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(KTLA Los Angeles)   Private prison sued by inmate kept in isolated confinement for over a year   (ktla.com) divider line
    More: Interesting, Criminal justice, United Kingdom, David Bowie, Supermax, Prison, KOS Media, private prison company, Man  
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3085 clicks; posted to Main » on 17 Oct 2021 at 2:26 PM (6 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2021-10-17 2:10:24 PM  
Instead of punitive damages, put the prison CEO and head of prison security in solitary/isolated confinement for more than a year.

/experience has a way of changing people
 
2021-10-17 2:32:59 PM  
Privatized corrections and civil forfeiture are the "one-two punch" of "fark your rights".
 
2021-10-17 2:36:47 PM  
Private Prisons and for profit detention should never be a thing.
 
2021-10-17 2:40:05 PM  
Thanks for providing a comprehensive article with enough information from all sides to form my own opinions.
 
2021-10-17 2:47:59 PM  
He says he is a U.S. citizen but lacks the necessary paperwork to prove it.

That's an interesting claim. It's possible, but how do you prove that?
 
2021-10-17 2:48:56 PM  

maxandgrinch: Thanks for providing a comprehensive article with enough information from all sides to form my own opinions.


Not subby, but there's a link to the L.A. Times full story at the bottom of the article. L.A. Times no longer links well to Fark.
 
2021-10-17 2:49:45 PM  
Prove you're in the United States!
 
2021-10-17 2:53:15 PM  
Pierce the corporate veil.
 
2021-10-17 2:56:54 PM  

maxandgrinch: Thanks for providing a comprehensive article with enough information from all sides to form my own opinions.


I actually only read half, I'm saving the other half for tonight; too wordy for one sitting.
 
2021-10-17 3:00:08 PM  
Everyone should read the chapter in Papillon that covers his 2 year stint in isolation. It does funny things to the mind but not funny ha ha.
 
2021-10-17 3:02:36 PM  
How do you isolate and confine a private prison for over a year?

/well maybe if it's in space...
 
2021-10-17 3:02:59 PM  

mrmopar5287: He says he is a U.S. citizen but lacks the necessary paperwork to prove it.

That's an interesting claim. It's possible, but how do you prove that?


Adolf here thinks everyone should have carry papers.
 
2021-10-17 3:05:10 PM  
I seriously wonder how many white Americans could prove their birth country.
 
2021-10-17 3:05:44 PM  
Holy Shiatballs.
How does a person survive and come back from a year of solitary?
 
2021-10-17 3:06:36 PM  

Laobaojun: Privatized corrections and civil forfeiture are the "one-two punch" of "fark your rights".


This is one of the few things I truly, deeply agree with.  This is a terrible system and should never be used.  It incentivizes authority to criminalize everything.
 
2021-10-17 3:10:31 PM  

noitsnot: mrmopar5287: He says he is a U.S. citizen but lacks the necessary paperwork to prove it.

That's an interesting claim. It's possible, but how do you prove that?

Adolf here thinks everyone should have carry papers.


Sure, it's required that I have my driver license with me every time I'm out operating my car in public. Aside from that, I've got a US passport so that's in a database and is de jure proof that I'm a citizen.
 
2021-10-17 3:12:34 PM  

mrmopar5287: He says he is a U.S. citizen but lacks the necessary paperwork to prove it.

That's an interesting claim. It's possible, but how do you prove that?


Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2021-10-17 3:19:39 PM  

alienated: mrmopar5287: He says he is a U.S. citizen but lacks the necessary paperwork to prove it.

That's an interesting claim. It's possible, but how do you prove that?

[Fark user image image 300x300]


Beat me to it. Maybe he was from east LA.
 
2021-10-17 3:19:40 PM  

mrmopar5287: He says he is a U.S. citizen but lacks the necessary paperwork to prove it.

That's an interesting claim. It's possible, but how do you prove that?


Prove you're not a terrorist.  Until you can do so I'm going to assume you are one.

/ We already knew you were a Trump fellating a-hole.
 
2021-10-17 3:21:54 PM  

starsrift: I seriously wonder how many white Americans could prove their birth country.


It's on your birth certificate.
 
2021-10-17 3:22:28 PM  

hlehmann: Prove you're not a terrorist.  Until you can do so I'm going to assume you are one.


Proving a negative is entirely the opposite of proving a positive. The burden is entirely on him to prove he's a US citizen.
 
2021-10-17 3:23:44 PM  

aungen: Laobaojun: Privatized corrections and civil forfeiture are the "one-two punch" of "fark your rights".

This is one of the few things I truly, deeply agree with.  This is a terrible system and should never be used.  It incentivizes authority to criminalize everything.


And it incentivizes private companies to lobby or bribe lawmakers or judges to criminalize everything.
 
2021-10-17 3:24:22 PM  

aungen: Laobaojun: Privatized corrections and civil forfeiture are the "one-two punch" of "fark your rights".

This is one of the few things I truly, deeply agree with.  This is a terrible system and should never be used.  It incentivizes authority to criminalize everything.


Steal from the weak.
 
2021-10-17 3:27:24 PM  
Is "isolated confinement" the same as "solitary confinement" and the author just had a brain fart? Also, not to be callous, but there are inmates in supermax prisons who have done multiple years in AdSeg.

Why yes, they come out completely bugfark insane, why do you ask?
 
2021-10-17 3:27:57 PM  

mrmopar5287: He says he is a U.S. citizen but lacks the necessary paperwork to prove it.

That's an interesting claim. It's possible, but how do you prove that?


The options are:
1) U.S. birth certificate;
2) U.S. passport;
3) Naturalization Certificate; or,
4) Certificate of Citizenship.

Most of us are not in the habit of carrying any of those documents around with us (the possible exception being the U.S. passport card) but any law enforcement agency can easily reach out to the County Registrar of your place of birth, the U.S. Department of State, or U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services to verify that you are rightly entitled to one (or more) of those documents.
 
2021-10-17 3:28:48 PM  
Solitary confinement is torture.
 
2021-10-17 3:34:17 PM  
I hope they get sued into bankruptcy.  Private prisons should not exist.
 
2021-10-17 3:34:39 PM  

Miss_Dorothy_Kilgallen: mrmopar5287: He says he is a U.S. citizen but lacks the necessary paperwork to prove it.

That's an interesting claim. It's possible, but how do you prove that?

The options are:
1) U.S. birth certificate;
2) U.S. passport;
3) Naturalization Certificate; or,
4) Certificate of Citizenship.

Most of us are not in the habit of carrying any of those documents around with us (the possible exception being the U.S. passport card) but any law enforcement agency can easily reach out to the County Registrar of your place of birth, the U.S. Department of State, or U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services to verify that you are rightly entitled to one (or more) of those documents.


You DO NOT NEED TO CARRY PAPERS.  Please don't feed the troll.
 
2021-10-17 3:40:24 PM  

Gyrfalcon: Is "isolated confinement" the same as "solitary confinement" and the author just had a brain fart? Also, not to be callous, but there are inmates in supermax prisons who have done multiple years in AdSeg.


After being tried and convicted of a crime.

The guy in TFA wasn't being incarcerated, he was being "detained".  No charges, no trial.
 
2021-10-17 3:49:14 PM  

Miss_Dorothy_Kilgallen: mrmopar5287: He says he is a U.S. citizen but lacks the necessary paperwork to prove it.

That's an interesting claim. It's possible, but how do you prove that?

The options are:
1) U.S. birth certificate;
2) U.S. passport;
3) Naturalization Certificate; or,
4) Certificate of Citizenship.

Most of us are not in the habit of carrying any of those documents around with us (the possible exception being the U.S. passport card) but any law enforcement agency can easily reach out to the County Registrar of your place of birth, the U.S. Department of State, or U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services to verify that you are rightly entitled to one (or more) of those documents.


The LA Times story details: "Murillo says he is entitled to U.S. citizenship through his late U.S.-born military veteran father."

Reading between the lines, he was not a citizen at birth (because that would be automatic and he wouldn't be "entitled to" US citizenship - he would already BE a citizen). That leaves me to assume his parents were not married, and the following applies if he was born in Mexico:

8 U.S.C. § 1409 paragraph (a) provides that children born to American fathers unmarried to the children's non-American mothers are considered U.S. citizens only if the father meets the "physical presence" conditions (the US citizen father has been "physically present" in the U.S. before the child's birth for a total period of at least five years, and at least two of those five years were after the U.S. citizen father's fourteenth birthday), and the father takes several actions:
1. Unless deceased, has agreed to provide financial support while the child is under the age of 18 years
2. Establish paternity by clear and convincing evidence and, while the person is under the age of 18 years:
- the person is legitimated under the law of the person's residence or domicile, and
    a) the father acknowledges paternity of the person in writing under oath, or
    b) the paternity of the person is established by adjudication of a competent court

If his dad did none of those things above, he's screwed. He cannot be an adult and gain citizenship because those things listed above have to be done before he turned 18. If his dad had done those things, he would be a citizen instead of claiming he is "entitled to" citizenship.
 
2021-10-17 3:49:50 PM  

noitsnot: You DO NOT NEED TO CARRY PAPERS


I never said you had to carry them. This is a case of a serious challenge for deportation, and when that happens you do have to provide them.
 
2021-10-17 3:53:26 PM  

mrmopar5287: noitsnot: You DO NOT NEED TO CARRY PAPERS

I never said you had to carry them. This is a case of a serious challenge for deportation, and when that happens you do have to provide them.


You can't deport a US citizen from the US.
 
2021-10-17 3:59:36 PM  

noitsnot: Miss_Dorothy_Kilgallen: mrmopar5287: He says he is a U.S. citizen but lacks the necessary paperwork to prove it.

That's an interesting claim. It's possible, but how do you prove that?

The options are:
1) U.S. birth certificate;
2) U.S. passport;
3) Naturalization Certificate; or,
4) Certificate of Citizenship.

Most of us are not in the habit of carrying any of those documents around with us (the possible exception being the U.S. passport card) but any law enforcement agency can easily reach out to the County Registrar of your place of birth, the U.S. Department of State, or U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services to verify that you are rightly entitled to one (or more) of those documents.

You DO NOT NEED TO CARRY PAPERS.  Please don't feed the troll.


No one said (or, even, implied) that you need to be carrying these papers.  In fact, I explicitly addressed that in my comment.
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2021-10-17 4:06:17 PM  

noitsnot: mrmopar5287: noitsnot: You DO NOT NEED TO CARRY PAPERS

I never said you had to carry them. This is a case of a serious challenge for deportation, and when that happens you do have to provide them.

You can't deport a US citizen from the US.


Sure you can. It's been done before.
 
2021-10-17 4:16:27 PM  
Forgetting for the moment the issue of his citizenship, assuming for the moment that the person belongs behind bars what on Earth is the justification for a year's length in solitary confinement?
 
2021-10-17 4:19:50 PM  

gaslight: Forgetting for the moment the issue of his citizenship, assuming for the moment that the person belongs behind bars what on Earth is the justification for a year's length in solitary confinement?


A year's worth of payments to the private prison.

Oh, sorry, you meant a legitimate justification.  Can't help ya there.
 
2021-10-17 4:19:52 PM  

gaslight: Forgetting for the moment the issue of his citizenship, assuming for the moment that the person belongs behind bars what on Earth is the justification for a year's length in solitary confinement?


The cruelty is the point.
 
2021-10-17 4:27:55 PM  

mrmopar5287: He says he is a U.S. citizen but lacks the necessary paperwork to prove it.

That's an interesting claim. It's possible, but how do you prove that?


Face, photograph, name, date of birth, fingerprints, then go into school documents bank documents etc.
 
2021-10-17 4:37:01 PM  

gaslight: what on Earth is the justification for a year's length in solitary confinement?


He was asked what he wanted and he chose that.
 
2021-10-17 4:37:29 PM  

WDFark think for a second: mrmopar5287: He says he is a U.S. citizen but lacks the necessary paperwork to prove it.

That's an interesting claim. It's possible, but how do you prove that?

Face, photograph, name, date of birth, fingerprints, then go into school documents bank documents etc.


None of that proves citizenship.
 
2021-10-17 4:37:48 PM  

mrmopar5287: He says he is a U.S. citizen but lacks the necessary paperwork to prove it.

That's an interesting claim. It's possible, but how do you prove that?


Maybe ask the anti-voter Id folks
 
2021-10-17 4:40:44 PM  

frankb00th: Everyone should read the chapter in Papillon that covers his 2 year stint in isolation. It does funny things to the mind but not funny ha ha.


Part of me thinks, I reckon I'd do all right at that.  But I'm sure it's hubris.
 
2021-10-17 4:58:52 PM  

Lady J: frankb00th: Everyone should read the chapter in Papillon that covers his 2 year stint in isolation. It does funny things to the mind but not funny ha ha.

Part of me thinks, I reckon I'd do all right at that.  But I'm sure it's hubris.


Its not just the social isolation, I think the monotonous visual stimulus affecr people a lot. We need some variety in our physical enviroment, and 8x8 call is distressing similar to a deprivation tank.

Deprivation tanks make people literally hallucinate.
 
2021-10-17 5:09:29 PM  
He's not going to be seen for a while.
 
2021-10-17 5:24:36 PM  

Lady J: frankb00th: Everyone should read the chapter in Papillon that covers his 2 year stint in isolation. It does funny things to the mind but not funny ha ha.

Part of me thinks, I reckon I'd do all right at that.  But I'm sure it's hubris.


2 years in isolation, no books, no talking, no interactions, naked bulb on 24 hrs a day, no climate control.
It would take an enormous capacity to focus inward to not let the crushing weight of isolation eat you alive. As stated in the book, many come out of there insane.
 
2021-10-17 5:34:11 PM  

mrmopar5287: He says he is a U.S. citizen but lacks the necessary paperwork to prove it.

That's an interesting claim. It's possible, but how do you prove that?


He isn't a US citizen.  He was born in Mexico and both his parents are not US citizens.  At some point in his life his father became naturalized in exchange for his US military service and he claims he incorrectly thought that automatically made him one.

But giving the full story might make the article less dramatic and so those little facts are glossed over.
 
2021-10-17 5:38:41 PM  

nobody11155: mrmopar5287: He says he is a U.S. citizen but lacks the necessary paperwork to prove it.

That's an interesting claim. It's possible, but how do you prove that?

He isn't a US citizen.  He was born in Mexico and both his parents are not US citizens.  At some point in his life his father became naturalized in exchange for his US military service and he claims he incorrectly thought that automatically made him one.

But giving the full story might make the article less dramatic and so those little facts are glossed over.


I looked it up since I couldn't remember the exact requirements.

Under current law, you derive citizenship if one of your parents was born in the U.S. or if one of your parents naturalized prior to your 18th birthday and while you were living in the U.S. in the legal and physical custody of that parent.

It wouldn't be that difficult to misunderstand the requirements.
 
2021-10-17 5:46:09 PM  

OgreMagi: Under current law, you derive citizenship if one of your parents was born in the U.S.


Not strictly true. Read what I posted about births out of wedlock.
 
2021-10-17 5:46:12 PM  
The only reason we have private prisons is 99% for GOPers to make money, and have slaves.
 
2021-10-17 5:46:46 PM  

nobody11155: mrmopar5287: He says he is a U.S. citizen but lacks the necessary paperwork to prove it.

That's an interesting claim. It's possible, but how do you prove that?

He isn't a US citizen.  He was born in Mexico and both his parents are not US citizens.  At some point in his life his father became naturalized in exchange for his US military service and he claims he incorrectly thought that automatically made him one.

But giving the full story might make the article less dramatic and so those little facts are glossed over.


That sounds like the drive-by media I know.
 
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