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(Some Guy)   Unclear on the Concept Department: Global warming is especially hard for the poor because they can't afford their heating bills   (businessweek.com) divider line
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4676 clicks; posted to Main » and Fandom » on 06 Nov 2007 at 5:05 PM (15 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



204 Comments     (+0 »)


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NikolaiFarkoff [TotalFark]
2007-11-06 2:02:06 PM  
"One in four low-income families have already missed a mortgage or rent payment because of rising energy costs,"

I sure am glad we passed that law prohibiting the poor from spending any money on beer, cigarettes, lottery tickets, rims, and car stereos. Otherwise, there might be other expenditures to blame for the cash shortage.
 
Pocket Ninja [TotalFark] [OhFark]
2007-11-06 2:35:26 PM  
Unclear on the Concept Department: Another Fark submitter doesn't understand why "global warming" doesn't mean "everything gets hotter everywhere."
 
MacEnvy [OhFark]
2007-11-06 2:41:03 PM  
Pocket Ninja: Unclear on the Concept Department: Another Fark submitter doesn't understand why "global warming" doesn't mean "everything gets hotter everywhere."

Quoted in the hopes that Fark Republicans learn by repetition.

Seemed to work for the made-up word "Islamofascism".
 
Sensei Can You See [TotalFark]
2007-11-06 2:57:39 PM  
Pocket Ninja: Another Fark submitter doesn't understand why "global warming" doesn't mean "everything gets hotter everywhere."

"Unfortunately, we barbers aren't gods. Why, just fifty years ago, they thought a disease like your daughter's was caused by demonic possession or witchcraft. Twenty years ago we would have said she was suffering from an imbalance of bodily humors, perhaps caused by a toad or a small dwarf living in her stomach. But today, we now know that everything -- hot weather, cold weather, high energy costs, your daughter's disease -- is caused by global warming."

Theodoric of York (new window)
 
amazing_live_seamonkeys
2007-11-06 4:33:59 PM  
groovygreen.com
 
JDAT [OhFark]
2007-11-06 5:08:26 PM  
Let's save the Global Warming threads to a more appropriate time like Halloween or April 1st mmmmkay.
 
tamarah
2007-11-06 5:10:15 PM  
I would imagine they wouldn't be able to afford their heating bills because they were poor....

...otherwise they wouldn't be poor....
 
youshallhaveeverbeen
2007-11-06 5:10:19 PM  
Everybody knows that global warming is caused by excess methane gas.

sooo.. cow farts.
 
thegourmez [TotalFark]
2007-11-06 5:10:50 PM  
Subby is unclear on the concept?
 
Mars232
2007-11-06 5:11:29 PM  
Shouldn't that be inflation and high oil prices with a huge government inability to invest any form of renewable resources?
 
borist
2007-11-06 5:11:43 PM  
Aw, serves them right. They're the ones causing all this global warming with all that oil smoke from their '87 Caprice Classics and their El Caminos.
 
Merltech
2007-11-06 5:12:03 PM  
Vundabar, now all the experts of fark will weigh in on global climate change.
 
TofuTheAlmighty [BareFark]
2007-11-06 5:12:05 PM  
Pocket Ninja: Unclear on the Concept Department: Another Fark submitter doesn't understand why "global warming" doesn't mean "everything gets hotter everywhere."

This makes three repetitions. Supposedly after seven, a statement is better retained by memory. Let's hope that's true even for wingnuts.
 
degreeless
2007-11-06 5:12:22 PM  
[image from img153.imageshack.us too old to be available]
 
Fishflinger
2007-11-06 5:13:00 PM  
Well if that bag of wind would keep her mouth shut global warming would be less of a problems.

/brought to you by the Group for anybody but Hillary
 
Donald_McRonald
2007-11-06 5:14:29 PM  
Let's see, one side has data and scientific analysis. The other has MS Paint and Anne Coulter....Hmmm, which one do I trust?
 
bighairyguy [TotalFark]
2007-11-06 5:15:26 PM  
Poor people have trouble paying their bills? I can't recall them ever having that problem before global warming, so that must be the culprit. A fine reason to change who's running the government too.

/That's damn fine logic, Hilly
 
vdantev
2007-11-06 5:15:42 PM  
degreeless 2007-11-06 05:12:22 PM

[*insert idiotic reactionary picture of Al Gore here*]

*golfer's clap*


clueless retard.
 
impaler
2007-11-06 5:16:18 PM  
FTA:

"The climate crisis is also one of the greatest economic opportunities in the history of our country," she said. "It will unleash a wave of innovation, create millions of new jobs, enhance our security and lead the world to a revolution in how we produce and use energy... One in four low-income families have already missed a mortgage or rent payment because of rising energy costs," Clinton said.

Looks to me she was talking about raising energy costs, and how the battle against global warming will help those that can't afford the raising costs of energy. Then again, I can read things and understand them.
 
Manfred J. Hattan
2007-11-06 5:16:25 PM  
Pocket Ninja: Unclear on the Concept Department: Another Fark submitter doesn't understand why "global warming" doesn't mean "everything gets hotter everywhere."

I'm not smitty, so I can't defend him or her. But if I were to submit this exact headline I would be clear on the concept and cognizant that global warming is not omnipresent. For me, it would work like this: Global warming, if anthropogenic, is caused by burning carbon thingies. For all of Senator Clinton's (laudable, for the record) optimism in the speech from the article, in the near term a credible fight against anthropogenic global warming means exactly one thing: deep reductions in the amount of carbon thingies being burned. Unfortunately, the best way to do that is to increase the price of those thingies. Equally unfortunately, one of the major things that poor people do is burn carbon thingies to heat their homes. So yes, global warming is especially hard on the poor (or at least the fight against it is), but it is supposed to be especially hard on the poor. By design. A person who believes in anthropogenic global warming and who opposes it wants it to be especially hard on the poor.
 
chi_tino
2007-11-06 5:16:29 PM  
Step 1 - Complain that energy prices are too high

Step 2 - Enact policies that drive energy costs even higher

Step 3 - Go to Step 1!
 
kirby528
2007-11-06 5:17:03 PM  
Anyone who doesn't think that climate change is a real problem is stupid and in denial. Americans too often dismiss things as "bullshiat" if it means they have to change their opulent lifestyle.

/Also, for the 1000th but not last time: Global Warming does not mean the whole world will get warmer, it means the climate will change radically in most areas as a result of carbon dioxide. Learn it well conservatives, or just cover your ears and make noise like you have been.
/that was a long slashy

If we don't lower carbon emissions soon, the decomposed plant matter in siberia and other places will thaw, and release tons of methane. Methane is a much more dangerous greenhouse gas then Co2, it's just not as highly present in the atmosphere. Once this methane is released it will warm the planet, causing more to thaw which will warm the planet more. Once it gets to this point it will be its own self-reinforcing cycle and there won't be much we can do about it. Then you conservatives can celebrate that it's out of our hands, and we can all join in a fun struggle for natural resources!

/sorry for the rant
 
oren0
2007-11-06 5:17:31 PM  
Another Fark submitter doesn't understand why "global warming" doesn't mean "everything gets hotter everywhere."

You're right. It means "any weather or other natural event, regardless of the trend, should be blamed on people."

Never mind that the Earth was much warmer in the middle ages than it is now.

Never mind that CO2 has NEVER in the history of the world initiated warming. The scientific literature is virtually unanimous that CO2 has always lagged temperature.

Temperature has swung much wider in the past than it is now, but we're so quick to blame people because Al Gore says so.

Ask the British government or Margaret Thatcher's former science advisor about Al Gore's accuracy.
 
yellow_shark
2007-11-06 5:18:07 PM  
So sorry Subby - you fail.
 
Manfred J. Hattan
2007-11-06 5:18:23 PM  
In other news, paragraph breaks make the baby Jesus cry and his tears magnify the sun's rays, increasing global temperatures. I may have just saved the world with my formatting.
 
djmed
2007-11-06 5:19:15 PM  
Corvus

So you don't even believe the average temperature of the earth is increasing?

Even most on the right at least admit this now.

sure it is warmer- about 1 degree. and it has nothing to do with you or me or any of our actions that the gorebots, the UN, or environazis want to CONTROL
 
Dark Overlord
2007-11-06 5:19:43 PM  
SquirrelsofDoom

"Unfortunately, we barbers aren't gods. Why, just fifty years ago, they thought a disease like your daughter's was caused by demonic possession or witchcraft. Twenty years ago we would have said she was suffering from an imbalance of bodily humors, perhaps caused by a toad or a small dwarf living in her stomach. But today, we now know that everything -- hot weather, cold weather, high energy costs, your daughter's disease -- is caused by global warming."

Theodoric of York (new window)


This!

There are scientists that disagree. OwlGore's message is overblown. And, he doesn't follow his own dictats. As stated earlier "Global Warming = Bullshiat."
 
mongbiohazard
2007-11-06 5:19:58 PM  
Pocket Ninja: Unclear on the Concept Department: Another Fark submitter doesn't understand why "global warming" doesn't mean "everything gets hotter everywhere."


It doesn't mean colder though, does it?

Most of what I've read predicts that most places would be getting a bit warmer - some places would get bigger increases than other though which would end up diminishing temperature variations. This would have the effect of minimizing weather events, since these are driven by temperature differentials. Other complex systems - I'm thinking ocean currents - may change and redistribute some of their usual effects, but generally speaking most places would rise in temperature a bit.

Anyhow, it's all completely missing the point anyway - we should be aiming as a species to advance to the point where we won't be so terrified of small temperature variations. If all it takes to devastate our global civilization is for the average global temperatures to increase or decrease by a few degrees then we've not yet become sufficiently adaptable. Regardless of who's fault it is these temperature fluctuations DO HAPPEN - even without our help - and chances are that no matter what we do one is going to confront us sooner or later. Why not prepare better technologies NOW to deal with surviving a warmer or colder world rather than obsessing over freezing in place some arbitrary climate model we just happen to have right NOW (earth hasn't always been like this).
 
Barakku
2007-11-06 5:20:22 PM  
Pocket Ninja: Unclear on the Concept Department: Another Fark submitter doesn't understand why "global warming" doesn't mean "everything gets hotter everywhere."

Way I understand it, greenhouse gasses trap sunlight, and more greenhouse gasses means more trapped energy...which means more heat. Heat dissipates, and we really are talking on a "global" scale.

Please explain how it getting hotter doesn't mean it'll...get...hotter?
I keep hearing stories in the paper that blame things like wildfires and droughts on "global warming." I thought this meant some sort of "planet" was getting "warmer," but I'm clearly wrong.
 
PsyLord
2007-11-06 5:21:14 PM  
Pocket Ninja: Unclear on the Concept Department: Another Fark submitter doesn't understand why "global warming" doesn't mean "everything gets hotter everywhere."

Yep, it's surprising that people don't realize that. I blame it on a) the educational system, b) government/industrial spin machines, or c) stupidity. Wait... is there a d) All of the above?
 
phlegmmo [TotalFark]
2007-11-06 5:21:37 PM  
youshallhaveeverbeen: Everybody knows that global warming is caused by excess methane gas.

sooo.. cow farts.

And this guy:

romancatholicblog.typepad.comView Full Size
 
impaler
2007-11-06 5:21:40 PM  
Never mind that CO2 has NEVER in the history of the world initiated warming. The scientific literature is virtually unanimous that CO2 has always lagged temperature.

No it isn't.

Scientific literature shows CO2 and temp to be correlated. There is no lead or lag outside the margin of error.
 
Barakku
2007-11-06 5:22:49 PM  
Manfred J. Hattan: Pocket Ninja: Unclear on the Concept Department: Another Fark submitter doesn't understand why "global warming" doesn't mean "everything gets hotter everywhere."

I'm not smitty, so I can't defend him or her. But if I were to submit this exact headline I would be clear on the concept and cognizant that global warming is not omnipresent. For me, it would work like this: Global warming, if anthropogenic, is caused by burning carbon thingies. For all of Senator Clinton's (laudable, for the record) optimism in the speech from the article, in the near term a credible fight against anthropogenic global warming means exactly one thing: deep reductions in the amount of carbon thingies being burned. Unfortunately, the best way to do that is to increase the price of those thingies. Equally unfortunately, one of the major things that poor people do is burn carbon thingies to heat their homes. So yes, global warming is especially hard on the poor (or at least the fight against it is), but it is supposed to be especially hard on the poor. By design. A person who believes in anthropogenic global warming and who opposes it wants it to be especially hard on the poor.

You...can't burn carbon. All that's left when something burns is carbon. But I get your point, kinda.
 
anonymous
2007-11-06 5:23:09 PM  
Heating oil is expensive -- but necessary -- to pay for the construction of new global sea walls.
 
chi_tino
2007-11-06 5:24:07 PM  
Let's get back on topic here.

Hillary is claiming that solutions to the climate "crisis" is going to drive energy costs DOWN, and save these poor Iowans.

This is the first time that I have ever heard someone take this point of view. It is generally recognized that prices for electricity are only going to go up. The magnitude of that increase is debatable. I see the cost of electricity doubling in the next 5-7 years.
 
Dinjiin [BareFark]
2007-11-06 5:24:11 PM  
Global warming is especially hard for the poor because they can't afford their heating bills


Actually, the issue is that they can't afford their energy bills. In a warming climate, that means rising A/C costs.

That said, there is a simple answer to the issue of being unable to afford the HVAC costs for their house - downsize. Or, using the concept of forethought, don't bite off more than you can chew to begin with.

Just because you could get a 3,000 sq-ft home on the outskirts of the Phoenix metro area for $200,000 doesn't mean you should. Especially since that crackerbox is only going to have the minimum insulation required by code. Which means $300/mo electric bills for the months of June and July.
 
Krymore
2007-11-06 5:24:46 PM  
Skwidd: Global Warming = Bullshiat

Just like gravity, evolution, round earth, and the heliocentric solar system.
 
Hank Rearden
2007-11-06 5:25:16 PM  
How about we STOP recycling.

Instead of moving around all that used carbon, we could just... ya know, leave it in the ground like we used to?

Oh, but then recycling people would have to go find new jobs I guess.

Whatever, fark em.

DON'T RECYCLE! It's a big waste.
 
Barakku
2007-11-06 5:25:20 PM  
PsyLord: Pocket Ninja: Unclear on the Concept Department: Another Fark submitter doesn't understand why "global warming" doesn't mean "everything gets hotter everywhere."

Yep, it's surprising that people don't realize that. I blame it on a) the educational system, b) government/industrial spin machines, or c) stupidity. Wait... is there a d) All of the above?

Wait...so is your point that "OMGZ--their's leik this palce that izn't hotter nowz, lol?"
That really doesn't disprove subby's point. Subby's point isn't true, but unless "Golbal warming" means "Everything/most things get cooler," your point isn't valid.
/OMGZ
 
kirby528
2007-11-06 5:25:35 PM  
oren0 Never mind that CO2 has NEVER in the history of the world initiated warming. The scientific literature is virtually unanimous that CO2 has always lagged temperature.


Wow you're very dense. very very dense. Co2 lags temperature in all those fancy graphs because when more co2 is released, the oceans absorb the remainder until they get to a certain temperature, which is when they release their co2. THIS is why co2 lags temperature increase. If you need me to explain this again, slower, and in different words, just let me know.
 
gradatim
2007-11-06 5:25:43 PM  
have already missed a mortgage or rent payment because of rising energy costs

DUMBASSES, if you have to choose between missing the mortgage/rent payment and skipping the heating bill, then skip the heating bill! If they shut off the heat, you'll at least still have a roof over your head. If you get evicted, then you'll have no place to sleep (or bathe or anything) except outdoors in the cold -- that would suck waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay worse than just not having heat!
 
cretinbob [TotalFark] [OhFark]
2007-11-06 5:25:57 PM  
Yes submitter, you are certainly unclear on the concept.
 
impaler
2007-11-06 5:27:10 PM  
This is the first time that I have ever heard someone take this point of view

This is the first time you've heard of someone suggesting renewable and more efficient energy sources will be cheaper in the long run?

Perhaps you should pay attention.
 
theknuckler_33
2007-11-06 5:28:07 PM  
impaler: FTA:

"The climate crisis is also one of the greatest economic opportunities in the history of our country," she said. "It will unleash a wave of innovation, create millions of new jobs, enhance our security and lead the world to a revolution in how we produce and use energy... One in four low-income families have already missed a mortgage or rent payment because of rising energy costs," Clinton said.

Looks to me she was talking about raising energy costs, and how the battle against global warming will help those that can't afford the raising costs of energy. Then again, I can read things and understand them.

Reading comprehension, FTW!
 
oren0
2007-11-06 5:28:27 PM  
Anyone who doesn't think that climate change is a real problem is stupid and in denial.

Tell that to these guys. Or how about the 17,000 scientists who signed the Oregon Petition? Tell it to the Sixty Scientists. Several credible scientists have expressed disagreement with the IPCC's "consensus". In fact, nobody has really demonstrated that the people studying climate are at any real consensus at all as to the degree of anthropogenic (human-caused) warming. People only think there's a consensus because the UN says so. And we all know the UN is never wrong.

Everyone agrees that the Earth is warmer now than it was 30 years ago, and it's warmer than it was 100 years ago. The question is how much of that is due to people. Anyone who refuses to accept that the science isn't settled yet is ignorant or in denial.
 
chi_tino
2007-11-06 5:28:58 PM  
Dinjiin: Actually, the issue is that they can't afford their energy bills. In a warming climate, that means rising A/C costs.

Even the most paranoid global warmer believes that temperatures will go up by a couple degrees. That is a marginal increase in electricity bills - a few percent over the course of a year.

However, the "solution" of putting in wind/solar/cow fart plants all over the US is going to drive electricity prices significantly higher, like 50 to 150% higher.

Mountains vs molehills.
 
Hank Rearden
2007-11-06 5:29:23 PM  
I've been investing a lot in oil companies.

It's freakin' sweet. You guys should too, its going to be very valuable soon, and you'll all be rich.
 
nologic
2007-11-06 5:30:27 PM  
global warming = personality cult with high priest al
illegal to say prove it
fail to disprove shelved
 
Barakku
2007-11-06 5:30:49 PM  
oren0: Anyone who doesn't think that climate change is a real problem is stupid and in denial.

Tell that to these guys. Or how about the 17,000 scientists who signed the Oregon Petition? Tell it to the Sixty Scientists. Several credible scientists have expressed disagreement with the IPCC's "consensus". In fact, nobody has really demonstrated that the people studying climate are at any real consensus at all as to the degree of anthropogenic (human-caused) warming. People only think there's a consensus because the UN says so. And we all know the UN is never wrong.

Everyone agrees that the Earth is warmer now than it was 30 years ago, and it's warmer than it was 100 years ago. The question is how much of that is due to people. Anyone who refuses to accept that the science isn't settled yet what I believe is ignorant or in denial.

Not making fun of you, but just taking that statement down to its most basic form.
 
Manfred J. Hattan
2007-11-06 5:31:18 PM  
Barakku: You...can't burn carbon. All that's left when something burns is carbon. But I get your point, kinda.

Thanks. Just to defend myself from charges of dumbassery, I referred to carbon "thingies," (coal, oil, gas, etc.). Burning thingies not attached to carbon (free hydrogen or oxygen) is not thought to advance anthropogenic global warming (depending, of course, on how those fuels are derived).
 
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