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(NBC News)   Sure is hard to be a teacher in Texas when the law requires you to talk about "both sides". The one side being the neo-nazi's perspective about shooting up Buffalo   (nbcnews.com) divider line
    More: Fail, Education, Racism, teacher Elizabeth Close, Teacher, School, ways teachers, new state law, social studies teachers  
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3166 clicks; posted to Politics » on 21 May 2022 at 12:01 AM (5 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2022-05-20 8:28:00 PM  
Talk about how we honor those who killed Nazis.

The truth.
 
2022-05-20 11:20:46 PM  
"Good morning class. I'm sure you all heard about the mass shooting and can't imagine why anyone would do this. Also, you might be wondering how it feels to the families and friends of the victims. There's really no way we can understand how a person could be so cruel and evil.

On the other hand, many of our brightest minds in state politics are perfectly okay with this kind of thing and feel it so important that you know that, they passed a law requiring me to tell they're fine with it."
 
2022-05-21 12:05:46 AM  
Sounds pretty similar to the conservative argument of "but the confederacy is a part of OUR HISTORY"

Your history dude, not mine.
 
2022-05-21 12:11:27 AM  
"They didn't teach US about racism in school in the 1960s, and we turned out just fine!"
 
2022-05-21 12:13:15 AM  
She needs more tats.

Tats, not ti...
 
2022-05-21 12:14:48 AM  
State Sen. John Schickel, the primary sponsor of a Kentucky law that restricts the ways teachers discuss racism and "controversial" subjects, said he thinks it's good that teachers are spending less time talking about current events, which he said students could learn about on their own by reading newspapers or watching TV.

"Our educational system I believe should be teaching reading, writing and arithmetic and factual history, and stay out of politics," Schickel said.


The guy went out of his way to shoot black people because of a racist conspiracy he learned on 4-chan. If you think that's political then you have some guttter-shiat thoughts about politics.
 
2022-05-21 12:17:17 AM  
"Our educational system I believe should be teaching reading, writing and arithmetic and factual history, and stay out of politics," Schickel said.

Factual history - like that this was a hate crime by a racist? That seems pretty factual.

Someone would have to advocate for a law to suppress discussion of those facts to make it about politics...

/smh
//wtf is wrong with people these days
 
2022-05-21 12:17:49 AM  
Not nearly on the same level, but I went to "the" high school that required the biology teacher to teach the "Of Pandas and People" intelligent design theory shiat, before it was struck down in court.

My teacher gave a sentence or two disclosure about Intelligent Design before diving right into evolution full throttle, never mentioning ID  again. I hope those teachers have similar leeway.
 
2022-05-21 12:19:04 AM  
Sure both sides - texas style.

"Boys and girls, today we learn about white supremacists. All republicans love them and want them to murder more children just like you. Isn't that wonderful? You could be painfully gunned down by a subhuman piece of trash who wants you to die for his fantasy god and all republicans will cheer and cheer your death."

"On the other side, we have people who have IQ's above 100, who vote Democrat and want you to live full, complete lives. Isn't that awful? You would be old like your grandparents <shudder> and they should all be exterminated because they can no longer breed - like the 'good book' says."

"Now you're heard both sides. Open your bibles to leviticus and let's read about all the ways you should be killed for major sins, like saying the wrong words or shunned for wearing mixed fabrics."

"Remember. Among all those words of killing you for no reason is god's love."
 
2022-05-21 12:24:46 AM  
State Sen. John Schickel, the primary sponsor of a Kentucky law that restricts the ways teachers discuss racism and "controversial" subjects, said he thinks it's good that teachers are spending less time talking about current events, which he said students could learn about on their own by reading newspapers or watching TV.

Oh, I'm sure you do, John.

They could learn about it on their own, just like that piece of garbage learned about it, right on 4Chan and Stormfront.

That's what you really want, isn't it? You can say it. We all know it's what you mean.
 
2022-05-21 12:27:03 AM  
Yeah I'd just start teaching that republicans are the party of white supremacy, that their policies and rhetoric are the sorts of thing that enabled and radicalized this piece of shiat, and that republicans love the mass murder of black people.
 
2022-05-21 12:28:02 AM  

nicholas m schumacher: State Sen. John Schickel, the primary sponsor of a Kentucky law that restricts the ways teachers discuss racism and "controversial" subjects, said he thinks it's good that teachers are spending less time talking about current events, which he said students could learn about on their own by reading newspapers or watching TV.

"Our educational system I believe should be teaching reading, writing and arithmetic and factual history, and stay out of politics," Schickel said.

The guy went out of his way to shoot black people because of a racist conspiracy he learned on 4-chan. If you think that's political then you have some guttter-shiat thoughts about politics.


Students should learn about politics from politicians, not teachers.  That's why politicians are the people who determine what teachers can and cannot teach their students.
 
2022-05-21 12:29:11 AM  
State law required her to tell her class that some people agree with the killings, and thought the killer's actions were justified. And so, she told them; but also prefaced it by telling them that state law required her to talk about the murders from the murderer's perspective.

Basically she said "the racially motivated killings in Buffalo are bad, but because the killings were racially motivated, I'm required by state law to mention that some people think racially motivated killings are good."

That's some excellent malicious compliance on her part. Telling her kids the lies the state wants them to hear verbatim, without actually poisoning their minds with those same lies.


/her actions were not malicious in any way, and were in fact the opposite
//the term "malicious compliance" means obeying a command you don't want to obey, to the letter, but intentionally doing so in a way which is antithetical to the spirit of the command -- the malice is directed to the order itself and/or the person(s) who gave the order
 
2022-05-21 12:29:37 AM  
Tangential CSB:

I was a freshman in highschool when 9/11 happened. I saw the second plane crash as I was getting ready for school.

My school district ordered all staff at all schools to make sure all televisions were off. I am extremely grateful that every single one of my teachers ignored that missive. It was horrible, yes. It was atrocious and appalling and frightening. But you cannot cut children off from the world they will inherit. You just cannot.

The real world is often ugly and vicious and controversial. It's going to make children uncomfortable at times. But they live in the real world, and one day they will be responsible for the real world. Forcing blinders on them and pretending reality doesn't exist until you send them off to a college dorm isn't doing anyone any favors.
 
2022-05-21 12:32:48 AM  

King Something: State law required her to tell her class that some people agree with the killings, and thought the killer's actions were justified. And so, she told them; but also prefaced it by telling them that state law required her to talk about the murders from the murderer's perspective.

Basically she said "the racially motivated killings in Buffalo are bad, but because the killings were racially motivated, I'm required by state law to mention that some people think racially motivated killings are good."

That's some excellent malicious compliance on her part. Telling her kids the lies the state wants them to hear verbatim, without actually poisoning their minds with those same lies.


/her actions were not malicious in any way, and were in fact the opposite
//the term "malicious compliance" means obeying a command you don't want to obey, to the letter, but intentionally doing so in a way which is antithetical to the spirit of the command -- the malice is directed to the order itself and/or the person(s) who gave the order


Malicious compliance is my favorite kind of compliance.
 
2022-05-21 12:40:23 AM  

foo monkey: nicholas m schumacher: State Sen. John Schickel, the primary sponsor of a Kentucky law that restricts the ways teachers discuss racism and "controversial" subjects, said he thinks it's good that teachers are spending less time talking about current events, which he said students could learn about on their own by reading newspapers or watching TV.

"Our educational system I believe should be teaching reading, writing and arithmetic and factual history, and stay out of politics," Schickel said.

The guy went out of his way to shoot black people because of a racist conspiracy he learned on 4-chan. If you think that's political then you have some guttter-shiat thoughts about politics.

Students should learn about politics from politicians, not teachers.  That's why politicians are the people who determine what teachers can and cannot teach their students.


Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2022-05-21 12:44:25 AM  
Now imagine they have to discuss Jeffrey Epstein and how he was just a great enabler of young entrepreneurs who were starting out as massage therapists.
 
2022-05-21 12:47:16 AM  
Do we have to debate whether murder is wrong or not?  Then it shouldn't be an issue.  It's not a discussion.

On one hand, she explained that authorities are investigating the killings as a racially motivated hate crime carried out by an 18-year-old who reportedly wrote of his belief in a conspiracy theory that white Americans are being "replaced" by people of color through immigration, interracial marriage and integration.
"But I'm also supposed to tell you that that's just one perspective," Close recalled telling her students. "Another perspective is that this young man was out defending the world - or his kind - from being taken over."


That's  not how explain it.  You say, he believed blah blah blah, so he shot people, which of course is why he's in jail.
Christ, reality does still exist.  I'm not going to debate mass murder, no matter what kind of shiat the lawmakers make up.


emtwo: Tangential CSB:
I was a freshman in highschool when 9/11 happened. I saw the second plane crash as I was getting ready for school.
My school district ordered all staff at all schools to make sure all televisions were off. I am extremely grateful that every single one of my teachers ignored that missive. It was horrible, yes. It was atrocious and appalling and frightening. But you cannot cut children off from the world they will inherit. You just cannot.
The real world is often ugly and vicious and controversial. It's going to make children uncomfortable at times. But they live in the real world, and one day they will be responsible for the real world. Forcing blinders on them and pretending reality doesn't exist until you send them off to a college dorm isn't doing anyone any favors.


My son's school turned on the TVs and just abandoned the school day.  It would be kind of dumb to ignore that one.  I don't know if this story rates a discussion, unless it's in your state, or your school is studying race or something.  How many farking mass murders and hate crimes do we have now?
 
2022-05-21 12:47:57 AM  

HighZoolander: "Our educational system I believe should be teaching reading, writing and arithmetic and factual history, and stay out of politics," Schickel said.

Factual history - like that this was a hate crime by a racist? That seems pretty factual.


But it's not history. Too soon.
 
2022-05-21 12:48:51 AM  
"OK class, let's review some of the different perspectives on the Buffalo mass shooter. Some suggest that the shooter was a crazed lunatic motivated by white supremacist hatred and a delusional belief in something called the 'Great Replacement Theory.' Others would say he was a gullible yet psychopathic kid who was radicalized by online forums preaching racial animus and who channeled what he learned into unspeakable violence. Yet a third perspective suggests that he was mentally ill and the natural end result of a society that worships violence and allows unfiltered racist dogma to masquerade as legitimate discourse."

So there's a variety of viewpoints. I'm sure there are others, but those are the ones I came up with off the top of my head.
 
2022-05-21 12:52:07 AM  

cryinoutloud: My son's school turned on the TVs and just abandoned the school day.  It would be kind of dumb to ignore that one.  I don't know if this story rates a discussion, unless it's in your state, or your school is studying race or something.  How many farking mass murders and hate crimes do we have now?


Doesn't matter. Every last one of them merits discussion.
 
2022-05-21 12:56:22 AM  
Although I have the good fortune to teach in California, where racists shiatbags aren't given completely free reign, it wouldn't matter where I was.

That sack of shiat should have been shot in the face instead of captured. I will tell my students that a racist murderer is a racist murderer until you wire my jaw shut and cut out my tongue.

farking cowards passing these laws. Republicans need to be driven out of the country.
 
2022-05-21 12:58:56 AM  
nicholas m schumacher: [Fark user image 750x562]

The criticism is of your framing to address the 'reasoning' of a politician versus a teacher's autonomy to practice their professional vocation. The sarcasm is likely based in an uncertainty if your argument was in good faith.
 
2022-05-21 12:59:17 AM  
Black lives don't matter.  Where's my gun.
2 wrongs don't make women's rights
 
2022-05-21 1:05:13 AM  
Yea but the other side wants them to see black people, gay people, and immigrants as people.
 
2022-05-21 1:05:35 AM  
Looking for my pillow case hoodie
 
2022-05-21 1:13:15 AM  
I have been a teacher for 17 years and I'm not going back. Ever. And I'm in CO where the teacher can and will be suedfor teaching anything "controversial.". FARK that! (and only 3 years left until retirement! )
 
2022-05-21 1:13:42 AM  
The United States is displaying amazing levels of self-hate.
The media is feeding an umbrage-outrage contest consisting of absolutely nothing that matters except scoring points in the culture wars and getting clicks.
All my life I've been waiting for a functional liberal democracy to emerge magically from this shiat show and little did I know that the 1960s would be a golden era of dignity and ethics compared to what we face now on a massive scale.
It's gawdammed morons all the way down.
 
2022-05-21 1:14:55 AM  

HighZoolander: "Our educational system I believe should be teaching reading, writing and arithmetic and factual history, and stay out of politics," Schickel said.


It's only political if someone takes the side of the racist murderer, no?
 
2022-05-21 1:15:37 AM  

Mister Buttons: Not nearly on the same level, but I went to "the" high school that required the biology teacher to teach the "Of Pandas and People" intelligent design theory shiat, before it was struck down in court.

My teacher gave a sentence or two disclosure about Intelligent Design before diving right into evolution full throttle, never mentioning ID  again. I hope those teachers have similar leeway.


Dover?

Pride of south-central PA, that episode.
 
2022-05-21 1:18:51 AM  
Class we will now analyze the following sentence:

buffalo bang buffalo bang buffalo buffalo bang buffalo bang.
 
2022-05-21 1:19:32 AM  
would you rather a teacher provide the information in a setting where it can be discussed rationally, or the local nazi recruiter when no one is there to rebut against him?
 
2022-05-21 1:22:06 AM  
"I am required by Texas law to give both sides of the shooting and the other side is that blacks are inhuman creatures who need to be eliminated.And since we just covered World War II, you should understand the other side on that and thus your summer reading assignment is Mein Kampf."
 
2022-05-21 1:22:36 AM  
FARK. TEXAS!
 
2022-05-21 1:22:46 AM  

edmo: "Good morning class. I'm sure you all heard about the mass shooting and can't imagine why anyone would do this. Also, you might be wondering how it feels to the families and friends of the victims. There's really no way we can understand how a person could be so cruel and evil.

On the other hand, many of our brightest minds in state politics are perfectly okay with this kind of thing and feel it so important that you know that, they passed a law requiring me to tell they're fine with it."


I'm sure someone with your career background would understand why a Texas teacher who actually said that would probably end up in jail. Maybe in prison.
 
2022-05-21 1:25:23 AM  

Bandito King: Although I have the good fortune to teach in California, where racists shiatbags aren't given completely free reign, it wouldn't matter where I was.


Won't matter in a year or two. There will be Federal laws enforcing this shit.
 
2022-05-21 1:27:21 AM  

HotIgneous Intruder: The media is feeding an umbrage-outrage contest consisting of absolutely nothing that matters except scoring points in the culture wars and getting clicks.


FWIW, I think using the phrase "culture wars" is just playing into the sensationalist clickbait bullshiat. There is no culture war. This is just the same ol' fight between oppressive wealth and crushing poverty that it's always been. The packaging has been updated a few times over the centuries, but the product inside is still original recipe.
 
2022-05-21 1:27:49 AM  
Let's just compromise and say that it's good that half of the victims are dead
 
2022-05-21 1:36:38 AM  
only really stupid people live in Texas. if you live there and are not a nazi you are too dumb to realize you can move,
 
2022-05-21 1:40:18 AM  
I always thought giving teachers guns was a bad idea.
After banning books, terrible parents and more laws.....
Maybe we should rethink that.
 
2022-05-21 1:42:11 AM  

SumoJeb: would you rather a teacher provide the information in a setting where it can be discussed rationally, or the local nazi recruiter when no one is there to rebut against him?


I thought TFA said NY schools.
Since this is Texas, I take back my comment.
 
2022-05-21 1:42:32 AM  

chucknasty: only really stupid people live in Texas. if you live there and are not a nazi you are too dumb to realize you can move,


Texas isn't a red state, it's a purple state that actively suppresses the vote.
 
2022-05-21 1:48:23 AM  

SloppyFrenchKisser: She needs more tats.

Tats, not ti...


It's good that you were able to focus on the most important and relevant portion of the article.

FYI, sometimes there are words down below the pictures.
 
2022-05-21 1:55:48 AM  
So if the class discussion is about any crime does she has to explain both sides?  Criminal commits crime and hurts someone, therefore we have to give the perspective of the criminal?  The Buffalo shooting was clearly a crime, and there isn't any opposing side to it.  Crazy guy is misled by equally crazy internet people and commits crime, simple as that.  What the criminal believed shouldn't be any part of the lesson.
 
2022-05-21 2:06:36 AM  

parkthebus: So if the class discussion is about any crime does she has to explain both sides?  Criminal commits crime and hurts someone, therefore we have to give the perspective of the criminal?  The Buffalo shooting was clearly a crime, and there isn't any opposing side to it.  Crazy guy is misled by equally crazy internet people and commits crime, simple as that.  What the criminal believed shouldn't be any part of the lesson.


It is when high-profile members of one of our two political parties and its propaganda arm are pushing the same exact bullshiat as the "crazy internet people".
 
2022-05-21 2:08:51 AM  
Republicans know damn well that supporting crazy bullshiat like "Great Replacement", QAnon, calling LGBTQ people 'groomers', and other such nonsense already has caused violence, and will continue to do so. They don't care; in fact, that's exactly what they're counting on.
 
2022-05-21 2:09:15 AM  

giantmeteor: Yea but the other side wants them to see black people, gay people, and immigrants as people.


You have like one job. What are you waiting for?
 
2022-05-21 2:15:57 AM  

jerryskid: Sure both sides - texas style.

"Boys and girls, today we learn about white supremacists. All republicans love them and want them to murder more children just like you. Isn't that wonderful? You could be painfully gunned down by a subhuman piece of trash who wants you to die for his fantasy god and all republicans will cheer and cheer your death."

"On the other side, we have people who have IQ's above 100, who vote Democrat and want you to live full, complete lives. Isn't that awful? You would be old like your grandparents <shudder> and they should all be exterminated because they can no longer breed - like the 'good book' says."

"Now you're heard both sides. Open your bibles to leviticus and let's read about all the ways you should be killed for major sins, like saying the wrong words or shunned for wearing mixed fabrics."

"Remember. Among all those words of killing you for no reason is god's love."


I read that in Jan Hooks' voice. 
i.imgflip.comView Full Size
 
2022-05-21 2:23:18 AM  

LordJiro: parkthebus: So if the class discussion is about any crime does she has to explain both sides?  Criminal commits crime and hurts someone, therefore we have to give the perspective of the criminal?  The Buffalo shooting was clearly a crime, and there isn't any opposing side to it.  Crazy guy is misled by equally crazy internet people and commits crime, simple as that.  What the criminal believed shouldn't be any part of the lesson.

It is when high-profile members of one of our two political parties and its propaganda arm are pushing the same exact bullshiat as the "crazy internet people".


I disagree.  In a classroom situation I would not get into broad-brushing either party with the statements of isolated politicians or media figures.   I would leave the discussion at the crime, and if a student wanted to know more about the story I would give them reports from both left and right leaning journalists and encourage them to think critically.
 
2022-05-21 2:24:57 AM  

King Something: State law required her to tell her class that some people agree with the killings, and thought the killer's actions were justified. And so, she told them; but also prefaced it by telling them that state law required her to talk about the murders from the murderer's perspective.

Basically she said "the racially motivated killings in Buffalo are bad, but because the killings were racially motivated, I'm required by state law to mention that some people think racially motivated killings are good."

That's some excellent malicious compliance on her part. Telling her kids the lies the state wants them to hear verbatim, without actually poisoning their minds with those same lies.


/her actions were not malicious in any way, and were in fact the opposite
//the term "malicious compliance" means obeying a command you don't want to obey, to the letter, but intentionally doing so in a way which is antithetical to the spirit of the command -- the malice is directed to the order itself and/or the person(s) who gave the order


Like this awesome teacher did?
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