Skip to content
Do you have adblock enabled?
 
If you can read this, either the style sheet didn't load or you have an older browser that doesn't support style sheets. Try clearing your browser cache and refreshing the page.

(Slate)   More and more people are starting to understand that "college rankings" are and always have been every bit as much bullshiat as what it costs to go to college in the first place   (slate.com) divider line
    More: Obvious, College, High school, different law schools, Ivy League, Ranking, Non-parametric statistics, U.S. News, Madrasah  
•       •       •

450 clicks; posted to Business » and Main » on 01 Dec 2022 at 9:18 AM (8 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



13 Comments     (+0 »)
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest
 
2022-12-01 9:37:44 AM  
Its all about brand at a certain point.

A harvard degree will beat a drunken state university degree for a job
 
2022-12-01 9:48:34 AM  
As in... sticker price is inflated to make the college look more prestigious (a Veblen hood... er, Veblen service?) and nobody actually pays sticker price?
 
2022-12-01 10:19:49 AM  
Well, good news for Podunk State. Or maybe not, if they can't at least get points for their top ten Communications Program
 
2022-12-01 11:41:09 AM  
A significant portion of most of these rankings is irrelevant or only tangentially relevant to the vast majority of undergraduate applicants who are the target audience of the ranking charts - the scores are heavily geared around research, endowments, peer reviewed and published papers, and things like Nobel prizes won by faculty.

None of this is directly relevant to any undergrads who don't plan to pursue careers in academia, and by the time those undergrads who are start applying for post grad positions they're sufficiently wired into the various university prestige ranking that they don't need these surveys.

This isn't to say that a university reputation is irrelevant to undergrads, degrees from more highly regarded universities tend to make it much easier to get your foot in the door and/or to readily get work outside the region/country your degree is from, but these ranking systems have somewhat limited utility even in that.
 
2022-12-01 12:27:55 PM  

Target Builder: A significant portion of most of these rankings is irrelevant or only tangentially relevant to the vast majority of undergraduate applicants who are the target audience of the ranking charts - the scores are heavily geared around research, endowments, peer reviewed and published papers, and things like Nobel prizes won by faculty.

None of this is directly relevant to any undergrads who don't plan to pursue careers in academia, and by the time those undergrads who are start applying for post grad positions they're sufficiently wired into the various university prestige ranking that they don't need these surveys.

This isn't to say that a university reputation is irrelevant to undergrads, degrees from more highly regarded universities tend to make it much easier to get your foot in the door and/or to readily get work outside the region/country your degree is from, but these ranking systems have somewhat limited utility even in that.


Most students pick the college with the best sports ball teams anyhow.
 
2022-12-01 12:46:22 PM  

Linux_Yes: Its all about brand at a certain point.

A harvard degree will beat a drunken state university degree for a job


I think it was Freakonomics that had a series on colleges. What you posted was pretty much quoted by one of the students attending an Ivy.

The education is the same, it is the access to a network is what they are buying.

also touched on rankings, alumni and standardized tests.

NCSB: During the pandemic, a lot of colleges suspended requiring ACT/SATs because students literally couldn't take the test. Nothing notably changed in the quality of applicants during that time or the performance of the new students. What did change was the demographics...those from underrepresented backgrounds saw an increase in acceptance to R1s and the likes.

Now they all want to require them again due to the stupid US News Reports ranking.
 
2022-12-01 12:48:03 PM  

Target Builder: A significant portion of most of these rankings is irrelevant or only tangentially relevant to the vast majority of undergraduate applicants who are the target audience of the ranking charts - the scores are heavily geared around research, endowments, peer reviewed and published papers, and things like Nobel prizes won by faculty.


Alumni love the rankings too.
 
2022-12-01 12:49:57 PM  

mcreadyblue: Most students pick the college with the best sports ball teams anyhow.


Yep. Schools that win championships or go deep into tourneys see an appreciable increase in student applications the following year.

College sports are a major advertising avenue for schools.
 
2022-12-01 1:05:13 PM  
The "Third Way" thing mentioned at the end of the interview is pretty cool: https://www.thirdway.org/graphic/rating-colleges-by-economic-mobility

They look at how much people actually end up paying (read: taking out loans for) after grants and stuff, how much more income someone will average per year with a degree from a given school than they would with just a high school diploma, and how long it'll take them to pay off the costs.  But then they also look at what percent of students are low-income enough to qualify for Pell grants, so schools that do very well for low-income people but hardly admit any of them don't rank as well as those that admit a lot and do well for them.

Suddenly among Boston-area schools, UMass-Boston is top-tier (40K net cost, 16K/year pay boost, 2.4-year paydown, 41% pell grants), MIT is second-tier (30K net cost, 99K/year pay boost, 0.3-year paydown, 18% pell grants), and Harvard is way down in the 4th tier (9.5K net cost, 102K/year pay boos, 0.1-year paydown, 12% pell grants).  Worst is Berklee College of Music, with 174K net cost, 1.4K pay boost vs. high school, and a 118-year paydown. ;-)
 
2022-12-01 2:10:20 PM  

Hyjamon: Linux_Yes: Its all about brand at a certain point.

A harvard degree will beat a drunken state university degree for a job

I think it was Freakonomics that had a series on colleges. What you posted was pretty much quoted by one of the students attending an Ivy.

The education is the same, it is the access to a network is what they are buying.

also touched on rankings, alumni and standardized tests.

NCSB: During the pandemic, a lot of colleges suspended requiring ACT/SATs because students literally couldn't take the test. Nothing notably changed in the quality of applicants during that time or the performance of the new students. What did change was the demographics...those from underrepresented backgrounds saw an increase in acceptance to R1s and the likes.

Now they all want to require them again due to the stupid US News Reports ranking.


Nations that best utilize the talents of their citizens will beat economically nations who dont.

And talent doesnt have a socio economic class.  The poor have just as much in their ranks as any other class.

I suspect those in the upper classes dont want their kids to have to compete w those in the lower classes.

Merica
 
2022-12-01 2:11:03 PM  

Hyjamon: mcreadyblue: Most students pick the college with the best sports ball teams anyhow.

Yep. Schools that win championships or go deep into tourneys see an appreciable increase in student applications the following year.

College sports are a major advertising avenue for schools.


Students who are not too bright anyway
 
2022-12-01 2:12:55 PM  

mcreadyblue: Target Builder: A significant portion of most of these rankings is irrelevant or only tangentially relevant to the vast majority of undergraduate applicants who are the target audience of the ranking charts - the scores are heavily geared around research, endowments, peer reviewed and published papers, and things like Nobel prizes won by faculty.

None of this is directly relevant to any undergrads who don't plan to pursue careers in academia, and by the time those undergrads who are start applying for post grad positions they're sufficiently wired into the various university prestige ranking that they don't need these surveys.

This isn't to say that a university reputation is irrelevant to undergrads, degrees from more highly regarded universities tend to make it much easier to get your foot in the door and/or to readily get work outside the region/country your degree is from, but these ranking systems have somewhat limited utility even in that.

Most students pick the college with the best sports ball teams anyhow.


So sad

The poor things
 
2022-12-02 6:28:47 AM  

dbirchall: The "Third Way" thing mentioned at the end of the interview is pretty cool: https://www.thirdway.org/graphic/rating-colleges-by-economic-mobility

They look at how much people actually end up paying (read: taking out loans for) after grants and stuff, how much more income someone will average per year with a degree from a given school than they would with just a high school diploma, and how long it'll take them to pay off the costs.  But then they also look at what percent of students are low-income enough to qualify for Pell grants, so schools that do very well for low-income people but hardly admit any of them don't rank as well as those that admit a lot and do well for them.

Suddenly among Boston-area schools, UMass-Boston is top-tier (40K net cost, 16K/year pay boost, 2.4-year paydown, 41% pell grants), MIT is second-tier (30K net cost, 99K/year pay boost, 0.3-year paydown, 18% pell grants), and Harvard is way down in the 4th tier (9.5K net cost, 102K/year pay boos, 0.1-year paydown, 12% pell grants).  Worst is Berklee College of Music, with 174K net cost, 1.4K pay boost vs. high school, and a 118-year paydown. ;-)


Thanks, that's pretty cool.

Suddenly Bowie State is the only Tier 1 university in the DMV (Not counting Baltimore, if you consider that DMV).  I thought "OK, maybe it's an HBCU thing" but Howard is Tier 3.
 
Displayed 13 of 13 comments

View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest

This thread is closed to new comments.

Continue Farking




On Twitter


  1. Links are submitted by members of the Fark community.

  2. When community members submit a link, they also write a custom headline for the story.

  3. Other Farkers comment on the links. This is the number of comments. Click here to read them.

  4. Click here to submit a link.