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(National Review)   The UN wants to station troops in Lebanon. MORE troops, actually--they've had troops there since 1978, who have done nothing but help Hezbollah attack Israel   (article.nationalreview.com) divider line
    More: Scary  
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451 clicks; posted to Politics » on 25 Jul 2006 at 1:35 PM (16 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



20 Comments     (+0 »)
 
2006-07-25 11:34:32 AM  
"In January 2005, Hezbollah planted five camouflaged “improvised explosive devices” (IEDs), inches on the Israeli side of the border near Zarit, 15 mountainous miles inland from the Mediterranean coast. The Israeli Defense Force (IDF) detected these IEDs and, following procedure, notified UNIFIL. A French UNIFIL engineer duly certified that the devices were indeed IEDs, then “requested” that Hezbollah remove them. Hezbollah, not denying it had planted them, flatly refused, stating that since the mines were (just barely) inside the “Zionist” border, it was up to the “Zionists” to remove them. So the IDF sent in a large armored bulldozer to carry the mines off for disposal. This task required making a sharp 90-degree right turn from an Israeli road onto the narrow border trail where the IEDs were located. Making this sharp right turn, the left front corner of the bulldozer inevitably occupied, for a couple of seconds, about a meter of land on the Lebanese side. During those seconds a Hezbollah fighter directed an anti-tank missile at the narrow, unguarded windshield of the bulldozer. The pinpoint strike, which our Israeli sources have admitted required extraordinary training and skill, killed the bulldozer’s driver, Sgt. Maj. Jan Rotzanski, a 21-year-old Russian immigrant from Herzliya."
 
2006-07-25 11:40:05 AM  
Wow, that UNFIL engineer really showed that Jewish bulldozer driver! Man, that's cold!
 
2006-07-25 12:09:10 PM  
The thing that always gets me is that for a nation who is under constant threat from it's neighbors, Israel has a really crappy border defense.
 
2006-07-25 12:13:46 PM  
and is commanded by French major-general Alain Pellegrini...

Well, there ya go
 
2006-07-25 12:22:15 PM  
So, TheCraneMeister, does that mean that Israel is going to start bombing Paris, because the UNIFIL engineer was French?
 
2006-07-25 12:30:27 PM  
From http://www.un.org/Depts/dpko/missions/unifil/

UNIFIL was created in 1978 to confirm Israeli withdrawal from Lebanon, restore the international peace and security, and help the Lebanese Government restore its effective authority in the area.

It isn't UNIFIL's job to remove IEDs or to protect one side from the other. They're UN observers. Not a fighting force. Not an engineering batallion. Observers. Their role is to keep both sides somewhat honest. It's a sucky position to be in, and plenty of them have been killed doing it.

Sucks for the dozer driver - but the fault lies with his superior officers. Way to secure the area first!

The whole story is re-cock-ulous... as if there's some link between the dozer occupying "a meter of land on the Lebanese side" and them firing on the driver. Sheesh - it's not like there's a big yellow first-down line people. Are we supposed to believe that Hezbollah had a bunch of guys in surveyors gear hanging out right there... "wait for it... wait for it... yup, he crossed the line, nail him". That story is fishier than smitty's mom's drawers.
 
2006-07-25 12:34:40 PM  
Yeah, why couldn't the Lebanese army that was a quarter of the size of Hezbollah, staffed with its supporters, and dealing with a country continually erupting in civil war do more. The reason the UN didn't act more is because then, as now, it would have ripped the country apart. I really wish they could have torn into them, and stopped being so by the letter, but it would have caused so much more bloodshed all over the country. Really, they were trying to choose between a quick orgy of death with an indeterminate outcome and a long slow bleed with an indeterminate outcome. Maybe it was trying to choose between mainly military deaths on the Israeli side or a mix of military and civilian deaths on the Lebanese side. Definitely a lesser of two evils choice to two very nasty evils.
 
2006-07-25 12:34:53 PM  
The thing that always gets me is that for a nation who is under constant threat from it's neighbors, Israel has a really crappy border defense.

And when they do build a wall, everyone biatches and moans that they are creating a ghetto by locking others out.
 
2006-07-25 12:37:32 PM  
The CraneMeister: So the IDF sent in a large armored bulldozer to carry the mines off for disposal. This task required making a sharp 90-degree right turn from an Israeli road onto the narrow border trail where the IEDs were located. Making this sharp right turn, the left front corner of the bulldozer inevitably occupied, for a couple of seconds, about a meter of land on the Lebanese side. During those seconds a Hezbollah fighter directed an anti-tank missile at the narrow, unguarded windshield of the bulldozer.

Why would Hezbollah have waited for the dozer to cross the line?? They don't care, remember??

clgrin: Yeah, why couldn't the Lebanese army that was a quarter of the size of Hezbollah, staffed with its supporters, and dealing with a country continually erupting in civil war do more. The reason the UN didn't act more is because then, as now, it would have ripped the country apart.

That and there wasn't really a native lebanese govt until just this year, right? (Cough, hint, Syria)
 
2006-07-25 12:38:07 PM  
To clarify - the hezzbollah chappies are obviously going to take a potshot at any softish IDF target that wanders into range no matter which side of the border it's on - they're a terrorist organization, recognizing international borders isn't real high on their TTD list.

Right on the frigging border should have struck the IDF honchos as a risky proposition. There should have been air cover for the dozer driver to make sure there were no threats (like a surveying team in black and green masks with a big yellow first down line and an anti-tank missile) in the area.
 
2006-07-25 1:27:54 PM  
my_word_is_poontang & clgrin

Exactly. The UN can only do what it is asked to do and what Israel and Lebanon allow it to do. Lebanon can't do much without reigniting a civil war. Hezbollah is a fact of life in Southern Lebanon for the time being.
 
2006-07-25 1:40:24 PM  
...In conclusion, smitty is an idiot.
 
2006-07-25 1:43:39 PM  
err.....any takers on the IDF's 500,000 land mines in Southern Lebanon, the locations of which they repeatedly refuse to disclose to the UN..........ooooohhhhh what an anti-semitic thing to say, forget the fact that most Lebanese and Middle Easterners are semitic. OI stop with the truth, it desperately undermines the national security of bla bla bla
 
2006-07-25 1:53:16 PM  
Israel use borderline illegal weaponry and not tell anybody about it? That's unpossible!
 
2006-07-25 1:55:42 PM  
Devil Slide Wolf

Contrary to what logic would dictate, here is the definitions of semitic and anti-semetic. Just to clear things up for you:

Se·mit·ic ( P ) Pronunciation Key (s-mtk)
adj.
Of or relating to the Semites or their languages or cultures.
Of, relating to, or constituting a subgroup of the Afro-Asiatic language group that includes Arabic, Hebrew, Amharic, and Aramaic.

n.
The Semitic languages.
Any one of the Semitic languages.


an·ti-Sem·ite (nt-smt, nt-)
n.
One who discriminates against or who is hostile toward or prejudiced against Jews.


anti-Se·mitic (-s-mtk) adj.
1: relating to or characterized by anti-Semitism; hating Jews 2: discriminatory especially on the basis of race or religion


 
2006-07-25 2:15:42 PM  
IHateHipHop

...In conclusion, smitty is I am an idiot.

Like iron81 alluded to, the UN can only do what Israel and Lebanon allow them to do. If Hezbollah/Lebanon decide that the UN can go fark itself, it doesn't exactly make sense for people to be pushing the whole UN peacekeeping force thing does it. That story was anecdotal support (debate the merits yourself) for the thesis, as the whole involvement of UNIFIL in this situation was rendered a hopelessly pointless waste of time.
 
2006-07-25 2:35:25 PM  
redmid17

This doesn't mean that the UN is useless. It has kept the peace successfully in many areas, including the Israel-Egypt border. The key is for there to be the political will for low-intensity combat, both from the UN and the nations contributing the troops. Now that the world is focused on Lebanon, this will now exists where it didn't 3 weeks ago. The UN can be a part of the eventual cease fire.
 
2006-07-25 2:38:50 PM  
Devil Slide Wolf

As for the landmines, the IDF does provide maps of landmines that occupied Lebanese territory. The problem of landmines in southern Lebanon comes from landmines laid during combat that weren't properly documented(you try to document every landmine when worrying about getting shot), landmines laid by Hezzbollah and militias, also including unexploded ordnance. Both sides are guilty of the landmine, UXO problem.
 
2006-07-25 4:21:58 PM  
WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA! Evil sand people are killing Israeli's!

It is therefore Israel's RIGHT to kill 10 times their number!

/Way to win friends and influence people
//Assholes
 
2006-07-26 2:34:53 PM  
"2006-07-25 04:21:58 PM Dave The Slushy

WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA! Evil sand people are killing Israeli's!

It is therefore Israel's RIGHT to kill 10 times their number!

/Way to win friends and influence people
//Assholes"

If needed to stop the first group of killings, yes, it is thier right.
 
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