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(Forbes)   Gird your loins, stay at home cryptobros   (forbes.com) divider line
    More: Amusing, Investment, Asset, crypto market crash, world's largest asset manager, institutional clients, major crypto exchange Coinbase, bitcoin price, institutional investors  
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1094 clicks; posted to Business » on 09 Aug 2022 at 8:52 AM (7 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2022-08-09 8:31:54 AM  
Good luck dumping your stuff, kids.
 
2022-08-09 8:55:36 AM  
content.artofmanliness.comView Full Size
 
hej
2022-08-09 8:56:37 AM  
What's $10T of Monopoly money?  Minus the value of a few thousand pounds of physical paper.
 
2022-08-09 9:26:00 AM  
If Blackrock is getting involved, it is too front run the common people's trades on Coinbase.
 
2022-08-09 9:31:04 AM  
Here's something I find really alarming about crypto:

It is heavily favored toward the early adopters. The ones who got into it 10 years ago. If you get in now, I suppose you might still make some money, but you won't become a whale making windfall fortunes like the early adopters. Each year there are diminishing returns with crypto mining and profit generation. It's getting tougher and tougher to generate a worthy ROI.

So what about people who get into it 10 years from now? 20? What about the people who aren't even alive yet but will want to get into crypto 30 years from now? How is it fair that they can't make massive profits from it simply because they were born too late to be an early adopter?

There doesn't seem to be a solve for this. The opportunity window to become a whale has already closed, so what is the incentive for any late adopters to get into crypto at all?
 
2022-08-09 9:41:03 AM  

Ishkur: There doesn't seem to be a solve for this. The opportunity window to become a whale has already closed, so what is the incentive for any late adopters to get into crypto at all?


Oppositional Defiant Disorder, FOMO, contrarianism, boredom, antisocial degeneracy.
 
2022-08-09 9:48:17 AM  

Ishkur: Here's something I find really alarming about crypto:

It is heavily favored toward the early adopters. The ones who got into it 10 years ago. If you get in now, I suppose you might still make some money, but you won't become a whale making windfall fortunes like the early adopters. Each year there are diminishing returns with crypto mining and profit generation. It's getting tougher and tougher to generate a worthy ROI.

So what about people who get into it 10 years from now? 20? What about the people who aren't even alive yet but will want to get into crypto 30 years from now? How is it fair that they can't make massive profits from it simply because they were born too late to be an early adopter?

There doesn't seem to be a solve for this. The opportunity window to become a whale has already closed, so what is the incentive for any late adopters to get into crypto at all?


Are you talking about crypto, or is this post a clever a critique of American Society at large?
 
2022-08-09 10:20:20 AM  
Given the overlap of cryptobros and incels, I doubt they will find many loins to gird.
 
2022-08-09 10:21:56 AM  
BlackRock has $10 Trillion in assets under management


the entire US GDP is about $24T      $10T is entirely too much wealth to be concentrated in a single set of hands.  Period
 
2022-08-09 10:32:16 AM  

Magorn: BlackRock has $10 Trillion in assets under management


the entire US GDP is about $24T      $10T is entirely too much wealth to be concentrated in a single set of hands.  Period


Big numbers are big. US housing is worth $43T and the market value of all traded stocks of US companies is about $100T.

Blackrock is still pretty damn big. Fidelity is around $4.5T and Schwab is around $8.
 
2022-08-09 10:39:30 AM  
Dogecoin is at 6 cents, how much swinging can it do?
 
2022-08-09 10:39:44 AM  

Ishkur: Here's something I find really alarming about crypto:

It is heavily favored toward the early adopters. The ones who got into it 10 years ago. If you get in now, I suppose you might still make some money, but you won't become a whale making windfall fortunes like the early adopters. Each year there are diminishing returns with crypto mining and profit generation. It's getting tougher and tougher to generate a worthy ROI.

So what about people who get into it 10 years from now? 20? What about the people who aren't even alive yet but will want to get into crypto 30 years from now? How is it fair that they can't make massive profits from it simply because they were born too late to be an early adopter?

There doesn't seem to be a solve for this. The opportunity window to become a whale has already closed, so what is the incentive for any late adopters to get into crypto at all?


I'm sure our friendly neighborhood OS-themed Crypto huckster will be along shortly to tell you how wrong you are.

And how wrong we all are. And how we hate the future and we're destined to die broke and ignorant.

Or something.
 
2022-08-09 10:43:55 AM  

Ishkur: Here's something I find really alarming about crypto:

It is heavily favored toward the early adopters. The ones who got into it 10 years ago. If you get in now, I suppose you might still make some money, but you won't become a whale making windfall fortunes like the early adopters. Each year there are diminishing returns with crypto mining and profit generation. It's getting tougher and tougher to generate a worthy ROI.

So what about people who get into it 10 years from now? 20? What about the people who aren't even alive yet but will want to get into crypto 30 years from now? How is it fair that they can't make massive profits from it simply because they were born too late to be an early adopter?

There doesn't seem to be a solve for this. The opportunity window to become a whale has already closed, so what is the incentive for any late adopters to get into crypto at all?


That's farking everything. Look at how much money you'd have if you had invested $10,000 in Apple Computer in 1995.

Hint: you'd have $4.7 million.

All things favor early adopters when it comes to investing.

Look at real estate. Someone with an acre of land in Manhattan on 57th Street right now would be sitting on billions of value.
 
2022-08-09 10:47:34 AM  
In finance generally, crypto or not, never ever put your $ in a system that requires it to be passed around between a bevy of different companies & money managers like this.

Each & every one of them will take their cut & eat away at your appreciation. They're leeches. Taxes & fees are the absolute devil. Minimize or eliminate them absolutely whenever & wherever you legally can.
 
2022-08-09 11:01:16 AM  

madgonad: Magorn: BlackRock has $10 Trillion in assets under management


the entire US GDP is about $24T      $10T is entirely too much wealth to be concentrated in a single set of hands.  Period

Big numbers are big. US housing is worth $43T and the market value of all traded stocks of US companies is about $100T.

Blackrock is still pretty damn big. Fidelity is around $4.5T and Schwab is around $8.


I don't see how that dollar amount is in "Blackrock's hands".  These are assets under management.  Their clients still own the money.  They can move it out.

Even moreso, Vanguard has $7.2T under management and the owners of that own Vanguard.
 
2022-08-09 11:02:50 AM  

Ishkur: Here's something I find really alarming about crypto:

It is heavily favored toward the early adopters. The ones who got into it 10 years ago. If you get in now, I suppose you might still make some money, but you won't become a whale making windfall fortunes like the early adopters. Each year there are diminishing returns with crypto mining and profit generation. It's getting tougher and tougher to generate a worthy ROI.

So what about people who get into it 10 years from now? 20? What about the people who aren't even alive yet but will want to get into crypto 30 years from now? How is it fair that they can't make massive profits from it simply because they were born too late to be an early adopter?

There doesn't seem to be a solve for this. The opportunity window to become a whale has already closed, so what is the incentive for any late adopters to get into crypto at all?


This is precisely why deflation is bad and that healthy economies try to have a moderate amount of inflation, so that you are incentivized to spend your money now while its worth more.
 
2022-08-09 11:06:33 AM  
I've just decided that I'm not going to pay attention to anything that didn't make any sense before about 1990.  There's really no reason to.  It's never about anything but sucking some money out of you.
 
2022-08-09 11:20:55 AM  

cryinoutloud: I've just decided that I'm not going to pay attention to anything that didn't make any sense before about 1990.  There's really no reason to.  It's never about anything but sucking some money out of you.


We look forward to no longer reading your posts on Fark.
 
2022-08-09 11:24:04 AM  

GregInIndy: In finance generally, crypto or not, never ever put your $ in a system that requires it to be passed around between a bevy of different companies & money managers like this.

Each & every one of them will take their cut & eat away at your appreciation. They're leeches. Taxes & fees are the absolute devil. Minimize or eliminate them absolutely whenever & wherever you legally can.


Great advice.  I am on it.

1.bp.blogspot.comView Full Size
 
2022-08-09 11:37:35 AM  

Ishkur: Here's something I find really alarming about crypto:

It is heavily favored toward the early adopters. The ones who got into it 10 years ago. If you get in now, I suppose you might still make some money, but you won't become a whale making windfall fortunes like the early adopters. Each year there are diminishing returns with crypto mining and profit generation. It's getting tougher and tougher to generate a worthy ROI.

So what about people who get into it 10 years from now? 20? What about the people who aren't even alive yet but will want to get into crypto 30 years from now? How is it fair that they can't make massive profits from it simply because they were born too late to be an early adopter?



Every innovation is heavily favored towards early adopters, at least if you want to make money.  $100 in apple stock at its IPO would is worth 68,000 today.  That doesn't stop late adopters from buying an iPhone or buying stock now for lesser profits.

Crypto will be the same way.  Bitcoin's price is designed to eventually stabilize and then beat inflation of fiat currencies.  It will become a financial instrument.  Ethereum will be similar, except probably more deflationary and work as the currency of smart applications.

Innovations either make early adopters a lot of money or they fizzle out.  Despite recent setbacks, the trajectory of crypto is still upward in the longer scale.
 
2022-08-09 12:43:41 PM  

Ishkur: Here's something I find really alarming about crypto:

So what about people who get into it 10 years from now? 20? What about the people who aren't even alive yet but will want to get into crypto 30 years from now? How is it fair that they can't make massive profits from it simply because they were born too late to be an early adopter?

If we

There doesn't seem to be a solve for this. The opportunity window to become a whale has already closed, so what is the incentive for any late adopters to get into crypto at all?


If we were talking about something tangible, not substitutable, and actually finite, like real estate, I would say you indeed are pointing out a huge problem.

However, you are talking about something created out of thin air, not tangible, and infinitely subsitutable with other crypto flavors created out of thin air.

In a hypothetical world where bitcoin has become progressivley more popular for the next 30 years and rewarded the early adopters more, what is to stop a class of people that feel wronged, or an imbalance in wealth (e.g. the young, or blue collar workers, or etc), from organizing and collectively saying "Screw this, we're moving to a new crypto space!"?

Nothing. Nothing would stop them. They would just need a charismatic leader, perhaps a celebrity, politician, or cultural figure, or perhaps memes and online momentum. Then they could start their OWN trend away to some other crypto that has just been created out of thin air, that is fairer for THEM.

And that is one of the MANY weaknesses of bitcoin, or any other deregulated. There is no reason it is any better than any other bullshiat crypto created out of thin air, except for mass psychology/support. Its not as if we are forced to pay taxes with any kind of crypto, receive government payment in any kind of crypto, regularly use any kind of crypto in daily transactions, etc, etc,

The only thing any deregulated crypto has is mass psychology. And there are countless examples of how mass psychology/support is VERY fickle over time.

Deregulated Crypto is just an idiotic game of "The Emperor's New Clothes". In a large crowd of idiot investors, nobody wants to be the first to say bitcoin or etc is completely naked, backed by nothing, because they're afraid they just might not understand something, and they already have too much vested in their beliefs.
 
2022-08-09 12:48:58 PM  

urethra_franklin: I'm sure our friendly neighborhood OS-themed Crypto huckster will be along shortly to tell you how wrong you are.

And how wrong we all are. And how we hate the future and we're destined to die broke and ignorant.

Or something.


'Murca.

/just filling in for now
 
2022-08-09 1:00:26 PM  

Lord Bear: Ishkur: Here's something I find really alarming about crypto:

Crypto will be the same way.  Bitcoin's price is designed to eventually stabilize and then beat inflation of fiat currencies.  It will become a financial instrument.  Ethereum will be similar, except probably more deflationary and work as the currency of smart applications.

$100 in apple stock at its IPO would is worth 68,000 today.


You sure have some nerve, comparing a laboriously built company over many decades - APPLE - to some crypto that was created out of thin air by software which can be duplicated by ANYBODY.

Innovations either make early adopters a lot of money or they fizzle out.

False dichotomy! You have never heard of an innovation that makes early adopters a lot of money AND THEN fizzles out? Or makes early adopters very little money, but continues surviving? Or etc.

Oh, I forgot. You insist on seeing the world on the way you want to, reality be damned. You don't have time for real logic.

Despite recent setbacks, the trajectory of crypto is still upward in the longer scale.

LOL! Wow, no part of all your handwaving leads to that conclusion. NONE of it.

"Handwaving. HANDWAVING! HaNdWaViNg! And so you see, that's why I'm an investment genius!"
 
2022-08-09 1:05:23 PM  

Flushing It All Away: Ishkur: Here's something I find really alarming about crypto:

It is heavily favored toward the early adopters. The ones who got into it 10 years ago. If you get in now, I suppose you might still make some money, but you won't become a whale making windfall fortunes like the early adopters. Each year there are diminishing returns with crypto mining and profit generation. It's getting tougher and tougher to generate a worthy ROI.

So what about people who get into it 10 years from now? 20? What about the people who aren't even alive yet but will want to get into crypto 30 years from now? How is it fair that they can't make massive profits from it simply because they were born too late to be an early adopter?

There doesn't seem to be a solve for this. The opportunity window to become a whale has already closed, so what is the incentive for any late adopters to get into crypto at all?

That's farking everything. Look at how much money you'd have if you had invested $10,000 in Apple Computer in 1995.

Hint: you'd have $4.7 million.

All things favor early adopters when it comes to investing.

Look at real estate. Someone with an acre of land in Manhattan on 57th Street right now would be sitting on billions of value.


Yes, but this is a currency.

A currency where the ones who start using it first get to own most of it.

Do you understand how economically broken that is for a medium of exchange?
 
2022-08-09 1:07:47 PM  

Lord Bear: Every innovation is heavily favored towards early adopters, at least if you want to make money. $100 in apple stock at its IPO would is worth 68,000 today. That doesn't stop late adopters from buying an iPhone or buying stock now for lesser profits.


We're talking about a currency. Something that you zealots believe will replace fiat money someday.

Do you understand how stupid and broken this setup is?
 
2022-08-09 1:28:05 PM  

Lord Bear: Bitcoin's price is designed to eventually stabilize


Bitcoin's price is entirely speculative.  The only number it can "stabilize" at is zero.  Anything else is... pull down the lap bar and enjoy the ride.
 
2022-08-09 1:43:53 PM  
Subby

You left out "*lazy sit at home crypto*stonk owner".

/thank you so much for the laugh
//had to clean the water snorted all over the phone
 
2022-08-09 2:08:14 PM  

ChibiDebuHage: Lord Bear: Ishkur: Here's something I find really alarming about crypto:

Crypto will be the same way.  Bitcoin's price is designed to eventually stabilize and then beat inflation of fiat currencies.  It will become a financial instrument.  Ethereum will be similar, except probably more deflationary and work as the currency of smart applications.

$100 in apple stock at its IPO would is worth 68,000 today.

You sure have some nerve, comparing a laboriously built company over many decades - APPLE - to some crypto that was created out of thin air by software which can be duplicated by ANYBODY.

Innovations either make early adopters a lot of money or they fizzle out.

False dichotomy! You have never heard of an innovation that makes early adopters a lot of money AND THEN fizzles out? Or makes early adopters very little money, but continues surviving? Or etc.

Oh, I forgot. You insist on seeing the world on the way you want to, reality be damned. You don't have time for real logic.

Despite recent setbacks, the trajectory of crypto is still upward in the longer scale.

LOL! Wow, no part of all your handwaving leads to that conclusion. NONE of it.

"Handwaving. HANDWAVING! HaNdWaViNg! And so you see, that's why I'm an investment genius!"


The majority of Apple's value, if P/E ratios mean anything, is the greater fool theory. The stock pays next to nothing in dividends, and while the stock buy backs have accelerated in recent years, there's nothing to say that will continue either.

Simply put, Apple stock makes money because of the theory that it's investors can sell it tomorrow for more than they paid today.

Investors don't get hardly any share of corporate profits at all and stocks like Amazon don't even pay dividends!
 
2022-08-09 2:10:36 PM  

Ishkur: Flushing It All Away: Ishkur: Here's something I find really alarming about crypto:

It is heavily favored toward the early adopters. The ones who got into it 10 years ago. If you get in now, I suppose you might still make some money, but you won't become a whale making windfall fortunes like the early adopters. Each year there are diminishing returns with crypto mining and profit generation. It's getting tougher and tougher to generate a worthy ROI.

So what about people who get into it 10 years from now? 20? What about the people who aren't even alive yet but will want to get into crypto 30 years from now? How is it fair that they can't make massive profits from it simply because they were born too late to be an early adopter?

There doesn't seem to be a solve for this. The opportunity window to become a whale has already closed, so what is the incentive for any late adopters to get into crypto at all?

That's farking everything. Look at how much money you'd have if you had invested $10,000 in Apple Computer in 1995.

Hint: you'd have $4.7 million.

All things favor early adopters when it comes to investing.

Look at real estate. Someone with an acre of land in Manhattan on 57th Street right now would be sitting on billions of value.

Yes, but this is a currency.

A currency where the ones who start using it first get to own most of it.

Do you understand how economically broken that is for a medium of exchange?


In they days when the dollar was backed by gold, it was the same. Those who held it held proof of tangible goods behind it. They only way to amass more of it, was to have gold.

The fact that we divorced ourselves from the gold standard doesn't mean that the maxim of "whomever has the gold, makes the rules" any less true.

Those who created any currency have always been the benefactors OF that currency. Whether it's USD, GBPs, or Zimbabwean Dollars.
 
2022-08-09 2:12:12 PM  

Ishkur: Lord Bear: Every innovation is heavily favored towards early adopters, at least if you want to make money. $100 in apple stock at its IPO would is worth 68,000 today. That doesn't stop late adopters from buying an iPhone or buying stock now for lesser profits.

We're talking about a currency. Something that you zealots believe will replace fiat money someday.

Do you understand how stupid and broken this setup is?


You sound like someone prior to the gold standard being abandoned saying there will always be something behind the money besides the full faith and credit of the US.

Who, btw, can print as much money as they want for any purpose at any time. Given how the GOP has been playing chicken with the default train over the last decade, it's not as strong of a bet as it may have been in the Regan era.
 
2022-08-09 2:13:25 PM  

Olympic Trolling Judge: Lord Bear: Bitcoin's price is designed to eventually stabilize

Bitcoin's price is entirely speculative.  The only number it can "stabilize" at is zero.  Anything else is... pull down the lap bar and enjoy the ride.


If you take any look at the stock markets P/E ratio, you'd come up with the same answer too.

Hell, look at AMC, BBY, or any other meme stock in recent years. The price paid for a share of a sompany hasn't related to the profitability or the dividend return in decades.
 
2022-08-09 2:19:01 PM  

Flushing It All Away: In they days when the dollar was backed by gold, it was the same.


NO! It wasn't! If it was it wouldn't farking work as a currency.

The point of money is to change hands -- it's supposed to be spent. That's how economies work. If only a few people hold all the money and they don't spend it, then it is functionally useless as a medium of exchange.
 
2022-08-09 2:20:09 PM  

Flushing It All Away: You sound like someone prior to the gold standard being abandoned saying there will always be something behind the money besides the full faith and credit of the US.


I read this statement three times and I have not the foggiest farking clue what you're trying to say.
 
2022-08-09 2:23:04 PM  

Rapmaster2000: madgonad: Magorn: BlackRock has $10 Trillion in assets under management


the entire US GDP is about $24T      $10T is entirely too much wealth to be concentrated in a single set of hands.  Period

Big numbers are big. US housing is worth $43T and the market value of all traded stocks of US companies is about $100T.

Blackrock is still pretty damn big. Fidelity is around $4.5T and Schwab is around $8.

I don't see how that dollar amount is in "Blackrock's hands".  These are assets under management.  Their clients still own the money.  They can move it out.

Even moreso, Vanguard has $7.2T under management and the owners of that own Vanguard.


Well, a big chunk of Blackwater is private equity. Rich people and other firms give Blackrock money and they buy up companies and make money from their operation (or destruction).
The rest of it is just managing retirement accounts, which I'm sure are focused on Blackrock managed funds - so they get a lot of fund management fees.
 
2022-08-09 2:28:42 PM  

Flushing It All Away: Olympic Trolling Judge: Lord Bear: Bitcoin's price is designed to eventually stabilize

Bitcoin's price is entirely speculative.  The only number it can "stabilize" at is zero.  Anything else is... pull down the lap bar and enjoy the ride.

If you take any look at the stock markets P/E ratio, you'd come up with the same answer too.

Hell, look at AMC, BBY, or any other meme stock in recent years. The price paid for a share of a sompany hasn't related to the profitability or the dividend return in decades.


Not really. Companies hold all kinds of assets. Some assets create predictable income flow - like Verizon. Other assets are more developmental. Tesla doesn't show much income, but they have a pretty high value due to their position in the market and goodwill (they still have some). Other companies just own a whole lot of valuable IP, so while they may not show much current income they are worth a lot.

However, crypto is not a business or entity. It is a digital asset. So it has as much value as somebody will pay for the digital asset. Really no different from Warcraft Gold, accept you can actually use the gold in the game and enjoy the benefit of it.
 
2022-08-09 2:29:18 PM  
Always remember, a crypto enthusiast needs you to put actual dollars into crypto so their crypto can be exchanged for more actual dollars.

A crypto skeptic has nothing to gain or lose by you doing such a thing.
 
2022-08-09 2:53:22 PM  

Rapmaster2000: Always remember, a crypto enthusiast needs you to put actual dollars into crypto so their crypto can be exchanged for more actual dollars.

A crypto skeptic has nothing to gain or lose by you doing such a thing.


I have zero actual dollars I've put into crypto. All the crypto I have is from unused or idle computer equipment that does me work while I do an actual job.

I've made tens of thousands of dollars (in 2020 and 2021, I made enough to cover my $3000/month condo dues) with stuff I already owned and stuff I already pay for.

It's great in the winter because I just use my computer as a space heater instead of the electric resistance heating my PTAC uses. In the summer? My rig sits on the fire ledge costing me nothing to keep it cool.

It's less profitable today, but the hardware is all purchased (with crypto, no less), and I hit ROI after only 3 months.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯
 
2022-08-09 2:54:03 PM  

madgonad: Flushing It All Away: Olympic Trolling Judge: Lord Bear: Bitcoin's price is designed to eventually stabilize

Bitcoin's price is entirely speculative.  The only number it can "stabilize" at is zero.  Anything else is... pull down the lap bar and enjoy the ride.

If you take any look at the stock markets P/E ratio, you'd come up with the same answer too.

Hell, look at AMC, BBY, or any other meme stock in recent years. The price paid for a share of a sompany hasn't related to the profitability or the dividend return in decades.

Not really. Companies hold all kinds of assets. Some assets create predictable income flow - like Verizon. Other assets are more developmental. Tesla doesn't show much income, but they have a pretty high value due to their position in the market and goodwill (they still have some). Other companies just own a whole lot of valuable IP, so while they may not show much current income they are worth a lot.

However, crypto is not a business or entity. It is a digital asset. So it has as much value as somebody will pay for the digital asset. Really no different from Warcraft Gold, accept you can actually use the gold in the game and enjoy the benefit of it.


As a stockholder, your rights to those assets are between fark all and none. Just ask anyone holding GM stock after 2008.
 
2022-08-09 2:58:28 PM  

Ishkur: Flushing It All Away: You sound like someone prior to the gold standard being abandoned saying there will always be something behind the money besides the full faith and credit of the US.

I read this statement three times and I have not the foggiest farking clue what you're trying to say.


The value of the US dollar, or hell, any currency, is just a game of who will accept it and for how much.

I work in construction and now that the dollar and Euro are essentially at parity, my cost to buy things on the continent is far, far less today than it was even a year ago.

So, if a $100,000 shipment of marble a year ago was $120,000 of marble, where did that $20,000 come from and where did it go?

PS, I can't buy Italian marble in USD. I have to buy it in Euro. So what's the functional difference if I have to buy something in BTC. The reference to USD doesn't exist in Europe and it sure as hell doesn't exist on the crypto sites that sell goods and services people buy (like video cards and mining equipment or computer processing time).
 
2022-08-09 3:00:27 PM  

Ishkur: Flushing It All Away: In they days when the dollar was backed by gold, it was the same.

NO! It wasn't! If it was it wouldn't farking work as a currency.

The point of money is to change hands -- it's supposed to be spent. That's how economies work. If only a few people hold all the money and they don't spend it, then it is functionally useless as a medium of exchange.


No, the point of money is whatever the holder of it wants it to be. If I want to insulate the walls of my apartment with USD, that's my prerogative.

PS., My goal in life is to spend as little of the money I earn as I possibly can to pass along to the next generation in my family. I don't mind. It's the immigrant way.

You win the game by having the highest score. You don't win the game by spending down your high score.
 
2022-08-09 3:03:07 PM  

Flushing It All Away: Rapmaster2000: Always remember, a crypto enthusiast needs you to put actual dollars into crypto so their crypto can be exchanged for more actual dollars.

A crypto skeptic has nothing to gain or lose by you doing such a thing.

I have zero actual dollars I've put into crypto. All the crypto I have is from unused or idle computer equipment that does me work while I do an actual job.

I've made tens of thousands of dollars (in 2020 and 2021, I made enough to cover my $3000/month condo dues) with stuff I already owned and stuff I already pay for.

It's great in the winter because I just use my computer as a space heater instead of the electric resistance heating my PTAC uses. In the summer? My rig sits on the fire ledge costing me nothing to keep it cool.

It's less profitable today, but the hardware is all purchased (with crypto, no less), and I hit ROI after only 3 months.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯


So just to be clear, you own crypto and if we don't believe in crypto, your crypto will be worth less actual dollars.
 
2022-08-09 3:10:16 PM  

Flushing It All Away: As a stockholder, your rights to those assets are between fark all and none. Just ask anyone holding GM stock after 2008.


Equity--that is, stonks--equals assets plus liabilities.  If you wanted to cash out Old GM's assets, you'd also be on the hook for its liabilities, which were significantly greater.  Zeroing out the stockholders is the nicest thing they could have done.
 
2022-08-09 3:15:44 PM  

Rapmaster2000: Flushing It All Away: Rapmaster2000: Always remember, a crypto enthusiast needs you to put actual dollars into crypto so their crypto can be exchanged for more actual dollars.

A crypto skeptic has nothing to gain or lose by you doing such a thing.

I have zero actual dollars I've put into crypto. All the crypto I have is from unused or idle computer equipment that does me work while I do an actual job.

I've made tens of thousands of dollars (in 2020 and 2021, I made enough to cover my $3000/month condo dues) with stuff I already owned and stuff I already pay for.

It's great in the winter because I just use my computer as a space heater instead of the electric resistance heating my PTAC uses. In the summer? My rig sits on the fire ledge costing me nothing to keep it cool.

It's less profitable today, but the hardware is all purchased (with crypto, no less), and I hit ROI after only 3 months.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

So just to be clear, you own crypto and if we don't believe in crypto, your crypto will be worth less actual dollars.


I could care less what it's worth in dollars just like I don't care what a dumpling in China is worth in dollars.

1 BTC is worth 1 BTC, just like 1 RMB is worth 1 RMB and 1 Euro is worth 1 Euro.

Whatever the exchange rates are doesn't really matter if the product or service you buy is priced in the local currency.

PS., People in China don't find it funny when you try to buy things in USD. I'm sure you people feel the same way when I try to buy something in BTC. It's cool. Don't use it. I don't use AUDs or buy anything from Australia, so the exchange rate doesn't really matter much at all to me.
 
2022-08-09 3:17:27 PM  

Flushing It All Away: Ishkur: Flushing It All Away: In they days when the dollar was backed by gold, it was the same.

NO! It wasn't! If it was it wouldn't farking work as a currency.

The point of money is to change hands -- it's supposed to be spent. That's how economies work. If only a few people hold all the money and they don't spend it, then it is functionally useless as a medium of exchange.

No, the point of money is whatever the holder of it wants it to be. If I want to insulate the walls of my apartment with USD, that's my prerogative.

PS., My goal in life is to spend as little of the money I earn as I possibly can to pass along to the next generation in my family. I don't mind. It's the immigrant way.

You win the game by having the highest score. You don't win the game by spending down your high score.


Dude, the community of people who post in Business tab threads is relatively small. Were we supposed to already forget your $2200 first class tickets from the recent airline threads where you insulted anyone who chooses to fly economy class?

Don't change your story now!

You've also confused "the point of money" with "things I am theoretically able to do with money."
 
2022-08-09 3:17:55 PM  

Flushing It All Away: Rapmaster2000: Always remember, a crypto enthusiast needs you to put actual dollars into crypto so their crypto can be exchanged for more actual dollars.

A crypto skeptic has nothing to gain or lose by you doing such a thing.

I have zero actual dollars I've put into crypto. All the crypto I have is from unused or idle computer equipment that does me work while I do an actual job.

I've made tens of thousands of dollars (in 2020 and 2021, I made enough to cover my $3000/month condo dues) with stuff I already owned and stuff I already pay for.

It's great in the winter because I just use my computer as a space heater instead of the electric resistance heating my PTAC uses. In the summer? My rig sits on the fire ledge costing me nothing to keep it cool.

It's less profitable today, but the hardware is all purchased (with crypto, no less), and I hit ROI after only 3 months.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯


Username (which is only a few months old) checks out.
 
2022-08-09 3:18:01 PM  

Flushing It All Away: The stock pays next to nothing in dividends


The interesting thing about dividends is that numerous companies continually raise them.  At the share price I purchased MSFT for in 2017, my current yield is 2.5% vs. the 0.62% it is at today's price.  Things change fast.

That's still pretty measly you might say.  While my return is only 331% from that time, if you include reinvested dividends it rises to 399%.

While I could have gotten instantly rich overnight on Dogecoin, there are currently over 1,700 dead coins.  I'd rather not hold the next one of those.

As a shareholder of MSFT, I don't want you to buy shares of MSFT.  If it fell to $10, I'd be making nearly a 10% dividend.  So please, don't buy stocks.  That's the difference between crypto people and non crypto people.
 
2022-08-09 3:19:53 PM  

Flushing It All Away: 1 BTC is worth 1 BTC


If that's true, why won't crypto people shut up about the tens of thousands of US Dollars they've made with BTC?
 
2022-08-09 3:19:59 PM  

Ishkur: s, but this is a currency.
A currency where the ones who start using it first get to own most of it.
Do you understand how economically broken that is for a medium of exchange?


It's a cryptocurrency.  Cryptocurrencies are not strictly currencies.  While they can be used like a currency they do things that traditional currencies are not capable of.

Not understanding that simple fact is a huge failure of most of the fark naysayers like yourself.  And even if the top 1% own 95% of the wealth, its no different than what we currently have.


Olympic Trolling Judge: Bitcoin's price is entirely speculative. The only number it can "stabilize" at is zero. Anything else is... pull down the lap bar and enjoy the ride.


As compared to what?  Over the long term fiat currencies hit 0 too.  The USD is worth less than 5% of where it was 100 years ago.  And that is by design.  Bitcoin is designed to hold value in the long term as its inflation rate is much lower and can't be changed.

If the demand for bitcoin is the same in 100 years as it is now, its buying power will be the same.  If that number grows, the buying power grows.  1 USD will have the buying power of a nickel in 100 years.

Bitcoin's price can stabilize if it becomes a more global asset class.  With enough investors and users the price gets more stable as it gets more distributed.  It's volatility is already 50% lower than it was 5 years ago. In time it can get as stable as any other world currency.
 
2022-08-09 3:21:33 PM  

Eddie Hazel's E string: Flushing It All Away: Ishkur: Flushing It All Away: In they days when the dollar was backed by gold, it was the same.

NO! It wasn't! If it was it wouldn't farking work as a currency.

The point of money is to change hands -- it's supposed to be spent. That's how economies work. If only a few people hold all the money and they don't spend it, then it is functionally useless as a medium of exchange.

No, the point of money is whatever the holder of it wants it to be. If I want to insulate the walls of my apartment with USD, that's my prerogative.

PS., My goal in life is to spend as little of the money I earn as I possibly can to pass along to the next generation in my family. I don't mind. It's the immigrant way.

You win the game by having the highest score. You don't win the game by spending down your high score.

Dude, the community of people who post in Business tab threads is relatively small. Were we supposed to already forget your $2200 first class tickets from the recent airline threads where you insulted anyone who chooses to fly economy class?

Don't change your story now!

You've also confused "the point of money" with "things I am theoretically able to do with money."


$2200 for business class tickets doesn't really mean much when compared to the shiat service you get in cattle class. That flight was paid for almost entirely on money I earned from paying my taxes and condo fees (free credit card processors to maximize your spending power is something to take advantage of).

You can have both. Be a Penny pincher on most but pay for what you value.

I'm sure I could buy a nice home in Ohio for 1/10th the cost of my apartment, but the opportunity cost of doing so negates any benefit from doing so.
 
2022-08-09 3:25:45 PM  

Rapmaster2000: Flushing It All Away: The stock pays next to nothing in dividends

The interesting thing about dividends is that numerous companies continually raise them.  At the share price I purchased MSFT for in 2017, my current yield is 2.5% vs. the 0.62% it is at today's price.  Things change fast.

That's still pretty measly you might say.  While my return is only 331% from that time, if you include reinvested dividends it rises to 399%.

While I could have gotten instantly rich overnight on Dogecoin, there are currently over 1,700 dead coins.  I'd rather not hold the next one of those.

As a shareholder of MSFT, I don't want you to buy shares of MSFT.  If it fell to $10, I'd be making nearly a 10% dividend.  So please, don't buy stocks.  That's the difference between crypto people and non crypto people.


Who said I didn't buy stocks? Crypto is something I do for fun arbitraging idle computer hardware and low cost electricity into economically advantageous proof of work tokens.

The percentage value of my portfolio is mostly in real estate at this point (because you be stupid not to in this city) with a significant amount held stocks and bonds. Crypto represents maybe 1% of my total net worth and I'm not looking to convert it into another asset class ... maybe ever.
 
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