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(Fark Fiction Anthology)   "We learn from failure, not from success." ― Bram Stoker, Dracula. Man, at this rate, I'm going to be the most educated person in the world. This is your Fark Writer's Thread, Mistaken Edition   (farkfiction.net) divider line
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516 clicks; posted to Main » and Discussion » on 01 Feb 2023 at 3:30 PM (7 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest
 
toraque [TotalFark] [OhFark]
2023-02-01 2:40:31 PM  
So last week, mistakes were made. I foolishly and fully believed that everyone in the world realized the New York Times Pitchbot was a comical parody account, and that it wouldn't turn into a political mudfest, but sadly my hopes were dashed. While there was some good information regarding the elevator pitch, or promoting your work in general, it was largely drowned out by politics so we're reprising the theme this week. Well, look on the bright side: at least I didn't go with the off-color 'pitchers and catchers' joke that was my first thought. I've already learned from that kind of mistake.

Anyway, to recap: an elevator pitch is a short advertisement for your work, intended to just grab the attention of someone enough that you can give them a synopsis. There's all sorts of rules or formats people suggest you should use, but the core of the problem is the same whether you're writing the blurb on the back cover of your novel, writing a tweet for #PitMad (or something like that, as it's now sadly defunct) or literally stuck in an elevator for a few precious seconds with a rich and credulous editor willing to publish anything that interests them. That last one will probably never happen, but luck is 99% preparation. So don't let yourself get stuck in that elevator with nothing to say!

Writer's Thread Question of the Week!

Self-promotion is for me the hardest part of writing. How do you promote your work and get people interested in what you do?

Writer's Thread Writing Prompt of the Week!

Fark user imageView Full Size
 
tcaptain
2023-02-01 3:44:18 PM  
Write for the fark anthology!
 
Maker_of_Roads [TotalFark]
2023-02-01 3:49:29 PM  
I didn't know these kinds of threads existed.

Besides "write, write, write", and "keep writing even if what you're putting out seems like it sucks", any advice for some budding word-mongers?
 
Im_Gumby
2023-02-01 3:51:40 PM  
"We learn from failure, not from success." ― Rep. George Santos

For the ultra rare writing/Pol tab cross thread.
 
Wenchmaster
2023-02-01 3:58:45 PM  

tcaptain: Write for the fark anthology!


This.

Please submit stories for the anthology. We have a ton of really talented writers here on Fark. I re-read every one of the anthologies regularly.
 
PvtStash
2023-02-01 4:02:26 PM  
I find one of the reasons this is a truth for us
"We learn from failure, not from success."

because so many successes can not be explained or replicated.
We can ID that we were successful, but we can rarely identify exactly why we were in any way we can replicate later.

However we are often pretty good at IDing what the failure was/what went wrong, though that is not the same as learning from that and not repeating it.
But we do seem to be fairly good at that step of when we had a failure, we were able to examine the situation and determine why things failed/what aspects of the situation were the failure points.

IDing the problems we had, and actually learning to not repeat them are seeming two really different things though. Clearly i'm just speaking about the part where we determined what the failure cause was, not the part where we learn something from that. ;)
 
Wenchmaster
2023-02-01 4:09:55 PM  

Maker_of_Roads: I didn't know these kinds of threads existed.

Besides "write, write, write", and "keep writing even if what you're putting out seems like it sucks", any advice for some budding word-mongers?


If there is a writer's group in your area, consider attending one of their meetings. Understanding how other writers deal with problems can often help with apparently dissimilar issues you might be having.

Every writer has different gimmicks/tricks to keep the creative juices flowing. Find something that works for you and stick to it until it doesn't work anymore, then change things up.

Don't let yourself get bogged down with writing something in a linear fashion. Write down vignettes and scenes as they occur to you, and worry about fitting them into a linear storyline afterwards. Your mind will work on various aspects of the overall story, and you'll probably develop a story narrative organically, based on the vignettes/scenes/dialogue you've already assembled.

What works for others may not work for you. If it does, that's awesome. Don't panic if "Miss Grey's Extra-Awesome Writing Tips for Newbie Authors" fails to ignite a flurry of creativity for you. Find something that does work (music, legal mind-altering substances, yoga, percussive-maintenance therapy- whatever works).

Don't listen to anonymous idiots on internet message boards. Their situation may not translate well to yours, and a lot of them us are ass-hats.
 
crumblecat
2023-02-01 4:13:09 PM  
Maybe I'm weird, but I write for fun and don't really care if anyone reads me.

I submit to Fark Anthologies and post a few links on Facebook, but that's it.
 
palelizard
2023-02-01 4:13:30 PM  
Has anybody written a choose-your-own-adventure type story, and if so, what mistakes did you learn from?
 
toraque [TotalFark] [OhFark]
2023-02-01 4:22:30 PM  

Maker_of_Roads: I didn't know these kinds of threads existed.

Besides "write, write, write", and "keep writing even if what you're putting out seems like it sucks", any advice for some budding word-mongers?


Number one, look out for these threads, one gets submitted every Wednesday (or Thursday if I'm like, hung over and forget or something)

I usually post 'how to write like famous writer X' or something along those lines, which usually boils down to a list of tips for writing. We've been doing this for a while, so a couple of tips keep showing up from a bunch of different authors, which really suggests how important they are. Some of the big ones are:

1. "The muse respects dedication." Set a habit of sitting down once per day and writing something. Even if you have nothing to write about. Even if it's just "See Dick! See Jane! See Jane shank Dick with a rusty shiv!" and then you delete it all thirty seconds later. The habit and practice of literally just sitting down and putting something on a page is how it all starts.

(You can see the daily war threads for one way I'm doing that--every day I post some absurdist satire propaganda, and every day I wonder if I can come up with something worth writing, and every day I write . . . well, something, anyway)

2. Read. You can't write if you don't read, because reading is how you get the tools you need to use. Read for enjoyment, but also train yourself to dissect what you're reading. What is the author doing that's cool? What works well? What's failing miserably?

3. Write about things you know. By 'things you know' it really means your lived experiences -- things you've done, places you've been, things you've seen. But keep in mind that you can write about things you research enough to know them: some writers spend a full year doing the background research for a book, and others just wing it based on what they already know.

4. Lastly, accept that everything you write is going to be the absolutely worst, most god-awful eye-stabbingly bad thing in the world. You'll despair, think it's crap, be dejected . . . and then set it aside and come back and look at it after a few weeks or months. Quite often, you'll think 'Huh, that's actually . . . good."

I personally highly recommend getting On Writing: A Memoir of the Craft by Stephen King. He's extremely approachable as a writer, and says 'I am the literary equivalent of a Big Mac and fries.' He's a great place to start, and that book is a solid nuts-and-bolts manual of how writing gets done. That book is literally a toolbox you can pick up, root around in, and start using.

But above all, keep an eye out for these threads, and consider sending in something to the annual Fark Fiction Anthologies!

https://farkfiction.net/
 
tcaptain
2023-02-01 4:30:11 PM  

Wenchmaster: tcaptain: Write for the fark anthology!

This.

Please submit stories for the anthology. We have a ton of really talented writers here on Fark. I re-read every one of the anthologies regularly.


Here's a question.  If you have appeared in the Fark Anthology, does that count as being able to call  yourself a "Published" author/writer?
 
Be polite walk on the right
2023-02-01 4:35:05 PM  
I never met a 4 I didn't liek.

/best of tiems
//blurst of tiem5
 
Creepy Lurker Guy [TotalFark]
2023-02-01 4:41:53 PM  

toraque: Writer's Thread Writing Prompt of the Week!


NBC Peacock desiccated and mummified?
 
Creepy Lurker Guy [TotalFark]
2023-02-01 4:42:48 PM  

tcaptain: Here's a question.  If you have appeared in the Fark Anthology, does that count as being able to call  yourself a "Published" author/writer?


I do.  ;-)
 
rwellor
2023-02-01 4:45:54 PM  

tcaptain: Wenchmaster: tcaptain: Write for the fark anthology!

This.

Please submit stories for the anthology. We have a ton of really talented writers here on Fark. I re-read every one of the anthologies regularly.

Here's a question.  If you have appeared in the Fark Anthology, does that count as being able to call  yourself a "Published" author/writer?


You can link it from your Amazon Author page, so that's gonna be a "yes".^^

I have at least two publications in anthologies that border on the embarrassing (the anthologies, not my pieces --- I think?). But they have ISBNs and some sales, so.......

Also had to pull one accepted piece that later ended up in the FARK anthology because at least two of the other stories involved were complicated forms of authorial suicide. An incestuous Native-American super-assassin whose native "rituals" were risible and whose assassination skills were worse than mine would be... Oh, and written by a older White dude.....It would have been horrible.^^

/my life story
 
Spawn_of_Cthulhu
2023-02-01 4:57:12 PM  
Should I repost the free pitch workshop info from last week?  I didn't realize the thread deteriorated into politics.

I'm very excited that I get to hang out with New York Times bestselling author Gail Carriger this weekend. I'm even on an author panel with her Friday! 😱 She's here in Connecticut at Stupid Cupid, a steampunk event. If you're local tickets are still available. You can have tea with her on Saturday.
 
toraque [TotalFark] [OhFark]
2023-02-01 4:59:36 PM  
Submissions are only accepted for the Fark anthologies once they've been voted on by a panel of editors and readers, and not all submissions are accepted (far from it!) so I think it counts.

Also at this point we've got better circulation numbers than some micropress publishers (depending on how you define that term and how you interpret Amazon's numbers)
 
spaceman375
2023-02-01 5:00:25 PM  
I was wrong once. It was when I thought I was incorrect, but I was mistaken.
 
Spice Must Flow
2023-02-01 5:07:09 PM  

Maker_of_Roads: I didn't know these kinds of threads existed.

Besides "write, write, write", and "keep writing even if what you're putting out seems like it sucks", any advice for some budding word-mongers?


I always suggest taking a newspaper class at a junior college, which not only helps you get into the habit of finishing, and provides editing assistance, but also gives you a cuttings for your scrapbook, which in turn helps open doors. If you have already gotten published, it's an easier introduction when pitching an editor.

Keep a notebook, and write down your ideas into it. When you hold onto that "great idea" so you don't forget it, that blocks the next part of the story from coming through.

I also suggest a bicameral approach to prewriting as story, utilizing both left-brained logic and right-brained creativity, but not necessarily at the same time. I've had good luck with it.

First, just write aboutwhat your story is, without trying to tell your story. Like you were explaining it to your writing partner, not your audience. Just listing the ingredients for each scene, like Planning the Heist scene, climax scene, etc. and I'll state the last event of the story, but without trying to figure out an amazing ending yet. Often, the process of outlining the story gives new ideas for enhancing it. But this left-brained process is just the skeleton of the story, hidden from the audience.

Next, start telling the story, fleshing it out with right-brained creativity. Remember it's just a rough draft, and you can polish iat later, but you need words on paper before you can edit them.

I have better luck writing pen-to-paper for my rough drafts, rather than using a word processor. That way your ideas keep flowing from the end of what you wrote, instead of continually rewriting and revising when you review trying to find your spot.

When I freelanced for a smallville newspaper, I'd take brief notes but all my writing was done on my laptop, typically because I was on a deadline of 4pm. So I'd keep writing until 3:50 and send it in, and by 6pm there was a link on Facebook to their online article, and in the next day's paper.

Naturally, I'd try writing fiction on my laptop because eventually I'd have to submit it electronically and it seemed like saving a step for me. But I'd often get "stuck" in ways which never occurred writing for the paper.

Eventually it dawned on me that when I wrote a newspaper article, the whole story already existed. All the elements were already there, already have interrelationships, and a timeline of events, and it's just a matter of choosing which details to highlight. The whole story is already there; it just needs distilling down. In contrast, writing fiction has none of those elements, and the added step before typing bogged me down, a lot.

So lately, I've been writing the "writing partner" outline first and then the "rough draft" by hand, and then transcribing the rough draft onto my laptop. It sounds like a lot of extra steps, but it has unjammed my writing and now it's like turning on a faucet when I sit down to write.

Also, it helps to cultivate a friendship with the Muses. They're always full of great ideas, if you know how to listen.
 
Spice Must Flow
2023-02-01 5:13:22 PM  

Spawn_of_Cthulhu: Should I repost the free pitch workshop info from last week?  I didn't realize the thread deteriorated into politics.

I'm very excited that I get to hang out with New York Times bestselling author Gail Carriger this weekend. I'm even on an author panel with her Friday! 😱 She's here in Connecticut at Stupid Cupid, a steampunk event. If you're local tickets are still available. You can have tea with her on Saturday.


Please repost. I plan on submitting next month in a couple weeks.

You mentioned the person who offered to help bailed on you, but do you still plan on a Lovecraftian anthology? I've got some ideas...

Love stories set in the starry gulfs are so necromantic!
 
Wenchmaster
2023-02-01 5:15:58 PM  

tcaptain: Wenchmaster: tcaptain: Write for the fark anthology!

This.

Please submit stories for the anthology. We have a ton of really talented writers here on Fark. I re-read every one of the anthologies regularly.

Here's a question.  If you have appeared in the Fark Anthology, does that count as being able to call  yourself a "Published" author/writer?


Yes.

IMO, it's much more of an accomplishment than some other valid excuses for saying you've been 'published'. I've had several articles published in a trade magazine, and I have a self-published book out, but I consider those less of an accomplishment than successfully getting a story included in the Fark anthology for one important reason- the vetting and editing process for the anthology is very thorough, so getting a story accepted is a show of support and appreciation from your peers. Several Farkers assist Toraque in reading and scoring the entries for submission, which nets some very good anthologies. I re-read them often- even one particular story from two years ago which made me sad and angry for days and made my wife cry.
 
Spawn_of_Cthulhu
2023-02-01 5:18:00 PM  
So here is the link again the the free savvy authors pitchfest.  https://savvyauthors.com/community/classes/2023-sweetheart-pitchfest.1938/
They have started to post the agents and publishers you can pitch to.
3 line pitch.  Rules are tight.
Runs Feb 15-17.  Again in the fall.
 
Spice Must Flow
2023-02-01 5:18:40 PM  

Spice Must Flow: Also, it helps to cultivate a friendship with the Muses. They're always full of great ideas, if you know how to listen.


What a writer's muse might look like:
Fark user imageView Full Size

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seshat

Nice hat!
 
frestcrallen [TotalFark]
2023-02-01 5:21:37 PM  
What are the accepted genres for anthology submissions again?
 
Sim Tree [OhFark]
2023-02-01 5:23:58 PM  
Sorry, toraque. Didn't know. I'm going to put on my dunce hat and stand in the corner.
/I do not like the cone of shame
 
Spawn_of_Cthulhu
2023-02-01 5:31:46 PM  

Spice Must Flow: Spawn_of_Cthulhu: Should I repost the free pitch workshop info from last week?  I didn't realize the thread deteriorated into politics.

I'm very excited that I get to hang out with New York Times bestselling author Gail Carriger this weekend. I'm even on an author panel with her Friday! 😱 She's here in Connecticut at Stupid Cupid, a steampunk event. If you're local tickets are still available. You can have tea with her on Saturday.

Please repost. I plan on submitting next month in a couple weeks.

You mentioned the person who offered to help bailed on you, but do you still plan on a Lovecraftian anthology? I've got some ideas...

Love stories set in the starry gulfs are so necromantic!


I am still doing the Lovecraft anthology. My editor had some family problems so my cosmic horror novel Fat Monster (which should be in my tentacles right now) is still being edited. Once I hand it off to Amazon I will open the anthology for submissions. It will be open until August.

The pitchfest thing is for any writer to try to find an agent or publisher. It's a great opportunity.
 
Last Surviving Flying Gruyere Brother
2023-02-01 5:48:24 PM  

frestcrallen: What are the accepted genres for anthology submissions again?


SciFi, Mystery, Horror, Humor, Fantasy, Suspense are the "standard" Tabs, but the boundaries are flexible. If you have something that doesn't fit neatly, go ahead and submit it.
 
GN Nymph
2023-02-01 6:15:51 PM  
HWA just expelled Thomas Moneleone.  This was after giving him a Lifetime Achievement Award in 2017.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/horror-writer-thomas-f-monteleone-booted-over-racist-transphobic-rants

https://file770.com/thomas-monteleone-ousted-by-horror-writers-association/


This is news not because of who he is but because lots of people are saying it's about time.  It seems his racism has been known for decades but nobody's done anything about it until a Facebook post and a recent interview took things too far (it seems.)  I haven't seen either so can't say how bad they were.
 
AtomPeepers
2023-02-01 6:17:04 PM  

palelizard: Has anybody written a choose-your-own-adventure type story, and if so, what mistakes did you learn from?


I've done a choose your own adventure type script for an RPG style game forever ago and it's things like response trees and dead ends and the randomness of humans in general that make you crazy at times. You realize you're coming up with dozens of story modules and they all have to interact and become a larger story. You also find new wells of creativity because you're coming up with scenarios you don't want to happen, so it does sort of make you plot harder.

ChatGPT has come so far I wonder how well you could do it via AI and natural language processing these days?
 
GN Nymph
2023-02-01 6:18:02 PM  

Spice Must Flow: Spice Must Flow: Also, it helps to cultivate a friendship with the Muses. They're always full of great ideas, if you know how to listen.

What a writer's muse might look like:
[Fark user image 330x745]
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seshat

Nice hat!


It took me too long to notice the head decoration.  I was too busy cursing out the standing desk.
 
Russell_Secord
2023-02-01 6:19:25 PM  

Maker_of_Roads: I didn't know these kinds of threads existed.

Besides "write, write, write", and "keep writing even if what you're putting out seems like it sucks", any advice for some budding word-mongers?


I'm going to rephrase what others have said because it's important.

The best thing you can do is write. It will suck at first (unless you have world-class innate talent). It will be derivative. It will embarrass you when you reread it. Can't be helped. This is the only way to get better. But--and most don't tell you this--you have to write with a writer's awareness. Pay attention to what you're doing and why.

Which brings me to the next-best thing. Read as much as you can. You will tend to write the kind of thing you like to read, so you need to learn the tropes, the techniques, the names of writers, and so on. Again, do it with a writer's awareness. Pay attention to how they put together sentences, paragraphs, and dialogues. Watch how they introduce characters, plot points, scenes, descriptions, background info, and all that stuff. Watch how they build and manipulate that stuff as the story progresses. Watch how the plot unfolds.

Take what you learn and incorporate what you like into your work. Don't be afraid to steal techniques. Don't be afraid to ignore them or discard them either. It's all part of developing your own voice.

We've all been there. There are no shortcuts. Sorry.
 
GN Nymph
2023-02-01 6:32:07 PM  
Spice Must Flow:
Maker_of_Roads:
Also, it helps to cultivate a friendship with the Muses. They're always full of great ideas, if you know how to listen.


It is difficult to make friends with someone who keeps waking me up at 2 a.m. with an idea for yet another story (it's not like I finished the last ten so sure why not add another half-done manuscript to the pile).  Any suggestions on how to keep from strangulating her so I can get four hours of sleep in a row?

/Don't suggest smothering her with a pillow.  The cat is sleeping on that.  I don't need her waking up too.
 
palelizard
2023-02-01 6:49:07 PM  

AtomPeepers: palelizard: Has anybody written a choose-your-own-adventure type story, and if so, what mistakes did you learn from?

I've done a choose your own adventure type script for an RPG style game forever ago and it's things like response trees and dead ends and the randomness of humans in general that make you crazy at times. You realize you're coming up with dozens of story modules and they all have to interact and become a larger story. You also find new wells of creativity because you're coming up with scenarios you don't want to happen, so it does sort of make you plot harder.

ChatGPT has come so far I wonder how well you could do it via AI and natural language processing these days?


I'm a tabletop GM of the old school, so I'm used to perfectly crafted stories going off the rails because of those stupid players, but did you actively map it out as a tree, or just kind of have a feeling of where it was going to go? How much advance planning did you do? My usual style of writing is to set the stage and characters (which the players contribute) and have a direction to go with an end desired, and then kind of let it flow? Did you do anything which absolutely did not work? I also want to bring multiple story paths back to a central area, assuming the reader didn't die (it's going to be one of those Lone Wolf/Avenger style books).

As for AI, I'll John Henry a weekend against any AI around today and see who has more fun.
 
palelizard
2023-02-01 6:53:52 PM  

tcaptain: Here's a question.  If you have appeared in the Fark Anthology, does that count as being able to call  yourself a "Published" author/writer?


I got published in one, and I consider myself to be a published author, and not the kind who just does that self-publish "sure if you pay enough" thing. My short story went through review and editing, and was still chosen among a pretty top-notch field.

That's not the same as "I'm a professional writer", as I didn't get paid for it. But the next time I come up for my office "Two Truths and a Lie" team building, "I'm a published author" is going on that, with pride, and it won't be the lie. (last time I did an algebra word problem just to annoy my boss who dropped it on my at the last second).
 
cynicalbastard
2023-02-01 8:30:49 PM  
"Look, you've gotta work in at least a couple of scenes involving hot wenches with bustiers and a knockout set of bristols if you want this thing to sell!"- Bram Stoker's publisher.
 
Elder of Psion
2023-02-01 8:37:34 PM  
We miss 100% of the shots we don't take.

- Lee Harvey Oswald
 
mad cowboy
2023-02-01 8:38:20 PM  
Since I paid to have my books (3 and a baby) published, I don't consider myself a writer. But since I've sold a few, that kind of counts. Somebody I don't know who couldn't know me bought my book in England.I spent more than I made but I got time. I started writing mostly as the notes I'd make for a public access show.  It was considered a nature show, so I'd go out in nature and film. Then I'd mix it in with me playing my guitar and singing mostly old songs. But in between the songs I started doing talks, about whatever mostly with an outline of what I was going to talk about.

About my third show I wrote like three pages of dialog on a note book, got in the studio and realized I couldn't read it.  It was fun, I've always told stories. My favorite response is "I'll never believe another word you say." The point is a good way to learn how to pitch a story, is to learn how to talk good. I got to find out exactly where but a library, or coffee shop in the city, does like an open mic, for story tellers.

I think to pitch in an elevator a good story helps but if you want them to listen, you need verbal skills as well. I don't go anywhere but I'm going to find the story teller open mic. I've embarrassed myself maybe hundreds of times, whats a few more.
P.S. You can practice pitching on anyone or thing.


0
 
Creepy Lurker Guy [TotalFark]
2023-02-01 9:12:44 PM  

GN Nymph: Spice Must Flow: Spice Must Flow: Also, it helps to cultivate a friendship with the Muses. They're always full of great ideas, if you know how to listen.

What a writer's muse might look like:
[Fark user image 330x745]
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seshat

Nice hat!

It took me too long to notice the head decoration.  I was too busy cursing out the standing desk.


Marijuana under a dome?
 
Billy Liar
2023-02-01 10:09:49 PM  
"We learn more when we make mistakes than when we don't."  That's what they told me.  They still get plenty mad when I f*ck up, though.
 
nartreb
2023-02-01 10:16:47 PM  

Creepy Lurker Guy: GN Nymph: Spice Must Flow: Spice Must Flow: Also, it helps to cultivate a friendship with the Muses. They're always full of great ideas, if you know how to listen.

What a writer's muse might look like:
[Fark user image 330x745]
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seshat

Nice hat!

It took me too long to notice the head decoration.  I was too busy cursing out the standing desk.

Marijuana under a dome?


Papyrus.
 
Bennie Crabtree
2023-02-01 11:45:43 PM  

toraque: Submissions are only accepted for the Fark anthologies once they've been voted on by a panel of editors and readers, and not all submissions are accepted (far from it!) so I think it counts.

Also at this point we've got better circulation numbers than some micropress publishers (depending on how you define that term and how you interpret Amazon's numbers)


Now might be a good time to publish a parallel Afrofuturism anthology, that casts a wider submissions call. Or even by invitation-only. Ask for stories with themes from the Fark tabs. The point, though, would be to pay the writers, and then make some bank for Fark as a book publisher, and send free digital copies to high school libraries across Kentucky. The best part is that Afrofuturism collections just piss off the GQP for merely existing, so its a pretty simple and effective act of resistance (if you're into that kind of thing).
 
jtown
2023-02-01 11:51:51 PM  
My grandpa on his experience in the space race back in the 50s and 60s:

"We learned a lot from every explosion."
 
Spawn_of_Cthulhu
2023-02-02 7:01:15 AM  

GN Nymph: HWA just expelled Thomas Moneleone.  This was after giving him a Lifetime Achievement Award in 2017.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/horror-writer-thomas-f-monteleone-booted-over-racist-transphobic-rants

https://file770.com/thomas-monteleone-ousted-by-horror-writers-association/


This is news not because of who he is but because lots of people are saying it's about time.  It seems his racism has been known for decades but nobody's done anything about it until a Facebook post and a recent interview took things too far (it seems.)  I haven't seen either so can't say how bad they were.


Pretty bad.
 
Maker_of_Roads [TotalFark]
2023-02-02 7:45:59 AM  
Wenchmaster:

toraque:

Spice Must Flow:

Russell_Secord:

I appreciate the responses!

From what I've seen/done, I can already see how useful this all is. I had already started disassembling some of my favorite authors styles and kitbashing them into something I like, but it is good to hear that it isn't necessarily something nobody else does (and therefore something I should be keeping to myself out of shame).

I guess some of the issues I have will probbaly sort themselves out in time, with experience. Stuff like finding a way to bridge two narratives or plot scenes in a way that isn't just hand wavy or completely tasteless filler, and finding the proper balance of writing an intricate and technical system (say, for magic, or a belief system of a certain sect of charcters) without writing a textbook that the reader has to slog through to understand anything.

Tho, I do have a question that has been bugging me, because I'm not 100% sure on how to solve it.

In a story I was considering, a character's impetus to begin the story revolves around them being bored in their current position. Day in day out slog, until one day another character gets them to step out of their comfort zone and the story begins in earnest. My question there is, how do you write someone/something as inherently bored or boring, without actually being boring for the reader? I've asked this before, and was just told to have the character simply exclaim "oh my this is boring" or something to that effect, but that kind of feels like a cop out personally. It isn't stopping me from filling in key points/ideas to this story, but getting the beginning filled in feels like it would be at least a good feather in this story's cap if you know what I mean.
 
Wenchmaster
2023-02-02 8:22:43 AM  

Maker_of_Roads: My question there is, how do you write someone/something as inherently bored or boring, without actually being boring for the reader?


It's largely going to depend on the story you're working on, and the narrative style. There are several methods of telling the reader about the character's monotonous existence without spelling it out in excruciating detail, not all of which are cop-out hand-waving. Here are a couple of possibilities:

- Character listens to the radio and hears a lyric to the effect of, ". . . is this living, or just existence?", then has a bit of internal monologue briefly discussing the monotony and drudgery.
- Character realizes in a moment of internal monologue that he/she has no actual memory of the day's work, except for a short interaction with the catalyst character.
- Character tries to describe his/her work to friend/relative/love interest, and both of them begin yawning and/or fall sleep during the dialogue.

A lot will depend on your narrative style and/or tolerance for using standard tropes.
 
Russell_Secord
2023-02-02 8:40:05 AM  

Maker_of_Roads: ...I do have a question that has been bugging me, because I'm not 100% sure on how to solve it.

In a story I was considering, a character's impetus to begin the story revolves around them being bored in their current position. Day in day out slog, until one day another character gets them to step out of their comfort zone and the story begins in earnest. My question there is, how do you write someone/something as inherently bored or boring, without actually being boring for the reader? I've asked this before, and was just told to have the character simply exclaim "oh my this is boring" or something to that effect, but that kind of feels like a cop out personally. It isn't stopping me from filling in key points/ideas to this story, but getting the beginning filled in feels like it would be at least a good feather in this story's cap if you know what I mean.


What you're talking about is called the inciting incident. It's the equivalent of lighting the fuse that leads to the explosion in the climax.

The last thing you want to do is bore the reader. Start the story with the inciting incident, or with the effect it has on the protagonist. If his job is boring, for instance, open with him screaming at his computer and throwing his keyboard across the office. We don't want you to show us his boring job, we all know what that's like. Light that fuse, show us the keg of gunpowder, and start running!
 
mad cowboy
2023-02-02 8:40:38 AM  

Maker_of_Roads: Wenchmaster:

toraque:

Spice Must Flow:

Russell_Secord:

I appreciate the responses!

From what I've seen/done, I can already see how useful this all is. I had already started disassembling some of my favorite authors styles and kitbashing them into something I like, but it is good to hear that it isn't necessarily something nobody else does (and therefore something I should be keeping to myself out of shame).

I guess some of the issues I have will probbaly sort themselves out in time, with experience. Stuff like finding a way to bridge two narratives or plot scenes in a way that isn't just hand wavy or completely tasteless filler, and finding the proper balance of writing an intricate and technical system (say, for magic, or a belief system of a certain sect of charcters) without writing a textbook that the reader has to slog through to understand anything.

Tho, I do have a question that has been bugging me, because I'm not 100% sure on how to solve it.

Not that you asked me but, I just went through changing a characters job, which means life change. Conflict is a good reason for change. I brought in an old adversary for the hero, who causes reflection on how his life has went. This is the seed of change. It sucked but I actually went with "Because I hate my job," as dialog. Later on I filled in the reason he hated the job, making it a small part of the story.
 
Maker_of_Roads [TotalFark]
2023-02-02 8:43:00 AM  

Wenchmaster: Maker_of_Roads: My question there is, how do you write someone/something as inherently bored or boring, without actually being boring for the reader?

It's largely going to depend on the story you're working on, and the narrative style. There are several methods of telling the reader about the character's monotonous existence without spelling it out in excruciating detail, not all of which are cop-out hand-waving. Here are a couple of possibilities:

- Character listens to the radio and hears a lyric to the effect of, ". . . is this living, or just existence?", then has a bit of internal monologue briefly discussing the monotony and drudgery.
- Character realizes in a moment of internal monologue that he/she has no actual memory of the day's work, except for a short interaction with the catalyst character.
- Character tries to describe his/her work to friend/relative/love interest, and both of them begin yawning and/or fall sleep during the dialogue.

A lot will depend on your narrative style and/or tolerance for using standard tropes.


Hrmm, those are good approaches. I'll try a couple of them out, see if I can come up with something interesting that isn't too predictble.

I had considered him considering what he had to do that day while at work, and then not being able to remember what day it was, but when I went to flesh that out it felt like I was getting bogged down in details I guess.
 
mad cowboy
2023-02-02 10:34:34 AM  
Heres a reason to want a new job.

Goin' To Work In Tall Buildings - John Hartford
Youtube VSWLm2wRHSA

Now I'm going to work with a tear in my eyes.
 
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