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(Some Guy)   Army Corps of Engineers releases renderings of a potential sea wall to protect the West Side of Manhattan against storm surges from climate change, seeks Snake Plissken's input   (thecity.nyc) divider line
    More: Interesting, New York City, New York, Storm surge, Hudson River, East River, Brooklyn, New Jersey, South Bronx  
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2568 clicks; posted to Main » on 27 Jan 2023 at 1:20 PM (8 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



54 Comments     (+0 »)
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2023-01-27 12:22:15 PM  
LOL! See walls...
 
2023-01-27 12:30:20 PM  

arrogantbastich: LOL! See walls...


I'm on a sea walls diet. I see walls and I eat them.

I maybe on LSD.
 
2023-01-27 12:31:48 PM  
Where walls?
 
2023-01-27 12:34:19 PM  

Mangoose: arrogantbastich: LOL! See walls...

I'm on a sea walls diet. I see walls and I eat them.

I maybe on LSD.


She sells see shells by the see shore, WHY CAN'T YOU SEA THAT?
 
2023-01-27 12:36:14 PM  
Just in case they correct it

Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2023-01-27 12:39:14 PM  
Hey, so long as it keeps the water away in a massive storm, who cares how it looks.
 
2023-01-27 12:51:41 PM  
No way those will attract taggers at all.
 
2023-01-27 1:22:09 PM  
Nah, needs more parapets.
 
2023-01-27 1:22:39 PM  
On account of the aliens.
 
2023-01-27 1:22:46 PM  
How do the walls work if there are gaps in them like that?
 
2023-01-27 1:25:23 PM  
Queue the "Its going to kill property values" folks.
 
2023-01-27 1:25:27 PM  
So this is the Hudson River side? Shared with New Jersey?

One would think the whole Manhattan island would want to be protected. Not just one side.
 
2023-01-27 1:27:35 PM  
The US Military is long range planning with climate change in mind - its literally baked in.  I am waiting for the day the Republicans INSIST they stop planning for (fake) global warming or they'll cut their funding.... /still waiting.
 
2023-01-27 1:28:34 PM  
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2023-01-27 1:32:04 PM  
That wall won't stop a kaiju, you need jaegers.
 
2023-01-27 1:32:47 PM  
Wonder if they took any queues when Sandy flooded south Manhattan.

Mayor: Yeah we flooded downtown. Can you fix that?
ACE: We could build a wall in the Hudson.
Mayor: Really?
ACE: We can try using Lego bricks.
Mayor: You're putting me on.
ACE: Your honor, I assure you, we don't fool around.
 
2023-01-27 1:32:58 PM  

stuffy: Queue the "Its going to kill property values" folks.


Repeated and worsening flooding is going to have an effect on property values too. You'd think they'd consider that too, eh?
 
2023-01-27 1:33:47 PM  
That sound you just heard was every single graffiti artist in the five boroughs simultaneously creaming their pants.
 
2023-01-27 1:34:15 PM  
They're going to need those walls. The question is only how to make them affordable and effective and also, aesthetic. That last part is optional but the part everyone focuses on and kills the project over.

The gaps in the wall are to let out water that needs to flow back out, but they can also probably be gated in some way for a full on barrier. In the midwest near some river towns you will often see underpasses between levees with massive steel gates that can be rolled into place when the worst flooding is imminent.

Taggers will assault these surfaces. The only thing you can do is muralize them first, and, construct complex surfaces that don't take the paint well. That can be thru expensive special coatings, or making the surface rough and corrugated and uneven enough that traditional tagging methods don't come out looking that good, or staying long.  You can also put a lot of low-income or unemployed people or low level criminals  to work, cleaning them continually.. Keeps them busy and fed.
 
2023-01-27 1:37:57 PM  
What a ridiculous idea. Why don't they just jack the entire island up 15 feet?
 
2023-01-27 1:38:13 PM  

Fizpez: The US Military is long range planning with climate change in mind - its literally baked in.  I am waiting for the day the Republicans INSIST they stop planning for (fake) global warming or they'll cut their funding.... /still waiting.


What do you mean "waiting for"? Check the dates on these links. 2015, 2016, 2017.... They've already been at that for years now. The so-called "conservative" movement is the #1 enemy of the future of the American people, hands down.

https://www.vice.com/en/article/qvagxw/stop-talking-about-climate-change-house-republicans-tell-the-pentagon-and-cia

https://www.politico.com/agenda/story/2016/06/republicans-trying-to-stop-pentagon-climate-plan-000149/

https://newrepublic.com/article/118830/pentagon-tell-republicans-climate-change-hurting-military

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/powerpost/paloma/the-energy-202/2017/07/13/the-energy-202-should-the-defense-department-take-seriously-the-threat-of-climate-change/59664cafe9b69b7071abcb17/
 
2023-01-27 1:39:11 PM  
I just now thought more about it and those walls could be built with a system of planters in them for vines and flowers and etc. that could grow to obscure the wall, leaving no room for tagging, but also making them look good from the dry side. Maybe even some of that wall space could be a vertical gardening opportunity for things like tomatoes, strawberries, what-have-you. But vines and flowers, stuff that's near-zero maintenance, that could be very nice, laid out on the walls strategically...

You could also put a lot of artists to work doing sculptural things onto those inner wall surfaces, friezes and such, three dimensional works.
 
2023-01-27 1:39:21 PM  

Any Pie Left: You can also put a lot of low-income or unemployed people


WANTED: Graffiti scrubbers to clean off the Hudson River Storm Walls. Must be nautical, able to swim and good with a sand blaster while standing on a wobbly boat. Apply within.
 
2023-01-27 1:39:34 PM  
So in this rendering of a proposed 20ft floodwall I see nothing 20 ft tall and that grey wall would seem to have some issues stopping flooding.

thecity.brightspotcdn.comView Full Size
 
2023-01-27 1:40:24 PM  

Myria: How do the walls work if there are gaps in them like that?


Ever close a drain part way?

If there were no gaps any water that makes it over the wall couldn't run back out.
 
2023-01-27 1:41:55 PM  

northernmanor: Why don't they just jack the entire island up 15 feet?


Well for one thing there's moving all that underground stuff up too

i.pinimg.comView Full Size
 
2023-01-27 1:43:30 PM  
 
2023-01-27 1:45:43 PM  
Rich people: We don't want to take any action against climate change or pay taxes! Wah wah.

Rich people: the thing you're doing to prevent damage from climate change is taking away my pretty views! Waaaaaah!
 
2023-01-27 1:45:56 PM  

northernmanor: What a ridiculous idea. Why don't they just jack the entire island up 15 feet?


Or just move?
 
2023-01-27 1:46:16 PM  
Less than $52 billion could be spent on sending flowers to the funerals of those who don't survive global warming.
 
2023-01-27 1:47:02 PM  
We'll tell them we're building the wall to keep the sea water out, while we're really building it to keep them penned in

Interesting how Corporations can move about the world freely, for example: setting up HQs in Ireland to avoid paying US income taxes. Yet people, aside from the wealthy are held prisoner, unable to move about with any sense of autonomy, locked in their respective National Pens

Personally, I think the idea of Nations or Nationhood needs to go by the wayside. I think if humanity is to survive and continue to progress in the face of radical climate change and as we start hitting 9 billion people, it will be required that we rethink how we allocate the habitable space on the planet and the resources we have
 
2023-01-27 1:48:02 PM  
I heard he was dead.
 
2023-01-27 1:48:14 PM  

maxandgrinch: Less than $52 billion could be spent on sending flowers to the funerals of those who don't survive global warming.


No way, flowers are going to be so rare, they'll be worth way more than $52B.
 
2023-01-27 1:52:35 PM  

Trocadero: maxandgrinch: Less than $52 billion could be spent on sending flowers to the funerals of those who don't survive global warming.

No way, flowers are going to be so rare, they'll be worth way more than $52B.


With global warming we'll have a year round growing season so the price should come down
 
2023-01-27 1:55:14 PM  
encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.comView Full Size


You're gonna need a lot of concrete for dat...plus disposal of all the material dug up. I can help.
 
2023-01-27 1:55:31 PM  

Myria: How do the walls work if there are gaps in them like that?


I'm sure those sections are lowered into the ground at the moment and can be raised when needed.  That way it allows access to the riverfront when not needed.
 
2023-01-27 1:56:56 PM  
So they gonna build it to withstand a "100 Year Storm", ya know, like the ones we get like 10x a year now.
 
2023-01-27 2:16:35 PM  

maxandgrinch: Less than $52 billion could be spent on sending flowers to the funerals of those who don't survive global warming.


LOL. Why would they do that? The $52 billion isn't to protect people, it's to protect the property. Dead people just mean new vacancies they can rent.
 
2023-01-27 2:19:18 PM  
I thught he was dead
 
2023-01-27 2:22:53 PM  
That's one expensive band-aid.
 
2023-01-27 2:28:07 PM  

Myria: How do the walls work if there are gaps in them like that?


Poorly.
 
2023-01-27 2:28:52 PM  

steklo: So this is the Hudson River side? Shared with New Jersey?

One would think the whole Manhattan island would want to be protected. Not just one side.


It's to protect us from NJ.
 
2023-01-27 2:31:39 PM  

electricjebus: Myria: How do the walls work if there are gaps in them like that?

I'm sure those sections are lowered into the ground at the moment and can be raised when needed.  That way it allows access to the riverfront when not needed.


Yes, they work on a wave monitoring system that is based off shore a bit that detects wave heights and raises another barrier to close that gap. However if a tidal wave or tsunami is detected then the protective dome is deployed for the entire island and the wall section is not raised
 
2023-01-27 2:34:46 PM  
That money would be better spent getting the hell away from New York City. There's no damned reason to have a centralized financial location, the place is too crowded and it's too expensive.

Decentralize, asshats.
 
2023-01-27 2:47:35 PM  
One simple solution: maybe transparent glass block sections of the seawalls? (Fine, fine, *when* we can mass produce transparent aluminum, great, but we can't now.)
 
2023-01-27 2:51:18 PM  

northernmanor: What a ridiculous idea. Why don't they just jack the entire island up 15 feet?


Pretty close to the historical solution... Fill in the streets and move the storefronts a couple floors up. See: Seattle and Sacramento.
 
2023-01-27 3:09:36 PM  

tobcc: So they gonna build it to withstand a "100 Year Storm", ya know, like the ones we get like 10x a year now.


Interesting thing, actually found it on the main page here. The Army Corps of Engineers like to gloss over things. Like the New Orleans levees that were rebuilt after Katrina? They built them for a 500 year storm but said it was for a 100 year storm to keep Congress happy. If I'm remembering that right. If I'm not someone will be along to correct me
 
2023-01-27 3:23:08 PM  

chitownmike: Yes, they work on a wave monitoring system that is based off shore a bit that detects wave heights and raises another barrier to close that gap. However if a tidal wave or tsunami is detected then the protective dome is deployed for the entire island and the wall section is not raised


It's on the Hudson River, when the river is low those sections are dropped down, when the river is rising they raise those portions.  We have the same thing in St. Louis.

There's a road on the wrong side of the levee downtown.  When the Mississippi is low it's accessible, when it's flooding those portions are raised into position.
 
2023-01-27 3:24:13 PM  

Any Pie Left: The gaps in the wall are to let out water that needs to flow back out, but they can also probably be gated in some way for a full on barrier. In the midwest near some river towns you will often see underpasses between levees with massive steel gates that can be rolled into place when the worst flooding is imminent.


Let me introduce you to Morgan City, LA.

https://goo.gl/maps/8deBneBBv1372WnS6

https://goo.gl/maps/Q8JUumxHX2T443Cq8
 
2023-01-27 3:33:07 PM  

northernmanor: What a ridiculous idea. Why don't they just jack the entire island up 15 feet?


Galveston did that after the 1906 storm. They didn't have a subway to worry about though.

/technically they just brought in a shiat-ton of sand and dirt and laid it over the top of the island, not jacked it up.
 
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