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(Yahoo)   Alleged carjacker allegedly shot in alleged buttocks, allegedly say alleged police   (news.yahoo.com) divider line
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3285 clicks; posted to Main » on 18 Jan 2007 at 2:13 PM (16 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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Megain
2007-01-18 12:32:12 PM  
[image from megain.smugmug.com too old to be available]
 
N. S. Radieaux
2007-01-18 2:18:03 PM  
So, Mike, you shoot people in the butt and they explode?
 
platypusjones
2007-01-18 2:18:38 PM  
what the hell does that even mean?
 
eva.in.wonderland
2007-01-18 2:19:35 PM  
Lord, he is no longer an ass-grabbin' man...
 
SBBGirl
2007-01-18 2:20:26 PM  
Felt like a bumble bee stung me in the buttocks!
 
SECSManiac
2007-01-18 2:20:38 PM  
FTFA:
A woman in the passenger seat pulled a gun from the glove compartment and fired five shots at Jeffcoat, hitting him once, investigators said.

Someone send her to an certified handgun instructor - we can't have such lousy shots roaming the streets.
 
smage
2007-01-18 2:20:39 PM  
5-shots and one hit to the buttocks? From 3-5 feet away? And people wonder why armed citizens can be scary sometimes, hehe.

/good on her, assuming no stray bullets hit anyone else
 
SaintAwesome
2007-01-18 2:21:40 PM  
"The sheriff said police don't encourage people to go out and "just start shooting,"

Well, dang it. That is exactly what I was fixin' to do after reading that story. I'm glad he told me that he (do not want) that.

Yep... just go out and start shooting. Don't matter what I shoot.. or who... just going out shooting.
 
Surly_Duff
2007-01-18 2:22:39 PM  
hey smitty
Good used of "alleged"...

In a related item, I remember a radio interview a few years back dealing with the topic of Mumia and the death penalty (I know, doesn't seem related - just follow me for a minute here...)

The interviewer kept says that Mumia "allegedly murdered a police officer", but the interviewee was calling Mumia "a convicted murderer". So some dope calls in and starts screaming about how he isn't a convicted murderer but an "alleged convicted murderer".

I almost bust my gut laughing at that one. While the guy may or may not have killed the police officer, there is nothing "alleged" about his conviction! You are either convicted or not - there can be no unproven allegations on that score! :)
 
Thud'nBlunder
2007-01-18 2:23:03 PM  
Was that Buttocks, SC, or Buttocks, FL? Same dumbass either way, I guess.
 
dahmers love zombie
2007-01-18 2:25:09 PM  
That's just so wrong. Nobody should use deadly force against a poor member of the discriminated-against underclass. Maybe he was just trying to get a car to drive to Walmart for baby formula!

People should give criminals anything they ask for. Because hey, a human life is worth more than stuff.
 
jcheatham
2007-01-18 2:25:32 PM  
Boobies...just seeing if everything works. And, oh...sucks to be that guy in the article.
 
Tactful
2007-01-18 2:27:12 PM  
Nice headline submitter.

I also have a story, Surly_Duff:

A local news item recently featured security video of a guy robbing a 7-11. The anchor referred to the man in the video as the "alleged robber". WTF?
 
voice_of_reason
2007-01-18 2:28:14 PM  
Too bad he wasn't illegally crossing the border with 700 pounds of pot. Then the shooter would be convicted, and he could sue the US for $5 million.

/Oh, that's right, the shooter wasn't a Border Control Officer
 
platypusjones
2007-01-18 2:30:03 PM  
tactful

the equally important part of the phrase "innocent until proven guilty" is "in a court of law".

until there, it's allegations all the way down.
 
Jument
2007-01-18 2:33:17 PM  
I bet that that would allegedly sting.
 
Evil Batman
2007-01-18 2:34:00 PM  
Hey Crab Man!
 
tweekster
2007-01-18 2:40:43 PM  
I personally dont use alleged unless there is a legit dispute about whether the person did it.

If he did it in the middle of the street with 20 people watching him plus a video tape of the incident, I dont care, he did it and I will publish that fact.

let him try and sue for defamation, defense exhibit A: the video tape.
 
animalmagnet
2007-01-18 2:45:25 PM  
She fired five shots and hit him once. Where did the other four shots go? I think I'd rather take my chances with the hijacker.
 
catchow
2007-01-18 2:47:25 PM  
Pencil me in with smitty, Tactful, Surly_Duff, and other Farkers annoyed by the superfluous use of the word "alleged." I have more stories than I care to count. It's the most egregious examples that make me literally shriek out loud: "A city police officer is dead of gunshot wounds tonight after allegedly being shot by an unknown assailant. Police have no witnesses, suspects, descriptions, or motives." Exactly WHOM is being protected by the use of "allegedly"? The cop wasn't "allegedly" shot. He really was shot. He's really dead. And someone really shot him. But no one knows who did it. When the cops have a suspect in custody, THEN you can say "Dante Smith is under arrest tonight; he's alleged to have shot a city police officer."

/rant
//Also literally shriek out loud at the constant, annoying (but sometimes amusing) misuse of "literally:" e.g. "The storm literally mushroomed over the East Coast." Um, no.
///slashie rant
 
CptnTriscuit
2007-01-18 2:49:31 PM  
Lt. Dan, ice cream!
 
platypusjones
2007-01-18 2:50:48 PM  
catchow

don't let bad journalism get in the way of good law.
 
catchow
2007-01-18 2:52:28 PM  
platypusjones

don't let bad journalism get in the way of good law.

What the hell does that even mean?
 
Surly_Duff
2007-01-18 2:53:10 PM  
Tactful;
"A local news item recently featured security video of a guy robbing a 7-11. The anchor referred to the man in the video as the "alleged robber". WTF?"

I know, Tactful...it's crazy! Our society has become so hyper vigilant about potential libel and slander lawsuits that speech is sometimes incomprehensible. It's retarded - but it can make for some funny turns-of-phrase.
 
platypusjones
2007-01-18 2:53:58 PM  
tweekster

in the court of public opinion, sure, we can all be judge, jury, and executioner.

but bully for us we have also have courts of law.
 
Vixenbergen
2007-01-18 3:08:07 PM  
[image from baltimoresun.com too old to be available]
And you know how to really get them angry? Point a gun at them!
Then, when they cower in fear, shoot it anywhere!
Then, point the gun at them again! They will be very scared at this point.
 
GlitchCog
2007-01-18 3:10:50 PM  
Ladies and gentlemen of this supposed jury...
 
Sensei Can You See [TotalFark]
2007-01-18 3:10:50 PM  
Surly_Duff: The interviewer kept says that Mumia "allegedly murdered a police officer", but the interviewee was calling Mumia "a convicted murderer". So some dope calls in and starts screaming about how he isn't a convicted murderer but an "alleged convicted murderer".

Dusting off my mental notes from media law classes:

1. If someone has been accused of a crime, you can say "Police accused Smith of shooting the clerk." That's a fact. Even if it turns out Smith DIDN'T shoot the clerk, he was indeed accused.

2. However, when describing the crime you have to say "alleged" or something similar: "Smith allegedly shot the clerk," or "Police say Smith shot the clerk."

3. If someone is convicted, you can legally say "Smith shot the clerk." Most media outlets are still cautious and say "Smith was convicted of shooting the clerk."

Still gets to be a bit much when it even creeps into headlines, though.

/the first thing we do, let's shoot all the lawyers
 
larrimo
2007-01-18 3:11:56 PM  
eva.in.wonderland

Lord, he is no longer an ass-grabbin' man...


On the contrary. I'm sure he grabbed his own after he got shot... And he'll probably be grabbing it more to protect it in jail... KY anyone?
 
Sensei Can You See [TotalFark]
2007-01-18 3:12:53 PM  
Tactful: The anchor referred to the man in the video as the "alleged robber". WTF?

Heh. Yeah, the guy in the video is hardly an alleged robber. If police have arrested somebody but he isn't convicted, you'd have to be careful about saying just who the person in the video is, though.
 
Sensei Can You See [TotalFark]
2007-01-18 3:15:24 PM  
tweekster: If he did it in the middle of the street with 20 people watching him plus a video tape of the incident, I dont care, he did it and I will publish that fact.

And if he gets acquitted he will own you. You can't legally say someone did something unless it is so established in court.

But I join those griping about the overuse of such language out of ignorance or because they have cowardly lawyers.
 
Jument
2007-01-18 3:23:33 PM  
catchow

That's a terrible example. Since there are no witnesses, how do we know the officer was shot? Maybe he fell on a bullet really hard.
 
Pollexabator
2007-01-18 3:30:08 PM  
Pfft, typical women shooters. 5 shots and only one connects (with a buttock) from a few feet away...?!
 
Dimensio [TotalFark]
2007-01-18 3:42:11 PM  
5 shots and only one connects (with a buttock) from a few feet away...?!

Maybe it was a new gun and she'd not familiarized herself with it?

I could get a good grouping pattern off with a GLOCK 28, and I could even get consistent headshots when I took time to aim (at 15yds), but when I went to a 23 (with a larger but narrower frame because of the single-stacked magazine) I kept pulling to the left. You'd have thought I was a total beginner (admittedly, I'm a novice, but I'm not normally THAT bad).
 
Sensei Can You See [TotalFark]
2007-01-18 3:44:53 PM  
Pollexabator: Pfft, typical women shooters. 5 shots and only one connects (with a buttock) from a few feet away...?!

Besides the fact that it's easy to hit something with a gun only in the movies, I wonder just what the distance was. He might have been running away.
 
catchow
2007-01-18 4:12:05 PM  
Jument

That's a terrible argument. Remember, we're talking egregious use of the word "alleged" in the news media. "Alleged" means to report, maintain, or accuse. It's meant to draw a distinction between facts and things which have yet to be proven or supported.

"How do we know the officer was shot?" The police department issued a news release that said so. They wouldn't do this unless the body was in the morgue. The bullet wounds are apparent. The family is grieving ("Quick, someone send a crew to get the obligatory 'grieving spouse w/kids' angle!").

"Maybe he fell on a bullet really hard." Now that's just dumb. The hospital staff and the medical examiners know a bullet wound when they see one. They can tell if it's a self-inflicted wound.

Cop shot: fact. Cop dead: fact. Cop shot by an assailant: fact, based on available evidence. BUT no one knows the identity of the assailant. So s/he cannot be "alleged" to have done anything...yet. Once a suspect is named...or arrested...or killed...then, legally, news outlets do have to be careful what they say until all the facts - and by extension, a conviction - are in.
 
Mr Rusty Shackleford
2007-01-18 4:24:45 PM  
Awesome headline, submitter. I love your strategy of taking one word used in the article and repeating it 4 times to make a stupid and un-funny headline. Bravo.
 
Kill_Da_Wabbit
2007-01-18 5:22:42 PM  
"Lott is calling the couple heroes"

Dangit, I wasn't called a "hero" when I blow 2 holes in a carjacker's chest...Instead, I was hauled downtown for questioning.

/not fun, never heard the word "alleged" either...
//but I did hear "where's your gun?"
 
SteelHorseRider
2007-01-18 5:40:48 PM  
I hereby challenge CNN to make it through one day without using the word Alleged or any of its variants. I'm so sick of their pussyfooting around with the facts. "A man was arrested after allegedly stabbing every witness on the scene." fark that, he did it!
 
Dimensio [TotalFark]
2007-01-18 6:22:32 PM  
Dangit, I wasn't called a "hero" when I blow 2 holes in a carjacker's chest...Instead, I was hauled downtown for questioning.

Really?
 
MartokTheAvenger
2007-01-18 6:35:12 PM  
platypusjones

the equally important part of the phrase "innocent until proven guilty" is "in a court of law".

until there, it's allegations all the way down.

In the case above, if the masked man broke in, but they weren't sure anything had been taken, then yes, it would be an alleged robbery by an alleged robber. However, with video evidence that the masked man took something, there is no alleged about it.
 
Redsrevenge
2007-01-18 7:16:55 PM  
I've always wanted to name my firstborn "alleged."
 
Kill_Da_Wabbit
2007-01-18 7:44:39 PM  
Dimensio

"Really?"

And when they tell you that you have the "right to remain silent" etc...they aren't kidding..

Of course, after disharging a firearm in the front seat of my car, all I heard was "you RING..have the RING...right..RING...to remain...RING"
 
Sensei Can You See [TotalFark]
2007-01-18 7:47:44 PM  
Mr Rusty Shackleford: Awesome headline, submitter. I love your strategy of taking one word used in the article and repeating it 4 times to make a stupid and un-funny headline. Bravo. I wish this was MY greenlight.

Fixed that for ya.
 
Dimensio [TotalFark]
2007-01-18 8:09:04 PM  
In what fascist state did this experience occur, Kill_Da_Wabbit?
 
Kill_Da_Wabbit
2007-01-18 8:12:29 PM  
Texas of course...
 
evilstein
2007-01-18 8:16:14 PM  
"Lott is calling the couple heroes. The sheriff said police don't encourage people to go out and "just start shooting," but they do want people to protect themselves"

here in the Bay Area, some asshats would be demanding justice for the carjacker and holding candlelight vigils. And we'd hear about how we're just supposed to turn the car/etc over to the criminal and call 911. Then his family would be allowed to sue you because you shot the cockbite that was robbing *you*.

Oh, that's right, North Carolina is one of the smart states that actually lets its citizens carry concealed weapons so they *can* defend themselves. Ahh..
 
Dimensio [TotalFark]
2007-01-18 8:17:12 PM  
Texas of course...

Was this a particularly anti-defense city in Texas, or just police on a power trip?

Also, did your hearing recover? What caliber handgun did you use?
 
smage
2007-01-18 8:20:24 PM  
Dimensio: In what fascist state did this experience occur, Kill_Da_Wabbit?

Put yourself in the police officers' shoes:

You arrive on the scene to see one man dead (shot) and another alive (presumably with the gun). It appears to have been an attempted car-jacking, but appearances have been known to be deceiving. You are a law enforcement officer, not a judge. Your job is to keep the peace (and sometimes even, GASP, arrest people). A judge's (and prosecutor's) job is to decide whether or not a crime has been committed.

Still think it's fascist for the police officer to arrest the man still alive at the scene? If so, DIAF.

If the man was convicted of a crime, then get angry at the prosecutor and judge/jury (assuming it's as simple as described), but it's never the police officer's job to decide innocence (good ones actually advise you to remain silent and seek the services of a lawyer; bad ones only do so if they believe you are innocent).
 
Kill_Da_Wabbit
2007-01-18 8:39:02 PM  
Nah, not anti-defense. They warned us during our CHL class that you would be arrested if you used deadly force (in Texas anyway).

I wasn't arrested per say (the bad guy lived), just "asked" to go downtown, read me my rights (basically warning me not to say something stupid, like "how was my grouping?")

Made a statement (with an attorney of course) and waited to see if I was going to have to go before the Grand Jury and or be charged with anything. Pretty obvious it was self defense but you never know for sure.

I used a .380 (I know, WUSS!) the police even told me right then and there as they were taking my gun away, "Um...you might want to consider a .40 or .45"

Hearing came back after a while. The bad guy had me pinned up against the passenger window (he ripped out the driver's window and jumped in) so when I fired, the gun was literally up right next my head...


/carry a .40 now
 
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