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21810 clicks; posted to Main » on 11 Feb 2005 at 9:12 AM (13 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2005-02-11 12:41:16 PM  
Holly_Wright

Dang, EVERYONE is showing up for this party. We have you and Walking Carpet and hebalo and nutzngum and every other person who loves to bash Christians. This is going to be fun.
 
2005-02-11 12:41:48 PM  
LEXSLAMMAN

"Christianity is the most politicized and overbearing religion of all time, and that is why it poses such a threat to our government and our freedom."

I disagree, i dont think its the religion, be it christianity or islam or aztec snake worshipping or whatever is the problem; religions and how they're practiced is a benchmark by which a society can be measured. If societies are literate, wealthy, happy etc their institutions will be correspondingly "liberal" (now i mean that in a classical not contemporary american partisan poliitcal sense). Conversely, if a group of people are savages, poor, helpless etc their religious beliefs will reflect that. If your society is civilized, so is your religion.

Christianity isnt a threat, its just an instituion which is as benevolent or vile as any other; it depends on who's wielding it.
 
2005-02-11 12:42:58 PM  
TappingTheVein:
mugato: Goddammit if the Jews can't wait for something to whine about

From previous threads i recall that you are not a fan of jews in general, and that's an understatement. What some jewish organizations were worried, i believe, is that some people have a problem telling reality from what they see on film so when in a scene like the one where some jewish cleric said that "the blame is on us" (it was cut from the theatrical version), some people will take that literally and act accordingly.
Actually, the line was not cut from the theatrical version. It's still there, albeit without the English subtitle. Anyone who remembers a little of their high school Latin would get the point.

The actual words in the Bible (Matt 27:25, KJV) are, "His blood be on us, and on our children!" (right after Pontius Pilate symbolically washes his hands "of the blood of this just person"). Another line that has also been used by anti-Semitics for the past couple of millennia is, "We have no king but Cæsar!" (John 19:15 - right after Pilate asks, "Shall I crucify your King?"), which is taken as the moment that the Jews ceased to be God's chosen people, having finally and completely denied Him as their King either directly or indirectly (through the kingly line of Judah through David) and accepted the Kingship of a man not annointed by God (Cæsar). That, too, remained in the theatrical version, spoken in Latin, but had its English subtitle removed.

I think, though, that when it comes to placing blame for the death of Christ, that His own words in John 10:17-18 trump all else. Nobody killed Him. Though mortal, He was still the Son of God, and no man nor men could kill Him against His will. He laid down His life of His own will, by His own power (which is why He died long before Crucifixion victims normally did). He gave up the ghost, freely. Too bad that those who through the ages, from the Diaspora through Hitler, used Jews as scapegoats and got great mileage from the two passages mentioned in the previous paragraph, didn't also read this passage (or, if they did, didn't let the people know about it - remember, the Church kept the Bible out of the hands of the masses for centuries, and once printing was invented, even executed people who dared to translate or print Bibles for the masses - I believe that this passage is one reason why - anti-Semitism would've been greatly defused had that passage been as common knowledge as it is today).

Of course, if the Jews did
kill Jesus, well, since the vast majority of versions of Christianity hold that Jesus's sacrifice is what enables us to be saved from our sins, we should thank them instead of persecuting them! They enabled our salvation! (Actually, since Jesus was a Jew Himself, they did anyway.)


To all who say how this movie was such a great portrayal of the suffering of Jesus - it didn't even come close to portraying His real suffering! The movie glossed over that part in the very beginning!

Lots and lots of people were crucified in Roman times. Many were crucified in worse ways than Jesus (Peter traditionally was crucified upside-down, at his own request since he felt unworthy to die the same way that Jesus did). Scourging was also very often a part of the process. Jesus did not suffer physically above and beyond many others who have died in horrible ways throughout history.

His real suffering was spiritual. That was the part that He, and He alone, could suffer - such suffering would destroy a normal human instantly. The body would refuse to live another moment in the face of such suffering.

Here's why: Jesus spent His whole life totally sinless. He had to, to be the perfect, spotless Lamb of God, the ultimate sacrifice. And yet, Satan was free to tempt Him, not just with the three great temptations in the wilderness forty days after His Baptism, but also throughout His life. Satan tempted Him much, much more than He tempts any of us, because Satan knew that all he had to do was get Him to sin, just once, to any degree, and the Atonement would be nullified before it could happen, and he would have all of us, forever! Paul recounts that Jesus was tempted in all things as we are, yet without sin. Makes sense: how could Jesus's Atonement apply to any sin whose temptation He Himself had never faced and utterly defeated without ever giving into it Himself?

Okay, now keep this in mind: Jesus lived for over three decades like this. Tempted constantly in all things as we are, tempted far more strongly, and yet never once giving in, to the least degree.

Now, imagine: after all of that, after having lived such a perfect, sinless life for decades, suddenly He feels remorse for the first time in His life. Have you ever felt remorse? Not a pleasant emotion, that. But in Gethsamanee, when He took the bitter cup, it was not the cup of His mere physical torture and death. Those were merely the sealings of His Atonement. As with the sacrifical lambs that were temporary substitutes preceeding Him, first the sins of the people were placed on the sacrifice, and then the sacrifice was killed.

When Jesus took the bitter cup, the sins of the whole world were placed upon Him. Think about it: at that moment, all at once, He felt the combined remorse for every single sin ever committed, or that would everbe committed. Everything evil that you, or I, or anyone else - in fact, everyone else - had ever done or would ever do, He felt the combined remorse for, as if He had done them Himself even though He never actually sinned even once! That, not mere fear of the physical torture and death that lay before Him, was what tormented Him so much in the Garden that great drops of blood fell from every pore (that alone would kill a normal person)!

Compared to that, the events so hideously portrayed in The Passion were an anticlimax!

Yes, He died for us. But, even more importantly, He lived for us. Decades living a sinless life under the worst temptations ever, only to suffer the combined remorse for all sins as if He had done them all Himself.

Also, of course, He lived again for us, defeating Death itself by His Resurrection (the first ever: Lazarus and others were merely resuscitated, not resurrected - a resuscitated person is still mortal and dies again, while a resurrected person is immortal - Jesus was the first fruits of the Resurrection).
 
2005-02-11 12:43:42 PM  
2005-02-11 12:19:17 PM AspiringPhilosopher [TotalFark]

Wytchocolate

A Mike_71 card?!?

You sunk my battleship!


Ask him about turtles and how it relates to him thinking homosexuality is completely wrong.
 
2005-02-11 12:45:22 PM  
Holly_Wright

Preach on, sistah! Preach on!

Now that's what I'm talking about!
 
2005-02-11 12:45:27 PM  
If I told you that a friend of a friend of mine could heal the sick , raise the dead , and walk on water without any evidence , would you believe me?



Umm... no. That is why the people who actually had this happen to them were around to answer questions as to what happened. Do you not think people went to every person Jesus talked to or dealt with in his entire life and tried to find sins he had committed. Do you honestly believe this did not happen? Christians were claiming Jesus was perfect. Not just good but PERFECT. Every person who could disprove this was alive. I do not think you understand the scrutiny the disciples were put under. Every statement was looked at and attempted to be proven false. Every miracle ascribed to Jesus was checked out. It passed the test of the hardest scrutiny in history.
 
2005-02-11 12:47:00 PM  
I thought Mike_71 went over to Iraq to defend all the gimpy-legged Americans from the freedom-haters.
 
2005-02-11 12:47:01 PM  
Dansker

I'm not leaving because of you. I'm not afraid of you or anything.

I will agree that I got the verses from that website, I'm sorry for not double-checking them against another source. I apologize if those verses were not accurate, like I said, I don't have my actual Bible with me.

I just don't want to get into "Is the Bible true?". My intention on entering this conversation was to talk about the movie.

My last post wasn't directed towards you. I don't know if you saw the movie or not. I was just saying how people are commenting on this movie without seeing it. That's the exact reason I won't comment on "9-11". I didn't see it, and will hold my judgement on it until I do.

I have read almost all the Bible, but I'm afraid I can't quote it from memory from you. It's kinda a long book.

I am a strong believer, and if misquoting a verse makes you think I am not one, than that's your opinion. Sorry again for the mistake. I'll be more careful about quoting Scripture next time.
 
2005-02-11 12:48:17 PM  
JEE-YUH-ZUSSSSS!
 
2005-02-11 12:50:20 PM  
 
2005-02-11 12:51:04 PM  
walkingtall:

Dang, EVERYONE is showing up for this party. We have you and Walking Carpet and hebalo and nutzngum and every other person who loves to bash Christians. This is going to be fun.

I don't love to bash Christians. I just like to point out how hypocritical most Christians are.

If they really followed the teachings of Jesus, we wouldn't even have half the flamewars about Christianity that we do.

Instead, all Christians do is hate, a vile, disgusting form of hatred wrapped in a cloak of faith and that makes me mad.

Also, they've done a bang-up job of infiltrating our government which is just fantastic. I think Christians are blind to how important the seperation of church and state is to the health of our nation.
 
2005-02-11 12:51:33 PM  
2005-02-11 12:41:16 PM walkingtall

Holly_Wright

Dang, EVERYONE is showing up for this party. We have you and Walking Carpet and hebalo and nutzngum and every other person who loves to bash Christians. This is going to be fun.


It's fun bashing those who believe in Christ and try to live his life? I understand Mike_71 and Bevets bashing, because it's easy and believe blindly. I'm a Christian and I do it. Maybe that's what you meant.
 
2005-02-11 12:52:22 PM  
COMALite J

That was an AWESOME post. My hat is off to you. Did you just write that or did you cut and paste from other debates?
 
2005-02-11 12:53:12 PM  
Open your hearts to christ, only through the love of Christ can you achieve everlasting life. All Praise is due to Our heavenly father, and his only begotten son, and thier' prophet George W Bush. When the hellfire of armageddon scorches the unfaithful, The Christians will take thier place beside the king of kings. The true children of god must stand firm against the evils of baby killing whores who murder thier unborn children, and the blasphemous homosexuals who wish to recruit our children for their deviant behavior. Damnation upon the Jewish elite and thier lying media, who try to subvert America from the Christian paradise it was meant to be.

Let us pray for New Jerusalem here in the USA..............
In the Name of the Father, The son, and the holy shiat I almost convinced myself there for a second. Instead all you christ lovers can sing this song.

I need you in my life, Jesus.
I can't live without you, Jesus
And I just want to feel you deep inside me, Jesus....
Don't ever leave me, Jesus. I couldn't stand to see you go.
My heart would simply snap, my Lord, if you walked on out that door.
I promise I'll be good to you, and keep you warm at night.
Jesus, Jesus, Jesus, why don't we just... shut off the lights...
The Shepherd and the Light, and His Word lifted me up
And I praise His Holy Name wherever I go...
I'll take good care of you baby. Call you my baby, baby!
You died for my sins, and you know that I would die for you, right?
What's the matter, baby? You tremble at Jesus, baby!
Your love... is my life! You know when Im without you, there's a black hole in my life! Oo-ohhh!
I wanna believe. It's all right, 'cause I get lonely in the night and it's up to you to
Save me! Jee...sus...bay-by...
Oh Lord you are my Savior! You know I miss you so much when you are gone...
Yes I may be born again, but I was wasn't born again yesterday...
I wanna get down on my knees and start pleasing Jesus! I wanna feel his salvation all over my face...
The Body of Christ! Sleek swimmer's body, all muscled up and toned!
The Body of Christ! O, Lord Almighty, I wish I could call it my own...You're one time, two times, three times my Savior...Whenever I see Jesus up on that Cross I can't help but think that he looks kinda hot...
 
2005-02-11 12:54:45 PM  
Wytchocolate

It's fun bashing those who believe in Christ and try to live his life? I understand Mike_71 and Bevets bashing, because it's easy and believe blindly. I'm a Christian and I do it. Maybe that's what you meant.


We are each responsible for our own faith but please tell me why you consider yourself a Christian. If my memory serves you are not a Christian. If I am wrong I apologize but your past posts do not jibe with your current claim unless I am mistaken.
 
2005-02-11 12:56:18 PM  
Got a hard-on for heathen-on-Christ violence? Screw Mel Gibson. Check out The Mashin' of the Christ. Brought to you by the fine folks of Negativland.
 
2005-02-11 12:56:51 PM  
It's abundantly clear that walkingtall knows next to nothing about early X-tianity and is doing his usual habbit of making broad sweaping statements without even providing detail, let alone verifyiable scholarship, to justify his rediculous statements.
 
2005-02-11 12:57:52 PM  
Walkingtall:

I'm more of a hate-spewing-loudmouth-Xtian basher. Mike_71 when I can get him, folks like you when I can't. Not that you're spewing hate, but you're certainly spouting off some crap about true xtains not being liberals, without ever defending it.

So yeah, count me in, biatch.
 
2005-02-11 12:58:49 PM  
WalkingCarpet

I don't love to bash Christians. I just like to point out how hypocritical most Christians are.

If they really followed the teachings of Jesus, we wouldn't even have half the flamewars about Christianity that we do.

Instead, all Christians do is hate, a vile, disgusting form of hatred wrapped in a cloak of faith and that makes me mad.

Also, they've done a bang-up job of infiltrating our government which is just fantastic. I think Christians are blind to how important the seperation of church and state is to the health of our nation.


I agree completely with the separation of church and state. Where we differ is that you believe the only religion to be guarded against is Christianity. I believe your beliefs are a religion also and should not be allowed to run or be propped up by the govt. Also you not only want the separation of church and state you want the elimination of church in anyone who is part of the state. That is where we diverge. I have read history and I do not want a theocracy any more then you do until Christ creates a TRUE theocracy on this earth.
 
2005-02-11 12:58:54 PM  
This movie was a piece of shiat and unless the new version is approximately 0 seconds long, Mel Gibson didn't trim nearly enough from it
 
2005-02-11 01:00:01 PM  
Not just good but PERFECT. Every person who could disprove this was alive. I do not think you understand the scrutiny the disciples were put under. Every statement was looked at and attempted to be proven false. Every miracle ascribed to Jesus was checked out. It passed the test of the hardest scrutiny in history.

And they published the results of said scurtiny as a work of fiction?

The bullshait in here is getting pretty deep.
 
2005-02-11 01:00:10 PM  
 
2005-02-11 01:02:19 PM  
2005-02-11 12:43:42 PM Wytchocolate

2005-02-11 12:19:17 PM AspiringPhilosopher [TotalFark]

Wytchocolate

A Mike_71 card?!?

You sunk my battleship!

Ask him about turtles and how it relates to him thinking homosexuality is completely wrong.


I saved that infamous "turtle" post if anyone's interested.
 
2005-02-11 01:03:21 PM  


I'm more of a hate-spewing-loudmouth-Xtian basher. Mike_71 when I can get him, folks like you when I can't. Not that you're spewing hate, but you're certainly spouting off some crap about true xtains not being liberals, without ever defending it.
So yeah, count me in, biatch.



Christians cannot be liberals as it is understood RIGHT NOW. That does not mean some liberal ideas are not good for Christians to get behind. I was talking then and made clear and I am stating again that you cannot be a fully vested modern American liberal and be a Christian. They cannot mix. I stand by that statement.
 
2005-02-11 01:04:18 PM  
Jesus fulfilled prophecies of old testament:
Or
The people rewriting the history, like the Bush admin does, rewrote it in a way to make him fit the prophecies.

It's all myth. It's needed by weak people who can't stand the concept of a meaningless universe.

And since it's been so long since I posted anything:

Fark your delusions, fark your gods, fark your ignorance and bigotry and self-righteousness.

Grow up, human species, put the childish fantasies of gods and demons away. Then and only then will there be peace on earth.
 
2005-02-11 01:05:52 PM  
kendi823
Dansker
I'm not leaving because of you. I'm not afraid of you or anything.


Aw damn, and here I was, trying to make you phear my m4d bible-skillz. All for nothing.

I just don't want to get into "Is the Bible true?". My intention on entering this conversation was to talk about the movie.

Yeah, but what you said about the movie, was that Mel Gibsons blood and gore accurately represents what is written in the bible.

It doesn't. Altough i'm sure mr. Gibson would love to hear that you believe that.
 
2005-02-11 01:05:53 PM  
sigdiamond2000

I saved that infamous "turtle" post if anyone's interested.

Post it! I never get tired of the classics. Anyway, it's only a matter of time before Elvis enters the building, so we might as well get warmed up.
 
2005-02-11 01:06:48 PM  
sigdiamond2000
I saved that infamous "turtle" post if anyone's interested.


lets see it. link?
 
2005-02-11 01:08:02 PM  
Abagadro

It's abundantly clear that walkingtall knows next to nothing about early X-tianity and is doing his usual habbit of making broad sweaping statements without even providing detail, let alone verifyiable scholarship, to justify his rediculous statements.

Which statement do you find wrong? Do you not believe the disciples worked within the lifetime of Jesus's contemporaries? Do you not believe the beliefs were questioned? There were hundreds of off shoot disciples during the early years of Christianity. The reason they fell by the wayside was because of the scrutiny that ALL Christians were subjected to. I know a lot of early Christian history. There is a lot of made up and revised history out there but everything I have stated jives with REAL history.
 
2005-02-11 01:08:12 PM  
walkingtall:

Also you not only want the separation of church and state you want the elimination of church in anyone who is part of the state

Not true. I could give a rats ass if my politicians are religious, just check that shiat at the door please.

Douche bags like that bigot Rick Santorum should never hold office.

Or how about that other prick Jim DeMint who doesn't think gays should be allowed to teach?

I bet they're right up your alley though.
 
2005-02-11 01:08:20 PM  
sigdiamond2000

2nd the post request
 
2005-02-11 01:08:35 PM  
walkingtall
I agree completely with the separation of church and state. Where we differ is that you believe the only religion to be guarded against is Christianity. I believe your beliefs are a religion also and should not be allowed to run or be propped up by the govt.

Which beliefs of his are a "religion"? How do you define "religion"? What is the difference between scientific belief and religious belief?

Also you not only want the separation of church and state you want the elimination of church in anyone who is part of the state.

Who has called for GWB to stop going to church or using God's name in his speeches?
 
2005-02-11 01:09:49 PM  
Hahaha, excellent headline.
 
2005-02-11 01:09:53 PM  
"2005-02-11 09:19:03 AM ScubaDoo


But I like seeing Jesus bleed for my sins!!!!"

__________________________________________________

Best.comment.in.thread.
 
2005-02-11 01:10:02 PM  
walkingtall:

Christians cannot be liberals as it is understood RIGHT NOW. That does not mean some liberal ideas are not good for Christians to get behind. I was talking then and made clear and I am stating again that you cannot be a fully vested modern American liberal and be a Christian. They cannot mix. I stand by that statement.


[image from democracymeansyou.com too old to be available]
 
2005-02-11 01:11:04 PM  
"Who has called for GWB to stop going to church or using God's name in his speeches?"

I hate religion with all my being, but even I wouldn't do this. I just want to make damn sure his idiotic faith-based morality isn't made into law and pushed on all of us that have gotten over relgion.
 
2005-02-11 01:12:44 PM  
Christians cannot be liberals as it is understood RIGHT NOW. That does not mean some liberal ideas are not good for Christians to get behind. I was talking then and made clear and I am stating again that you cannot be a fully vested modern American liberal and be a Christian. They cannot mix. I stand by that statement.

But you have never explained WHY you believe that. Point form, explain to us why someone who is a christian cannot be considered a Liberal.

Liberals/Democrats as they are often lumped together these days stand for increased social programs for people, and allowing for freedoms for people.

Pretty sure JC would have agreed, if he existed.
 
2005-02-11 01:13:05 PM  
sigdiamond

YES! The suspense is killing me. Either post it or gmail me.
 
2005-02-11 01:13:33 PM  
I don't enjoy bashing Christians; It's a knee-jerk reaction. Self-defence. For years I've had Christians trying to damage me simply because of who I am, and yet when I fight back I'm somehow "bashing" them?

So, by these standards, a bully beating the hell out of everybody in the school yard is being "bashed" when some kids in the school yard start fighting back and refusing to take his crap?

A boxer who puts his guard up after being hit in the face repeatedly, or- heavens forbid!- swings back at his opponent is "bashing" the other boxer?

A woman who knees a serial rapist in the balls so hard that it cripples him must then be "bashing" the rapist, who is only trying to spread his love to all the people he can?

Yes. Rape. Christian proselytizing is like rape to me. Even the best-intentions of a Christian who wanders around preaching to everyone boil down to nothing more than behavior that mirrors that of a flasher who gets off on indecent exposure. Cornering someone and quoting scripture at them is mental rape. Forcing a child to believe in Jesus with horror stories and promised rewards is worse than molestation.

Rape! You're forcing yourself upon me in an intimate way. You're forcing me to succumb to your beliefs. You're forcing your way of life into laws that govern me. Christians are rapists, the Bible is their penis.

/Keep your bible-penis out of me. NO means NO.
 
2005-02-11 01:14:29 PM  
Is it just me, or does anyone else laugh at Catholics every ash Wednesday? I just want to walk up to them and wipe their foreheads; but around here that'll get me 5-10...stab-wounds that is.
 
2005-02-11 01:15:19 PM  
Dansker

This really is my last post, heehee, lunch time and all that.

Mel is a man who just feels very strongly about this and takes his faith seriously. He took from what the Bible provided (not a ton, I agree with you), other sources from the time, and what he learned about the crucifixion process in those days. As other have said, all crucifixions in the day by the Romans were horribly gory, and it is known to be one the worse way to die (long, painful, etc). I really believe that he made (to the best of his ability) an accurate and powerful movie. If you don't think that, you're not alone. But I have read and studied Jesus' death, and I think the movie was accurate.

Good talking to you. peace.
 
2005-02-11 01:17:05 PM  
WalkingCarpet

Does that button mean that what the button says is truth?
If Jesus was alive today, and he IS alive today if you must know, but if he walked today he would be now what he was then. He obeyed the laws of the land unless the human laws conflicted with biblical laws. Many of the people modern liberals like to try to usurp as their own were just that. However, he would not be pro-choice. He would not tell homosexuals that their BEHAVIOR is OK. He would not say sin was OK in any sense or form. He would do in our world exactly as he did 2000 years ago. Jesus is eternal. People are eternal. The human condition has not changed. People are people. The same battles we fight today were fought 2000 years ago. The same sins. The same injustices. The same pain and sorrow. The same joys and love. Jesus would be Jesus. He would not be defined as anything but what he is.
 
2005-02-11 01:17:18 PM  
Man, all these kilobytes suffering for the discussion of a nonexistant metaphor. Tsk, tsk.
 
2005-02-11 01:18:08 PM  
Is it just me, or does anyone else laugh at Catholics every ash Wednesday? I just want to walk up to them and wipe their foreheads; but around here that'll get me 5-10...stab-wounds that is.

I just like to stare a bit, and then give them the old....


You've got a little something (licks thumb, gestures toward them), (points at forehead, nervous laugh), I could (waggles hand with thumb up).
 
2005-02-11 01:18:45 PM  
chaoswolf
I hate religion with all my being, but even I wouldn't do this.

Of course not - I don't think any rational person would. In fact, the only people I've ever met who hold those beliefs are the make-believe people who exist solely inside Mike_71 and walkingtall's heads.
 
2005-02-11 01:20:45 PM  
2005-02-11 01:12:44 PM Hebalo [TotalFark]

But you have never explained WHY you believe that. Point form, explain to us why someone who is a christian cannot be considered a Liberal.

I'm not a Christian now, but I was raised one, and we went to this really goofy church that taught that the defining characteristic of a Christian is the acceptance of Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior. Politics never entered into the equation. Apparently, now churches are claiming that you're bound for Hell if you disagree with the Fox News Channel's stance on the issue de jour.
 
2005-02-11 01:20:46 PM  
Many of the people modern liberals like to try to usurp as their own were just that. However, he would not be pro-choice. He would not tell homosexuals that their BEHAVIOR is OK. He would not say sin was OK in any sense or form.


Aaahhhh, so you're a gay-basher. It makes sense now.

Jesus loves the little children, all the children of the world. Red or black, except IF THEY'RE GAY. Right, big guy?


P.S. Being Liberal does not require one to be adamantly pro-choice.
 
2005-02-11 01:20:55 PM  
Ahem... as posted earlier, the death of Jesus is 'more important in the grand scheme of things', because without His act of obedience to the Father, nothing else would have mattered. "Love Your Neighbor" and the like was already well-known from other teachers.

Our own personal view of things about what is or isn't important is part of the problem. That sort of pride is what caused Lucifer (and Adam) to rebel.


So by judging me by implying that I have self "pride", are you not committing a sin?

Whoa there, hoss! I made a statement about "our" (i.e. mankind's) tendency to make our personal views more important than God's word. Don't go melodramatic on me by playing the martyr card... just wear the shoe if it fits. I count myself in that "our", and pointing out that pride is at the root of Lucifer's, Adam's, and our own constant rebelliousness is not 'judging', merely stating the facts. So spare me the tom-farkery of that misuse of "judge not, lest ye be judged" maxim.

Plus, by stating that because "Love Your Neighbor" was taught by other teachers, makes it somehow less important that Jesus taught the same thing?

That's not the issue. The point you originally made (and of which I attempted to disabuse you) is that His message along those lines was MORE IMPORTANT than His death, an ill-founded statement that contradicts His own view of the matter. This same sort of thing is what Peter tried to say, at which Christ turned to His best friend and rebuked him harshly, saying "Get thee behind me, Satan!"

That clears up why the vast majority of Christians are so vitriolic and hate-filled towards gays, poor, brown men, etc.

Vast majority? Less drama please, there's a good fellow.

Why on earth do you think God gave us Free-Will if you propose that we are to blindly follow an idea without thinking for ourselves?

Again with the binary view of things! You must learn to think in three dimensions, my friend.

God doesn't ask for 'blind' obedience, but neither does He tolerate usurpers and liars. God's Word itself says "come, let us reason together", and He obviously don't mind when we think for ourselves, lest why would He have come up with the awesome gift of free will? But faith and trust is not "blind obedience", and disloyal rebellion for pride's sake is not fair use of free will.
 
2005-02-11 01:21:01 PM  
Holly_Wight

Marry me?
 
2005-02-11 01:21:09 PM  
Barjocky, I watch the Daily Show too. Great plagerism.

My "Good Book" is Green Eggs and Ham. Hey, it's a book, too!! If you're going to blindy follow a book, why not make it a fun book??
 
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