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(12News Phoenix)   Arizona decides that golf courses are more important than food. Or water   (12news.com) divider line
    More: Facepalm, Colorado River, file photo, Arizona's golf courses, water shortage, Water resources, Water supply, Water crisis, Colorado  
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4388 clicks; posted to Main » and Politics » on 05 Nov 2021 at 4:20 PM (11 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2021-11-05 3:27:28 PM  
What could possibly be more important than the games played by rich old white men?
 
2021-11-05 4:14:29 PM  
Article also conveniently focuses on how little Colorado River water golf courses use, while they suck the aquifers dry.

Turn them all into public parks with native flora.
 
2021-11-05 4:22:07 PM  
Arizona should be farming and it should have golf courses. Let it be desert. There's a lot of land in a lot of areas with lots of water; why the fark are we in the desert?
 
2021-11-05 4:22:43 PM  
Al Czervik on country clubs and cemeteries
Youtube y4XQuEYDoj4
 
2021-11-05 4:23:37 PM  
Oh you think it's fun now, just wait till there's no more cheap hydroelectricity or water to cool down those huge mega data centers everyone is using these days.
Data is about to get expensive again.
 
2021-11-05 4:23:43 PM  

meanmutton: Arizona shouldn't be farming and it shouldn't have golf courses. Let it be desert. There's a lot of land in a lot of areas with lots of water; why the fark are we in the desert?


WTF was that. Sheesh.
 
2021-11-05 4:23:54 PM  
Soon to be non-fiction.

images-na.ssl-images-amazon.comView Full Size
 
2021-11-05 4:24:30 PM  
They water their courses with city water? I thought greywater was preferred for that.
 
2021-11-05 4:25:45 PM  
Once that water is gone, it's not coming back anytime soon.
 
2021-11-05 4:28:53 PM  

The_Sponge: [iFrame https://www.youtube.com/embed/y4XQuEYDoj4?autoplay=1&widget_referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.fark.com&start=0&enablejsapi=1&origin=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.fark.com&widgetid=1]


Speaking of which, I went to check out some old cemeteries last weekend. One was the field where they moved all the Chinese and Irish burials starting in the 1930's after they decided they didn't want them buried in the city cemetery.

Then in 1956 they covered part of it with the municipal golf course.

Fark user imageView Full Size


Fark user imageView Full Size


Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2021-11-05 4:29:51 PM  

JessieL: Article also conveniently focuses on how little Colorado River water golf courses use, while they suck the aquifers dry.

Turn them all into public parks with native flora.


Have you seen the native flora in Phoenix? It's rock.

Not saying it shouldn't be turned into that. But that parks and civilization shouldn't exist there.

When the water dries up, they'll be all WTF?

They waste so much water there it boggles my mind. I only lived there for 7 years, and could see it's not sustainable in any way large scale like it is for more than another 25-50 years tops without major fallout elsewhere.
 
2021-11-05 4:30:01 PM  

JessieL: The_Sponge: [iFrame https://www.youtube.com/embed/y4XQuEYDoj4?autoplay=1&widget_referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.fark.com&start=0&enablejsapi=1&origin=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.fark.com&widgetid=1]

Speaking of which, I went to check out some old cemeteries last weekend. One was the field where they moved all the Chinese and Irish burials starting in the 1930's after they decided they didn't want them buried in the city cemetery.

Then in 1956 they covered part of it with the municipal golf course.

[Fark user image image 712x949]

[Fark user image image 712x949]

[Fark user image image 712x949]


Oh wow.
 
2021-11-05 4:30:34 PM  
The article says the lake levels went up recently due to the rains. But the current data from Lake Mead and Lake Powell don't show any effect at all.
 
2021-11-05 4:31:24 PM  
Side note:

I am so glad I live in a place where our tap water tastes great.  (Seattle area.)
 
2021-11-05 4:31:32 PM  

Pointy Tail of Satan: The article says the lake levels went up recently due to the rains. But the current data from Lake Mead and Lake Powell don't show any effect at all.


Because those lakes are running a 20+ year water deficit.
 
2021-11-05 4:32:34 PM  
"It won't make a dent, so we shouldn't even try."

"Oh, okay."

"Now watch this drive."
 
2021-11-05 4:32:58 PM  
That's not to say Arizona's agriculture industry isn't efficient. Conservation efforts mandated by the state require farmers to be sustainable and efficient in their water usage. It just naturally takes a lot of water to grow crops in the desert. "Even with the most efficient uses and being good stewards of water..."

You aren't, you're growing crops in the desert. Full stop.
 
2021-11-05 4:34:08 PM  
At least It's a dry dryness
 
2021-11-05 4:35:16 PM  

JessieL: What could possibly be more important than the games played by rich old white men?


You don't have to be old and white to play golf. I play at my local public 9 hole course for 5 dollars and use a set of clubs i got at goodwill and walk the course. Of course i'm in Michigan which makes it more sustainable than trying to put a course in the desert.
 
2021-11-05 4:35:41 PM  
Theres a chance ill read something dumber today.

But I doubt it.
 
2021-11-05 4:36:04 PM  
Maybe instead of asking why we should waste water on golf courses, you should ask yourself why we should waste water on any of the several million people who relocated to Phoenix in the last 20 years.

On the spectrum of start to stupidity, voluntarily moving yourself by settling the desert and building golf courses in the desert are near equal on the scale.

Fark them. Move where there isn't water? Die thirsty.
 
2021-11-05 4:36:51 PM  

logieal: JessieL: Article also conveniently focuses on how little Colorado River water golf courses use, while they suck the aquifers dry.

Turn them all into public parks with native flora.

Have you seen the native flora in Phoenix? It's rock.

Not saying it shouldn't be turned into that. But that parks and civilization shouldn't exist there.

When the water dries up, they'll be all WTF?

They waste so much water there it boggles my mind. I only lived there for 7 years, and could see it's not sustainable in any way large scale like it is for more than another 25-50 years tops without major fallout elsewhere.


Did you ever get outside the city?

Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2021-11-05 4:36:53 PM  

Jgok: They water their courses with city water? I thought greywater was preferred for that.


Yup. Here in LA pretty much all golf courses are required to use reclaimed water.
 
2021-11-05 4:37:27 PM  
Golf courses are one of the single largest wastes of natural resources in the US.
 
2021-11-05 4:38:12 PM  

Weaver95: Pointy Tail of Satan: The article says the lake levels went up recently due to the rains. But the current data from Lake Mead and Lake Powell don't show any effect at all.

Because those lakes are running a 20+ year water deficit.


But there should still be at least a small short term rise. All that rain doesn't just disappear.
 
2021-11-05 4:38:17 PM  
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2021-11-05 4:38:48 PM  

JessieL: What could possibly be more important than the games played by rich old white men?


In my state, it seems like everyone (black, white, blue collar, white collar) plays that stupid game.
 
2021-11-05 4:39:02 PM  

ShowStop: Jgok: They water their courses with city water? I thought greywater was preferred for that.

Yup. Here in LA pretty much all golf courses are required to use reclaimed water.


No one cares about your communist reuse of natural resources, you liberal tree hugger.

/s
 
2021-11-05 4:39:56 PM  
Of course (no pun intended). Stories about a hole-in-one or an eagle on a par-5 can keep a doctor or lawyer fed with clubhouse scotch or brandy for years. It's something poor people can't understand, nevermind partipate in (if it's any decent club that is).
 
2021-11-05 4:40:50 PM  
If someone drew a giant dick on it with herbicide I'd understand.
 
2021-11-05 4:41:23 PM  
Phoenix and surrounding cities are full of Bermuda grass playing fields of all kinds. There are grass fields for every game, organized or pick-up. Sports clubs of all types come here to play their sport on these fields in winter. When growing up here there were always baseball and softball fields with grass and backstops. Now every neighborhood has grass fields for soccer. And the spring training facilities for 16 Major League teams are being used for Fall league and then Winter League ball. The grass at these facilities is awesome.
 
2021-11-05 4:42:37 PM  
"The average amount of water used per course in Arizona was 504 acre-feet during the year, or about 450,000 gallons a day"

"The average person uses 101.5 gallons of water per day"


Quick math:

As the average person uses approximately 100 gallons, so an average golf courses usesthe water equivalent to the daily needs of 4,500 people. From 2010 to 2020, 600,000 people moved to Maricopa County, adding the daily water usage of 133 golf courses in just 10 years.

Seems to me maybe it's people that are the problem, not so much golf courses.
 
2021-11-05 4:43:12 PM  

JessieL: The_Sponge: [iFrame https://www.youtube.com/embed/y4XQuEYDoj4?autoplay=1&widget_referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.fark.com&start=0&enablejsapi=1&origin=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.fark.com&widgetid=1]

Speaking of which, I went to check out some old cemeteries last weekend. One was the field where they moved all the Chinese and Irish burials starting in the 1930's after they decided they didn't want them buried in the city cemetery.

Then in 1956 they covered part of it with the municipal golf course.

[Fark user image 712x949]

[Fark user image 712x949]

[Fark user image 712x949]


You only removed the tees. You didn't replace the divots! Poltergeist: Caddyshack.
 
2021-11-05 4:43:49 PM  

137 Is An Excellent Time: "The average amount of water used per course in Arizona was 504 acre-feet during the year, or about 450,000 gallons a day"

"The average person uses 101.5 gallons of water per day"

Quick math:

As the average person uses approximately 100 gallons, so an average golf courses usesthe water equivalent to the daily needs of 4,500 people. From 2010 to 2020, 600,000 people moved to Maricopa County, adding the daily water usage of 133 golf courses in just 10 years.

Seems to me maybe it's people that are the problem, not so much golf courses.


If you didn't build all those golf courses for retirees in the first place, they wouldn't have moved there, now would they?
 
2021-11-05 4:44:04 PM  

JessieL: logieal: JessieL: Article also conveniently focuses on how little Colorado River water golf courses use, while they suck the aquifers dry.

Turn them all into public parks with native flora.

Have you seen the native flora in Phoenix? It's rock.

Not saying it shouldn't be turned into that. But that parks and civilization shouldn't exist there.

When the water dries up, they'll be all WTF?

They waste so much water there it boggles my mind. I only lived there for 7 years, and could see it's not sustainable in any way large scale like it is for more than another 25-50 years tops without major fallout elsewhere.

Did you ever get outside the city?

[Fark user image 800x533]


Yep. And it does look like that right after the monsoons. Then that all dries up and turns into tumbleweeds.
Not saying it doesn't look nice for a minute.

Again, it's a nice place to visit in the winter. The summer is literally uninhabitable but for man-made methods of battling it. if the water or power go out, you're cooked.

/And the water is literally just liquid rocks it's so hard
//Convinced that the water could form concrete if left to evaporate
///And sure, let's just spray it in the air to keep it cool...
 
2021-11-05 4:44:13 PM  
i.redd.itView Full Size
 
2021-11-05 4:44:41 PM  
I should refresh more often.
 
2021-11-05 4:46:00 PM  
Why is anyone concerned about this? Tons of people on the internet have repeatedly assured me that the Earth's climate has always been changing and that this is all natural.

/I wish this was a joke.
 
2021-11-05 4:47:02 PM  

Jgok: They water their courses with city water? I thought greywater was preferred for that.


This. My county (Santa Clara Cal, mediterranean climate) has been sending recycled water back to golf courses and other businesses for decades. The pipes used are are purple, so it's easy to see it's recycled water.

The sewage treatment plant gets fined if they release too much fresh water (recycled or otherwise) into the bay. Affects salinity, which is bad for bay plants and animals. So they're motivated to find users for it. Golf courses get cheaper water, most everyone wins. They're now talking about putting the recycled water into percolation ponds, to replenish aquifers. Wtf AZ?
 
2021-11-05 4:49:04 PM  
Ahh, the old "it won't completely solve the problem so why bother trying" argument.
 
2021-11-05 4:49:05 PM  

phishrace: Jgok: They water their courses with city water? I thought greywater was preferred for that.

This. My county (Santa Clara Cal, mediterranean climate) has been sending recycled water back to golf courses and other businesses for decades. The pipes used are are purple, so it's easy to see it's recycled water.

The sewage treatment plant gets fined if they release too much fresh water (recycled or otherwise) into the bay. Affects salinity, which is bad for bay plants and animals. So they're motivated to find users for it. Golf courses get cheaper water, most everyone wins. They're now talking about putting the recycled water into percolation ponds, to replenish aquifers. Wtf AZ?


You're fundamentally misunderstanding what Phoenix water is.
 
2021-11-05 4:49:53 PM  

Someone Else's Alt: ShowStop: Jgok: They water their courses with city water? I thought greywater was preferred for that.

Yup. Here in LA pretty much all golf courses are required to use reclaimed water.

No one cares about your communist reuse of natural resources, you liberal tree hugger.

/s


We can't hug the trees anymore, they're on fire.
 
2021-11-05 4:50:22 PM  

137 Is An Excellent Time: Maybe instead of asking why we should waste water on golf courses, you should ask yourself why we should waste water on any of the several million people who relocated to Phoenix in the last 20 years.

On the spectrum of start to stupidity, voluntarily moving yourself by settling the desert and building golf courses in the desert are near equal on the scale.

Fark them. Move where there isn't water? Die thirsty.


Contrarian view -
If land has water & is arable, it has much more important uses than being a Walmart parking lot.  It could be a forest, a wetland, or a farm.

Move people to occupy non-arable land so the arable land can be put to better use.
With effort, people can learn to conserve water.
Better yet, move all cemeteries to the desert.
It's agriculture that's using most of the water.
 
2021-11-05 4:50:43 PM  

JessieL: logieal: JessieL: Article also conveniently focuses on how little Colorado River water golf courses use, while they suck the aquifers dry.

Turn them all into public parks with native flora.

Have you seen the native flora in Phoenix? It's rock.

Not saying it shouldn't be turned into that. But that parks and civilization shouldn't exist there.

When the water dries up, they'll be all WTF?

They waste so much water there it boggles my mind. I only lived there for 7 years, and could see it's not sustainable in any way large scale like it is for more than another 25-50 years tops without major fallout elsewhere.

Did you ever get outside the city?

[Fark user image image 800x533]


Hell, it's only "all rocks" now because we dammed all the rivers that used to flow through the valley, and leave the riverbeds dry.

Some level of farming and population in the Phoenix area was sustainable before we started farming with it.

But yeah... now that we can move food, it makes little sense to farm so much in the area. We could reduce the farming by about 1/4, and that would save more water than every non-farming use in AZ combined, including all the golf courses, all the power generation, and that guy from Illinois who insists on a Midwestern lawn.
 
2021-11-05 4:51:48 PM  

JessieL: What could possibly be more important than the games played by rich old white men?


Golf has grown to include all sorts of bleep holes...

"Country Clubs" still look like Rush Limbaugh impersonator conventions...
 
2021-11-05 4:53:36 PM  

Pointy Tail of Satan: Weaver95: Pointy Tail of Satan: The article says the lake levels went up recently due to the rains. But the current data from Lake Mead and Lake Powell don't show any effect at all.

Because those lakes are running a 20+ year water deficit.

But there should still be at least a small short term rise. All that rain doesn't just disappear.


After 20 years of drought, that ground is more than a bit dry.
 
2021-11-05 4:54:27 PM  

The_Sponge: Side note:

I am so glad I live in a place where our tap water tastes great.  (Seattle area.)


The one positive thing I ever say about living in Bremerton.
 
2021-11-05 4:55:08 PM  

melfunction: Phoenix and surrounding cities are full of Bermuda grass playing fields of all kinds. There are grass fields for every game, organized or pick-up. Sports clubs of all types come here to play their sport on these fields in winter. When growing up here there were always baseball and softball fields with grass and backstops. Now every neighborhood has grass fields for soccer. And the spring training facilities for 16 Major League teams are being used for Fall league and then Winter League ball. The grass at these facilities is awesome.


In winter, it'll be rye grass. You have to re-plant like twice a year here. High-water but heat tolerant bermuda in the summer, dying off and seeded with rye as winter arrives. Repeat forever.

Better to use a drought- and heat-tolerant Buffalo grass if you must have grass, but "it's the way we always do it" is a hard tradition to break, even when there's better options now.
 
2021-11-05 4:57:19 PM  

Petroleum Oligarch: JessieL: What could possibly be more important than the games played by rich old white men?

You don't have to be old and white to play golf. I play at my local public 9 hole course for 5 dollars and use a set of clubs i got at goodwill and walk the course. Of course i'm in Michigan which makes it more sustainable than trying to put a course in the desert.


That's crazy cheap! Here in Washtenaw County we're paying $15-20 for a round at muni courses (which is pretty cheap, frankly).
 
2021-11-05 4:58:09 PM  

JessieL: The_Sponge: [iFrame https://www.youtube.com/embed/y4XQuEYDoj4?autoplay=1&widget_referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.fark.com&start=0&enablejsapi=1&origin=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.fark.com&widgetid=1]

Speaking of which, I went to check out some old cemeteries last weekend. One was the field where they moved all the Chinese and Irish burials starting in the 1930's after they decided they didn't want them buried in the city cemetery.

Then in 1956 they covered part of it with the municipal golf course.

[Fark user image 712x949]

[Fark user image 712x949]

[Fark user image 712x949]


It's like Poltergeist, except they didn't even bother to move the headstones.
 
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