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(CNN)   America is now $31,000,000,000,000 in debt because we cut taxes on rich people and corporations for 40 years. Don't you feel it trickling down?   (cnn.com) divider line
    More: Fail, Barack Obama, Money, Democratic Party, Joe Biden, America's national debt, borrowing spree, United States public debt, nation's total public debt  
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1409 clicks; posted to Politics » and Main » on 05 Oct 2022 at 8:50 AM (9 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2022-10-05 5:09:01 AM  
Yeah, it's not credit card debt, it's bonds, just like the kind issued by any company that no one complains about.
 
2022-10-05 5:27:08 AM  
OK, so who is making these Scrooge McDuck money vaults? They don't exist.

That $31 trillion in debt is matched by $31 trillion in expenditures, a good chunk of which are in fixed asset infrastructure of various sorts. (Most of the rest was spent on wars.)
 
2022-10-05 5:28:44 AM  
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2022-10-05 6:29:24 AM  

cretinbob: Yeah, it's not credit card debt, it's bonds, just like the kind issued by any company that no one complains about.


Any company with a debt load like this, facing the current interest rate environment would have been declared insolvent by now.
 
2022-10-05 6:45:50 AM  

NewportBarGuy: cretinbob: Yeah, it's not credit card debt, it's bonds, just like the kind issued by any company that no one complains about.

Any company with a debt load like this, facing the current interest rate environment would have been declared insolvent by now.


Good thing countries don't work like companies, right? And you're aware of that fact, right?

Right?
 
2022-10-05 7:27:34 AM  
Fark user imageView Full Size
Those Damm demoncrats!
 
2022-10-05 7:38:34 AM  

johnryan51: [Fark user image 425x434]Those Damm demoncrats!


As always, republicans run up the deficit, democrats pay it down.

....and when a democrat is POTUS, republicans whine and biatch about the deficit, without admitting they they are largely responsible for the problem.
 
2022-10-05 7:39:43 AM  

Farking Clown Shoes: NewportBarGuy: cretinbob: Yeah, it's not credit card debt, it's bonds, just like the kind issued by any company that no one complains about.

Any company with a debt load like this, facing the current interest rate environment would have been declared insolvent by now.

Good thing countries don't work like companies, right? And you're aware of that fact, right?

Right?


Maybe if you read that another time, that's what I was pointing out to Bob.

The interest on this debt is going to absolutely crush the budget. Crush iat.

We are in trouble and simply saying things like "we owe the debt to ourselves" and "well it paid for things"...

The simple thing is this: WE HAVE TO PAY IT BACK!!!

The only way to do that is with increased race receipts. It's so massive we can't even cut outr way out of this.

In essence, we're f*cked.
 
2022-10-05 8:00:34 AM  
Federal borrowing reached record levels during the Covid-19 pandemic, as the government tried to support the economy amid lockdowns, layoffs and supply chain disruptions. The national debt reached $30 trillion by late January, whereas at the end of 2019, before alarms sounded over the Covid-19 pandemic, total stood at $22.7 trillion. When former President Barack Obama took office in 2009, the outstanding debt was $10.6 trillion.

Some debt is fine and necessary for government to function. Hamilton pointed that out better than most. But this level of debt and the rate at which we keep adding to it, most certainly is not.

We're only doing it because we refuse to tax the people and corporations with the money. That is forcing us to borrow every f*cking year. We can't keep doing it. It does not work like that.
 
2022-10-05 8:00:59 AM  
I feel trickled on...
 
2022-10-05 8:52:56 AM  
Soak 'em.
 
MFK
2022-10-05 8:53:29 AM  

NewportBarGuy: cretinbob: Yeah, it's not credit card debt, it's bonds, just like the kind issued by any company that no one complains about.

Any company with a debt load like this, facing the current interest rate environment would have been declared insolvent by now.


For all intents and purposes, the United States is "immortal" so this comparison isn't exactly an apt one.
 
2022-10-05 8:54:42 AM  
SNORE.

Assets: At least 270 trillion
GDP: 21 trillion
 
2022-10-05 8:54:50 AM  

johnryan51: [Fark user image 425x434]Those Damm demoncrats!


Pretty sure that 2020 line would have been just as tall had it been blue.

Unless you think it would have been a good idea for a Democratic Congress/president NOT to spend like a drunken sailor during Covid.
 
2022-10-05 8:55:08 AM  
So subby, spending plays no part in this scenario?
 
2022-10-05 8:55:13 AM  
Maybe... just maybe... we should only budget for things we can actually afford?

I mean who doesn't want to bribe voters to get their way into power? I get it. That's the east way. Thankfully the people that get bribed don't understand math or budgets amiright?
 
2022-10-05 8:55:59 AM  
When have conservatives been correct on...anything?

Economy, families, military, education, etc.

What did they get right?

Why are they still allowed to have any say, in anything?
 
2022-10-05 8:56:12 AM  

NewportBarGuy: cretinbob: Yeah, it's not credit card debt, it's bonds, just like the kind issued by any company that no one complains about.

Any company with a debt load like this, facing the current interest rate environment would have been declared insolvent by now.


Tell me you can't do arithmetic without telling me you can't do arithmetic.
 
2022-10-05 8:56:19 AM  
Something's trickling down, all right...
 
2022-10-05 8:56:49 AM  
Why would millionaire senators/representative want to tax the rich?
 
2022-10-05 8:56:53 AM  
I think the federal reserve intends to cut workers wages as much as possible while giving rich people and corporations more tax cuts.
So there's that.
 
2022-10-05 8:57:19 AM  
Yeah....at, like, 0.25% to 1% interest.

The only problem I have with it is how much smaller it would be if you just rolled back some of the last 40 years tax rates.

Tax appropriately and that thing disappears over 15 or 20 years, minus whatever 30 year bonds are issued this week.
 
2022-10-05 8:59:04 AM  

RasIanI: Yeah....at, like, 0.25% to 1% interest.

The only problem I have with it is how much smaller it would be if you just rolled back some of the last 40 years tax rates.

Tax appropriately and that thing disappears over 15 or 20 years, minus whatever 30 year bonds are issued this week.


You're going to have $1T+ surpluses every year for decades and NOT have politicians spend it like diddy at a titty bar?

//surejan
 
2022-10-05 8:59:12 AM  
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2022-10-05 8:59:32 AM  

tfresh: Maybe... just maybe... we should only budget for things we can actually afford?

I mean who doesn't want to bribe voters to get their way into power? I get it. That's the east way. Thankfully the people that get bribed don't understand math or budgets amiright?


So if a bridge falls down and we just "can't afford" to fix it, everybody just swims?
 
2022-10-05 8:59:50 AM  

KCinPA: So subby, spending plays no part in this scenario?


It turns out you have to spend money to maintain a superpower.
 
2022-10-05 9:00:20 AM  

tfresh: Maybe... just maybe... we should only budget for things we can actually afford?

I mean who doesn't want to bribe voters to get their way into power? I get it. That's the east way. Thankfully the people that get bribed don't understand math or budgets amiright?


"Thankfully the people that get bribed don't understand math or budgets amiright?"

Fark user imageView Full Size


Narrator:  Poster was not "right" -- about anything contained therein.
 
2022-10-05 9:01:23 AM  

NewportBarGuy: The simple thing is this: WE HAVE TO PAY IT BACK!!!

The only way to do that is with increased race receipts. It's so massive we can't even cut outr way out of this.

In essence, we're f*cked


:shrug:

What if I we all just didn't give a shiat?

This "omg the debt will destroy us all!" with zero evidence beyond esoteric economic prognostications in the face of provable global environmental catastrophe rings hollower than a Christmas ornament.

I can explain how and why and in precisely what ways the planet is going to fark us in the next 50 years in 3 sentences or less.

Can you explain how, why, and in precisely what ways the "debt" is going to fark us?
 
2022-10-05 9:02:27 AM  

Albert911emt: johnryan51: [Fark user image 425x434]Those Damm demoncrats!

As always, republicans run up the deficit, democrats pay it down.

....and when a democrat is POTUS, republicans whine and biatch about the deficit, without admitting they they are largely responsible for the problem.


Deficits don't get paid down. The simply contribute less to the national debt as they fall.
 
2022-10-05 9:03:15 AM  

Weaver95: I think the federal reserve intends to cut workers wages as much as possible while giving rich people and corporations more tax cuts.
So there's that.


It's called a "soft landing".  Asking if this "soft landing" will involve any "golden parachutes" makes you childish and unserious.
 
2022-10-05 9:03:25 AM  

Koodz: tfresh: Maybe... just maybe... we should only budget for things we can actually afford?

I mean who doesn't want to bribe voters to get their way into power? I get it. That's the east way. Thankfully the people that get bribed don't understand math or budgets amiright?

So if a bridge falls down and we just "can't afford" to fix it, everybody just swims?


Don't be soft. Spending within reason. Of course that's the excuse we've been saying for the last 30 T anyways. It's all 'necessary'.
 
2022-10-05 9:04:08 AM  

Testiclaw: When have conservatives been correct on...anything?

Economy, families, military, education, etc.

What did they get right?

Why are they still allowed to have any say, in anything?


Conservatives are great at messaging and creating a narrative teamed up with propaganda outlets that allow them to do it. They also have a submissive ignorant base that loves to be told what to feel, who to hate, and who to blame.
 
2022-10-05 9:04:46 AM  

NewportBarGuy: Farking Clown Shoes: NewportBarGuy: cretinbob: Yeah, it's not credit card debt, it's bonds, just like the kind issued by any company that no one complains about.

Any company with a debt load like this, facing the current interest rate environment would have been declared insolvent by now.

Good thing countries don't work like companies, right? And you're aware of that fact, right?

Right?

Maybe if you read that another time, that's what I was pointing out to Bob.

The interest on this debt is going to absolutely crush the budget. Crush iat.

We are in trouble and simply saying things like "we owe the debt to ourselves" and "well it paid for things"...

The simple thing is this: WE HAVE TO PAY IT BACK!!!

The only way to do that is with increased race receipts. It's so massive we can't even cut outr way out of this.

In essence, we're f*cked.


Are we not currently servicing the national debt according to the various rates of interest at which it was incurred? Why are you expecting that to change?
 
2022-10-05 9:05:36 AM  

BeesNuts: Weaver95: I think the federal reserve intends to cut workers wages as much as possible while giving rich people and corporations more tax cuts.
So there's that.

It's called a "soft landing".  Asking if this "soft landing" will involve any "golden parachutes" makes you childish and unserious.


I think that there's no going back. We already came close to a national rail workers strike. I think that if the rich people keep shoving all the debt at us, we will see industries hiat by shutdowns and workers walking off jobs.
 
2022-10-05 9:05:53 AM  

tfresh: Koodz: tfresh: Maybe... just maybe... we should only budget for things we can actually afford?

I mean who doesn't want to bribe voters to get their way into power? I get it. That's the east way. Thankfully the people that get bribed don't understand math or budgets amiright?

So if a bridge falls down and we just "can't afford" to fix it, everybody just swims?

Don't be soft. Spending within reason. Of course that's the excuse we've been saying for the last 30 T anyways. It's all 'necessary'.


What's within reason? What's outside of reason? What are your criteria for deciding?
 
2022-10-05 9:05:59 AM  

tfresh: RasIanI: Yeah....at, like, 0.25% to 1% interest.

The only problem I have with it is how much smaller it would be if you just rolled back some of the last 40 years tax rates.

Tax appropriately and that thing disappears over 15 or 20 years, minus whatever 30 year bonds are issued this week.

You're going to have $1T+ surpluses every year for decades and NOT have politicians spend it like diddy at a titty bar?

//surejan


Well, if we can stop electing Republicans, there's at least a *chance* that the money doesn't disappear into the cocaine and [redacted] party budget.
 
2022-10-05 9:08:03 AM  

BeesNuts: NewportBarGuy: The simple thing is this: WE HAVE TO PAY IT BACK!!!

The only way to do that is with increased race receipts. It's so massive we can't even cut outr way out of this.

In essence, we're f*cked

:shrug:

What if I we all just didn't give a shiat?

This "omg the debt will destroy us all!" with zero evidence beyond esoteric economic prognostications in the face of provable global environmental catastrophe rings hollower than a Christmas ornament.

I can explain how and why and in precisely what ways the planet is going to fark us in the next 50 years in 3 sentences or less.

Can you explain how, why, and in precisely what ways the "debt" is going to fark us?


Don't remember when we almost defaulted on the debt a few back?

It's all fun and games until our credit rating goes to hell and the USD is no longer a safe place to buy from.

A few more fed bumps and the debt repayments will be $1T/year.

Imagine how many voters you could buy with $1T that's getting pissed away.
 
2022-10-05 9:08:13 AM  
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
ENS
2022-10-05 9:08:30 AM  
CNBC told me it's because we gave $1,600 to working people almost two years ago to solve everything. They're the finance channel - look it up.
 
2022-10-05 9:08:34 AM  
Time for one of these...

Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2022-10-05 9:08:40 AM  

BeesNuts: NewportBarGuy: The simple thing is this: WE HAVE TO PAY IT BACK!!!

The only way to do that is with increased race receipts. It's so massive we can't even cut outr way out of this.

In essence, we're f*cked

:shrug:

What if I we all just didn't give a shiat?

This "omg the debt will destroy us all!" with zero evidence beyond esoteric economic prognostications in the face of provable global environmental catastrophe rings hollower than a Christmas ornament.

I can explain how and why and in precisely what ways the planet is going to fark us in the next 50 years in 3 sentences or less.

Can you explain how, why, and in precisely what ways the "debt" is going to fark us?


People who shiat their pants about the national debt are people who know exactly nothing about finance, economics, or business, and also can't do basic arithmetic to boot.

I roll my eyes every single time.  It's nothing more than Republican talking points, the hysteria over borrowing money to finance national investments that, more often than not, contribute to GROWING the economy.

I am NOT denying that a shiatload of money gets wasted and that there's a shiat ton of corruption involved in all of it.  But the sky
-is-falling hysteria is total horseshiat and always has been.
 
2022-10-05 9:09:18 AM  

GoldSpider: johnryan51: [Fark user image 425x434]Those Damm demoncrats!

Pretty sure that 2020 line would have been just as tall had it been blue.

Unless you think it would have been a good idea for a Democratic Congress/president NOT to spend like a drunken sailor during Covid.


It would have been high, but not as high because they would not have made the level of bad decision making that left the US vastly disproportionately affected by the pandemic, which would include not getting rid of the team that prior administrations (including W.) had in place explicitly to help deal with such a disaster. Some of the spending was Trump trying desperately to stem the leaks from the economy he'd already weakened by everything from tax cuts for the rich to placing people in charge of important departments who were opposed to the existence of said departments, and that wouldn't have happened under a boring but competent leadership continuing the policies of the previous successful administration.

The graph would have spiked either way, but I doubt it would have been as high had competent leadership been in place. They'd also likely have been starting from a lower deficit point.
 
2022-10-05 9:10:26 AM  

tfresh: BeesNuts: NewportBarGuy: The simple thing is this: WE HAVE TO PAY IT BACK!!!

The only way to do that is with increased race receipts. It's so massive we can't even cut outr way out of this.

In essence, we're f*cked

:shrug:

What if I we all just didn't give a shiat?

This "omg the debt will destroy us all!" with zero evidence beyond esoteric economic prognostications in the face of provable global environmental catastrophe rings hollower than a Christmas ornament.

I can explain how and why and in precisely what ways the planet is going to fark us in the next 50 years in 3 sentences or less.

Can you explain how, why, and in precisely what ways the "debt" is going to fark us?

Don't remember when we almost defaulted on the debt a few back?

It's all fun and games until our credit rating goes to hell and the USD is no longer a safe place to buy from.

A few more fed bumps and the debt repayments will be $1T/year.

Imagine how many voters you could buy with $1T that's getting pissed away.


The US credit rating only falls if Congress decides to default on the debt.
 
2022-10-05 9:10:59 AM  
Trickle down economics has never worked. It trickles upward.  Execs and CEOs have hoarded the vast majority of wealth over my lifetime, keeping it out of the hands of 90% of the people who actually with and generate that wealth.

And what happens to all that money?  It sits there in their accounts, unspent, not flowing through the economy, not driving any sort of progress.  It sits while they demand that we make more of it for them while we're told to accept less.

Want the economy to flourish?  Disincentive wealth hoarding and give a big bump to workers' pay.  Suddenly everyone will be spending at levels not seen in over half a century or more, the average standard of living will skyrocket, people will be generally happier overall with much less financial insecurity.

Or, maintain the status quo and keep allowing robber barons to hoard wealth, and lead society to the inevitable revolution that they know they can't delay forever.
 
2022-10-05 9:11:46 AM  

Koodz: Are we not currently servicing the national debt according to the various rates of interest at which it was incurred? Why are you expecting that to change?


Because as interest rates go up they have to issue new debt on a monthly basis and that new debt carries the higher interest payments.

The cost of servicing the debt is going to swamp the entire federal budget at current rates of increase.
 
2022-10-05 9:13:12 AM  

BeesNuts: NewportBarGuy: The simple thing is this: WE HAVE TO PAY IT BACK!!!

The only way to do that is with increased race receipts. It's so massive we can't even cut outr way out of this.

In essence, we're f*cked

:shrug:

What if I we all just didn't give a shiat?

This "omg the debt will destroy us all!" with zero evidence beyond esoteric economic prognostications in the face of provable global environmental catastrophe rings hollower than a Christmas ornament.

I can explain how and why and in precisely what ways the planet is going to fark us in the next 50 years in 3 sentences or less.

Can you explain how, why, and in precisely what ways the "debt" is going to fark us?


This is the way

/ We'll pay down our own national deficit: hookers and blackjack lightning round!
 
2022-10-05 9:13:16 AM  

mudesi: People who shiat their pants about the national debt are people who know exactly nothing about finance, economics, or business, and also can't do basic arithmetic to boot.


I've heard people say that at $5t, $10t, $20t, and now $30t... We've added $20 trillion in just 10 years.

At a certain point, your masterful understanding of "finance, economics, and business" are going to bite you right in the ass.
 
2022-10-05 9:13:23 AM  
Never forgot in the late nineties before Bush and his taxes cuts, there was a fear that the US woukd pay off it's national debt.
 
2022-10-05 9:13:42 AM  

NewportBarGuy: Koodz: Are we not currently servicing the national debt according to the various rates of interest at which it was incurred? Why are you expecting that to change?

Because as interest rates go up they have to issue new debt on a monthly basis and that new debt carries the higher interest payments.

The cost of servicing the debt is going to swamp the entire federal budget at current rates of increase.


Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2022-10-05 9:13:57 AM  

Tyrone Slothrop: tfresh: BeesNuts: NewportBarGuy: The simple thing is this: WE HAVE TO PAY IT BACK!!!

The only way to do that is with increased race receipts. It's so massive we can't even cut outr way out of this.

In essence, we're f*cked

:shrug:

What if I we all just didn't give a shiat?

This "omg the debt will destroy us all!" with zero evidence beyond esoteric economic prognostications in the face of provable global environmental catastrophe rings hollower than a Christmas ornament.

I can explain how and why and in precisely what ways the planet is going to fark us in the next 50 years in 3 sentences or less.

Can you explain how, why, and in precisely what ways the "debt" is going to fark us?

Don't remember when we almost defaulted on the debt a few back?

It's all fun and games until our credit rating goes to hell and the USD is no longer a safe place to buy from.

A few more fed bumps and the debt repayments will be $1T/year.

Imagine how many voters you could buy with $1T that's getting pissed away.

The US credit rating only falls if Congress decides to default on the debt.


If you expect Congress to save us then we're actually farked.
 
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