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(CBS 21 Harrisburg)   Yeah, like that is really going to stop forest fires   (local21news.com) divider line
    More: Unlikely, California wildfire, Sequoia, trees  
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4534 clicks; posted to Main » on 24 Oct 2021 at 1:36 PM (6 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2021-10-24 11:43:14 AM  
We shall see. Let's ask this bear named Smokey how we should prevent forest fires.
 
2021-10-24 12:27:43 PM  
It used to be that 50 pine trees lived on 1 hectacre and now they are packed to 10,000 pine trees live on 1 hectacre because the forest is NOT allowed to burn any more. Forests are supposed to burn. Modern Humans have stopped them from burning in order to live near them.
 
2021-10-24 1:38:38 PM  
Can't have a forest fire if you don't have forests

Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2021-10-24 1:41:15 PM  
Biatch and moan.
Gloom and doom.
Biatch and moan.
 
2021-10-24 1:41:21 PM  
It's about time obviously wildfires are getting worse the climate is changing etc. etc. etc. we have to adapt our forest management procedures to meet the current situation.

Letting it remain wild is not a solution if we want to prevent the fires we have to manage it to keep the fuel level of those fires to a minimum

There are environmentally friendly ways of logging, mule logging comes to mind, where we can cut and remove select trees without damaging the surrounding forest.
 
2021-10-24 1:43:31 PM  
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2021-10-24 1:43:35 PM  
Looks like I'll be getting some redwood for my next project.
 
2021-10-24 1:52:38 PM  
Only you can prevent forest fires.

You

It's your farking fault
 
2021-10-24 1:57:05 PM  

theteacher: It used to be that 50 pine trees lived on 1 hectacre and now they are packed to 10,000 pine trees live on 1 hectacre because the forest is NOT allowed to burn any more. Forests are supposed to burn. Modern Humans have stopped them from burning in order to live near them.


Pretty sure the giant sequoias have been at about the same density for the last few thousand years in the places where we didn't clear cut them.
 
2021-10-24 1:58:24 PM  
So, they gonna take all the trees, and put em in a tree museum? And charge the people a dollar and a half to see them?

/screen door slam
 
2021-10-24 2:01:25 PM  

theteacher: It used to be that 50 pine trees lived on 1 hectacre and now they are packed to 10,000 pine trees live on 1 hectacre because the forest is NOT allowed to burn any more. Forests are supposed to burn. Modern Humans have stopped them from burning in order to live near them.


In another lifetime I was hiking with my grandfather and I asked him how in the heck the pioneers got their wagons through the forests. The trees were so thick, i could barely imagine riding horses through. He told me it didn't used to be like this and how fire kept a forest healthy. Oh, well. It was pretty while it lasted.
 
2021-10-24 2:02:59 PM  
FTFA: "The hazard trees could potentially fall onto people and cars on the section of State Route 180 known as Generals Highway, or they could create barriers for emergency and fire response, the Sequoia and Kings Canyon national parks said Friday."

This is the sort of thinking we don't need. It is normal for trees to fall over and provide habitat for the animals that live under and in them, the plants that live around, the fungus that grows on them, etc. Compared to the natural benefits, the possibility that they might hinder human activities (before they are pulled out of the way) is negligible.
 
2021-10-24 2:04:30 PM  

MBooda: So, they gonna take all the trees, and put em in a tree museum? And charge the people a dollar and a half to see them?

/screen door slam


Depends on the alternative...last time I checked, Paradise (CA) was mostly reduced to a parking lot by a wildfire
 
2021-10-24 2:06:47 PM  

brilett: Looks like I'll be getting some redwood for my next project.


i.imgflip.comView Full Size
 
2021-10-24 2:07:50 PM  
Firefighters took extraordinary measures to protect the sequoias by wrapping fire-resistant material around the bases of some giants, raking and clearing vegetation around them

"See, I was right"
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2021-10-24 2:09:22 PM  

brilett: Looks like I'll be getting some redwood for my next project.


Looks like redwood is back on the menu, boys!
 
2021-10-24 2:13:29 PM  
They are only taking badly  damaged and diseased trees, because those trees are brittle and more prone to collapsing and burning in a fire.  Healthy trees are staying put.  This actually increases the survivability of the remaining trees, then good.  I don't expect the wood to be of great quality though.
 
2021-10-24 2:14:16 PM  

MBooda: So, they gonna take all the trees, and put em in a tree museum? And charge the people a dollar and a half to see them?

/screen door slam


Joni Mitchell - Big Yellow Taxi (Official Lyric Video)
Youtube 2595abcvh2M
 
2021-10-24 2:20:42 PM  
Replace them with yew trees, because, as we all know, only yew can prevent forest fires.
 
2021-10-24 2:21:12 PM  

kdawg7736: We shall see. Let's ask this bear named Smokey how we should prevent forest fires.


Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2021-10-24 2:23:14 PM  

kdawg7736: We shall see. Let's ask this bear named Smokey how we should prevent forest fires.


Who cares, no one made a claim that it would, nor is it the purpose.
 
2021-10-24 2:32:44 PM  

The Irresponsible Captain: brilett: Looks like I'll be getting some redwood for my next project.

[i.imgflip.com image 500x520]


That goes against all the grains.
 
2021-10-24 2:32:58 PM  

theteacher: It used to be that 50 pine trees lived on 1 hectacre and now they are packed to 10,000 pine trees live on 1 hectacre because the forest is NOT allowed to burn any more. Forests are supposed to burn. Modern Humans have stopped them from burning in order to live near them.


Not just that, but we've been disallowed from cleaning out underbrush and dead detritus to help healthy trees STAY healthy.
 
2021-10-24 2:34:49 PM  
Fark it...

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I'm out!
 
2021-10-24 2:47:17 PM  
I thought we wanted the world to burn
 
2021-10-24 2:56:09 PM  
Like they used to say, save a tree, eat a beaver.

Aw geeze.  I get it.  A double entendre
 
2021-10-24 2:57:03 PM  

maudibjr: I thought we wanted the world to burn


Republicans do.
 
2021-10-24 2:58:15 PM  

kdawg7736: We shall see. Let's ask this bear named Smokey how we should prevent forest fires.


In England, they have smackey the frog. Which is a much less aggressive fire prevention mascot.  "Oh look, a frog! I hope will settle and come near me!"

Paraphrase of Mitch hedberg. God i miss that man.
 
2021-10-24 2:58:58 PM  

Tom_Slick: It's about time obviously wildfires are getting worse the climate is changing etc. etc. etc. we have to adapt our forest management procedures to meet the current situation.

Letting it remain wild is not a solution if we want to prevent the fires we have to manage it to keep the fuel level of those fires to a minimum

There are environmentally friendly ways of logging, mule logging comes to mind, where we can cut and remove select trees without damaging the surrounding forest.


Let's also remember that we pushed Native Americans out of many forests, and they had been the ones managing them so they stay healthy.

As stupid as 'rake the forest' is, most forests had people collecting downed branches for their cooking and heating fuel.  And foraging for mushrooms and plants, with a little poaching along the way.  Not just in the US-- Europe, Asia, etc.

I wonder how much indigenous forestry knowledge still survives after we pushed so many of them into Oklahoma and they've spent generations in non-forest areas.  I know there are still a few smaller pockets on the Maryland Eastern Shore, New England, and Canada, but I have no idea if all of the forestry practices travel well due to different climates and plant species.

I'd be all for putting national forests back under the care of the tribes who once lived there.
 
2021-10-24 3:07:01 PM  

theteacher: It used to be that 50 pine trees lived on 1 hectacre and now they are packed to 10,000 pine trees live on 1 hectacre because the forest is NOT allowed to burn any more. Forests are supposed to burn. Modern Humans have stopped them from burning in order to live near them.


We've been working on one of our forested plots for 40 years to reduce the risk of catastrophic fire.  Our forester has studied the stumps from the trees that were cut ~120 years ago and estimates a very similar density to that, about 20 trees/acre.  He and his colleagues from the local forestry school have sectioned some of the stumps and have evidence that those trees were exposed to low-intensity fire on the average of once every 8-12 years and survived.

We did our most recent controlled burn eleven years ago last week, so I guess we should start planning to do another.
 
DVD
2021-10-24 3:09:20 PM  

Oneiros: Tom_Slick: It's about time obviously wildfires are getting worse the climate is changing etc. etc. etc. we have to adapt our forest management procedures to meet the current situation.

Letting it remain wild is not a solution if we want to prevent the fires we have to manage it to keep the fuel level of those fires to a minimum

There are environmentally friendly ways of logging, mule logging comes to mind, where we can cut and remove select trees without damaging the surrounding forest.

Let's also remember that we pushed Native Americans out of many forests, and they had been the ones managing them so they stay healthy.

As stupid as 'rake the forest' is, most forests had people collecting downed branches for their cooking and heating fuel.  And foraging for mushrooms and plants, with a little poaching along the way.  Not just in the US-- Europe, Asia, etc.

I wonder how much indigenous forestry knowledge still survives after we pushed so many of them into Oklahoma and they've spent generations in non-forest areas.  I know there are still a few smaller pockets on the Maryland Eastern Shore, New England, and Canada, but I have no idea if all of the forestry practices travel well due to different climates and plant species.

I'd be all for putting national forests back under the care of the tribes who once lived there.


______________________________________​_________

Europeans and Americans "pushed" the few survivors of many now-extinct tribes out.  The tribes were largely wiped out by disease brought by Europe.

But if you're suddenly going to place that much land under the authority of the remaining tribes, could you do them a favor and also allocate human and financial resources with which to manage all of that?  I don't think that they'd want to be in charge of areas that they're only nominally in charge of, with defacto control being under the most ruthless of cartels and warlords.
 
2021-10-24 3:20:09 PM  

Oneiros: As stupid as 'rake the forest' is, most forests had people collecting downed branches for their cooking and heating fuel.


When I was a young warthog I went to Pbilmont Scout Ranch and we backpacker for 14 days. You have to imagine they have 2000 or more kids on the property at any given time, so your itinerary is planned as far as what campsite and what night. On the 6th or so night we stayed with 6 or so other troops at a camp with hot showers (extreme luxury), but it had a wood fired boiler.
Entire forest picked clean, cleanest forest floor I've ever walked through.
 
2021-10-24 3:20:52 PM  
frinkiac.comView Full Size
 
2021-10-24 3:23:39 PM  
Will it make a sound?
 
2021-10-24 3:27:29 PM  

GaperKiller: Oneiros: As stupid as 'rake the forest' is, most forests had people collecting downed branches for their cooking and heating fuel.

When I was a young warthog I went to Pbilmont Scout Ranch and we backpacker for 14 days. You have to imagine they have 2000 or more kids on the property at any given time, so your itinerary is planned as far as what campsite and what night. On the 6th or so night we stayed with 6 or so other troops at a camp with hot showers (extreme luxury), but it had a wood fired boiler.
Entire forest picked clean, cleanest forest floor I've ever walked through.


2000 scouts gathering firewood for the duration of a summer will pick the undergrowth clean.  Don't forget that the scouts are taught to douse the fire so thoroughly they can break the embers with their hands, then throw the ashes away something like a mile [forgetting the actual distance, but you really walked a ton of miles their] to throw them away (so the area around the official fire rings aren't covered in ashes).
 
2021-10-24 3:39:10 PM  
Have Dan Snyder build a house there.  Problem solved.
 
2021-10-24 3:48:19 PM  

LordOfThePings: Will it make a sound?


Presumedly, yes.

images.45worlds.comView Full Size
 
2021-10-24 3:58:33 PM  

MBooda: So, they gonna take all the trees, and put em in a tree museum? And charge the people a dollar and a half to see them?

/screen door slam


Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2021-10-24 4:05:06 PM  
We just need to recruit the locals
Fark user imageView Full Size


/daily bad drawing
//suppose to be deer, squirrel(3), racoon, bunny, park ranger
 
2021-10-24 4:15:39 PM  

kabloink: We just need to recruit the locals
[Fark user image 447x500]

/daily bad drawing
//suppose to be deer, squirrel(3), racoon, bunny, park ranger


Add some torches and it has a completely different meaning
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2021-10-24 4:16:52 PM  

Tom_Slick: There are environmentally friendly ways of logging, mule logging comes to mind, where we can cut and remove select trees without damaging the surrounding forest.


When trees are removed from a forest repeatedly (as opposed to rotting or burning in situ) what happens to the composition of the soil?

There is a reason you often see a new tree glomming onto the trunk of a fallen tree.
 
2021-10-24 4:29:10 PM  

HighlanderRPI: [Fark user image 525x348]


Rake News!
 
2021-10-24 4:59:15 PM  
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2021-10-24 4:59:38 PM  

flondrix: Tom_Slick: There are environmentally friendly ways of logging, mule logging comes to mind, where we can cut and remove select trees without damaging the surrounding forest.

When trees are removed from a forest repeatedly (as opposed to rotting or burning in situ) what happens to the composition of the soil?

There is a reason you often see a new tree glomming onto the trunk of a fallen tree.


How long does it take an entire forest to regenerate after a complete and total forest fire?  There are pros and cons, I grew up in the forest and I can tell you young trees prefer not to grow through logs they prefer nice areas with fallen leaves and needles
 
2021-10-24 5:00:05 PM  
(Probably should have used the larger image instead)
 
2021-10-24 5:33:24 PM  

GaperKiller: When I was a young warthog I went to Pbilmont Scout Ranch and we backpacker for 14 days. You have to imagine they have 2000 or more kids on the property at any given time, so your itinerary is planned as far as what campsite and what night. On the 6th or so night we stayed with 6 or so other troops at a camp with hot showers (extreme luxury), but it had a wood fired boiler.
Entire forest picked clean, cleanest forest floor I've ever walked through.


So you all think that forests out west aren't logged, used for firewood, picked clean for firewood for campers, or used at all?
They are pretty much trashed from our use--picked clean, logged out, roads everywhere, and they burn anyway.  That's because the world is different now.   Nobody gave a fark about the forests or the state of the world when they built their cabins in the woods and flew around the world and bought a new car every 2 years, so the world changed.
It's not the farking forest's fault that it burns.  It's yours.  It's all of ours.  And you can't "manage" anymore, because we didn't manage our natural resources before, and now  it's out of our hands.  Nature is going to fix it for us however it needs to be fixed to lessen our damage, and we don't have a say in it.
so MANAGE that.
 
2021-10-24 5:48:55 PM  

GaperKiller: Oneiros: As stupid as 'rake the forest' is, most forests had people collecting downed branches for their cooking and heating fuel.

When I was a young warthog I went to Pbilmont Scout Ranch and we backpacker for 14 days. You have to imagine they have 2000 or more kids on the property at any given time, so your itinerary is planned as far as what campsite and what night. On the 6th or so night we stayed with 6 or so other troops at a camp with hot showers (extreme luxury), but it had a wood fired boiler.
Entire forest picked clean, cleanest forest floor I've ever walked through.


I've seen it theorized that the cause of the collapse of Rome, and maybe a few other great cities, was that the cleared out the surrounding forests for fire and building. Eventually the wood was coming from too far away to meet the needs of the city, and it collapsed over the course of a generation.

Until the advent of the steam engine the only way to move goods was by water (ship, boat, barge) or land (animal-drawn cart or sled). And they can only go so fast and haul so much.
 
DVD
2021-10-24 5:57:49 PM  

flondrix: Tom_Slick: There are environmentally friendly ways of logging, mule logging comes to mind, where we can cut and remove select trees without damaging the surrounding forest.

When trees are removed from a forest repeatedly (as opposed to rotting or burning in situ) what happens to the composition of the soil?

There is a reason you often see a new tree glomming onto the trunk of a fallen tree.


______________________________________​___

Cannibal trees!
 
2021-10-24 6:23:18 PM  

Tom_Slick: flondrix: Tom_Slick: There are environmentally friendly ways of logging, mule logging comes to mind, where we can cut and remove select trees without damaging the surrounding forest.

When trees are removed from a forest repeatedly (as opposed to rotting or burning in situ) what happens to the composition of the soil?

There is a reason you often see a new tree glomming onto the trunk of a fallen tree.

How long does it take an entire forest to regenerate after a complete and total forest fire?  There are pros and cons, I grew up in the forest and I can tell you young trees prefer not to grow through logs they prefer nice areas with fallen leaves and needles


upload.wikimedia.orgView Full Size
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nurs​e_​log

When a forest burns down, the ashes contain potasium, phosphorus, boron, copper, etc.  When you cut down a tree and haul it away, those elements go somewhere else.
 
2021-10-24 6:29:32 PM  

GRCooper: Can't have a forest fire if you don't have forests



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