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(MSN)   AZ SoS sues Cochise County to compel them to certify their election. Cochise County is delaying certification due to oddities in Maricopa County. Maricopa County voted to certify its election unanimously   (msn.com) divider line
    More: Followup, Voting, Arizona, Election, Cochise County, Arizona Secretary of State Katie Hobbs, state's statutory deadline, election results, NBC News People  
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1503 clicks; posted to Politics » on 29 Nov 2022 at 6:20 AM (8 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2022-11-29 2:07:32 AM  
Confused?

You won't be after this episode of Soap
 
2022-11-29 2:12:27 AM  
It's a special Republican talent to pretend to be an oppressed minority when they're in the majority and running everything.
 
2022-11-29 2:39:17 AM  
Republicans DON'T want those results certified in Cochise County. They WANT the county's votes to disappear.

It's a temporary L with huge positive implications for Republicans down the road if, somehow, a court says "yeah this is fine, so we just don't count your county."  That will make 2024... so, so much worse
 
2022-11-29 3:53:22 AM  
Checks. Those are the kind of people who are nosy. They want to know what's in your pants, what's going on in your bedroom, what you did at the doctor. Absolutely on brand to be sticking their nose in someone else's election business.
 
2022-11-29 5:37:47 AM  
The chem-trails were a failure. Our only hope is the 5G chips.
 
2022-11-29 5:42:45 AM  

puffy999: Republicans DON'T want those results certified in Cochise County. They WANT the county's votes to disappear.

It's a temporary L with huge positive implications for Republicans down the road if, somehow, a court says "yeah this is fine, so we just don't count your county."  That will make 2024... so, so much worse


If Republicans are nullifying their own counties I fail to see how that could turn out well for them in 24
 
2022-11-29 6:24:56 AM  

cameroncrazy1984: puffy999: Republicans DON'T want those results certified in Cochise County. They WANT the county's votes to disappear.

It's a temporary L with huge positive implications for Republicans down the road if, somehow, a court says "yeah this is fine, so we just don't count your county."  That will make 2024... so, so much worse

If Republicans are nullifying their own counties I fail to see how that could turn out well for them in 24


It sets a precedent for legal challenges that aim to exclude votes from "blue" counties. They're looking for a court ruling that says that a county failing to certify can just have all their votes thrown out; this can be used by using legal challenges to "blue" counties to delay their certifications to past deadlines.

No guarantee it will work, of course, but the buffer is the courts/judges, and that's not comforting.
 
2022-11-29 6:38:40 AM  

cameroncrazy1984: puffy999: Republicans DON'T want those results certified in Cochise County. They WANT the county's votes to disappear.

It's a temporary L with huge positive implications for Republicans down the road if, somehow, a court says "yeah this is fine, so we just don't count your county."  That will make 2024... so, so much worse

If Republicans are nullifying their own counties I fail to see how that could turn out well for them in 24


They are whining that elections aren't "fair" because they're losing, just based on changing demographics. The way I understand it, If they can succeed in calling this election into question, the ideas will spread to other places. If they can get a GOP majority onto election boards in Democrat majority or even "leaning D" counties, they can disenfranchise the people they don't like.

It's one reason why the same group that sued to allow weekend voting in the Georgia runoff is supporting lawsuits in Arizona.
 
2022-11-29 6:42:09 AM  
Republicans know they're losing. They know they're unpopular, that conservative ideology does not have the support they expected. The GOP is bleeding out rivers of money, Trump just won't stop getting in the way, and the liberals aren't afraid of the trumpers at all. Not even a tiny bit.
Tantrums are to be expected.
 
2022-11-29 6:43:23 AM  
If anyone needed any more evidence that Republicans are anti-democratic, this is it: They've turned voting into another culture war where they appoint themselves the arbiters of who gets to vote and who doesn't based on their bigoted, moronic "beliefs."
 
2022-11-29 6:49:22 AM  

wxboy: cameroncrazy1984: puffy999: Republicans DON'T want those results certified in Cochise County. They WANT the county's votes to disappear.

It's a temporary L with huge positive implications for Republicans down the road if, somehow, a court says "yeah this is fine, so we just don't count your county."  That will make 2024... so, so much worse

If Republicans are nullifying their own counties I fail to see how that could turn out well for them in 24

It sets a precedent for legal challenges that aim to exclude votes from "blue" counties. They're looking for a court ruling that says that a county failing to certify can just have all their votes thrown out; this can be used by using legal challenges to "blue" counties to delay their certifications to past deadlines.

No guarantee it will work, of course, but the buffer is the courts/judges, and that's not comforting.


No, because the court isn't ordering the county to not certify. This isn't "some random Republican county can halt certification in other counties" case even if they somehow win.
 
2022-11-29 6:51:37 AM  
I expected more from Nathan wind. I know he wants to set it straight, but every thing isn't Watergate.
 
2022-11-29 6:56:13 AM  
Fark user imageView Full Size

What I think of literally every time I see a story about this place.
 
2022-11-29 6:58:00 AM  

RI_Red: If anyone needed any more evidence that Republicans are anti-democratic, this is it: They've turned voting into another culture war where they appoint themselves the arbiters of who gets to vote and who doesn't based on their bigoted, moronic "beliefs."


Republicans have accepted that they cannot and will not achieve their objectives via democracy. I'm just waiting for everyone else to figure that out as well.
 
2022-11-29 6:59:42 AM  

qorkfiend: wxboy: cameroncrazy1984: puffy999: Republicans DON'T want those results certified in Cochise County. They WANT the county's votes to disappear.

It's a temporary L with huge positive implications for Republicans down the road if, somehow, a court says "yeah this is fine, so we just don't count your county."  That will make 2024... so, so much worse

If Republicans are nullifying their own counties I fail to see how that could turn out well for them in 24

It sets a precedent for legal challenges that aim to exclude votes from "blue" counties. They're looking for a court ruling that says that a county failing to certify can just have all their votes thrown out; this can be used by using legal challenges to "blue" counties to delay their certifications to past deadlines.

No guarantee it will work, of course, but the buffer is the courts/judges, and that's not comforting.

No, because the court isn't ordering the county to not certify. This isn't "some random Republican county can halt certification in other counties" case even if they somehow win.


The truly delightful irony is that if Cochise County doesn't certify and their votes aren't included, two races flip from R to D, the state school superintendent and their congress critter.
 
2022-11-29 7:00:07 AM  
It's pretty straightforward middle school "if I win it's fair, if i lost you cheated" at this point. No reason to dig any deeper than that.

They think in their peabrained little heads that they set everything up to win, so they CANNOT BE LOSING. Life doesn't work like that; but they don't have that kind of processing power.
 
2022-11-29 7:02:16 AM  

RI_Red: If anyone needed any more evidence that Republicans are anti-democratic, this is it: They've turned voting into another culture war where they appoint themselves the arbiters of who gets to vote and who doesn't based on their bigoted, moronic "beliefs."


Of course they're anti-democratic, all nazis are.
 
2022-11-29 7:02:45 AM  
So how long until we become Iraq? That's what goes on over there. Your party loses an election? Eh bomb em till you do win!
 
2022-11-29 7:04:04 AM  
Why aren't Republicans in Cochise County pissed off and protesting about their votes about to not be counted?
 
2022-11-29 7:04:57 AM  
What does Gender Fluidity have to do with voting?   Or was that one guy just going down the checklist of made up conspiracy theories trying to find something that might stick?
 
2022-11-29 7:05:05 AM  

Aquapope: Why aren't Republicans in Cochise County pissed off and protesting about their votes about to not be counted?


Because they're polishing up their victim cards
 
2022-11-29 7:18:02 AM  

fnordfocus: It's a special Republican talent to pretend to be an oppressed minority when they're in the majority and running everything.


No they are the minority but they do run much of everything and have undo influence in places they don't run yet still whine about being oppressed.
 
2022-11-29 7:18:57 AM  
Go on and save yourselves.
 
2022-11-29 7:20:14 AM  
Sour grapes make a potent whine.
 
2022-11-29 7:25:53 AM  
Nebby jagoffs
 
2022-11-29 7:26:15 AM  

fnordfocus: It's a special Republican talent to pretend to be an oppressed minority when they're in the majority and running everything.


Its hard being a white man in a white man's world.
 
2022-11-29 7:33:05 AM  

qorkfiend: Aquapope: Why aren't Republicans in Cochise County pissed off and protesting about their votes about to not be counted?

Because they're polishing up their victim cards


That sounds like a euphemism.

/Tiny, tiny little victim's cards.
 
2022-11-29 7:39:19 AM  

Derek Force: What does Gender Fluidity have to do with voting?   Or was that one guy just going down the checklist of made up conspiracy theories trying to find something that might stick?


Everything I don't like is an attack against me; everything that changes is part of a plot; everything different from what I know is a threat. They're all part of a grand conspiracy to make me unhappy.
 
2022-11-29 7:40:31 AM  
In 2020 my IP congressman voted against certifying the election because of "irregularities" with other states numbers. This so the same thing they've done for years.
 
2022-11-29 7:45:17 AM  

cameroncrazy1984: puffy999: Republicans DON'T want those results certified in Cochise County. They WANT the county's votes to disappear.

It's a temporary L with huge positive implications for Republicans down the road if, somehow, a court says "yeah this is fine, so we just don't count your county."  That will make 2024... so, so much worse

If Republicans are nullifying their own counties I fail to see how that could turn out well for them in 24


Because it means any county with a republican board can choose if they certify based on the results of the election in that county.

In other words they can refuse to certify if a Democrat wins the county.

Wonder what this does about other issues or races or issues on the ballot, I'm going to go read the article now and see if it mentions anything.
 
2022-11-29 7:46:08 AM  

TelemonianAjax: In 2020 my IP congressman voted against certifying the election because of "irregularities" with other states numbers. This so the same thing they've done for years.


At least in theory they're supposed to.

This is more like Texas refusing to cast its electoral votes because the Democratic candidate won California.
 
2022-11-29 7:46:49 AM  

olorin604: cameroncrazy1984: puffy999: Republicans DON'T want those results certified in Cochise County. They WANT the county's votes to disappear.

It's a temporary L with huge positive implications for Republicans down the road if, somehow, a court says "yeah this is fine, so we just don't count your county."  That will make 2024... so, so much worse

If Republicans are nullifying their own counties I fail to see how that could turn out well for them in 24

Because it means any county with a republican board can choose if they certify based on the results of the election in that county.

In other words they can refuse to certify if a Democrat wins the county.

Wonder what this does about other issues or races or issues on the ballot, I'm going to go read the article now and see if it mentions anything.


Right. So, it only affects Republican counties with Republican majorities on their canvassing boards.
 
2022-11-29 7:54:20 AM  

qorkfiend: olorin604: cameroncrazy1984: puffy999: Republicans DON'T want those results certified in Cochise County. They WANT the county's votes to disappear.

It's a temporary L with huge positive implications for Republicans down the road if, somehow, a court says "yeah this is fine, so we just don't count your county."  That will make 2024... so, so much worse

If Republicans are nullifying their own counties I fail to see how that could turn out well for them in 24

Because it means any county with a republican board can choose if they certify based on the results of the election in that county.

In other words they can refuse to certify if a Democrat wins the county.

Wonder what this does about other issues or races or issues on the ballot, I'm going to go read the article now and see if it mentions anything.

Right. So, it only affects Republican counties with Republican majorities on their canvassing boards.


Which sounds fine until you remember that what Republicans are fighting is a demographic shift that's turning some red places blue. Dems can't take over local government if Reps in place can just refuse to certify elections that they win.
 
2022-11-29 7:54:42 AM  

qorkfiend: olorin604: cameroncrazy1984: puffy999: Republicans DON'T want those results certified in Cochise County. They WANT the county's votes to disappear.

It's a temporary L with huge positive implications for Republicans down the road if, somehow, a court says "yeah this is fine, so we just don't count your county."  That will make 2024... so, so much worse

If Republicans are nullifying their own counties I fail to see how that could turn out well for them in 24

Because it means any county with a republican board can choose if they certify based on the results of the election in that county.

In other words they can refuse to certify if a Democrat wins the county.

Wonder what this does about other issues or races or issues on the ballot, I'm going to go read the article now and see if it mentions anything.

Right. So, it only affects Republican counties with Republican majorities on their canvassing boards.


Pretty much, it's a hail Mary against counties voting in an unexpected manner, which if I remember right happened in 2020, but I think the big swing then was huge turnout in the highly populous left leaning areas.

someone above pointed out it would also make it possible to use legal shenanigans to get stays preventing certification to take counties out of the running. Which is far more nefarious than my mind went to.
 
2022-11-29 7:55:59 AM  

olorin604: qorkfiend: olorin604: cameroncrazy1984: puffy999: Republicans DON'T want those results certified in Cochise County. They WANT the county's votes to disappear.

It's a temporary L with huge positive implications for Republicans down the road if, somehow, a court says "yeah this is fine, so we just don't count your county."  That will make 2024... so, so much worse

If Republicans are nullifying their own counties I fail to see how that could turn out well for them in 24

Because it means any county with a republican board can choose if they certify based on the results of the election in that county.

In other words they can refuse to certify if a Democrat wins the county.

Wonder what this does about other issues or races or issues on the ballot, I'm going to go read the article now and see if it mentions anything.

Right. So, it only affects Republican counties with Republican majorities on their canvassing boards.

Pretty much, it's a hail Mary against counties voting in an unexpected manner, which if I remember right happened in 2020, but I think the big swing then was huge turnout in the highly populous left leaning areas.

someone above pointed out it would also make it possible to use legal shenanigans to get stays preventing certification to take counties out of the running. Which is far more nefarious than my mind went to.


Yeah, the problem is that observation is completely lacking in any logical foundation, so...
 
2022-11-29 7:56:41 AM  

The Negro Community: qorkfiend: olorin604: cameroncrazy1984: puffy999: Republicans DON'T want those results certified in Cochise County. They WANT the county's votes to disappear.

It's a temporary L with huge positive implications for Republicans down the road if, somehow, a court says "yeah this is fine, so we just don't count your county."  That will make 2024... so, so much worse

If Republicans are nullifying their own counties I fail to see how that could turn out well for them in 24

Because it means any county with a republican board can choose if they certify based on the results of the election in that county.

In other words they can refuse to certify if a Democrat wins the county.

Wonder what this does about other issues or races or issues on the ballot, I'm going to go read the article now and see if it mentions anything.

Right. So, it only affects Republican counties with Republican majorities on their canvassing boards.

Which sounds fine until you remember that what Republicans are fighting is a demographic shift that's turning some red places blue. Dems can't take over local government if Reps in place can just refuse to certify elections that they win.


Why would these majority Democratic areas have Republican canvassing boards?
 
2022-11-29 8:08:19 AM  

qorkfiend: The Negro Community: qorkfiend: olorin604: cameroncrazy1984: puffy999: Republicans DON'T want those results certified in Cochise County. They WANT the county's votes to disappear.

It's a temporary L with huge positive implications for Republicans down the road if, somehow, a court says "yeah this is fine, so we just don't count your county."  That will make 2024... so, so much worse

If Republicans are nullifying their own counties I fail to see how that could turn out well for them in 24

Because it means any county with a republican board can choose if they certify based on the results of the election in that county.

In other words they can refuse to certify if a Democrat wins the county.

Wonder what this does about other issues or races or issues on the ballot, I'm going to go read the article now and see if it mentions anything.

Right. So, it only affects Republican counties with Republican majorities on their canvassing boards.

Which sounds fine until you remember that what Republicans are fighting is a demographic shift that's turning some red places blue. Dems can't take over local government if Reps in place can just refuse to certify elections that they win.

Why would these majority Democratic areas have Republican canvassing boards?


Because they may be mandated to be evenly split, as is the case in Michigan, as we recall from 2020, when they tried to certify everything but Wayne County (Detroit)
 
2022-11-29 8:12:06 AM  

qorkfiend: wxboy: cameroncrazy1984: puffy999: Republicans DON'T want those results certified in Cochise County. They WANT the county's votes to disappear.

It's a temporary L with huge positive implications for Republicans down the road if, somehow, a court says "yeah this is fine, so we just don't count your county."  That will make 2024... so, so much worse

If Republicans are nullifying their own counties I fail to see how that could turn out well for them in 24

It sets a precedent for legal challenges that aim to exclude votes from "blue" counties. They're looking for a court ruling that says that a county failing to certify can just have all their votes thrown out; this can be used by using legal challenges to "blue" counties to delay their certifications to past deadlines.

No guarantee it will work, of course, but the buffer is the courts/judges, and that's not comforting.

No, because the court isn't ordering the county to not certify. This isn't "some random Republican county can halt certification in other counties" case even if they somehow win.


They're hoping the result will be the votes from the county get thrown out, with court approval.

Then in 2024 there are a lot of counties that lean Democratic but have either equally split or GOP controlled election boards. If they can establish this cycle that failure to certify means the votes get thrown out then next cycle their counterparts in blue counties can implement this in a way that will affect election outcomes.
 
2022-11-29 8:17:31 AM  

Target Builder: qorkfiend: wxboy: cameroncrazy1984: puffy999: Republicans DON'T want those results certified in Cochise County. They WANT the county's votes to disappear.

It's a temporary L with huge positive implications for Republicans down the road if, somehow, a court says "yeah this is fine, so we just don't count your county."  That will make 2024... so, so much worse

If Republicans are nullifying their own counties I fail to see how that could turn out well for them in 24

It sets a precedent for legal challenges that aim to exclude votes from "blue" counties. They're looking for a court ruling that says that a county failing to certify can just have all their votes thrown out; this can be used by using legal challenges to "blue" counties to delay their certifications to past deadlines.

No guarantee it will work, of course, but the buffer is the courts/judges, and that's not comforting.

No, because the court isn't ordering the county to not certify. This isn't "some random Republican county can halt certification in other counties" case even if they somehow win.

They're hoping the result will be the votes from the county get thrown out, with court approval.

Then in 2024 there are a lot of counties that lean Democratic but have either equally split or GOP controlled election boards. If they can establish this cycle that failure to certify means the votes get thrown out then next cycle their counterparts in blue counties can implement this in a way that will affect election outcomes.


Yeah, and there's a huge difference between "we want to throw out our own votes" and "we want to throw out these other votes"
 
2022-11-29 8:17:49 AM  
IANAL, but maybe criminal charges would get them to act?
 
2022-11-29 8:18:18 AM  
"There is no reason for us to delay," English told vice chair Peggy Judd and Tom Crosby. "We have been presented materials that was asked for at the last meeting from both sides, and I feel that you both have the information necessary in order to make this decision," she added.

I eagerly await the day when Democrats stop being so God damn civil and reasonable. It's like she's in a dream world.
 
2022-11-29 8:19:04 AM  
This is all starting to sound pretty similar to all of the Fark hivemind hurr and durr back in 2018 that the Republicans would simply refuse to seat any Democratic members of Congress.
 
2022-11-29 8:19:30 AM  

Mambo Bananapatch: "There is no reason for us to delay," English told vice chair Peggy Judd and Tom Crosby. "We have been presented materials that was asked for at the last meeting from both sides, and I feel that you both have the information necessary in order to make this decision," she added.

I eagerly await the day when Democrats stop being so God damn civil and reasonable. It's like she's in a dream world.


And instead they should be doing...what, exactly?
 
2022-11-29 8:24:23 AM  

Hong Kong Phooey: [Fark user image 360x240]
What I think of literally every time I see a story about this place.


Dude, the exact same thing for me.
 
2022-11-29 8:24:25 AM  

RI_Red: If anyone needed any more evidence that Republicans are anti-democratic, this is it: They've turned voting into another culture war where they appoint themselves the arbiters of who gets to vote and who doesn't based on their bigoted, moronic "beliefs."


You *do* realize that 4 of the 5 members of the election board that voted unanimously to certify Maricopa, to Dems' benefit, were Republicans, right?

Brad Raffaspergers & Mike Pence didn't do Mafia Donald any favors in 2020 either.

The civil war between the GQP and R "lets break the system, not the rules" traditionalists seems to be shaking out in favor of the ones who don't favor an *explicitly direct* political coup.  (According to the trend of midterm winners and losers.)

Still plenty of dangerous political f*ckery to be on guard for, but we're not seeing the insane amount of election denial from the losing parties' Representatives we expected this time.

That's... Progress?
 
2022-11-29 8:26:57 AM  

qorkfiend: Yeah, and there's a huge difference between "we want to throw out our own votes" and "we want to throw out these other votes"


Yes. They're not trying to throw out other counties votes themselves. They're trying to set a precedent that their allies in other countries can use to throw out their own counties votes in 2024.

If the ruling ends up: "no certification = votes not counted" then there are a lot of lean-blue counties with Split/GOP controlled boards who can block certification.
 
2022-11-29 8:35:25 AM  

wxboy: cameroncrazy1984: puffy999: Republicans DON'T want those results certified in Cochise County. They WANT the county's votes to disappear.

It's a temporary L with huge positive implications for Republicans down the road if, somehow, a court says "yeah this is fine, so we just don't count your county."  That will make 2024... so, so much worse

If Republicans are nullifying their own counties I fail to see how that could turn out well for them in 24

It sets a precedent for legal challenges that aim to exclude votes from "blue" counties. They're looking for a court ruling that says that a county failing to certify can just have all their votes thrown out; this can be used by using legal challenges to "blue" counties to delay their certifications to past deadlines.

No guarantee it will work, of course, but the buffer is the courts/judges, and that's not comforting.


It's extra stupid because that county undoubtedly had local races for things like school boards and county supervisor board and sheriff and judges, etc etc.

Do those positions in Cochise county go unfilled?
 
2022-11-29 8:45:05 AM  

qorkfiend: Mambo Bananapatch: "There is no reason for us to delay," English told vice chair Peggy Judd and Tom Crosby. "We have been presented materials that was asked for at the last meeting from both sides, and I feel that you both have the information necessary in order to make this decision," she added.

I eagerly await the day when Democrats stop being so God damn civil and reasonable. It's like she's in a dream world.

And instead they should be doing...what, exactly?


There are two kinds of people in the world. People who can extrapolate, and ...
 
2022-11-29 8:47:35 AM  

Hong Kong Phooey: [Fark user image 360x240]
What I think of literally every time I see a story about this place.


So you're tell us it's sabotage?
 
2022-11-29 9:02:40 AM  

olorin604: cameroncrazy1984: puffy999: Republicans DON'T want those results certified in Cochise County. They WANT the county's votes to disappear.

It's a temporary L with huge positive implications for Republicans down the road if, somehow, a court says "yeah this is fine, so we just don't count your county."  That will make 2024... so, so much worse

If Republicans are nullifying their own counties I fail to see how that could turn out well for them in 24

Because it means any county with a republican board can choose if they certify based on the results of the election in that county.

In other words they can refuse to certify if a Democrat wins the county.

Wonder what this does about other issues or races or issues on the ballot, I'm going to go read the article now and see if it mentions anything.


But that's not a precedent that needs to be set.  In AZ it's just the law.  No court opinion is going to change that.  They don't need to get any sort of court opinion on the matter, they can just do it as is.
 
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