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(CNBC)   Russia warns that radioactive waste will cover Germany if Russia continues to damage nuclear power plant. So, uh, be warned   (cnbc.com) divider line
    More: Fail, Chernobyl disaster, nuclear power plant, southern Ukraine, Russia's Ministry, Nuclear power, Nuclear safety, plant's backup support systems, Three Mile Island accident  
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2689 clicks; posted to Main » and Politics » on 18 Aug 2022 at 1:35 PM (7 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2022-08-18 1:24:43 PM  
The Russians sound like they plan to blow the place up.  That should count as a nuclear attack and a response from NATO would not be unreasonable.  Nuke all the orcs.
 
2022-08-18 1:35:38 PM  
""""""accident""""""
 
2022-08-18 1:36:36 PM  
Then Russia can look forward to more sanctions.
Sure hope Vlad wanted to completely isolate Russia from the world... because that's what's happening.
 
2022-08-18 1:37:05 PM  
Nice country you have there. Be a shame if anything happened to it...
 
2022-08-18 1:37:15 PM  

Marcus Aurelius: The Russians sound like they plan to blow the place up.  That should count as a nuclear attack and a response from NATO would not be unreasonable.  Nuke all the orcs.


That would solve nothing and only make things worse for everyone involved
 
2022-08-18 1:37:36 PM  
See thread down below, I'm not retyping all of what I typed.

TLDR: modern plants will put up with a lot, containment is hostile architecture, and they could get more ahem bang for their buck by popping the turbine or causing transformer fires.

Of course anything they do will be a friendly fire situation. You can't tell the power plant you just pissed off to please, only kill the enemy. Nope, that's a FARK YOU in X radius.
 
2022-08-18 1:37:52 PM  
Orcs not happy about Germany restarting their nuke plants.  Orcs smash Zaporozhzhia plant in retaliation.  Orcs glow in dark.  Orcs now easier to shoot.
 
2022-08-18 1:38:05 PM  
sounds like Ukraine should regain control of their nuclear facilities.   sounds like every NATO signatory should go all-in on driving Russia out of there.   maybe Putin should have an accident.
 
2022-08-18 1:40:39 PM  
You big meanies!!!  You better let us win this fight, or else......
 
2022-08-18 1:40:56 PM  
Using radiological weapons against a NATO member could have repercussions
 
2022-08-18 1:41:01 PM  
No worries. I understand the Germans are a very friendly and forgiving people.
 
2022-08-18 1:41:32 PM  

Meatsim1: Marcus Aurelius: The Russians sound like they plan to blow the place up.  That should count as a nuclear attack and a response from NATO would not be unreasonable.  Nuke all the orcs.

That would solve nothing and only make things worse for everyone involved


No. That would solve everything.

As to if it would be worse. That's arm chair quarterbacking I don't play.

But I think Newton's Third Law applies.
 
2022-08-18 1:41:34 PM  
Depends on the wind direction. It might blow up in your own face, Vladimir. Literally.
 
2022-08-18 1:42:06 PM  
Perhaps some other countries should get in there and hit the bully in the teeth. With a baseball bat.
 
2022-08-18 1:42:30 PM  

Man On Pink Corner: Orcs not happy about Germany restarting their nuke plants.  Orcs smash Zaporozhzhia plant in retaliation.  Orcs glow in dark.  Orcs now easier to shoot.


They just want to kickstart their FEV program.
 
2022-08-18 1:43:21 PM  
awful nice nuclear power plant you have there...be a shame if something happened to it

pbs.twimg.comView Full Size
 
2022-08-18 1:44:23 PM  

ParallelUniverseParking: Depends on the wind direction. It might blow up in your own face, Vladimir. Literally.


The thing about wind is that it eventually blows in every direction.

If this plant is opened up, it will take years to confine. Even if there weren't a war going on.

/ Personally, I still think that this is Putin-ist bluster
 
2022-08-18 1:44:36 PM  

the voice of raisin: awful nice nuclear power plant you have there...be a shame if something happened to it

[pbs.twimg.com image 500x390]


dammit, but with pic goodness
 
2022-08-18 1:45:05 PM  

Weaver95: Then Russia can look forward to more sanctions.
Sure hope Vlad wanted to completely isolate Russia from the world... because that's what's happening.


China's got their back.
 
2022-08-18 1:46:10 PM  
Shouldn't there be a situation where the United nations goes in and takes control of vital spots, and declares them off limits and protects them?  Should this be a security council issue if there ever was one
 
2022-08-18 1:46:30 PM  

mononymous: No worries. I understand the Germans are a very friendly and forgiving people.


well except for that one time...

but we dont talk about the war.
 
2022-08-18 1:46:49 PM  

Destructor: Weaver95: Then Russia can look forward to more sanctions.
Sure hope Vlad wanted to completely isolate Russia from the world... because that's what's happening.

China's got their back.


Handing his balls to China isn't a winning scenario for Putin.
 
2022-08-18 1:47:02 PM  

ParallelUniverseParking: Depends on the wind direction. It might blow up in your own face, Vladimir. Literally.


Yuuup.

Looks like as i type this, they'd contaminate the Ukraine, Moldova, and Black Sea. Maybe Turkey? Per earth.nullschool.net, Fark hates the link. It's a windmap of the globe.

Now I could be wrong but I don't think Turkey would be thrilled about that.
 
2022-08-18 1:47:12 PM  
It would be unfair not to donate radiation to Russia's two largest cities, in the relative amount that Putin is trying to poison Ukraine and Western Europe.

If it were at all possible, dump the broken, bombed, and bleeding reactors in Ukraine in the middle of Red Square.  No overreaction, just eye for an eye and measure for measure.  Putin needs to find out that Russians have no stomach to go through a great patriotic war started in a fit of pique by one dwarf with pretensions.
 
2022-08-18 1:47:51 PM  

anuran: Using radiological weapons against a NATO member could have repercussions


Yeah, the minute that shiat crosses the border into Poland or another NATO country, there must be immediate and deadly serious repercussions for Russia.
 
2022-08-18 1:49:54 PM  
Deterrence can only come in one form. Give Ukraine a nuclear missile now, and the code to launch it at Moscow after any "accident" at this plant.
 
2022-08-18 1:49:59 PM  

Destructor: China's got their back.


Literally.

China, unlike Russia, isn't run by complete morons.  Putin will end his career as Xi's houseboy.
 
2022-08-18 1:52:24 PM  

WillofJ2: Shouldn't there be a situation where the United nations goes in and takes control of vital spots, and declares them off limits and protects them?  Should this be a security council issue if there ever was one


The UN is a debate club. Not a "super government". The actual teeth of the UN is the US. They kind of use us like the "bad cop" role in "good cop/bad cop" when talking to recalcitrant third world dictators.
 
2022-08-18 1:52:29 PM  
I don't think they have thought their plan through.  As usual.

1. Its a lot closer to Russia then it is to Germany.  And the winds tend to blow from the West meaning that Russia is FAR more likely to be impacted.
2. China has a treaty with Ukraine that says they will defend them against nuclear weapons.  This could become a issue depending on how its written and interpreted.
3. If they damage a NATO country due to this it could be a triggering event calling up NATO.
 
2022-08-18 1:53:53 PM  

BitwiseShift: If it were at all possible, dump the broken, bombed, and bleeding reactors in Ukraine in the middle of Red Square.  No overreaction, just eye for an eye and measure for measure.  Putin needs to find out that Russians have no stomach to go through a great patriotic war started in a fit of pique by one dwarf with pretensions.


I really like this idea.  Use the robots designed for cleanup work at Fukushima to load the corium fragments onto a drone of some type, then crash-land the drone in the employee parking lot at the Kremlin.  Make it Putin's problem.
 
2022-08-18 1:54:02 PM  
Fark user imageView Full Size

This should end well
 
2022-08-18 1:55:44 PM  
Everyone should attack Russia all at once. Just don't make the mistake that Napoleon and Hitler made. Don't try to take over the entire country. Just blow it all up.
 
2022-08-18 1:57:06 PM  

Destructor: Weaver95: Then Russia can look forward to more sanctions.
Sure hope Vlad wanted to completely isolate Russia from the world... because that's what's happening.

China's got their back.


not if they're playing with nuclear material.

At the end of the day, China still wants reliable trading partners.
 
2022-08-18 1:58:11 PM  
As if we need another reason not to do nuclear power.

How much damage could Putin do with a solar array?  Or wind turbines?

Hurl them like Zeus?
 
2022-08-18 1:58:24 PM  
And if anyone knows a thing about ruining Ukraine with nuclear waste, it's Russia.
 
2022-08-18 1:58:59 PM  
No point in letting Ukraine go it alone if Russia is going to start indirect nuking of things. At this point there isn't anything to lose cause they already showed their incompetence by digging around Chernobyl. Trusting their word on this other plant would be foolish.
 
2022-08-18 2:01:22 PM  
Would an emergency shutdown be enough to keep the plant from being used this way or do they only need the nuclear material itself?

I don't know how much power is going out to people from this plant, but if pulling the plug keeps saboteurs from doing stupid shiat with radiation I hope that's at least in the cards as a counter.

But then that might be the plan and this is just a bluff by Russia to cut the power to tighten the squeeze on the people out there!

This sucks!
 
2022-08-18 2:02:05 PM  

Man On Pink Corner: Orcs not happy about Germany restarting their nuke plants.  Orcs smash Zaporozhzhia plant in retaliation.  Orcs glow in dark.  Orcs now easier to shoot.


It's the Cherenkov Effect, perfectly natural.
 
2022-08-18 2:02:12 PM  
Looks to me like if there were an "accident" at Zaporizhzhia , the winds would carry the fallout South over Crimea, Sea of Azov, and Black Sea, then East to Georgia and Russia.

Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2022-08-18 2:06:08 PM  

Man On Pink Corner: Orcs not happy about Germany restarting their nuke plants.  Orcs smash Zaporozhzhia plant in retaliation.  Orcs glow in dark.  Orcs now easier to shoot.


So, it's turning orcs into glowing ones?
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2022-08-18 2:08:09 PM  

whidbey: As if we need another reason not to do nuclear power.


Dumbass tankie says what?
 
2022-08-18 2:08:57 PM  
So this all over again:
cdn.theatlantic.comView Full Size
 
2022-08-18 2:10:12 PM  

WillofJ2: Shouldn't there be a situation where the United nations goes in and takes control of vital spots, and declares them off limits and protects them?  Should this be a security council issue if there ever was one


Mr. Google says that Russia is still one of five Permanent members of the UN security council. So, technically, you're right.
 
2022-08-18 2:10:16 PM  

WillofJ2: Shouldn't there be a situation where the United nations goes in and takes control of vital spots, and declares them off limits and protects them?  Should this be a security council issue if there ever was one


Guess who's on the security council, and has unilateral veto authority.

Hint: It's not Frank Stallone this time.
 
2022-08-18 2:11:14 PM  

Alebak: Would an emergency shutdown be enough to keep the plant from being used this way or do they only need the nuclear material itself?

I don't know how much power is going out to people from this plant, but if pulling the plug keeps saboteurs from doing stupid shiat with radiation I hope that's at least in the cards as a counter.

But then that might be the plan and this is just a bluff by Russia to cut the power to tighten the squeeze on the people out there!

This sucks!


Russia wants to sever the plant's connection to Ukraine and hook it up to power Russia and Russian-controlled territory. They also have thoughts of perhaps ultimately selling some of the power back to Ukraine in the future.
 
2022-08-18 2:11:49 PM  
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2022-08-18 2:12:08 PM  

Alebak: Would an emergency shutdown be enough to keep the plant from being used this way or do they only need the nuclear material itself?

I don't know how much power is going out to people from this plant, but if pulling the plug keeps saboteurs from doing stupid shiat with radiation I hope that's at least in the cards as a counter.

But then that might be the plan and this is just a bluff by Russia to cut the power to tighten the squeeze on the people out there!

This sucks!


If the cooling water is drained or the pumps shut off..THAT would be a problem...
The core fuel rods are thermally hot, and would just become more so, to the point it melts, then
it goes into a chain reaction as the fuel melts together uncontrolled and burns through the containment..
Being that the plant is right next to a giant lake, the ground water would get hit vaporizing to a nice steam
explosion, blowing chunks of fuel and bits of reactor parts all over the place..
 
2022-08-18 2:12:15 PM  
Kick them off the UNSC, now.
 
2022-08-18 2:13:16 PM  

Alebak: Would an emergency shutdown be enough to keep the plant from being used this way or do they only need the nuclear material itself?

I don't know how much power is going out to people from this plant, but if pulling the plug keeps saboteurs from doing stupid shiat with radiation I hope that's at least in the cards as a counter.

But then that might be the plan and this is just a bluff by Russia to cut the power to tighten the squeeze on the people out there!

This sucks!


So this was discussed a little bit in an earlier thread, but basically if they can destroy all the cooling/back up cooling/ emergency cooling/ extra emergency cooling, then the decay heat from fission products will be strong enough to melt the fuel. Then it's a question of how much damage can be done to the containment to expose the molten core to the environment. There are a lot of what ifs and questions about firepower, knowledge, capability, willingness ect... but shutting down the reactors doesn't prevent possible meltdown scenarios. Also, there is a lot of spent fuel on site since this is the primary spent fuel processing plant for Ukraine, (they have a lot of pool and dry cask storage along with hot cells).
 
2022-08-18 2:17:18 PM  

Mr. Shabooboo: Alebak: Would an emergency shutdown be enough to keep the plant from being used this way or do they only need the nuclear material itself?

I don't know how much power is going out to people from this plant, but if pulling the plug keeps saboteurs from doing stupid shiat with radiation I hope that's at least in the cards as a counter.

But then that might be the plan and this is just a bluff by Russia to cut the power to tighten the squeeze on the people out there!

This sucks!

If the cooling water is drained or the pumps shut off..THAT would be a problem...
The core fuel rods are thermally hot, and would just become more so, to the point it melts, then
it goes into a chain reaction as the fuel melts together uncontrolled and burns through the containment..
Being that the plant is right next to a giant lake, the ground water would get hit vaporizing to a nice steam
explosion, blowing chunks of fuel and bits of reactor parts all over the place..


VVER's do have core catchers.

upload.wikimedia.orgView Full Size


The bigger issue is what type of sabotage is being enacted on containment and if a meltdown occurs, will there be a response to try and control the corium?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Core_catcher
 
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