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(SFGate)   The first man in human history to be cryogenically frozen is still awaiting revival 55 years later. Doctors are skeptical, though: "He's dead once he's frozen, and he's not going to come back." Ooh, that's cold   (sfgate.com) divider line
    More: Interesting, Cryonics, Cryogenics, Bedford's body, Cryopreservation, Cryobiology, first man, last move, young man  
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859 clicks; posted to STEM » on 18 Jan 2022 at 6:17 AM (24 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2022-01-18 4:23:19 AM  
Dumbass tag would seem more appropriate. Or Obvious.
 
2022-01-18 6:03:48 AM  
The underlying assumptions of cryogenics are two-fold. One, in the future medical science will advance to the point where it can revive people who, by today's standards, are unambiguously and irreversibly dead.

And two, in the future society will have such a severe shortage of old, rich, selfish assholes that it will want to revive some of ours.


In addition, the whole enterprise depends on a bunch of third-generation trust fund kids getting together and saying "Sure, let's revive great-granddad and spend the rest of our lives fighting over whether he gets his money back!".
 
2022-01-18 6:14:25 AM  
"Bedford can be preserved in suspended animation in his huge thermos bottle for 20,000 years, awaiting revival,"

As long as my revival involves 1970s Mariette Hartley, I'm in.

i.pinimg.comView Full Size


/I'll be in my cryogenic bunk
 
2022-01-18 6:30:14 AM  

HugeMistake: The underlying assumptions of cryogenics are two-fold. One, in the future medical science will advance to the point where it can revive people who, by today's standards, are unambiguously and irreversibly dead.

And two, in the future society will have such a severe shortage of old, rich, selfish assholes that it will want to revive some of ours.


In addition, the whole enterprise depends on a bunch of third-generation trust fund kids getting together and saying "Sure, let's revive great-granddad and spend the rest of our lives fighting over whether he gets his money back!".


You have to build a religion around this like the Egyptians did. They had a good run, it seems like a reasonable approach. We should also be able to preserve more than just our god king, too.
 
2022-01-18 6:44:58 AM  
Bob Geldof - Ending Death
Youtube 0PczI-KnIjI
 
2022-01-18 6:47:13 AM  
COLD IN HERE, ISN'T IT?
 
2022-01-18 6:53:22 AM  

Igors_Be_Us: COLD IN HERE, ISN'T IT?


Here, take this space heater to keep you warm.
 
2022-01-18 7:06:31 AM  
The cryogenics nuts are a special breed.  You try to tell them that their frozen body will have pretty much every cell torn apart by crystallization as it freezes, turning their corpse to mush... and they just have this religious faith that future science will not only be able to magically reverse entropy at that scale, but that someone will actually care to do it for them.

Hell of a business, though.  You charge a metric buttload of money to keep a corpspicle, and barring a major failure that leaves melted corpse flooding out your front doors and a family member with legal standing who gives a shiat, you don't have to do much.
 
2022-01-18 7:08:08 AM  
Is this about alcor , the company who's founder is basically a pseudoscientist who embalmed and froze his own mother Alive and kept the state from doing an autopsy on her, essentially getting away with murder?

These guys are chucklefarks. I've read some of their "case reports" and it's farking scary how inept and hillariously bad they are at their job. It's also farking terrifying that they are performing life support measures that have a good likelihood of restoring awareness immediately after death, and give medicine to mask this.
 
2022-01-18 7:22:59 AM  
I'm pretty sure he wouldn't want to be here now anyways.
 
2022-01-18 7:36:28 AM  
When Alcor member Orville Richardson passed away in 2009, his two siblings, who served as co-conservators after he developed dementia, buried his remains even though they knew about his agreement with Alcor.[39] Alcor sued them when they found out about Richardson's death to have the body exhumed so his head could be preserved. Initially, a district court ruled against Alcor, but upon appeal, the Iowa Court of Appeals ordered Richardson's remains be disinterred a year after they had been buried in May 2010.[40][41]
 
2022-01-18 7:45:21 AM  
tv-fanatic-res.cloudinary.comView Full Size
 
2022-01-18 7:52:00 AM  

LewDux: When Alcor member Orville Richardson passed away in 2009, his two siblings, who served as co-conservators after he developed dementia, buried his remains even though they knew about his agreement with Alcor.[39] Alcor sued them when they found out about Richardson's death to have the body exhumed so his head could be preserved. Initially, a district court ruled against Alcor, but upon appeal, the Iowa Court of Appeals ordered Richardson's remains be disinterred a year after they had been buried in May 2010.[40][41]


Business is business.  They don't care what they're freezing, they care that they get to collect their money for freezing it AND show future clients that they're serious about it.  Because those clients are farking NUTS and want to know they're getting frozen for sure.
 
2022-01-18 7:54:02 AM  
You mean Hollywood lied to us?
Fark user imageView Full Size

Totally bogus, dudes!
 
2022-01-18 8:02:32 AM  
He's Dead Jim
Youtube 3at_Ev2kOoI
 
2022-01-18 8:02:44 AM  

Unsung_Hero: The cryogenics nuts are a special breed.  You try to tell them that their frozen body will have pretty much every cell torn apart by crystallization as it freezes, turning their corpse to mush... and they just have this religious faith that future science will not only be able to magically reverse entropy at that scale, but that someone will actually care to do it for them.

Hell of a business, though.  You charge a metric buttload of money to keep a corpspicle


I believe the term is "meat popsicle".
 
2022-01-18 8:07:47 AM  
For the company's sake I hope he paid upfront.

For the lols I hope it's like idiocracy where everyone forgets about him for 1000 years and he ends up in a trash dump.
 
2022-01-18 8:12:15 AM  

Mail Order American Husband: For the company's sake I hope he paid upfront.

For the lols I hope it's like idiocracy where everyone forgets about him for 1000 years and he ends up in a trash dump.


He's currently in a facility in Scottsdale, so it's already true.
 
2022-01-18 8:20:02 AM  
One has to assume that two technologies are going to be "good enough" to do this. Can a person be unfrozen in the future? Who knows? Let's try! Maybe... etc. etc.

But the part we DO know is the technology we have today, that is... freezing. And that technology sucked 50 years ago. It is a lot better today. Probably still not good enough, but a lot better.

But first, I suppose people have seen the (Brit) Tom Scott video on YouTube of the guy who invented the microwave oven using it to revive frozen hamsters in the 50s, I think. So the internal warming of microwaves and other technologies are progressing rather well. I am not saying that we can be unfrozen like a  7 11 burrito, making Mariette Hartley ready to eat, but we might be able to do that part if we do it carefully.

The second part is modern flash freezing, which is being used to GREAT effect in the restaurant industry along with chillers and other devices. You can limit cell damage while freezing something, and bring it back with pretty good texture and er... freshness.

So we have lost our chance to have a fresh Mariette Hartley or a Bettie Page, but future humans might be able to freeze someone really small, thin perhaps. I am thinking Taylor Swift and not so much Snooky or whatever her name is. More Paulie Shore than Brendan Fraser is what I am saying. More Pat Paulsen than Buddy Hackett. More Fred Rogers (165 lbs!) than Donald Trump is what I am getting at.

It is hard to think of applications of this. Using flesh as a receptacle for a consciousness is doing it the hard way. Maybe just uploading to an AI shell or construct could give nearly unlimited lifetime and a variety of android shells if one ever wanted to become physical.
 
2022-01-18 8:32:38 AM  
But then grave-robbing space mushrooms...well, you know the rest.
 
2022-01-18 8:43:58 AM  

HugeMistake: And two, in the future society will have such a severe shortage of old, rich, selfish assholes that it will want to revive some of ours.


Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2022-01-18 8:57:06 AM  
Wakes up, refuses covid vaccine, dies.
 
2022-01-18 9:10:09 AM  
Fark user imageView Full Size

My stocks are still good, right?
 
2022-01-18 9:13:07 AM  
 
2022-01-18 9:16:14 AM  

HugeMistake: And two, in the future society will have such a severe shortage of old, rich, selfish assholes that it will want to revive some of ours.


That's the part that is really fuzzy. Paying for cryogenics is relatively affordable - a couple hundred thousand dollars will cover the freezing and then have a fund where interest on the account pays for storage fees and continual replenishment of the liquid N2 to keep you frozen. That assumes there isn't some economic collapse that makes your maintenance account worthless to where it can't pay the bill to top off your storage tube...

So, in the future they'll maybe be able to revive you. OK, that sounds expensive to pay for the nanobots or whatever that will be flushed through your body to cure the cancer, repair all the cell damage, yada yada. Where is the money from that coming from? Your little savings account to pay the annual LN2 costs probably isn't enough for that. Do they do the medical treatment to wake you up and then hand you a bill? Where are you expected to get the money to pay for that?

After they wake you up, you're going to need money to do things like just exist. Where does that come from? Presumably all your other money, possessions, property is gone by distribution to heirs. You don't have a house to return to living in, you don't have a job you still work, and you don't have a huge Scrooge McDuck sized pile of money set aside somewhere unless you did something like set up a perpetual trust account for that (and the money wasn't stolen somewhere along the many years you were dead).

Like, you think people are going to wake you up so you can have a net worth of $0 and be a suck on society? We have enough of those. Heck, if we hand you a bill for your medical treatment to bring you back, your net worth is negative. We have enough of those, too.
 
2022-01-18 9:21:10 AM  
Here's to another lousy millenium
 
2022-01-18 9:22:07 AM  

mrmopar5287: After they wake you up, you're going to need money to do things like just exist. Where does that come from?


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joice_Heth

There;s a Sucker born Every Minute
 
2022-01-18 9:23:59 AM  

2fardownthread: One has to assume that two technologies are going to be "good enough" to do this. Can a person be unfrozen in the future? Who knows? Let's try! Maybe... etc. etc.


The current thinking (and who can predict the future, right?) is that medical technology will progress forward to where we freeze people "better" than prior subjects, and that medical technology will likewise progress to where revivals can get better even with more damage on early/prior subjects.

The thinking is that revival of subjects will be a "last in, first out" kind of process because freezing will get better to where the last people we freeze prior to revival will have less damage. The thinking is that medical technology will continue to advance to where we can repair more and more damage done and work our way back through subjects to revive people frozen earlier who have more damage done to their body from the freezing process.

Will we be able to go back and revive the earliest frozen people? Who knows, but that's a lot of damage done to overcome.
 
2022-01-18 9:28:08 AM  

HugeMistake: The underlying assumptions of cryogenics are two-fold. One, in the future medical science will advance to the point where it can revive people who, by today's standards, are unambiguously and irreversibly dead.

And two, in the future society will have such a severe shortage of old, rich, selfish assholes that it will want to revive some of ours.


In addition, the whole enterprise depends on a bunch of third-generation trust fund kids getting together and saying "Sure, let's revive great-granddad and spend the rest of our lives fighting over whether he gets his money back!".


There's a common fantasy among people that knowledge/skills will have been lost and they'll have gone from an ordinary chump to now be considered wise/important/useful.  Lots of media has glamorized it, but don't know whether it's because of the feeling or if the feeling is because of the glamorizing, or if it feeds itself.  This allows them to play that fantasy out... until they die in which case their beliefs were never dispelled in their mind.

/it's the media trope called Human Popsicle
//https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/HumanPopsicle
 
2022-01-18 9:29:55 AM  

zeroflight222: There's a common fantasy among people that knowledge/skills will have been lost and they'll have gone from an ordinary chump to now be considered wise/important/useful.


That was the plot of 3001. Frank Poole was revived to become a living global treasure, as a sort of historian who had knowledge of what Earth was like a thousand years prior.
 
2022-01-18 9:37:05 AM  
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2022-01-18 9:41:08 AM  

mrmopar5287: zeroflight222: There's a common fantasy among people that knowledge/skills will have been lost and they'll have gone from an ordinary chump to now be considered wise/important/useful.

That was the plot of 3001. Frank Poole was revived to become a living global treasure, as a sort of historian who had knowledge of what Earth was like a thousand years prior.


First one that came to my mind was the Woody Allen movie Sleeper, followed by A.I., then two episodes of TNG, then Demolition Man.
 
2022-01-18 9:52:22 AM  
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2022-01-18 9:55:13 AM  
Sometimes dead is better.
 
2022-01-18 10:29:21 AM  
Look, you're all laughing now, but wait until he's declared America's Ass.
 
2022-01-18 10:45:13 AM  
if you are bound and determined to lock onto the idea of an afterlife believing in cryo-status is only slightly less crazy than any given religion.  i don't believe for a moment any of the frozen people will be resurrected with science but i know it won't happen with religion.
 
2022-01-18 11:31:17 AM  

mrmopar5287: HugeMistake: And two, in the future society will have such a severe shortage of old, rich, selfish assholes that it will want to revive some of ours.

That's the part that is really fuzzy. Paying for cryogenics is relatively affordable - a couple hundred thousand dollars will cover the freezing and then have a fund where interest on the account pays for storage fees and continual replenishment of the liquid N2 to keep you frozen. That assumes there isn't some economic collapse that makes your maintenance account worthless to where it can't pay the bill to top off your storage tube...

So, in the future they'll maybe be able to revive you. OK, that sounds expensive to pay for the nanobots or whatever that will be flushed through your body to cure the cancer, repair all the cell damage, yada yada. Where is the money from that coming from? Your little savings account to pay the annual LN2 costs probably isn't enough for that. Do they do the medical treatment to wake you up and then hand you a bill? Where are you expected to get the money to pay for that?

After they wake you up, you're going to need money to do things like just exist. Where does that come from? Presumably all your other money, possessions, property is gone by distribution to heirs. You don't have a house to return to living in, you don't have a job you still work, and you don't have a huge Scrooge McDuck sized pile of money set aside somewhere unless you did something like set up a perpetual trust account for that (and the money wasn't stolen somewhere along the many years you were dead).

Like, you think people are going to wake you up so you can have a net worth of $0 and be a suck on society? We have enough of those. Heck, if we hand you a bill for your medical treatment to bring you back, your net worth is negative. We have enough of those, too.


Just few dollars set aside would make you extremely wealthy in 700 years.

Interest is crazy over very long periods of time.
 
2022-01-18 11:54:47 AM  

mcreadyblue: Just few dollars set aside would make you extremely wealthy in 700 years.


Never going to happen.  First, you need enough that fees don't drain the account faster than it accrues value.  Second, you need to prevent the account from being pilfered.  Third, you need to hope your money isn't destroyed by a corporate or general economic downturn, or by a revolution... or a law passed by the government to confiscate it.

700 years is a LONG time.
 
2022-01-18 12:14:14 PM  
DNRTFA, but they're talking about Disney, aren't they?
 
2022-01-18 12:17:29 PM  

Unsung_Hero: mcreadyblue: Just few dollars set aside would make you extremely wealthy in 700 years.

Never going to happen.  First, you need enough that fees don't drain the account faster than it accrues value.  Second, you need to prevent the account from being pilfered.  Third, you need to hope your money isn't destroyed by a corporate or general economic downturn, or by a revolution... or a law passed by the government to confiscate it.

700 years is a LONG time.


Came to say this. Lots of faith your money will be good in however many thousands of years. This isn't Futurama.
 
2022-01-18 12:36:47 PM  

Unsung_Hero: mcreadyblue: Just few dollars set aside would make you extremely wealthy in 700 years.

Never going to happen.  First, you need enough that fees don't drain the account faster than it accrues value.  Second, you need to prevent the account from being pilfered.  Third, you need to hope your money isn't destroyed by a corporate or general economic downturn, or by a revolution... or a law passed by the government to confiscate it.

700 years is a LONG time.


The Sassoon Family Continuation Trust originated 1495 in the aftermath of the Spanish Inquisition.

The sole beneficiary is David E. Sassoon.  Assets are over $100 billion.
 
2022-01-18 1:28:23 PM  
At the very least... you have the tissue samples to clone them.  They won't be the same person, but their mortal body could feasibly be remade with technology in our lifetime.
 
2022-01-18 2:05:39 PM  

mcreadyblue: The Sassoon Family Continuation Trust originated 1495 in the aftermath of the Spanish Inquisition.

The sole beneficiary is David E. Sassoon. Assets are over $100 billion.


There are a couple of problems with your example - First, it's for a living line of people, not for some dead person hoping to be resurrected someday.  Your kids would be first in line to pillage your wealth if you tried to keep it after death.  Second, it's a bit of survivor bias.  We're going to need some stats on the average survival time of a multi-generational trust to know what it really means.
 
2022-01-18 2:50:36 PM  

Unsung_Hero: mcreadyblue: The Sassoon Family Continuation Trust originated 1495 in the aftermath of the Spanish Inquisition.

The sole beneficiary is David E. Sassoon. Assets are over $100 billion.

There are a couple of problems with your example - First, it's for a living line of people, not for some dead person hoping to be resurrected someday.  Your kids would be first in line to pillage your wealth if you tried to keep it after death.  Second, it's a bit of survivor bias.  We're going to need some stats on the average survival time of a multi-generational trust to know what it really means.


They are outlawed in the US, so that should give you some idea of how powerful they are.
 
2022-01-18 7:13:39 PM  
375 for 6 hours.
 
2022-01-18 7:23:25 PM  

mcreadyblue: They are outlawed in the US, so that should give you some idea of how powerful they are.


Legal in South Dakota: https://www.sdtrustco.com/why-south-dakota/dynasty-trust/
 
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