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(Wall Street Journal)   One of the very few people who predicted Howard Dean would come in third in Iowa in 2004 is the same person who predicted Hillary would come in third yesterday: Every Democrat's favorite political writer, Robert Novak   (opinionjournal.com) divider line
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1127 clicks; posted to Politics » on 04 Jan 2008 at 3:11 PM (15 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



44 Comments     (+0 »)
 
sigdiamond2000
2008-01-04 10:55:48 AM  
Thank you for not referring to him as a "journalist", submitter.
 
FlashHarry [TotalFark]
2008-01-04 11:03:42 AM  
i think a lot of people predicted hillary would come in third. besides, only neocon republicans and their media minions peddled that "hilary is inevitable" crap. nobody else really believed it.
 
albo
2008-01-04 11:13:52 AM  
i joke about hillary clinton being a close personal friend of the debbil, but novak is one guy who, if the devil existed, would be on his earthly speed-dial
 
Diogenes [TotalFark] [OhFark]
2008-01-04 11:43:53 AM  
albo: i joke about hillary clinton being a close personal friend of the debbil, but novak is one guy who, if the devil existed, would be on his earthly speed-dial

Oh quite the contrary -- Novak is an Opus Dei member. He's got spooky powers!
 
stevecody
2008-01-04 12:05:17 PM  
Almost EVERYBODY predicted that Hillary would come in third.

Edwards has been campaigning in IOWA for almost 4 years.
Obama is from a neighboring state.

Novak is a crusty old traitoring ass kissing Cheney-puppet crap that should be in jail.
 
cameroncrazy1984 [TotalFark]
2008-01-04 1:02:37 PM  
I'm going to really enjoy listening to the right-wing media when Obama becomes the nominee. It's going to sound like Germany in 1932.
 
Zarkin Frood
2008-01-04 1:18:45 PM  
cameroncrazy1984: I'm going to really enjoy listening to the right-wing media when Obama becomes the nominee. It's going to sound like Germany in 1932.

It kinda already does (at least for one far-right fundie coont)
[image from i190.photobucket.com too old to be available][image from i190.photobucket.com too old to be available][image from i190.photobucket.com too old to be available]
 
Code_Archeologist
2008-01-04 1:28:42 PM  
cameroncrazy1984: I'm going to really enjoy listening to the right-wing media when Obama becomes the nominee. It's going to sound like Germany in 1932.

Or Alabama circa 1955
 
downstairs [TotalFark] [OhFark]
2008-01-04 1:50:37 PM  
He also predicted Romney over Huckabee, so....
 
robsul82
2008-01-04 2:01:20 PM  
stevecody: Almost EVERYBODY predicted that Hillary would come in third.

Uh, no. That might even be more divorced from reality than the Paul People predicting third and even second place finishes in Iowa.
 
KyngNothing
2008-01-04 2:19:00 PM  
downstairs: He also predicted Romney over Huckabee, so....

It's almost as if you can tell who he does and doesn't like!
 
Sensei Can You See [TotalFark]
2008-01-04 2:22:14 PM  
cameroncrazy1984: I'm going to really enjoy listening to the right-wing media when Obama becomes the nominee. It's going to sound like Germany in 1932.

Yeah. Because the only possible objection someone could have to Obama as a candidate is because he's black. His experience, policies, ideology--none of that matters.

If someone does raise one of those issues, it's simple--they're just using that as an excuse to cover up their bigotry. None of this "judge a man by the content of his character rather than the color of his skin" nonsense for the Democrats!

And the politics of race go on and on and on....
 
TheCid
2008-01-04 2:38:27 PM  
SquirrelsOfDoom: cameroncrazy1984: I'm going to really enjoy listening to the right-wing media when Obama becomes the nominee. It's going to sound like Germany in 1932.

Yeah. Because the only possible objection someone could have to Obama as a candidate is because he's black. His experience, policies, ideology--none of that matters.

If someone does raise one of those issues, it's simple--they're just using that as an excuse to cover up their bigotry. None of this "judge a man by the content of his character rather than the color of his skin" nonsense for the Democrats!

And the politics of race go on and on and on....

Have you seen the right-wing mouth breathers on fark? Almost every single one of them refers to him as "B. Hussein Obama".
There's no way you can say that's not racism.
 
Sensei Can You See [TotalFark]
2008-01-04 2:46:18 PM  
TheCid: Have you seen the right-wing mouth breathers on fark? Almost every single one of them refers to him as "B. Hussein Obama".

Well, I stand corrected. Everyone knows a small, vocal handful of anonymous loudmouth asshole tough guys on the rudest forum on the entire Internet fully represents all Republicans in the US.
 
Sensei Can You See [TotalFark]
2008-01-04 2:47:45 PM  
TheCid: Have you seen the right-wing mouth breathers on fark?

Oh, and BTW: This right-wing mouth-breather could not care less about Obama's name OR race, but does not favor his lack of experience, vague platform and habit of skipping out on controversial Senate votes.

Does that make me racist?
 
lilbjorn
2008-01-04 3:15:31 PM  
One of the very few people who predicted Howard Dean would come in third in Iowa in 2004 is the same person who predicted Hillary would come in third yesterday: Every Democrat's favorite political writer, Robert Novak

... and he heard it direct from Diebold.
 
aegisalpha
2008-01-04 3:23:22 PM  
SquirrelsOfDoom: TheCid: Have you seen the right-wing mouth breathers on fark? Almost every single one of them refers to him as "B. Hussein Obama".

Well, I stand corrected. Everyone knows a small, vocal handful of anonymous loudmouth asshole tough guys on the rudest forum on the entire Internet fully represents all Republicans in the US.

There are right-wingers of 4chan that aren't there for tentacle rape porn?
 
Donald_McRonald
2008-01-04 3:23:55 PM  
So what? This broken clock is right twice a day.
wfmu.orgView Full Size
 
Treygreen13
2008-01-04 3:25:21 PM  
cameroncrazy1984: I'm going to really enjoy listening to the right-wing media when Obama becomes the nominee. It's going to sound like Germany in 1932.

Poisoning the well already? Impressive!
 
Nemo's Brother
2008-01-04 3:25:41 PM  
Already the TFers are revising history. Your Hilldawg proved to be everything "the vast rightwing conspiracy" said she was. Even the left is seeing through her lies and CNN now.
 
Diogenes [TotalFark] [OhFark]
2008-01-04 3:36:49 PM  
Nemo's Brother: Already the TFers are revising history. Your Hilldawg proved to be everything "the vast rightwing conspiracy" said she was. Even the left is seeing through her lies and CNN now.

I don't know what threads you've been hanging out in, but from what I've seen here, Democratic enthusiasm for Hillary has bee muted at best.

She never had my support. The only time I rush to defend her is when I think people are attacking the wrong things about her.
 
HotWingConspiracy
2008-01-04 3:39:22 PM  
Let me know when he's swinging by the neck from a tree.
 
mrjared
2008-01-04 3:40:16 PM  
aegisalpha: SquirrelsOfDoom: TheCid: Have you seen the right-wing mouth breathers on fark? Almost every single one of them refers to him as "B. Hussein Obama".

Well, I stand corrected. Everyone knows a small, vocal handful of anonymous loudmouth asshole tough guys on the rudest forum on the entire Internet fully represents all Republicans in the US.

There are right-wingers of 4chan that aren't there for tentacle rape porn?

not to threadjack...but what the hell is 4chan? I've heard it mentioned a few times. Guess I'm old and out of the loop.
 
Darth_Lukecash
2008-01-04 3:46:32 PM  
SquirrelsOfDoom: cameroncrazy1984: I'm going to really enjoy listening to the right-wing media when Obama becomes the nominee. It's going to sound like Germany in 1932.

Yeah. Because the only possible objection someone could have to Obama as a candidate is because he's black. His experience, policies, ideology--none of that matters.

If someone does raise one of those issues, it's simple--they're just using that as an excuse to cover up their bigotry. None of this "judge a man by the content of his character rather than the color of his skin" nonsense for the Democrats!

And the politics of race go on and on and on....

You know, the only ones who make it an issue are those who are against him. Obama sure doesn't care what color he is. Neiher do you nor I.

Hopefully, he'll be judged on his record and himself.
 
seventypercent [TotalFark]
2008-01-04 3:46:41 PM  
I'm a Democrat and I've always liked Bob Novak.
 
noneyourbase
2008-01-04 3:49:32 PM  
mrjared: aegisalpha: SquirrelsOfDoom: TheCid: Have you seen the right-wing mouth breathers on fark? Almost every single one of them refers to him as "B. Hussein Obama".

Well, I stand corrected. Everyone knows a small, vocal handful of anonymous loudmouth asshole tough guys on the rudest forum on the entire Internet fully represents all Republicans in the US.

There are right-wingers of 4chan that aren't there for tentacle rape porn?

not to threadjack...but what the hell is 4chan? I've heard it mentioned a few times. Guess I'm old and out of the loop.


According to UrbanDictionary

we are 4channers. the people devoid of any type of soul or conscience. products of cynicism and apathy, spreading those very sentiments daily. anonymous is the hardened war veteran of the internet. he does not forgive or forget. we have seen things that defy explantions. heard stories that would make any god-fearing, law abiding citzen empty their stomach where they stand. we have experienced them multiple times and eagerly await their return.
Read more
 
Charninja
2008-01-04 3:51:21 PM  
mrjared:
not to threadjack...but what the hell is 4chan? I've heard it mentioned a few times. Guess I'm old and out of the loop.

Another forum where lots of hentai porn is shared. Very famous among certain groups, but NSFW in any way, shape, or form.
 
Sensei Can You See [TotalFark]
2008-01-04 3:53:18 PM  
Darth_Lukecash: You know, the only ones who make it an issue are those who are against him. Obama sure doesn't care what color he is. Neiher do you nor I.

Sorry; can't agree. Many of his supporters will play the race card pre-emptively to blunt any legitimate criticism of Obama. It has already happened not only in the thread but in the same post you're quoting from:

cameroncrazy1984: I'm going to really enjoy listening to the right-wing media when Obama becomes the nominee. It's going to sound like Germany in 1932.
 
tychoides
2008-01-04 3:57:31 PM  
mrjared: but what the hell is 4chan?

The best site on the internet.

random
humor
pr0n
torrents

Pretty much everything you need in once site.
 
tychoides
2008-01-04 3:58:30 PM  
Oh, and the rules of the internet in my profile belong to 4chan.
 
KrispyKringle
2008-01-04 4:03:04 PM  
SquirrelsOfDoom: Sorry; can't agree. Many of his supporters will play the race card pre-emptively to blunt any legitimate criticism of Obama. It has already happened not only in the thread but in the same post you're quoting from:

cameroncrazy1984: I'm going to really enjoy listening to the right-wing media when Obama becomes the nominee. It's going to sound like Germany in 1932.

It will happen. It's a straw-man and it's unfair. But that's not what cameroncrazy was doing; just as we can be sure that some of Obama's supporters will play the race card against his opponents, we can be sure some of the right wing media will play the race card against him.

To his credit, Obama himself has refrained from doing so; his campaign doesn't strike me so much as the campaign of a black man--compared to, say, the likes of Jessie Jackson--as the campaign of a man who happens to be black. That some of his supporters may perceive his critics as racist isn't his fault, but it also isn't exactly surprising; surely some of his critics are racists.
 
Number41
2008-01-04 4:06:40 PM  
robsul82: Uh, no. That might even be more divorced from reality than the Paul People predicting third and even second place finishes in Iowa.

Not everyone was predicting it (though many did), but I don't think anyone expected her to do better than second. The last DM Register poll put her at a percentage point over Edwards, and it was reversed in the real deal.

Paul, on the other hand, never had a shot at third. The DM Register poll was pretty spot on for the Republican field.
 
RevLovejoy
2008-01-04 4:11:12 PM  
I thought the most intruiging thing from TFA was this:

The two-party system has proved remarkably resilient, but a nine-month span between the selection of nominees and the actual election may prove to be what it takes to undermine it.


/it's about time
 
robsul82
2008-01-04 4:16:18 PM  
Number41: robsul82: Uh, no. That might even be more divorced from reality than the Paul People predicting third and even second place finishes in Iowa.

Not everyone was predicting it (though many did), but I don't think anyone expected her to do better than second. The last DM Register poll put her at a percentage point over Edwards, and it was reversed in the real deal.

Paul, on the other hand, never had a shot at third. The DM Register poll was pretty spot on for the Republican field.

Again. Uh, no. The DM Register poll was derided as relying far too heavily on independents, and just because it was proven correct doesn't mean the polls saying Clinton was leading didn't exist, the talking heads saying Clinton would win never happened.
 
Number41
2008-01-04 4:35:22 PM  
robsul82: Again. Uh, no. The DM Register poll was derided as relying far too heavily on independents, and just because it was proven correct doesn't mean the polls saying Clinton was leading didn't exist, the talking heads saying Clinton would win never happened.

An overview of the most recent Iowa polls. Half called it in the right order, DM Register was close, and two called it for Clinton. I wasn't the one who said everyone was calling Clinton for third, but to say that it's as deluded as Paul coming in third is flat out wrong.
 
Harvey Manfrenjensenjen
2008-01-04 4:40:13 PM  
With this thread, it looks like the "progressives" are closing the Godwin and hyperbole gaps with the fundies. Should be a photo finish. Kudos to Zarkin Frood... you stay classy.
 
robsul82
2008-01-04 4:41:01 PM  
Number41: robsul82: Again. Uh, no. The DM Register poll was derided as relying far too heavily on independents, and just because it was proven correct doesn't mean the polls saying Clinton was leading didn't exist, the talking heads saying Clinton would win never happened.

An overview of the most recent Iowa polls. Half called it in the right order, DM Register was close, and two called it for Clinton. I wasn't the one who said everyone was calling Clinton for third, but to say that it's as deluded as Paul coming in third is flat out wrong.

Obama 30.8, Clinton 29.2. A far farking cry from "everybody was saying Clinton was going to finish third," is it not, which is what I made that comment about in the first place, yes yes? I'll say it again. You told Brandt...Brandt told me. Hello? Parla usted ingles?
 
mrjared
2008-01-04 4:43:47 PM  
tychoides: mrjared: but what the hell is 4chan?

The best site on the internet.

random
humor
pr0n
torrents

Pretty much everything you need in once site.

interesting
 
Number41
2008-01-04 4:43:50 PM  
robsul82: Obama 30.8, Clinton 29.2. A far farking cry from "everybody was saying Clinton was going to finish third," is it not, which is what I made that comment about in the first place, yes yes? I'll say it again. You told Brandt...Brandt told me. Hello? Parla usted ingles?

You said it was as deluded as saying Ron Paul would come in third. That's about the height of delusional. However, there were plenty of polls calling Hillary in third. Not everyone, I'll agree, but enough that it pales in comparison to Paultardness.
 
cameroncrazy1984 [TotalFark]
2008-01-04 5:16:29 PM  
KrispyKringle: To his credit, Obama himself has refrained from doing so; his campaign doesn't strike me so much as the campaign of a black man--compared to, say, the likes of Jessie Jackson--as the campaign of a man who happens to be black.

Exactly. And that's why Iowa, a predominantly-white state, voted for him over a white guy and a white woman. He has substance and character. Just because you haven't heard it, doesn't mean it isn't there.


/I solved the tree-falling-in-the-woods question.
 
Anekdote
2008-01-04 8:01:05 PM  
Robert Novak, a paeleoconservative, has endorsed Ron Paul.
 
Brubold
2008-01-04 10:33:14 PM  
cameroncrazy1984
I'm going to really enjoy listening to the right-wing media when Obama becomes the nominee. It's going to sound like Germany in 1932.

Ah so because they aren't going to want Obama to win it's going to be because he is black and not because they disagree with his politics? I suppose that means the more than 60% of Democrats that didn't vote for him in Iowa are racists too?

I'm a conservative non-Republican and if I had to choose one of the Democrats to get elected it would be Obama. It has nothing to do with his race. It's that he is newer to politics and thus will be less likely to be bought and payed for by corporate interests like the other politicians in the race.
 
Zarkin Frood
2008-01-05 9:15:26 AM  
Harvey Manfrenjensenjen: With this thread, it looks like the "progressives" are closing the Godwin and hyperbole gaps with the fundies. Should be a photo finish. Kudos to Zarkin Frood... you stay classy.

Hey hey, I didn't make those pictures, I just think they're funny. And I'd hate Ann Coulter even if she shared my political beliefs. She's that much of an intolerant, racist, bigoted, greedy coont. Oops, I guess with qualities like those, there's no way she could ever share my political beliefs..
 
Alphax
2008-01-05 9:46:56 AM  
Zarkin Frood: And I'd hate Ann Coulter even if she shared my political beliefs. She's that much of an intolerant, racist, bigoted, greedy coont. Oops, I guess with qualities like those, there's no way she could ever share my political beliefs..

QFT
 
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