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(Yahoo) Hero If there ever was an appropriate use of the Hero tag it's this 26 year old wrestling the gun away from the Monterey Park mass shooter   (yahoo.com) divider line
    More: Hero, Dance, Good Morning America, Brandon Tsay, Social dance, video of a man, Handgun, Gun, suspected Monterey Park shooter  
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2322 clicks; posted to Main » on 24 Jan 2023 at 7:35 AM (12 days ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2023-01-24 7:44:35 AM  
The media has been calling him a "Good Samaritan".  That's not what it means.  Treating the wounded yes, disarming the gunman, no.  That's more of a Good Rambo-itan.
 
2023-01-24 7:45:40 AM  
Elderly Asians committing mass shootings of other Asians, seemingly at random, in a small California town seems really, really strange.

The old guy who shot up a Lunar New Year party then tried to shoot up another one, then later shot himself was odd enough.

Now we have a second pair of shootings in the same town, after which the shooter just drive to the police station and turned themselves in.

WTF???????????????????
 
2023-01-24 7:46:05 AM  
He was definitely using his Kung Fu for good.
🎶 Everybody was Kung Fu fighting🎵

/Yay hero!
 
2023-01-24 7:48:52 AM  

Permanent Solutions For Permanent Problems: Elderly Asians committing mass shootings of other Asians, seemingly at random, in a small California town seems really, really strange.

The old guy who shot up a Lunar New Year party then tried to shoot up another one, then later shot himself was odd enough.

Now we have a second pair of shootings in the same town, after which the shooter just drive to the police station and turned themselves in.

WTF???????????????????


Some kind of murder suicide pact?
 
2023-01-24 7:54:13 AM  
Gigantic huevos on that guy!
 
2023-01-24 8:03:47 AM  
He was all "Tsay my name, biatch!" When he got the gun.

Los Angeles County Sheriff Robert Luna said Sunday the weapon recovered at the Alhambra dance hall was a "semi-automatic assault pistol" with an extended large-capacity magazine clip attached..

Fixed that for ya, Chief.
 
2023-01-24 8:12:09 AM  
FTFA:
"But something amazing happened, a miracle actually. He started to try to prep his weapon so he could shoot everybody, but then it dawned on me that this was the moment to disarm him. I could do something here that could protect everybody and potentially save myself."

Fight or flight time! This man decided to fight for his life. Amazing!
 
2023-01-24 8:21:13 AM  

SBinRR: He was all "Tsay my name, biatch!" When he got the gun.

Los Angeles County Sheriff Robert Luna said Sunday the weapon recovered at the Alhambra dance hall was a "semi-automatic assault pistol" with an extended large-capacity magazine clip attached..

Fixed that for ya, Chief.


I actually came to thread to see if I could figure out what a semi automatic assualt pistol is.
 
2023-01-24 8:23:23 AM  
Great self control there. How do you not just blast the f*cker once you take away his gun?
 
2023-01-24 8:34:45 AM  

Barricaded Gunman: Great self control there. How do you not just blast the f*cker once you take away his gun?


Fark user imageView Full Size


the moment came and he stepped up! true hero

/it looks like he may have tried but wasn't familiar w the weapon
//that would've also been heroic
 
2023-01-24 8:35:53 AM  

Natalie Portmanteau: SBinRR: He was all "Tsay my name, biatch!" When he got the gun.

Los Angeles County Sheriff Robert Luna said Sunday the weapon recovered at the Alhambra dance hall was a "semi-automatic assault pistol" with an extended large-capacity magazine clip attached..

Fixed that for ya, Chief.

I actually came to thread to see if I could figure out what a semi automatic assualt pistol is.


Only thing I can think of is one of those AR platform pistols?
 
2023-01-24 8:41:31 AM  
"No! no more gun! You go NOW!!"
 
2023-01-24 8:42:45 AM  
That story can't be right.

I have been repeatedly, and loudly, informed that only a good guy with a gun can stop a bad guy with a gun.

Are they implying that guns aren't the solution to all of America's problems?

I must be missing something.
 
2023-01-24 8:52:01 AM  

olorin604: Natalie Portmanteau: SBinRR: He was all "Tsay my name, biatch!" When he got the gun.

Los Angeles County Sheriff Robert Luna said Sunday the weapon recovered at the Alhambra dance hall was a "semi-automatic assault pistol" with an extended large-capacity magazine clip attached..

Fixed that for ya, Chief.

I actually came to thread to see if I could figure out what a semi automatic assualt pistol is.

Only thing I can think of is one of those AR platform pistols?


Looked more like an Cobray M11/9.
 
2023-01-24 8:53:21 AM  

olorin604: Natalie Portmanteau: SBinRR: He was all "Tsay my name, biatch!" When he got the gun.

Los Angeles County Sheriff Robert Luna said Sunday the weapon recovered at the Alhambra dance hall was a "semi-automatic assault pistol" with an extended large-capacity magazine clip attached..

Fixed that for ya, Chief.

I actually came to thread to see if I could figure out what a semi automatic assualt pistol is.

Only thing I can think of is one of those AR platform pistols?


Article on a bar shooting described a high capacity assault revolver. Adding 'high capacity' and 'assault' to anything makes it sound scary.
Also makes it sound like 'assault weapons' are responsible for most shootings, when mass shootings are usually handguns. Just like most shootings in general.
 
2023-01-24 9:09:03 AM  

RolandTGunner: olorin604: Natalie Portmanteau: SBinRR: He was all "Tsay my name, biatch!" When he got the gun.

Los Angeles County Sheriff Robert Luna said Sunday the weapon recovered at the Alhambra dance hall was a "semi-automatic assault pistol" with an extended large-capacity magazine clip attached..

Fixed that for ya, Chief.

I actually came to thread to see if I could figure out what a semi automatic assualt pistol is.

Only thing I can think of is one of those AR platform pistols?

Looked more like an Cobray M11/9.


I was trying to think of what I would describe as an "assault pistol"

Wonder if it was the police of the journalists that started that description.

Could read the article, but that would go against the union rules here on fark.
 
2023-01-24 9:13:38 AM  

Permanent Solutions For Permanent Problems: Elderly Asians committing mass shootings of other Asians, seemingly at random, in a small California town seems really, really strange.

The old guy who shot up a Lunar New Year party then tried to shoot up another one, then later shot himself was odd enough.

Now we have a second pair of shootings in the same town, after which the shooter just drive to the police station and turned themselves in.

WTF???????????????????


The first shootings were in SoCal.  The more recent ones were outside SF several hundred miles away.  So not the same town, but strange.
 
2023-01-24 9:14:55 AM  

Permanent Solutions For Permanent Problems: Elderly Asians committing mass shootings of other Asians, seemingly at random, in a small California town seems really, really strange.

The old guy who shot up a Lunar New Year party then tried to shoot up another one, then later shot himself was odd enough.

Now we have a second pair of shootings in the same town, after which the shooter just drive to the police station and turned themselves in.

WTF???????????????????


I had CNN on this morning and herd "a second older Asian shooter..." and was like WTF?  Am I taking crazy pills.  F$cked-up.
 
2023-01-24 9:16:00 AM  

bedonkadonk: FTFA:
"But something amazing happened, a miracle actually. He started to try to prep his weapon so he could shoot everybody, but then it dawned on me that this was the moment to disarm him. I could do something here that could protect everybody and potentially save myself."

Fight or flight time! This man decided to fight for his life. Amazing!


Thankfully his actions were not encumbered by his enormous brass balls.  Truly a hero in every sense of the word.
 
2023-01-24 9:17:24 AM  

Natalie Portmanteau: SBinRR: He was all "Tsay my name, biatch!" When he got the gun.

Los Angeles County Sheriff Robert Luna said Sunday the weapon recovered at the Alhambra dance hall was a "semi-automatic assault pistol" with an extended large-capacity magazine clip attached..

Fixed that for ya, Chief.

I actually came to thread to see if I could figure out what a semi automatic assualt pistol is.


If you have an extended mag, your primary intent is not self-defence.
 
2023-01-24 9:18:25 AM  

Warthog: Permanent Solutions For Permanent Problems: Elderly Asians committing mass shootings of other Asians, seemingly at random, in a small California town seems really, really strange.

The old guy who shot up a Lunar New Year party then tried to shoot up another one, then later shot himself was odd enough.

Now we have a second pair of shootings in the same town, after which the shooter just drive to the police station and turned themselves in.

WTF???????????????????

The first shootings were in SoCal.  The more recent ones were outside SF several hundred miles away.  So not the same town, but strange.


Two in the same year is strange, within days is f$cked-up.
 
2023-01-24 9:20:32 AM  

Giant Clown Shoe: Barricaded Gunman: Great self control there. How do you not just blast the f*cker once you take away his gun?

[Fark user image 720x405]

the moment came and he stepped up! true hero

/it looks like he may have tried but wasn't familiar w the weapon
//that would've also been heroic


It would have been understandable - he would have remained a hero but shooting an unarmed person is not, in itself, heroic IMHO.
 
2023-01-24 9:21:14 AM  
The funny thing about the gun debate, is way too many simple folk think that if you use the wrong terminology then your whole argument is invalid and all weapons should be legal with no restrictions. As noted above, the weapon in question was referred to as an assault-pistol. If you google this incident, at least 50% of the results deal with people arguing over the terminology of that. Its the same people who run into every mass shooting thread and say, "wELl AKshUllaY A r sTANds FOr...." or the people who absolutely lose their shiat anytime someone says clip instead of magazine. Yeah, we get it. You know one, maybe two facts about firearms and now you think you're smarter than everyone. Grow the Fark up. You wanna know what an "assault weapon" is? By the etymology definition of the 2 words it's clearly any weapon used to assault someone. Which is ALL OF THEM. Get over it.
 
2023-01-24 9:24:15 AM  

mrshowrules: Natalie Portmanteau: SBinRR: He was all "Tsay my name, biatch!" When he got the gun.

Los Angeles County Sheriff Robert Luna said Sunday the weapon recovered at the Alhambra dance hall was a "semi-automatic assault pistol" with an extended large-capacity magazine clip attached..

Fixed that for ya, Chief.

I actually came to thread to see if I could figure out what a semi automatic assualt pistol is.

If you have an extended mag, your primary intent is not self-defence.


Sure, and I agree, but using inaccurate terminology reduces the effectiveness of arguments.
 
2023-01-24 9:31:33 AM  

Barricaded Gunman: Great self control there. How do you not just blast the f*cker once you take away his gun?


There was another article I read in which he said he'd never even actually seen a gun in real life before (which I sort of doubt; this is America, after all), so maybe he wasn't really sure how to use it. At the very least, he would not have wanted to pause long enough to aim only to realize a round wasn't chambered, and risk the guy getting his hands back on the gun.
 
2023-01-24 9:36:36 AM  

Dryad: olorin604: Natalie Portmanteau: SBinRR: He was all "Tsay my name, biatch!" When he got the gun.

Los Angeles County Sheriff Robert Luna said Sunday the weapon recovered at the Alhambra dance hall was a "semi-automatic assault pistol" with an extended large-capacity magazine clip attached..

Fixed that for ya, Chief.

I actually came to thread to see if I could figure out what a semi automatic assualt pistol is.

Only thing I can think of is one of those AR platform pistols?

Article on a bar shooting described a high capacity assault revolver. Adding 'high capacity' and 'assault' to anything makes it sound scary.
Also makes it sound like 'assault weapons' are responsible for most shootings, when mass shootings are usually handguns. Just like most shootings in general.


Don't worry, I read an article that assured us, the gun is totally safe and OK.  Just taking a rest from it's very busy day.
 
2023-01-24 9:36:59 AM  

IRestoreFurniture: Dryad: olorin604: Natalie Portmanteau: SBinRR: He was all "Tsay my name, biatch!" When he got the gun.

Los Angeles County Sheriff Robert Luna said Sunday the weapon recovered at the Alhambra dance hall was a "semi-automatic assault pistol" with an extended large-capacity magazine clip attached..

Fixed that for ya, Chief.

I actually came to thread to see if I could figure out what a semi automatic assualt pistol is.

Only thing I can think of is one of those AR platform pistols?

Article on a bar shooting described a high capacity assault revolver. Adding 'high capacity' and 'assault' to anything makes it sound scary.
Also makes it sound like 'assault weapons' are responsible for most shootings, when mass shootings are usually handguns. Just like most shootings in general.

Don't worry, I read an article that assured us, the gun is totally safe and OK.  Just taking a rest from it's very busy day.


Its.


phone.
 
2023-01-24 9:37:11 AM  
This guy got VERY VERY lucky.
Several times the shooter got some distance, but he failed to fire the gun.

He's still a hero and still very brave, but he also got very lucky.
 
2023-01-24 9:37:56 AM  

vilesithknight: The funny thing about the gun debate, is way too many simple folk think that if you use the wrong terminology then your whole argument is invalid and all weapons should be legal with no restrictions. ..... By the etymology definition of the 2 words it's clearly any weapon used to assault someone. Which is ALL OF THEM. Get over it.


farking thank you. Can you please repost this with every gun -related thread? Because the folks here need to hear it. I'll even reinforce your message for those in the back: the choice of words is not the issue here, it's the easy access to firearms and a non-existent mental health care system that allow for this. Fix either one and the shootings nearly disappear, regardless of how accurate a journalist is with their terminology.

People were killed. Many people.

I was visiting LA for the first time when this shooting happened (about 6 miles away), so I guess I got the full American Experience.
 
2023-01-24 9:44:53 AM  
Seems like as many of these incidents are stopped by unarmed people as armed.
Maybe more.
Maybe they should have called the Uvalde PD.
 
2023-01-24 10:01:32 AM  

vilesithknight: The funny thing about the gun debate, is way too many simple folk think that if you use the wrong terminology then your whole argument is invalid and all weapons should be legal with no restrictions. As noted above, the weapon in question was referred to as an assault-pistol. If you google this incident, at least 50% of the results deal with people arguing over the terminology of that. Its the same people who run into every mass shooting thread and say, "wELl AKshUllaY A r sTANds FOr...." or the people who absolutely lose their shiat anytime someone says clip instead of magazine. Yeah, we get it. You know one, maybe two facts about firearms and now you think you're smarter than everyone. Grow the Fark up. You wanna know what an "assault weapon" is? By the etymology definition of the 2 words it's clearly any weapon used to assault someone. Which is ALL OF THEM. Get over it.


This is a phenomenon that goes beyond guns. The Internet has allowed an entire tribe of dumb nerds to convince themselves that being technically correct about something stupid, that only an asshole would even care about, makes them look smart.
You can distinguish them by their mating call: "Citation Please! Citation Please!", and the continual barking and slapping of flippers.
 
2023-01-24 10:06:01 AM  

Natalie Portmanteau: mrshowrules: Natalie Portmanteau: SBinRR: He was all "Tsay my name, biatch!" When he got the gun.

Los Angeles County Sheriff Robert Luna said Sunday the weapon recovered at the Alhambra dance hall was a "semi-automatic assault pistol" with an extended large-capacity magazine clip attached..

Fixed that for ya, Chief.

I actually came to thread to see if I could figure out what a semi automatic assualt pistol is.

If you have an extended mag, your primary intent is not self-defence.

Sure, and I agree, but using inaccurate terminology reduces the effectiveness of arguments.


There is no definition of assault weapon that would satisfy the gun enthusiast community.  They think calling an AR-15 an assault weapon is stupid.  Comes-up in almost every thread.

I have no issue using the term "assault" to describe a weapon whose primary intent is to kill people.  Not as a legal or technical definition but rather as the proper use of that adjective.
 
2023-01-24 10:07:19 AM  

bighairyguy: The media has been calling him a "Good Samaritan".  That's not what it means.  Treating the wounded yes, disarming the gunman, no.  That's more of a Good Rambo-itan.


The Samaritans were heretics, outcasts, and isolationists. The whole point of the parable was that people who clothe themselves in righteousness often fail to be as decent as a human being of the lowliest station.

Calling someone a Good Samaritan is a bit of a backhanded compliment.
 
2023-01-24 10:07:37 AM  
Try writing gun control legislation and getting the public to support it without using the correct well defined words and see how far you get. The terminology used farking matters If we want any meaningful gun control laws and it starts with everyone being at least partially on the same page.

One of the biggest stumbling blocks to assault weapons bans is defining it with a legal definition that will encapsulate what you want banned. They have been attacked and struck down for vagueness, so again defining your terms is important.

I also saw absolutely nothing in this thread attempting to use the definitions or words to say an argument was invalid, it was people trying to figure out what weapon was used despite the incredibly meaningless terminology used by the police and the journalist.

A gun ban isn't going to happen, so yah accurately discussing what was actually used makes it possible to figure out what feasible gun control measures could have prevented this.
 
2023-01-24 10:07:40 AM  

wxboy: Barricaded Gunman: Great self control there. How do you not just blast the f*cker once you take away his gun?

There was another article I read in which he said he'd never even actually seen a gun in real life before (which I sort of doubt; this is America, after all), so maybe he wasn't really sure how to use it. At the very least, he would not have wanted to pause long enough to aim only to realize a round wasn't chambered, and risk the guy getting his hands back on the gun.


No, sounds legit. I've not seen one outside of a sporting-goods store display cabinet, or on a cop in probably that long... Not fired one since Scouts, at least.
 
2023-01-24 10:12:03 AM  

mrshowrules: Giant Clown Shoe: Barricaded Gunman: Great self control there. How do you not just blast the f*cker once you take away his gun?

[Fark user image 720x405]

the moment came and he stepped up! true hero

/it looks like he may have tried but wasn't familiar w the weapon
//that would've also been heroic

It would have been understandable - he would have remained a hero but shooting an unarmed person is not, in itself, heroic IMHO.


back up gun?

i think you have to assume a guy trying to enter a dance hall w an assault weapon likely has another weapon or two on his utility belt
 
2023-01-24 10:13:46 AM  

Giant Clown Shoe: mrshowrules: Giant Clown Shoe: Barricaded Gunman: Great self control there. How do you not just blast the f*cker once you take away his gun?

[Fark user image 720x405]

the moment came and he stepped up! true hero

/it looks like he may have tried but wasn't familiar w the weapon
//that would've also been heroic

It would have been understandable - he would have remained a hero but shooting an unarmed person is not, in itself, heroic IMHO.

back up gun?

i think you have to assume a guy trying to enter a dance hall w an assault weapon likely has another weapon or two on his utility belt


Man, if I have any option other than shooting someone to not die I'll m gonna take it. I just do not want to deal with the potential legal complications both criminal and civil that could pop up.
 
2023-01-24 10:14:28 AM  

mrshowrules: Natalie Portmanteau: mrshowrules: Natalie Portmanteau: SBinRR: He was all "Tsay my name, biatch!" When he got the gun.

Los Angeles County Sheriff Robert Luna said Sunday the weapon recovered at the Alhambra dance hall was a "semi-automatic assault pistol" with an extended large-capacity magazine clip attached..

Fixed that for ya, Chief.

I actually came to thread to see if I could figure out what a semi automatic assualt pistol is.

If you have an extended mag, your primary intent is not self-defence.

Sure, and I agree, but using inaccurate terminology reduces the effectiveness of arguments.

There is no definition of assault weapon that would satisfy the gun enthusiast community.  They think calling an AR-15 an assault weapon is stupid.  Comes-up in almost every thread.

I have no issue using the term "assault" to describe a weapon whose primary intent is to kill people.  Not as a legal or technical definition but rather as the proper use of that adjective.


It's a term used to describe a type of weapon primarily used in a military assault.

They're just being giant farking babies about it.
 
2023-01-24 10:16:11 AM  

vilesithknight: The funny thing about the gun debate, is way too many simple folk think that if you use the wrong terminology then your whole argument is invalid and all weapons should be legal with no restrictions. As noted above, the weapon in question was referred to as an assault-pistol. If you google this incident, at least 50% of the results deal with people arguing over the terminology of that. Its the same people who run into every mass shooting thread and say, "wELl AKshUllaY A r sTANds FOr...." or the people who absolutely lose their shiat anytime someone says clip instead of magazine. Yeah, we get it. You know one, maybe two facts about firearms and now you think you're smarter than everyone. Grow the Fark up. You wanna know what an "assault weapon" is? By the etymology definition of the 2 words it's clearly any weapon used to assault someone. Which is ALL OF THEM. Get over it.


Well said and right on point.
 
2023-01-24 10:19:21 AM  

Giant Clown Shoe: mrshowrules: Giant Clown Shoe: Barricaded Gunman: Great self control there. How do you not just blast the f*cker once you take away his gun?

[Fark user image 720x405]

the moment came and he stepped up! true hero

/it looks like he may have tried but wasn't familiar w the weapon
//that would've also been heroic

It would have been understandable - he would have remained a hero but shooting an unarmed person is not, in itself, heroic IMHO.

back up gun?

i think you have to assume a guy trying to enter a dance hall w an assault weapon likely has another weapon or two on his utility belt


It would be understandable and would not detract from the overall heroic act.  However, imagine a 3 person scenario.  First person risks his life seemingly disarming the suspect.  Second, person walks up and shoots the suspect.  You probably wouldn't consider the second person a hero.
 
2023-01-24 10:21:08 AM  
Fauxalt rifles are good for nothing but slaughtering unarmed people.
Useless for hunting.
Useless for sniping - actually so inaccurate that their is no point practicing with them.
Useless in a real firefifght.
Good for one thing, and one thing only - mowing down the unarmed.
And that's what they are sold for, and most of the social misfits who buy them intend to use them for that some day, whether they are consciously aware of it or not.
Otherwise they would buy real guns that are for useful purposes - Fauxalt rifles are death toys for murder toddlers.
 
2023-01-24 10:22:31 AM  

slantsix: it's the easy access to firearms and a non-existent mental health care system that allow for this. Fix either one and the shootings nearly disappear, regardless of how accurate a journalist is with their terminology.


Exactly what "mental disease" causes men to shoot random strangers?  And why does it overwhelmingly affect only men?
 
2023-01-24 10:30:57 AM  

TwilightZone: slantsix: it's the easy access to firearms and a non-existent mental health care system that allow for this. Fix either one and the shootings nearly disappear, regardless of how accurate a journalist is with their terminology.

Exactly what "mental disease" causes men to shoot random strangers?  And why does it overwhelmingly affect only men?


All the mental health bullshiat in the world won't scratch the surface of this problem.
But if you look at a relatively similar society that has done something intelligent about it - Australia - you can see that placing reasonable regulation on firearms reduces the incidence of such events.
No, it doesn't eliminate ALL violence, or ALL firearm crime or ALL of anything - but that is a phony threshold, intended to silence debate, not to offer useful argument.
If we wanted less gun violence, we would elect politicians who will appoint judges who go back to the old, sane interpretation of the Second Amendment that allows society the authority to regulate dangerous tools - like it say right IN the amendment.
It's the guns, people.
 
2023-01-24 10:32:03 AM  

jso2897: Fauxalt rifles are good for nothing but slaughtering unarmed people.
Useless for hunting.
Useless for sniping - actually so inaccurate that their is no point practicing with them.
Useless in a real firefifght.

Good for one thing, and one thing only - mowing down the unarmed.
And that's what they are sold for, and most of the social misfits who buy them intend to use them for that some day, whether they are consciously aware of it or not.
Otherwise they would buy real guns that are for useful purposes - Fauxalt rifles are death toys for murder toddlers.


You should tell the military that. They seem to use a lot of them for both those tasks.
In fact, now that I think about it, you usually claim they are military grade weapons useful only for combat.
If you are going to screech inaccurate hyperbole, at least keep it consistent dude.
-
/Also, this is now a white supremacists with assault rifles thread. Took you longer to ignore handguns today, but you managed it.
 
2023-01-24 10:35:41 AM  

olorin604: Try writing gun control legislation and getting the public to support it without using the correct well defined words and see how far you get. The terminology used farking matters If we want any meaningful gun control laws and it starts with everyone being at least partially on the same page.

One of the biggest stumbling blocks to assault weapons bans is defining it with a legal definition that will encapsulate what you want banned. They have been attacked and struck down for vagueness, so again defining your terms is important.

I also saw absolutely nothing in this thread attempting to use the definitions or words to say an argument was invalid, it was people trying to figure out what weapon was used despite the incredibly meaningless terminology used by the police and the journalist.

A gun ban isn't going to happen, so yah accurately discussing what was actually used makes it possible to figure out what feasible gun control measures could have prevented this.


To paraphrase the Simpsons, "you've tried nothing and you're all out of ideas!"

Ban all handguns, period. There's no reason to own one. Want to go to the shooting range? Fine. You can rent.
Traveling with a shotgun or rifle for hunting? It must be kept in a safe, in an inaccessible part of the vehicle (trunk or covered and locked truck bed).
This would reduce shootings by 90%. Not perfect but it's a start.
Notice how there's very little technical terminology in there? Because it's about keeping people safe, rather than protecting your precious guns.
 
2023-01-24 10:35:52 AM  

jso2897: TwilightZone: slantsix: it's the easy access to firearms and a non-existent mental health care system that allow for this. Fix either one and the shootings nearly disappear, regardless of how accurate a journalist is with their terminology.

Exactly what "mental disease" causes men to shoot random strangers?  And why does it overwhelmingly affect only men?

All the mental health bullshiat in the world won't scratch the surface of this problem.
But if you look at a relatively similar society that has done something intelligent about it - Australia - you can see that placing reasonable regulation on firearms reduces the incidence of such events.
No, it doesn't eliminate ALL violence, or ALL firearm crime or ALL of anything - but that is a phony threshold, intended to silence debate, not to offer useful argument.

If we wanted less gun violence, we would elect politicians who will appoint judges who go back to the old, sane interpretation of the Second Amendment that allows society the authority to regulate dangerous tools - like it say right IN the amendment.
It's the guns, people.


Funny how when anyone else suggests the same thing, regulation is the phony attempt to silence debate, anyone suggesting it is an NRA shill, and only total ban and seizure is the solution.
Why the total 180? Did you just join the NRA or something
 
2023-01-24 10:40:06 AM  

slantsix: olorin604: Try writing gun control legislation and getting the public to support it without using the correct well defined words and see how far you get. The terminology used farking matters If we want any meaningful gun control laws and it starts with everyone being at least partially on the same page.

One of the biggest stumbling blocks to assault weapons bans is defining it with a legal definition that will encapsulate what you want banned. They have been attacked and struck down for vagueness, so again defining your terms is important.

I also saw absolutely nothing in this thread attempting to use the definitions or words to say an argument was invalid, it was people trying to figure out what weapon was used despite the incredibly meaningless terminology used by the police and the journalist.

A gun ban isn't going to happen, so yah accurately discussing what was actually used makes it possible to figure out what feasible gun control measures could have prevented this.

To paraphrase the Simpsons, "you've tried nothing and you're all out of ideas!"

Ban all handguns, period. There's no reason to own one. Want to go to the shooting range? Fine. You can rent.
Traveling with a shotgun or rifle for hunting? It must be kept in a safe, in an inaccessible part of the vehicle (trunk or covered and locked truck bed).
This would reduce shootings by 90%. Not perfect but it's a start.
Notice how there's very little technical terminology in there? Because it's about keeping people safe, rather than protecting your precious guns.


Why did the favorite talking point lately become attacking anyone who says we need clear, well defined gun laws so that the nutjobs don't simply work around them like they have done to the last 30 years of poorly worded laws?
Seriously. Kicking everyone out of your circle that suggests using clear terms in gun legislation seems like a way to repeat the mistakes of '94 over and over.
 
2023-01-24 10:41:06 AM  
1. Run toward the weapon.
2. Secure the weapon.
3. Neutralize the situation.
 
2023-01-24 10:43:48 AM  

Dryad: Why did the favorite talking point lately become attacking anyone who says we need clear, well defined gun laws so that the nutjobs don't simply work around them like they have done to the last 30 years of poorly worded laws?
Seriously. Kicking everyone out of your circle that suggests using clear terms in gun legislation seems like a way to repeat the mistakes of '94 over and over.


Because it's so blatantly obvious what happens when things become an argument over semantics.

For example: Chemists have been modifying molecules to change the components of the drugs they produce, to stay ahead of the law. We've been seeing this for years.

The law is first and foremost about intent.
 
2023-01-24 10:47:16 AM  

slantsix: olorin604: Try writing gun control legislation and getting the public to support it without using the correct well defined words and see how far you get. The terminology used farking matters If we want any meaningful gun control laws and it starts with everyone being at least partially on the same page.

One of the biggest stumbling blocks to assault weapons bans is defining it with a legal definition that will encapsulate what you want banned. They have been attacked and struck down for vagueness, so again defining your terms is important.

I also saw absolutely nothing in this thread attempting to use the definitions or words to say an argument was invalid, it was people trying to figure out what weapon was used despite the incredibly meaningless terminology used by the police and the journalist.

A gun ban isn't going to happen, so yah accurately discussing what was actually used makes it possible to figure out what feasible gun control measures could have prevented this.

To paraphrase the Simpsons, "you've tried nothing and you're all out of ideas!"

Ban all handguns, period. There's no reason to own one. Want to go to the shooting range? Fine. You can rent.
Traveling with a shotgun or rifle for hunting? It must be kept in a safe, in an inaccessible part of the vehicle (trunk or covered and locked truck bed).
This would reduce shootings by 90%. Not perfect but it's a start.
Notice how there's very little technical terminology in there? Because it's about keeping people safe, rather than protecting your precious guns.


It's also politically unrealistic and logistically impossible.

I don't give a fark about guns, I care about a solution that has some basis in reality, not the fantasy utopia plans like yours require.
 
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