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(Platformer)   A bunch of Tech CEOs are looking Muskward, watching jealously as his rapid unscheduled disassembly of Twitter continues   (platformer.news) divider line
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    More: Scary, Twitter, Elon Musk's radical remaking, Last week, tech CEOs, closet of Twitter headquarters, CEO's revenge, T-shirts, much joy  
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1433 clicks; posted to Business » on 29 Nov 2022 at 6:05 AM (16 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



45 Comments     (+0 »)
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest
 
Aar1012 [TotalFark]
2022-11-29 2:08:48 AM  
Oh yeah...other CEOs are equally as sociopathic as Musk.

We're doomed
 
Nintenfreak [TotalFark]
2022-11-29 3:50:37 AM  
Techbros are just fascists.
 
edmo [TotalFark] [OhFark]
2022-11-29 4:53:00 AM  

Aar1012: Oh yeah...other CEOs are equally as sociopathic as Musk.

We're doomed


The shiatty ones will kill off thier own companies as well. We won't miss them. There's always another startup. I wish Elon would hurry up and finish off Twitter.
 
rubi_con_man
2022-11-29 6:53:03 AM  
 When these guys say "the government should be run like a business" ... they mean "an autocracy"
 
Muta
2022-11-29 7:07:24 AM  
The DEI movement has lost control of Twitter, which served as the main instrument to run ideological enforcement in the corporate sphere. The threat of Twitter mobs ensured quick compliance from corporate executives, and other figures of power, lest the pitchforks be aimed at their necks.

But now Twitter is owned by Elon Musk. A fact that has fundamentally altered the balance of power on the platform.

Those 'mobs' were your customers and product.  They were the reason people used the forum.  If you alienate them then you're alienating about 1/2 your community and once they leave, it will be hard to get them to come back.
 
Snarcoleptic_Hoosier
2022-11-29 7:13:54 AM  

Nintenfreak: Techbros are just fascists.


STUPID fascists! I have never met an MBA holder who impressed me, ever.
 
waxbeans [TotalFark]
2022-11-29 7:22:03 AM  
I didn't think I could find new reason to dislike CEOs. And. Yet here we are.  Wow. Omg. WTF.  We really need to do away with the position.  And the pay. Now. Before we're all slaves to awful people.
 
fastfxr
2022-11-29 7:26:53 AM  
Remember this: Musk sees an employee as purely something to exploit, not as a resource that becomes more valuable over time. To his pathetic mind, the engineer with 15 years experience is no different than the engineer fresh out of school.
 
zeroflight222
2022-11-29 7:48:54 AM  

edmo: Aar1012: Oh yeah...other CEOs are equally as sociopathic as Musk.

We're doomed

The shiatty ones will kill off thier own companies as well. We won't miss them. There's always another startup. I wish Elon would hurry up and finish off Twitter.


Sadly, sociopaths do well in those positions. I forget the number but the percentage of sociopaths in leadership roles is way higher than in any other position.
 
Bluenosed Baker
2022-11-29 7:56:08 AM  
Aar1012:

Nah.

These guys built their fortunes on other's work. Now those others work for other people or themselves.
 
twistedsteel5252
2022-11-29 7:56:49 AM  
This is why if you're not pro union you're a moron.
 
Bluenosed Baker
2022-11-29 7:56:53 AM  

rubi_con_man: When these guys say "the government should be run like a business" ... they mean "an autocracy"


Nah, that's just plain old, straight up, fascism.
 
Scorpitron is reduced to a thin red paste
2022-11-29 8:00:35 AM  
Musk is showing how utterly stupid and bizarre the executive class is. No human being should see the burbling Musk cesspool and say, "Yes, THIS!"

The tech/fin press is showing there's no set of executive balls (or girlballs) they will not tongue-wash.
 
Tyrone Slothrop
2022-11-29 8:14:39 AM  
Capitalism and authoritarianism go hand-in-hand.
 
Russell_Secord
2022-11-29 8:23:06 AM  
This is what happens when you give your trust-fund baby the keys to the Maserati. All the others will want to drive too.
 
valkore
2022-11-29 8:31:58 AM  

Scorpitron is reduced to a thin red paste: Musk is showing how utterly stupid and bizarre the executive class is. No human being should see the burbling Musk cesspool and say, "Yes, THIS!"

The tech/fin press is showing there's no set of executive balls (or girlballs) they will not tongue-wash.


I wouldn't have minded Marissa Mayer's sweaty girlballs plastered against my chin, as much as I disagreed with her policies.
 
TappingTheVein
2022-11-29 8:44:59 AM  
"you mean you can fire 80% of the company including senior developers and still stay in business? hell yea!"
 
Rapmaster2000 [TotalFark]
2022-11-29 8:47:01 AM  
pbs.twimg.com
George Hotz
@realGeorgeHotz
Every tech product you use came out between 2000-2010. Nothing was built from 2010-2020. The culture was so broken. PMs, MBAs, SJWs, and entitlement. But the culture is changing. Wild things will be built in the next 10 years. Are you in or out?

What are you talking about?  Just off the top of my head, I use a Nintendo Switch nearly every day and it's from 2017.  I've worked on about 50 different WiFi and router advancements that are substantial though likely unseen by the user, which is the whole point, but nearly everyone is aware of WiFi mesh networks and the litany of products to support that.  Alexa is from 2014.   Fire Stick is 2016 (I guess you could say the concept of streaming predates that, but the concept of IP streaming is ancient - it's probably from the 70s).  You new boss' glorious creation, the Tesla Model S, is from 2012.

But you say "nothing was built".  Nothing.  What's your resume again?  iPhone jailbreaker?  He clearly wrote his own wiki page and he still can't make himself sound successful.  His supposed self-driving company is a bust.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Hotz
 
Opacity [TotalFark] [OhFark]
2022-11-29 8:58:29 AM  
For every actually remotely reasonable argument in the article about problems with tech businesses, which will undoubtably be parroted for years out of context, there isn't anything along these lines:
It's a failure unless Musk can turn Twitter into a profitable company.
I'm giving a lot of leeway there- no timeline, nothing about collateral damage, no interpretation of what "Twitter 2" will be, no suggestion of where the profit comes from, or impact to other Musk companies. If Twitter doesn't eventually generate revenue in excess of costs, consistently, his methods are not a template for how to take a company and make it profitable.
 
mofa [TotalFark]
2022-11-29 9:02:14 AM  
This is one of those rare moments where I come down on the side of burning everything to the ground.
 
Rapmaster2000 [TotalFark]
2022-11-29 9:03:47 AM  

TappingTheVein: "you mean you can fire 80% of the company including senior developers and still stay in business? hell yea!"


Possibly in SV you can since VC has been throwing money at unicorns like Uber or Hello Fresh that are simply bad business models, but with an app.  Take Uber.  It's a great product.  Everyone loves it.  But at its core, it simply connects buyers and sellers.  It's a middle-man that takes a cut, and most importantly, it makes no money doing this.  So Uber made up vaporware like flying taxis, but they never put any real work into it.

The rest of SV seems to be guys promising various AI applications like self-driving, but they never achieve the success they promise.  Elon himself is a vaporware machine.  Self-driving robotaxis going in to mass production next year for the last 3 years.  Same with the Cybertruck.  Full self-driving next year every year.  Hyperloops and tunnels under Miami.  This stuff never happens so it probably doesn't matter if you fire all the engineers.  There probably aren't engineers working on it anyway.

What new tech is Twitter working on?  As far as I can tell, it's a mature business.  What specifically are they planning to do?  So far, all we've gotten is new pricing plans.
 
HotWingConspiracy
2022-11-29 9:18:01 AM  
"We anticipated early efforts like this from bad actors, and we are adapting dynamically to prevent and detect them," the document reads. What about "large scale coordinated misinformation attacks funded by wealthy organizations or governments?" the document asks. "Large-scale bad actors would also require a huge supply of unique credit card numbers and mobile phones," the document says. "As we detect and suspend these, the logistical hurdles to re-offend at scale become insurmountable."

LOL
 
freakdiablo [TotalFark]
2022-11-29 9:25:02 AM  

fastfxr: Remember this: Musk sees an employee as purely something to exploit, not as a resource that becomes more valuable over time. To his pathetic mind, the engineer with 15 years experience is no different than the engineer fresh out of school.


Even worse. He probably sees the engineer with a decade and a half of experience as an asshole for asking for 3-4 times the pay.
 
Muta
2022-11-29 9:31:35 AM  

Rapmaster2000: What new tech is Twitter working on?  As far as I can tell, it's a mature business.  What specifically are they planning to do?  So far, all we've gotten is new pricing plans.


Twitter is going to do everything, it will be the everything app.  Musk has Tesla's self driving car programmers working on it right now.  It will be ready next year.
 
Rage Against the Thorazine [TotalFark]
2022-11-29 9:33:37 AM  

Rapmaster2000: [pbs.twimg.com image 73x73]
George Hotz
@realGeorgeHotz
Every tech product you use came out between 2000-2010. Nothing was built from 2010-2020. The culture was so broken. PMs, MBAs, SJWs, and entitlement. But the culture is changing. Wild things will be built in the next 10 years. Are you in or out?

What are you talking about?  Just off the top of my head, I use a Nintendo Switch nearly every day and it's from 2017.  I've worked on about 50 different WiFi and router advancements that are substantial though likely unseen by the user, which is the whole point, but nearly everyone is aware of WiFi mesh networks and the litany of products to support that.  Alexa is from 2014.   Fire Stick is 2016 (I guess you could say the concept of streaming predates that, but the concept of IP streaming is ancient - it's probably from the 70s).  You new boss' glorious creation, the Tesla Model S, is from 2012.

But you say "nothing was built".  Nothing.  What's your resume again?  iPhone jailbreaker?  He clearly wrote his own wiki page and he still can't make himself sound successful.  His supposed self-driving company is a bust.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Hotz


He's just salty because he hasn't been relevant since 2010.
 
valkore
2022-11-29 9:50:00 AM  

HotWingConspiracy: "We anticipated early efforts like this from bad actors, and we are adapting dynamically to prevent and detect them," the document reads. What about "large scale coordinated misinformation attacks funded by wealthy organizations or governments?" the document asks. "Large-scale bad actors would also require a huge supply of unique credit card numbers and mobile phones," the document says. "As we detect and suspend these, the logistical hurdles to re-offend at scale become insurmountable."

LOL


In other words:

Fark user imageView Full Size

"I meant to do that."
 
TappingTheVein
2022-11-29 9:54:44 AM  

Rapmaster2000: What new tech is Twitter working on?  As far as I can tell, it's a mature business.  What specifically are they planning to do?  So far, all we've gotten is new pricing plans.


I agree 100%. I've been in IT for years and I'm familiar with companies with managers who manage other less senior managers who manage the team leader who has several project managers with the only job to write down tasks for the 3 developers and product designers who actually do all the work and know the tasks better than the senior managers.

The problem begins when you fire the key value people like senior developers who never bothered to document their stuff and are the only ones who know how things work. It looks like Musk has the right idea but not how to execute it properly because he knows better than everyone else. For example firing people left and right and then realizing he made a terrible mistake and then asking developers to please come back.
 
Joe_diGriz [BareFark]
2022-11-29 10:00:40 AM  
The audacity of workers ASKING THE COMPANY TO IMPROVE THINGS!!! Who do they think they are, people?
 
valkore
2022-11-29 10:13:17 AM  

Rapmaster2000: The rest of SV seems to be guys promising various AI applications like self-driving, but they never achieve the success they promise.  Elon himself is a vaporware machine.  Self-driving robotaxis going in to mass production next year for the last 3 years.  Same with the Cybertruck.  Full self-driving next year every year.  Hyperloops and tunnels under Miami.  This stuff never happens so it probably doesn't matter if you fire all the engineers.  There probably aren't engineers working on it anyway.


Chris Urmson is one of the biggest offenders.

From 2015 BBC Article: Chris Urmson told delegates at the 2015 Ted (Technology, Entertainment and Design) conference that his eldest son was 11-years-old and due to take his driving test in "four and a half years". "My team are committed to making sure that doesn't happen," he said.

I wonder if his now 18-year-old son is still getting driven around by somebody else.  He would be if Urmson really believed his own BS.

And then he started up a new company, Aurora, to focus on self-driving technology.  And, of course, they used a SPAC to go public. So 2021!  Let's see how they're doing...

Fark user imageView Full Size


Hmm...  Maybe firing all the engineers will boost that stock price.
 
Rapmaster2000 [TotalFark]
2022-11-29 10:17:44 AM  

valkore: Rapmaster2000: The rest of SV seems to be guys promising various AI applications like self-driving, but they never achieve the success they promise.  Elon himself is a vaporware machine.  Self-driving robotaxis going in to mass production next year for the last 3 years.  Same with the Cybertruck.  Full self-driving next year every year.  Hyperloops and tunnels under Miami.  This stuff never happens so it probably doesn't matter if you fire all the engineers.  There probably aren't engineers working on it anyway.

Chris Urmson is one of the biggest offenders.

From 2015 BBC Article: Chris Urmson told delegates at the 2015 Ted (Technology, Entertainment and Design) conference that his eldest son was 11-years-old and due to take his driving test in "four and a half years". "My team are committed to making sure that doesn't happen," he said.

I wonder if his now 18-year-old son is still getting driven around by somebody else.  He would be if Urmson really believed his own BS.

And then he started up a new company, Aurora, to focus on self-driving technology.  And, of course, they used a SPAC to go public. So 2021!  Let's see how they're doing...

[Fark user image 665x399]

Hmm...  Maybe firing all the engineers will boost that stock price.

In November 2021, Aurora went public by merging with Reinvent Technology Partners Y, a Special Purpose Acquisition Company (SPAC).[27] The merger made Chris Urmson a billionaire, as Chris holds 145,831,739 shares of Aurora[28] with a value of approximate $10 a share at the time of going public.


Ha ha.  At least he still has $186M.

People have been saying "move fast, break things", but I don't think that's what they're doing.  It should be "overpromise, underdeliver".
 
Mad_Radhu
2022-11-29 10:53:39 AM  
Do you really want to be remember as that guy who caused a bunch of talented employees making six figures to look for better employers because you stood firm and made them use single-ply toilet paper that had its softness measured in "grit".
 
groppet
2022-11-29 10:55:48 AM  
Elon Musk Is An Idiot (and so are Zuck and SBF)
Youtube oVj4kZF-Fgk
 
OptionC [TotalFark]
2022-11-29 11:52:57 AM  
FTFA:

Behind the scenes, Musk has also continued to antagonize his own engineers. In an email late last night, the CEO said employees should prepare for another round of "code reviews" this week. (Last week's "code reviews" served as a pretext to lay off yet more engineering talent, particularly on machine-learning teams.)

"As a reminder, all managers are expected to write a meaningful amount of software themselves," he added. "Being unable to do so is like a cavalry captain who can't ride a horse."

Current employees say Musk is planning to lay off most of the remaining engineering managers this week, though nothing has been shared in writing so far.

This is all insane.

Having some rando review your code is worse than useless - large, complicated systems require context and experience.  Some FSD guys from Tesla who showed up a month ago won't have any idea what they're dealing with.

Having (most) managers write meaningful amounts of software is just.. shouldn't they be managing?  My manager was an excellent engineer but she's barely had any opportunity to do any sort of engineering tasks since becoming a manager because she's busy doing other stuff (and she will probably never forgive me for recommending her for the manager spot)

Laying off "most" engineering managers is just crazytown.  Individual engineers are going to end up being pulled in a million different directions at once by various factions within the company and the result is going to be an incoherent furball of a product.
 
Muta
2022-11-29 12:36:48 PM  

OptionC: Laying off "most" engineering managers is just crazytown.  Individual engineers are going to end up being pulled in a million different directions at once by various factions within the company and the result is going to be an incoherent furball of a product.


Engineer 1 is going to get a spec from Faction A and Engineer 2 will get a conflicting spec from Faction B.  It will percolate to the CEO to resolve the conflict and the loser will get fired.
 
baka-san [TotalFark]
2022-11-29 2:25:49 PM  
God these assholes don't get it
Woz is the hero
Jobs is generally ranked below Gates and Bormer on the scuzbucket scale
 
madpeanut
2022-11-29 4:36:12 PM  

fastfxr: Remember this: Musk sees an employee as purely something to exploit, not as a resource that becomes more valuable over time. To his pathetic mind, the engineer with 15 years experience is no different than the engineer fresh out of school.


Wrong.  The engineer fresh out of college costs less that a 15yr veteran.  That's why they want coder and tech jobs in India, China or South America, basically anywhere you have people in power who are okay with abusing the people of their country while saving tons of money they can instead pay the CEO and definitely not distribute that to any employees/commoners who just want to get their grubby hands on that justily earned CEO money.
 
madpeanut
2022-11-29 4:41:19 PM  

twistedsteel5252: This is why if you're not pro union you're a moron.


Unions aren't what they are all cracked up to be either, the union leaders tend to work harder for themselves than the union members (your dues are what fund the union).  I had a union job, it's bullshiat.  Just because you've been somewhere longer doesn't mean you're better at it.  It's harder for an employer to get rid of you for legitimate reasons and a lot of times you can do just a bad enough job to not be fired but because you've been there longer can be promoted.  I wasn't eligible for a better position because someone who had been at the company for 10yrs wanted it despite being busted multiple times for going out to their car to take a 2hr nap in the afternoon and generally having really low performance.  The better position was non-management so they were still protected (not like it was a promotion to them cut them loose), they're still there engineering naps to this day...
 
madpeanut
2022-11-29 4:53:17 PM  

valkore: Rapmaster2000: The rest of SV seems to be guys promising various AI applications like self-driving, but they never achieve the success they promise.  Elon himself is a vaporware machine.  Self-driving robotaxis going in to mass production next year for the last 3 years.  Same with the Cybertruck.  Full self-driving next year every year.  Hyperloops and tunnels under Miami.  This stuff never happens so it probably doesn't matter if you fire all the engineers.  There probably aren't engineers working on it anyway.

Chris Urmson is one of the biggest offenders.

From 2015 BBC Article: Chris Urmson told delegates at the 2015 Ted (Technology, Entertainment and Design) conference that his eldest son was 11-years-old and due to take his driving test in "four and a half years". "My team are committed to making sure that doesn't happen," he said.

I wonder if his now 18-year-old son is still getting driven around by somebody else.  He would be if Urmson really believed his own BS.

And then he started up a new company, Aurora, to focus on self-driving technology.  And, of course, they used a SPAC to go public. So 2021!  Let's see how they're doing...

[Fark user image image 665x399]

Hmm...  Maybe firing all the engineers will boost that stock price.


It would but temporarily because the "market" would see it as a profit gain, that's old hat tricks though.
 
madpeanut
2022-11-29 4:55:54 PM  

Mad_Radhu: Do you really want to be remember as that guy who caused a bunch of talented employees making six figures to look for better employers because you stood firm and made them use single-ply toilet paper that had its softness measured in "grit".


That's the old joke: "want to know how much your employer values you, look at the toilet paper they stock".
 
madpeanut
2022-11-29 5:03:25 PM  

OptionC: FTFA:

Behind the scenes, Musk has also continued to antagonize his own engineers. In an email late last night, the CEO said employees should prepare for another round of "code reviews" this week. (Last week's "code reviews" served as a pretext to lay off yet more engineering talent, particularly on machine-learning teams.)

"As a reminder, all managers are expected to write a meaningful amount of software themselves," he added. "Being unable to do so is like a cavalry captain who can't ride a horse."

Current employees say Musk is planning to lay off most of the remaining engineering managers this week, though nothing has been shared in writing so far.

This is all insane.

Having some rando review your code is worse than useless - large, complicated systems require context and experience.  Some FSD guys from Tesla who showed up a month ago won't have any idea what they're dealing with.

Having (most) managers write meaningful amounts of software is just.. shouldn't they be managing?  My manager was an excellent engineer but she's barely had any opportunity to do any sort of engineering tasks since becoming a manager because she's busy doing other stuff (and she will probably never forgive me for recommending her for the manager spot)

Laying off "most" engineering managers is just crazytown.  Individual engineers are going to end up being pulled in a million different directions at once by various factions within the company and the result is going to be an incoherent furball of a product.


Managers "should" be leaders, like proper leaders, build partnerships with their peers, tracking work, status and blockers; keeping stuff flowing.  They also need to provide a roadmap and vision for others to follow and align with the business.  If your managers are writing code or doing the tasks themselves then they aren't leading.

The company I recently left had metrics of "hands on keyboard" and "lines of code generated" and used tracking software to monitor screens, tracking time and a group to monitor that, managers who snooped on employees, and a turnover rate to match.  The CEO is also a giant trump fanboi
 
madpeanut
2022-11-29 5:05:59 PM  

baka-san: God these assholes don't get it
Woz is the hero
Jobs is generally ranked below Gates and Bormer on the scuzbucket scale


Because virtually ALL of the modern day CEOs never actually worked hard for their money.  Musk comes from connected wealth, so does Bezos, Gates, Zuckerbot, and he rest.  In fact finding a person that made it without those things is a lot harder.
 
Dancis_Frake
2022-11-29 5:30:22 PM  
They're CEOs.
Of course they're absolute c*nts.
 
Muta
2022-11-29 5:42:52 PM  

madpeanut: baka-san: God these assholes don't get it
Woz is the hero
Jobs is generally ranked below Gates and Bormer on the scuzbucket scale

Because virtually ALL of the modern day CEOs never actually worked hard for their money.  Musk comes from connected wealth, so does Bezos, Gates, Zuckerbot, and he rest.  In fact finding a person that made it without those things is a lot harder.


Off the top of my head, and I am not going to research it, Bezos and Gate can from 'comfortable' but not what one would call 'connected wealth' backgrounds.
 
madpeanut
2022-11-29 8:56:19 PM  

Muta: madpeanut: baka-san: God these assholes don't get it
Woz is the hero
Jobs is generally ranked below Gates and Bormer on the scuzbucket scale

Because virtually ALL of the modern day CEOs never actually worked hard for their money.  Musk comes from connected wealth, so does Bezos, Gates, Zuckerbot, and he rest.  In fact finding a person that made it without those things is a lot harder.

Off the top of my head, and I am not going to research it, Bezos and Gate can from 'comfortable' but not what one would call 'connected wealth' backgrounds.


Gates Sr was an attorney who founded a prominent law firm (which makes him connected) and Jr was going to Harvard andhe wasn't on scholarship.  Paul Allen convinced  I'll to quit Harvard to start Microsoft.  Both smart guys but not your average citizen.

Bezos parents gave him $300k for Amazon back in the 90's which translates into about $570k today.  Not exactly the average income or amount someone can invest.

Today a startup has more hurdles to go through and get less support and typically have to sign away a large % while you still do all the hard work on it.
 
anuran
2022-11-29 9:18:00 PM  

rubi_con_man: When these guys say "the government should be run like a business" ... they mean "an autocracy"


That is PRECISELY what cuckservatives have always meant when they say it.
 
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