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(The Hill)   New poll finds most Americans see Biden as likeable and intelligent, but not as a strong, decisive leader who's just so darn likeable   (thehill.com) divider line
    More: Interesting, President of the United States, Democratic Party, Joe Biden, Jimmy Carter, Barack Obama, Gerald Ford, Harry S. Truman, percent view Biden  
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777 clicks; posted to Politics » on 25 Jan 2022 at 2:35 PM (16 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2022-01-25 11:00:45 AM  
I'm trying to decide who was the last president who was strong and decisive? Bush the elder?

Politicians are more reluctant to do anything except spout their party lines than at anytime in the 40 years I've been voting.
 
2022-01-25 11:46:13 AM  
He comes across as the well-meaning fun uncle that maybe doesn't always think before he speaks.

Contrast that with Trump being the asshole racist uncle that the entire family tries to avoid outside of Thanksgiving and Christmas, but put up with him because he's not worth arguing with and ruining the mood.
 
2022-01-25 1:31:07 PM  
What is he indecisive about?
 
2022-01-25 1:55:58 PM  

Mugato: What is he indecisive about?


You know... stuff!

He's not a big, strong man like Daddy Trump, who put people in their place and told them to take it like a man. Yeah, he said and did things that hurt, but it was only to toughen us up so we wouldn't be wussies, because really, he loved us and wasn't at all insecure about his place in the world. And one day, when he sees us picking on those other, weaker wusses in the UN like Ukraine who go crying to NATO because they can't stand up to a real man like Putin, with his gleaming, bulging muscles on a horse like a dreamy mix of John Wayne and Rock Hudson, on that day he'll look at us and say he's proud of us.

I'm sorry, what were we talking about again?

Right, Biden is weak because inflation is happening and it's all his fault.
 
2022-01-25 2:36:39 PM  
And it's your Daily Derp from The Hill.
 
2022-01-25 2:37:26 PM  

nmrsnr: Mugato: What is he indecisive about?

You know... stuff!

He's not a big, strong man like Daddy Trump, who put people in their place and told them to take it like a man. Yeah, he said and did things that hurt, but it was only to toughen us up so we wouldn't be wussies, because really, he loved us and wasn't at all insecure about his place in the world. And one day, when he sees us picking on those other, weaker wusses in the UN like Ukraine who go crying to NATO because they can't stand up to a real man like Putin, with his gleaming, bulging muscles on a horse like a dreamy mix of John Wayne and Rock Hudson, on that day he'll look at us and say he's proud of us.

I'm sorry, what were we talking about again?

Right, Biden is weak because inflation is happening and it's all his fault.


I hate so much that you just described too many people I know.
 
2022-01-25 2:38:13 PM  
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2022-01-25 2:38:32 PM  
"Less than half of those surveyed also believed Biden could manage the government effectively (38 percent)"

This is because most people have no idea of what the President actually does, and will never be in any sort of senior management position themselves, which would give them the very start of understanding.
 
2022-01-25 2:38:49 PM  

edmo: I'm trying to decide who was the last president who was strong and decisive? Bush the elder?

Politicians are more reluctant to do anything except spout their party lines than at anytime in the 40 years I've been voting.


It's pretty easy to look "decisive" when you're not swimming against any currents.

/voted Dukakis
 
2022-01-25 2:39:13 PM  

whidbey: And it's your Daily Derp from The Hill.


You do God's work.
 
2022-01-25 2:39:27 PM  
I agree.

I like Biden but he's exactly the wrong choice we need now. He's not a fascist Republican or obstructionist dickbag like Manchin or Sinema and that's nice, but we need an FDR or LBJ and not a Carter or Buchanan.
 
2022-01-25 2:40:14 PM  
Please, someone develop a rational computer generated Artificial Intelligence that I can vote for, this can't be worse.

imore.comView Full Size


Nevermind. Existence is hell.
 
2022-01-25 2:40:24 PM  

BigNumber12: "Less than half of those surveyed also believed Biden could manage the government effectively (38 percent)"

This is because most people have no idea of what the President actually does, and will never be in any sort of senior management position themselves, which would give them the very start of understanding.


I thought it was because he can't even control his own party to pass legislation that has broad support?

But thanks for demsplaining.
 
2022-01-25 2:41:11 PM  
You have to lean Democrat to think he is likable and smart and that is at 60%.

From there he drops significantly on being a strong decisive leader

That means his base doesn't like the job he is doing.
 
2022-01-25 2:41:55 PM  
Interesting, because he is overturning Obama and Trump era failed foreign policy decisions.

Almost like people who want authoritarian regimes in Russia and China want Biden to look weak and indecisive like Trump and Obama were.
 
2022-01-25 2:44:10 PM  
Doesn't a President yell at the kid mowing the grass?
Biden is weak because that kid mowed the grass last summer and did a crap job.
Putin saw on his satellite that the White House lawn was chopped up and said "Now iz zee time to take Ukraine.  American President WEAK!"
 
2022-01-25 2:44:51 PM  

nmrsnr: He's not a big, strong man like Daddy Trump, who put people in their place and told them to take it like a man.


You sure that wasn't what Putin said to Trump before their...ahem...summits?
 
2022-01-25 2:45:24 PM  
He tried to be a leader. He's failed at it.

Decisive? Sure, I can agree with that. Strong? He doesn't throw the testosterone that Obama did in pics with Putin, but I have noticed that Putin started tucking his chin again.

His biggest drawback seems to be his naïveté, in that he presumed his party was unified behind him and the Republicans wouldn't be such obstructionists.

In a more normal political environment he'd be acceptable, but right now he's fallen short. It'll be interesting to see what if any adjustments he makes in the next two years.
 
2022-01-25 2:45:39 PM  

Laobaojun: Interesting, because he is overturning Obama and Trump era failed foreign policy decisions.

Almost like people who want authoritarian regimes in Russia and China want Biden to look weak and indecisive like Trump and Obama were.


You were ok until you BSAB'd all over your bib there.

You might clean it up.  It stinks too.
 
2022-01-25 2:46:55 PM  
The Executive is supposed to execute. It's not always going to be possible to make the perfect decision. So we hire someone to make A decision.

But the kind of things being thrown at  Joe are not necessarily the president's problems to solve.

The idea that the president becomes the leader of the party is dumb, second in stupidity only to the existence of political parties in the structure of our government in the first place.

The very first president we had said 'Hey, watch out for this, it's a bad idea.' and we said 'Right you are, George' and ignored him before he was dead.
 
2022-01-25 2:47:27 PM  
What is perceived as strong during the pandemic? I'd be interested in how this plays out on governors-my guess would be that "go out and have fun with the virus, kids" is strong and "we put this masking policy in place because the state health system requires it and your whining is irrelevant" is weak.
 
2022-01-25 2:47:37 PM  
Thank you, Joe                            Manchin
 
2022-01-25 2:48:21 PM  
We don't want a Representative Republic...we want a Dictator.

/ you know who ELSE perpetuated a big lie because it was politically expedient and got them that Dictatorship that they always craved?
 
2022-01-25 2:49:13 PM  
The only thing strong about TFG is his body odor.
 
2022-01-25 2:49:17 PM  
He's a tyrant!
He's not mean enough!

Make up your minds.
 
2022-01-25 2:49:19 PM  

Night Train to Wakanda: BigNumber12: "Less than half of those surveyed also believed Biden could manage the government effectively (38 percent)"

This is because most people have no idea of what the President actually does, and will never be in any sort of senior management position themselves, which would give them the very start of understanding.

I thought it was because he can't even control his own party to pass legislation that has broad support?

But thanks for demsplaining.


All you had to say was that you don't understand how Congress works.
 
2022-01-25 2:49:28 PM  
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2022-01-25 2:52:00 PM  
I think everyone on the left/center more or less agrees he is likeable but the youngish professional left wants money in the form of loan forgiveness and the more further left people really buy into the narrative that we are about to slip into fascism so they can't understand Biden's lack of urgency on voting rights. That is where the difference is coming from, not because some trumper likes Biden thinks he is smart but thinks he is a weak leader.
 
2022-01-25 2:53:40 PM  
Did Derpmitter have a stroke while hurrying out that headline? Maybe English is your fourth language?
 
2022-01-25 2:54:21 PM  
This mostly positive piece of news about a Gallup opinion poll did not meet my standards of immodest praise for President Biden. The Hill is clearly a Russian psy ops.
 
2022-01-25 2:54:26 PM  

Visual Howlaround Title Sequence: I agree.

I like Biden but he's exactly the wrong choice we need now. He's not a fascist Republican or obstructionist dickbag like Manchin or Sinema and that's nice, but we need an FDR or LBJ and not a Carter or Buchanan.


Peki: He tried to be a leader. He's failed at it.

Decisive? Sure, I can agree with that. Strong? He doesn't throw the testosterone that Obama did in pics with Putin, but I have noticed that Putin started tucking his chin again.

His biggest drawback seems to be his naïveté, in that he presumed his party was unified behind him and the Republicans wouldn't be such obstructionists.

In a more normal political environment he'd be acceptable, but right now he's fallen short. It'll be interesting to see what if any adjustments he makes in the next two years.


Biden's problem is he's trying to be a 1970s Democrat in the 2020s.

This article written during the 2016 primaries also applies here:

"Looking at 1968, it would seem the lesson that history has for us is that Democrats need to be really careful about assuming that the establishment candidate is the key to electoral victory. But what about 1972? Isn't the lesson of that election that Democrats suffer their most devastating losses when they run candidates who speak to the party's progressive base.

Actually, no. The lesson of 1972 is something quite different. To begin with, McGovern was not a particularly strong candidate. He had secured the nomination with only a quarter of the primary votes.  The unions refused to work for him. And he ran a poor campaign. Even more significant, he was going up against a sitting president, Richard Nixon, who had brought troop levels in Vietnam down from almost half a million to around 30,000, had eased Cold War tensions by going to China and had stabilized the economy, at least temporarily, by implementing wage and price controls. Nixon would have been tough to beat under any circumstances, and McGovern was not the candidate to do it.

But the real lesson that McGovern's defeat teaches us is not the dangers of progressivism so much as the dangers of being out of step with the electorate. Every few decades, the existing political order is completely overturned and in the upheaval a new order emerges.  This happened in the 1930s, when Franklin Delano Roosevelt replaced what has been called the 'Republican Ascendancy' with his New Deal Coalition. It happened again in the late 1960s and early 1970s when the rise of the right replaced the liberalism of the New Deal.

We are due for another upheaval and there are indications that we are actually in the middle of one right now. If that is the case, then what the election of 1972 teaches us is not that McGovern was too liberal for voters but that he was too out of step. He was trying to run as a '60s liberal when the electorate had moved well beyond the '60s, just as Clinton is running as a '90s triangulating liberal when voters are hungry for change.

History has some important lessons to teach.  They are just not the one that pundits and establishment politicians are claiming."

https://www.salon.com/2016/03/06/democrats_have_their_history_wrong_and_are_about_to_make_a_grievous_mistake/
 
2022-01-25 2:55:23 PM  

BigNumber12: Night Train to Wakanda: BigNumber12: "Less than half of those surveyed also believed Biden could manage the government effectively (38 percent)"

This is because most people have no idea of what the President actually does, and will never be in any sort of senior management position themselves, which would give them the very start of understanding.

I thought it was because he can't even control his own party to pass legislation that has broad support?

But thanks for demsplaining.

All you had to say was that you don't understand how Congress works.


I too remember when naïveté was an asset and not a liability.

It's okay if you don't understand how politics works and choose to hide behind the mechanical operations as some mealy mouthed dungeons and dragons rules lawyer.

But we both know that just makes you look like a pedantic dick. So you couldn't possibly do that.
 
2022-01-25 2:56:22 PM  

Rapmaster2000: [Fark user image 640x480]


Third Way triangulation is a losing strategy. It's trying to uphold a middle ground between sense and nonsense.
 
2022-01-25 2:56:39 PM  
Many people have really farking stupid ideas of what makes a good leader. Case in point: 70 some odd million people voted for Donald Trump in 2020. Among other toxic bullshiat ideas, Trumpers go along with his belief that apologizing for anything ever is "weak".

Night Train to Wakanda:
I thought it was because he can't even control his own party to pass legislation that has broad support?

But thanks for demsplaining.


And then there are progressives who think if a leader can't force 50 of 50 Democratic senators to vote his way, he must be weak. Maybe so, or maybe two of those senators are just especially shiatty. Leaders can persuade and pressure, but ultimately no matter how able they are, they may run into a particularly stubborn obstructionist. Then what?
 
2022-01-25 2:57:16 PM  
I honestly can't think of a single person who could do a better job right now given the current situation.

He doesn't have the votes and he never had them to do much of anything lasting.
 
2022-01-25 2:57:39 PM  

Headso: I think everyone on the left/center more or less agrees he is likeable but the youngish professional left wants money in the form of loan forgiveness and the more further left people really buy into the narrative that we are about to slip into fascism so they can't understand Biden's lack of urgency on voting rights. That is where the difference is coming from, not because some trumper likes Biden thinks he is smart but thinks he is a weak leader.


FTA: From 2020 to 2022, Democrats' perceptions of three of Biden's traits fell significantly -- effective government management (-19 points), strong leadership (-12 points) and caring (-8 points).

Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2022-01-25 2:59:02 PM  

Decorus: I honestly can't think of a single person who could do a better job right now given the current situation.

He doesn't have the votes and he never had them to do much of anything lasting.


Which is why the best strategy is ultimately holding the line until we have more Democrats in Congress

and fewer Republicans.

And that makes the Purity Test Brigade lose their f*cking shiat.
 
2022-01-25 2:59:28 PM  
One of Joe's great strengths is that a man with no real political future doesn't have to worry about his own.
 
2022-01-25 3:00:04 PM  

misanthropicsob: Headso: I think everyone on the left/center more or less agrees he is likeable but the youngish professional left wants money in the form of loan forgiveness and the more further left people really buy into the narrative that we are about to slip into fascism so they can't understand Biden's lack of urgency on voting rights. That is where the difference is coming from, not because some trumper likes Biden thinks he is smart but thinks he is a weak leader.

FTA: From 2020 to 2022, Democrats' perceptions of three of Biden's traits fell significantly -- effective government management (-19 points), strong leadership (-12 points) and caring (-8 points).

[Fark user image 425x234]


oh look at mr read-the-article over here.
 
2022-01-25 3:00:16 PM  
The President is not supposed to be a leader!!

He's not supposed to tell me where to go or what to do. He's supposed to execute the laws passed by congress which should be people who reflect my values aka representatives. That's how the system is set up. In theory the president works for me, the average American citizen.


In practice not so much, but it was probably closer to true when only wealthy white landowners could vote and/or be president. But that disconnect  just makes it doubly important not to  want to follow a president.

We need a charismatic statesman with some morality,  not a "leader" as defined by the hill of all freakin places
 
2022-01-25 3:00:35 PM  

Bith Set Me Up: Rapmaster2000: [Fark user image 640x480]

Third Way triangulation is a losing strategy. It's trying to uphold a middle ground between sense and nonsense.


What defines "Third Way"?  Is there a sliding scale, or have you sorted everyone into groups?   Is it only Joe Biden and assorted white Democrats in the Third Way, or are there Republicans and minorities?  If Joe Biden is halfway between sense and nonsense, what specific nonsense of his would you like corrected?

I thank you ahead of time for you answer.
 
2022-01-25 3:00:57 PM  

whidbey: Decorus: I honestly can't think of a single person who could do a better job right now given the current situation.

He doesn't have the votes and he never had them to do much of anything lasting.

Which is why the best strategy is ultimately holding the line until we have more Democrats in Congress

and fewer Republicans.

And that makes the Purity Test Brigade lose their f*cking shiat.


Ah that's cute. Whidbey thinks elections still have meaning.
 
2022-01-25 3:01:59 PM  
What they really mean: "He doesn't scream incoherent racist nonsense whartgarbl that get's Mama June's panties moist at volume 11 to our liking therefore he is weak. We want a shiatshow monster truck rally dammit"
 
2022-01-25 3:02:09 PM  

Headso: misanthropicsob: Headso: I think everyone on the left/center more or less agrees he is likeable but the youngish professional left wants money in the form of loan forgiveness and the more further left people really buy into the narrative that we are about to slip into fascism so they can't understand Biden's lack of urgency on voting rights. That is where the difference is coming from, not because some trumper likes Biden thinks he is smart but thinks he is a weak leader.

FTA: From 2020 to 2022, Democrats' perceptions of three of Biden's traits fell significantly -- effective government management (-19 points), strong leadership (-12 points) and caring (-8 points).

[Fark user image 425x234]

oh look at mr read-the-article over here.


Actually, I was reading the Gallup results...so the article linked within the article!

I'm just an overachiever, I guess.
 
2022-01-25 3:02:41 PM  

patrick767: Many people have really farking stupid ideas of what makes a good leader. Case in point: 70 some odd million people voted for Donald Trump in 2020. Among other toxic bullshiat ideas, Trumpers go along with his belief that apologizing for anything ever is "weak".

Night Train to Wakanda:
I thought it was because he can't even control his own party to pass legislation that has broad support?

But thanks for demsplaining.

And then there are progressives who think if a leader can't force 50 of 50 Democratic senators to vote his way, he must be weak. Maybe so, or maybe two of those senators are just especially shiatty. Leaders can persuade and pressure, but ultimately no matter how able they are, they may run into a particularly stubborn obstructionist. Then what?


Voters don't give a shiat about good intentions if there aren't any meaningful improvements to their lives.

Decorus: I honestly can't think of a single person who could do a better job right now given the current situation.

He doesn't have the votes and he never had them to do much of anything lasting.


Has the Democratic Party leadership actually attempted anything besides finger-wagging or shoulder-shrugging?

whidbey: Decorus: I honestly can't think of a single person who could do a better job right now given the current situation.

He doesn't have the votes and he never had them to do much of anything lasting.

Which is why the best strategy is ultimately holding the line until we have more Democrats in Congress

and fewer Republicans.

And that makes the Purity Test Brigade lose their f*cking shiat.


And who would support the party that punted on all their promises to appease at least two intra-party obstructionists?
 
2022-01-25 3:02:58 PM  

Mugato: What is he indecisive about?


Paraphrasing here, but, let's see:

Example 1:
Summer 2021: "I'm going to veto the bipartisan infrastructure bill if it isn't sent to me with BBB attached"
Fall 2021: "The bipartisan infrastructure bill that just passed by itself is a huge win for this country"

Example 2:
Summer 2021: "BBB is my top priority for the country"
January 2022: "Never mind. Now my top priority is overturning the filibuster"
January 2022: "I guess neither BBB nor filibuster reform passed, so now I'm not going to work with Republicans any more."

Example 3:
November 2020: "I know how to beat coronavirus."
December 2021: "Get back to work, it's just the sniffles."

Maybe indecisive is the wrong term. Confused? Incoherent? Politically inept?
 
2022-01-25 3:03:43 PM  

Peki: whidbey: Decorus: I honestly can't think of a single person who could do a better job right now given the current situation.

He doesn't have the votes and he never had them to do much of anything lasting.

Which is why the best strategy is ultimately holding the line until we have more Democrats in Congress

and fewer Republicans.

And that makes the Purity Test Brigade lose their f*cking shiat.

Ah that's cute. Whidbey thinks elections still have meaning.


This.  Voting is for suckers.  The only way Biden wins is by me not voting.

Shiat.
 
2022-01-25 3:03:48 PM  
DNRTFT\
But how many thinj these are positive traits?
 
2022-01-25 3:06:00 PM  
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2022-01-25 3:08:45 PM  

PirateKing: The Executive is supposed to execute. It's not always going to be possible to make the perfect decision. So we hire someone to make A decision.

But the kind of things being thrown at  Joe are not necessarily the president's problems to solve.

The idea that the president becomes the leader of the party is dumb, second in stupidity only to the existence of political parties in the structure of our government in the first place.

The very first president we had said 'Hey, watch out for this, it's a bad idea.' and we said 'Right you are, George' and ignored him before he was dead his first term ended.

 
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