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(Ars Technica)   If you bought a "SmartDry" sensor to make your dumb laundry dryer smarter, bad news   (arstechnica.com) divider line
    More: Asinine, Home automation, Information appliance, Power line communication, Wi-Fi, Input device, Clothes dryer, Device, Laundry  
•       •       •

1064 clicks; posted to Business » on 31 Aug 2022 at 6:55 AM (22 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



22 Comments     (+0 »)
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest
 
2022-08-31 7:24:46 AM  
Internet is about the only service that I am willing to pay for (and video gsmes) that can be bricked-at-will, because that's just the world we live in. Appliances that require internet to work is just hostage negaotiations until the end of time.
 
2022-08-31 8:10:15 AM  

AppleOptionEsc: Internet is about the only service that I am willing to pay for (and video gsmes) that can be bricked-at-will, because that's just the world we live in. Appliances that require internet to work is just hostage negaotiations until the end of time.


Yep. The Cloud giveth and the Cloud taketh away, and it doesn't even care whether you get bent or not.
 
2022-08-31 8:51:49 AM  

Lochsteppe: AppleOptionEsc: Internet is about the only service that I am willing to pay for (and video gsmes) that can be bricked-at-will, because that's just the world we live in. Appliances that require internet to work is just hostage negaotiations until the end of time.

Yep. The Cloud giveth and the Cloud taketh away, and it doesn't even care whether you get bent or not.


As a security person, I find it rather entertaining to watch businesses move things to the cloud. I always find it elucidative when costs suddenly change and the business has to decide whether or not it's worth the money to move services.
 
2022-08-31 8:57:16 AM  
My dryer isn't IoT, but it has a built-in humidity detector. A simple mechanical switch that sits next to the over-temperature switch.

The only "appliance" I have that's IoT is my air quality monitor and it can function without a connection. All the connection does is give me readings from an outdoor monitor the State runs.
 
2022-08-31 9:12:08 AM  
I'm planning to spend 2k on a speed queen washer/dryer set.   While I could get a new W/D set that would probably be decent for 2/3rds that price, Modern stuff just sucks & speed queen's are (over) built to last.

My dryer is going on 30 years old, the washer was the same age & its electronics slowly bit the dust a couple years ago.  First it was the sensor for the top being closed, then the dial.  Since it was an emergency, just had to buy whatever was available, which was a 700$ GE top loader, which works.  its probably fine, but they're built as cheaply as possible and I know at some point it is much more likely to cause grief than the speed queen would, and likely the queen set would last me 30 years.
 
2022-08-31 9:15:44 AM  

natazha: My dryer isn't IoT, but it has a built-in humidity detector. A simple mechanical switch that sits next to the over-temperature switch.


Even new, these sensors are available on the second cheapest drier you can buy (the cheapest model, otherwise identical, doesn't have one).

We inherited a small, cheap laundry centrifuge, and it really reduces drying time. Can recommend. Added benefit: it removes water along with whatever the water had in solution. The heat of a drier evaporates the water and leaves the non-volatile stuff on your clothes.
 
2022-08-31 9:16:15 AM  

natazha: My dryer isn't IoT, but it has a built-in humidity detector.


Imagine being so cheap you buy a dryer that doesn't have this to save $100 but then buy a sensor that costs $100.
 
2022-08-31 9:32:26 AM  
This is encouraging. Mostly, exiting markets and leaving customers abandoned and stranded with inoperable stuff has been for much bigger companies like Google. It's nice to see a small company succeeding in this area.
 
2022-08-31 9:38:55 AM  

phedex: I'm planning to spend 2k on a speed queen washer/dryer set.   While I could get a new W/D set that would probably be decent for 2/3rds that price, Modern stuff just sucks & speed queen's are (over) built to last.

My dryer is going on 30 years old, the washer was the same age & its electronics slowly bit the dust a couple years ago.  First it was the sensor for the top being closed, then the dial.  Since it was an emergency, just had to buy whatever was available, which was a 700$ GE top loader, which works.  its probably fine, but they're built as cheaply as possible and I know at some point it is much more likely to cause grief than the speed queen would, and likely the queen set would last me 30 years.


Don't set yourself up for disappointment. There's no way any modern appliance is making it to the 30 year mark. I'm not even sure if SpeedQueen is still using mechanical timers or diaphragm pressure switches. I'm personally a fan of LG because their stuff is designed to be repaired and can easily make it to the 15 year mark if treated well.

No matter what you get, you need to use a washing machine cleaner every month, and a detergent charge of two tablespoons of liquid detergent for a normally sized, normally dirty load. Modern laundry detergent is caustic af, and detergent vapor is probably what took apart your lid lock. Tide has these commercials showing people throwing two pods in and that's a great way to destroy a machine.
 
2022-08-31 9:47:26 AM  

Intrepid00: natazha: My dryer isn't IoT, but it has a built-in humidity detector.

Imagine being so cheap you buy a dryer that doesn't have this to save $100 but then buy a sensor that costs $100.


The issue the article is facing isn't the cost factor, but the functionality factor.  If you buy a dryer without the sensor, then add one later, you can get a lot more functionality without having to have an IoT dryer.

As the article suggested, if you set up a DIY solution, you can not only shut the dryer off when the clothes are actually dry, but you can also have notifications sent throughout your house to let you know it's actually done.  That would be difficult to do with a built in sensor without buying into the company's entire IoT platform as well.

A well designed smart home doesn't need the internet to continue basic function.
 
2022-08-31 9:49:46 AM  

phedex: I'm planning to spend 2k on a speed queen washer/dryer set.   While I could get a new W/D set that would probably be decent for 2/3rds that price, Modern stuff just sucks & speed queen's are (over) built to last.

My dryer is going on 30 years old, the washer was the same age & its electronics slowly bit the dust a couple years ago.  First it was the sensor for the top being closed, then the dial.  Since it was an emergency, just had to buy whatever was available, which was a 700$ GE top loader, which works.  its probably fine, but they're built as cheaply as possible and I know at some point it is much more likely to cause grief than the speed queen would, and likely the queen set would last me 30 years.


Don't take my word for it, but I've seen reviews that the newer Speed Queen stuff isn't all that great.

If you willing to spend tons of cash, you could try Miele.
 
2022-08-31 9:51:46 AM  

Driedsponge: Intrepid00: natazha: My dryer isn't IoT, but it has a built-in humidity detector.

Imagine being so cheap you buy a dryer that doesn't have this to save $100 but then buy a sensor that costs $100.

The issue the article is facing isn't the cost factor, but the functionality factor.  If you buy a dryer without the sensor, then add one later, you can get a lot more functionality without having to have an IoT dryer.

As the article suggested, if you set up a DIY solution, you can not only shut the dryer off when the clothes are actually dry, but you can also have notifications sent throughout your house to let you know it's actually done.  That would be difficult to do with a built in sensor without buying into the company's entire IoT platform as well.

A well designed smart home doesn't need the internet to continue basic function.


Why do I need all this custom functions when the dryer already turns itself off when dry.
 
2022-08-31 10:23:55 AM  
After a couple uses you'll naturally know how long it takes to dry your damn clothes. If you're putting a dryer on indefinitely until a sensor says it's dry you're a moron.
 
2022-08-31 10:24:32 AM  

Intrepid00: Driedsponge: Intrepid00: natazha: My dryer isn't IoT, but it has a built-in humidity detector.

Imagine being so cheap you buy a dryer that doesn't have this to save $100 but then buy a sensor that costs $100.

The issue the article is facing isn't the cost factor, but the functionality factor.  If you buy a dryer without the sensor, then add one later, you can get a lot more functionality without having to have an IoT dryer.

As the article suggested, if you set up a DIY solution, you can not only shut the dryer off when the clothes are actually dry, but you can also have notifications sent throughout your house to let you know it's actually done.  That would be difficult to do with a built in sensor without buying into the company's entire IoT platform as well.

A well designed smart home doesn't need the internet to continue basic function.

Why do I need all this custom functions when the dryer already turns itself off when dry.


First, the sensor inside your dryer is potentially a point of failure for the entire dryer, whereas an external sensor is only a point of failure for the sensor, the dryer would continue to function.

Secondly, if your dryer is in an area of the house that's not as accessible or you have some sort of disability, then the ability to know the drying cycle is actually finished can be a godsend.

Thirdly, there's a high probability you can get a better sensor than whatever is installed in your dryer, Which means you're more likely to get better results with the external sensor than an internal one.

Lastly, (some math would need to be done on this one) an external sensor will typically use extremely little power, and you would be shutting off the dryer at the socket.  With an internal sensor, the electronics on the dryer still need power to function, and these electronics may not have been designed with extreme power-saving in mind.  So you could potentially be saving money on vampiric power draw over time.

I'm not saying it's for everyone, but there are certain plus sides to this avenue.  Personally, I'd rather buy a bulletproof old dryer and put some external sensors on it than buy a new one that won't last as long, and has all those guaranteed points of failure built into it.
 
2022-08-31 10:52:18 AM  
Why was a simple sensor built into an IoT device with a smartphone app in the first place? That's like replacing the float in your toilet with an IoT device and when the service is shut down you can't flush. Some simple things should just stay as simple things.
 
2022-08-31 11:32:57 AM  
I hope that after you've been drying clothes in a dryer for a year or so, you can estimate how long it will take for your clothes to dry. And then the thing usually buzzes when it's done anyway.  Or you can hear it. I wasn't aware that I needed the internet to help me with this.

But never underestimate the depths of people's learned helplessness.  That's how you signal status now--being too stupid to tell time, because time should announce itself to you, and not take up any more of your precious brain than it already does.  You don't have TIME for thinking about how to dry clothes.

/I don't own a dryer.
 
2022-08-31 11:42:33 AM  

AppleOptionEsc: Internet is about the only service that I am willing to pay for (and video games) that can be bricked-at-will, because that's just the world we live in. Appliances that require internet to work is just hostage negaotiations until the end of time.


"only" huh.

Fark user imageView Full Size


Fark user imageView Full Size


You all have a very warped sense of proportion.   $50 billion in disposable electronics every year is not ONLY.  It's farking huge.
But sure, it's just the world we live in. Nothing we can do about it.  Just go throw that crap in the pile to go "away" and don't think about it.  Nothing you can do.
Speaking of learned helplessness.  You all excel at it.

Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2022-08-31 12:23:25 PM  
I'm not even sure if SpeedQueen is still using mechanical timers

You can still get them as of last year, but their soft button panels are just as reliable now, I change them at about the same rate. Just avoid the stackables they are a giant PITA.
 
2022-08-31 12:48:10 PM  
Your smart dryer's been clotheslined.
 
2022-08-31 12:55:22 PM  

cryinoutloud: AppleOptionEsc: Internet is about the only service that I am willing to pay for (and video games) that can be bricked-at-will, because that's just the world we live in. Appliances that require internet to work is just hostage negaotiations until the end of time.

"only" huh.

[Fark user image image 489x348]

[Fark user image image 553x306]

You all have a very warped sense of proportion.   $50 billion in disposable electronics every year is not ONLY.  It's farking huge.
But sure, it's just the world we live in. Nothing we can do about it.  Just go throw that crap in the pile to go "away" and don't think about it.  Nothing you can do.
Speaking of learned helplessness.  You all excel at it.

[Fark user image image 449x323]


You doing OK? That's one hell of a rage dump.
 
2022-08-31 8:38:44 PM  

Driedsponge: Intrepid00: Driedsponge: Intrepid00: natazha: My dryer isn't IoT, but it has a built-in humidity detector.

Imagine being so cheap you buy a dryer that doesn't have this to save $100 but then buy a sensor that costs $100.

The issue the article is facing isn't the cost factor, but the functionality factor.  If you buy a dryer without the sensor, then add one later, you can get a lot more functionality without having to have an IoT dryer.

As the article suggested, if you set up a DIY solution, you can not only shut the dryer off when the clothes are actually dry, but you can also have notifications sent throughout your house to let you know it's actually done.  That would be difficult to do with a built in sensor without buying into the company's entire IoT platform as well.

A well designed smart home doesn't need the internet to continue basic function.

Why do I need all this custom functions when the dryer already turns itself off when dry.

First, the sensor inside your dryer is potentially a point of failure for the entire dryer, whereas an external sensor is only a point of failure for the sensor, the dryer would continue to function.

Secondly, if your dryer is in an area of the house that's not as accessible or you have some sort of disability, then the ability to know the drying cycle is actually finished can be a godsend.

Thirdly, there's a high probability you can get a better sensor than whatever is installed in your dryer, Which means you're more likely to get better results with the external sensor than an internal one.

Lastly, (some math would need to be done on this one) an external sensor will typically use extremely little power, and you would be shutting off the dryer at the socket.  With an internal sensor, the electronics on the dryer still need power to function, and these electronics may not have been designed with extreme power-saving in mind.  So you could potentially be saving money on vampiric power draw over time.

I'm not saying it's for everyone, but there are certain plus sides to this avenue.  Personally, I'd rather buy a bulletproof old dryer and put some external sensors on it than buy a new one that won't last as long, and has all those guaranteed points of failure built into it.


Don't make the moisture sensor in a dryer to be this big deal. It's two strips of metal with a DC signal coming to one. A piece of wet clothing bridges the gap and completes the circuit. I have literally never replaced a moisture sensor in 13 years.
 
2022-08-31 8:56:15 PM  

DanInKansas: Don't make the moisture sensor in a dryer to be this big deal. It's two strips of metal with a DC signal coming to one. A piece of wet clothing bridges the gap and completes the circuit. I have literally never replaced a moisture sensor in 13 years.


You are literally proving my point.

A moisture sensor you describe, like those found pre-installed in the dryer, can leave wet pockets in your laundry if you fill the dryer too high or have a fitted sheet that wraps all the other clothes inside.  Every dryer I have ever owned does the exact same damn thing, using a similar sensor, making the sensing feature useless for actually drying clothes.  The sensor itself may last forever, but it's got terrible accuracy.

Most add-on solutions, including the solution of the sensor in the article, measure the humidity of the air in the dryer as a whole, so it can pick up moisture even if there's only pockets of wet areas.

Which leads me to my point again:  Give me an old, bulletproof, no frills dryer that will last 20+ years, and I'll add whatever functions I want on my own.
 
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