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(Deadline)   "He certainly can't take back all the things he's done. You need a time machine for that." Co-creator Peter Gould chats on the finale of 'Better Call Saul.' **HUELL-FREE SPOILERS**   (deadline.com) divider line
    More: Followup, Breaking Bad, Bob Odenkirk, Better Call Saul series finale, Bryan Cranston, Saul Goodman, fellow lawyer Kim Wexler, seeing Breaking Bad, Vince Gilligan  
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406 clicks; posted to Entertainment » on 16 Aug 2022 at 11:35 AM (6 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2022-08-16 11:47:01 AM  
So Saul's confession at the end... How much do you believe? Did he have that much of a role in making Walter White? He had some part, but how much does he believe he was the puppet master the whole time and how much is exaggeration to take focus away from Kim?
 
2022-08-16 11:53:05 AM  

mcmnky: So Saul's confession at the end... How much do you believe? Did he have that much of a role in making Walter White? He had some part, but how much does he believe he was the puppet master the whole time and how much is exaggeration to take focus away from Kim?


Saul was a failure and a hack. He was a success in his own mind. And the minds of his fellow inmates.
 
2022-08-16 11:58:29 AM  

mcmnky: So Saul's confession at the end... How much do you believe? Did he have that much of a role in making Walter White? He had some part, but how much does he believe he was the puppet master the whole time and how much is exaggeration to take focus away from Kim?


Saul had the contacts that put Walter White into the big time - Walter had the chemistry but didn't know the game.  Jesse knew the game, but was too small time and not serious enough.  Saul connects Walter with Mike who connects him with Gus.

Saul was absolutely essential in building Walter's meth empire.

But that was largely irrelevant.  Ultimately the speech was about Chuck.
 
2022-08-16 11:58:48 AM  

mcmnky: So Saul's confession at the end... How much do you believe? Did he have that much of a role in making Walter White? He had some part, but how much does he believe he was the puppet master the whole time and how much is exaggeration to take focus away from Kim?


I think there's definitely a good bit of Walter White's "success" owed to Saul, in some fashion or another. I don't think the confession was all about Breaking Bad though. It was more of a catharsis. Coming clean for all the crimes he's ever committed, facing the music, and accepting the punishment. It was his last gamble at earning any sort of redemption, in his own eyes even if in no one else's. In him mind, doing so gave him back his McGill name. Justice was done though the heavens may fall.
 
2022-08-16 11:59:24 AM  

Snapper Carr: Saul connects Walter with Mike who connects him with Gus.


Rather Saul's relationship with Mike connects Walter with Gus.
 
2022-08-16 12:02:53 PM  

Snapper Carr: mcmnky: So Saul's confession at the end... How much do you believe? Did he have that much of a role in making Walter White? He had some part, but how much does he believe he was the puppet master the whole time and how much is exaggeration to take focus away from Kim?

Saul had the contacts that put Walter White into the big time - Walter had the chemistry but didn't know the game.  Jesse knew the game, but was too small time and not serious enough.  Saul connects Walter with Mike who connects him with Gus.

Saul was absolutely essential in building Walter's meth empire.

But that was largely irrelevant.  Ultimately the speech was about Chuck.


The part about Walt being dead or in jail in a month without Saul's help? And all the people who died as a result? Absolutely correct.

Although Saul wasn't so much directly at fault for all the ensuing mayhem as much as he was the last man standing.
 
2022-08-16 12:14:06 PM  

mcmnky: So Saul's confession at the end... How much do you believe? Did he have that much of a role in making Walter White? He had some part, but how much does he believe he was the puppet master the whole time and how much is exaggeration to take focus away from Kim?


That allowed Saul to go 'on the record' as a genuine, brilliant criminal mastermind while at the same time taking the weight off of Kim.
He falls on his sword, she sees he did the right thing and he is redeemed in her eyes.
And Saul/Jimmy/Gene sacrifices himself to achieve the redemption arc as a dramatic character like Walt did in BB.

say goddam, that's tight writing.
 
2022-08-16 12:22:40 PM  
I watched Breaking Bad on Netflix in one binge.

I have not seen Better Call Saul, been waiting for it to be completed. I intend to watch it all with someone fresh to both series.

My question is - Should someone watching these shows for the first time watch them in chronological or airing order?

Can you keep your answers as spoiler-free for BCS as possible? This random person on the internet would appreciate it.
 
2022-08-16 12:24:40 PM  

Jim from Saint Paul: My question is - Should someone watching these shows for the first time watch them in chronological or airing order?


I think you'll definitely get more out of it if you watch it in broadcast order - Breaking Bad first, then BCS.
 
2022-08-16 12:25:31 PM  
Reading the Twitter thread for the series, I think the biggest mistake the showrunners made was trusting the audience to understand nuance and subtext. So many people complaining "duh why did Saul blow up his seven year deal and get 86 years? Soooo stupid, worst ending ever!"

The real mystery is what show these people have been watching all this time, because it sure wasn't BCS.
 
2022-08-16 12:25:42 PM  

Jim from Saint Paul: I watched Breaking Bad on Netflix in one binge.

I have not seen Better Call Saul, been waiting for it to be completed. I intend to watch it all with someone fresh to both series.

My question is - Should someone watching these shows for the first time watch them in chronological or airing order?

Can you keep your answers as spoiler-free for BCS as possible? This random person on the internet would appreciate it.


I'd watch Breaking Bad first. There are a lot of easter eggs and appearances that pop-up in BCS, and it's more fun if you understand the original concept of the characters.
 
2022-08-16 12:26:51 PM  

Jim from Saint Paul: I watched Breaking Bad on Netflix in one binge.

I have not seen Better Call Saul, been waiting for it to be completed. I intend to watch it all with someone fresh to both series.

My question is - Should someone watching these shows for the first time watch them in chronological or airing order?

Can you keep your answers as spoiler-free for BCS as possible? This random person on the internet would appreciate it.


Airing order.
 
2022-08-16 12:27:06 PM  

AnotherBluesStringer: mcmnky: So Saul's confession at the end... How much do you believe? Did he have that much of a role in making Walter White? He had some part, but how much does he believe he was the puppet master the whole time and how much is exaggeration to take focus away from Kim?

I think there's definitely a good bit of Walter White's "success" owed to Saul, in some fashion or another. I don't think the confession was all about Breaking Bad though. It was more of a catharsis. Coming clean for all the crimes he's ever committed, facing the music, and accepting the punishment. It was his last gamble at earning any sort of redemption, in his own eyes even if in no one else's. In him mind, doing so gave him back his McGill name. Justice was done though the heavens may fall.


I thought the purpose was tanking his case so he could protect Kim from going to jail...?
 
2022-08-16 12:27:38 PM  

Jim from Saint Paul: I watched Breaking Bad on Netflix in one binge.

I have not seen Better Call Saul, been waiting for it to be completed. I intend to watch it all with someone fresh to both series.

My question is - Should someone watching these shows for the first time watch them in chronological or airing order?

Can you keep your answers as spoiler-free for BCS as possible? This random person on the internet would appreciate it.


The order they aired.  BCS is mostly pre-BB, but there are scenes here and there, including a few entire episodes, that take place during and after BB, it would be impossible to watch it in chronological order.
 
2022-08-16 12:27:43 PM  

Jim from Saint Paul: I watched Breaking Bad on Netflix in one binge.

I have not seen Better Call Saul, been waiting for it to be completed. I intend to watch it all with someone fresh to both series.

My question is - Should someone watching these shows for the first time watch them in chronological or airing order?

Can you keep your answers as spoiler-free for BCS as possible? This random person on the internet would appreciate it.


The article nails it when they call BB a "hidden mid-season for BCS." The way it resolves, I think you can do it either way.
 
2022-08-16 12:29:42 PM  

Fart And Smunny: AnotherBluesStringer: mcmnky: So Saul's confession at the end... How much do you believe? Did he have that much of a role in making Walter White? He had some part, but how much does he believe he was the puppet master the whole time and how much is exaggeration to take focus away from Kim?

I think there's definitely a good bit of Walter White's "success" owed to Saul, in some fashion or another. I don't think the confession was all about Breaking Bad though. It was more of a catharsis. Coming clean for all the crimes he's ever committed, facing the music, and accepting the punishment. It was his last gamble at earning any sort of redemption, in his own eyes even if in no one else's. In him mind, doing so gave him back his McGill name. Justice was done though the heavens may fall.

I thought the purpose was tanking his case so he could protect Kim from going to jail...?


I think it's a bit of both.
 
2022-08-16 12:30:02 PM  

Fart And Smunny: AnotherBluesStringer: mcmnky: So Saul's confession at the end... How much do you believe? Did he have that much of a role in making Walter White? He had some part, but how much does he believe he was the puppet master the whole time and how much is exaggeration to take focus away from Kim?

I think there's definitely a good bit of Walter White's "success" owed to Saul, in some fashion or another. I don't think the confession was all about Breaking Bad though. It was more of a catharsis. Coming clean for all the crimes he's ever committed, facing the music, and accepting the punishment. It was his last gamble at earning any sort of redemption, in his own eyes even if in no one else's. In him mind, doing so gave him back his McGill name. Justice was done though the heavens may fall.

I thought the purpose was tanking his case so he could protect Kim from going to jail...?


They made it very clear Kim was almost certainly free from legal jeopardy, and that Saul knew this.

He did it to redeem himself in her eyes. Because in the end, all that mattered to him was Kim's love and respect.
 
2022-08-16 12:30:18 PM  

Jim from Saint Paul: I watched Breaking Bad on Netflix in one binge.

I have not seen Better Call Saul, been waiting for it to be completed. I intend to watch it all with someone fresh to both series.

My question is - Should someone watching these shows for the first time watch them in chronological or airing order?

Can you keep your answers as spoiler-free for BCS as possible? This random person on the internet would appreciate it.


BCS is both a prequel and sequel to BB. The prequel part doesn't require seeing BB, but a lot of the sequel part won't make sense without seeing BB first. It's like you should see The Godfather before The Godfather Part 2, even though part of Part 2 is a prequel.
 
2022-08-16 12:33:11 PM  

AnotherBluesStringer: Fart And Smunny: AnotherBluesStringer: mcmnky: So Saul's confession at the end... How much do you believe? Did he have that much of a role in making Walter White? He had some part, but how much does he believe he was the puppet master the whole time and how much is exaggeration to take focus away from Kim?

I think there's definitely a good bit of Walter White's "success" owed to Saul, in some fashion or another. I don't think the confession was all about Breaking Bad though. It was more of a catharsis. Coming clean for all the crimes he's ever committed, facing the music, and accepting the punishment. It was his last gamble at earning any sort of redemption, in his own eyes even if in no one else's. In him mind, doing so gave him back his McGill name. Justice was done though the heavens may fall.

I thought the purpose was tanking his case so he could protect Kim from going to jail...?

I think it's a bit of both.


That's a relief. I was worried I misinterpreted that whole section of the episode for a minute.
 
2022-08-16 12:33:39 PM  

mcnguyen: Jim from Saint Paul: I watched Breaking Bad on Netflix in one binge.

I have not seen Better Call Saul, been waiting for it to be completed. I intend to watch it all with someone fresh to both series.

My question is - Should someone watching these shows for the first time watch them in chronological or airing order?

Can you keep your answers as spoiler-free for BCS as possible? This random person on the internet would appreciate it.

The order they aired.  BCS is mostly pre-BB, but there are scenes here and there, including a few entire episodes, that take place during and after BB, it would be impossible to watch it in chronological order.


I'll add that if you watch BCS first, the post-BB stuff, in addition to having the problem that these scenes would make zero sense, would reveal HUGE spoilers about the events of BB.  Watching BCS first would be a big mistake.
 
2022-08-16 12:34:19 PM  

gilgigamesh: Fart And Smunny: AnotherBluesStringer: mcmnky: So Saul's confession at the end... How much do you believe? Did he have that much of a role in making Walter White? He had some part, but how much does he believe he was the puppet master the whole time and how much is exaggeration to take focus away from Kim?

I think there's definitely a good bit of Walter White's "success" owed to Saul, in some fashion or another. I don't think the confession was all about Breaking Bad though. It was more of a catharsis. Coming clean for all the crimes he's ever committed, facing the music, and accepting the punishment. It was his last gamble at earning any sort of redemption, in his own eyes even if in no one else's. In him mind, doing so gave him back his McGill name. Justice was done though the heavens may fall.

I thought the purpose was tanking his case so he could protect Kim from going to jail...?

They made it very clear Kim was almost certainly free from legal jeopardy, and that Saul knew this.

He did it to redeem himself in her eyes. Because in the end, all that mattered to him was Kim's love and respect.


I guess I somehow read it as the opposite on Kim's part. I thought it was clear that Saul was trying to take sole responsibility for Howard's death so Kim wouldn't be gone-after for that.
 
2022-08-16 12:35:09 PM  
Again - Totally possible that I misinterpreted the situation, perhaps grossly. That was just my read.
 
2022-08-16 12:42:29 PM  

Fart And Smunny: gilgigamesh: Fart And Smunny: AnotherBluesStringer: mcmnky: So Saul's confession at the end... How much do you believe? Did he have that much of a role in making Walter White? He had some part, but how much does he believe he was the puppet master the whole time and how much is exaggeration to take focus away from Kim?

I think there's definitely a good bit of Walter White's "success" owed to Saul, in some fashion or another. I don't think the confession was all about Breaking Bad though. It was more of a catharsis. Coming clean for all the crimes he's ever committed, facing the music, and accepting the punishment. It was his last gamble at earning any sort of redemption, in his own eyes even if in no one else's. In him mind, doing so gave him back his McGill name. Justice was done though the heavens may fall.

I thought the purpose was tanking his case so he could protect Kim from going to jail...?

They made it very clear Kim was almost certainly free from legal jeopardy, and that Saul knew this.

He did it to redeem himself in her eyes. Because in the end, all that mattered to him was Kim's love and respect.

I guess I somehow read it as the opposite on Kim's part. I thought it was clear that Saul was trying to take sole responsibility for Howard's death so Kim wouldn't be gone-after for that.


It's worth watching again, but I'm pretty sure Saul was told her exposure was slim, except for a likely civil suit by Cheryl. While you could reasonably assume she may be less inclined to go after Kim after Saul took full responsibility, that's by no means guaranteed. She signed a full confession, after all.  And that would be a big gaping hole if his plan was to sacrifice himself to save her.

I think the simplest answer is that he always saw Kim as his moral guide post, and when he saw her accept responsibility for her actions, he did the same.
 
2022-08-16 12:44:15 PM  

Fart And Smunny: gilgigamesh: Fart And Smunny: AnotherBluesStringer: mcmnky: So Saul's confession at the end... How much do you believe? Did he have that much of a role in making Walter White? He had some part, but how much does he believe he was the puppet master the whole time and how much is exaggeration to take focus away from Kim?

I think there's definitely a good bit of Walter White's "success" owed to Saul, in some fashion or another. I don't think the confession was all about Breaking Bad though. It was more of a catharsis. Coming clean for all the crimes he's ever committed, facing the music, and accepting the punishment. It was his last gamble at earning any sort of redemption, in his own eyes even if in no one else's. In him mind, doing so gave him back his McGill name. Justice was done though the heavens may fall.

I thought the purpose was tanking his case so he could protect Kim from going to jail...?

They made it very clear Kim was almost certainly free from legal jeopardy, and that Saul knew this.

He did it to redeem himself in her eyes. Because in the end, all that mattered to him was Kim's love and respect.

I guess I somehow read it as the opposite on Kim's part. I thought it was clear that Saul was trying to take sole responsibility for Howard's death so Kim wouldn't be gone-after for that.


FWIW, even with Saul taking full responsibility, it doesn't entirely let Kim off the hook as an accessory who didn't report the crime immediately. However, she might get by with saying she felt under threat from Gus and/or the Salamancas.
 
2022-08-16 12:50:11 PM  
Do you think Kim kept visiting him?  I'd like to believe so.
 
2022-08-16 12:55:10 PM  

gilgigamesh: Fart And Smunny: AnotherBluesStringer: mcmnky: So Saul's confession at the end... How much do you believe? Did he have that much of a role in making Walter White? He had some part, but how much does he believe he was the puppet master the whole time and how much is exaggeration to take focus away from Kim?

I think there's definitely a good bit of Walter White's "success" owed to Saul, in some fashion or another. I don't think the confession was all about Breaking Bad though. It was more of a catharsis. Coming clean for all the crimes he's ever committed, facing the music, and accepting the punishment. It was his last gamble at earning any sort of redemption, in his own eyes even if in no one else's. In him mind, doing so gave him back his McGill name. Justice was done though the heavens may fall.

I thought the purpose was tanking his case so he could protect Kim from going to jail...?

They made it very clear Kim was almost certainly free from legal jeopardy, and that Saul knew this.

He did it to redeem himself in her eyes. Because in the end, all that mattered to him was Kim's love and respect.


Well, we don't know what he gave the prosecutors when the plane landed. We do know his "confession" contradicted that information. So we really have no idea what Kim was in for. My takeaway was that Jimmy felt betrayed by Kim, and unredeemable, so he was going to blow it all up. When he saw her in the courtroom, he realized she still cared and had great affection for him, so he gave that speech and saved her, while owning up to everything. Redeeming himself to both of them.
 
2022-08-16 12:57:43 PM  

mcmnky: So Saul's confession at the end... How much do you believe? Did he have that much of a role in making Walter White? He had some part, but how much does he believe he was the puppet master the whole time and how much is exaggeration to take focus away from Kim?


I think the part at the end of the "Breaking Bad" episode (#11) where Saul talked with Mike about how he viewed Walt as moldable and then went to the school to meet with him flipped a little of the BB story for us, and was meant to indicate that Saul definitely pulled more of the strings than we thought while watching BB. So, he's inflating his role in his own mind a bit, but I think the writers think the core of that confession is true now.
 
2022-08-16 1:02:55 PM  

AnotherBluesStringer: gilgigamesh: Fart And Smunny: AnotherBluesStringer: mcmnky: So Saul's confession at the end... How much do you believe? Did he have that much of a role in making Walter White? He had some part, but how much does he believe he was the puppet master the whole time and how much is exaggeration to take focus away from Kim?

I think there's definitely a good bit of Walter White's "success" owed to Saul, in some fashion or another. I don't think the confession was all about Breaking Bad though. It was more of a catharsis. Coming clean for all the crimes he's ever committed, facing the music, and accepting the punishment. It was his last gamble at earning any sort of redemption, in his own eyes even if in no one else's. In him mind, doing so gave him back his McGill name. Justice was done though the heavens may fall.

I thought the purpose was tanking his case so he could protect Kim from going to jail...?

They made it very clear Kim was almost certainly free from legal jeopardy, and that Saul knew this.

He did it to redeem himself in her eyes. Because in the end, all that mattered to him was Kim's love and respect.

Well, we don't know what he gave the prosecutors when the plane landed. We do know his "confession" contradicted that information. So we really have no idea what Kim was in for. My takeaway was that Jimmy felt betrayed by Kim, and unredeemable, so he was going to blow it all up. When he saw her in the courtroom, he realized she still cared and had great affection for him, so he gave that speech and saved her, while owning up to everything. Redeeming himself to both of them.


I think they left that deliberately vague, whether it was his plan all along or he suddenly had a change of heart when he saw her. Either way is valid.

Again, a second viewing may clarify. But I think they left that open to interpretation.
 
2022-08-16 1:03:51 PM  
Why did Saul blow up his seven year deal and get 86 years? Soooo stupid, worst ending ever!
 
2022-08-16 1:05:29 PM  

Subtonic: Why did Saul blow up his seven year deal and get 86 years? Soooo stupid, worst ending ever!


Oh you.
 
2022-08-16 1:08:14 PM  
Just curious: Am I the only BB-BCS fan who is also obsessed with Only Murders In the Building?

The shows are almost entirely different in nature - don't get me wrong - but the directorial eye, especially as it involves the use of color, is superb.

The only other show I know of running that's this good with color is The Marvelous Ms. Maisel. I love a properly beautifully shot show, though. That it's also hilarious is a bonus.
 
2022-08-16 1:12:27 PM  

Fart And Smunny: Just curious: Am I the only BB-BCS fan who is also obsessed with Only Murders In the Building?


Probably. I got through the first season, had no desire to check the second. Of course, I have an passionate hate for Steve Martin (he knows what he did), so YMMV.
 
2022-08-16 1:25:31 PM  

Fart And Smunny: AnotherBluesStringer: mcmnky: So Saul's confession at the end... How much do you believe? Did he have that much of a role in making Walter White? He had some part, but how much does he believe he was the puppet master the whole time and how much is exaggeration to take focus away from Kim?

I think there's definitely a good bit of Walter White's "success" owed to Saul, in some fashion or another. I don't think the confession was all about Breaking Bad though. It was more of a catharsis. Coming clean for all the crimes he's ever committed, facing the music, and accepting the punishment. It was his last gamble at earning any sort of redemption, in his own eyes even if in no one else's. In him mind, doing so gave him back his McGill name. Justice was done though the heavens may fall.

I thought the purpose was tanking his case so he could protect Kim from going to jail...?


Kim wasn't going to jail in any case.  She was at risk for heavy civil lawsuits from Howard's widow, but the DA wasn't going near her.

Tanking the case was about him trying to regain some self respect.   I think his final scene with Carol Burnett really drove home just how far he had fallen.
 
2022-08-16 1:33:38 PM  

gilgigamesh: Reading the Twitter thread for the series, I think the biggest mistake the showrunners made was trusting the audience to understand nuance and subtext. So many people complaining "duh why did Saul blow up his seven year deal and get 86 years? Soooo stupid, worst ending ever!"

The real mystery is what show these people have been watching all this time, because it sure wasn't BCS.


There are still people to this day who insist that Walt did it all for his family and at first was genuinely just trying to build up a nest egg, even though Walt come right out and TOLD us that that was always B.S. and he was doing it for himself from the start.

These are often the same people who insist that Skyler was just as bad as Walt because she cheated on him, completely missing the point that the only reason for F'd Ted was to drive her sociopath husband out of the house. It was the only power she had over him and the only move she thought she could make.

The entire BCS series was summed up by Walt in the finale: "So you were always this way."

That's what happened in the end. Saul made one final move to become Jimmy again, in front of Kim, both to save Kim and to do a small, small thing to save whatever soul he had left. That was their smoke together. It was one final moment of Kim and Jimmy instead of Kim and Saul.

He's still not a good guy. He was always this way. But Jimmy sometimes fought against the worst of his nature. He tried to rise above it. Saul didn't. And that's part of why he tried to re-embrace Jimmy at the end. He had to believe that he wasn't as bad as he'd finally become: a sleazy dirtbag who would rob a man dying of cancer.

Saul allowed himself to go to prison because he knew he DESERVED it.
 
2022-08-16 1:39:42 PM  

Fart And Smunny: Just curious: Am I the only BB-BCS fan who is also obsessed with Only Murders In the Building?

The shows are almost entirely different in nature - don't get me wrong - but the directorial eye, especially as it involves the use of color, is superb.

The only other show I know of running that's this good with color is The Marvelous Ms. Maisel. I love a properly beautifully shot show, though. That it's also hilarious is a bonus.


I love it. Tonight's penultimate episode should be great after the reveal last week.
 
2022-08-16 1:41:41 PM  
I think it was important that neither of the regrets expressed in those scenes appeared to be about... not taking the longer term paths they took, but instead fixing bumps along the road. It's a curious thing, and kinda drives home that neither of them are good dudes, at their core.
 
2022-08-16 1:49:07 PM  

Fart And Smunny: I think it was important that neither of the regrets expressed in those scenes appeared to be about... not taking the longer term paths they took, but instead fixing bumps along the road. It's a curious thing, and kinda drives home that neither of them are good dudes, at their core.


I thought Mike's was clearly a regret that he took the path he took. I don't really know another way to read it.
 
2022-08-16 1:54:35 PM  
Well, other than the confession, some of my favorite moments:

-The reframing of Chuck was genius. After this whole season echoing Chuck being 100% correct about Jimmy, yet still being a self-fulfilling prophecy about the situation...All Jimmy ever wanted was Chuck's affection and approval, and from what we've seen, he never got it. Finally, after all these scenes regarding a time machine, we see a memory of a kinder Chuck, that actually did reach out to Jimmy. He saw genuine love from Jimmy in his actions and tried to reciprocate. Jimmy turned HIM down for once. Then he grabs his copy of H.G. Wells' The Time Machine, and you realize....this was the moment. This was the turning point that could have saved him. Had he sat with Chuck, he could have had that relationship he strived for.

-We got genuine comedy with Walt talking about the impossibility of a time machine, and ending with "So you've always been this person?" They really brought Cranston back to the moment Walt was in at that point of the story. When he talks about Grey matter, he still very much plays the victim card and acts like he was manipulated out of the company. He does yearn for the empire and notoriety though. Exactly who he was before the run. And Jimmy really shines through the Saul persona for one gleaming moment and show that he could have prevented all this, but Walt dismissing him cemented that Saul is all there is. It's a stench he can never wash off. He's corrupted.

-Mike somehow becoming even more of a tragic figure choosing to change the day he took his first bribe. Showing nothing but regret for his entire life and the man he's become. Holy fark.

-Marie didn't feel shoe-horned in either. When I saw her, I was really wondering how the hell they were gonna make her relevant. I think they did a great job, especially for a character that really had no relevance to Saul.

I appreciate that this finale was a sum of its parts and not one HOLY SHIAT moment at the end for everyone to talk about at the water cooler. It was a slow burn and a culmination of both shows, that really brought the characters to a conclusion they deserved.
 
2022-08-16 1:54:41 PM  

boyofd: Fart And Smunny: I think it was important that neither of the regrets expressed in those scenes appeared to be about... not taking the longer term paths they took, but instead fixing bumps along the road. It's a curious thing, and kinda drives home that neither of them are good dudes, at their core.

I thought Mike's was clearly a regret that he took the path he took. I don't really know another way to read it.


Mike's definitely - I just meant Walt's and Saul's - Mike's was an excellent contrast from that.
 
2022-08-16 2:02:42 PM  

boyofd: Fart And Smunny: I think it was important that neither of the regrets expressed in those scenes appeared to be about... not taking the longer term paths they took, but instead fixing bumps along the road. It's a curious thing, and kinda drives home that neither of them are good dudes, at their core.

I thought Mike's was clearly a regret that he took the path he took. I don't really know another way to read it.


Of the many deaths in BB/BCS, many of them were not tragic in any way. They involved bad people who put themselves in bad situations. The truly tragic ones involved innocents caught in the crossfire.

Mike's is perhaps the murkiest. He put himself in the bad position he was in, he took a bad path and it eventually killed him.

You get the sense he never wanted this path, though. He instead saw it as a tragic inevitability, like he had to live this life out of some sort of penance. Things went wrong for him, he failed himself by taking bribes, he failed his son, so he accepted what he'd become and tried to make the best of it.

I think it haunted him, but he was like the alcoholic who didn't believe it was possible to just quit, so he kept drinking, but did so with a series of self-imposed rules. It was a life of self-torture for past mistakes.

He'd have changed things if he believed he could, but for whatever reason -- perhaps the loss of his son -- he saw no path towards the light for himself, so instead, he devoted himself to his granddaughter and held himself to a code of honor, but stayed in his dark road.

My favorite character in the BB universe, by far.

The fact that Banks didn't win an Emmy for his "I broke my boy" episode is criminal.
 
2022-08-16 2:15:18 PM  

shoegaze99: The fact that Banks didn't win an Emmy for his "I broke my boy" episode is criminal.


*world-weary sigh*
 
2022-08-16 2:36:25 PM  

Jim from Saint Paul: I watched Breaking Bad on Netflix in one binge.

I have not seen Better Call Saul, been waiting for it to be completed. I intend to watch it all with someone fresh to both series.

My question is - Should someone watching these shows for the first time watch them in chronological or airing order?

Can you keep your answers as spoiler-free for BCS as possible? This random person on the internet would appreciate it.


Release order. BCS jumps between some scenes after BB and mostly before. And towards the end, during.

Someone who has seen it all might want to do a chronological rewatch.

But for your first time, release order. BB series 1 - 6, then BCS 1 - 6.
 
2022-08-16 2:38:33 PM  

mcmnky: Someone who has seen it all might want to do a chronological rewatch.


That is my goal.  I've done the Godfather and Star Wars chronologically.

This is next.
 
2022-08-16 2:45:45 PM  

Rent Party: mcmnky: Someone who has seen it all might want to do a chronological rewatch.

That is my goal.  I've done the Godfather and Star Wars chronologically.

This is next.


I guarantee if you wait a few months, or even a few weeks, someone will take all the BB flashback scenes and edit them directly into Breaking Bad episodes for exactly this purpose. Keep your eye on fan edit forums. I'll be REALLY surprised if this sort of thing doesn't materialize at some point.
 
2022-08-16 2:47:10 PM  

Jim from Saint Paul: I watched Breaking Bad on Netflix in one binge.

I have not seen Better Call Saul, been waiting for it to be completed. I intend to watch it all with someone fresh to both series.

My question is - Should someone watching these shows for the first time watch them in chronological or airing order?

Can you keep your answers as spoiler-free for BCS as possible? This random person on the internet would appreciate it.


You have all been helpful. Thanks for the answers. Airing order it is.
 
2022-08-16 2:49:55 PM  
If someone has mentioned it in other threads I missed it, but I like BCS going 63 episodes, one better than BB's 62.
 
2022-08-16 2:52:40 PM  

Rent Party: I think his final scene with Carol Burnett really drove home just how far he had fallen.


Either that, or clawing around in the muck for the diamonds he dropped in a panic in the Dumpster he was hiding in.
 
2022-08-16 3:18:18 PM  
Next up: the Better Call Saul sequel:  Jailhouse Lawyer as Saul uses his legal expertise to take on the cases of those unjustly imprisoned. Bit of Shawshank Redemption.
 
2022-08-16 3:21:21 PM  

gilgigamesh: Rent Party: I think his final scene with Carol Burnett really drove home just how far he had fallen.

Either that, or clawing around in the muck for the diamonds he dropped in a panic in the Dumpster he was hiding in.


I think it was hearing that Kim had delivered a full confession to the DA and to Cheryl.  He owed it to Kim (and ultimately to Chuck) to take responsibility for what he'd become.
 
2022-08-16 3:25:14 PM  
shoegaze99:

The fact that Banks didn't win an Emmy for his "I broke my boy" episode is criminal.

Absolutely
 
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