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(The Verge)   Inside the fight to save video game history. Yes, Nintendo is a big part of the problem   (theverge.com) divider line
    More: Sad, Nintendo, older games, Video game preservationists, Video game console, Video game industry, Game designer, video games, Video game  
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1421 clicks; posted to Fandom » and STEM » on 21 Mar 2022 at 11:50 AM (13 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



48 Comments     (+0 »)
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest
 
2022-03-21 12:42:18 PM  
Got it. I am morally obligated to download roms.
 
2022-03-21 12:44:54 PM  
1989 Nintendo Cereal System commercial
Youtube REpiQnnp6p8
 
2022-03-21 12:47:24 PM  

Jumpthruhoops: Got it. I am morally obligated to download roms.


Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2022-03-21 12:59:37 PM  
I've still got some of it in a closet upstairs.  Original X-Com, a PC joystick, probably one of those late-stage modems that only took up a tiny triangle of silicon.  Not sure what else.  Ooh probably Tie Fighter and X-Wing, which was why I needed the joystick.
 
2022-03-21 1:01:32 PM  

ThomasPaineTrain: Jumpthruhoops: Got it. I am morally obligated to download roms.

[Fark user image 425x213]


Thanks for this! I may be coming back periodically today, just for the chuckle. :-)
 
2022-03-21 1:01:53 PM  
Not to worry, Nintendo will bring them back on a new storefront.  For limited times.  At stupid prices.  And needing Amibo codes for full content.
 
2022-03-21 1:05:54 PM  
I mean, the world decided at some point that the only way to go was being capitalist free market. You can't expect Nintendo, Sony, Microsoft, whomever to keep all storefronts and all games available for eternity at costs to themselves. Video games are for profit, they are not a service to humanity. Sounds like they are already doing the best available solution by hoarding physical games and the hardware to play them, as well as saving digital files to hard drives, etc. Anything that has been produced since the early atari days is playable somewhere, some how. I really don't see what the problem is?
 
2022-03-21 1:07:34 PM  
Historical preservation is very important.  That said, anyone who uses it as an excuse to download ROMs because they feel entitled to play them is just looking for an excuse to do it.

I download ROMs, sure, but I don't pretend to argue that I'm entitled to it or that it's perfectly legit just because I want to.
 
2022-03-21 1:10:22 PM  

vilesithknight: I mean, the world decided at some point that the only way to go was being capitalist free market. You can't expect Nintendo, Sony, Microsoft, whomever to keep all storefronts and all games available for eternity at costs to themselves. Video games are for profit, they are not a service to humanity. Sounds like they are already doing the best available solution by hoarding physical games and the hardware to play them, as well as saving digital files to hard drives, etc. Anything that has been produced since the early atari days is playable somewhere, some how. I really don't see what the problem is?


Not necessarily.  The biggest problem is digital-only games.  Once those get pulled from digital storefronts (such as Scott Pilgrim did for a while) or the storefront itself goes away, that's it for access to those games.  At best, you might be able to find a device with them already installed and hope there's no account validation to actually play them, but preserving those games is a nightmare.

And then there's the issue of games that change significantly over time, which is becoming more and more common.  In that case, old versions can be completely lost.
 
2022-03-21 1:15:52 PM  
This is just another attempt to justify piracy.  What possible video games would be unavailable if not for "preservationists" making efforts to keep them around?

static-cdn.jtvnw.netView Full Size
 
2022-03-21 1:20:39 PM  
archive.org is doing an excellent job of hosting roms and video game bios'
 
2022-03-21 1:24:45 PM  

Dimensio: This is just another attempt to justify piracy.  What possible video games would be unavailable if not for "preservationists" making efforts to keep them around?


Software is great because it's totally goddamn indefensible, allowing me to choose to support developers and publishers for their attitudes, not their products, while totally and remorselessly pilfering all their shiat.

i.pinimg.comView Full Size
 
2022-03-21 1:28:03 PM  

NeoCortex42: vilesithknight: I mean, the world decided at some point that the only way to go was being capitalist free market. You can't expect Nintendo, Sony, Microsoft, whomever to keep all storefronts and all games available for eternity at costs to themselves. Video games are for profit, they are not a service to humanity. Sounds like they are already doing the best available solution by hoarding physical games and the hardware to play them, as well as saving digital files to hard drives, etc. Anything that has been produced since the early atari days is playable somewhere, some how. I really don't see what the problem is?

Not necessarily.  The biggest problem is digital-only games.  Once those get pulled from digital storefronts (such as Scott Pilgrim did for a while) or the storefront itself goes away, that's it for access to those games.  At best, you might be able to find a device with them already installed and hope there's no account validation to actually play them, but preserving those games is a nightmare.

And then there's the issue of games that change significantly over time, which is becoming more and more common.  In that case, old versions can be completely lost.


The real problem here though is that the only actual argument for things being made available on perpetuity is that content creators shouldn't be able to control their content once it exists. Which is actually a much more nuanced debate to be had than anything strictly limited to video games. Can an artist decline to sell a painting they've made if they don't want to? If they've offered it for sale in the past, can they change their mind? If they don't want it to be viewable by the public (ignoring the virtual impossibility of that in the modern day given the way cameras and the internet works) should they be allowed to not display it to the public? Because a lot of the argument that things that were once available must always be available ultimately boils down to "creators shouldn't be allowed to control the things they create", which I'm not sure I can get behind, no matter how much I loved some particular games in my youth.

It's also touched upon in the "some games change significantly over time" aspect of it. It carries the same sort of potential consequences. "I liked that painting better without the happy little trees", which is an absolutely valid opinion and viewpoint, but not one that I'm comfortable saying creators should be beholden to. If the creator don't like the painting without the trees, your opinion shouldn't really matter beyond whether or not you choose to consume the creation. Having some sort of moral or legal obligation to continue providing support for a product the creator doesn't wish to support will probably only lead to fewer products reaching the market officially, which may be a benefit if it means the videogame world is spared the sea of unfinished product meant to milk the most out of micro transactions as possible, but could have serious effects on the willingness of creators to put their work out there in the first place if a game could both flop *and* require them to keep it functional way into the days of the PS17 in a future decade.
 
2022-03-21 1:36:41 PM  
darkmythology:
The real problem here though is that the only actual argument for things being made available on perpetuity is that content creators shouldn't be able to control their content once it exists. Which is actually a much more nuanced debate to be had than anything strictly limited to video games. Can an artist decline to sell a painting they've made if they don't want to? If they've offered it for sale in the past, can they change their mind? If they don't want it to be viewable by the public (ignoring the virtual impossibility of that in the modern day given the way cameras and the internet works) should they be allowed to not display it to the public? Because a lot of the argument that things that were once available must always be available ultimately boils down to "creators shouldn't be ...

Agreed that this thing tends to be more nuanced than hyperbolic mouthpieces and dedicated rom collectors give it credit for.

Counterpoint(?): the lack of control creators have over their digital media forces them to build a more personal connection to their consumer through good behavior and excellence, and makes it easier for consumers to selectively Darwinize garbage companies out of existence.  For example, I explode my wallet for the Total Warhammer games and all of their expensive DLC because there's an unbelievable amount of art and effort going into them, whereas I steal absolutely everything Paradox Interactive makes and smile and laugh at the thought of their revenue stream withering to nothing and everyone having to find new jobs because their content model is abusive nonsense.

I don't have that kind of power when it comes to buying a bag of chips.  I either buy the brand, or not.  Lays has more control over me in this regard.

Well, don't buy the chips, you say!  That's of course not how hungry people work.

Go forth and steal!  Buy a Nintendo Switch!  The new Kirby game is very good!  And steal all the old ones!  Shape Nintendo's behavior buy forcing them to engage your purchasing habits on your terms, not theirs.
 
2022-03-21 1:40:04 PM  

vilesithknight: I mean, the world decided at some point that the only way to go was being capitalist free market. You can't expect Nintendo, Sony, Microsoft, whomever to keep all storefronts and all games available for eternity at costs to themselves. Video games are for profit, they are not a service to humanity. Sounds like they are already doing the best available solution by hoarding physical games and the hardware to play them, as well as saving digital files to hard drives, etc. Anything that has been produced since the early atari days is playable somewhere, some how. I really don't see what the problem is?


Half of the problem is that games published 40 years ago for systems that haven't been sold new for almost as long are still protected by I.P. laws.

The US copyright used to be limited to two 14-year terms.  Now it is around 100 years.  It would be nice to see it return to 14-year terms, but with a renewal fee that grows significantly with each renewal, nudging orphaned and unprofitable works out of copyright.
 
2022-03-21 1:40:06 PM  
Currently building a bartop arcade machine that will hopefully play every game from every system made before 2000 or so.

\ copied thousands of roms onto the memory card yesterday
\\ made a new joystick too.
\\\ Getting a kick etc...
 
2022-03-21 1:42:33 PM  

Lord Bear: Currently building a bartop arcade machine that will hopefully play every game from every system made before 2000 or so.

\ copied thousands of roms onto the memory card yesterday
\\ made a new joystick too.
\\\ Getting a kick etc...


SIR WOULD YOU COPY A POTATO CHIP??? THINK OF THE FARMERS WITH THEIR HANDS IN THE EARTH
 
2022-03-21 1:49:34 PM  

darkmythology: NeoCortex42: vilesithknight: I mean, the world decided at some point that the only way to go was being capitalist free market. You can't expect Nintendo, Sony, Microsoft, whomever to keep all storefronts and all games available for eternity at costs to themselves. Video games are for profit, they are not a service to humanity. Sounds like they are already doing the best available solution by hoarding physical games and the hardware to play them, as well as saving digital files to hard drives, etc. Anything that has been produced since the early atari days is playable somewhere, some how. I really don't see what the problem is?

Not necessarily.  The biggest problem is digital-only games.  Once those get pulled from digital storefronts (such as Scott Pilgrim did for a while) or the storefront itself goes away, that's it for access to those games.  At best, you might be able to find a device with them already installed and hope there's no account validation to actually play them, but preserving those games is a nightmare.

And then there's the issue of games that change significantly over time, which is becoming more and more common.  In that case, old versions can be completely lost.

The real problem here though is that the only actual argument for things being made available on perpetuity is that content creators shouldn't be able to control their content once it exists. Which is actually a much more nuanced debate to be had than anything strictly limited to video games. Can an artist decline to sell a painting they've made if they don't want to? If they've offered it for sale in the past, can they change their mind? If they don't want it to be viewable by the public (ignoring the virtual impossibility of that in the modern day given the way cameras and the internet works) should they be allowed to not display it to the public? Because a lot of the argument that things that were once available must always be available ultimately boils down to "creators shouldn't be ...


There's two different things going on here:
Retail availability
Historical preservation

People like to conflate the two in order to justify piracy, but they are very different situations.  To make an analogy using movies, I would like the theatrical version of Star Wars to be available at retail, but regardless of what version you prefer, the theatrical version should absolutely be historically persevered in some capacity for historical significance and scholarly study.
 
2022-03-21 2:03:32 PM  
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2022-03-21 2:07:08 PM  
Is is me, or does "The fight to save video game history" sound like it comes from the same people who gave us "it's about ethics in gaming journalism"?
 
2022-03-21 2:07:28 PM  
FTA: Section 1201 allows for the preservation of video games not currently being sold but limits their access to the preserving institution's physical location. Because of Section 1201, the only way to make use of MADE or the Video Game History Foundation's archives is to be physically present at their locations. Despite the fact that these games can be loaned and distributed digitally, with all kinds of protections to ensure legitimate use, off-site access is not allowed. This creates a serious burden for video game scholars and makes these archives essentially unusable.

That's not an unreasonable restriction with preservation.  This isn't a public library with a license to loan.
 
2022-03-21 2:10:59 PM  

Myk-House of El: [Fark user image 850x637]


I've downloaded a couple 3D printer model files so my neighbor could print out some replacement parts for my car, so I am getting a kick out of that.
 
2022-03-21 2:11:03 PM  
I just purchased a VCS 800 for $249 solely to use as an emulator box.  With the two 60 dollar contrrolers in the box, the box itself was on 125 bucks.  Not a huge deal and I could build better, but not with the same build quality.
 
2022-03-21 2:12:51 PM  
https://www.zophar.net/

All your emulator needs
 
2022-03-21 2:13:14 PM  

NeoCortex42: darkmythology: NeoCortex42: vilesithknight: I mean, the world decided at some point that the only way to go was being capitalist free market. You can't expect Nintendo, Sony, Microsoft, whomever to keep all storefronts and all games available for eternity at costs to themselves. Video games are for profit, they are not a service to humanity. Sounds like they are already doing the best available solution by hoarding physical games and the hardware to play them, as well as saving digital files to hard drives, etc. Anything that has been produced since the early atari days is playable somewhere, some how. I really don't see what the problem is?

Not necessarily.  The biggest problem is digital-only games.  Once those get pulled from digital storefronts (such as Scott Pilgrim did for a while) or the storefront itself goes away, that's it for access to those games.  At best, you might be able to find a device with them already installed and hope there's no account validation to actually play them, but preserving those games is a nightmare.

And then there's the issue of games that change significantly over time, which is becoming more and more common.  In that case, old versions can be completely lost.

The real problem here though is that the only actual argument for things being made available on perpetuity is that content creators shouldn't be able to control their content once it exists. Which is actually a much more nuanced debate to be had than anything strictly limited to video games. Can an artist decline to sell a painting they've made if they don't want to? If they've offered it for sale in the past, can they change their mind? If they don't want it to be viewable by the public (ignoring the virtual impossibility of that in the modern day given the way cameras and the internet works) should they be allowed to not display it to the public? Because a lot of the argument that things that were once available must always be available ultimately boils down to "creato ...


Fair point. Plus now you are directly speaking to me personally. I kept my original theatrical release VHS tapes of Star Wars for a reason...
 
2022-03-21 2:15:06 PM  

Myk-House of El: [Fark user image image 850x637]


I should go pirate some Gran Turismo games.
 
2022-03-21 2:32:19 PM  
Eventually the likes of GOG or Steam are going to get to the point where they can deliver emulation of old console games with minimal cost the same way Spotify does for music. At that point, the illegal industry will dry up because legal and easy is always preferred to illegal and complicated.

It took a long time for the music industry to get to that point, but it seems to have established a new, happy paradigm. Video games will get there eventually, too.
 
2022-03-21 2:37:30 PM  

ReapTheChaos: Is is me, or does "The fight to save video game history" sound like it comes from the same people who gave us "it's about ethics in gaming journalism"?


Nah, this has nothing to do with misogyny. It's about if a company has the right to restrict or deny access to something they own the rights for over time or if people are entitled to be allowed access to games no longer available for sale in the name of preservation and historical relevance.
 
2022-03-21 2:45:52 PM  

Shaggy_C: Eventually the likes of GOG or Steam are going to get to the point where they can deliver emulation of old console games with minimal cost the same way Spotify does for music. At that point, the illegal industry will dry up because legal and easy is always preferred to illegal and complicated.

It took a long time for the music industry to get to that point, but it seems to have established a new, happy paradigm. Video games will get there eventually, too.


I mean, that's already kind of happening with GamePass, EA Play and Ubisoft+. But console IP rights are way trickier for much of it, like Nintendo isn't going to let GOG or Steam use their titles. SEGA already releases classic collections every couple of years. Sony isn't going to let either use their First Party titles either classic or newer.

And that's before you get into the music licensing for the games (see GTA remasters as an example), the various IP rights for studios that don't even exist anymore, rights for brands like TMNT where the licensing of the characters isn't owned by the game publishers (and whoo boy were there ever a lot of commercial IP games in the NES/SEGA era).

A bunch of old titles are licensing nightmares, and the demand doesn't merit the effort, which is why you don't see anything like that.
 
2022-03-21 2:53:44 PM  

Lumbar Puncture: Shaggy_C: Eventually the likes of GOG or Steam are going to get to the point where they can deliver emulation of old console games with minimal cost the same way Spotify does for music. At that point, the illegal industry will dry up because legal and easy is always preferred to illegal and complicated.

It took a long time for the music industry to get to that point, but it seems to have established a new, happy paradigm. Video games will get there eventually, too.

I mean, that's already kind of happening with GamePass, EA Play and Ubisoft+. But console IP rights are way trickier for much of it, like Nintendo isn't going to let GOG or Steam use their titles. SEGA already releases classic collections every couple of years. Sony isn't going to let either use their First Party titles either classic or newer.

And that's before you get into the music licensing for the games (see GTA remasters as an example), the various IP rights for studios that don't even exist anymore, rights for brands like TMNT where the licensing of the characters isn't owned by the game publishers (and whoo boy were there ever a lot of commercial IP games in the NES/SEGA era).

A bunch of old titles are licensing nightmares, and the demand doesn't merit the effort, which is why you don't see anything like that.


Just look at GoldenEye. Publishing rights held by Nintendo, source code controlled by Microsoft, story/names licensed by the film studio, character likenesses licensed by the actors. It's a complete farking mess.
 
2022-03-21 3:26:13 PM  
I love my emulation devices from my fire stick to my odroid n2+. Even my anbernic 351 or my pandora's box a partial arcade cabinet that hooks up to a TV.Me and the boy beat the Simpson's arcade game where otherwise we'd have spent like $15 in quarters.
 
2022-03-21 4:07:18 PM  

Buttforce: Lord Bear: Currently building a bartop arcade machine that will hopefully play every game from every system made before 2000 or so.

\ copied thousands of roms onto the memory card yesterday
\\ made a new joystick too.
\\\ Getting a kick etc...

SIR WOULD YOU COPY A POTATO CHIP??? THINK OF THE FARMERS WITH THEIR HANDS IN THE EARTH


Been done.

Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2022-03-21 4:23:14 PM  

Lumbar Puncture: A bunch of old titles are licensing nightmares, and the demand doesn't merit the effort, which is why you don't see anything like that.


But how is this fundamentally different than, say, music from the 1960s, when you had separate regional labels competing with oneanother for each single and which to this day can retain different distribution rights by country? The cost-benefit analysis makes sense, but I have to believe that the vast majority of games could be done pretty simply and cheaply. Even in the complicated cases like a Goldeneye you just need to agree the percentage of revenue share between the various license holders and then you're off to printing money.
 
2022-03-21 4:48:51 PM  

vilesithknight: Anything that has been produced since the early atari days is playable somewhere, some how. I really don't see what the problem is?


Except that I'm not sure this is true.  I read an article very similar to this one about two years ago, only the prime example they used was a Tomb Raider game that was a Nokia phone exclusive from over a decade ago.  With this example, the chips that run software in older cellphones are not the same chips that run your PC.  Somebody has to take the time not only to write a cellphone emulator (seriously) but also find a way to memory dump the game out of the old phone.  The complaint, specifically, was that even if you don't want to play some crappy pixelated game on your 12 key phone, that the game in question contained lore about the "Lara Croft Universe" that didn't exist in any other game and cannot be otherwise verified.  Ok, maybe you don't care that this one game is the only time we learn what the name of Lara's childhood pet porcupine is, but the argument can apply to any cross platformed franchise.... maybe one you do care about like Zelda or Pac Man or Star Wars.  But anyway, the point is, its my understanding that not everything has been made emulatable or preserved.  This is likely true for major consoles and even some notable failed ones.  But.. we don't know how many flash games never got archived because back in its infancy nobody considered the possibility of its obsolescence.  More recently, even if you have Power Rangers: Battle for the Grid on a cartridge, you don't have the bug fixes and DLC that you download from the platform's server backed up on hard media.
 
2022-03-21 4:49:12 PM  

Shaggy_C: Even in the complicated cases like a Goldeneye you just need to agree the percentage of revenue share between the various license holders and then you're off to printing money.


And that's where a lot are going to fail. This isn't just music labels, it's music AND publisher AND developer, and in the case of Goldeneye, movie studio and actor. And every game is going to have a different combination of that and all of it is going to be super messy.

In music you have distributors which handle all of that and are consolidated and have already existing agreements with labels. The relationship between publisher and developer is different than that relationship between distributor and label/artist. Like Silicon Knights developed Eternal Darkness, but Nintendo owns the rights to the license and even had ownership of the sanity system used in it (and of course SK doesn't exist any more since it imploded spectacularly over multiple things, like game engine licensing). Not to mention the rights that were never bought during auctions or when multiple parties are involved (such as Disney or WB) who aren't going to share what they believe is rightfully theirs.
 
2022-03-21 4:53:57 PM  

NeoCortex42: Lumbar Puncture: Shaggy_C: Eventually the likes of GOG or Steam are going to get to the point where they can deliver emulation of old console games with minimal cost the same way Spotify does for music. At that point, the illegal industry will dry up because legal and easy is always preferred to illegal and complicated.

It took a long time for the music industry to get to that point, but it seems to have established a new, happy paradigm. Video games will get there eventually, too.

I mean, that's already kind of happening with GamePass, EA Play and Ubisoft+. But console IP rights are way trickier for much of it, like Nintendo isn't going to let GOG or Steam use their titles. SEGA already releases classic collections every couple of years. Sony isn't going to let either use their First Party titles either classic or newer.

And that's before you get into the music licensing for the games (see GTA remasters as an example), the various IP rights for studios that don't even exist anymore, rights for brands like TMNT where the licensing of the characters isn't owned by the game publishers (and whoo boy were there ever a lot of commercial IP games in the NES/SEGA era).

A bunch of old titles are licensing nightmares, and the demand doesn't merit the effort, which is why you don't see anything like that.

Just look at GoldenEye. Publishing rights held by Nintendo, source code controlled by Microsoft, story/names licensed by the film studio, character likenesses licensed by the actors. It's a complete farking mess.


And I just realized that movie studio was MGM.  So now you need a joint agreement between Nintendo, Microsoft, Amazon, plus actor likeness agreements to get a modern port released.
 
2022-03-21 5:27:31 PM  

ThomasPaineTrain: Myk-House of El: [Fark user image image 850x637]

I should go pirate some Gran Turismo games.


From what I've read about the economy in GT7, you may need to go further in order to get the best cars in any sort of reasonable amount of time.

Linky
 
2022-03-21 6:51:15 PM  
I don't understand that company at all. All of us are seeking some "simpler times" nostalgia right now and early Nintendo games and consoles are a huge part of that for a lot of people. They could be making so much more money if they would just lighten the fark up
 
2022-03-21 7:02:09 PM  

Karma Chameleon: I don't understand that company at all. All of us are seeking some "simpler times" nostalgia right now and early Nintendo games and consoles are a huge part of that for a lot of people. They could be making so much more money if they would just lighten the fark up


It's the same attitude as the Disney Vault. Lock stuff away for years at a time, then get a surge in sales when the new release becomes an event.

It's not consumer-friendly, but it makes perfect sense for a company.
 
2022-03-21 7:45:02 PM  

Gordon Bennett: Buttforce: Lord Bear: Currently building a bartop arcade machine that will hopefully play every game from every system made before 2000 or so.

\ copied thousands of roms onto the memory card yesterday
\\ made a new joystick too.
\\\ Getting a kick etc...

SIR WOULD YOU COPY A POTATO CHIP??? THINK OF THE FARMERS WITH THEIR HANDS IN THE EARTH

Been done.

[Fark user image image 850x647]


The thing that especially sucked about this case and others like them is it gives hippies another reason to go LOOK GMOS ARE BAD BIG AGRICULTURE RUINS EVERYTHING, and, no, the problem here is capitalism, doofuses.
 
2022-03-21 11:24:35 PM  

darkmythology: NeoCortex42: vilesithknight: I mean, the world decided at some point that the only way to go was being capitalist free market. You can't expect Nintendo, Sony, Microsoft, whomever to keep all storefronts and all games available for eternity at costs to themselves. Video games are for profit, they are not a service to humanity. Sounds like they are already doing the best available solution by hoarding physical games and the hardware to play them, as well as saving digital files to hard drives, etc. Anything that has been produced since the early atari days is playable somewhere, some how. I really don't see what the problem is?

Not necessarily.  The biggest problem is digital-only games.  Once those get pulled from digital storefronts (such as Scott Pilgrim did for a while) or the storefront itself goes away, that's it for access to those games.  At best, you might be able to find a device with them already installed and hope there's no account validation to actually play them, but preserving those games is a nightmare.

And then there's the issue of games that change significantly over time, which is becoming more and more common.  In that case, old versions can be completely lost.

The real problem here though is that the only actual argument for things being made available on perpetuity is that content creators shouldn't be able to control their content once it exists. Which is actually a much more nuanced debate to be had than anything strictly limited to video games. Can an artist decline to sell a painting they've made if they don't want to? If they've offered it for sale in the past, can they change their mind? If they don't want it to be viewable by the public (ignoring the virtual impossibility of that in the modern day given the way cameras and the internet works) should they be allowed to not display it to the public? Because a lot of the argument that things that were once available must always be available ultimately boils down to "creators shouldn't be ...


Well considering cameras exist, as long as one picture was taken then someone has the ability to see it even if you burn every copy in existence.  Same with music, sure you can take down this album that you've been selling for a decade so no one can buy it, but people can still probably listen to it on youtube, listen to live performances, play covers of the damn song. 

Like this is probably more likely to head in the direction of Metallica playing at BlizzCon on twitch where they were replaced by 8-bit music because of copy-write concerns.

I mean I could agree if, well, lets face it, we both know this is about billion dollar corporations wanting more $$$.  Whoever actually created the damn 'art' doesn't have any control over it's being available anyways.
 
2022-03-22 12:14:33 AM  

NeoCortex42: Karma Chameleon: I don't understand that company at all. All of us are seeking some "simpler times" nostalgia right now and early Nintendo games and consoles are a huge part of that for a lot of people. They could be making so much more money if they would just lighten the fark up

It's the same attitude as the Disney Vault. Lock stuff away for years at a time, then get a surge in sales when the new release becomes an event.

It's not consumer-friendly, but it makes perfect sense for a company.


And if some things just don't get rereleased, well, that just makes the surge for the things that DO get rereleased bigger, because who knows when it'll happen again?

IP laws need a serious kick in the junk.
 
2022-03-22 4:15:52 AM  
That is, if you want a legal way to play them. As games age and as companies continue to remove the means to properly purchase and download them, people are looking at other, less than legitimate options to continue to play the games they enjoy.

That's the way to do it. Pirate away. Thanks to our laws having been written by corporations, the only options are to either break those laws or sit passively as gaming history vanishes.
 
2022-03-22 8:22:03 AM  

vilesithknight: I mean, the world decided at some point that the only way to go was being capitalist free market. You can't expect Nintendo, Sony, Microsoft, whomever to keep all storefronts and all games available for eternity at costs to themselves. Video games are for profit, they are not a service to humanity. Sounds like they are already doing the best available solution by hoarding physical games and the hardware to play them, as well as saving digital files to hard drives, etc. Anything that has been produced since the early atari days is playable somewhere, some how. I really don't see what the problem is?


This, "grow up", and "move on" are really all that needed to be said in this thread.
 
2022-03-22 9:37:40 AM  

Hate Tank: I've still got some of it in a closet upstairs.  Original X-Com, a PC joystick, probably one of those late-stage modems that only took up a tiny triangle of silicon.  Not sure what else.  Ooh probably Tie Fighter and X-Wing, which was why I needed the joystick.


*sigh* i haven't been able to find a good joystick since my beloved Microsoft 3D Pro finally bit the bullet.  I've rarely been a fan of MS software but i always found their hardware to be great, until they try to improve it.

for instance : the OG that was farking fantastic.  the newly "improved" fold-flat version is hot trash.
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2022-03-22 9:49:27 AM  
You think it's bad now? Wait till everything is cloud based and vanishes quicker then the flick of a server power switch. Oh... we're almost there even for PC gaming thanks to Windows progression to SaaS instead of a general purpose OS.
 
2022-03-22 10:09:09 AM  

Nimbull: You think it's bad now? Wait till everything is cloud based and vanishes quicker then the flick of a server power switch. Oh... we're almost there even for PC gaming thanks to Windows progression to SaaS instead of a general purpose OS.


Kind of ironic that we're heading in the direction of bringing back dumb terminals.  That seems to be the natural progression here, except instead of working off a server down the hall, it will be a cloud server several states away.
 
2022-03-23 12:17:17 AM  

tom baker's scarf: Hate Tank: I've still got some of it in a closet upstairs.  Original X-Com, a PC joystick, probably one of those late-stage modems that only took up a tiny triangle of silicon.  Not sure what else.  Ooh probably Tie Fighter and X-Wing, which was why I needed the joystick.

*sigh* i haven't been able to find a good joystick since my beloved Microsoft 3D Pro finally bit the bullet.  I've rarely been a fan of MS software but i always found their hardware to be great, until they try to improve it.

for instance : the OG that was farking fantastic.  the newly "improved" fold-flat version is hot trash.
[Fark user image 850x504]


sm.pcmag.comView Full Size

Being a fan of a touchstrip, for easy scrolling through multiple pages while having three separate middle buttons, the pinnacle for me was the Explorer Touch.

They recently tried with the arc touch, but you can't hold down the middle button, which is a dealbreaker for anyone that uses that functionality, for example to change view in Fusion 360 or do similar things in other programs.

I have two, they are well over a decade old, and I'll probably cannibalize one to keep the other going as long as I can.
 
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