38:58 AM  

Edsel: The Palin association is something that the McCain campaign fed the media, and the media bit on it.


Yep. If you actually watch the clip, it's obvious he's talking about McCain. Obviously, that isn't as juicy a story though, so we get this crap instead.
 
2008-09-10 10:38:59 AM  

Mr Logo: HighOnCraic: Which American people have the legitimate authority to factually state the exact moment when life begins?

The idea is that people should have a choice. That is unless you can tell me of a politician who can factually state the exact moment when life begins.


I was asking a rhetorical question; I don't think anyone can say exactly when life begins, and I think that was Obama's point as well.
 
2008-09-10 10:39:24 AM  
Imagine that...

Obama's sexist primary campaign against Hillary Clinton has come around to bite him in the ass.

The Obama strategy against Sarah Palin backfired, immensely.. as Americans recognized Obama's tactics from the primary.

Remember "Not ready to lead" is the same campaign Clinton ran, and her voters are coming over to the McCain side everyday.
 
2008-09-10 10:41:40 AM  
JimmyTheHutt: If, right now, with everything going on in our country and the world, your big issue is your ability to keep your handgun, there is nothing way to argue otherwise.

What about the left's single issue of abortion rights?

While I do think single issue voters on both sides are myopic, I don't think they are idiots.
 
2008-09-10 10:41:51 AM  

Gunther: dittybopper: The reason I don't want Obama to win is that I am a gun owner, and part of the 'Great American Gun Culture'(tm), and I just can't support a person who spent several years on the board of directors of the notoriously anti-gun Joyce Foundation.

You do know BO has spoken in support of the second amendment, right? And that Democrats in general have been moving away from the "anti-gun" position for the last ten years or so?


Come on.

You expect me to believe that a man who supported banning semiautomatics, who supported complete handgun bans in Chicago and DC, and was part of a small group of people who helped to funnel *MILLIONS* of dollars to various anti-gun groups is all of a sudden a Second Amendment supporter?

Do I have "STUPID" written on my forehead or something?

But hey, lets look at his current voting record in the Senate:

He voted *FOR* SA1615, which would have banned most rifle ammunition because of it's ability to penetrate body armor. That includes most hunting calibers, like the .30'06 Springfield, the .308 Winchester and derivatives, and the venerable .30-30 Winchester. Yes, SA1615 would have banned the old 'Thirty Thirty', depending on what standard of body armor exemplar they chose.

He voted *AGAINST* S.397, which protects gun manufacturers from lawsuits stemming from the third party criminal misuse of their legal products. After all, what good is having the Second Amendment if no companies are willing to manufacture guns because of the risk they will get sued because a criminal misused one? Do we sue Chevy, Ford, Anheiser-Busch, and Coors when a drunk driver kills people?

His continuing support for local handgun bans, including the ones in Chicago and and it's suburbs, shows that he is no friend of gun owners, no matter *WHAT* his supporters might say.

If, indeed, as you say the Democrats have recognized that gun control is a losing proposition for them, outside of hyper-urban communities, then why is this in their 2008 National Platform:

Firearms
We recognize that the right to bear arms is an important part of the American tradition,
and we will preserve Americans' continued Second Amendment right to own and use
firearms. We believe that the right to own firearms is subject to reasonable regulation, but
we know that what works in Chicago may not work in Cheyenne1. We can work together
to enact and enforce common-sense laws and improvements, like closing the gun show
loophole
2, improving our background check system and reinstating the assault weapons
ban
3, so that guns do not fall into the hands of terrorists4 or criminals. Acting responsibly
and with respect for differing views on this issue, we can both protect the constitutional
right to bear arms and keep our communities and our children safe.


1. This is a racist code phrase, that basically says "Don't worry middle aged rural white guys, we aren't going to take away your duck gun or deer rifle. We just want to keep guns out of the hands of BLACK people."

2. In other words, preventing you from selling your private property without getting government approval first. The same laws that apply outside a gun show apply inside, there is no "loophole".

3. This is "ban" that died a deserved death: It didn't reduce or prevent crime, and all the manufacturers did was change cosmetic features with no effect on functionality to comply with it. The only true way to ban "assault weapons" is to ban semiautomatics, which is a non-starter. Everything else is like banning racing stripes and spoilers on cars.

4. Generally, terrorists don't get their guns at gun stores or gun shows, and they generally don't bother to buy them legally here, nor would they. Go ahead and google "Gun shops of Peshawar".
 
2008-09-10 10:42:40 AM  

McCainDemocrat: Imagine that...

Obama's sexist primary campaign against Hillary Clinton has come around to bite him in the ass.

The Obama strategy against Sarah Palin backfired, immensely.. as Americans recognized Obama's tactics from the primary.

Remember "Not ready to lead" is the same campaign Clinton ran, and her voters are coming over to the McCain side everyday.


How was his campaign sexist? Her crying was the only thing sexist and I disike Obama the politician.
 
2008-09-10 10:43:35 AM  

Scratch Meany: generaltimmy: FuriousGeorge945: I'm still not all that worried about Obama's chances in November because I think the debates will change everything. All the fact checking and debunking of McCain's bullshiat that goes under the radar can be brought out front and center by Obama in a venue that the press will have to cover in detail, and he seems ready to do this. Since the convention he's definitely taken a much sharper approach to addressing McCain in his stump speeches, but you don't hear much about that right now. I think a lot of casual observers are going to be very surprised by what they see when the debates come around, and the media is going to have to address the ways McCain has lied and flip flopped.

Also, I think the structure of the debates really benefits Obama. The first debate on Sept. 26th is about foreign policy, and I'm sure people will see it as his weakest because a disappointingly large percentage of the country thinks you're an effete liberal pussy if you don't want to bomb every country that looks at us funny. The third debate on Oct 15th, the last head to head meeting of these two just a few short weeks before election day, is all about domestic policies and the economy. This strongly favors Obama by most accounts and will give him an opportunity to better frame McCain's idea of "change" as continuing almost all of the same domestic policies of the last 8 years. It'll be a good final impression for him before the voting begins.

/possibly being too optimistic about the media doing its farking job
//still think he'll win handily

I know people shoul dnot underestimate Obama, but all I keep hearing is remove his teleprompter and he is dead in the water. W will see.
I worry about this too. This is solely my opinion, but both Obama and Biden seem to be intelligent men who, when asked a question off the cuff have several ideas they want to voice that get logjammed on the way to their mouths, causing them to either hesitate or (occasionally) jumble up what they are trying to say. When they're writing speeches they have a chance to organize their thoughts and flesh out their ideas. the opposing side on the other hand, seems to just have to stick to USA USA USA, Jesus Jesus Jesus, Drill Drill Drill and POW POW POW for their answers. perhaps there is something to be said for simplification, but I want my candidate to be aware that we live in a world of grey and nuances and there is no such thing as a cookie-cutter solution to any problem.I'm really hoping that Obama and Biden are drilling and practicing for these debates so, when asked about any of the issues they at least have an outline in their head to control the flow of ideas and make it managable.


FunkOut: mekki: fortean chicken: Most of the women I know now like Palin, based off how they feel about her. They never even bring up where she stands on issues.

My opinion of women as a whole just took a massive dive. We never should have given them the right to vote.

Hey, these idiots don't speak for the rest of us women. We know a pandering ploy when we see one. Many of us are insulted by Palin. Even more so since she doesn't seem to want to face the cameras unless she has full control.

She is Cheney in a skirt.

Yeah, when I see Palin I want to KHITBASH. Then again, I'm a Canadian with anarchist leanings and a cupboard full of soybeans. I can't really expect to have any other reaction to people like Palin. As a mother, I find it appalling that she named her Down's baby "Trig". That's the kind of name you give a Jack Russell Terrier.

I blame chick flicks and Disney films. Enough with this "just follow your heart and drop your brain in the trashcan" business. Why is critical thinking so undervalued? Enough with the warm fuzzies, just look at the facts.


You DO have to communicate on the level of your target audience, the average american has an eighth grade reading level. They understand DRILL DRILL DRILL and POW POW POW and JESUS JESUS JESUS.

Obama needs to cut the nuances and go straight for his basic message. IRAQ IRAQ IRAQ, JOBS JOBS JOBS.

/pew pew pew
 
2008-09-10 10:44:46 AM  
You know what is really surprising about Obama's pig comment. Pigs are reviled by those in the Mooslim faith. By calling her a Pig, he was saying that she was a filthy beast...code words to his suporters in detroit and Saudi Arabia.
 
2008-09-10 10:44:52 AM  

generaltimmy: McCainDemocrat: Imagine that...

Obama's sexist primary campaign against Hillary Clinton has come around to bite him in the ass.

The Obama strategy against Sarah Palin backfired, immensely.. as Americans recognized Obama's tactics from the primary.

Remember "Not ready to lead" is the same campaign Clinton ran, and her voters are coming over to the McCain side everyday.

How was his campaign sexist? Her crying was the only thing sexist and I disike Obama the politician.


Because it's easier to claim it was sexist than to admit her campaign got it's butt kicked by his campaign.

/was going to vote in primary for Clinton, changed to Obama
 
2008-09-10 10:45:01 AM  

Munchausen's Proxy:
While I do think single issue voters on both sides are myopic, I don't think they are idiots.


On that, we would have to disagree. Willing to suspend everything else for ONE issue, and a particularly insubstantial issue when weighted against everything else, is an act of stupidity and ignorance.
 
2008-09-10 10:45:18 AM  
Obama just lied to my face on national TV.
 
2008-09-10 10:46:04 AM  
Was it Elanor Clift who said that they were laughing in her newsroom at McCain picking Palin? Wonder if they still think it is funny.
 
2008-09-10 10:47:06 AM  
Obama was condescending to women.. here's some examples of his sexism.

"1) Obama saying Hillary is "likable enough" during the NH debate and looking down his nose at her constantly.

2) Obama tells female factory worker in Allentown- "You look like you might be a dancer... You're gorgeous."

3) "Sen. Barack Obama approached first overflow in the parking lot outside of the Scranton town hall, and immediately went to Denise Mercuri, a pharmacist from Dunmore who was wearing a Hillary Clinton button. She held an Obama button in her hand, and he asked what he needed to do to get her to wear his instead of his rival's. "What do I need to do? Do you want me on my knees?" he asked. He then conceded, keeping with his flirty trend of the day (see earlier report), "I'll give you a kiss."

4) Jake Tapper's list of Obama's sexist references to Clinton such as "You challenge the status quo and suddenly the claws come out." and Language such as "when she's feeling down" "periodically" she "launches attacks."

5) Called a female reporter "sweetie" while ducking her question."

And now Obama has referred to Sarah Palin as a pig..

Obama must be steamed that he hasn't produced a male heir. So now he's taking out his beef with women on the campaign trail.
 
2008-09-10 10:48:08 AM  
The Icelander: So Obama should come out and say "See! The surge worked! We won! Let's bring our boys home!" Even if it isn't true, the Heartlanders will eat it up and vote for him.

If he could sell that, it might work. He would need to work in something like "I was against the surge, but our service men and women rose to the task to prove me and their detractors wrong and that nothing is out of their realm of possibility. I will remember that as we march on Afganistan to put the Taliban in the ground" He needs to sell it.

It is a fine line between eating shiat for opposing the surge and making the mistake work in his favor - even greater respect for the unimaginable abilities of the armed forces - or something like that.

/I am not joking or sarcastic.
 
2008-09-10 10:48:27 AM  

McCainDemocrat: Obama must be steamed that he hasn't produced a male heir. So now he's taking out his beef with women on the campaign trail.


This explains a LOT about George W. Bush.
 
2008-09-10 10:48:27 AM  

Peter von Nostrand:
/was going to vote in primary for Clinton, changed to Obama


Such bravery to jump on the bandwagon.
 
2008-09-10 10:48:53 AM  

stpickrell: "Curious -- which of these do you yourself believe in?"


None, really. Activist government and regulation are relative terms. Sometimes the government needs to do things, other times it should leave things alone. It's all a matter of circumstance, IMO. Some commonsense regulation of human activity is inseperable from civilization itself, and it is a fine line between too much and too little. I don't believe in God, nor do I disbelieve in God. The supernatural is intrinsically unknowable. The SCOTUS has spoken on the 2nd Amendment - as well as on abortion - so I think these issues are irrelevant. As to open borders, I don't think the issue of carrying capacity has been properly addressed in regard to that issue, and favor a moratorium on all immigration. Both parties have dropped the ball on immigration.

Listen: I'm not advocating any of these positions, I'm trying to describe reality. Just because one might disagree with the values of these people does not mean they are irrelevant or nonexistant. These traditionalists exist. There are millions and millions of them. Amazingly enough, they are not necessarily bad people.

I thought the most telling line in Palin's acceptance speech was this:

"Al Qaeda terrorists still plot to inflict catastrophic harm on America - he's worried that someone won't read them their rights?"

This grabbed the traditionalists right in their guts. These are people who have no second thoughts about the atomic bombing of Hiroshima, who shed no tears over collateral damage, and whose instinctive response to 9-11 was to go kick the living sh*t out of those responsible and their fellow travelers. They saw the removal of Saddam Hussein as a worthy end in itself, regardless the cost or consequences. Their view on these matters is not nuanced, and Obama's popularity overseas is not a plus in their minds - in fact, it makes them doubly suspicious of Obama. Keep in mind that these people are by-and-large the ones who actually go fight America's wars. They see themselves as the guardians of a free America, and couldn't care less about the opinions of foreigners and disdain any hand-wringing in war time. They may represent a shrinking demographic, but but they are still a focused demographic. The Democratic Party can't seem to figure out how to approach these people, and that fact puts Obama's election in doubt.
 
2008-09-10 10:50:11 AM  

Chester the Snake: Peter von Nostrand:
/was going to vote in primary for Clinton, changed to Obama

Such bravery to jump on the bandwagon.


What an intelligent comment, you sir are a genius.
 
2008-09-10 10:50:17 AM  
Republicans will follow their candidate right into the ovens wont they?

Any NYZooMan you already tried that tactic in 3 or 4 other threads...
 
2008-09-10 10:51:28 AM  

Edsel: dittybopper: In other words, it sounds like Obama was calling Palin a pig, which is a nasty thing to call a woman.

Except he wasn't talking about Palin at all, he was talking about McCain's policy shifts.

The Palin association is something that the McCain campaign fed the media, and the media bit on it.


That's entirely plausible.

That doesn't change the fact that even if it's true, it's something that can and was spun quite easily by the McCain campaign.
 
2008-09-10 10:51:33 AM  
JimmyTheHutt: On that, we would have to disagree.

That's fine, and I know what you are driving at and agree with you on that. My initial point was that disagreeing does not make either one an idiot.
 
2008-09-10 10:51:41 AM  

canyoneer: I thought the most telling line in Palin's acceptance speech was this:

"Al Qaeda terrorists still plot to inflict catastrophic harm on America - he's worried that someone won't read them their rights?"


I also thought it was telling, in that it reinforced how little understanding Sarah Palin has of the Constitution, due process, or the rule of law.
 
2008-09-10 10:52:04 AM  
Some men just fear women being equal. They fear it when it's Hillary Clinton or Sarah Palin.

Women can strike a blow against sexism with a vote for McCain.
 
2008-09-10 10:52:17 AM  

HighOnCraic: I was asking a rhetorical question; I don't think anyone can say exactly when life begins, and I think that was Obama's point as well.


Oh, somehow it was lost over the internets.
 
2008-09-10 10:52:39 AM  

JimmyTheHutt: Munchausen's Proxy:
While I do think single issue voters on both sides are myopic, I don't think they are idiots.

On that, we would have to disagree. Willing to suspend everything else for ONE issue, and a particularly insubstantial issue when weighted against everything else, is an act of stupidity and ignorance.


We see people do it on the abortion issue, though. And I say this even though I'm pro-abortion.

/I'd say "pro-choice" but it sounds weasely.
//And I'm a bit more likely to have a gun than have an abortion.
 
2008-09-10 10:53:31 AM  

dittybopper: Edsel: dittybopper: In other words, it sounds like Obama was calling Palin a pig, which is a nasty thing to call a woman.

Except he wasn't talking about Palin at all, he was talking about McCain's policy shifts.

The Palin association is something that the McCain campaign fed the media, and the media bit on it.

That's entirely plausible.

That doesn't change the fact that even if it's true, it's something that can and was spun quite easily by the McCain campaign.


Again -- only because the media bought their narrative and decided they could make a story out of it.

Listening to a slightly fuller clip makes it clear that there's no frame of reference to Palin there, unless one tries to make the (unprovable) argument that he was invoking lipstick as a code word for Palin.
 
2008-09-10 10:54:32 AM  
McCainDemocrat: Women can strike a blow against sexism with a vote for McCain.

i221.photobucket.comView Full Size
 
2008-09-10 10:54:49 AM  

McCainDemocrat: Some men just fear women being equal. They fear it when it's Hillary Clinton or Sarah Palin.

Women can strike a blow against sexism with a vote for McCain.


ZOMG.. You're being sexist by using that word!!1!ELEVENTY
 
2008-09-10 10:56:38 AM  

Edsel: canyoneer: I thought the most telling line in Palin's acceptance speech was this:

"Al Qaeda terrorists still plot to inflict catastrophic harm on America - he's worried that someone won't read them their rights?"

I also thought it was telling, in that it reinforced how little understanding Sarah Palin has of the Constitution, due process, or the rule of law.


Edsel, at some point, defending sociopaths becomes a losing proposition.
 
2008-09-10 10:57:30 AM  
dittybopper: a man who supported banning semiautomatics

[citation needed]

He voted *FOR* SA1615, which would have banned most rifle ammunition

that's a distortion of the bill, which gave the attorney general the ability to ban ammunition designed to pierce body armor, not just ban every type of ammunition that can pierce body armor.

This is a racist code phrase, that basically says "Don't worry middle aged rural white guys, we aren't going to take away your duck gun or deer rifle. We just want to keep guns out of the hands of BLACK people."

OK, now you're coming across as a little nutty... Make that very nutty.

I'm not a big fan of gun control laws, but is that seriously your only concern for this election? You don't care about anything as long as you get to keep your guns?

Surely there's some other issues that affect you.
 
2008-09-10 10:58:00 AM  

Ali_the_Cat: I'm a white woman and I am with Obama!


I hope you Obamabots like the sound of this, cause as soon as he becomes president, your wives and daughters are gonna start looking at black men a little differently. Don't say I didn't warn you.
 
2008-09-10 10:58:59 AM  

stpickrell: Edsel: canyoneer: I thought the most telling line in Palin's acceptance speech was this:

"Al Qaeda terrorists still plot to inflict catastrophic harm on America - he's worried that someone won't read them their rights?"

I also thought it was telling, in that it reinforced how little understanding Sarah Palin has of the Constitution, due process, or the rule of law.

Edsel, at some point, defending sociopaths becomes a losing proposition.


Sociopaths... like cab drivers and assorted random citizens held without probable cause, evidence, or ever actually being charged with a crime?

I'm sorry, but there is NO POINT at which defending civil liberties becomes a "losing proposition". What a pathetic argument that is.
 
2008-09-10 10:59:28 AM  
You dumbasses.

Don't you get it? There are people out there that hate us, no matter who's in charge. For many years, they saw that they could hit us (Iran hostages, Kobar towers, Lebanon Marine Barracks, U.S.S. Cole, Somalia, etc.) make us bleed, and then we picked up and RAN. The most reaction they'd get is a few cruise missiles shot into some desert somewhere.

Osama bin Laden references this in his videos, concluding that we were a "weak horse." His beliefs led him to conceive the 9/11 attacks. He thought he could punch us and we wouldn't swing back.

Oops. There goes Afghanistan.

Then there's Iraq. The regional bully. Led by an unstable dictator who passionately hated the U.S., funded terrorists, attacked his neighbors, used chemical weapons/WMDs, made a mockery of the U.N. and defied all attempts by the U.S. to reign him in.

So, we make good on the U.N.'s empty promises of "action" and eliminate the Saddam threat. This leads to several positive things, including Libya giving up their nuclear program voluntarily, rather than being "volunteered" for regime change.

Of course, Saddam and his WMDs (Hell, Saddam WAS a WMD) were only half the equation. The other half is the cesspool that passes for middle eastern politics/government. For years, Arab and MIddle eastern governments have blamed their problems on the west/Israel. Proving to them that a functioning, prosperous democracy is possible in Iraq could change that dynamic. We began to see the fruits of this in Lebanon and other bright spots.

Of course, the jihadis, the Baathists in Syria, the Iranians, etc., are not keen on this, to put it mildly. Proving Iraq can work is a major setback for people like them. They want the status quo back...they hit us, we run away. We can't afford to go back to that dynamic. We have to win and prove them wrong.

There are plenty of reasons to support winning in Iraq. That you idiots seem to be parroting The One's pathetic "clinging to their guns and religion" line about "rednecks" and "rural folk" shows how out of touch you are with America, and reality.

What a bunch of sheep you are. Suck it.

Sincerely,

America's Sweetheart: Drill Sergeant Poopypants

P.S. Obama should know a pig when he sees one. After all, he has always preferred pork over people. That's why he voted twice to for the bridge to nowhere, instead of reallocating those funds to hurricane Katrina victims. That's the truth. You just think it's hell.
 
2008-09-10 11:00:05 AM  
Not that I have to pacify you, Drill Sergeant, or anyone else, but I am in fact at home raising my kids...I'm a stay at home mom, and that was my choice. I'll never vote for a candidate who believes choices about my body or any other personal liberty, should be taken away.

done.
 
2008-09-10 11:00:45 AM  
And once again, the arrogance builds to a crescendo.

Obama, protect me from your followers.
 
2008-09-10 11:01:26 AM  

Edsel: "I also thought it was telling, in that it reinforced how little understanding Sarah Palin has of the Constitution, due process, or the rule of law."


Well, good for you. Too bad for you that millions of traditionalists don't think American constitutional protections extend to foreign-born terrorist revolutionaries. You can split hairs on that all day long, and traditionalist Americans will just tune you out like white noise while dismissing you as a candy-assed hand-wringer. That's how they see the matter, Edsel.
 
2008-09-10 11:03:06 AM  

McCainDemocrat: Obama was condescending to women.. here's some examples of his sexism.

"1) Obama saying Hillary is "likable enough" during the NH debate and looking down his nose at her constantly.

2) Obama tells female factory worker in Allentown- "You look like you might be a dancer... You're gorgeous."

3) "Sen. Barack Obama approached first overflow in the parking lot outside of the Scranton town hall, and immediately went to Denise Mercuri, a pharmacist from Dunmore who was wearing a Hillary Clinton button. She held an Obama button in her hand, and he asked what he needed to do to get her to wear his instead of his rival's. "What do I need to do? Do you want me on my knees?" he asked. He then conceded, keeping with his flirty trend of the day (see earlier report), "I'll give you a kiss."

4) Jake Tapper's list of Obama's sexist references to Clinton such as "You challenge the status quo and suddenly the claws come out." and Language such as "when she's feeling down" "periodically" she "launches attacks."

5) Called a female reporter "sweetie" while ducking her question."

And now Obama has referred to Sarah Palin as a pig..

Obama must be steamed that he hasn't produced a male heir. So now he's taking out his beef with women on the campaign trail.


1. That is because he is an uppity Community Organizer.

Maybe he is his fathers' (apostrophe is correct!). I think Hillary ran a more sexist campaign 18,000,000 cracks. Her campaign was also more racist as Bill was retarded in SC.

Your comments have been noted
 
2008-09-10 11:05:22 AM  
generaltimmy: Maybe he is his fathers' (apostrophe is correct!)

Obama has more than one father?
 
2008-09-10 11:08:24 AM  
"These are people who have no second thoughts about the atomic bombing of Hiroshima, who shed no tears over collateral damage, and whose instinctive response to 9-11 was to go kick the living sh*t out of those responsible and their fellow travelers. They saw the removal of Saddam Hussein as a worthy end in itself, regardless the cost or consequences. Their view on these matters is not nuanced, and Obama's popularity overseas is not a plus in their minds - in fact, it makes them doubly suspicious of Obama. Keep in mind that these people are by-and-large the ones who actually go fight America's wars. They see themselves as the guardians of a free America, and couldn't care less about the opinions of foreigners and disdain any hand-wringing in war time. They may represent a shrinking demographic, but but they are still a focused demographic. The Democratic Party can't seem to figure out how to approach these people, and that fact puts Obama's election in doubt."

If Truman doesn't nuke Japan til it glowed, I am never born along with hundreds of millions of other Americans. I won't go into the details of why but it's an indisputable fact. Truman's decision saved hundreds of thousands of American males from certain death trying to subdue the Japanese mainland. War and global struggles are a zero sum game. Nothing nuanced about survival.
 
2008-09-10 11:09:13 AM  

Munchausen's Proxy: generaltimmy: Maybe he is his fathers' (apostrophe is correct!)

Obama has more than one father?


It was a gaffe he made in a recent speech. Not an issue, but funny
http://www.break.com/index/a-moment-for-the-history-books1.html
 
2008-09-10 11:12:24 AM  
John McCain keeps talking about 'victory with honor' in Iraq, but just like the Bush/Cheney administration before him, does not give a clear definition of victory.
 
2008-09-10 11:12:46 AM  

canyoneer: Edsel: "I also thought it was telling, in that it reinforced how little understanding Sarah Palin has of the Constitution, due process, or the rule of law."

Well, good for you. Too bad for you that millions of traditionalists don't think American constitutional protections extend to foreign-born terrorist revolutionaries. You can split hairs on that all day long, and traditionalist Americans will just tune you out like white noise while dismissing you as a candy-assed hand-wringer. That's how they see the matter, Edsel.


Millions of "traditionalists" (love the new buzzword) think a lot of stupid things. The best that one can do is to try and get the other states to vote for you and pick off a "traditionalist" state or two.
 
2008-09-10 11:13:12 AM  

sunshine_mcbihface: Okay. I know this is probably horrible of me, but whatever, I'm a terrible person. If McCain wins, I hope this country goes down the shiatter, and we split into separate countries. Except Buffalo...that gets absorbed by Ontario. :-)


Hey, don't pass your garbage onto us.
 
2008-09-10 11:13:18 AM  

generaltimmy: I know people shoul dnot underestimate Obama, but all I keep hearing is remove his teleprompter and he is dead in the water. W will see.


When he's thinking of stuff to fill in the spaces with, yes, he is a little bit of a stutterer. But we're talking about a professor here, someone that is used to speaking in front of groups and when it comes down to talking about policies, laws, and his other strengths he's fine. I have no doubt he will perform just fine during the debates, all he has to do is be himself and the moment McCain becomes himself you will see a lot of turn arounds on peoples opinions of them both.
 
2008-09-10 11:13:26 AM  

Softens_hands_while_you_do_the_dishes: "These are people who have no second thoughts about the atomic bombing of Hiroshima, who shed no tears over collateral damage, and whose instinctive response to 9-11 was to go kick the living sh*t out of those responsible and their fellow travelers. They saw the removal of Saddam Hussein as a worthy end in itself, regardless the cost or consequences. Their view on these matters is not nuanced, and Obama's popularity overseas is not a plus in their minds - in fact, it makes them doubly suspicious of Obama. Keep in mind that these people are by-and-large the ones who actually go fight America's wars. They see themselves as the guardians of a free America, and couldn't care less about the opinions of foreigners and disdain any hand-wringing in war time. They may represent a shrinking demographic, but but they are still a focused demographic. The Democratic Party can't seem to figure out how to approach these people, and that fact puts Obama's election in doubt."

If Truman doesn't nuke Japan til it glowed, I am never born along with hundreds of millions of other Americans. I won't go into the details of why but it's an indisputable fact. Truman's decision saved hundreds of thousands of American males from certain death trying to subdue the Japanese mainland. War and global struggles are a zero sum game. Nothing nuanced about survival.


I would take this posting on point by point, but it was so full owf WRONG my head exploded and I feel it would be prudent to seek immediate medical attention.
 
2008-09-10 11:13:43 AM  

FunkOut: My mother's American and I recently discovered she likes Palin based on the premise that 1) Palin is supposed to be a downhome country girl and 2) Palin's a mommy. Up until now I thought my mother was fairly left-wing. I tried to tell her a few of the things Palin stood for and my mom thinks they're all just smear attacks. And apparently Obama is bad because he's "coming out of big city Chicago". I had no idea cities were evil and being in the country made people good. Or that being a mother made someone saintly. Palin reminds me of those psycho biatchy cheerleader girls who bullied people and made a big deal out of being a tough girl in high school. In particular, the one who led that pray by the flagpole thing even though she was sleeping with one of the male gym teachers.


FunkOut, I know you love your mother so I won't say anything derogatory about her. But do your American neighbors a favor and lock her up on election day!

Thanks.
 
2008-09-10 11:14:24 AM  
generaltimmy: It was a gaffe he made in a recent speech. Not an issue, but funny

I saw that but did not make the connection. I think that guy is never going to live that down. Every Christmas party - "Hey, watch this!"
 
2008-09-10 11:14:57 AM  
And furthermore if Truman doesn't bring the Pacific war to a speedy conclusion and race occupation troops into Japan, that country would have been partitioned as was Europe with the Russians occupying the Northern half. Russia was moving in on Japan to open a northern front and try and sieze half the island chain until Truman cock blocked them with the bomb.

Democrats as presently constituted aren't fit to lead. They can lead in the Senate and vote for gay marriage legal rights or some shiat but they have no business being in the business of protecting my family from foreign and domestic threats.
 
2008-09-10 11:15:50 AM  
Obama seems akin to putting a brand new 2LT in charge of a division...
 
2008-09-10 11:16:27 AM  

Hobodeluxe: Pics of gangsta wannabes in Alska


Please post that in every single thread that has to do with Palins kids!
 
2008-09-10 11:17:21 AM  

Softens_hands_while_you_do_the_dishes: If Truman doesn't nuke Japan til it glowed, I am never born along with hundreds of millions of other Americans. I won't go into the details of why but it's an indisputable fact.


Not true at all
 
2008-09-10 11:18:43 AM  

priestrape: give credit where credit is due - the republicans were down to their last strike, and they hit a grandslam double and will probably get picked off trying to steal third.


FTFY!
 
2008-09-10 11:18:46 AM  
Scratch Meany: I would take this posting on point by point, but it was so full owf WRONG my head exploded and I feel it would be prudent to seek immediate medical attention.

No, pretty much spot on. If the democrats want their vote, they need to understand what motivates those that don't live within 100 miles of an ocean. You may disagree, but that does not make it wrong. Unless, of course you were referring to his lineage, of which I would yield to the possibility that you know more of Softens_hands_while_you_do_the_dishes' parents and grand parents.
 
2008-09-10 11:19:56 AM  

Softens_hands_while_you_do_the_dishes: And furthermore if Truman doesn't bring the Pacific war to a speedy conclusion and race occupation troops into Japan, that country would have been partitioned as was Europe with the Russians occupying the Northern half. Russia was moving in on Japan to open a northern front and try and sieze half the island chain until Truman cock blocked them with the bomb.

Democrats as presently constituted aren't fit to lead. They can lead in the Senate and vote for gay marriage legal rights or some shiat but they have no business being in the business of protecting my family from foreign and domestic threats.


Truman was a Demacrat dumbass. The Republicans were pro-Nazi and opposed our intervention in WWII.

The Republicans have never demonstrated any credible international leadership. Ever. It's always been Democrats.
 
2008-09-10 11:22:54 AM  

priestrape: The lipstick remark in Palin's speech was inserted to elicit this precise response from the Democrats - the "put a pig in lipstick" joke was obvious, as was the media's response.

Since Palin got nominated, the Obama and crew have stepped on every landmine. This is just the latest.

You can question the right all you want, but they have completely taken over the momentum of this election, and nominating Palin was a masterstroke.

Our only hope now is the debate(s)


Look, I am a Republican* (though I haven't decided who to vote for) and that's flat-out idiotic.

First of all, Obama isn't even losing. Most polls are more or less even, and he still has the advantage in the electoral college.

Second of all, a million things could happen. McCain could have some horrific meltdown. Palin could, once she does some interviews & press conferences, completely turn people off. Or (much likelier than the previous two) the economy could continue to worsen, making the desire to change parties irresistible.

/Man up, Nancy.

*NOT a Fark Independent.
 
2008-09-10 11:23:00 AM  

ilambiquated: Truman was a Demacrat dumbass. The Republicans were pro-Nazi and opposed our intervention in WWII.

The Republicans have never demonstrated any credible international leadership. Ever. It's always been Democrats.


You're right to a certain extent...I wouldn't call them Pro-Nazi, but they definitely advocated staying out of WWII. They relished in the idea of isolationism and were against the "lend-lease" and "cash-and-carry" policies.

Now they all get a big boner at the thought of war...how times have changed.

/Ok, well most of them are old white men, so small boner.
 
MFL
2008-09-10 11:23:11 AM  
ilambiquated The Republicans have never demonstrated any credible international leadership. Ever. It's always been Democrats.

visitingdc.comView Full Size


blog.kir.comView Full Size


tinypic.comView Full Size
 
2008-09-10 11:23:12 AM  
ilambiquated: The Republicans have never demonstrated any credible international leadership. Ever. It's always been Democrats.

So Nixon was a democrat when he went to China? What about Reagan and the end of the cold war?

A word of warning, an absolute statement can always be defeated.
 
2008-09-10 11:23:32 AM  

stpickrell: Macaca moments, perhaps.


Obama had his Macaca moment with the "lipstick on a pig" statement, and he's going to be forgiven.

I bet that if McCain or Palin say something that might be construed as racism, the Obama people will just turn the other cheek & take the high road about it.
 
2008-09-10 11:24:17 AM  
Obama, spare ME the phony gutless apology.

You OWN AUDIENCE knew exactly what you meant.
Have the BALLS to admit you took a swipe. Chickenshiat.
 
2008-09-10 11:24:30 AM  

FunkOut: My mother's American and I recently discovered she likes Palin based on the premise that 1) Palin is supposed to be a downhome country girl and 2) Palin's a mommy. Up until now I thought my mother was fairly left-wing. I tried to tell her a few of the things Palin stood for and my mom thinks they're all just smear attacks. And apparently Obama is bad because he's "coming out of big city Chicago". I had no idea cities were evil and being in the country made people good. Or that being a mother made someone saintly. Palin reminds me of those psycho biatchy cheerleader girls who bullied people and made a big deal out of being a tough girl in high school. In particular, the one who led that pray by the flagpole thing even though she was sleeping with one of the male gym teachers.

I can't decide who to vote for in the Canadian election, I mean, there's Neocon Robot, French Muppet, Big Moustache Mouth, and Ignored Green Party Lady.


It's senility. My mother was a devout Democrat during my childhood and once grounded one of my sisters for entertaining the idea of being a Republican. Now she's moved to Utah, had her stomach stapled, divorced my father after 39 years, taken up with a bunch of LDS freaks, and thinks the Republicans and their strong family values should stay in office forever. This is, of course, in between her imaginary internship at Princeton University and her regular online conversations where she pretends to be a 22-year old stripper with an identical twin dying of brain cancer.


/It would be funnier if it weren't all true. :-(
 
2008-09-10 11:24:33 AM  

Roo1013: Not that I have to pacify you, Drill Sergeant, or anyone else, but I am in fact at home raising my kids...I'm a stay at home mom, and that was my choice. I'll never vote for a candidate who believes choices about my body or any other personal liberty, should be taken away.

done.


//close thread
 
2008-09-10 11:25:05 AM  

Edsel: dittybopper: Edsel: dittybopper: In other words, it sounds like Obama was calling Palin a pig, which is a nasty thing to call a woman.

Except he wasn't talking about Palin at all, he was talking about McCain's policy shifts.

The Palin association is something that the McCain campaign fed the media, and the media bit on it.

That's entirely plausible.

That doesn't change the fact that even if it's true, it's something that can and was spun quite easily by the McCain campaign.

Again -- only because the media bought their narrative and decided they could make a story out of it.


The media *THRIVES* on controversy. It drives ratings, which is how they make their money. Of *COURSE* they are going to buy it, just like they've bought into some of the attacks on Palin and McCain. Obama should be smart enough to expect it, and act accordingly (as should McCain, Biden, and Palin).


Listening to a slightly fuller clip makes it clear that there's no frame of reference to Palin there, unless one tries to make the (unprovable) argument that he was invoking lipstick as a code word for Palin.

Well, given that Palin is a self-described bulldog with lipstick, and she just called herself that less than 2 weeks ago, it's not *THAT* far of a stretch. I'm not saying that is what Obama intended, I'm sure it isn't. Having said that, what you intend to say and how it sounds to others can often be quite different things.
 
2008-09-10 11:26:32 AM  
Anyway, the US will get what it ultimately deserves. You've got a great team in Obama/Biden. But if you want to elect a mildly senile president who still thinks the Cold War is going on, and a Christian Fundamentalist who believes that Earth is 6000 years old and man and dinosaurs walked together, have at it. If the US voters fall for it and vote for McCain/Palin, the majority of voters will have succeeded in voting based on fear and not based on hope.

We're having an election up in Canada right now. I wish I could vote for Obama, because your country sure as hell doesn't deserve him.
 
2008-09-10 11:26:50 AM  

Munchausen's Proxy: ilambiquated: The Republicans have never demonstrated any credible international leadership. Ever. It's always been Democrats.

So Nixon was a democrat when he went to China? What about Reagan and the end of the cold war?

A word of warning, an absolute statement can always be defeated.


Reagan didn't end the cold war. Gorbachov did.

You know who esle thinkshe ended the Cold War?
downwiththeinternet.files.wordpress.comView Full Size


Another delusional maniac
 
2008-09-10 11:26:55 AM  
What I fear the most in the coming weeks, is the fact that when the media does ask Palin questions, they won't be hard hitting questions, they'll be soft on her.

The Obama campaign has to stamp out any chance of the McCain campaign's use of "sexism" as loose as they have already done so.

Why isn't anyone getting up in arms at the fact that McCain's ad is spinning Obama's policy to teach kindergardners about sexual predators into "ZOMG, OBAMA WANTS TO TEACH SEX TO LITTLE CHILDREN!"???

/Very disappointed in McCain and the Republicans, I honestly thought this election would be over intellectual discourse, how naive of me.
 
2008-09-10 11:27:00 AM  

FarktheHeraldAngelSings: My mother was a devout Democrat during my childhood and once grounded one of my sisters for entertaining the idea of being a Republican. Now she's moved to Utah, had her stomach stapled, divorced my father after 39 years, taken up with a bunch of LDS freaks, and thinks the Republicans and their strong family values should stay in office forever. This is, of course, in between her imaginary internship at Princeton University and her regular online conversations where she pretends to be a 22-year old stripper with an identical twin dying of brain cancer.


/It would be funnier if it weren't all true. :-(


Do you still have her number?
 
2008-09-10 11:28:05 AM  
Edsel

"Traditionalist" seems like a handy shorthand for this voting block, which is actually quite diverse.
 
2008-09-10 11:29:04 AM  
Wasn't it "hey, where the white women women at?'
 
2008-09-10 11:29:45 AM  
Palin's speaking live right now. I think McCain's plan to beat us into submission using her nasal, pinched voice and condescending-3rd-grade-teacher delivery is working.

Folks, PLEASE get out there and vote away this travesty of a ticket.
 
2008-09-10 11:29:46 AM  
ilambiquated: Reagan didn't end the cold war. Gorbachov did.

Really? To most Gorbachov did the only thing he could and not get in the way. The USSR could not keep up with the military budget Reagan implemented for the US.

But that is a discussion for another thread.
 
2008-09-10 11:30:25 AM  

NYZooMan: Obama, spare ME the phony gutless apology.

You OWN AUDIENCE knew exactly what you meant.
Have the BALLS to admit you took a swipe. Chickenshiat.


You're just proving that the McCain campaign can't attack Obama on issues, but just spins.

Why can't Palin admit that she was FOR the bridge to nowhere instead of always saying that she told congress "thanks, but no thanks" like the trite liar she is?

Why can't Palin admit that she had a hand in the firing of her ex brother-in-law?
 
2008-09-10 11:31:49 AM  
Palin Dodges Tough Questions About Existence of "Alaska"

By Elizabeth Bumiller, New York Times, Wednesday, September 3, 2008; A1

Media Bubble, Sept. 2 - Embattled former beauty queen Sarah Palin* continued to wilt yesterday under the pressure of numerous fair, evenhanded media questions regarding the alleged state of "Alaska."

Palin has claimed to be "governor" of the legendary northern land mass, which, while heretofore undiscovered by explorers, was once rumored to contain vast expanses rich with oil, gold, and "eski-mos." Palin first made the "Alaska" claim during an Aug. 29 public appearance alongside elderly, mean-looking cancer victim John McCain.

McCain, a white man with even whiter hair, has long publicly blocked efforts by Barack Obama, a youthful black man with a certain indefinable aura about him, to move into Obama's new house. Palin, also white-skinned, has been linked to the McCain offensive.

After four days of telling silence from the McCain camp, Palin finally deigned to reappear in public yesterday. In a followup press conference, Palin, who is a girl, lashed out at the media. "Listen to me: Alaska. Is. A. State. Seriously. The 49th state, in fact. Way up north there. What, did somebody go around your newsrooms and hide all the maps underneath the ethics manuals? Or are you idiots just completely insane?"

Shaking her head in a transparent attempt to feign exasperation, Palin - who is perhaps not as pretty as she thinks she is - then left the podium without answering followup questions regarding her plagiarism of CBS's Northern Exposure. Internet reaction to the unfit mother's unhinged rant was swift. Andrew Sullivan, right-wing blogger for The Atlantic, saw Palin's comments as a major misstep. "She's working the refs. This is what they do. Sure, blame the media. Is it their fault she's too chicken to back up these suspicious claims?"

He added: "Look, I'm willing to entertain the idea that there really is a place called 'Alaska.' We've all heard the old wives' tales, and I've dreamed about such a rugged, outdoorsy paradise since I was about 13 or 14. But why is she so afraid to give us some proof? I mean, I've never been there, have you?"

Yukon Cornelius could not be reached for comment.

Update: After consultation with the Association of American Geographers and several DC-area kindergarten students, the Times can now report that many current world maps contain a small area in the northwest corner of North America labeled "Alaska." Palin's relationship with the mapmaking industry is currently under investigation.

*Real name undetermined at press time
 
2008-09-10 11:33:21 AM  

canyoneer: Edsel

"Traditionalist" seems like a handy shorthand for this voting block, which is actually quite diverse.


Diverse? Yeah.

I hear they like BOTH kinds of music.

Country AND Western.

/Blues Bros. FTW
 
2008-09-10 11:34:39 AM  
My wife, a white republican, is voting against McCain because of all the bullshiat he has pulled this election cycle.

We both voted for him in the 2000 primaries, and feel royally duped.

/Not change you can believe in.
 
2008-09-10 11:34:52 AM  

NYZooMan: Have the BALLS to admit you took a swipe. Chickenshiat.


Read the full transcript of what he was saying, dumbass. He wasn't talking about Palin.

Softens_hands_while_you_do_the_dishes:
If Truman doesn't nuke Japan til it glowed, I am never born along with hundreds of millions of other Americans. I won't go into the details of why but it's an indisputable fact.


Oh wow, I think that actually hurt my brain. "hundreds of millions of other Americans"? really?
 
MFL
2008-09-10 11:35:41 AM  
ilambiquated Reagan didn't end the cold war. Gorbachov did.

Gorbachov "ended" the cold war because he lost.
 
2008-09-10 11:38:04 AM  

Munchausen's Proxy: ilambiquated: The Republicans have never demonstrated any credible international leadership. Ever. It's always been Democrats.

So Nixon was a democrat when he went to China? What about Reagan and the end of the cold war?

A word of warning, an absolute statement can always be defeated.


Nothing can make up for the crimes Nixon committed in Cambodia.
 
2008-09-10 11:38:16 AM  

canyoneer: Edsel

"Traditionalist" seems like a handy shorthand for this voting block, which is actually quite diverse.


When "traditionalists" believe the president can break the law, they aren't.

But kudos to you for assisting in the redefinition of traditionalist to "believer since 9/12/01". Your newspeak dictionary, show it to me.
 
2008-09-10 11:38:46 AM  
So...anyone else planning on getting really shiatfaced on Election Night? I feel it may be necessary.
 
2008-09-10 11:39:15 AM  
Hillary Clinton supporters should know that McCain called her a pig.
http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2007/10/11/mccain-clintons-healthcare-plan- is-still-a-pig/
 
2008-09-10 11:39:46 AM  

Munchausen's Proxy: ilambiquated: Reagan didn't end the cold war. Gorbachov did.

Really? To most Gorbachov did the only thing he could and not get in the way. The USSR could not keep up with the military budget Reagan implemented for the US.

But that is a discussion for another thread.


Why should they keep up with American military spending? That is a self-serving claim by a weapons lobbyist that only works on someone who has no understanding of nuclear strategy.
 
2008-09-10 11:40:59 AM  
ilambiquated: Nothing can make up for the crimes Nixon committed in Cambodia

Except for maybe the crimes committed by Pol Pot?
 
2008-09-10 11:41:15 AM  

MFL: ilambiquated Reagan didn't end the cold war. Gorbachov did.

Gorbachov "ended" the cold war because he lost.


Actually he won the war by ending it. We are still losing by pounding vast sums of money down the rathole of military spending.
 
2008-09-10 11:41:52 AM  

Munchausen's Proxy: ilambiquated: Nothing can make up for the crimes Nixon committed in Cambodia

Except for maybe the crimes committed by Pol Pot?


Who Nixon installed.
 
2008-09-10 11:43:34 AM  

Munchausen's Proxy: generaltimmy: It was a gaffe he made in a recent speech. Not an issue, but funny

I saw that but did not make the connection. I think that guy is never going to live that down. Every Christmas party - "Hey, watch this!"


There was a book and a new term devoted to "Bushisms". Obama is hailed (and is) a gifted speaker...Bush never was.
 
2008-09-10 11:43:41 AM  

legion_of_doo: stpickrell: Macaca moments, perhaps.

Obama had his Macaca moment with the "lipstick on a pig" statement, and he's going to be forgiven.

I bet that if McCain or Palin say something that might be construed as racism, the Obama people will just turn the other cheek & take the high road about it.


This comment brought to you by the same kind of person who brought you this:

talkingpointsmemo.comView Full Size


Remember, Republicans hated McCain before they loved him.
 
2008-09-10 11:44:10 AM  

Minus1Kelvin: So...anyone else planning on getting really shiatfaced on Election Night? I feel it may be necessary.


I sometimes feel as though I should get shiatfaced every night until election night too, news is killing me!
 
2008-09-10 11:44:45 AM  

ilambiquated: Munchausen's Proxy: ilambiquated: Nothing can make up for the crimes Nixon committed in Cambodia

Except for maybe the crimes committed by Pol Pot?

Who Nixon installed.


What? Pol Pot installed Pol Pot by defeating the US-backed government in a civil war.
 
2008-09-10 11:45:53 AM  

ilambiquated: Reagan didn't end the cold war. Gorbachov did.


You should look up the meeting Reagan and Gorbachov had in Reykjavik Iceland sometime and read about it.
 
2008-09-10 11:48:46 AM  

Tyee: ilambiquated: Reagan didn't end the cold war. Gorbachov did.

You should look up the meeting Reagan and Gorbachov had in Reykjavik Iceland sometime and read about it.


You're all wrong. ROCKY ENDED THE COLD WAR.
 
2008-09-10 11:49:21 AM  

Somacandra: "Diverse? Yeah. I hear they like BOTH kinds of music. Country AND Western. /Blues Bros. FTW"


You see? Your attitude is precisely why the Democratic Party always loses this demographic. It doesn't understand it, represent it, or respect it. And if Obama loses - which is about even odds at this point - the Democrats will once again stand there scratching their asses wondering what happened.
 
2008-09-10 11:50:15 AM  

keypusher: ilambiquated: Munchausen's Proxy: ilambiquated: Nothing can make up for the crimes Nixon committed in Cambodia

Except for maybe the crimes committed by Pol Pot?

Who Nixon installed.

What? Pol Pot installed Pol Pot by defeating the US-backed government in a civil war.


Well. "installed" is abit too strong I guess, but Nixon destabilized Sihanouk and replaced him with absolutely nothing. Oh and Pol Pot was backed by Nixon's BFF Mao.

Pol Pot and Mao were anti-Soviet. That's the point to the "China-card"
 
2008-09-10 11:50:38 AM  
ilambiquated: Why should they keep up with American military spending? That is a self-serving claim by a weapons lobbyist that only works on someone who has no understanding of nuclear strategy.

The problem with that line of thought is that world war III or whatever it would be called would not necessarily be a nuclear war. What the USSR wanted was victory for themselves, not, as the islamic terrorists desire, defeat for America. Big difference. For victory, they need to build up their ground, air and naval forces to compete.

The GDP discrepancy between the two countries made keeping up $ for $ a huge strain on them, plus the fact that innovation in the USSR was largely nonexistent.

One of the truly surprising things to come out of the Iraqi war was the relative ineffectiveness of the Russian tanks compared to the M1.
 
2008-09-10 11:57:48 AM  

TonnageVT: What I fear the most in the coming weeks, is the fact that when the media does ask Palin questions, they won't be hard hitting questions, they'll be soft on her.


What's even scarier to me is that the media will, for all intents and purpose, determine the outcome of whatever questioning she faces. Her speech was mostly invective and empty tough-talking rhetoric, yet it was decreed to be a success. The media praised McCain's ultra-simplistic response to the Russia-Georgia conflict, making his response politically succesful regardless of its actual merit.
 
2008-09-10 12:00:33 PM  

ilambiquated: keypusher: ilambiquated: Munchausen's Proxy: ilambiquated: Nothing can make up for the crimes Nixon committed in Cambodia

Except for maybe the crimes committed by Pol Pot?

Who Nixon installed.

What? Pol Pot installed Pol Pot by defeating the US-backed government in a civil war.

Well. "installed" is abit too strong I guess, but Nixon destabilized Sihanouk and replaced him with absolutely nothing. Oh and Pol Pot was backed by Nixon's BFF Mao.

Pol Pot and Mao were anti-Soviet. That's the point to the "China-card"


No, "installed" is flat wrong. And calling Mao Nixon's "BFF" is juvenile.

I won't argue with you, because you don't know shiat*, but you may want to check on where Sihanouk went to live after he was overthrown, and his relationship with the Khmer Rouge.

*That is, you don't know shiat about Cambodia, Mao, or US-Chinese relations in the 1970s. You may be quite knowledgeable about other topics.
 
2008-09-10 12:03:20 PM  
Hobodeluxe:
stupidcelebrities.netView Full Size

HappyDaddy: You still think those pictures were of Palin kids?

Of Bristol yeah. Her hair was lightened,heavier makeup and she was thinner but it's her. the high forehead,pronounced canine teeth,short stubby chin and eyes give it away. Her cheeks are much fatter now (as is most everything else) and her hair color is natural now, not blonde. but it's her and Levi. Although he has a different haircut now.
That's not Levi with the weed in that pic though it's another of their friends.


i367.photobucket.comView Full Size


found it on this bodybuilding forum:
http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=110373371&page=2

apparently this is his myspace
http://www.myspace.com/dc951

The plot thickens!
 
2008-09-10 12:04:36 PM  
Baby he is NOT from Havana!
 
2008-09-10 12:08:16 PM  

mcdainlcrapspoot: I hope you Obamabots like the sound of this, cause as soon as he becomes president, your wives and daughters are gonna start looking at black men a little differently. Don't say I didn't warn you.


I think a lot of people will start to look a little differently at black people, hell i think black people will start to look at themselves a little differently as well, in a good way. It's an achievement of the highest order and if he comes through and is actually able to slow down this train wreck i think the blacks in this country will have a better standing and a better attitude about themselves in the time to come. So how do you see it as a bad thing? Oh, you're being a racist pig, i see.

/Oh jeez, i called you a pig, but at least i did it directly and you don't have to twist my words around to make it that way
 
2008-09-10 12:10:10 PM  

Gunther: dittybopper: a man who supported banning semiautomatics

[citation needed]

He voted *FOR* SA1615, which would have banned most rifle ammunition

that's a distortion of the bill, which gave the attorney general the ability to ban ammunition designed to pierce body armor, not just ban every type of ammunition that can pierce body armor.


Really? Here is the text of the proposed amendment:

SA 1615. Mr. KENNEDY submitted an amendment intended to be proposed by him to the bill S. 397, to prohibit civil liability actions from being brought or continued against manufacturers, distributors, dealers, or importers of firearms or ammunition for damages, injunctive or other relief resulting from the misuse of their products by others; which was ordered to lie on the table; as follows:

On page 13, after line 4, insert the following:

SEC. 5. ARMOR PIERCING AMMUNITION.

(a) EXPANSION OF DEFINITION OF ARMOR PIERCING AMMUNITION.--Section 921(a)(17)(B) of title 18, United States Code, is amended--

(1) in clause (i), by striking ``or'' at the end;

(2) in clause (ii), by striking the period at the end and inserting a semicolon; and

(3) by adding at the end the following:

``(iii) a projectile that may be used in a handgun and that the Attorney General determines, under section 926(d), to be capable of penetrating body armor; or

``(iv) a projectile for a center-fire rifle, designed or marketed as having armor piercing capability, that the Attorney General determines, under section 926(d), to be more likely to penetrate body armor than standard ammunition of the same caliber.''.

(b) DETERMINATION OF THE CAPABILITY OF PROJECTILES TO PENETRATE BODY ARMOR.--Section 926 of title 18, United States Code, is amended by adding at the end the following:

``(d)(1) Not later than 1 year after the date of enactment of this subsection, the Attorney General shall promulgate standards for the uniform testing of projectiles against Body Armor Exemplar.

``(2) The standards promulgated under paragraph (1) shall take into account, among other factors, variations in performance that are related to the length of the barrel of the handgun or center-fire rifle from which the projectile is fired and the amount and kind of powder used to propel the projectile.

``(3) As used in paragraph (1), the term `Body Armor Exemplar' means body armor that the Attorney General determines meets minimum standards for the protection of law enforcement officers.''.

Take a look at the part that I bolded, then reconcile that with guns like the Thompson Contender, which can fire rifle rounds like the .30-30 Winchester, and .30'06 Springfield. In other words, any round that can be fired in *ANY* pistol would be banned under the language, if it could penetrate a body armor 'exemplar'. And yes, stupid as that sounds, it's been done before. The ATF decided that steel core 7.62x39mm rifle ammunition is "armor piercing" pistol ammunition simply because someone made a pistol capable of firing it.

There are only two possible reasons to vote for language like that: Either you aren't smart enough to know the difference, or you are and don't care.

Neither case would earn my vote.


This is a racist code phrase, that basically says "Don't worry middle aged rural white guys, we aren't going to take away your duck gun or deer rifle. We just want to keep guns out of the hands of BLACK people."

OK, now you're coming across as a little nutty... Make that very nutty.


No, it's not nutty. The burden of gun control in the United States has fallen most firmly upon the shoulders of minorities, and most particularly against blacks. The first gun control laws in the Colonies were mostly aimed at keeping slaves and free blacks from owning guns, and even after the Civil War they were just re-written to be facially race neutral, but still only applied to blacks. In fact, a judge in a 1941 case in Florida specifically stated it:

"I know something of the history of this legislation. The original Act of 1893 was passed when there was a great influx of negro laborers in this State drawn here for the purpose of working in turpentine and lumber camps.... [T]he Act was passed for the purpose of disarming the negro laborers and to thereby reduce the unlawful homicides that were prevalent in turpentine and saw-mill camps and to give the white citizens in sparsely settled areas a better feeling of security. The statute was never intended to be applied to the white population.... it is a safe guess to assume that more than 80% of the white men living in the rural sections of Florida have violated this statute.... [T]here has never been, within my knowledge, any effort to enforce the provisions of this statute as to white people, because it has been generally conceded to be in contravention of the Constitution and non-enforceable if contested."
Watson v. Stone, 4 So. 2d 700, 703 (Fla. 1941)

"NEVER INTENDED TO BE APPLIED TO THE WHITE POPULATION": FIREARMS REGULATION AND RACIAL DISPARITY--THE REDEEMED SOUTH'S LEGACY TO A NATIONAL JURISPRUDENCE?




I'm not a big fan of gun control laws, but is that seriously your only concern for this election? You don't care about anything as long as you get to keep your guns?


It's a pretty big one.

But what of the other concerns?

The War: My family has a *VERY* long history of military service. It would be hard to find a male member of my family, going back to at least the Civil War, who hasn't served in the military*. Those of us still around don't want to leave until the job is DONE. That includes my youngest brother, who was stationed in Kosovo and Afghanistan when he was in the Army, and who went to Iraq as a civilian contractor.

We broke it, it's our responsibility to fix it.
Advantage: McCain


The Economy: The president has little to no control over the economy. Any thing he or she can do is pretty marginal. Anyone who votes based mainly on this issue is dense.
Advantage: Neither.

Abortion: As the adoptive parent of a child left under the NYS "Safe Haven Act", I'd like to see fewer abortions, and more women take advantage of programs like that. A healthy newborn is the wish of every prospective adoptive parent, and those are precisely the children in short supply. My wife and I 'hit the lottery', we got extremely lucky. No, I don't want abortion banned, but having it discouraged as a means of birth control suits me fine.
Advantage: Neither. (I'm not a big fan of abortion bans of any kind, but neither do I like them being freely given out)

Alternate Energy: Drill, build some modern nuke plants, look into renewable sources, do the whole schmear. There is no one answer, so do it all as much as possible.
Advantage: Neither. Both sides say essentially the same thing.


Surely there's some other issues that affect you.


It looks like that's the big difference in this campaign to me.

Like I've said, I don't care if you have an R or a D behind your name.

*The only notable exception is my paternal grandfather, and he worked at Frankfort Arsenal his entire adult life.
 
2008-09-10 12:10:13 PM  

danlpoon: Aren't you supposed to be traveling, dipshiat?

Ha!. This is why you're losing. You let your emotions cloud your judgment. LoserThink. It's not full retard but it's damn close.


Nah, this election is being decided by your fark posts a lot more than by his emotions.
 
2008-09-10 12:11:09 PM  

DrillSergeantPoopyPants: Then there's Iraq. The regional bully. Led by an unstable dictator who passionately hated the U.S., funded terrorists, attacked his neighbors, used chemical weapons/WMDs, made a mockery of the U.N. and defied all attempts by the U.S. to reign him in.


i178.photobucket.comView Full Size


Yea, it sucks when our hired despots get all uppity, isn't it?
 
2008-09-10 12:14:33 PM  
Space_Poet: hired despots

You must be referring to someone else. Saddam rose to evil all on his own.
 
2008-09-10 12:21:25 PM  

Munchausen's Proxy: Space_Poet: hired despots

You must be referring to someone else. Saddam rose to evil all on his own.


We did hire him to beat the crap out of Iran for 10 years.
 
2008-09-10 12:30:02 PM  

shocker66s: Munchausen's Proxy: Space_Poet: hired despots

You must be referring to someone else. Saddam rose to evil all on his own.

We did hire him to beat the crap out of Iran for 10 years.


No, no, no, no, no.

He started a war with Iraq, for reasons of his own. After initial successes, it began to look like he would lose. We didn't want him to lose, for the excellent reason that we thought it would lead to a shiite-dominated Iraq. We did not give him massive support, much less "hire him." He continued to get his weapons from China, the USSR and France.

Five years ago, we invaded Iraq on our own, overthrew Saddam, and got a shiite-dominated replacement government. Why? I have no idea.
 
2008-09-10 12:30:20 PM  
"Where all the white women at?"

Not so much. I'm actually convinced now that Obama is a far better candidate for the presidency than McCain, and I'm one of those "white wimmin". McCain doesn't seem to be in control of his mouth, let alone his dick or various other parts of him, like his brain.
 
2008-09-10 12:30:27 PM  

Munchausen's Proxy: You must be referring to someone else. Saddam rose to evil all on his own.


He's too stupid to understand decades of war by proxy in context or other events that were going on across multiple boarders in the M.E at the time.

It's sad when your best hope for stability in a region and national security is a completely evil farking nutjob despot.

He's only good at posting jpgs.

moonbattery.comView Full Size
 
2008-09-10 12:33:35 PM  
dittybopper: Here is the text of the proposed amendment:

I agree that the bill is poorly worded, and could theoretically be misused to ban any rifle round capable of being fired from a pistol, but the intent of the bill is to ban rounds designed to pierce body armor. To claim the bill's purpose is to ban rifle rounds is not accurate.


We broke it, it's our responsibility to fix it.
Advantage: McCain


You are aware that McCain's position on Iraq is stolen nearly identical to Obama's right?

The president has little to no control over the economy. Any thing he or she can do is pretty marginal.

While the president's sway over the economy isn't as large as other factors, to say it is "marginal" simply isn't true. In particular, the national debt and rate of inflation are heavily influenced by a president's policies.
 
2008-09-10 12:38:40 PM  

Obviously: To all of a sudden specifically mention "lipstick" (a gender-specific inference) when it isn't a part of his normal dialogue is suspect, albeit with plausible deniability. Like if Palin had said "you can put Afrosheen on it to make it look slick, but it's still the same tired socialism."


obama didn't pick 'lipstick' suddenly out of the blue. Palin mentions lipstick in her speech. She talks about hockey moms and lipstick there. it was a memorable line from her speech. Afterwards, Obama talks about lipstick in reference to palin's use of it in her speech. still, it does seem to be going after her as a woman.
 
2008-09-10 12:40:29 PM  

Munchausen's Proxy: What the USSR wanted was victory for themselves


Brezhnev was a WWII veteran, not some ITG who watches History Channel and thinks war is like chess. He had no interest whatsoever in expansion. The idea of tanks rolling in from the West was a nightmare he wanted to avoid.

The Soviets were not interseted in taking risks.
 
2008-09-10 12:44:23 PM  

keypusher: shocker66s: Munchausen's Proxy: Space_Poet: hired despots

You must be referring to someone else. Saddam rose to evil all on his own.

We did hire him to beat the crap out of Iran for 10 years.

No, no, no, no, no.

He started a war with Iraq, for reasons of his own. After initial successes, it began to look like he would lose. We didn't want him to lose, for the excellent reason that we thought it would lead to a shiite-dominated Iraq. We did not give him massive support, much less "hire him." He continued to get his weapons from China, the USSR and France.

Five years ago, we invaded Iraq on our own, overthrew Saddam, and got a shiite-dominated replacement government. Why? I have no idea.


Reagan backed Saddam in the war with weapons, money and intelligence and was not going to let Iraq lose the war. I would consider that massive support but honestly it does not matter what you or I think. What matters is what the Iranian people think. They see us as backing a psycho the gased his own people and started a war that killed many Iranians for 10 years. Then when we go on to start a war with this same psycho. Doesn't make much sense to you or I and to the Iranians we must be high on batshiat.
 
2008-09-10 12:45:26 PM  

Gunther: You are aware that McCain's position on Iraq is stolen nearly identical to Obama's right?


Actually, if you were less opinionated and biased, you'd find they're similar on a lot more issues than you think (and McCain has a better track record of working across party lines to get results).


The "stolen" comments just make you look like a biased ignorant "liberal freeper".

At least McCain wasn't re-writing and publishing policy in the middle of the night to cover up his flip-flops. (pops)
 
2008-09-10 12:46:11 PM  
dittybopper: Alternate Energy: ... Both sides say essentially the same thing.

And this is simply false. McCain's solution to the problem is basically to A)drill more and B) build 45 new nuclear reactors by 2030.

Obama's is to increase funding for research, overhaul the electrical grid and put in more public mass transit systems.

Now you can feel free to pick and choose which of those you think is better, but they aren't identical.
 
2008-09-10 12:48:31 PM  

keypusher: No, "installed" is flat wrong. And calling Mao Nixon's "BFF" is juvenile.


Wait wait wait. The conversation began with the claim that Nixon was a great leader because he allied himself with China.

I know perfectly well that Sihanouk lived in China for years. So what?

I also know that China invaded Vietnam when Vietnam invaded Cambodia and Laos.
 
2008-09-10 12:49:40 PM  
la.indymedia.orgView Full Size

"Bring it, biatches!"
 
2008-09-10 12:51:34 PM  

Hideously Gigantic Smurf: "Bring it, biatches!"


OH, Its brought! With spirit fingers even.
 
2008-09-10 12:53:29 PM  

shocker66s: . They see us as backing a psycho the gased his own people and started a war that killed many Iranians for 10 years.


blogs.psychologytoday.comView Full Size
 
2008-09-10 12:54:38 PM  

McCainDemocrat: Some men just fear women being equal. They fear it when it's Hillary Clinton or Sarah Palin.

Women can strike a blow against sexism with a vote for McCain.


Ya, cuz Palin represents female liberation and grace.

Do you jerk-off at the sound of your own voice?
 
2008-09-10 12:58:30 PM  
kerpal32: Actually, if you were less opinionated... biased...biased.. ignorant... "liberal freeper"

Wow, three sentences and so much bile. you might wanna calm down a little.

The plans are very similar, and Obama's came first.[1][2]

Anything else I can clarify for you?
 
2008-09-10 12:59:35 PM  

kerpal32: shocker66s: . They see us as backing a psycho the gased his own people and started a war that killed many Iranians for 10 years.


Seriously, you really need a citation for Saddam gassing Iraqi kurds and Saddam starting the Iraq/Iran war?
 
2008-09-10 12:59:47 PM  

SlothB77: Palin mentions lipstick in her speech.


Nobody is allowed to mention lipstick now.

[image from ivorydome.us too old to be available]

Anyone remember this image? Wasn't that the image the Republicans were posting at fark in every thread a few months ago?
 
2008-09-10 1:01:54 PM  
Obama's is to increase funding for research, overhaul the electrical grid and put in more public mass transit systems.


Obama is an inexperienced Dreamer. You folks are as dumb as he is so you buy it hook, line and Ab-Lounger.

Increase funding for Research: New Taxes. Maybe he'll develop the elusive and smelly Cat-fart Battery.

Overhaul the electrical grid: Oh. Say, Barack 'Ol chum. Are you referring to the electrical grid that is owned by investors and municipalities? That one? That grid that you can't do shiat to unless you nationalize it, Kommrade?

more public mass transit systems

Public transportation is already the most highly subsidized municipal service available. Let's do more! We'll shake the money tree and buy EVERYONE a bus pass! After all- if we all have to ride a bus that's real PROGRESS!
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

McCain put up a plan that is DO-able by the President.

A)drill more and B) build 45 new nuclear reactors by 2030.

Drill more: These are FEDERAL oil leases. Do-able!

Nuke plants: These are FEDERALLY permitted: Do-able!
 
2008-09-10 1:02:57 PM  
To be fair, McCain might've said the same "pig w/lipstick" joke about Shrillary over a year ago, but at least he didn't follow it up by referring to the smell of fish like Obama did.
 
2008-09-10 1:04:05 PM  
Oh! Here's another one!

lobatek.comView Full Size


How forgetful we all are! The Republicans were trashing this guy just a few months ago, now they worhip him as a Messiah! No one is allowed to say anything that could be construed as derogitory to anyone near him!

Wow, you guys sure are flexible!
 
2008-09-10 1:06:56 PM  

ilambiquated: Oh! Here's another one!

How forgetful we all are! The Republicans were trashing this guy just a few months ago, now they worhip him as a Messiah! No one is allowed to say anything that could be construed as derogitory to anyone near him!

Wow, you guys sure are flexible!


Ahh, Are you talking about Obama or McCain? I think you were typing too fast and put Republicans instead of Democrats
 
2008-09-10 1:07:17 PM  

shocker66s: kerpal32: shocker66s: . They see us as backing a psycho the gased his own people and started a war that killed many Iranians for 10 years.

Seriously, you really need a citation for Saddam gassing Iraqi kurds and Saddam starting the Iraq/Iran war?



No, I need a citation where they blame the U.S. Like you said they did.

Unless you think they were cool with the Iranians overthrowing their country.

Thank you for helping to prove my point.

Yes dillweed, I know history (it wasn't history when I was watching it unfold).

Sreiously, you think you can run at the mouth and not get called on it?
 
2008-09-10 1:15:46 PM  

Insertwitty Namehere: Yes, because weed is very, very hard to find in Alaska.


I'm aware it is; roughly as easy as finding oregano. Thus, oregano as likely as anything else, given the brains I've seen demonstrated so far.
 
2008-09-10 1:17:57 PM  
danlpoon: WHARGARRBL

i221.photobucket.comView Full Size
 
2008-09-10 1:22:44 PM  
danlpoon: Overhaul the electrical grid: Oh. Say, Barack 'Ol chum. Are you referring to the electrical grid that is owned by investors and municipalities? That one? That grid that you can't do shiat to unless you nationalize it, Kommrade?

This is what he said about the electrical grid:

"I will also work closely with utilities to introduce a digital smart grid that can optimize the overall efficiency of the nation's electric utility system, by managing demand and making effective use of renewable energy and energy storage. "

Don't see anything about nationalizing it there. Working with the utilities to improve the efficiency of the grid sounds reasonable to me, but perhaps I'm a secret communist too.
 
2008-09-10 1:23:59 PM  

ilambiquated: keypusher: No, "installed" is flat wrong. And calling Mao Nixon's "BFF" is juvenile.

Wait wait wait. The conversation began with the claim that Nixon was a great leader because he allied himself with China.

Goddamit! The conversation, if that's the proper word, began with some idiot saying only Democrats had ever offered "credible international leadership." Then someone offered Nixon going to China (not "allying himself, moron) as a counterexample. And not that he was a "great leader," dickweed, but that he had offered "credible international leadership" by ending 25 years of unremitting hostility between the US and China. And then you, because you're an idiotic knee-jerk partisan, said some ridiculous nonsense about Nixon "installing" Pol Pot and added a reference to Nixon and Mao being BFFs.

Everything you have said on this subject is balls-to-the-wall stupid, idiotic, brain-dead, regurgitated crap. So shut up about it.
 
2008-09-10 1:31:17 PM  

kerpal32: shocker66s: kerpal32: shocker66s: . They see us as backing a psycho the gased his own people and started a war that killed many Iranians for 10 years.

Seriously, you really need a citation for Saddam gassing Iraqi kurds and Saddam starting the Iraq/Iran war?


No, I need a citation where they blame the U.S. Like you said they did.

Unless you think they were cool with the Iranians overthrowing their country.

Thank you for helping to prove my point.

Yes dillweed, I know history (it wasn't history when I was watching it unfold).

Sreiously, you think you can run at the mouth and not get called on it?


Ok, so you agree that Saddam gassed his own people and started the Iraq war. I never said Iran blames the U.S., that is your lack of reading comprehension. I stated they must think we are high on batshiat, just like you. It is blatantly obvious they do not have a very good opinion of America but since you cannot use critical thinking or read on your own here is a link.

http://www.usip.org/iran/iran_presentation.pdf
 
2008-09-10 1:44:45 PM  

shocker66s: Ok, so you agree that Saddam gassed his own people and started the Iraq war.


everyone knows this.

again, where is your citation that the Iraqis blame the U.S. for 8 years of war with Iran and Saddam's atrocities from 1980 - 1988?

Like you were stating dillweed?


I'm sorry you cannot distinguish the difference between YOUR BULLshiat OPINION with a 2007 Iraqi public opinion poll 20 YEARS AND 2 WARS LATER ON A COMPLETELY farkING DIFFERENT CONTEXT. Overall, you fail.

Bottom line, you don't have a citation. Not one. But it doesn't stop you from trying to cite your weak ass opinion as "fact".

sorry, but your opinions are like assholes.

/it's blatantly obvious you've got nothing and are trying to associate one period in history and current opinion poll/survey for forward planning with a different period in history and opinion of it WITHOUT ANY farkING EVIDENCE.

Basically, you're bloviating out your ass citing your opinions again.

/cheers.
 
2008-09-10 2:02:02 PM  

kerpal32: shocker66s: Ok, so you agree that Saddam gassed his own people and started the Iraq war.

everyone knows this.

again, where is your citation that the Iraqis blame the U.S. for 8 years of war with Iran and Saddam's atrocities from 1980 - 1988?

Like you were stating dillweed?


Ahh, I see what is going on. I stated "What matters is what the Iranian people think. They see us as backing a psycho the gased his own people and started a war that killed many Iranians for 10 years. Then when we go on to start a war with this same psycho. Doesn't make much sense to you or I and to the Iranians we must be high on batshiat."
You have poor reading comprehension and thought I was talking about the Iraqis. It is easy if you try. Iraq is spelled I-R-A-Q
and Iran is spelled I-R-A-N.
To improve your reading comprehension try and read SSSSLLLLLLOOOOOWWWLLLLY.
Got it? Good.

/I have not once posted that Iraq blames the U.S. for 8 years of war with Iran. If you think I did please post my quote.
 
2008-09-10 2:03:41 PM  

Space_Poet:

Yea, it sucks when our hired despots get all uppity, isn't it?


img183.imageshack.usView Full Size

I don't know, you'd have to ask Jacques Chirac.

/All we gave him was some intelligence reports
//Chirac gave him a freakin' nuclear reactor.
///And a bunch of Mirage fighters.
////Among other things.
 
2008-09-10 2:05:05 PM  

ilambiquated: SlothB77: Palin mentions lipstick in her speech.

Nobody is allowed to mention lipstick now.

Anyone remember this image? Wasn't that the image the Republicans were posting at fark in every thread a few months ago?


Holy crap, someone's anal about hotlinking. What an asshat Freeper.

"Obama will remove Civil Liberties"

That's classic projection.
 
2008-09-10 2:05:52 PM  
kerpal32:

Iraqi public opinion poll 20 YEARS AND 2 WARS LATER ON A COMPLETELY farkING DIFFERENT CONTEXT. Overall, you fail.

Did you even see the link? It is on Iranians!! I-R-A-N-I-A-N-S
not Iraqis!

/You suck
 
2008-09-10 2:20:17 PM  
So some women are willing to give up a shot at equal pay and accessible healthcare because they can 'relate' to someone who isn't even running for president but for #2?
That glass ceiling is officially storm-proof.
 
2008-09-10 2:32:44 PM  

Gunther: dittybopper: Alternate Energy: ... Both sides say essentially the same thing.

And this is simply false. McCain's solution to the problem is basically to A)drill more and B) build 45 new nuclear reactors by 2030.


BZZZT. From McCain's website:

John McCain Will Propose A $300 Million Prize To Improve Battery Technology For Full Commercial Development Of Plug-In Hybrid And Fully Electric Automobiles.

John McCain Supports Flex-Fuel Vehicles (FFVs) And Believes They Should Play A Greater Role In Our Transportation Sector.

John McCain Believes Alcohol-Based Fuels Hold Great Promise As Both An Alternative To Gasoline And As A Means of Expanding Consumers' Choices.

John McCain Will Establish A Permanent Tax Credit Equal To 10 Percent Of Wages Spent On R&D.

John McCain Will Encourage The Market For Alternative, Low Carbon Fuels Such As Wind, Hydro And Solar Power.

Source:
McCain/Palin website.

Now, I believe that crap just about as much as I believe Obama's. I'm not saying that I think he WILL do it, I'm saying you mischaracterized his position.


Obama's is to increase funding for research, overhaul the electrical grid and put in more public mass transit systems.

Now you can feel free to pick and choose which of those you think is better, but they aren't identical.


Pretty much, they are. McCain and Obama both support research into alternative fuels, both say they want to encourage research and development, blah blah blah.

They only differ on the fringes. McCain would encourage more nuke plants, Obama would encourage more mass transit. Both sides recognize that we need research into alternative energy technologies, and both would encourage it.
 
2008-09-10 2:33:06 PM  

Munchausen's Proxy: ilambiquated: The Republicans have never demonstrated any credible international leadership. Ever. It's always been Democrats.

So Nixon was a democrat when he went to China? What about Reagan and the end of the cold war?

A word of warning, an absolute statement can always be defeated.


Hey there...you do realize your word of warning against absolute statements just happens to be an absolute statement.

You've just created a paradox Harcourt Fenton Mudd would be proud of.

/I'm lying
 
2008-09-10 2:43:27 PM  
faithmouse.comView Full Size
 
2008-09-10 2:44:21 PM  

shocker66s: kerpal32:

Iraqi public opinion poll 20 YEARS AND 2 WARS LATER ON A COMPLETELY farkING DIFFERENT CONTEXT. Overall, you fail.

Did you even see the link? It is on Iranians!! I-R-A-N-I-A-N-S
not Iraqis!

/You suck

Yes, I saw it. That's why I was saying you're a bloviating troll posting shiat out of context. I typed Iraqi opinion instead of Iranian Opinion (confused it with the Iraqi opinion survey while typing).


Thanks for proving my point that you suck, have zero citations, really are just a bloviating troll and got nothing though.
zip sero nada shiat big fat farking nuthin for citations.
 
2008-09-10 2:56:38 PM  
dittybopper: BZZZT. From McCain's website:

Well yeah, but that's mostly crap like "John McCain Supports", "John McCain Believes" and "John McCain Will Encourage" without any actual policies. Not much actual expenditure on alternate energy research, or anything that's gonna, y'know accomplish anything.
 
2008-09-10 2:57:32 PM  

kerpal32: shocker66s: kerpal32:

Iraqi public opinion poll 20 YEARS AND 2 WARS LATER ON A COMPLETELY farkING DIFFERENT CONTEXT. Overall, you fail.

Did you even see the link? It is on Iranians!! I-R-A-N-I-A-N-S
not Iraqis!

/You suck
Yes, I saw it. That's why I was saying you're a bloviating troll posting shiat out of context. I typed Iraqi opinion instead of Iranian Opinion (confused it with the Iraqi opinion survey while typing).


Thanks for proving my point that you suck, have zero citations, really are just a bloviating troll and got nothing though. zip sero nada shiat big fat farking nuthin for citations.


Your stupidity is really amazing. Keep going!
 
2008-09-10 3:24:45 PM  
Don't see anything about nationalizing it there.

That's because you're blinded by ignorance. Digital Smart Grid. Geez, You people will fall for ANYTHING. Ab-Lounger much? What's Obama gonna do go to the INVESTOR-OWNED, PRIVATE utilities and force them to make transmission and distribution "improvements"?

Even if he COULD do it (which he can't, no jurisdiction) it would increase the cost of electricity during a recession.

More Obama genius.
 
2008-09-10 3:31:56 PM  

Gunther: dittybopper: BZZZT. From McCain's website:

Well yeah, but that's mostly crap like "John McCain Supports", "John McCain Believes" and "John McCain Will Encourage" without any actual policies. Not much actual expenditure on alternate energy research, or anything that's gonna, y'know accomplish anything.


Yeah, that 300 million bucks is *NOTHING*.

/Didn't say I believed it, said it was being mischaracterized.
 
2008-09-10 3:53:33 PM  
danlpoon: What's Obama gonna do go to the INVESTOR-OWNED, PRIVATE utilities and force them to make transmission and distribution "improvements"?

How about the INVESTOR-OWNED, PRIVATE car companies that have to comply with fleet mileage standards? Or the INVESTOR-OWNED, PRIVATE steel mills that have to follow pollutant emission guidelines?

Do you actually believe 10% of the crap you and your alts spew here? Because that level of stupidity would be truly breathtaking.
 
2008-09-10 3:56:22 PM  

shocker66s: Your stupidity is really amazing. Keep going!


And your opinions of the opinions of people living under a radical theology in an information controlled society since a revolution 30 years ago just shows what a loony troll you are.

But I know you'll keep going. Idiots like you never stop. You just think you've made some pertinent point.


I could say "they've" hated the west since the reconquista. And I'd be right.

I suggest you poll people who have managed to leave since 88' to see what THEY think.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/06/21/AR200706210007 9. html (pops)

Or look at some other polls out of Iran
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/graphic/2008/03/09/GR200803090012 7. html (pops)

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/2294509.stm (pops)

Oh, wait, you're too much of an idiotic tool to do that.

It would shine a light on what an idiot you are.

img352.imageshack.usView Full Size
 
2008-09-10 4:37:45 PM  
shocker66s::

BTW - I said "theology", but meant theocracy.

/no, you don't get my full attention, and never will. You're just a troll unable to actually provide citations for any of your opinions.
 
2008-09-10 5:34:52 PM  

kerpal32: shocker66s::

BTW - I said "theology", but meant theocracy.

/no, you don't get my full attention, and never will. You're just a troll unable to actually provide citations for any of your opinions.


Keep going! So where did I post that Iraq blamed the U.S. for the Iran/Iraq war as you stated "Iraqis blame the U.S. for 8 years of war with Iran and Saddam's atrocities from 1980 - 1988" Just please show me that. Do you know what the difference between Iraq and Iran is yet? Need help?

/This will be funny
 
2008-09-10 5:42:09 PM  

kerpal32: shocker66s: Your stupidity is really amazing. Keep going!

And your opinions of the opinions of people living under a radical theology in an information controlled society since a revolution 30 years ago just shows what a loony troll you are.

But I know you'll keep going. Idiots like you never stop. You just think you've made some pertinent point.


I could say "they've" hated the west since the reconquista. And I'd be right.

I suggest you poll people who have managed to leave since 88' to see what THEY think.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/06/21/AR2007062100079. html (pops)

Or look at some other polls out of Iran
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/graphic/2008/03/09/GR2008030900127. html (pops)

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/2294509.stm (pops)

Oh, wait, you're too much of an idiotic tool to do that.

It would shine a light on what an idiot you are.


That is great! Are you even reading your own links? Is your little brother on and posting crap to make you look bad? I wish I could find out. Your posts make absolutely no sense at all.
 
2008-09-10 5:43:16 PM  

shocker66s: kerpal32: shocker66s::

Keep going! So where did I post that Iraq blamed the U.S. for the Iran/Iraq war as you stated "Iraqis blame the U.S. for 8 years of war with Iran and Saddam's atrocities from 1980 - 1988" Just please show me that. Do you know what the difference between Iraq and Iran is yet? Need help?

/This will be funny


Still waiting for you to post a citation about the Iranians and the same opinions.

Regardless of which way you try to spin it, you're just bloviating your opinions out your ass troll.
 
2008-09-10 8:59:52 PM  

dittybopper: Yeah, that 300 million bucks is *NOTHING*.


When your opponent's putting 150 BILLION towards alternate energy research? yeah, 300 million is nothing.

Remember, you're the one claiming they're identical here. do you really think one candidate's position towards something is equal to another who's pledging 1/50th of the money?
 
2008-09-10 10:49:03 PM  

dittybopper: I know the "lipstick on a pig" phrase is older than dirt. So is "Finger lickin' good", but I wouldn't use it in campaign speech if I were running against Obama


Excellent. I finally laughed today, thank you!
 
2008-09-11 1:27:02 PM  

kerpal32: shocker66s: kerpal32: shocker66s::

Keep going! So where did I post that Iraq blamed the U.S. for the Iran/Iraq war as you stated "Iraqis blame the U.S. for 8 years of war with Iran and Saddam's atrocities from 1980 - 1988" Just please show me that. Do you know what the difference between Iraq and Iran is yet? Need help?

/This will be funny

Still waiting for you to post a citation about the Iranians and the same opinions.

Regardless of which way you try to spin it, you're just bloviating your opinions out your ass troll.


I never stated that the Iranians blamed the U.S. for the war between Iraq and Iran. You are now in a flat spin headed out to sea. Please post A. when I posted that Iraq blamed the U.S. for the Iran/Iraq war and B. When I posted that Iran Blames the U.S. for the Iran/Iraq war. The list is getting bigger and you will probably puss out like the biatch that you are.
 
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