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(Jalopnik)   Deadliest train line in America increases speeds, expands service, presumably to a cemetery   (jalopnik.com) divider line
    More: Florida, Rail transport, High-speed rail, Locomotive, Public transport, Brightline passenger train, South Florida metropolitan area, Railroad car, Palm Beach County, Florida  
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3485 clicks; posted to Main » on 21 May 2022 at 1:25 AM (6 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2022-05-20 7:18:02 PM  
So this article is both right and wrong about stuff but I'm gonna take a nap, maybe go buy beer, probably watch a bike race and contemplate my actual response.
 
2022-05-20 7:30:56 PM  
American capitalism is addicted to automobiles.  It's not going to last forever, guys.  Mass transit will arrive, or no transit will get here.  We can't even keep the bridges up.
 
2022-05-20 8:53:12 PM  
This train runs solely within Florida, and only kills Floridians.  I'm completely failing to see the problem.
 
2022-05-20 9:14:07 PM  

Monty_Zoncolan: So this article is both right and wrong about stuff but I'm gonna take a nap, maybe go buy beer, probably watch a bike race and contemplate my actual response.


Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2022-05-20 11:30:29 PM  

Warthog: This train runs solely within Florida, and only kills Floridians.  I'm completely failing to see the problem.


other than the fact it's "killer" performance to date might be used to argue against this elsewhere?

there is enough train v car/pedestrian data, nation-wide, to show we need better safety measures before we can adopt a high-speed rail line ala Japan

I know, "ha-ha, dead Floridians" is so fetch but it's really about more than that

fwiw, my spouse and son rode the Brightline up and back for father's day 2 or 3 years ago, just because
"first class" seats, food and drink and so on

they had a hell of a good time and marveled at how fast it moved compared to, you know, idling in traffic

it really would be nice if it worked properly, don't you think?
 
2022-05-21 12:27:17 AM  
64.media.tumblr.comView Full Size


It's not the deadliest train line in America.

The people on the train are safe. They just get delayed an hour or so.

The train is safe. What doesn't wash off with a hose will buff out..

The line is safe. The rails will be rinsed off in the next rainstorm.

Not really seeing the problem here.
 
2022-05-21 1:34:05 AM  
Build a system of tunnels 50' below ground level, make the everything waterproof, and create the first submarine subway system!

:-D
 
2022-05-21 1:40:03 AM  
Fark user imageView Full Size
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2022-05-21 1:40:42 AM  
Ugh, I live about two blocks away from one of the "death zones", so I'm really getting a kick...

/You might actually be able to fix stupid.
//With a train
///HONK HONK
 
2022-05-21 1:42:01 AM  
Outside railway experts told the Miami Herald earlier this year that the problem lies with Floridians:

i.imgflip.comView Full Size
 
2022-05-21 1:44:05 AM  

Archie Goodwin: Outside railway experts told the Miami Herald earlier this year that the problem lies with Floridians


They aren't wrong.
 
2022-05-21 1:44:09 AM  
How is a train like a stick of gum?

Chew! Chew!

I got nothing....
 
2022-05-21 1:47:01 AM  
If you read the articles that are linked out of this main article you see a pattern of Floridian stupidity. Drivers going around the lowered gates to try and beat the trains. They lost. Not the trains' fault.
 
2022-05-21 1:51:36 AM  

Warthog: This train runs solely within Florida, and only kills Floridians.  I'm completely failing to see the problem.


Location: Inside the Beltway

This is Irony performance art at it's finest
 
2022-05-21 1:52:28 AM  

minnesotaboy: Not the trains' fault.


EVERY. SINGLE. TIME.

The local newspapers aren't helping.

"How can we stop these vicious deadly trains?!"

*Proceeds to get blown out in the FB comments*

Repeat weekly.
 
2022-05-21 1:55:37 AM  
11 cars crashed into trains, the Palm Beach Post reports.


It seems to be a Florida driver problem
 
2022-05-21 1:58:00 AM  
Tangerine Dream - Love On A Real Train (State Azure Cover)
Youtube ZRSNy8DcIDk
 
2022-05-21 2:10:14 AM  

Mock26: Build a system of tunnels 50' below ground level, make the everything waterproof, and create the first submarine subway system!

:-D


"50 feet below ground level" in Florida is mud and swamp water. There isn't even enough of what could be called "ground" there for most buildings to even have basements. Tunnels which go under water go through the rock underneath the bottom of the water, not through the water itself -- all tunnels, whether they cross a stream or the English Channel.

And funny thing about railroad tunnels -- the trains need to be able to enter and exit the tunnels. The surface-level railroads are not 50 feet below surface level, so good luck connecting them to the 50-foot-deep rail tunnels.
 
2022-05-21 2:14:12 AM  

King Something: Mock26: Build a system of tunnels 50' below ground level, make the everything waterproof, and create the first submarine subway system!

:-D

"50 feet below ground level" in Florida is mud and swamp water. There isn't even enough of what could be called "ground" there for most buildings to even have basements. Tunnels which go under water go through the rock underneath the bottom of the water, not through the water itself -- all tunnels, whether they cross a stream or the English Channel.

And funny thing about railroad tunnels -- the trains need to be able to enter and exit the tunnels. The surface-level railroads are not 50 feet below surface level, so good luck connecting them to the 50-foot-deep rail tunnels.


Isn't the "rock" below florida mostly just limestone anyway?
 
2022-05-21 2:14:41 AM  
Dad said there was Blood and guts and dead Wall Street guys everywhere. Almost ended before I was made.

For once the train lost
 
2022-05-21 2:16:55 AM  
Just rode Amtrak from Ann Arbor to Chicago and then flew back first class on Delta - the coach trip on Amtrak was a vastly superior experience in nearly every way. Train > plane for short trips.
 
2022-05-21 2:21:01 AM  
There's a grade crossing near here with a weird Y-shaped intersection next to the crossing. Every month or two someone listens to their GPS when it says "bear right" and they drive right onto the tracks. Most of the time the train line is shut down for a bit as a tow truck recovers the vehicle from the tracks. Sadly, a few people have failed to leave their cars recently and have become statistics.

While making fun of Floridians is a great sport here, this is a nationwide problem. Trains and cars mix as well as cars and pedestrians/bicyclists . Any incident involving a mix of vehicles with such different sizes will result in fatalities if any kind of speed is involved. We need to create a better framework to deal with this.
 
2022-05-21 2:31:42 AM  
JALOPNIK is also dead.  They're reading Fark from 2019 or maybe just 10-11 days ago
 
2022-05-21 2:40:26 AM  
Retractable bollards, hydraulic rising bollards, automatic bollards - MairsTurnstile.com
Youtube LdFuOzUHgHo


The fun part of people in cars trying to race across the tracks to beat a Brightline is that these aren't long freight trains. And they're fast. They're racing a train that would inconvenience them for less than 1 minute.

Install retractable bollards (poles that come out of the ground) at railroad crossings. Make them come up fast so if some moron crosses the line his car gets a pole though the engine the second it senses it.

Big warnings at the crossing saying "if your car crosses the big farking white line when the gates are down, your car will automatically be destroyed.

Good luck stopping people on foot from trying to beat the train or otherwise 'trespassing' when a train is coming.
 
2022-05-21 2:49:27 AM  
RTFA until the company's claim that 75% of the deaths are suicide.

So, either your hiring process is to blame, or (most likely), your working conditions are to blame.

DIAF corporate pigs.
 
2022-05-21 3:07:10 AM  

King Something: Mock26: Build a system of tunnels 50' below ground level, make the everything waterproof, and create the first submarine subway system!

:-D

"50 feet below ground level" in Florida is mud and swamp water. There isn't even enough of what could be called "ground" there for most buildings to even have basements. Tunnels which go under water go through the rock underneath the bottom of the water, not through the water itself -- all tunnels, whether they cross a stream or the English Channel.

And funny thing about railroad tunnels -- the trains need to be able to enter and exit the tunnels. The surface-level railroads are not 50 feet below surface level, so good luck connecting them to the 50-foot-deep rail tunnels.


Inclined planes are neat.

Also, lighten up.
 
2022-05-21 3:09:34 AM  

sforce: [YouTube video: Retractable bollards, hydraulic rising bollards, automatic bollards - MairsTurnstile.com]

The fun part of people in cars trying to race across the tracks to beat a Brightline is that these aren't long freight trains. And they're fast. They're racing a train that would inconvenience them for less than 1 minute.

Install retractable bollards (poles that come out of the ground) at railroad crossings. Make them come up fast so if some moron crosses the line his car gets a pole though the engine the second it senses it.

Big warnings at the crossing saying "if your car crosses the big farking white line when the gates are down, your car will automatically be destroyed.

Good luck stopping people on foot from trying to beat the train or otherwise 'trespassing' when a train is coming.


But it's Florida, and those poor bollards don't deserve how they'll be used and abused

Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2022-05-21 3:09:50 AM  
Not RingTFA. But I am pretty sure it's safe for passengers. Just not for Floridians.
 
2022-05-21 3:39:05 AM  

sforce: [YouTube video: Retractable bollards, hydraulic rising bollards, automatic bollards - MairsTurnstile.com]

The fun part of people in cars trying to race across the tracks to beat a Brightline is that these aren't long freight trains. And they're fast. They're racing a train that would inconvenience them for less than 1 minute.

Install retractable bollards (poles that come out of the ground) at railroad crossings. Make them come up fast so if some moron crosses the line his car gets a pole though the engine the second it senses it.

Big warnings at the crossing saying "if your car crosses the big farking white line when the gates are down, your car will automatically be destroyed.

Good luck stopping people on foot from trying to beat the train or otherwise 'trespassing' when a train is coming.


The problem with that design is those could trap someone on the tracks. Someone starts across crossing, bollards pop up, now they can't leave the tracks.

In Russia some railroad crossings have these guards that rise out out of the road to prevent driving around the gates, but if you're already on the crossing you can drive over them to get off the crossing. You can see them about 40 seconds in. The Brightline should probably look into something like this... I imagine someone outside of Russia makes something similar. 

RailWay. Russian railroad crossing St. Petersburg Oil tanker train/Наливной поезд в Санкт-Петербурге
Youtube vDF6zXBaJIQ

Also, Russian railroad crossing signals sound like old telephones ringing.
 
2022-05-21 3:47:56 AM  

King Something: Mock26: Build a system of tunnels 50' below ground level, make the everything waterproof, and create the first submarine subway system!

:-D

"50 feet below ground level" in Florida is mud and swamp water. There isn't even enough of what could be called "ground" there for most buildings to even have basements. Tunnels which go under water go through the rock underneath the bottom of the water, not through the water itself -- all tunnels, whether they cross a stream or the English Channel.

And funny thing about railroad tunnels -- the trains need to be able to enter and exit the tunnels. The surface-level railroads are not 50 feet below surface level, so good luck connecting them to the 50-foot-deep rail tunnels.


How to miss the joke...
 
2022-05-21 3:50:09 AM  

Warthog: This train runs solely within Florida, and only kills Floridians.  I'm completely failing to see the problem.


It's better than that.  Floridians use this line to kill themselves!

When you die running your car over a grade crossing and get smashed by a train, that ain't the train's fault.   The vast majority of rail related deaths are from cars trying to beat the train at grade.   It ain't even close.   The problem here is Florida Man, not Brightline.

Caltrain is working on gated crossing activation right now.    That would let the train know the state of the gate before arrival, and if it isn't right, stop the train.

Houston has more grade crossings than any other place in the country.   Somehow they manage to not get squashed.
 
2022-05-21 4:00:49 AM  

meanmutton: Just rode Amtrak from Ann Arbor to Chicago and then flew back first class on Delta - the coach trip on Amtrak was a vastly superior experience in nearly every way. Train > plane for short trips.


Out of curiosity I compared plane, bus and train tickets from Denver to Houston a number of years ago. Flying was obviously much faster, but surprisingly (at least to me) cheaper too. Trains and buses were ridiculous. I didn't expect a train to be faster, but I did expect it to be cheaper. It still might be fun to take a train or maybe it would only be fun for the first few hours.

Buses were by far the worst option though but I wasn't seriously considering them anyway. I wasn't even seriously considering a train, I was just curious. Trains and buses were slower than a sloth making sweet love and using his Texas time.
 
2022-05-21 4:08:58 AM  

Rent Party: Houston has more grade crossings than any other place in the country.   Somehow they manage to not get squashed.


It is all the guns. That is the only logical explanation.

:-D
 
2022-05-21 4:14:16 AM  

sforce: Install retractable bollards


We're gonna set the record for idiots in lifted trucks and SUVs suspended on top of bollards, man!

/when the train clips them they spin
 
2022-05-21 5:07:03 AM  
Every other country with rail can figure this shiat out, but somehow we can't. Like universal healthcare or more than 2 political parties.

I know other places suck in their own ways but sometimes I can barely stand the idiocy here.
 
2022-05-21 5:26:40 AM  
I thought the deadliest train line in America was a Trolley.

blogs.discovery.wisc.eduView Full Size
 
2022-05-21 5:36:52 AM  

Entropy_Bot: sforce: Install retractable bollards

We're gonna set the record for idiots in lifted trucks and SUVs suspended on top of bollards, man!

/when the train clips them they spin


Paint this around the base of the bollard:
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2022-05-21 6:04:18 AM  

King Something: The surface-level railroads are not 50 feet below surface level, so good luck connecting them to the 50-foot-deep rail tunnels.


Rapid-transit systems do that all the time. Neither the New York subway nor the Chicago L are 100% in-character; both have elevated and underground sections. Good luck tunneling underground in Florida, though.

A key issue with Brightline is that it's running on an existing right-of-way with lots of level crossings. Combine high-speed trains with car/pedestrian stupidity and you have a recipe for trouble. There's been plenty of times when people have been killed by much slower commuter trains in the Chicago area, going around lowered gates. Amtrak has been trying for years to upgrade the Chicago-St. Louis corridor to 110 MPH, but teething problems with the positive train control system and grade crossing timing have resulted in speeds being only being raised to 90 recently.

France, Germany, Japan, etc. build out their high-speed lines on separate, grade-separated rights-of-way, with many tunnels to go through hills rather than around them (not a problem in Florida), and even their conventional lines tend to have few grade crossings and higher speeds than the US. 160 km/h (about 99 MPH) is commonplace, and there's plenty of 200 km/h (124 MPH) trackage as well, which barely qualifies as "high-speed" over there. Dedicated lines can exceed 300 km/h (186 MPH) these days in regular service.
 
2022-05-21 6:54:06 AM  
Rail in America is barely fit for freight.
 
2022-05-21 6:58:53 AM  

adamatari: Every other country with rail can figure this shiat out, but somehow we can't. Like universal healthcare or more than 2 political parties.

I know other places suck in their own ways but sometimes I can barely stand the idiocy here.


It's not just every other country, it's every other state too.   This is purely a problem for the sunburned masses in the Sunshine State.
 
2022-05-21 6:59:46 AM  

GrymRpr: Rail in America is barely fit for freight.


American freight rail is the envy of the world.
 
2022-05-21 7:08:13 AM  

untoldforce: There's a grade crossing near here with a weird Y-shaped intersection next to the crossing. Every month or two someone listens to their GPS when it says "bear right" and they drive right onto the tracks. Most of the time the train line is shut down for a bit as a tow truck recovers the vehicle from the tracks. Sadly, a few people have failed to leave their cars recently and have become statistics.

While making fun of Floridians is a great sport here, this is a nationwide problem. Trains and cars mix as well as cars and pedestrians/bicyclists . Any incident involving a mix of vehicles with such different sizes will result in fatalities if any kind of speed is involved. We need to create a better framework to deal with this.


In Drivers' Ed, my nephew learned this analogy:  train is to car as car is to?  Answer:  tin can. By extension, train is to pedestrian as car is to...bug, probably.
 
2022-05-21 7:16:24 AM  

Fubegra: Amtrak has been trying for years to upgrade the Chicago-St. Louis corridor to 110 MPH, but teething problems with the positive train control system and grade crossing timing have resulted in speeds being only being raised to 90 recently.


Amtrak doesn't own that line.  I think KCS does.   Amtrak owns almost no track outside of the NEC.

PTC has nothing to do with grade crossings, either.   FRA is probably going to mandate that it does, but as of right now, grade crossings are track circuit activated, which means the approach and warning times are going to put an upper limit on the speed of the trains running on the line.

France, Germany, Japan, etc. build out their high-speed lines on separate, grade-separated rights-of-way,

This is the answer.  Unfortunately for us, it is never going to happen in the states.   If surface traffic flow is impacting freight rail, the freights will build an over/underpass, but a fully owned right of way is a practical impossibility these days.   We would all be dead long before the permitting process ever finished.

Texas might do it with their Houston to Dallas HSR line, and despite Florida Man stupidity, Brightline is doing it, too.  But a national rail system here that actually owns it's own track....   Abraham Lincoln killed that.
 
2022-05-21 7:24:52 AM  

Gough: untoldforce: There's a grade crossing near here with a weird Y-shaped intersection next to the crossing. Every month or two someone listens to their GPS when it says "bear right" and they drive right onto the tracks. Most of the time the train line is shut down for a bit as a tow truck recovers the vehicle from the tracks. Sadly, a few people have failed to leave their cars recently and have become statistics.

While making fun of Floridians is a great sport here, this is a nationwide problem. Trains and cars mix as well as cars and pedestrians/bicyclists . Any incident involving a mix of vehicles with such different sizes will result in fatalities if any kind of speed is involved. We need to create a better framework to deal with this.

In Drivers' Ed, my nephew learned this analogy:  train is to car as car is to?  Answer:  tin can. By extension, train is to pedestrian as car is to...bug, probably.


Sometimes you're the windshield
Sometimes you're the bug

The Bug
Youtube DRICXdPhjA4
 
2022-05-21 7:30:44 AM  
It seems to be more of a Florida man issue rather than anything to do with the trains mechanics or track engineering.

I say put a cattle pusher on the front and let evolution do it's job.
 
2022-05-21 7:33:32 AM  

Warthog: This train runs solely within Florida, and only kills Floridians.  I'm completely failing to see the problem.


The train runs solely in Florida, and only kills former Ohioans.
FTFY
 
2022-05-21 7:36:56 AM  
Protip: Train/vehicle collisions are NEVER the fault of the train.
 
2022-05-21 7:38:48 AM  
Well the article said they were number one in deaths per mile traveled.  So going faster and traveling further may actually be a good solution.
 
2022-05-21 7:42:12 AM  

lycanth: Protip: Train/vehicle collisions are NEVER the fault of the train.


Well usually at least.

https://www.kare11.com/article/news/investigations/legal-loophole-shields-light-rail-driver-from-prosecution-in-deadly-crash/89-c33e4f41-9fd8-4cc4-92b1-736bc18229ea
 
2022-05-21 8:26:34 AM  

parasol: Warthog: This train runs solely within Florida, and only kills Floridians.  I'm completely failing to see the problem.

other than the fact it's "killer" performance to date might be used to argue against this elsewhere?

there is enough train v car/pedestrian data, nation-wide, to show we need better safety measures before we can adopt a high-speed rail line ala Japan

I know, "ha-ha, dead Floridians" is so fetch but it's really about more than that

fwiw, my spouse and son rode the Brightline up and back for father's day 2 or 3 years ago, just because
"first class" seats, food and drink and so on

they had a hell of a good time and marveled at how fast it moved compared to, you know, idling in traffic

it really would be nice if it worked properly, don't you think?


True high speed rail like in Japan is grade separated. Can't get car vs train accidents nor any accidental pedestrian deaths.

I bet a majority of these accidents were people driving past barriers or ignoring traffic signs.
 
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