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(Metro)   "Kids are so expensive I had to quit my job"   (metro.co.uk) divider line
    More: Sad, Parental leave, Maternity, years of good work relationships, months of statutory maternity leave, full-time childcare options, Leave, regular pay, home parent  
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5440 clicks; posted to Main » and Politics » on 03 Jul 2022 at 1:50 PM (6 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2022-07-03 9:07:59 AM  
Birth control is free at the health department.
 
2022-07-03 9:24:32 AM  
Welcome to a decade ago, article writer.
 
2022-07-03 10:03:24 AM  

kittyhas1000legs: Welcome to a decade ago, article writer.


Or two or three.

It's the same as it ever was. Considered women's work, and therefore undervalued and almost always underpaid.

I don't think my kids would have lived to grow up if I hadn't found the great daycare provider I did, and as it turned out, that man (yes, man) has been an angel to me for nearly 30 years.

I bow down only to teachers and daycare providers.
 
2022-07-03 10:12:14 AM  
All the Nordic countries and Northern Europe child care is free or heavily subsided. Most start at age 2-3 (after paid family leave time) to be free to the parents and are staffed with trained child support personal with a majority with a degree in  child development.
 
2022-07-03 10:46:52 AM  

Cafe Threads: kittyhas1000legs: Welcome to a decade ago, article writer.

Or two or three.

It's the same as it ever was. Considered women's work, and therefore undervalued and almost always underpaid.

I don't think my kids would have lived to grow up if I hadn't found the great daycare provider I did, and as it turned out, that man (yes, man) has been an angel to me for nearly 30 years.

I bow down only to teachers and daycare providers.


I became a stay at home dad for a year when we figured out that it was cheaper for me to do that and work weekends than send my son off to daycare.

I loved doing that. House was in order, got to bond, wasn't stressed or angry as I was at my old position. Had to go back a year later but went on to a better job within a year.

I'll admit we lucked out though. More should be done to let people work and not be on the brink of poverty.

Now it's just my son and me. I'm lucky I can qualify for financial aid on his before/after school program and day camp. I look forward to the day he can just go home while I finish up at work
 
2022-07-03 11:44:22 AM  
FTFA: '... it wasn't until I fell pregnant with our daughter...'

Fell pregnant?! You make it sound like an accident... oh wait. Yeah maybe you shouldn't have more kids if you can't afford them?
 
2022-07-03 12:12:17 PM  
Are there no prisons? Are there no workhouses?
 
2022-07-03 12:50:00 PM  

tfresh: FTFA: '... it wasn't until I fell pregnant with our daughter...'

Fell pregnant?! You make it sound like an accident... oh wait. Yeah maybe you shouldn't have more kids if you can't afford them?


You'll get plenty of bites, congrats.
 
2022-07-03 1:17:54 PM  

Mugato: tfresh: FTFA: '... it wasn't until I fell pregnant with our daughter...'

Fell pregnant?! You make it sound like an accident... oh wait. Yeah maybe you shouldn't have more kids if you can't afford them?

You'll get plenty of bites, congrats.


You didn't say I was wrong so 👍 that's improvement.
 
2022-07-03 1:47:13 PM  

eurotrader: All the Nordic countries and Northern Europe child care is free or heavily subsided. Most start at age 2-3 (after paid family leave time) to be free to the parents and are staffed with trained child support personal with a majority with a degree in  child development.


Free universal child care in the US would be almost as big as free universal healthcare, in terms of benefits to the working poor.  In addition to creating jobs, you free up a lot of people who are able to work but can't afford the child care.
 
2022-07-03 1:49:56 PM  

TomFooolery: eurotrader: All the Nordic countries and Northern Europe child care is free or heavily subsided. Most start at age 2-3 (after paid family leave time) to be free to the parents and are staffed with trained child support personal with a majority with a degree in  child development.

Free universal child care in the US would be almost as big as free universal healthcare, in terms of benefits to the working poor.  In addition to creating jobs, you free up a lot of people who are able to work but can't afford the child care.


Wouldn't it be a lot easier (and better) to pay stay at home parents to care for their own, leaving the child care providers to get other jobs?
 
2022-07-03 1:55:35 PM  

cherryl taggart: Birth control is free at the health department.


For now.
 
2022-07-03 1:56:45 PM  

TomFooolery: eurotrader: All the Nordic countries and Northern Europe child care is free or heavily subsided. Most start at age 2-3 (after paid family leave time) to be free to the parents and are staffed with trained child support personal with a majority with a degree in  child development.

Free universal child care in the US would be almost as big as free universal healthcare, in terms of benefits to the working poor.  In addition to creating jobs, you free up a lot of people who are able to work but can't afford the child care.


NO THAT'S SOCIALISM
 
2022-07-03 1:58:08 PM  
Get a better job and the ultimate luxury: a stay at home husband.
 
2022-07-03 1:58:29 PM  
not sure how this is worth featuring (obvs on fark doesn't need to meet the threshold of 'news'), and the metro is trash...

but, childcare is insanely expensive in this country.  unless you have family willing to do it for free, or you don't mind parking your kid basically in glorified dog kennels, your earning potential needs to be really quite high, for it to be worth you going back to work.

some ppl do it anyway, taking a slight financial hit, else otherwise they'd go mad.  don't blame em.
 
2022-07-03 1:58:30 PM  
But nobody is Forcing you to have childre--- oh wait.....
 
2022-07-03 2:01:03 PM  
And the thread has already been shat on by the "cLoSe yOuR LeGs!" crowd.
 
2022-07-03 2:01:25 PM  
I was working within a large company, keen to progress quickly and making career development plans with management so that I could have a clear path to follow.

That's rich.
 
2022-07-03 2:02:49 PM  
I remember watching part of a TV show about budgeting. The expert sat down with the family and did the math on everything. If the mom quit and started cooking from scratch meals and other time consuming but cheaper ways to do thing, they would be ahead.
 
2022-07-03 2:03:13 PM  

TomFooolery: eurotrader: All the Nordic countries and Northern Europe child care is free or heavily subsided. Most start at age 2-3 (after paid family leave time) to be free to the parents and are staffed with trained child support personal with a majority with a degree in  child development.

Free universal child care in the US would be almost as big as free universal healthcare, in terms of benefits to the working poor.  In addition to creating jobs, you free up a lot of people who are able to work but can't afford the child care.


It's not "free" - someone has to pay for it.

There are 23.4 million kids in the US aged 0-5.  If we need to spend $20K on each of them, that's $468 billion.

The federal budget is something in the neighborhood of $4.5 trillion.  So this would be 10% of our federal budget right there.

(And you can go ahead and double that to get the actual cost because we're going to have to administer the program and have various layers of bureaucracy involved.)
 
2022-07-03 2:04:18 PM  
Child care...$1500 per month.  22 work days, so $68 per day?
$8.50 an hour?
I know it's a big bill and I'm not saying it's right, but how could one expect to pay less than $8/hr for child care?
 
2022-07-03 2:04:49 PM  
Good thing Elon has $100 billion. Based on his latest Twitter posts, I can tell it's an efficient allocation of resources
 
2022-07-03 2:05:49 PM  

covfefe: TomFooolery: eurotrader: All the Nordic countries and Northern Europe child care is free or heavily subsided. Most start at age 2-3 (after paid family leave time) to be free to the parents and are staffed with trained child support personal with a majority with a degree in  child development.

Free universal child care in the US would be almost as big as free universal healthcare, in terms of benefits to the working poor.  In addition to creating jobs, you free up a lot of people who are able to work but can't afford the child care.

Wouldn't it be a lot easier (and better) to pay stay at home parents to care for their own, leaving the child care providers to get other jobs?


No.
Republicans are already trying to eliminate public education and paying people to stay home with children past 2 years of paid family leave after the child is born would make that worse. The biggest thing providing childcare at a highly subsided including free for low wage earners  manner is the providers could be paid a wage reflecting the education and qualifications they should have to do the job. Working in childcare is currently similar to CNA in health care no education or training is required and the pay is generally below a living wage and both have a direct impact on the quality of care a child or patient receive.
 
2022-07-03 2:05:53 PM  

IDisposable: TomFooolery: eurotrader: All the Nordic countries and Northern Europe child care is free or heavily subsided. Most start at age 2-3 (after paid family leave time) to be free to the parents and are staffed with trained child support personal with a majority with a degree in  child development.

Free universal child care in the US would be almost as big as free universal healthcare, in terms of benefits to the working poor.  In addition to creating jobs, you free up a lot of people who are able to work but can't afford the child care.

It's not "free" - someone has to pay for it.

There are 23.4 million kids in the US aged 0-5.  If we need to spend $20K on each of them, that's $468 billion.

The federal budget is something in the neighborhood of $4.5 trillion.  So this would be 10% of our federal budget right there.

(And you can go ahead and double that to get the actual cost because we're going to have to administer the program and have various layers of bureaucracy involved.)


America: We're exceptional and NUMBER 1!

Also America: we can't do that thing that makes their country so much nicer, it's too haaaaaaard.
 
2022-07-03 2:07:26 PM  
£1500 a month is cheap for two full time kids. We pay nearly that just for one part time.
 
2022-07-03 2:09:29 PM  

tfresh: FTFA: '... it wasn't until I fell pregnant with our daughter...'

Fell pregnant?! You make it sound like an accident... oh wait. Yeah maybe you shouldn't have more kids if you can't afford them?


...and then I took an arrow to the womb.
 
2022-07-03 2:10:39 PM  
Woman shocked and dismayed that it makes maximal economical sense for her to raise her children full-time while her husband works outside the home. This is just like The Handmaid's Tale!
 
2022-07-03 2:10:48 PM  
Remove child labor restrictions and put those kids to work.
 
2022-07-03 2:12:31 PM  
I remember during the 09 meltdown they had those reality shows where they showed people's finances and how to trim the fat from them. A lot of them showed that they made more on one income since a least one parents pay went to childcare. It was cheaper to have a parent at home taking care of the kids.
 
2022-07-03 2:14:49 PM  

covfefe: TomFooolery: eurotrader: All the Nordic countries and Northern Europe child care is free or heavily subsided. Most start at age 2-3 (after paid family leave time) to be free to the parents and are staffed with trained child support personal with a majority with a degree in  child development.

Free universal child care in the US would be almost as big as free universal healthcare, in terms of benefits to the working poor.  In addition to creating jobs, you free up a lot of people who are able to work but can't afford the child care.

Wouldn't it be a lot easier (and better) to pay stay at home parents to care for their own, leaving the child care providers to get other jobs?


If we pay them, they better do a good job raising the spawn to government standards.  And we should create stamdards.

If they want to raise them how they want, they can do it on their own dime.  Want to raise the child with religion?  Do it on your own dime.

And we should be able to choose who spawns on the government dime.  Spawning with a ex con?  Do it on your own dime.
 
2022-07-03 2:15:26 PM  

whatisaidwas: Child care...$1500 per month.  22 work days, so $68 per day?
$8.50 an hour?
I know it's a big bill and I'm not saying it's right, but how could one expect to pay less than $8/hr for child care?


Daycare teachers often care for more than one child at once. Which is how my older kid's daycare is less than $1500/month.
 
2022-07-03 2:15:31 PM  

IDisposable: TomFooolery: eurotrader: All the Nordic countries and Northern Europe child care is free or heavily subsided. Most start at age 2-3 (after paid family leave time) to be free to the parents and are staffed with trained child support personal with a majority with a degree in  child development.

Free universal child care in the US would be almost as big as free universal healthcare, in terms of benefits to the working poor.  In addition to creating jobs, you free up a lot of people who are able to work but can't afford the child care.

It's not "free" - someone has to pay for it.

There are 23.4 million kids in the US aged 0-5.  If we need to spend $20K on each of them, that's $468 billion.

The federal budget is something in the neighborhood of $4.5 trillion.  So this would be 10% of our federal budget right there.

(And you can go ahead and double that to get the actual cost because we're going to have to administer the program and have various layers of bureaucracy involved.)


How about cut the military budget and close corporate tax loopholes and bailouts?  Then it can be done.
 
2022-07-03 2:18:05 PM  

drunk_bouncnbaloruber: IDisposable: TomFooolery: eurotrader: All the Nordic countries and Northern Europe child care is free or heavily subsided. Most start at age 2-3 (after paid family leave time) to be free to the parents and are staffed with trained child support personal with a majority with a degree in  child development.

Free universal child care in the US would be almost as big as free universal healthcare, in terms of benefits to the working poor.  In addition to creating jobs, you free up a lot of people who are able to work but can't afford the child care.

It's not "free" - someone has to pay for it.

There are 23.4 million kids in the US aged 0-5.  If we need to spend $20K on each of them, that's $468 billion.

The federal budget is something in the neighborhood of $4.5 trillion.  So this would be 10% of our federal budget right there.

(And you can go ahead and double that to get the actual cost because we're going to have to administer the program and have various layers of bureaucracy involved.)

How about cut the military budget and close corporate tax loopholes and bailouts?  Then it can be done.


Lets get Biden to propose cutting the military budget.  And get pelosi and harris to back him.  And do the same with corperate tax loopholes

How will that go with the elites that donate money to them?

Aint none of that gonna happen.  Politicians like when elites give them money.
 
2022-07-03 2:20:18 PM  

little big man: I was working within a large company, keen to progress quickly and making career development plans with management so that I could have a clear path to follow.

That's rich.


Seriously. I did the math and she makes minimum wage, assuming the numbers mentioned are accurate.

I'm a bleeding heart liberal but I also believe in personal responsibility. I'll withhold further comment.
 
2022-07-03 2:21:03 PM  

tfresh: FTFA: '... it wasn't until I fell pregnant with our daughter...'

Fell pregnant?! You make it sound like an accident... oh wait. Yeah maybe you shouldn't have more kids if you can't afford them?


British. I'm just here to see who didn't figure out this isn't about the USA.
 
2022-07-03 2:22:51 PM  

drunk_bouncnbaloruber: IDisposable: TomFooolery: eurotrader: All the Nordic countries and Northern Europe child care is free or heavily subsided. Most start at age 2-3 (after paid family leave time) to be free to the parents and are staffed with trained child support personal with a majority with a degree in  child development.

Free universal child care in the US would be almost as big as free universal healthcare, in terms of benefits to the working poor.  In addition to creating jobs, you free up a lot of people who are able to work but can't afford the child care.

It's not "free" - someone has to pay for it.

There are 23.4 million kids in the US aged 0-5.  If we need to spend $20K on each of them, that's $468 billion.

The federal budget is something in the neighborhood of $4.5 trillion.  So this would be 10% of our federal budget right there.

(And you can go ahead and double that to get the actual cost because we're going to have to administer the program and have various layers of bureaucracy involved.)

How about cut the military budget and close corporate tax loopholes and bailouts?  Then it can be done.


There is no excuse for the richest country on Earth not "being able" to afford taking care of its citizens. If other countries can do it with less money, then there's no reason we can't with more.
 
2022-07-03 2:23:27 PM  
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2022-07-03 2:23:27 PM  

thurstonxhowell: whatisaidwas: Child care...$1500 per month.  22 work days, so $68 per day?
$8.50 an hour?
I know it's a big bill and I'm not saying it's right, but how could one expect to pay less than $8/hr for child care?

Daycare teachers often care for more than one child at once. Which is how my older kid's daycare is less than $1500/month.


Of course but you've got a staff and property to pay for at day care, even with multiple kids.
 
2022-07-03 2:25:00 PM  

UNC_Samurai: And the thread has already been shat on by the "cLoSe yOuR LeGs!" crowd.


It's called family planning you complete clown.
 
2022-07-03 2:25:15 PM  

whatisaidwas: Of course but you've got a staff and property to pay for at day care, even with multiple kids.


Uhhhh... you do like the rest of the world and subsidize it. But that would be communism, unlike the roads, bridges, sewers, water treatment... Etc
 
2022-07-03 2:25:27 PM  
This is most of the labor shortage we're having right now. We don't have a labor shortage; we have a child care shortage.

If you offer a position for less money per hour than the cost of child care no one can afford to fill it, because they'd be working for negative money to take that job and then pay for child care.

When Republicans say that people don't deserve $15 an hour or a living wage, and then act surprised that 'people don't want to work anymore' when you offer $6 an hour and child care costs $8 an hour so they'd be making a whopping negative two dollars an hour working for you; "What?! No one wants a job that pays negative two dollars an hour?"
 
2022-07-03 2:25:53 PM  

whatisaidwas: Child care...$1500 per month.  22 work days, so $68 per day?
$8.50 an hour?
I know it's a big bill and I'm not saying it's right, but how could one expect to pay less than $8/hr for child care?


The caretakers make up for it in volume.  They aren't watching just one kid at a time.
 
2022-07-03 2:25:54 PM  

Klyukva: Woman shocked and dismayed that it makes maximal economical sense for her to raise her children full-time while her husband works outside the home. This is just like The Handmaid's Tale!


Men largely having been raised on a steady diet of internalized misogyny and privilege unwilling to acknowledge the systemic realities behind the impractical, unnecessary economic stratification faced by women since forever instead revert to the tried and true appeal to the status quo as natural fallacy, as this most easily relieves them of the responsibility of having to look objectively at the world around them and consider the well-being and status of people not like themselves. They then by extension excuse themselves of this requirement wholesale using the reasoning that the emotional and mental labor that has never been obliged of them should not be obliged of them now or in the future as that is the responsibility of the lesser female class.
 
2022-07-03 2:26:11 PM  
Kids should be starting pre K at age 4 then then child care would involve after school or half days so the number to be considered is age 18 months to 4 years so around 10 million in the US and for after school care add another 15 million. It is very doable and would do an enormous in public good. California has had paid family leave for for 20 years in the 6th largest economy in the world and other western countries provide even more social and economic support and still have thriving economies. The Model from Germany with a large population and sizable immigrant population being able to do social services that republicans say are impossible or too expensive shows republicans are just lying to keep people working, poor and without a good way to improve their lives.
 
2022-07-03 2:28:42 PM  
We are looking at paying 2k a month for one infant, and are still going to have to juggle 6 months of care until the wait list clears. We put a deposit down IN THE FIRST TRIMESTER.
WE WERE TOLD THAT PEOPLE THINKING OF CONCEIVING WERE GETTING TOURS
Denver is farking expensive.
 
2022-07-03 2:32:28 PM  
This is why neither my sister nor I will have children. It's too expensive. Neither of us could afford one, much less more than one, and thankfully our parents were never bothered by the possibility of not being grandparents. Not to mention, the country is swirling down the toilet as we speak. Why bring another life into it? If I have a choice between expensive formula and diapers or sushi with my boyfriend, I'd rather the sushi. Is that selfish? Maybe to some people, yes, but I know too many people who are parents that shouldn't be. If they'd taken the time to really ask themselves if having kids was right for them, they wouldn't have done it and the kids would be better off.
 
2022-07-03 2:33:31 PM  

Markoff_Cheney: We are looking at paying 2k a month for one infant, and are still going to have to juggle 6 months of care until the wait list clears. We put a deposit down IN THE FIRST TRIMESTER.
WE WERE TOLD THAT PEOPLE THINKING OF CONCEIVING WERE GETTING TOURS
Denver is farking expensive.


Curious on the ratio of staff to infants for $2k a month? Guessing on the economics of it being around 6-10 infants per care provider. Possible to pay staff $50k a year and cover other costs and make a decent profit at that number. Guessing staff is not paid $25+ an hour though.
 
2022-07-03 2:33:53 PM  

cherryl taggart: Birth control is free at the health department.


media.defense.govView Full Size

And in the Military
 
2022-07-03 2:33:54 PM  

TomFooolery: eurotrader: All the Nordic countries and Northern Europe child care is free or heavily subsided. Most start at age 2-3 (after paid family leave time) to be free to the parents and are staffed with trained child support personal with a majority with a degree in  child development.

Free universal child care in the US would be almost as big as free universal healthcare, in terms of benefits to the working poor.  In addition to creating jobs, you free up a lot of people who are able to work but can't afford the child care.


The resulting larger supply of workers would mean companies could reduce wages, and likely coming out ahead even factoring in the cost of the child care, which any company should support. Oh but wait, that doesn't square with the "fark the poors" approach, so ne'ermind.
 
2022-07-03 2:36:07 PM  

Coco LaFemme: This is why neither my sister nor I will have children. It's too expensive. Neither of us could afford one, much less more than one, and thankfully our parents were never bothered by the possibility of not being grandparents. Not to mention, the country is swirling down the toilet as we speak. Why bring another life into it? If I have a choice between expensive formula and diapers or sushi with my boyfriend, I'd rather the sushi. Is that selfish? Maybe to some people, yes, but I know too many people who are parents that shouldn't be. If they'd taken the time to really ask themselves if having kids was right for them, they wouldn't have done it and the kids would be better off.


There is nothing selfish about exercising your agency in ways that don't impact anyone else.
 
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