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(Max Planck)   Scientists discover that Chimpanzee vocalizations are far more complex and structured than previously thought. Tarzan nods knowingly   (mpg.de) divider line
    More: Interesting, Human, Human evolution, complex use of human language, Primate, Hominidae, different vocal sequences, Bonobo, human syntax  
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244 clicks; posted to STEM » on 19 May 2022 at 4:30 AM (6 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2022-05-19 4:34:21 AM  
Obvious tag broken?
 
2022-05-19 5:04:11 AM  
TFA: "Humans are the only species on earth known to use language"

Um... really?

Gorilla's can *learn* sign language... And express thoughts, feelings, and emotions...

Parrots and Corvids can farking TALK

Who wrote this?
 
2022-05-19 5:44:17 AM  

makerofbadjokes: TFA: "Humans are the only species on earth known to use language"

Um... really?

Gorilla's can *learn* sign language... And express thoughts, feelings, and emotions...

Parrots and Corvids can farking TALK

Who wrote this?


It's difficult (if not impossible) to objectively verify how much insight the gorillas and birds have regarding their use of language, and how much they're just imitating. Many peer-reviewed papers have been published saying that this does not really constitute "language" or that we are overestimating (anthropomorphizing / assigning human ideas and motives to) the subjects' abilities or ideas. Particularly with birds, their thought processes and constructions are probably unlike ours, so it doesn't make sense that the language would resemble ours.

On the other hand, we can pretty conclusively (as best it's possible to do so) say that other humans are self-aware. We can describe our feelings using language and for the most part, what one of us thinks about lines up pretty well with what others think, even accounting for differences in gender, age, culture, etc.

In order to say that other animals really possess language, we would need to have evidence of some more insightful conversations, particularly between members of their own species, where it's clear that they're using language to accomplish goals among themselves.
 
2022-05-19 5:47:42 AM  

khatores: In order to say that other animals really possess language, we would need to have evidence of some more insightful conversations, particularly between members of their own species, where it's clear that they're using language to accomplish goals among themselves.


If you define language as a means of communicating intentions or ideas, then pretty much every living thing with a central nervous system does it.

Even insects have languages.
 
2022-05-19 6:09:13 AM  

Ishkur: khatores: In order to say that other animals really possess language, we would need to have evidence of some more insightful conversations, particularly between members of their own species, where it's clear that they're using language to accomplish goals among themselves.

If you define language as a means of communicating intentions or ideas, then pretty much every living thing with a central nervous system does it.

Even insects have languages.


Insects don't just have language, but slavery, war, and agriculture...  Chimpanzees conduct guerilla warfare.  Corvids engage is favor exchanges with humans.
 
2022-05-19 6:56:01 AM  
external-content.duckduckgo.comView Full Size
 
2022-05-19 7:12:28 AM  
khatores:

We have that in spades, but the scientific method is very strict and was heavily r-ed by Abrahamic religions'  biases on society from the start, so we have no "scientific" evidence that the extreme bar drawn for one true scotsman's definition of language between animals, but actually humans probably couldn't clear that bar if they spoke the same language as the scientist, let alone a foreign one so fark those nerds.

We know animals communicate. We know they have intelligence.  So right off the bat they're superior conservatives.
 
2022-05-19 7:43:44 AM  

leeksfromchichis: khatores:

We have that in spades, but the scientific method is very strict and was heavily r-ed by Abrahamic religions'  biases on society from the start, so we have no "scientific" evidence that the extreme bar drawn for one true scotsman's definition of language between animals, but actually humans probably couldn't clear that bar if they spoke the same language as the scientist, let alone a foreign one so fark those nerds.


Indeed...but just by virtue of having a set method of any kind, we're introducing bias into the equation one way or another.
 
2022-05-19 8:00:33 AM  
Ook oouhk?
Oook OOOK OOKA AHHHAHHHHAAA EEE EEEEEK OOOK!
/ooka ook
//oooh eee aah
/// Ooh oooh aah aah
 
2022-05-19 8:24:05 AM  
Animals use sounds to communicate, that is fact. How complex it gets is the only question.
 
2022-05-19 8:44:51 AM  
Corvids have been shown, by years-long-study, to be able to recognize individual characteristics of humans they deem threats, and then communicate that knowledge to a generation of decendants who will react to the person described as if they were a threat, never having firsthand experience of that person.  It's like an old hunter telling a son, "Beware of that one-eyed bear, Odin, he's a maneater!" and then on a hunt one day, years later, the boy-grown-to-manhood sees a bear with one eye and screams 'Odin!' and shoots it immediately."  That is some next-level communication skills.

The bottom line is, we barely know anything about cognition fundamentally, because it's the height of unethical to study a living human brain in any way that would reveal its functionality.  At least for now it is, maybe future imaging technology will change that.
 
2022-05-19 9:03:51 AM  

vudukungfu: Ook oouhk?
Oook OOOK OOKA AHHHAHHHHAAA EEE EEEEEK OOOK!
/ooka ook
//oooh eee aah
/// Ooh oooh aah aah


Ting
Tang
Walla walla Bing bang!
 
2022-05-19 11:25:42 AM  
Translation: "F*cking humans!  They're f*cking up the air, the water, the trees.  Let the uprising begin!"
 
2022-05-20 7:57:52 AM  

Marcos P: vudukungfu: Ook oouhk?
Oook OOOK OOKA AHHHAHHHHAAA EEE EEEEEK OOOK!
/ooka ook
//oooh eee aah
/// Ooh oooh aah aah

Ting
Tang
Walla walla Bing bang!


I see you've read the book of love
 
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