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(Al Jazeera)   'Unprecedented' power cuts in China hit homes and factories amid coal shortage, as industry watchers predict China will suddenly and miraculously find an ancient map showing a historical claim to all of Siberia   (aljazeera.com) divider line
    More: Interesting, Greenhouse gas, Electricity generation, Coal, Carbon monoxide, Power station, Power outage, northeastern China, Northeast China  
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1654 clicks; posted to Main » on 28 Sep 2021 at 4:30 PM (10 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



45 Comments     (+0 »)
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest
 
2021-09-28 3:26:14 PM  
I do not envy being the Russian government
 
2021-09-28 4:05:08 PM  
Or they will show us some more record setting construction, this time of nuclear reactors.
 
2021-09-28 4:18:51 PM  

aleister_greynight: Or they will show us some more record setting construction, this time of nuclear reactors.


Well, that's a disturbing thought.

/Not against nuclear reactors
//Against rushed nuclear reactors
///Especially given their track record on other rushed buildings.
 
2021-09-28 4:35:00 PM  
c.tenor.comView Full Size
 
2021-09-28 4:35:56 PM  
how a watch predicts:

Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2021-09-28 4:37:44 PM  
China just needs more NBA money to keep the sweat-shops open.
 
2021-09-28 4:37:50 PM  
Subby - did you even read TFA?

It's not that China doesn't have coal/fuel.
It's that their gov is forcibly limiting power generation in an effort to meet emissions targets.

They could burn coal all day long-but it has become politically problematic to do so
 
Xai [recently expired TotalFark]
2021-09-28 4:40:07 PM  
I wonder how the latest trade war is going...

Hmm, funny how trade wars seem to mostly hurt the people starting them.
 
2021-09-28 4:41:12 PM  
 
2021-09-28 4:43:54 PM  
GOOD.
 
2021-09-28 4:48:38 PM  

ElecricalPast: Subby - did you even read TFA?

It's not that China doesn't have coal/fuel.
It's that their gov is forcibly limiting power generation in an effort to meet emissions targets.

They could burn coal all day long-but it has become politically problematic to do so


They mention many times in the article "coal shortage"

the electricity crunch has taken hold amid disruptions to coal supplies due to the pandemic as well as a trade tiff with Australia.

The coal shortages, toughening greenhouse gas emissions standards and strong demand from industry have pushed coal prices to record highs in China.

But coal traders noted finding new import sources may be easier said than done.

What article are you referring to?
 
2021-09-28 4:51:00 PM  

aleister_greynight: Or they will show us some more record setting construction, this time of nuclear reactors.


Considering that the way they achieve those records is by ignoring safety standards, that does not comfort me.

SirDigbyChickenCaesar: ElecricalPast: Subby - did you even read TFA?

It's not that China doesn't have coal/fuel.
It's that their gov is forcibly limiting power generation in an effort to meet emissions targets.

They could burn coal all day long-but it has become politically problematic to do so

They mention many times in the article "coal shortage"

the electricity crunch has taken hold amid disruptions to coal supplies due to the pandemic as well as a trade tiff with Australia.

The coal shortages, toughening greenhouse gas emissions standards and strong demand from industry have pushed coal prices to record highs in China.

But coal traders noted finding new import sources may be easier said than done.

What article are you referring to?


Australia used to be a major supplier, if I recall correctly. Perhaps pissing off the countries that sell you your power source is unwise? But good luck getting the Chinese to admit that their posturing in the South China Sea is a bad thing.
 
2021-09-28 4:55:02 PM  

ElecricalPast: Subby - did you even read TFA?

It's not that China doesn't have coal/fuel.
It's that their gov is forcibly limiting power generation in an effort to meet emissions targets.

They could burn coal all day long-but it has become politically problematic to do so


You apparently only read part of the article. China can't get coal supplies (due to them being assholes), they use the 'environmental' excuse to ignore the problems they are experiencing, after-all China can not have the World see them fail at something.
 
2021-09-28 4:55:40 PM  

SirDigbyChickenCaesar: ElecricalPast: Subby - did you even read TFA?

It's not that China doesn't have coal/fuel.
It's that their gov is forcibly limiting power generation in an effort to meet emissions targets.

They could burn coal all day long-but it has become politically problematic to do so

They mention many times in the article "coal shortage"

the electricity crunch has taken hold amid disruptions to coal supplies due to the pandemic as well as a trade tiff with Australia.

The coal shortages, toughening greenhouse gas emissions standards and strong demand from industry have pushed coal prices to record highs in China.

But coal traders noted finding new import sources may be easier said than done.

What article are you referring to?


I guess I'm Referring to the fact that it's a self-produced, self-inflicted issue.

It's due almoat entirely to political meddling:

https://www.wsj.com/articles/china-po​w​er-outages-pose-new-threat-to-supplies​-of-chips-and-other-goods-11632769617
 
2021-09-28 5:00:40 PM  
...ancient map showing a historical claim to all of Siberia

Aka "The Northern Resource Area."
 
2021-09-28 5:07:06 PM  
On the case!

thewrap.comView Full Size
 
2021-09-28 5:14:13 PM  

ElecricalPast: Subby - did you even read TFA?

It's not that China doesn't have coal/fuel.
It's that their gov is forcibly limiting power generation in an effort to meet emissions targets.

They could burn coal all day long-but it has become politically problematic to do so


Oh... that's what a functional government looks like?

/We're doomed
//Doooooooooooooomed!
///...So... roll coal for Jesus?
 
2021-09-28 5:28:35 PM  
Who owns that power company?  Large companies in China tend to be controlled by ex-CCP members or retired army generals and the two groups seem to be fighting amongst themselves.  Until 30 years ago, the Chinese army was mostly self funded thought their ownership of things like shipping and steel manufacturing.  If your supply chain depends on China, your problems are just going to get worse.
 
2021-09-28 5:38:32 PM  

Destructor: ...ancient map showing a historical claim to all of Siberia

Aka "The Northern Resource Area."


Look at all the water Lake Baikal has and it's not being used for glorious benefit of China. What a waste
 
2021-09-28 5:45:53 PM  

DON.MAC: Who owns that power company?  Large companies in China tend to be controlled by ex-CCP members or retired army generals and the two groups seem to be fighting amongst themselves.  Until 30 years ago, the Chinese army was mostly self funded thought their ownership of things like shipping and steel manufacturing.  If your supply chain depends on China, your problems are just going to get worse.


China allows private ownership of infrastructure? I was not aware of this. I knew the Army got revenues from industries it controlled, but that is still socialism. I did not realize they'd relaxed things to the extent you say.
 
2021-09-28 5:47:56 PM  

Toxophil: ElecricalPast: Subby - did you even read TFA?

It's not that China doesn't have coal/fuel.
It's that their gov is forcibly limiting power generation in an effort to meet emissions targets.

They could burn coal all day long-but it has become politically problematic to do so

Oh... that's what a functional government looks like?

/We're doomed
//Doooooooooooooomed!
///...So... roll coal for Jesus?


I just hope political correctness could be in SoCal...

i.pinimg.comView Full Size
 
2021-09-28 5:48:25 PM  
"Northern Resource Area"

Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2021-09-28 5:49:34 PM  

Destructor: ...ancient map showing a historical claim to all of Siberia

Aka "The Northern Resource Area."


You beat me to it.
 
2021-09-28 5:49:38 PM  
Tom Clancy wrote two books about this exact subject, one in 1986 the other in 2000. We helped Russia in Siberia in one and China in Siberia in another.  I wonder which side the US will go with in real life.
 
2021-09-28 5:54:24 PM  

Bread314: Tom Clancy wrote two books about this exact subject, one in 1986 the other in 2000. We helped Russia in Siberia in one and China in Siberia in another.  I wonder which side the US will go with in real life.


We will study the situation carefully and invade Burkina Faso.
 
2021-09-28 6:20:14 PM  

Arkanaut: Well, there's this... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/​Primorsky_Krai


Wow, some beautiful country.
Hmmm.42 -48 degrees latitude N... probably colder than Arkansas in the winter.

Do not want.
 
2021-09-28 6:28:56 PM  

Bootleg: aleister_greynight: Or they will show us some more record setting construction, this time of nuclear reactors.

Well, that's a disturbing thought.

/Not against nuclear reactors
//Against rushed nuclear reactors
///Especially given their track record on other rushed buildings.


As long as there is foreign money in it, it seems to hold up well. Unless the government has some kind of news wall, I don't think I have ever heard if a Nike or Apple factory falling down like those condos and appartments.
 
2021-09-28 6:30:39 PM  
tin foil hat on.

engineering in a crisis to help russia

going to announced push to finish that pipeline that was suppose to finish next year and russia will say to europe o geez you know everybody need gas now and china's a dear friend and our pipeline can ship that gas to them now instead of just europe so well ... gas price X2 keep taking your time on nordstream 2 approval.
 
2021-09-28 6:41:48 PM  

mrmopar5287: "Northern Resource Area"

[Fark user image 252x395]


I love the Tom Clancy novel where the liberal stooge has to be rescued from their own naivete by the hard swole special ops guy from the wrong side of the tracks but he toed the line and went to all the military things that made him hard and swole.
 
2021-09-28 6:42:37 PM  

AlgaeRancher: I do not envy being the Russian government


I'm surprised china hasn't done it yet. But I bet after Putin is deposed and there is a civil war, they will just waltz in and take what they want. Who would stop them?
 
2021-09-28 6:46:38 PM  

mrmopar5287: Destructor: ...ancient map showing a historical claim to all of Siberia

Aka "The Northern Resource Area."

You beat me to it.


Not one thing is ever too obscure on Fark.

Thank you for restoring my faith in that.
 
DVD
2021-09-28 6:50:42 PM  

Arkanaut: Well, there's this... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/​Primorsky_Krai


_________________________________

Well there's a little bit more eek on the plate for consideration.

However, Russian nukes are not out of consideration yet, so the Northern Resource Areas might not be practical to plan for, yet.
 
2021-09-28 7:00:22 PM  

CheatCommando: DON.MAC: Who owns that power company?  Large companies in China tend to be controlled by ex-CCP members or retired army generals and the two groups seem to be fighting amongst themselves.  Until 30 years ago, the Chinese army was mostly self funded thought their ownership of things like shipping and steel manufacturing.  If your supply chain depends on China, your problems are just going to get worse.

China allows private ownership of infrastructure? I was not aware of this. I knew the Army got revenues from industries it controlled, but that is still socialism. I did not realize they'd relaxed things to the extent you say.


Many of the old army assets are now in private hands because it didn't look capitalistic. Of course those hands are high up people in the army and or the CPP.   A good example to look into is China Shipping and COSCO as a mix of those companies all were little corporate fiefdoms controlled by former officials.  Then there is Macau which seems to have a completely different power structure that predates both.
 
2021-09-28 7:22:29 PM  
The coal industry has long been the darling of the Chinese economy. They ask for what they want and they get it. They provide heat and electricity to much more than half the country. You think the US has a problem with West Virginia? Ha!

Anyway, so this is happening. Someone upthread remarked that a crash construction program of nuclear plants might be coming. That would be a real silver lining. It might even happen. It would be a benefit to the whole world if they did it, and they might be able to swing it politically. Given a mature view of the "real" hazards of nuclear power and the fact that I can smell China's coal plants from my doorstep every winter, nuclear would be a big step simply in terms of public safety.

Another out that China has is joint development of Russian natural gas on a huge huge scale. That is bad geopolitics for the US, but a big leap forward for climate change policy.
 
2021-09-28 7:32:05 PM  

Destructor: mrmopar5287: Destructor: ...ancient map showing a historical claim to all of Siberia

Aka "The Northern Resource Area."

You beat me to it.

Not one thing is ever too obscure on Fark.

Thank you for restoring my faith in that.


Weird coincidence: I'm reading the book now.

A hobby of mine is to buy books from thrift stores, read them, and then put them in Little Libraries in my city. The thrift store has literally every hardcover Clancy novel filter through multiple times each year.
 
2021-09-28 7:42:22 PM  
When was the last time China invaded any foreign country?

1979 and they basically took and held a few miles of North Vietnam for a short period then backed off.

Why would they do it over access to coal or oil? It's for sale and they are rolling in cash.

Premiere Winnie the Pooh ain't interested in fighting over what he can buy.
 
2021-09-28 8:02:49 PM  
Reading between the lines of what's coming thru China's minders, looks like China is about to implode on itself. It's falling apart fast.
 
2021-09-28 8:06:32 PM  

Bootleg: aleister_greynight: Or they will show us some more record setting construction, this time of nuclear reactors.

Well, that's a disturbing thought.

/Not against nuclear reactors
//Against rushed nuclear reactors
///Especially given their track record on other rushed buildings.


Oh come on they'll only cut a few corners
 
2021-09-28 8:15:41 PM  

Bowen: I wonder how those "traditional Chinese fishing grounds" off the coast of Indonesia are doing?

[Fark user image image 425x425]


I wonder how the quality varies by location. In the steam sailing age, UK coal was preferred, iirc because it burned cleaner. I think sometimes you could tell what kind of coal (where from) by how smokey it was.
 
2021-09-28 9:48:30 PM  

Medic Zero: Bowen: I wonder how those "traditional Chinese fishing grounds" off the coast of Indonesia are doing?

[Fark user image image 425x425]

I wonder how the quality varies by location. In the steam sailing age, UK coal was preferred, iirc because it burned cleaner. I think sometimes you could tell what kind of coal (where from) by how smokey it was.


Brits had access to anthracite (hard) coal. It was clean burning and they exported it for profit.

Bituminous is the next lower grade and it was generally smoky and dirty to burn. My parents have access to that and we use it for some heating in winter because it is so cheap, but it sends a steady stream of smoke out the chimney.
 
2021-09-28 9:48:34 PM  
China threatened to stop buying Australian coal over some petty diplomatic dispute where they (the Chinese) were incapable of admitting they were wrong or backing down.  When you absolutely need something, that kind of threat is always going to bite you in the backside.

On the plus side, China is burning less coal for a change.
 
2021-09-28 9:50:13 PM  

wejash: Why would they do it over access to coal or oil? It's for sale and they are rolling in cash.


A whole lot of their wealth is an illusion.
 
2021-09-28 9:55:11 PM  

elgrancerdo: Toxophil: ElecricalPast: Subby - did you even read TFA?

It's not that China doesn't have coal/fuel.
It's that their gov is forcibly limiting power generation in an effort to meet emissions targets.

They could burn coal all day long-but it has become politically problematic to do so

Oh... that's what a functional government looks like?

/We're doomed
//Doooooooooooooomed!
///...So... roll coal for Jesus?

I just hope political correctness could be in SoCal...

[i.pinimg.com image 480x477]


In my opinion, anyone caught rolling coal like that should be forced to watch as a tank drives over their precious vehicle.  Preferably from the inside of their truck.
 
2021-09-28 10:40:26 PM  

mrmopar5287: Destructor: mrmopar5287: Destructor: ...ancient map showing a historical claim to all of Siberia

Aka "The Northern Resource Area."

You beat me to it.

Not one thing is ever too obscure on Fark.

Thank you for restoring my faith in that.

Weird coincidence: I'm reading the book now.

A hobby of mine is to buy books from thrift stores, read them, and then put them in Little Libraries in my city. The thrift store has literally every hardcover Clancy novel filter through multiple times each year.


Wow. That's a really nice thing to do. Way to go.
 
2021-09-29 7:45:55 AM  

OgreMagi: wejash: Why would they do it over access to coal or oil? It's for sale and they are rolling in cash.

A whole lot of their wealth is an illusion.


Got bad news about the US stock market capitalization, friendo
 
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