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(Metro)   China denies claim it tested a 21,000mph nuclear-capable 'hypersonic missile', says it was just a simple 'space vehicle' and not a deadly high-tech weapon. Probably one of those nuclear-powered Jetson mobiles   (metro.co.uk) divider line
    More: Followup, Nuclear weapon, Ballistics, Rocket, United States, Missile, case of this particular test, Ballistic missile, Outer space  
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1341 clicks; posted to Main » on 18 Oct 2021 at 10:35 AM (7 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2021-10-18 10:37:08 AM  
I keep reading these hypersonic missile articles about both China and Russia, but an ICBM goes 21,000 mph and it has done so for the last 60+ years.  Why am I supposed to be worried about this?
 
2021-10-18 10:38:12 AM  

Rapmaster2000: I keep reading these hypersonic missile articles about both China and Russia, but an ICBM goes 21,000 mph and it has done so for the last 60+ years.  Why am I supposed to be worried about this?


Defense budget.
 
2021-10-18 10:39:39 AM  

Rapmaster2000: I keep reading these hypersonic missile articles about both China and Russia, but an ICBM goes 21,000 mph and it has done so for the last 60+ years.  Why am I supposed to be worried about this?


Icbms go 24000 kph which is like 18000 mph.
 
2021-10-18 10:40:31 AM  

Rapmaster2000: I keep reading these hypersonic missile articles about both China and Russia, but an ICBM goes 21,000 mph and it has done so for the last 60+ years.  Why am I supposed to be worried about this?


FOBS are more dangerous because they're less predictable than ICBMS, and can give less warning.

As to why you should be worried, it's because the government will want to give yet more money to the military.
 
2021-10-18 10:41:24 AM  
If it was a weapon, China would be telling everyone about it. That's the point. They routinely tell people about programs that are years from deployment to make it sound like they're scarier than they are, they use it for deterrence factor. If China isn't making a big deal of it, it's probably not a weapon.
 
2021-10-18 10:42:37 AM  

Rapmaster2000: I keep reading these hypersonic missile articles about both China and Russia, but an ICBM goes 21,000 mph and it has done so for the last 60+ years.  Why am I supposed to be worried about this?


We need a big bad to promote a new war.

"They're getting ready to invade Taiwan and nuke Los Angeles!"
 
2021-10-18 10:45:06 AM  
You know, I think I would prefer nuclear annihilation over the nazi dumpster fire this country is headed for.
 
2021-10-18 10:45:30 AM  

Rapmaster2000: I keep reading these hypersonic missile articles about both China and Russia, but an ICBM goes 21,000 mph and it has done so for the last 60+ years.  Why am I supposed to be worried about this?


It's not really about ICBMs. It's about being able to put something with the yield of a Tomahawk into a Carrier Battlegroup (or hurled at Guam) that is so fast it cant be detected in time to do anything about, or be dealt with by existing intercept systems.
 
2021-10-18 10:48:28 AM  
Fark user imageView Full Size

FTA: "The FT said it flew through space and circled the globe before cruising down toward its target - which it missed by about two dozen miles."

I guess that makes this 'the shot heard 'round the world!'

/I'll show myself out
 
2021-10-18 10:50:07 AM  
LEO speed is about 17500mph, and if you go elliptical you can get much higher, so what it sounds like is "reentry vehicle."

indylaw: We need a big bad to promote a new war.



100% This.
 
2021-10-18 10:53:29 AM  

Rapmaster2000: I keep reading these hypersonic missile articles about both China and Russia, but an ICBM goes 21,000 mph and it has done so for the last 60+ years.  Why am I supposed to be worried about this?


These suckers can be used as orbital platforms for bombs, IIRC. So more unpredictable than a ballistic missile.

But ever since we started working with ABMs designed to counter ICBMs, this has been predicted as a counter.

The reality is that the Chinese build just enough nuclear capability to provide deterrence. They can already rent half the rest of the globe, why conquer or (worse) irradiate it?
 
2021-10-18 10:55:03 AM  
the Chinese are so trust worthy when it comes to such things.
 
2021-10-18 10:55:52 AM  

zbtop: Rapmaster2000: I keep reading these hypersonic missile articles about both China and Russia, but an ICBM goes 21,000 mph and it has done so for the last 60+ years.  Why am I supposed to be worried about this?

It's not really about ICBMs. It's about being able to put something with the yield of a Tomahawk into a Carrier Battlegroup (or hurled at Guam) that is so fast it cant be detected in time to do anything about, or be dealt with by existing intercept systems.


Hell travelling at those speeds you don't really need a warhead
 
2021-10-18 10:56:41 AM  
Don't all space vehicles have the potential to be deadly high-tech weapons?
 
2021-10-18 10:57:37 AM  

Zenith: zbtop: Rapmaster2000: I keep reading these hypersonic missile articles about both China and Russia, but an ICBM goes 21,000 mph and it has done so for the last 60+ years.  Why am I supposed to be worried about this?

It's not really about ICBMs. It's about being able to put something with the yield of a Tomahawk into a Carrier Battlegroup (or hurled at Guam) that is so fast it cant be detected in time to do anything about, or be dealt with by existing intercept systems.

Hell travelling at those speeds you don't really need a warhead


People have been looking at space based kinetic energy weapons ever since we went to space.
 
2021-10-18 11:02:48 AM  
It doesn't surprise me at all that Fark's all up in China's jock.
 
2021-10-18 11:03:59 AM  

Marcos P: Rapmaster2000: I keep reading these hypersonic missile articles about both China and Russia, but an ICBM goes 21,000 mph and it has done so for the last 60+ years.  Why am I supposed to be worried about this?

Icbms go 24000 kph which is like 18000 mph.


That's 31680000 football fields!
 
2021-10-18 11:05:47 AM  
warmongers are some of the worst kinds of people.
 
2021-10-18 11:07:09 AM  

ketkarsa: Don't all space vehicles have the potential to be deadly high-tech weapons?


...if you're brave enough.
 
2021-10-18 11:07:33 AM  
The military industrial complex working as designed. Use fear to justifying taking tax payers money and giving it to private military contractors to keep us safe from the imaginary bogeyman.
 
2021-10-18 11:08:03 AM  

Flincher: You know, I think I would prefer nuclear annihilation over the nazi dumpster fire this country is headed for.


And we agree.  You should be nuked rather than allowed to control our school board or something something.
 
2021-10-18 11:08:56 AM  

zbtop: Rapmaster2000: I keep reading these hypersonic missile articles about both China and Russia, but an ICBM goes 21,000 mph and it has done so for the last 60+ years.  Why am I supposed to be worried about this?

It's not really about ICBMs. It's about being able to put something with the yield of a Tomahawk into a Carrier Battlegroup (or hurled at Guam) that is so fast it cant be detected in time to do anything about, or be dealt with by existing intercept systems.


I don't know about that though - the Aegis BMD system can already target ICBMs, which during reentry are hypersonic. And Japan picked up some of the Aegis BMD systems specifically to deal with hypersonic missiles.
 
2021-10-18 11:12:31 AM  

Rapmaster2000: I keep reading these hypersonic missile articles about both China and Russia, but an ICBM goes 21,000 mph and it has done so for the last 60+ years.  Why am I supposed to be worried about this?


Hypersonic missiles can manuever.

ICBMs follow a predictable path. Once it launches you know where it's going.

guardingindia.comView Full Size
 
2021-10-18 11:12:58 AM  
Kind of have to believe them on this. If they had such a thing, they would be bragging about it.
 
2021-10-18 11:14:04 AM  
If they use them we're all dead anyway and they are too.

I hope the Chinese love their children too.

Seriously hope they understand that.
 
2021-10-18 11:14:30 AM  
Whew! I was worried there for a second. Thankfully, the trusty people of the Chinese government put this rumor to bed once and for all.
 
2021-10-18 11:15:50 AM  

Publikwerks: zbtop: Rapmaster2000: I keep reading these hypersonic missile articles about both China and Russia, but an ICBM goes 21,000 mph and it has done so for the last 60+ years.  Why am I supposed to be worried about this?

It's not really about ICBMs. It's about being able to put something with the yield of a Tomahawk into a Carrier Battlegroup (or hurled at Guam) that is so fast it cant be detected in time to do anything about, or be dealt with by existing intercept systems.

I don't know about that though - the Aegis BMD system can already target ICBMs, which during reentry are hypersonic. And Japan picked up some of the Aegis BMD systems specifically to deal with hypersonic missiles.


ICBMs have a big arc up and then down, and are easier to detect. These new-fangled guys go parallel to the ground at high speed, and hit their target (if they can make them accurate enough) before they can be detected or defended against.
 
2021-10-18 11:17:07 AM  

zbtop: Rapmaster2000: I keep reading these hypersonic missile articles about both China and Russia, but an ICBM goes 21,000 mph and it has done so for the last 60+ years.  Why am I supposed to be worried about this?

It's not really about ICBMs. It's about being able to put something with the yield of a Tomahawk into a Carrier Battlegroup (or hurled at Guam) that is so fast it cant be detected in time to do anything about, or be dealt with by existing intercept systems.


FOBS is about hitting targets on the other side of the world from less predictable angles. It won't be inherently more difficult to detect. It might, for a short period of time, be able to evade existing long range radar detection because they aren't optimized for a Southern approach. However, they cannot hide the launch of said weapons. We would still know they are on their way.

Hypersonic weapons are, as you said, more about delivering conventional precision weapons quickly. There are lots of people claiming that they are being WAY over estimated. They are very detectable at a great range as they are largely required to fly in the upper atmosphere to avoid melting. I have seen nothing indicating that they are any less interceptable by SM-6s.
 
2021-10-18 11:17:09 AM  

zbtop: Rapmaster2000: I keep reading these hypersonic missile articles about both China and Russia, but an ICBM goes 21,000 mph and it has done so for the last 60+ years.  Why am I supposed to be worried about this?

It's not really about ICBMs. It's about being able to put something with the yield of a Tomahawk into a Carrier Battlegroup (or hurled at Guam) that is so fast it cant be detected in time to do anything about, or be dealt with by existing intercept systems.


But you can't do anything anyway about a cloud of ICBM missiles with MIRVs either. China just wants to be able to fark something, anything before one US boomer sub wipes out all it's cities to keep some kind of MAD going.

I'm not going to loose any sleep over this.
 
2021-10-18 11:17:44 AM  

ketkarsa: Don't all space vehicles have the potential to be deadly high-tech weapons?


Yes.  The entire Go To The Moon program was just testing all the systems for nuclear missiles without you know, directly saying we were testing the systems for nuclear missiles.  About the only thing not ICBM-related were the life-support systems.  And considering the batty ideas for pigeon-guided nukes, even those might still have been weapon systems.
 
2021-10-18 11:17:46 AM  
Oh noes, let's give the Pentagon a few more trillion dollars to lose ASAP!  fark off.  The whole procurement and administration side of the DoD needs to be fired.

dryknife: Marcos P: Rapmaster2000: I keep reading these hypersonic missile articles about both China and Russia, but an ICBM goes 21,000 mph and it has done so for the last 60+ years.  Why am I supposed to be worried about this?

Icbms go 24000 kph which is like 18000 mph.

That's 31680000 football fields!


Gonna needs that translated to Rhode Islands.
 
2021-10-18 11:18:53 AM  
It is NOT a nuclear-capable hypersonic missile.

It's just a regular missile that sometimes flies too fast because it loves its job. We only developed it to deliver takeout and it's just a weird coincidence that a 100KT micro design warhead is exact the same size as a bucket of KFC.
 
2021-10-18 11:19:38 AM  

Flincher: You know, I think I would prefer nuclear annihilation over the nazi dumpster fire this country is headed for.


Can I pick "none of the above"?  That still leaves us with climate change and Milli Vanilli reunion tours to worry about.
 
2021-10-18 11:30:22 AM  
If the rest of the world can do it, why can't China? US has killed more people in stupid wars than China not even started has in a long time.......Welcome your new superpower......
 
2021-10-18 11:35:04 AM  
The way scramjets work is really cool too, no moving parts, the air compresses itself from inertia. The hard part is getting it up to speed first.

thumbs.dreamstime.comView Full Size
 
2021-10-18 11:35:19 AM  
They keep saying their weapons developments are purely defensive, so that's a relief.
 
2021-10-18 11:35:59 AM  
Ding!...........................slobbe​r.
 
2021-10-18 11:37:34 AM  

allears: Publikwerks: zbtop: Rapmaster2000: I keep reading these hypersonic missile articles about both China and Russia, but an ICBM goes 21,000 mph and it has done so for the last 60+ years.  Why am I supposed to be worried about this?

It's not really about ICBMs. It's about being able to put something with the yield of a Tomahawk into a Carrier Battlegroup (or hurled at Guam) that is so fast it cant be detected in time to do anything about, or be dealt with by existing intercept systems.

I don't know about that though - the Aegis BMD system can already target ICBMs, which during reentry are hypersonic. And Japan picked up some of the Aegis BMD systems specifically to deal with hypersonic missiles.

ICBMs have a big arc up and then down, and are easier to detect. These new-fangled guys go parallel to the ground at high speed, and hit their target (if they can make them accurate enough) before they can be detected or defended against.


Moreover, they're maneuverable, so you can't predict where they're headed. That makes it even tougher.
 
2021-10-18 11:38:43 AM  
149346005.v2.pressablecdn.comView Full Size
 
2021-10-18 11:42:29 AM  

zbtop: Rapmaster2000: I keep reading these hypersonic missile articles about both China and Russia, but an ICBM goes 21,000 mph and it has done so for the last 60+ years.  Why am I supposed to be worried about this?

It's not really about ICBMs. It's about being able to put something with the yield of a Tomahawk into a Carrier Battlegroup (or hurled at Guam) that is so fast it cant be detected in time to do anything about, or be dealt with by existing intercept systems.


So they burn 10x the fuel for 1/10th the accuracy?
 
2021-10-18 11:47:05 AM  
We cannot allow a Hypersonic Missile Gap
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2021-10-18 11:48:51 AM  
Or they could save a few billion yuan and simply stick a warhead in a shipping container if they really wanted a sneak attack.

These things are pointless- fine, you have a weapon that can avoid detection and blow up a US city, or even a lot of them.  At any given point there are something like 8 Ohio class SSBNs on patrol- any one of them ends human civilization.  Did you sink all of them before your magic hypersonic missile attack?
 
2021-10-18 11:56:48 AM  

ketkarsa: Don't all space vehicles have the potential to be deadly high-tech weapons?


Yes.

bigboy.comView Full Size
 
2021-10-18 11:59:24 AM  

Glockenspiel Hero: Or they could save a few billion yuan and simply stick a warhead in a shipping container if they really wanted a sneak attack.

These things are pointless- fine, you have a weapon that can avoid detection and blow up a US city, or even a lot of them.  At any given point there are something like 8 Ohio class SSBNs on patrol- any one of them ends human civilization.  Did you sink all of them before your magic hypersonic missile attack?


I think it is only like 3 to 4 at any one time. Only half of them can target China.
 
2021-10-18 12:09:22 PM  
Fark user imageView Full Size


/I miss the classics when it comes to cold war hysteria
 
2021-10-18 12:19:26 PM  

Rapmaster2000: I keep reading these hypersonic missile articles about both China and Russia, but an ICBM goes 21,000 mph and it has done so for the last 60+ years.  Why am I supposed to be worried about this?


When your doing 2100 mph and that guy passes like your standing still.
 
Juc
2021-10-18 12:33:13 PM  
space vehicle or weapon, it's pretty much just a difference of payload and where you have it crash.
 
2021-10-18 12:34:16 PM  
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2021-10-18 12:37:58 PM  
Thankfully a Wisconsin douche (republican) congressman went ahead and made the requisite political jab at President Biden:

Gallagher said America could "lose the new Cold War with Communist China within the decade" if the Biden administration sticks to its "current complacent course."

Obviously $750 billion is just not quite enough this year.
 
2021-10-18 12:41:31 PM  

SirGunslinger: zbtop: Rapmaster2000: I keep reading these hypersonic missile articles about both China and Russia, but an ICBM goes 21,000 mph and it has done so for the last 60+ years.  Why am I supposed to be worried about this?

It's not really about ICBMs. It's about being able to put something with the yield of a Tomahawk into a Carrier Battlegroup (or hurled at Guam) that is so fast it cant be detected in time to do anything about, or be dealt with by existing intercept systems.

So they burn 10x the fuel for 1/10th the accuracy?


What assholes, it's almost like they don't even care about the carbon footprint of their nukes.
 
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