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(WRAL)   HOA: Um, we gonna need you to go ahead and remove the solar panels you installed, mmmkay? That would be great. Home Owner: Not right now, HOA. In fact, I'm going to have to ask you to go ahead and read the court's decision regarding this matter   (wral.com) divider line
    More: Interesting, North Carolina, Raleigh, North Carolina, United States, Supreme Court of the United States, solar panels, Energy News Network, State supreme court, Raleigh homeowner's association  
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7392 clicks; posted to Main » on 10 Aug 2022 at 10:16 PM (8 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2022-08-10 8:46:19 PM  
The HOA quagmire is something I don't even want to get into. They should be excellent tools for community building. Enforcing rules should be 0.5% of their activity. They should derive authority by providing needed services, not by punishing people.

There are many ways of installing solar that can be attractive. Recently, I see a lot of systems that cover a roof from edge to edge, so it looks like  glass roof. THat looks really cool, I think. Japan had "solar roofs" long before Musk started doing it. About 2009 or even earlier, marketed by Panasonic, and I think Sanyo. They were pretty cool, but pricey and more of a pain than they were worth. (Come to think of it, Japan had smartphones, EVs and solar roofs long before they were a thing in the US. They just did not have PT Barnum types to market them correctly, apparently.)

But beyond that, I will share that, during natural disasters or such events, the guy with the panels gets really popular. Some systems will only allow 1 kW or maybe 2 kW from a solar array if the grid goes down, but that can charge a lot of phones and it can cook hot food without open flames. It can boil water.

We are also entering an era of "rolling blackouts" in many places around the world. Having a lot of homes with panels can make blackouts less likely to affect an area. They can reduce peak consumption of a community.

My area has a lot of small to medium sized solar farms, and a lot of rooftop solar. Low density housing in the burbs.

People should be encouraged at the community level to put panels up.
 
2022-08-10 9:13:40 PM  
2fardownthread:

Recently, I see a lot of systems that cover a roof from edge to edge, so it looks like  glass roof. 

But beyond that, I will share that, during natural disasters or such events, the guy with the panels gets really popular. Some systems will only allow 1 kW or maybe 2 kW from a solar array if the grid goes down, but that can charge a lot of phones and it can cook hot food without open flames. It can boil water.


Systems that don't have batteries don't provide any power when the grid goes down.

The edge to edge panels generally don't meet code because of wind loading but they do look better.  They are a pain to install and do maintenance on but if there aren't lots of trees near by, that isn't much of an issue and it lets the water proof roof last much longer.
 
2022-08-10 10:22:09 PM  
You need to be specific in contracts. Lack of specificity in a contact generally benefits the the person subjected to the limitations.
 
2022-08-10 10:22:33 PM  
I live in a HOA. I'm not impressed by it.
 
2022-08-10 10:23:06 PM  
If you can afford to live where there is an HOA, you should be required to install solar panels.
 
2022-08-10 10:24:04 PM  
The lesser the amount of a person's authority, they more likely they are to abuse it.
 
2022-08-10 10:25:05 PM  
I understand why there are HOAs, and although I wouldn't want to live in one I can understand why someone might not want cars up on blocks, pink houses (in places where pink houses don't fit the natural color scheme... pink house in my town that is hideous, but I've seen them look great in the desert Southwest), but I'm not going to block you because I don't want restrictive rules on me.  Detente.

That said, any HOA that tries to block solar panels needs to just be straight up disbanded.

And the board members should be forced to live ferally down by the beach where they can experience global warming as their stick shelters are destroyed by every storm and wave.

Their spouses should be forced to live in grassy fields around solar panels, but never allowed to use the electricity they generate, or even take refuge in the shade under the panels.

And their children should be sold into slavery in the Middle East to help fund our appetite for foreign oil.

And their pets should be turned into biofuel.

And their houses should be given to homeless people, just to screw over the non-board member NIMBY's still in the neighborhood.

And their outhouses should have a copy of their HOA regulations, printed on 400 grit sandpaper, as the only toilet paper they are ever allowed to use.

/Sorry there.  Got a bit carried away.  I'm sure the pets are totally innocent.
 
2022-08-10 10:27:32 PM  

HoratioGates: I understand why there are HOAs, and although I wouldn't want to live in one I can understand why someone might not want cars up on blocks, pink houses (in places where pink houses don't fit the natural color scheme... pink house in my town that is hideous, but I've seen them look great in the desert Southwest), but I'm not going to block you because I don't want restrictive rules on me.  Detente.

That said, any HOA that tries to block solar panels needs to just be straight up disbanded.

And the board members should be forced to live ferally down by the beach where they can experience global warming as their stick shelters are destroyed by every storm and wave.

Their spouses should be forced to live in grassy fields around solar panels, but never allowed to use the electricity they generate, or even take refuge in the shade under the panels.

And their children should be sold into slavery in the Middle East to help fund our appetite for foreign oil.

And their pets should be turned into biofuel.

And their houses should be given to homeless people, just to screw over the non-board member NIMBY's still in the neighborhood.

And their outhouses should have a copy of their HOA regulations, printed on 400 grit sandpaper, as the only toilet paper they are ever allowed to use.

/Sorry there.  Got a bit carried away.  I'm sure the pets are totally innocent.


Lol. Cracked me up. On another note what % of HOA's are actually useful. Are there even any?
 
2022-08-10 10:27:32 PM  
Saves energy costs? Good for the environment? And Fark the HOA?  Brilliant!
 
2022-08-10 10:30:09 PM  
Yet more evidence that HOA's are a shiat sandwich with no bread.
 
2022-08-10 10:30:12 PM  

2fardownthread: We are also entering an era of "rolling blackouts" in many places around the world. Having a lot of homes with panels can make blackouts less likely to affect an area. They can reduce peak consumption of a community.


There should be a solar panel and a wind turbine on every telephone pole. If electrical power was decentralized, it would work a lot better. But what we need, say the power companies, is large array solar power, and more centralized generation plants. That's to get government money (from us) and then make a profit (from us).
 
2022-08-10 10:30:34 PM  

HoratioGates: I understand why there are HOAs, and although I wouldn't want to live in one I can understand why someone might not want cars up on blocks, pink houses (in places where pink houses don't fit the natural color scheme... pink house in my town that is hideous, but I've seen them look great in the desert Southwest), but I'm not going to block you because I don't want restrictive rules on me.  Detente.

That said, any HOA that tries to block solar panels needs to just be straight up disbanded.

And the board members should be forced to live ferally down by the beach where they can experience global warming as their stick shelters are destroyed by every storm and wave.

Their spouses should be forced to live in grassy fields around solar panels, but never allowed to use the electricity they generate, or even take refuge in the shade under the panels.

And their children should be sold into slavery in the Middle East to help fund our appetite for foreign oil.

And their pets should be turned into biofuel.

And their houses should be given to homeless people, just to screw over the non-board member NIMBY's still in the neighborhood.

And their outhouses should have a copy of their HOA regulations, printed on 400 grit sandpaper, as the only toilet paper they are ever allowed to use.

/Sorry there.  Got a bit carried away.  I'm sure the pets are totally innocent.


Meh. They are just a way to be a bigot.
 
2022-08-10 10:31:05 PM  
State laws everywhere need to be modified to hold the directors of HOAs personally responsible for losses in state courts.

State legislatures refuse to do the simplest things regarding HOAs (in virtually every state public records laws don't apply) so you get asshats running HOAs like they're Donald Putin or Vladimir Trump.

/Don't even ask about the $1,000 bill that every homeowner in my former HOA was required to pay.
 
2022-08-10 10:31:09 PM  

jaivirtualcard: HoratioGates: I understand why there are HOAs, and although I wouldn't want to live in one I can understand why someone might not want cars up on blocks, pink houses (in places where pink houses don't fit the natural color scheme... pink house in my town that is hideous, but I've seen them look great in the desert Southwest), but I'm not going to block you because I don't want restrictive rules on me.  Detente.

That said, any HOA that tries to block solar panels needs to just be straight up disbanded.

And the board members should be forced to live ferally down by the beach where they can experience global warming as their stick shelters are destroyed by every storm and wave.

Their spouses should be forced to live in grassy fields around solar panels, but never allowed to use the electricity they generate, or even take refuge in the shade under the panels.

And their children should be sold into slavery in the Middle East to help fund our appetite for foreign oil.

And their pets should be turned into biofuel.

And their houses should be given to homeless people, just to screw over the non-board member NIMBY's still in the neighborhood.

And their outhouses should have a copy of their HOA regulations, printed on 400 grit sandpaper, as the only toilet paper they are ever allowed to use.

/Sorry there.  Got a bit carried away.  I'm sure the pets are totally innocent.

Lol. Cracked me up. On another note what % of HOA's are actually useful. Are there even any?


-1%
 
2022-08-10 10:31:19 PM  
Should have used that money to buy a house that isn't in an HOA.
 
2022-08-10 10:32:14 PM  

Nosferartoo: Yet more evidence that HOA's are a shiat sandwich with no bread.


No. Their that sandwich that is toast between two pieces of 🍞.
 
2022-08-10 10:32:30 PM  

Omnivorous: State laws everywhere need to be modified to


...not force people to join HOAs just because they buy a home.
Let people choose not to join one if they don't want to.
Then of course, HOAs would mostly stop existing.
 
2022-08-10 10:33:49 PM  
As I read the decision, I only see that the HOA forgot to explicitly forbid solar panels in the original agreement. I'd rather see a court tell HOAs to go Fark themselves in general, but this isn't a bad outcome.
 
2022-08-10 10:33:55 PM  
Did I miss something? The article states that the court sided with the homeowner and told the HOA to get knotted because their contract didn't explicitly regulate the installation of solar panels.

FTA:
"The use of residential solar panels was not specifically mentioned anywhere in the declaration," the document reads. "The declaration does not expressly prohibit the installation of solar panels ... this there is no restriction set forth in the declaration that prohibits or would have the effect of prohibiting the installation of solar panels."
As Energy News Network explains, the ruling reduces the chances a homeowner's request to install solar panels will be denied.

So the homeowners won.
 
2022-08-10 10:34:21 PM  
another reason states/cities need to have laws on the book to restrict what HOA can and can't do.

Places near me has had a lot of HOA look at it for a place to build one but none have as the town has rules on the books saying that while HOA are able to be in the town. The HOA has no right to restrict what a person can and can't do with their little plot of land in the HOA over what the town already dose.   The only power the HOA has is over the common area and enforcing the normal lawn care rules(grass cutting/trash on lawn) but at the same levels the town dose for everyone else.

For example lots of places if you want to put up a fence you have to get permits from both the city and the HOA.  and the if the town is ok with  say 10 different style fences the HOA can say you can only chose form 2 types.  Not in this town once you get that permit from the HOA is powerless to stop you.

So far no HOA has tried to fight it in courts.  Have always wondered what would happen if one dose.
 
2022-08-10 10:37:41 PM  
As Energy News Network explains, the ruling reduces the chances a homeowner's request to install solar panels will be denied.

No, it increases the chance solar panels will specifically be prohibited in the fine print from now on.
 
2022-08-10 10:38:11 PM  
Bravo to the solar panelists for sticking to their guns panels and telling the HOA to pound sand, which will now allow more people to proceed in the state, despite their personal farkwad HOAs.

We are maybe only a decade before solar panel use will be mandated by law. (I hope)
 
2022-08-10 10:39:51 PM  

WastrelWay: If you can afford to live where there is an HOA, you should be required to install solar panels.


HOAs don't always correlate with wealth. They can crop up in almost any neighborhood. If there is power to be had, a Karen will grab it. A friend's mother & a couple of her equally Karen-y neighbors just up and decided they were going to create their apartment building's HOA. It was in Belmar, NJ, just 3 blocks from the beach. They plied the other residents into accepting them by promising to keep the tourists from using their parking lot and gave the best parking spots to the residents they thought would oppose them.  Friend's mother & neighbors set up watch shifts for the parking lot and called a tow company the second someone who didn't live there parked. By the end of the summer, the other residents were more than happy to cede power to them.  The landlord even thanked them, since he didn't have to deal with parking lot calls ever again. By January, they were regretting that decision since this trio of Karens were as toxic and power-mad as you imagine them to be.  My friend moved out, just so he wouldn't have to deal with the dirty looks in the hallways and elevator anymore.
 
2022-08-10 10:44:15 PM  

jaivirtualcard: HoratioGates: I understand why there are HOAs, and although I wouldn't want to live in one I can understand why someone might not want cars up on blocks, pink houses (in places where pink houses don't fit the natural color scheme... pink house in my town that is hideous, but I've seen them look great in the desert Southwest), but I'm not going to block you because I don't want restrictive rules on me.  Detente.

That said, any HOA that tries to block solar panels needs to just be straight up disbanded.

And the board members should be forced to live ferally down by the beach where they can experience global warming as their stick shelters are destroyed by every storm and wave.

Their spouses should be forced to live in grassy fields around solar panels, but never allowed to use the electricity they generate, or even take refuge in the shade under the panels.

And their children should be sold into slavery in the Middle East to help fund our appetite for foreign oil.

And their pets should be turned into biofuel.

And their houses should be given to homeless people, just to screw over the non-board member NIMBY's still in the neighborhood.

And their outhouses should have a copy of their HOA regulations, printed on 400 grit sandpaper, as the only toilet paper they are ever allowed to use.

/Sorry there.  Got a bit carried away.  I'm sure the pets are totally innocent.

Lol. Cracked me up. On another note what % of HOA's are actually useful. Are there even any?


We had one once where the yearly dues were less than $50 and all they did was stock the neighborhood pond with fish.

We also had one that tried to be busybodies about someone who kept several cars on their driveway, tried to sue, discovered in court that they had never filed the paperwork to be an actual HOA, and promptly ceased to exist.

Both great, but for different reasons.
 
2022-08-10 10:45:47 PM  

Incontinent_dog_and_monkey_rodeo: The lesser the amount of a person's authority, they more likely they are to abuse it.


upload.wikimedia.orgView Full Size


Or you know, the other way around too.

/it's okay, it's an excuse to drink
 
2022-08-10 10:46:19 PM  

waxbeans: Nosferartoo: Yet more evidence that HOA's are a shiat sandwich with no bread.

No. Their that sandwich that is toast between two pieces of 🍞.


That's too much bread.
 
2022-08-10 10:46:28 PM  
HOAs are unreasonable tools of petty dictatorship. NEVER move into a neighborhood with one. NEVER.

I'm knee-deep in a HOA hell right now that I can neither fight nor deny, forced to pay thousands of dollars for outdoor renovations I do not want, done by contractors I don't approve of, because the majority ruled and the rest of us have no choice but to comply. I am no longer in control of my own property, under thread of losing my home, and there's literally nothing I can do about it because of the HOA. And it's all 100% legal.
 
2022-08-10 10:48:29 PM  
HOAs can provide some degree of useful services as long as they're kept restricted.

Example:  Attached townhouses or condos with common building components.  HOAs basically are necessary.  Exterior maintenance of the roof, siding, and common spaces of the building is all handled by the HOA.  You call the mgmt office, they get the contractors and the work gets done, they pay the bill.  Heck, they even cover structural insurance for the building.  Yes, that comes out of the HOA budget that drives the monthly HOA fee.  But it's really a social contract.

Stand alone houses where you pay for all that out of pocket as needed?  Yeah, not so much.  That's just neighbors being assholes to each other.
 
2022-08-10 10:52:35 PM  
HOAs are silly. Essentially they turn your house into a condo by adding another layer of government and taxes (fees), so some places you have to follow Federal, State, County, Municipal, and HOA rules.

I think 3-4 levels of rules is more than enough.

If you do have the displeasure of living with an HOA, get yourself on the board and approve every variance and work to eradicate the HOA fees.
 
2022-08-10 10:52:56 PM  

2fardownthread: But beyond that, I will share that, during natural disasters or such events, the guy with the panels gets really popular. Some systems will only allow 1 kW or maybe 2 kW from a solar array if the grid goes down, but that can charge a lot of phones and it can cook hot food without open flames. It can boil water.


I have a 2 kW generator that cost me $200 from a friend, a 2 kW inverter to run off my car battery, and a Coleman white gas stove. Those things are about 1% the cost of a solar roof.
 
2022-08-10 11:03:25 PM  
I think there is a correlation between how much an HOA costs, and their tyrant level.
My mom moved to an hoa that cost like 1800 a year. She had a bay window with an *interior* lattice work that made it look like individual panes. She didn't like it, so she took it out so the it would look like a big window. It wasn't 4 hours before the head of the HOA came knocking and told her she had 24 hours to restore it, or she would be fined.
My brother lived at an HOA (600/y?) that required your trash cans to be in by 5pm on pickup day. Don't get home until 5:30, well then enjoy your fee. Though he managed to get himself on the board He did a lot of free handyman shiat for his neighbors and thus got himself elected president. He then stopped a lot of that bs, and then made it so unpaid fees were capped to $100 per year and they couldn't lien your house anymore, and then put in a requirement for 90% vote to overturn that bylaw. Then when he got tired of being president he stopped paying the HOA fees. He said "fark it, they can only put me in collections for 2 years of non payment, and if I send in like 50 bucks, it resets."

Meanwhile my HOA fee is $100 a year and they are chill. You can't leave your cans out over night, but my neighbors have had them out every day for 2 years now. I was two months late on the fees this year, (I forgot to pay it)  but I told them I was sorry and asked if they'd waive the late fees ($20) if I paid it now. They said sure, no prob. No one cares if you put solar panels in, or don't cut your grass for 3 weeks. You're supposed to get approval for improvements like drive ways and additions, but basically you just tell them what you're going to do, and they approve as long as it's code. I redid my stairs without asking, and no one said a word.

I'm actually looking at taking the secretary position this year, and found out if you're on the board, you don't have to pay the hoa fee. That's $100 a year right in my pocket!
 
2022-08-10 11:07:41 PM  

MythDragon: Incontinent_dog_and_monkey_rodeo: The lesser the amount of a person's authority, they more likely they are to abuse it.

[upload.wikimedia.org image 850x1076]

Or you know, the other way around too.

/it's okay, it's an excuse to drink


Guessing that's a deepfake or render. His skin colour is normal and he almost looks like a legit nice guy.
 
2022-08-10 11:10:25 PM  

mrmopar5287: I have a 2 kW generator that cost me $200 from a friend, a 2 kW inverter to run off my car battery, and a Coleman white gas stove. Those things are about 1% the cost of a solar roof.


2kw of solar would cost me about US$540 based on the last panels.  A new 2kw generator would cost me more than that.

I would love to find a cheap 2kw inverter that could be powered off the existing solar array but the cheap ones done like 400V.
 
2022-08-10 11:16:18 PM  
MythDragon: I think there is a correlation between how much an HOA costs, and their tyrant level.

Your screen name is appropriately taken.  While that's a noble thought, an HOA is actually an unrestricted liability against your property.  And you have precious few controls against a  process that's out of control.

What happened in our case was a spat over view-restrictions.  HOA moved against a homeowner, he sued.  He won, He should have applied for damages, but was nice: it was a four-year effort that turned homeowner against homeowner.

The cost: $1,000 per household.  It could have been four or five times that amount.

/Guess what: the loser board members sold their homes and bailed, right before the court decision against them.
 
2022-08-10 11:18:27 PM  

2fardownthread: The HOA quagmire is something I don't even want to get into. They should be excellent tools for community building. Enforcing rules should be 0.5% of their activity. They should derive authority by providing needed services, not by punishing people.


HOAs are, by definition, good in theory, bad in practice. Because 9 times out of 10, some power seeking asswipe busybody with a Napoleon/Karen complex winds up being the head of the HOA. That's why they go to hell so often.
 
2022-08-10 11:20:59 PM  
HOA HATE THREAD !
 
2022-08-10 11:22:00 PM  

brigid_fitch: WastrelWay: If you can afford to live where there is an HOA, you should be required to install solar panels.

HOAs don't always correlate with wealth. They can crop up in almost any neighborhood. If there is power to be had, a Karen will grab it. A friend's mother & a couple of her equally Karen-y neighbors just up and decided they were going to create their apartment building's HOA. It was in Belmar, NJ, just 3 blocks from the beach. They plied the other residents into accepting them by promising to keep the tourists from using their parking lot and gave the best parking spots to the residents they thought would oppose them.  Friend's mother & neighbors set up watch shifts for the parking lot and called a tow company the second someone who didn't live there parked. By the end of the summer, the other residents were more than happy to cede power to them.  The landlord even thanked them, since he didn't have to deal with parking lot calls ever again. By January, they were regretting that decision since this trio of Karens were as toxic and power-mad as you imagine them to be.  My friend moved out, just so he wouldn't have to deal with the dirty looks in the hallways and elevator anymore.


In other words HOAs is a way for grown-ups to bully other grown-ups. Look people want a pink house it's not my place to say. If there is a parking issue that's for the cops. The grass is getting too long: That's a county issue. If there needs to be plowed roads after a snow storm that's on the road commission.
 
2022-08-10 11:22:06 PM  

ansius: Did I miss something? The article states that the court sided with the homeowner and told the HOA to get knotted because their contract didn't explicitly regulate the installation of solar panels.

FTA:
"The use of residential solar panels was not specifically mentioned anywhere in the declaration," the document reads. "The declaration does not expressly prohibit the installation of solar panels ... this there is no restriction set forth in the declaration that prohibits or would have the effect of prohibiting the installation of solar panels."
As Energy News Network explains, the ruling reduces the chances a homeowner's request to install solar panels will be denied.

So the homeowners won.


I'm not sure what you're missing. That was what was in the article and the Fark headline, too.
 
2022-08-10 11:25:14 PM  

DON.MAC: Systems that don't have batteries don't provide any power when the grid goes down.


Show your work .
 
2022-08-10 11:26:51 PM  

mrmopar5287: 2fardownthread: But beyond that, I will share that, during natural disasters or such events, the guy with the panels gets really popular. Some systems will only allow 1 kW or maybe 2 kW from a solar array if the grid goes down, but that can charge a lot of phones and it can cook hot food without open flames. It can boil water.

I have a 2 kW generator that cost me $200 from a friend, a 2 kW inverter to run off my car battery, and a Coleman white gas stove. Those things are about 1% the cost of a solar roof.


I have a dual fuel generator that powers my entire home on an automatic transfer switch.  I'd still buy solar in an instant because it insulates you against any future disturbances in the price of electricity.  I haven't because I need to re-arrange some finances first, but solar generally pays off after about 20 years.  What I think the gov't should do is zero interest loans for solar/wind/etc, along with paying for the intellectual property on a couple of basic, easy-to-produce designs.  That way, everybody can get solar for basically whatever they're paying right now for electricity and the overall cost is way less because the components can be made to meet a given standard and ultra-mass produced.  Only problem is night time when the electric companies have you by the gonads.  Of course, usage should be lower at night, if cooling is the biggest use of electricity.
 
2022-08-10 11:28:09 PM  
I don't have the personality to live under an HOA. I won't wear a uniform. Why would I want my house and yard to?
 
2022-08-10 11:28:49 PM  

alice_600: brigid_fitch: WastrelWay: If you can afford to live where there is an HOA, you should be required to install solar panels.

HOAs don't always correlate with wealth. They can crop up in almost any neighborhood. If there is power to be had, a Karen will grab it. A friend's mother & a couple of her equally Karen-y neighbors just up and decided they were going to create their apartment building's HOA. It was in Belmar, NJ, just 3 blocks from the beach. They plied the other residents into accepting them by promising to keep the tourists from using their parking lot and gave the best parking spots to the residents they thought would oppose them.  Friend's mother & neighbors set up watch shifts for the parking lot and called a tow company the second someone who didn't live there parked. By the end of the summer, the other residents were more than happy to cede power to them.  The landlord even thanked them, since he didn't have to deal with parking lot calls ever again. By January, they were regretting that decision since this trio of Karens were as toxic and power-mad as you imagine them to be.  My friend moved out, just so he wouldn't have to deal with the dirty looks in the hallways and elevator anymore.

In other words HOAs is a way for grown-ups to bully other grown-ups. Look people want a pink house it's not my place to say. If there is a parking issue that's for the cops. The grass is getting too long: That's a county issue. If there needs to be plowed roads after a snow storm that's on the road commission.


Basically all the reasons people say there should be HOAs are code enforcement, which should be up to real elected officials anyway, not dipshiats on a condo board elected because they are the five retirees with an axe to grind against the neighborhood
 
2022-08-10 11:28:59 PM  

WastrelWay: If you can afford to live where there is an HOA, you should be required to install solar panels.


That's not entirely true at all.

A lot of mobile home parks even have HOAs.
 
2022-08-10 11:31:22 PM  

DON.MAC: mrmopar5287: I have a 2 kW generator that cost me $200 from a friend, a 2 kW inverter to run off my car battery, and a Coleman white gas stove. Those things are about 1% the cost of a solar roof.

2kw of solar would cost me about US$540 based on the last panels.  A new 2kw generator would cost me more than that.


How are you getting 2KW of solar for US $540? 320 watt panels are in the $400/ea range (a bit less if you buy multiples), but right now I'm looking at a 4 pack of 320 watt panels for $1435 on Amazon.

And of course, that's not 2KW anywhere near all the time, either.
 
2022-08-10 11:33:45 PM  

alienated: DON.MAC: Systems that don't have batteries don't provide any power when the grid goes down.

Show your work .


Grid connect inverters are required to not energize the network when there is no voltage on the gird. UL standard 1741 and 62109 in the US, IEC 62109 in EU and AS4777 downunder.

The reality is grid connect inverters need the grid A/C power to generate the 60 or 50 hz voltage sinewave.

Standalone systems will have batteries otherwise a single cloud could damage anything plugged into the inverter.
 
2022-08-10 11:36:42 PM  

ansius: Did I miss something? The article states that the court sided with the homeowner and told the HOA to get knotted because their contract didn't explicitly regulate the installation of solar panels.

FTA:
"The use of residential solar panels was not specifically mentioned anywhere in the declaration," the document reads. "The declaration does not expressly prohibit the installation of solar panels ... this there is no restriction set forth in the declaration that prohibits or would have the effect of prohibiting the installation of solar panels."
As Energy News Network explains, the ruling reduces the chances a homeowner's request to install solar panels will be denied.

So the homeowners won.


They were trying for a technicality. Even if the solar ban had been in the HOA agreement it would have been voided by a state law.

However, under the same state law HOAs are allowed to dictate the location of panels. So the HOA argued they could ban them being on the street facing roof. The defendants argued that effectively banned the panels because the rear roof didn't get enough useful sunlight.
 
2022-08-10 11:40:56 PM  

HoratioGates: I understand why there are HOAs, and although I wouldn't want to live in one I can understand why someone might not want cars up on blocks, pink houses (in places where pink houses don't fit the natural color scheme... pink house in my town that is hideous, but I've seen them look great in the desert Southwest), but I'm not going to block you because I don't want restrictive rules on me.  Detente.

That said, any HOA that tries to block solar panels needs to just be straight up disbanded.

And the board members should be forced to live ferally down by the beach where they can experience global warming as their stick shelters are destroyed by every storm and wave.

Their spouses should be forced to live in grassy fields around solar panels, but never allowed to use the electricity they generate, or even take refuge in the shade under the panels.

And their children should be sold into slavery in the Middle East to help fund our appetite for foreign oil.

And their pets should be turned into biofuel.

And their houses should be given to homeless people, just to screw over the non-board member NIMBY's still in the neighborhood.

And their outhouses should have a copy of their HOA regulations, printed on 400 grit sandpaper, as the only toilet paper they are ever allowed to use.

/Sorry there.  Got a bit carried away.  I'm sure the pets are totally innocent.


HOAs can be bad, I have horror stories and I never even lived in one but just inherited a shiatshow, but in reality HOAs are generally fine and cause no issues.  There are over 370,000 HOAs in the US.

The problem is like a lot of different things in the US, you hear the most outrageous cases but you never hear "Sunnyblock in suburbantown USA had another normal day without a power tripping asshole."

It's basically like any other thing in the US.  If you went off the media narrative kids are getting snatched off the street by random strangers.

Most HOAs are just fine.  Yes, technically they're one election away from some power tripping assholes ruining it, but so is our country and if non-assholes pay attention and participate it shouldn't be an issue.
 
2022-08-10 11:43:31 PM  

2fardownthread: They should derive authority by providing needed services, not by punishing people.


Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2022-08-10 11:44:57 PM  
A friend lived in an HOA neighborhood but happened to know the laws on that subject.  Some aspect of California law requiries HOAs to submit their bylaws for review to be valid.  Changing any aspect of the bylaws requires a review.  His HOA skipped that requirement when they made some changes, so none of their rules could be enforced.  They'd send him notice of violations (over petty shiat that no one cared about except the karens on the HOA board) and he's have his lawyer send them a fark off letter.  This went on for years.  They never got a dime of the fines they assessed.
 
2022-08-10 11:45:12 PM  

brigid_fitch: WastrelWay: If you can afford to live where there is an HOA, you should be required to install solar panels.

HOAs don't always correlate with wealth. They can crop up in almost any neighborhood. If there is power to be had, a Karen will grab it. A friend's mother & a couple of her equally Karen-y neighbors just up and decided they were going to create their apartment building's HOA. It was in Belmar, NJ, just 3 blocks from the beach. They plied the other residents into accepting them by promising to keep the tourists from using their parking lot and gave the best parking spots to the residents they thought would oppose them.  Friend's mother & neighbors set up watch shifts for the parking lot and called a tow company the second someone who didn't live there parked. By the end of the summer, the other residents were more than happy to cede power to them.  The landlord even thanked them, since he didn't have to deal with parking lot calls ever again. By January, they were regretting that decision since this trio of Karens were as toxic and power-mad as you imagine them to be.  My friend moved out, just so he wouldn't have to deal with the dirty looks in the hallways and elevator anymore.


Grew up near belmar.  No one in that area needs an HOA.  It just isn't a thing that's needed.  There or in general.  Sheesh.
 
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