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(Tom's Hardware)   Your CPU is no longer fast enough. Again   (tomshardware.com) divider line
    More: Spiffy, Central processing unit, Liquid nitrogen, Nitrogen, AMD's Ryzen, quartet of world record, World records, Decathlon, Guinness World Records  
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2028 clicks; posted to STEM » on 25 Sep 2022 at 8:53 PM (10 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2022-09-25 7:13:38 PM  
These non-real world setups skew the whole mess. Because who's going to run that setup to play Crysis?
 
2022-09-25 7:23:30 PM  
If you can afford it, it's obsolete.

Also see:

If you can actually buy it, it's obsolete.
 
2022-09-25 8:57:43 PM  

Uncle Eazy: If you can afford it, it's obsolete.

Also see:

If you can actually buy it, it's obsolete.


When I buy it, it not only is it obsolete, it's a factory refurb.
 
2022-09-25 9:02:15 PM  

arrogantbastich: These non-real world setups skew the whole mess. Because who's going to run that setup to play Crysis?


I bet it still can't run Doom 3 at its highest settings.

/got nothin'
 
2022-09-25 9:03:52 PM  

arrogantbastich: These non-real world setups skew the whole mess. Because who's going to run that setup to play Crysis?


Someone that wants to play Crysis.
 
2022-09-25 9:07:56 PM  
Back in the day, CPU increases were shocking in how much easier your computer was to work with...I can't be the only guy on here of the age that was blown away at the difference between a 486, and a pentium 200.

i saved up and bought a cyrix...233 I think? 16mb of ram, 1gb hard drive. With a Voodoo 1, man that thing was rocking the house.  Like going from a ford escort to a mustang GT.

I don't think CPU has been the major difference when it comes to things like gaming though in well over a decade though, and every change is so incremental that you'd have to have a pretty ancient computer to know the difference.  the SSD, and the giant leap forward that graphics cards have been were the real differences.

/Quit messing with computers for gaming once consoles became reliable and cheaper than frequent graphic card updates, circa 2008
//no ragerts
 
2022-09-25 9:23:48 PM  
CPUs have been more than enough since Ryzen 1 and 8th Gen Core in 99% of scenarios.

We're heading back into lazy days of developers once again as a result. Where hardware picks up the slack so well that bad habits are being allowed to take root and fester.
 
2022-09-25 9:33:07 PM  

Uncle Eazy: If you can afford it, it's obsolete.

Also see:

If you can actually buy it, it's obsolete.


It's a ryzen 7000 series.  You can't actually buy it.  You should be able to buy it next week.  Maybe you will even be able to buy the new type of motherboard it needs.  Don't forget the latest type of RAM that was ultra-expensive when the newest Intel motherboards required it (the CPU can use the old stuff, but then you have to buy a motherboard that locks you into the old stuff).  Can't be bothered to check the price of DDR5 now.

/will buy the last generation ryzen if it gets cheap enough (Black Friday, cough cough)
//allegedly compatible with my motherboard
///still isn't cheap enough.  I really doubt it will make a difference, but moar faster cores...
 
2022-09-25 9:49:20 PM  
Yes but can it run Spider Solitaire?
 
2022-09-25 10:08:28 PM  
Would be nice to have as much % overhead as you used to get. I remember getting a 233Mhz Pentium 2 that ran happily at 400Mhz and this was well before the days of being able to increase your cooling, voltage etc
 
2022-09-25 10:09:19 PM  

phedex: Back in the day, CPU increases were shocking in how much easier your computer was to work with...I can't be the only guy on here of the age that was blown away at the difference between a 486, and a pentium 200.

i saved up and bought a cyrix...233 I think? 16mb of ram, 1gb hard drive. With a Voodoo 1, man that thing was rocking the house.  Like going from a ford escort to a mustang GT.

I don't think CPU has been the major difference when it comes to things like gaming though in well over a decade though, and every change is so incremental that you'd have to have a pretty ancient computer to know the difference.  the SSD, and the giant leap forward that graphics cards have been were the real differences.

/Quit messing with computers for gaming once consoles became reliable and cheaper than frequent graphic card updates, circa 2008
//no ragerts


Consoles still suck for gaming.  It's not thr graphics(though they are always far behind), it's the interface.
 
2022-09-25 10:11:10 PM  

phedex: Back in the day, CPU increases were shocking in how much easier your computer was to work with...I can't be the only guy on here of the age that was blown away at the difference between a 486, and a pentium 200.


I remember the difference between a 486SX and Pentium being the ability to play Quake, which certainly blew me away. Then I had a K6-II with, I think, a Rage 128 and got to be blown away by Unreal. Then a P4 and GeForce2 with Serious Sam, RtCW, Red Faction, and whatnot. We went from Quake I to Return to Castle Wolfenstein in like 5 years. My current CPU was released 5 years ago and I feel no real pressure to upgrade. In terms of single-core performance, upgrading to a comparable current cpu would provide maybe a 50% increase.
 
2022-09-25 10:15:45 PM  
But can it run Doo--

harleyquinnical: I bet it still can't run Doom 3 at its highest settings.


Oh nevermind.
 
2022-09-25 10:24:13 PM  

Explodo: phedex: Back in the day, CPU increases were shocking in how much easier your computer was to work with...I can't be the only guy on here of the age that was blown away at the difference between a 486, and a pentium 200.

i saved up and bought a cyrix...233 I think? 16mb of ram, 1gb hard drive. With a Voodoo 1, man that thing was rocking the house.  Like going from a ford escort to a mustang GT.

I don't think CPU has been the major difference when it comes to things like gaming though in well over a decade though, and every change is so incremental that you'd have to have a pretty ancient computer to know the difference.  the SSD, and the giant leap forward that graphics cards have been were the real differences.

/Quit messing with computers for gaming once consoles became reliable and cheaper than frequent graphic card updates, circa 2008
//no ragerts

Consoles still suck for gaming.  It's not thr graphics(though they are always far behind), it's the interface.


TRUTH^

Every generation the Con-Slows claim "revolution in gaming."
and every generation(for all of them now) i ask the same question:
Are you gonna drop a KB+M in the box by default and add whole entire genres of game options to your library for the players?

And here we are, which of the consoles opened up the MMO, the RTS, any heavy menu driven games?

what's up wiht that? piles of games to add, granddaddy of subfees, major online multi player genre(rts) with existing crossplay player base to plug into.
like all this time really on the table anytime they wanted to just, open it up to the players by doing nothing more than dropping the right peripheral in the box by default.

that would have revolutionized a generation of consoles more than most of what i've seen.
what gives?
 
2022-09-25 10:27:49 PM  

dready zim: Would be nice to have as much % overhead as you used to get. I remember getting a 233Mhz Pentium 2 that ran happily at 400Mhz and this was well before the days of being able to increase your cooling, voltage etc


It was because of a dirty trick PC manufacturers used to do. PC's with different speed Pentiums all used the same chip and most of the time the same board. They would just nerf the clock speed on the cheaper models.
 
2022-09-25 10:33:17 PM  
This is great and all but unless you are playing 4K with all the effects on, it won't really make that much difference to 95% of the market. But for production work that it excels at, people will be more than happy to shave a few minutes off their work. In that sense, it would pay for itself fairly quickly. Personally, I am going to stick with the AM4 platform for a while. I have two 3000-series powered PCs & picked up a couple of 5000 series chips during this year's Prime Days. At some point I will swap them out and sell or give away the "old" ones. I figure I should be good for three or four years before worrying about buying a new motherboard, RAM and alike. Probably have to get new PSUs too esp if AMD moves to that new power connector Intel is trying to get everyone to adopt.
 
2022-09-25 10:41:06 PM  

Rage Against the Thorazine: dready zim: Would be nice to have as much % overhead as you used to get. I remember getting a 233Mhz Pentium 2 that ran happily at 400Mhz and this was well before the days of being able to increase your cooling, voltage etc

It was because of a dirty trick PC manufacturers used to do. PC's with different speed Pentiums all used the same chip and most of the time the same board. They would just nerf the clock speed on the cheaper models.


Used to?

That's literally what CPU and GPU manufacturers have always done.
 
2022-09-25 10:42:04 PM  

PvtStash: TRUTH^

Every generation the Con-Slows claim "revolution in gaming."
and every generation(for all of them now) i ask the same question:
Are you gonna drop a KB+M in the box by default and add whole entire genres of game options to your library for the players?

And here we are, which of the consoles opened up the MMO, the RTS, any heavy menu driven games?

what's up wiht that? piles of games to add, granddaddy of subfees, major online multi player genre(rts) with existing crossplay player base to plug into.
like all this time really on the table anytime they wanted to just, open it up to the players by doing nothing more than dropping the right peripheral in the box by default.

that would have revolutionized a generation of consoles more than most of what i've seen.
what gives?


People play console games on their televisions, usually while sitting on their couch. A keyboard+mouse simply does not work very well on that setup. Gamers would need to have their consoles attached to a monitor (or a small TV) at a desk. But... at that point, why not just use a computer?
 
2022-09-25 10:47:30 PM  
What is with CPU prices?  I bought a Ryzen 9 3900X in July 2020 for $419.99 from Newegg and it currently is listed as $428.87.  In two years the processor went up?  Has development slowed that much?
 
2022-09-25 11:04:40 PM  

dyhchong: Rage Against the Thorazine: dready zim: Would be nice to have as much % overhead as you used to get. I remember getting a 233Mhz Pentium 2 that ran happily at 400Mhz and this was well before the days of being able to increase your cooling, voltage etc

It was because of a dirty trick PC manufacturers used to do. PC's with different speed Pentiums all used the same chip and most of the time the same board. They would just nerf the clock speed on the cheaper models.

Used to?

That's literally what CPU and GPU manufacturers have always done.


But they used to be insultingly lazy about it. Just give you an example, years ago at this place I worked at we had Compaq Pentium 1 desktops. If I remember correctly the 2 different models in that series ran at 90Mhz and 133Mhz. The only difference between the 2 models was a jumper setting on the board and the case badge with the model number but the price difference was over $500 in 1990's money. Otherwise the exact same computer.
 
2022-09-25 11:10:04 PM  
Mine's almost never fast enough.
 
2022-09-25 11:32:24 PM  

King Something: Yes but can it run Spider Solitaire?


Yes, but only if you use HIMEM.
 
2022-09-25 11:36:51 PM  
When you see someone using a rig that doesn't have liquid nitrogen CPU cooling:
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2022-09-25 11:41:52 PM  

dyhchong: Rage Against the Thorazine: dready zim: Would be nice to have as much % overhead as you used to get. I remember getting a 233Mhz Pentium 2 that ran happily at 400Mhz and this was well before the days of being able to increase your cooling, voltage etc

It was because of a dirty trick PC manufacturers used to do. PC's with different speed Pentiums all used the same chip and most of the time the same board. They would just nerf the clock speed on the cheaper models.

Used to?

That's literally what CPU and GPU manufacturers have always done.


There's nothing from stopping you from overclocking your AMD or K-series Intel CPU with a good motherboard, but you're not going to get much extra speed on a stock setup. Manufacturing and packaging have improved significantly and many of those inefficiencies are gone. 233 to 400mhz is a huge amount and I think the poster may be referring to the 333Mhz which would happily run at 400Mhz.
 
2022-09-26 12:03:24 AM  

natazha: Uncle Eazy: If you can afford it, it's obsolete.

Also see:

If you can actually buy it, it's obsolete.

When I buy it, it not only is it obsolete, it's a factory refurb.


When I buy it, not only is it obsolete, it's a second-hand computer shop refurb.

/which explains why it runs Linux Mint
//it really only affects me when I want to run PowerPoint anyway, and even then
 
2022-09-26 12:13:02 AM  

falkone32: I remember the difference between a 486SX and Pentium being the ability to play Quake, which certainly blew me away.


LOL, I remember when we replaced our XT clone with a 286 and Flight Simulator 1.0 was actually playable.

Wait, that's not funny. It means I'm old.
 
2022-09-26 12:24:01 AM  

phedex: I don't think CPU has been the major difference when it comes to things like gaming though in well over a decade though


I do a lot of cross-compiling for embedded projects and my present Ryzen 3700X was a big step up... but it was the PCIe Gen4 NVMe SSD that cinched the winning partnership on my desk.  Yes, I could do well with more cores on a complete source re-build, but I'm in so much better shape now than before that I can stand to put at least 10 years more on this system before getting really antsy about upgrades again.
 
2022-09-26 12:25:35 AM  

ImpendingCynic: falkone32: I remember the difference between a 486SX and Pentium being the ability to play Quake, which certainly blew me away.

LOL, I remember when we replaced our XT clone with a 286 and Flight Simulator 1.0 was actually playable.

Wait, that's not funny. It means I'm old.


I remember when I upgraded my TRS-80 to a Z80H at 3.86 MHz and all the games became unplayable (software timing loops).
 
2022-09-26 1:04:27 AM  

SansNeural: Wait, that's not funny. It means I'm old.

I remember when I upgraded my TRS-80 to a Z80H at 3.86 MHz and all the games became unplayable (software timing loops).


I owe my career and livelihood to the TRS-80 Models I and III.
Old. I'm old now too.
 
2022-09-26 2:40:20 AM  

EsqueletoAtheist: SansNeural: Wait, that's not funny. It means I'm old.

I remember when I upgraded my TRS-80 to a Z80H at 3.86 MHz and all the games became unplayable (software timing loops).

I owe my career and livelihood to the TRS-80 Models I and III.
Old. I'm old now too.


know any good trs80/level2 emulators?
 
2022-09-26 4:12:26 AM  

ImpendingCynic: falkone32: I remember the difference between a 486SX and Pentium being the ability to play Quake, which certainly blew me away.

LOL, I remember when we replaced our XT clone with a 286 and Flight Simulator 1.0 was actually playable.

Wait, that's not funny. It means I'm old.


I just pulled apart my 486SX which was the first PC I ever got new that I found my dad had tossed outside in his shed in the original box. I had copied win 3.11 off it via a 300 baud null modem connection to my 286 which took about a full day to do. I can't get any of my modern equipment to access the 200 something MB HD rather sadly. Seems to spin up ok. Was excellent to see the huge SB16 in there along with the 16MB stick of ram that cost me almost a full paycheck from my first job in 1993...
 
2022-09-26 4:27:20 AM  

PvtStash: MMO, the RTS, any heavy menu driven games


I'm kind of meh on the PC/console arguments, but one of the things I've noticed when such arguments occasionally and temporarily pique my interest is that PC gamebros always seem to have this monomaniacal mindset that whatever genre of gaming they like is the only kind of gaming there is (it tends to be FPS, RTS, and Simulation) and if they get into an argument about it, they would do nothing except repeat in a tight loop how the controls and/or graphics is better for their style of game and not even remotely comprehend that the arguments are irrelevant to every other genres of gaming.  They're not unlike gearheads, actually.

You get a little bit of that on the console side from fans of fighting games, but by and large, console people (if they are arguing at all) are more into franchise loyalty, convenience, not having to tweak everything, and the general gaming experience, and seem perfectly capable of acknowledging that PC is better for some mindsets.

In PC gamers' defense, I have to say I've noticed more willingness for PC gamers to go outside keyboard/mouse in recent years.  But that's definitely an innovation driven more by the consoles.
 
2022-09-26 5:26:47 AM  
Is this becoming the thread where the old farkers play 'Get off my lawn with that shiat'?

Started with an Apple //e with 64k, one disk drive, and a 300 baud modem.  Few years later, was up to four 5 1/4" disk drives, and a 1200 baud modem.  (But only at half-duplex.)

Learned Assembler on a 36 bit Honeywell machine using punched cards.

Few years after that, wrote a program doing something that they told a One-star General that it couldn't be done.  I swear the lights dimmed when it ran, because it used so much of the system resources.

These days, I'm just happy that I can run Excel at work...
 
2022-09-26 6:23:46 AM  
Honestly I think the best CPUs are the ones that have the best built in graphics these days. I'm really hopeful about those RDNA2 APUs. With a good enough APU you eliminate the need for a wall mounted AC sized graphics card in your computer as well as the power draw it entails. Seriously at the rate we're going motherboard/cpu's will be add on cards to graphics cards instead of the other way around.
 
2022-09-26 7:02:10 AM  
One of the nice things about no longer being a gamer (I stopped in the 90s) is that I never have to worry anymore about whether or not my computer is fast enough to do what I want.  I'm reasonably confident the sub-$300 refurbed desktop I bought in January will do everything I need until I no longer have to sit in front of the computer all day for work.  And if it does crap out early, I'll be able to buy another sub-$300 refurbed computer to get the job done.
 
2022-09-26 7:34:41 AM  

Shotgun Justice: What is with CPU prices?  I bought a Ryzen 9 3900X in July 2020 for $419.99 from Newegg and it currently is listed as $428.87.  In two years the processor went up?  Has development slowed that much?


In March 2020, I could not buy a 5900X retail, ended up buying it on StockX for $820, now it's $370 at Microcenter.

I suspect 3000 series processor pricing might be more of a supply/demand thing at this point. A 3900X is still a decent processor, but available in far lower numbers than the 5900X now.

Nimbull: Honestly I think the best CPUs are the ones that have the best built in graphics these days. I'm really hopeful about those RDNA2 APUs. With a good enough APU you eliminate the need for a wall mounted AC sized graphics card in your computer as well as the power draw it entails. Seriously at the rate we're going motherboard/cpu's will be add on cards to graphics cards instead of the other way around.


Well, they'll be better than old IGPs, but they won't be running Cyberpunk 2077 all that great at anything better than medium potato settings. AMD just threw those on because its customers (and by that, I mean the big companies making laptops and portables) demanded it. They will be serviceable for some gaming, but mostly in the 720p/1080p range with a lot of bling turned down.

At least APUs are coming back into fashion as the base... that will make putting together systems easier, as you won't need several GPUs to plug in if something goes wrong.

I plan on building a new main system with a 7950X with my tax return money.... timing should be good, with the rough patches knocked out of the new chipsets and some decent GPU offerings at a decent price.
 
2022-09-26 7:40:12 AM  

falkone32: 233 to 400mhz is a huge amount and I think the poster may be referring to the 333Mhz which would happily run at 400Mhz.


I've remembered since posting it was a 266Mhz when bought.
 
2022-09-26 7:43:56 AM  

dyhchong: Rage Against the Thorazine: dready zim: Would be nice to have as much % overhead as you used to get. I remember getting a 233Mhz Pentium 2 that ran happily at 400Mhz and this was well before the days of being able to increase your cooling, voltage etc

It was because of a dirty trick PC manufacturers used to do. PC's with different speed Pentiums all used the same chip and most of the time the same board. They would just nerf the clock speed on the cheaper models.

Used to?

That's literally what CPU and GPU manufacturers have always done.


Well these days they have shaken things up a bit, at least in GPUs. The new 4080 series cards have a different GPU chip in them yet they claim the only difference is that one is the 12GB version and the other the 16GB version.
 
2022-09-26 7:45:34 AM  

Wave Of Anal Fury: One of the nice things about no longer being a gamer (I stopped in the 90s) is that I never have to worry anymore about whether or not my computer is fast enough to do what I want.  I'm reasonably confident the sub-$300 refurbed desktop I bought in January will do everything I need until I no longer have to sit in front of the computer all day for work.  And if it does crap out early, I'll be able to buy another sub-$300 refurbed computer to get the job done.


That was the thing for me.  When i realized consoles were still what I wanted (growing up playing them in the 80's and 90's) and that my computer functionally just needed to be for storing and playing (and occasionally recording) music, and internet use, it honestly made my life easier.  Even with some of the cooler content that you tend to have on computers (i would love to play some of the new fallout content that is being crowdsourced), I couldnt justify the costs a decade ago, and definitely not now.

I'm just happier not thinking that I need to upgrade things.   I'm going on the fourth year of the laptop i'm typing this on, a 500 dollar asus with an SSD & a terabyte SD card and.... it's still as good as when I bought it.   If I can bring myself to taking it apart and replacing the internal battery, I could use this for another few years, easy.

I felt the same way when i let go of feeling like i needed to modify every car I ever owned.
 
2022-09-26 8:05:17 AM  

dyhchong: CPUs have been more than enough since Ryzen 1 and 8th Gen Core in 99% of scenarios.

We're heading back into lazy days of developers once again as a result. Where hardware picks up the slack so well that bad habits are being allowed to take root and fester.


640K should be enough for anyone.
 
2022-09-26 8:18:16 AM  

Rage Against the Thorazine: dready zim: Would be nice to have as much % overhead as you used to get. I remember getting a 233Mhz Pentium 2 that ran happily at 400Mhz and this was well before the days of being able to increase your cooling, voltage etc

It was because of a dirty trick PC manufacturers used to do. PC's with different speed Pentiums all used the same chip and most of the time the same board. They would just nerf the clock speed on the cheaper models.


They still do that. Mind you it's for more practical reasons but the chip is the same. They just turn off extra cores and down frequencies to meet lower chip skews because it's cheaper to manufacture one chip. Then they validate each of the cores and the frequency they are capable of running at safely. Due to the manufacturing process tiny errors are expected and not all cores work as expected. So they just turn those off and turn down the clock speed. Suddenly your i9 becomes an i3.
 
2022-09-26 8:20:56 AM  

falkone32: dyhchong: Rage Against the Thorazine: dready zim: Would be nice to have as much % overhead as you used to get. I remember getting a 233Mhz Pentium 2 that ran happily at 400Mhz and this was well before the days of being able to increase your cooling, voltage etc

It was because of a dirty trick PC manufacturers used to do. PC's with different speed Pentiums all used the same chip and most of the time the same board. They would just nerf the clock speed on the cheaper models.

Used to?

That's literally what CPU and GPU manufacturers have always done.

There's nothing from stopping you from overclocking your AMD or K-series Intel CPU with a good motherboard, but you're not going to get much extra speed on a stock setup. Manufacturing and packaging have improved significantly and many of those inefficiencies are gone. 233 to 400mhz is a huge amount and I think the poster may be referring to the 333Mhz which would happily run at 400Mhz.


Intel definitely tunes their products to the extreme. There isn't a ton of overclocking room left because they push everything to the limit of what they can run stable at unless you get a golden chip.
 
db2
2022-09-26 8:34:27 AM  
I've got a 9-year-old Core i7 Optiplex 7010 (not Win-11 compatible lolz) with an RX 460, and it's still a really solid gaming setup. My FreeSync-capable Asus monitor cost at least twice what I paid for the computer and GPU (which was $0 + $50).
 
2022-09-26 8:45:56 AM  

falkone32: My current CPU was released 5 years ago and I feel no real pressure to upgrade. In terms of single-core performance, upgrading to a comparable current cpu would provide maybe a 50% increase.


My tower at home is pushing towards a decade old.  i3570k, Z77X-UD3H, 16GB, SSDs, GTX960.  It still does everything I need it to do, will play the games I want to play.

My laptop is not much newer.  It is a Haswell Inspiron 14R, 8GB ram and SSD.  I use it to write and as a backup to my other computers.  It's not fast, but the battery still holds a solid charge.  It does what I need it to do.

Do have one newer computer.  Wife's desktop is a CHUWI Herobox.  Celeron J4124, 8GB and SSD.  She plays a few games on it and uses it for schoolwork.  It could easily be used as an HTPC as well.  For $179, it is inexpensive but perfectly capable.

Computing power is a commodity item now.  Unless you are doing high end gaming or graphical work, there's no longer a need to replace things every couple of years anymore.
 
2022-09-26 8:57:05 AM  

keldaria: Rage Against the Thorazine: dready zim: Would be nice to have as much % overhead as you used to get. I remember getting a 233Mhz Pentium 2 that ran happily at 400Mhz and this was well before the days of being able to increase your cooling, voltage etc

It was because of a dirty trick PC manufacturers used to do. PC's with different speed Pentiums all used the same chip and most of the time the same board. They would just nerf the clock speed on the cheaper models.

They still do that. Mind you it's for more practical reasons but the chip is the same. They just turn off extra cores and down frequencies to meet lower chip skews because it's cheaper to manufacture one chip. Then they validate each of the cores and the frequency they are capable of running at safely. Due to the manufacturing process tiny errors are expected and not all cores work as expected. So they just turn those off and turn down the clock speed. Suddenly your i9 becomes an i3.


Back when the Duron was king, you could change your available clock speed using a pencil or conductive pen.
 
2022-09-26 9:03:58 AM  

TTFK: keldaria: Rage Against the Thorazine: dready zim: Would be nice to have as much % overhead as you used to get. I remember getting a 233Mhz Pentium 2 that ran happily at 400Mhz and this was well before the days of being able to increase your cooling, voltage etc

It was because of a dirty trick PC manufacturers used to do. PC's with different speed Pentiums all used the same chip and most of the time the same board. They would just nerf the clock speed on the cheaper models.

They still do that. Mind you it's for more practical reasons but the chip is the same. They just turn off extra cores and down frequencies to meet lower chip skews because it's cheaper to manufacture one chip. Then they validate each of the cores and the frequency they are capable of running at safely. Due to the manufacturing process tiny errors are expected and not all cores work as expected. So they just turn those off and turn down the clock speed. Suddenly your i9 becomes an i3.

Back when the Duron was king, you could change your available clock speed using a pencil or conductive pen.


If you go back far enough you could reach your hand into the "processor" too
 
2022-09-26 9:36:43 AM  
I don't get the benchmarkers..stable "enough" to run what, prime95 for a few minitues? get a cinebench score for a few minutes?

I use my computer for more than a few minutes, I expect rock solid stability, not something where I can get a prime number for just a "few minutes".
 
2022-09-26 9:39:06 AM  

LesserEvil: Shotgun Justice: What is with CPU prices?  I bought a Ryzen 9 3900X in July 2020 for $419.99 from Newegg and it currently is listed as $428.87.  In two years the processor went up?  Has development slowed that much?

In March 2020, I could not buy a 5900X retail, ended up buying it on StockX for $820, now it's $370 at Microcenter.

I suspect 3000 series processor pricing might be more of a supply/demand thing at this point. A 3900X is still a decent processor, but available in far lower numbers than the 5900X now.

Nimbull: Honestly I think the best CPUs are the ones that have the best built in graphics these days. I'm really hopeful about those RDNA2 APUs. With a good enough APU you eliminate the need for a wall mounted AC sized graphics card in your computer as well as the power draw it entails. Seriously at the rate we're going motherboard/cpu's will be add on cards to graphics cards instead of the other way around.

Well, they'll be better than old IGPs, but they won't be running Cyberpunk 2077 all that great at anything better than medium potato settings. AMD just threw those on because its customers (and by that, I mean the big companies making laptops and portables) demanded it. They will be serviceable for some gaming, but mostly in the 720p/1080p range with a lot of bling turned down.

At least APUs are coming back into fashion as the base... that will make putting together systems easier, as you won't need several GPUs to plug in if something goes wrong.

I plan on building a new main system with a 7950X with my tax return money.... timing should be good, with the rough patches knocked out of the new chipsets and some decent GPU offerings at a decent price.


Oh.... my build MIGHT get delayed if there is a "3D" version of the new gen CPU scheduled to come out... looks like the embargo is up, and reviews are up on the new gen AMD chips. They are great, but that "3D" version will probably be amazing.
 
2022-09-26 9:40:41 AM  

phedex: Back in the day, CPU increases were shocking in how much easier your computer was to work with...I can't be the only guy on here of the age that was blown away at the difference between a 486, and a pentium 200.

i saved up and bought a cyrix...233 I think? 16mb of ram, 1gb hard drive. With a Voodoo 1, man that thing was rocking the house.  Like going from a ford escort to a mustang GT.

I don't think CPU has been the major difference when it comes to things like gaming though in well over a decade though, and every change is so incremental that you'd have to have a pretty ancient computer to know the difference.  the SSD, and the giant leap forward that graphics cards have been were the real differences.

/Quit messing with computers for gaming once consoles became reliable and cheaper than frequent graphic card updates, circa 2008
//no ragerts


I remember using CPUs that clearly defined the "megahertz myth" before it was really a thing, where going from a 16MHz 286 to a 16MHz 386, then a 25MHz 386 to a 25MHz 486DX, then a 66MHz 486DX2 to a 66MHz Pentium was night and day. Huge leaps in every respect. Things that were possible only on supercomputers just 5 years prior were now available on your desktop.

Nowadays, CPU increases are much less pronounced as far as general usability goes. You can do much the same on a C2D as you can on a new Pentium Gold or whatever, and unless you're doing heavy VM work or HD video editing or playing Crysis, most people who just do Facebook or YouTube aren't going to notice a huge difference between a late C2D and a modern i7.
 
2022-09-26 9:56:55 AM  

keldaria: TTFK: keldaria: Rage Against the Thorazine: dready zim: Would be nice to have as much % overhead as you used to get. I remember getting a 233Mhz Pentium 2 that ran happily at 400Mhz and this was well before the days of being able to increase your cooling, voltage etc

It was because of a dirty trick PC manufacturers used to do. PC's with different speed Pentiums all used the same chip and most of the time the same board. They would just nerf the clock speed on the cheaper models.

They still do that. Mind you it's for more practical reasons but the chip is the same. They just turn off extra cores and down frequencies to meet lower chip skews because it's cheaper to manufacture one chip. Then they validate each of the cores and the frequency they are capable of running at safely. Due to the manufacturing process tiny errors are expected and not all cores work as expected. So they just turn those off and turn down the clock speed. Suddenly your i9 becomes an i3.

Back when the Duron was king, you could change your available clock speed using a pencil or conductive pen.

If you go back far enough you could reach your hand into the "processor" too


And if you go back far enough, it'd be a sexual harassment scandal...
 
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