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(Yahoo)   Voters shouldn't have to, like, wait in line or anything   (news.yahoo.com) divider line
    More: Asinine  
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624 clicks; posted to Politics » on 12 Sep 2006 at 11:45 AM (16 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2006-09-12 10:44:13 AM  
There were 9 hour lines in Ohio last election. That is a disservice to the voters and no doubt skewed the election results. No one should have to wait longer to vote then they would for a ride in a theme park.
 
2006-09-12 10:55:29 AM  
It's a local issue.

Never had to wait more than 20 minutes for any national election.
 
2006-09-12 11:13:28 AM  
BobtheFascist: It's a local issue.

The problem is, if you have local officials who are (a) running the election, and (b) campaign managers for one side or the other, that could lead to, at the very least, indications of manipulation, right?

Especially if lines were worse in precincts that tended to vote for one side over the other? That might be funny? Look slightly odd?

// Independent electoral system/officials, please
 
2006-09-12 11:14:40 AM  
BobtheFascist

It's a local issue. Never had to wait more than 20 minutes for any national election.

Which is precisely why it is such an important issue. The people in your area had greater representation in the last election due to the fact that they were able to vote in an orderly fashion. You don't see a problem here?
 
2006-09-12 11:18:54 AM  
You shouldn't have to miss a day of work to vote, plain and simple.
 
2006-09-12 11:40:03 AM  
There were 9 hour lines in Ohio last election

that's incompetence by the county. a half-hour wait in a presidential year is the most, in my opinion. i kept mine below that in 2004, and i even set up two lines to get people signed in.
 
2006-09-12 11:45:32 AM  
I waited in line for four hours in North West Washington, DC. My partner had to wait for three hours in Philadelphia. It is a bigger problem then just a few counties.
 
2006-09-12 11:46:13 AM  
BTW, good for you for volunteering albo.
 
2006-09-12 11:52:23 AM  
From TFA: "Even then, if only 538 Floridians who came to the precincts did not vote due to the widely reported long lines, the election outcome would be in doubt."

Uh, no. Even if only 538 Floridians, every single one of whom would have voted for Vice President Gore, even though the whole rest of the state split down the middle, did not vote...

This is a real issue, an many municipalities ought to do a better job. And nothing will make it a non-issue faster than proponents of change playing fast and loose with facts.

Black Box has done more harm to electoral reform than Diebold with their crap.
 
2006-09-12 11:56:31 AM  
Another reason why we need a national holiday for voting?
 
2006-09-12 11:57:01 AM  
I never had to wait more than 10 minutes.
 
2006-09-12 11:57:29 AM  
I've never had to wait in a line, ever. Always been several empty booths waiting.

Then again, our voter turnout bites.
 
2006-09-12 11:59:48 AM  
It takes a fairly large leap of faith to think that all people that had to wait in line were going to vote a particular way.
 
2006-09-12 12:00:32 PM  
Just like with schools, the poorer the area the crappier their infrastructure is. Good on all you with no voting lines for living in a nice area.
 
2006-09-12 12:05:50 PM  
Awesome, I love feigned ignorance or apathy in an attempt to justify screwing people out of their right to vote.
 
2006-09-12 12:08:20 PM  
robrr2003
It takes a fairly large leap of faith to think that all people that had to wait in line were going to vote a particular way.


Or, a particularly rudimentary understanding of statistics.

If properly performed polls indicate that a particular population will have a higher probability of voting for candidate X, then a manipulation of the opportunity to vote for voters in that district will have the probable affect of fewer votes for candidate X.

These people aren't stupid. When the republican administrations in two swing states realize a handful of voters will decide the national election, you bet your sweet arse that they will try to swing the vote their way.

To dismiss the possibility completely out of hand is rather disingenuous.
 
2006-09-12 12:08:41 PM  
I've never been killed in a terrorist attack.

Therefore, terrorist attacks don't happen

Solipsism, much?
 
2006-09-12 12:14:36 PM  
I say for get Reps completely, obsolete with the invention of the internet.

Just set up a huge board where people can post all the propositions they want, and once 100K SSN based signatures, it becomes a bill, then vote online once based on your SSN. anyone with eonough support can get anything passed in this manner. then just keep the courts around to say if it is constitutional.

Or even make it more simple. Keep reps, but don't let them vote. Public internet vote on all laws. No reason not to have a direct democracy anymore.
 
2006-09-12 12:21:27 PM  
Voting shouldn't require a heroic act of patience

Is this really what the word heroic has come to? Simply standing in line for a long period of time is heroic? What a joke.
 
2006-09-12 12:22:12 PM  
Does "asinine" refer to the article or submitters summation of same?
 
2006-09-12 12:31:17 PM  
everyone needs to fight for their right to vote - fight against hunger, thirst, a tired back and the need to use the bathroom, often under heroic conditions of B.O. wafting from the hambone in front of you...
 
2006-09-12 12:37:22 PM  
Weaver95 [TotalFark]
I never had to wait more than 10 minutes.

Do you live in a heavily-Democratic precinct in Ohio?
 
2006-09-12 12:39:50 PM  
LaoTsu128: No reason not to have a direct democracy anymore.

Y'know, aside from preventing mobocracy and another Reign of Terror.
 
2006-09-12 12:49:50 PM  
Just like with schools, the poorer the area the crappier their infrastructure is. Good on all you with no voting lines for living in a nice area.

This bears repeating in bold and italic even since most lower income areas tend to vote Democratic.
 
2006-09-12 12:58:32 PM  
Petey4335: This bears repeating in bold and italic even since most lower income areas tend to vote Democratic.

Eh, there are plenty of poor white trash who live vicariously through the rich and vote republican.
 
2006-09-12 1:02:10 PM  
KyngNothing, vazrtian

Actually, over the past 3 major elections I've lived in both a low income neighborhood in Mpls & a more middle class neighborhood in Phx. Both have had excellent access for voters. Easy access polling locations and relatively short lines. MN is a blue state, AZ is red. I really don't buy too much into the myth that one makes it easier than the other.

In MN, on site registration is a cake walk. Simply walk in w/ a valid ID & a utility bill, fill out a short form & you're a legitimate voter in minutes.

In AZ, they do a great job of informing you of exactly where you need to go, the polling hours & the issues at hand. About a month ago I recieved by mail a booklet with very straight forward descriptions of the local issues we'll be voting on, pros, cons, etc.

I can only base my opinions on my experience. Fortunately, they've been good. Should that change, chances are my opinions will as well.
 
2006-09-12 1:10:18 PM  
Heh. While I agree anything over an hour (under normal conditions) is ridiculous - you folks DO realize that the numbers of workers and machines is determined by the local folks, right? Every time I hear complaints and conspiracy theories about how overwhelmingly Dem districts supposedly get shortchanged to suppress the Dem vote, I wince thinking how stupid you have to be to believe that standards and support levels set by local DEMS are part of a Republican conspiracy.

As for the "most lower income areas tend to vote Democratic".
I think you should state that in reverse instead ...
most areas that vote Democratic tend to become lower income areas.

FSM knows it works that way in New Orleans........
 
2006-09-12 1:13:18 PM  
Sloth_DC

I am intrigued as to how that is exaactly you came to this conclusion. I still support checks, (keep a president and executive) and still am for a judiciary. But in my experience congress rarly seems to be bending to the will of the people, on both sides. this seems like a good way to remove partisanship entirely. You always vote your heart on each issue, and it always counts.
 
2006-09-12 1:21:17 PM  
LaoTsu128

I'm pretty sure they tried that in ancient Greece. Didn't work out so well.

People are jerks. It makes no difference if you have 535 selfish pricks making the decisions or 300,000,000.
 
2006-09-12 1:22:00 PM  
LaoTsu128: I am intrigued as to how that is exaactly you came to this conclusion. I still support checks, (keep a president and executive) and still am for a judiciary.

The president *is* the executive. And, you know, the French had an executive at the start of the Reign of Terror, too. Course, he lost 'is head before it was over...
 
2006-09-12 1:23:29 PM  
LaoTsu128

Also...

How long do you think it would take a computer to vote on the behalf of 999,999,999 social security numbers?

Representative democracy has nothing to do with a lack of technology.
 
2006-09-12 1:26:49 PM  
I had to wait for over 3 hours in the '04 general election. I live in a very blue collar area (that's right, lots of Dem voting union folk). My parents, who live in an affluent area very close to me walked in, voted, walked out. It was a f*cked up election.
 
2006-09-12 1:29:08 PM  
2wheeljunkie: I had to wait for over 3 hours in the '04 general election. I live in a very blue collar area (that's right, lots of Dem voting union folk). My parents, who live in an affluent area very close to me walked in, voted, walked out.

1) Have you considered the relative population densities?
2) Have you presented your concerns to you local, County, and State election boards?
 
2006-09-12 1:29:36 PM  
maddogdelta
These people aren't stupid. When the republican administrations in two swing states realize a handful of voters will decide the national election, you bet your sweet arse that they will try to swing the vote their way.

I agree 100%
But how does the republican administration, control the voting lines in districts that are run primarily by Democrats?
 
2006-09-12 2:07:08 PM  
Sloth_DC

Ok, i am still missing your point. The only difference i propose is to have individuals vote instead of voting in reps to vote. We will even kkeep the house and senate to write bills, just not vote. Nothing will change, except laws will accurately reflect the will of the people.

Dr. Jesus
I can see that to be a problem. Isurely a brilliant programmer or two could create a fairly secure system, and vote tracking could prevent possible fraud. I know there is holes on the technical side, and am willing to concede that.
Also, wy was greece so bad, other than the whole easily conquered thing?
 
2006-09-12 2:12:52 PM  
Sloth_DC: 1) Have you considered the relative population densities?

Well, if there are more people, shouldn't there be more machines?

Yes, I have notified the BoE. I'll be furious if they let the old guy with palsy look up names again. I'm sure this was the major delay. It took this old bastage a solid 5 minutes to look up my name.
 
2006-09-12 2:20:32 PM  
2wheeljunkie : Yes, I have notified the BoE. I'll be furious if they let the old guy with palsy look up names again. I'm sure this was the major delay. It took this old bastage a solid 5 minutes to look up my name.

You do realize that the poll workers are volunteers, right? If you feel so strongly about it, you COULD actually volunteer yourself (plan on using a vacation day) instead of being all pissed off that some elderly retired guy is doing the (free) job you didn't want to do.
 
2006-09-12 2:22:25 PM  
Well here in sunny Maryland where the primaries are taking place, a large number of voting precincts are completely gridlocked because a variety of factors. The news is reporting that many people have given up and just gone to work. Low voter turnout favors the incumbent. So I'm guessing I'll be stuck with the same crooked state legislators for a few more years. Great.
 
2006-09-12 2:25:20 PM  
Has Bush v. Gore Become the Case That Must Not Be Named?

The heart of Bush v. Gore's analysis was its holding that the recount was unacceptable because the standards for vote counting varied from county to county. "Having once granted the right to vote on equal terms," the court declared, "the state may not, by later arbitrary and disparate treatment, value one person's vote over that of another." If this equal protection principle is taken seriously, if it was not just a pretext to put a preferred candidate in the White House, it should mean that states cannot provide some voters better voting machines, shorter lines, or more lenient standards for when their provisional ballots get counted - precisely the system that exists across the country right now.

[...]

The courts should also stand by Bush v. Gore's equal protection analysis for the simple reason that it was right (even if the remedy of stopping the recount was not). Elections that systematically make it less likely that some voters will get to cast a vote that is counted are a denial of equal protection of the law. The conservative justices may have been able to see this unfairness only when they looked at the problem from Mr. Bush's perspective, but it is just as true when the N.A.A.C.P. and groups like it raise the objection.
 
2006-09-12 2:49:17 PM  
bmasso: If you feel so strongly about it, you COULD actually volunteer yourself

I've actually been thinking about it. I have a friend that does it, and he finds it rewarding.
 
2006-09-12 3:18:41 PM  
I've always been a 'conscience' voter, a waster of votes. But I've never understood voting for a party. Stood in line for what seemed like an eternity to vote, which isn't so long when you see people in other countries stand in line for a couple of days to vote. But then you see how (percentage-wise)low our turnout is, and realise that if we had their turnout percentage, we would also be in line all day.

While visiting in another state last year, I met a would-be conscience voter who brought up something I'd not thought about:

How hard it is not to vote for one of the 2 parties in a 'winner-take-all' state. What a load of crap that is. Talk about feeling like you're wasting a vote! Of the many things that should be changed, that ought to be pretty high on the list.

 
2006-09-12 4:44:39 PM  
We've got mail-in ballots in Oregon. Solves all of these problems as far as I can tell.
 
2006-09-12 6:13:22 PM  
pontechango: Has Bush v. Gore Become the Case That Must Not Be Named?

The heart of Bush v. Gore's analysis was its holding that the recount was unacceptable because the standards for vote counting varied from county to county. "Having once granted the right to vote on equal terms," the court declared, "the state may not, by later arbitrary and disparate treatment, value one person's vote over that of another." If this equal protection principle is taken seriously, if it was not just a pretext to put a preferred candidate in the White House, it should mean that states cannot provide some voters better voting machines, shorter lines, or more lenient standards for when their provisional ballots get counted - precisely the system that exists across the country right now.


Umm, those elections are *STATE* elections. Differences from county to county are reasonable to look at. Differences between different States are not, because it is not a national election - each State election is discrete.
 
2006-09-12 6:14:19 PM  
LaoTsu128: Ok, i am still missing your point. The only difference i propose is to have individuals vote instead of voting in reps to vote. We will even kkeep the house and senate to write bills, just not vote. Nothing will change, except laws will accurately reflect the will of the people.

Ah, ok, I'm kinda with you there, I suppose.
 
2006-09-12 6:46:54 PM  
I am tired of the complaining of long vote lines and inadiquate machines being placed on the fed gov. If you know there are routinely understaffed polls where you live, take the day off and do a civic duty, help your fellow man out. If you know the machines might not be up to par, get involved with the local govt, collect money independantly for new machines, anything. Just try. Do. Care. Stop biatching and do something.

/never waited longer than 10 min to get in a booth
//good people and good equipment in my district
 
2006-09-12 7:03:54 PM  
LaoTsu128 --
Hell, no. At least there's a theoretical possibility of a representative having a modicum of understanding of what he's voting on, given that it's his freakin' job to do so and that he gets a staffing budget. Random voters aren't exactly reknowned for being highly informed on even large issues (ex -- how many voters would know what the Doha round of talks covered; or basics like the difference between a patent, a copyright and a trademark?) -- let alone have any familiarity with the structure of the International Criminal Court or the current regulations regarding genetically modified produce.
 
2006-09-12 7:42:45 PM  
Gosling: I've never had to wait in a line, ever. Always been several empty booths waiting.

Then again, our voter turnout bites.


Seems to me that the Dems might make more headway on this issue if they presented it as a good problem to have to solve rather than part of the Vast Right-Wing Conspiracy™.
 
2006-09-12 7:44:26 PM  
Petey4335: most lower income areas tend to vote Democratic

Hmmm. If that's the case why do the Democrats keep blaming this on Republicans?
 
2006-09-12 7:48:20 PM  
SustainedHavoc: I've always been a 'conscience' voter, a waster of votes.

Nonsense. The only way to waste your vote is to fail to use it.
 
2006-09-12 7:49:48 PM  
Sloth_DC: Umm, those elections are *STATE* elections. Differences from county to county are reasonable to look at. Differences between different States are not, because it is not a national election - each State election is discrete.

Doesn't matter. The Equal Protection Clause is part of the Constitution and it applies to the election of your local dogcatcher just as much as it does to the election of the US president.
 
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